The Defining Christian Confession: The Trinity | James White | 2016 G3 Conference

[@ButGOD-Eph2.1-10]

Oh so grateful! Thank you Dr White!

[@lindanicholason878]

G3 Conference # Dr. James White, THANK YOU for expounding on THIS ETERNAL TRUTH of our Sovereign, Eternal, Triune GOD.

[@bama101010]

Yes, the gospel of I Corinthians 15:1-4 tells us that our sins were forgiven on the cross (before we were born), and that we are saved when we believe the gospel of I Corinthians 15:1-4. There is no water baptism in I Corinthians 15:1-4. Those that practice "water baptism" are just replacing "circumcision" that Satan attempted to get the Galatians to practice - with "water baptism" which Satan has gotten you to NOW practice. Sadly, our Apostle Paul is no longer alive - Sadly, we no longer have preachers that are disciples of Paul - Sadly, today's preachers preach false gospels. NOW, why do you practice "water baptism?"

[@randypacchioli2933]

The Trinity is indeed a theological truth that can never be denied by those who love His Word. ✝️

[@AstariahJW]

Theres no truth in it

[@randypacchioli2933]

@@AstariahJW Sure it is.

[@AstariahJW]

@@randypacchioli2933 if it is then why doesnt almighty God say hes 3 persons ? He inspired prophets to write his thoughts Throughout the bible he is spoken as 1 person Psalms 83:18 You who's name is Jehovah you alone the most high over all the earth Deut Jehovah our God is one Jehovah God is one . Separate individual from the son 2 distinct individuals in heaven Jesus sits at Gods right hand

[@randypacchioli2933]

@@AstariahJW The Father is called God in scripture. The Son is called God in scripture. The Holy Spirit is called God in scripture. God is indeed One God (monotheism). There are NOT 3 Gods which would be tritheism. The trinity is One God who exists as three eternal Persons. The Trinity is not 1+1+1=3 but rather 1x1x1=1.

[@Wisdoms_Inheritance]

​@@randypacchioli2933Actually trinity is not scripture and doesn't make sense, scripture doesn't support one being in three persons, one side of Jesus talking to the other side of Jesus, modern day schizophrenia, NO WAY. Scripture supports Father, Son and Holy Spirit, three individual Spirit beings who are God, God is H430 elohiym which means gods, "God" is understood in the singular but plural in form, it's just a title that describes what they are, not who they are and the word "one" in Deut 6:4 is H259 echad and means united, which scripture supports even in the new testament as we are all one in the body of Christ but we all have our own spirit Numbers 27:16. John 6:38 as James used, shows two wills, Jesus will and the Fathers will and he came down from heaven, and in John 1:1, 17:5 you can't be with someone you are. Christ humbled himself and took on bodily form after being in the form of God Philippians 2:6-8, his spirit is now in that glorified body in heaven at the right hand of the Father, he had his own spirit and commended it into the Fathers hands who also is a spirit Luke 23:46. Yes he existed right along with the Father in the beginning but they are not one being in three persons, a person is described as a human being in the old and new testament, so it wasn't a person that came down from heaven but a spirit as there were not humans in heaven. The trinity doctrine is false based on scripture and is made up, so is rapture, that word doesn't even mean what people use it for, we really should not be adding to or taking away from scripture.

[@jlandles]

Sermon on the glories of the Holy Trinity... interrupted by an ad from Palmolive. It's hard to build up the church in reverence and awe without ad breaks from Pringles.

[@spectatorwv1054]

That's why we should attend church in person.

[@tomhitchcock8195]

God is the only Being we should be fearful of offending.

[@bama101010]

Yes, the gospel of I Corinthians 15:1-4 tells us that our sins were forgiven on the cross (before we were born), and that we are saved when we believe the gospel of I Corinthians 15:1-4. There is no water baptism in I Corinthians 15:1-4. Those that practice "water baptism" are just replacing "circumcision" that Satan attempted to get the Galatians to practice - with "water baptism" which Satan has gotten you to NOW practice. Sadly, our Apostle Paul is no longer alive - Sadly, we no longer have preachers that are disciples of Paul - Sadly, today's preachers preach false gospels. NOW, why do you practice "water baptism?"

[@deanandthe]

Probably because Jesus Himself was baptised, and sought out His personal baptism at the proper time. If in being baptised we are sinning in that we are siding with Satan, then this would mean that Christ's first act in His ministry was to sin - which to believe as truth would make someone not a believer in the Divine Christ. Don't the Apostles who started the church baptise in water that the Holy Spirit might enter in, in a baptism of His own nature? I fear you may have misunderstood baptism and its purpose. That is not to say I do not think it possible that Satan use anything and twist it against humanity. That does mean to say I don't think people would do the same - but baptism, as seen throughout scriptures, used for the sanctification of people and the glorification of God, truly is wonderful! God bless, may the Lord keep you safe and well

[@mikepruett1745]

need more mic gain

[@kevinschaafsma9711]

James, I'm really interested in your teaching on the Trinity. But why can't the same principles be used in support of the doctrine of Purgatory? Not quite set out clearly in scripture, but it's what we understand?

[@MrShooter72]

Came here from a Twisted Sister video….

[@terryglovier5803]

From twisted sister to twisted scripture

[@jamesirvin7799]

Mornon theology likely inspired the multiverse comic book fantasy. Green Lantern fighters and Silver Surfer are probably Mormon Spinoff.

[@bama101010]

Yes, the gospel of I Corinthians 15:1-4 tells us that our sins were forgiven on the cross (before we were born), and that we are saved when we believe the gospel of I Corinthians 15:1-4. There is no water baptism in I Corinthians 15:1-4. Those that practice "water baptism" are just replacing "circumcision" that Satan attempted to get the Galatians to practice - with "water baptism" which Satan has gotten you to NOW practice. Sadly, our Apostle Paul is no longer alive - Sadly, we no longer have preachers that are disciples of Paul - Sadly, today's preachers preach false gospels. NOW, why do you practice "water baptism?"

[@bama101010]

Yes, the gospel of I Corinthians 15:1-4 tells us that our sins were forgiven on the cross (before we were born), and that we are saved when we believe the gospel of I Corinthians 15:1-4. There is no water baptism in I Corinthians 15:1-4. Those that practice "water baptism" are just replacing "circumcision" that Satan attempted to get the Galatians to practice - with "water baptism" which Satan has gotten you to NOW practice. Sadly, our Apostle Paul is no longer alive - Sadly, we no longer have preachers that are disciples of Paul - Sadly, today's preachers preach false gospels. NOW, why do you practice "water baptism?"

[@craiglittle7367]

A representation of someone is not the same someone they are a representation of. Greg showed you that.

[@kardiognostesministries8150]

Jesus isn't the Father, but Jesus is YHWH.

[@craiglittle7367]

@@kardiognostesministries8150 Jesus is not YHVH. Micah 5:4 in the Hebrew clearly states YHVH is Jesus’s God. Hence, Jesus cannot be YeHoVaH.

[@kardiognostesministries8150]

@@craiglittle7367 Jesus is YHWH (Acts 2:21).

[@llewellynGS1]

I really like Dr White- one of my go-to men for theology. But I wish sometimes he would dumb down things a bit for us mortals.

[@HartyBiker]

Definitely one of my favourites too. I personally think his high language is a feature rather than a bug because it gives me some new words, phrases and concepts to research and understand.

[@AstariahJW]

Apostate christianity cares more about traditions Jesus spoke out against there traditions and hypocrisy They had him killed Christendom is not jesus sheep Trinitarians are misleading people

[@mimigutierrez948]

Someone once said, " The Three is One and the One is Three! Never 3 gods but One God existing Eternally in Three Distinct Persons! You can't divide the Essence of Confuse the Persons: God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. Hallelujah!!!!!

[@lindanicholason878]

# # Wes 'Lies' lines May The LORD GOD REBUKE you!!!

[@bama101010]

Yes, the gospel of I Corinthians 15:1-4 tells us that our sins were forgiven on the cross (before we were born), and that we are saved when we believe the gospel of I Corinthians 15:1-4. There is no water baptism in I Corinthians 15:1-4. Those that practice "water baptism" are just replacing "circumcision" that Satan attempted to get the Galatians to practice - with "water baptism" which Satan has gotten you to NOW practice. Sadly, our Apostle Paul is no longer alive - Sadly, we no longer have preachers that are disciples of Paul - Sadly, today's preachers preach false gospels. NOW, why do you practice "water baptism?"

[@ojluna]

I’m confused why you say this. What about Jesus’ own words- go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age (Matthew 28:18-20).

[@gimel77]

Dr. White, I really would like to debate you. With regard to Matthew 28:19, the reason that verse is questioned is because the apostles never baptized that way. Not once. You ignore this and pretend there's not a contradiction there, but there is. John 17:5- Why does Jesus go all the way back to before the world was if he was by his Father's side only a little over 33 years ago, just before he came to earth? There are other verses that speak of God knowing us, glorifying us, and calling us in him, before the foundation of the world. 1 Peter 1:20 literally says that Christ was foreknown (see Romans 8:29) before the foundation of the world. But you pretend verses like that don't exist and read something into John 17:5 that the original audience didn't understand. Because Peter was sitting right next to Jesus during that prayer, and we have 1 Peter 1:20. How do you explain that? Okay, now "schizophrenia" - How does a human person praying to God equal schizophrenia? Can't a human person, who is the incarnation of the divine person, pray to God, because he is a human? You're creating a second divine person to explain how Jesus and the Father can talk to each other, believing that the incarnation can't be possible without the existence of two divine persons. But, the one divine person can become incarnate as a man, and the "man" be his own unique person. This is a mystery, God becoming flesh, but it still happened. In Philippians 2, you know that the word "genomenos" is used in verse 7. A completely different tense than what's used in John 1:14. But you're pretending they mean the same thing? Philippians 2 doesn't refer to "becoming," it refers to "being." A man who is also God, but not seizing equality as by robbery. Adam and Eve, for example, tried to seize what was not theirs. Jesus, on the other hand, did not seize what was rightfully his. And the example that Jesus lived out, in the flesh, is the example that Paul followed by being a slave to the gospel. In John 1, the "Word" is the word of eternal life (1 John 1), stored up with the Father, the Father himself being that life, which, in the fulness of time, was manifested in the person of Jesus. Yes, Jesus is divine, because he is of the Father. Since the Father is the only true God (John 17:3), Jesus' deity comes from the Father. God is incarnate in, and reveals himself, through Christ. "All power is given to me" - It says "given," Dr. White. And there will come a time when he will give it back. There's a lot more to say, but we can save that for if, and when, you decide to debate me. The reason lots of people don't believe in the Trinity is because it is not necessitated, and even contradicted, by so many verses. And you probably know what they are, but you have your own explanations I'm sure.

[@kardiognostesministries8150]

Jesus is YHWH (Acts 2:21).

[@gimel77]

@@kardiognostesministries8150 Okay, but not "God the Son."

[@kardiognostesministries8150]

@@gimel77 Jesus, being the Son, is YHWH (Acts 2:21).

[@gimel77]

@@kardiognostesministries8150 So he's our heavenly Father seen as a human person.

[@kardiognostesministries8150]

@@gimel77 Jesus is not His own Father (John 14:23).

[@yasaaley]

With all humility I submit the trinity doctrine is sacrilegious. Here is why: Jesus in prayer to the Father said "3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent." [John17:3]. Paul said "But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him." [1Corinthians 8:6]. Jesus said the Father is the only true God. Paul said there is one God who is the Father and from him are all things (including the Word). I believe what the Lord and Paul are saying. Check to see if you also believe them.

[@jamalbaraja6130]

If the three are co-equal and co-eternal, they become three not One.

[@4jgarner]

Why is that?

[@hubertlancaster]

John reveals that Jesus is God, not a God among other Gods, but the only supreme God there is, or ever will be, It was so before the world was created. The body of Christ is the bodily dwelling place of the Spirit of the Father, it is the same supreme God both the visible body in Christ and the invisible Spirit of the Father together. The error of the Trinitarian doctrine is to look at the Eternal Spirit of God as a person and not as a Spirit and to remove the Father from Christ’s Body as a separate person, from Christ. The Father is an indwelling Spirit; we are talking about two separate natures, not two separate persons. If in doctrine we remove the Spirit of the Father from Christ, then Jesus is no longer the Christ and the doctrine becomes a confusing doctrine of the Antichrist. We read this in 2 Co 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself. Also in, Colossians 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. 9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. 10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power: Paul says that we are complete in Christ as the fullness of the Godhead is in Him. Jesus said, I and my Father are one (John 10:30). I would not want to be the one who contradicts Jesus. Jesus Christ is the incarnation of God in Human flesh. The only reason that Jesus can be called God is because God is in Him. The Holy Ghost is the Glorified Spirit of Christ. Jesus says, this in, John14:17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. John 14:18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you. John 14:19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also. John 14:20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.

[@ministeronaldstimphil5448]

I respect Dr. White and his great knowledge, but I have an issue with him believing that the doctrine of the Trinity makes clearer what the Bible does not express as clearly. It becomes dangerous when we think that we can be clearer than God Himself. If the doctrine of the Trinity is that important to our Christian identity, why is not God the one emphasizing it in Scripture? I'm afraid we are making ourselves better than God through this doctrine. That is a dangerous trend. Why do we insist on pinning on God something that He does not pin on Himself? I could use the same scriptures to prove that God is a Duality, for Jesus says: "The Father and I are one," or "But for us, There is one God, the Father, by whom all things were created, and for whom we live. And there is one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things were created, and through whom we live." (1 Corinthians 8:6) "Whatever you ask in my name, this I will do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son." (John 14:13) "And truly our fellowship is with the Father and with His Son Jesus Christ." (1 John 1:3b) Those verses clearly show that there is a profound emphasis on the specific relationship between the Father and the Son; yet, it would be erroneous to talk about God as a duality. To be more precise, let us say that we could talk about a duality within the trinity, for we cannot deny the presence of the Holy Spirit. The concept of a Trinity is totally flawed and dangerous. It is indeed dangerous, because of God's claim in Revelation 22:18 which states "I testify to everyone who hears the words of prophecy in this book: If anyone adds to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book."

[@mitchellc4]

Hello Jesus is the Messiah The Son of God The Son of David The Son of man The man God has chosen to be his anointed king The man God will judge the world through The man God raised from the dead Jesus will return and rule the nations with believers in the kingdom of God on the earth Jesus has a God There is no triune god in scripture Jesus said the Father is the only true God! John 17 3 And this is eternal life, that they know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom thou hast sent. - Acts 3 13 The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Servant Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied before the face of Pilate, when he had determined to release him. 14 But ye denied the Holy and Righteous One, and asked for a murderer to be granted unto you, 15 and killed the Prince of life; whom God raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses. Notice Jesus is NOT the God of Abraham 13 The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Servant Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied before the face of Pilate, when he had determined to release him.

[@dannymcmullan9375]

In Psalm 102: 12 and on, who is being addressed?

[@mitchellc4]

@@dannymcmullan9375 Hello Danny I would say the Father is being addressed Agreed? You may also want to tell me who is speaking in the verse?

[@dannymcmullan9375]

@@mitchellc4 Now read Hebrews 1 where psalm 102 is quoted. Who does the writer of Hebrews say psalm 102 is addressed to.

[@mitchellc4]

@@dannymcmullan9375 Hello Danny Thanks for responding You didn’t answer my question Who is the SPEAKER in Psalm 102? And are you claiming the Son is the Father? Did we not agree the subject in Psalm 102 is the Father? Please address my questions

[@deanandthe]

Absolute legend, really well put! God bless, dude

[@craiglittle7367]

Philippians 2 doesn’t say anything about eternity. Nor does John 1. Stop adding words to Scripture, James.

[@tjkhan4541]

Stop being a troll, sir.

[@craiglittle7367]

James White is insane. The concept of the Trinity is not taught in the Bible, nor is anyone in the OT or NT a trinitarian. In fact, the word God is never used for the trinity That is 3 person in one God.

[@thomasarthurmaj]

The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are grouped together numerous times in the New Testament, as you probably well know, in contexts that unambiguously refer to God. The doctrine is not argued for at length, but assumed as the apostles experienced God’s self-revelation. The Son refers to the Spirit and the Father as separate persons, and yet always monotheistically.

[@dgreenja]

Surely the trinity is not found in Deut 6:4. Jesus is the NT revelation of the one true God.

[@mimigutierrez948]

@@dgreenja The Three is One and the One is Three! Someone once said," If you tried to understand it you will lose your mind but if you don't accept it your will lose your soul." No the word Trinity is not in the Bible but the Revelation of it is there from the very beginning, God said," Let US make man in OUR image and in OUR likeness. The Hebrew word of God is ELOHIM which represent the unity of plurality! This belief is the foundation of the Christian and faith and settle at the Council of Nicaea which settle the question of the Person of the Lord Jesus and He being Equal and Coeternal with the Holy Spirit! I will stand on this belief forever!

[@dgreenja]

@@mimigutierrez948 my not accepting the trinity, is not based on a misunderstanding, but rather on the reality that it is an unbiblical teaching. The revelation and understanding of biblical truth, must go together. “Then opened he there understanding, that they might understand the scriptures” is where a divine revelation is certain. Any verse which presents “God” speaks of his complete oneness. Echad which speak.of unity, in everyday usage does not always connote a group of entities, as it can be applied also to solitary entities. A solitary entity is not divided, hence one united entity. The same applies to the Greek equivalent heis. Most verses in the bible where echad and heis are used, apply to solitary entities.

[@dgreenja]

@@mimigutierrez948 the Nicean creed is not an inspired writing as it contradicts the word of God where the numeric definition of God, is concerned. Genesis 1:26 doesn't identify a triune being, neither does it reveal co-Creators. There is only one Creator.

[@francissweeney7318]

The trinity is a false doctrine handed down from Origen to the catholic church, the great harlot. Isaiah 9:6 " For unto us a child is born, and unto us a Son is given: and the government is upon his shoulder, and He shall call His name, Wonderful, Counselor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, the prince of peace." The wisdom of The Holy Spirit is not in James White. He speaks from his own spirit. James, your quoting of the thoughts of men as evidence is no evidence at all. The prophesy of Isaiah, a true prophet of God is solid evidence. There is only one throne in heaven as it states in The Book of The Revelation of Jesus Christ. Beware the doctrines of James White.

[@jamalbaraja6130]

The only indication regarding the trinity is in the gospel "according" to John only. John 1:1 was not in the earliest greek scriptures. It was added by a scribe and so was the word "begotten". John was certainly not an eyewitness to Jesus. He wrote his gospel more than 100 years after God raised Jesus.

[@AstariahJW]

To trinity theology you need 2 other Gods to make 1 almighty God Co equal and co eternal is not found in scripture Jesus said father is greater than I am James white has to much pride . The way he talks shows he cares more about what he says than what bible actually teaches

[@Episcopalianacolyte]

The reason is the Trinity is not 3 GOD'S. GOD isn't your old man in the sky, He is way more than that. Consider the verses from the scriptures. JESUS says He is equal to the FATHER in John 5 : 18, John 8 : 19, Philliapians 2, John 12 : 44, John 14 : 9. JESUS said He is eternal in John 8 : 58, Isaiah 9 : 6, Colossians 1 : 17, Revelations 1 : 17, Hebrews 7 : 3, Genesis 1 : 26. As to John 14 : 28 "The FATHER is greater than I", this does not prove that JESUS is not GOD. Hebrews 2 : 9 What happened is that JESUS was temorarily made lower than the angels so that is why He said "the FATHER is greater than I. Phillipians chapter 2 says the reason for it. Also, the Trinity is believed and taught by most Bible only churches. Billions of Christians study only the Bible and have the same conclusion as I do about the Trinity. My grandmother was hardcore about the scriptures and taught me that GOD is Trinity. She would not go to a church unless it's name was found in the Bible. GOD is Trinity. JESUS has always existed just as the Bible says. This is not mans doctrins but is revealed throughout scripture.

[@AstariahJW]

@@Episcopalianacolyte so jesus is equal and at the same time is greater ? Those scriptures can be easily refuted Jesus enimies accused him of being equal but jesus never made that claim Jesus faught back that charge and said the son can do nothing on his own and only does what the father tells him Can you imagine someone claiming to be equal and saying he csnt do anything on his own?

[@AstariahJW]

@@Episcopalianacolyte What is the meaning of John 5:18? John 5:18, RS: “This was why the Jews sought all the more to kill him, because he not only broke the sabbath but also called God his Father, making himself equal with God.” It was the unbelieving Jews who reasoned that Jesus was attempting to make himself equal with God by claiming God as his Father. While properly referring to God as his Father, Jesus never claimed equality with God. He straightforwardly answered the Jews: “Truly, truly, I say to you, the Son can do nothing of his own accord, but only what he sees the Father doing.” (John 5:19, RS; see also John 14:28; John 10:36.) It was those unbelieving Jews, too, who claimed that Jesus broke the Sabbath, but they were wrong also about that. Jesus kept the Law perfectly, and he declared: “It is lawful to do good on the sabbath.”-Matt. 12:10-12, RS. Making Himself Equal to God”? ANOTHER scripture offered as support for the Trinity is John 5:18. It says that the Jews (as at John 10:31-36) wanted to kill Jesus because “he was also calling God his own Father, making himself equal to God.” But who said that Jesus was making himself equal to God? Not Jesus. He defended himself against this false charge in the very next verse (Joh 5:19): “To this accusation Jesus replied: . . . ‘the Son can do nothing by himself; he can do only what he sees the Father doing.’”-JB. By this, Jesus showed the Jews that he was not equal to God and therefore could not act on his own initiative. Can we imagine someone equal to Almighty God saying that he could “do nothing by himself”? (Compare Daniel 4:34, 35.) Interestingly, the context of both John 5:18 and Joh 10:30 shows that Jesus defended himself against false charges from Jews who, like the Trinitarians, were drawing wrong conclusions Philippians 2:6 KJ reads: “Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God.” (Dy has the same wording. JB reads: “he did not cling to his equality with God.”) However, in NW the latter portion of that passage reads: “who, although he was existing in God’s form, gave no consideration to a seizure [Greek, har·pag·monʹ], namely, that he should be equal to God.” (RS, NE, TEV, NAB convey the same thought.) Which thought agrees with the context? Verse 5 counsels Christians to imitate Christ in the matter here being discussed. Could they be urged to consider it “not robbery,” but their right, “to be equal with God”? Surely not! However, they can imitate one who “gave no consideration to a seizure, namely, that he should be equal to God.” (NW) (Compare Genesis 3:5.) Such a translation also agrees with Jesus Christ himself, who said: “The Father is greater than I.”-John 14:28 The Expositor’s Greek Testament says: “We cannot find any passage where [har·paʹzo] or any of its derivatives [including har·pag·monʹ] has the sense of ‘holding in possession,’ ‘retaining’. It seems invariably to mean ‘seize,’ ‘snatch violently’. Thus it is not permissible to glide from the true sense ‘grasp at’ into one which is totally different, ‘hold fast.’”-(Grand Rapids, Mich.; 1967), edited by W. Robertson Nicoll, Vol. III, pp. 436, 437. Some claim, however, that even these more accurate renderings imply that (1) Jesus already had equality but did not want to hold on to it or that (2) he did not need to grasp at equality because he already had it. The context of the surrounding verses (Php 2:3-5, 7, 8, Dy) makes it clear how Php 2 verse 6 is to be understood. The Philippians were urged: “In humility, let each esteem others better than themselves.” Then Paul uses Christ as the outstanding example of this attitude: “Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus.” What “mind”? To ‘think it not robbery to be equal with God’? No, that would be just the opposite of the point being made! Rather, Jesus, who ‘esteemed God as better than himself,’ would never ‘grasp for equality with God,’ but instead he “humbled himself, becoming obedient unto death.” Surely, that cannot be talking about any part of Almighty God. It was talking about Jesus Christ, who perfectly illustrated Paul’s point here-namely the importance of humility and obedience to one’s Superior and Creator, Jehovah God. John 8:58 a number of translations, for instance The Jerusalem Bible, have Jesus saying: “Before Abraham ever was, I Am.” Was Jesus there teaching, as Trinitarians assert, that he was known by the title “I Am”? And, as they claim, does this mean that he was Jehovah of the Hebrew Scriptures, since the King James Version at Exodus 3:14 states: “God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM”? At Exodus 3:14 (KJ) the phrase “I AM” is used as a title for God to indicate that he really existed and would do what he promised. The Pentateuch and Haftorahs, edited by Dr. J. H. Hertz, says of the phrase: “To the Israelites in bondage, the meaning would be, ‘Although He has not yet displayed His power towards you, He will do so; He is eternal and will certainly redeem you.’ Most moderns follow Rashi [a French Bible and Talmud commentator] in rendering [Exodus 3:14] ‘I will be what I will be.’” The expression at John 8:58 is quite different from the one used at Exodus 3:14. Jesus did not use it as a name or a title but as a means of explaining his prehuman existence. Hence, note how some other Bible versions render John 8:58: 1869: “From before Abraham was, I have been.” The New Testament, by G. R. Noyes. 1935: “I existed before Abraham was born!” The Bible-An American Translation, by J. M. P. Smith and E. J. Goodspeed. 1965: “Before Abraham was born, I was already the one that I am.” Das Neue Testament, by Jörg Zink. 1981: “I was alive before Abraham was born!” The Simple English Bible 1984: “Before Abraham came into existence, I have been.” New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures. Thus, the real thought of the Greek used here is that God’s created “firstborn,” Jesus, had existed long before Abraham was born.-Colossians 1:15; Proverbs 8:22, 23, 30; Revelation 3:14. Again, the context shows this to be the correct understanding. This time the Jews wanted to stone Jesus for claiming to “have seen Abraham” although, as they said, he was not yet 50 years old. (Joh 8 Verse 57) Jesus’ natural response was to tell the truth about his age. So he naturally told them that he “was alive before Abraham was born!”-The Simple English Bible.

[@humblejoes3263]

This car salesman is trying so hard to convince you all his ancestors sins in the name of the man made trinity doctrine were righteous that he says Jesus said “unless you believe ‘I Am, (God),” you will die in your sin.” Liar. Jesus never claims to be God and in fact Jesus, over and over again tells you He is not equal to The Father. Jesus is in fact The first trinity denier. Mat 15:7-9 Words of The Father through Isaiah and Jesus. You have been profoundly warned.

[@deanandthe]

I'm interested in your thoughts on John 1:1 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." John 1:2-5 continues to talk about how the Word (Capital letter in this context indicates Godhood traditionally) was involved in the creation. This account would surely imply, therefore, at least a God who is two in one - The Word that was God, and the Word that was *with* God. Ofc, John 1:1-2 is a play on Genesis 1:1-2, which in itself talks of there being multiple beings involved in tr creation of the world, "in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth... and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters." I wish only to understand what you meant by your statement, perhaps you have revelation that has evaded Christ and the church for 2000 years. What revelation was Jesus talking about then when Simon-Peter was given his new name- was it not on the revelation that Christ Jesus was the Messiah, the Son of man that would ascend to the throne? Was it not what Chirst Jesus was killed for? When he was charged with these claims, did he deny them? or did He take them? Jesus could not lie lest he forsake all that he had come to do. Finally, I leave you with Numbers 6:24-26; that you might remember this lesson: It is better to be loving than to be right, and that we can only love because God first loved us, and it is love and mercy enacted together that proves righteousness God bless, friend, may the peace of the Lord Jesus Christ be with you

[@humblejoes3263]

@@deanandthe So typical… dearest heretic, I would like your thoughts…while I calmly regurgitate the same old talking points Ive been fed all my life by the Pharisees of Christianity. Your passive aggressive straw manning is not lost on me. Perhaps I have revelation that has evaded Christ! Condescending twit. Don’t quote John if your twisted interpretation contradicts the simple words of Jesus. Don’t quote Paul if your interpretation contradicts the simple words of Jesus. Only Jesus is the highest authority in the bible. With your twisted trinity doctrine in play it becomes obvious John contradicts John and Paul contradicts Paul. Mat 24:35; Mark 13:31; Luke 21:33. Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away. In this simple statement of Fact by Jesus one can see this is A Promise. Forever. Only Jesus’s words (Which come directly from The Father) will NEVER be changed, mistranslated or otherwise disappear! Knowing humans, this may well be Jesus’s and The Father’s finest miracle. The second observation one can deduce from this promise is that Jesus’s words hold The Highest Authority. This Promise is not said about anyone elses words in the bible. Of course because they are, in all actuality, The Fathers words. If any biblical author “seems” to contradict Jesus’s words then simply pluck the diamonds from among the pearls and do not cloud your mind another second. In other words ONLY JESUS IS YOUR SAVIOR. Everyone else is supporting cast. WHY? Because every word was directly from The Father. The Father NEVER contradicts JESUS and Jesus NEVER contradicts The Father. What does outlast mean? It means His words will never be changed or mistranslated to mean something other than he intended. If the meaning of His words are changed then they did not last and His promise would be empty. Considering the many changes to the bible for well intentioned or nefarious reasons this promise that Jesus uttered directly from The Father may well be The Fathers finest miracle. God Our Father’s words as spoken by His Only Son and Our Only Savior, The Highest Authority. I’ve heard all of your regurgitated dribble. Do you know, Mr. full of someone else’s regurgitation, that there are no capital letters in Hebrew? But you say John the uneducated Hebrew fisherman somehow knew the Greek personalization of logos? Unlikely. John supposedly calls Jesus the Word but after his prologue never uses Word as a pronoun again in his entire gospel. Weird. John uses the word, word some 40 more times in his gospel but never again with a capital w. How Weird! Am I suggesting someone with a greek mystical tradition messed with the prologue? Youbetcha. They are not Jesus’s words, why not mess with them. Jesus only guaranteed His Words would outlast heaven and earth. Jesus refutes the trinity doctrine ad nauseam. In one instance alone He tells you His Father is your Father and your God is His God. Are you dense? The highest authority in the bible told you point blank He has a God. Not He is God. John 20:17 Tell me how many high minded theologians who understand this nonsensical trinity delusion are or were like children as required by Jesus in order to enter the Kingdom of God? Luke 18:17 Also Jesus says in Luke 10:21 that The Father hides things from the wise and understanding and reveals them to little children. “I thank you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that you have hidden these things from the wise and understanding and revealed them to little children; yes, Father, for such was your gracious will. Do little children understand the trinity idiocy? No. Do most of you pewbots who repeat it and it’s nonsensical proofs understand it? No. To hell with anyone who purposely twists scripture in order to make themselves clever custodians of the obscure and the privileged interpreters of unintelligible mystery. In essence making themselves the irrevocable conduit to God and a higher authority than Jesus Himself. Sounds exactly like the pharisees fatal flaw.

[@AstariahJW]

​@@deanandthetrinitarians are blind . John 1 says the word had a beginning. Jehovah has no beginning

[@deanandthe]

@AstariahFox not quite! In the same way God (Jehovah) was in the beginning the Word was too. John clearly states that the Word was God and was with God in the beginning confirming these two members were there in the beginning (that is, before, during and after the beginning which is what the Hebrew word Bereshit means and was used to mean)m We know with certainty that Christ was a Creator, rather than one who was created- if we forsake this fact we renounce our messianic Jewish faith or our Christian faith and put on the cloak of Islam, Mormonism or JWs, that is to renounce the salvation Jesus suffered and died for. And if we have forsaken that truth then the problem is not a trinitarian issue but an issue of faith. Truly, if anyone is interested in learning they Will learn. Throughout the Bible the image of people with ears that do not hear and eyes that do not see is used. In fact, proverbs 18:2 speaks of my favourite verse that cuts to my heart each time the Holy Spirit reminds me of it. Believe me, I have tried to justify your view, to understand it, to test it against the Word - in line with proverbs 18:2 - but it does not hold without removing Godhood from any of the Trinity. My final statement will not be about trinity, but rather your mode of delivery. Rebuke is important, we must make sure that we are checking each others walls that they do not crumble when the rains come - but you have spoken with such hate and disgust for the people who hold a differing view. Have you not learned that the worst way to convince someone that they're misguided or wrong is by shouting "you're wrong and I'm right" at them? Why do you speak with such anger and frustration and hate to those made in God's image? Were not first the Jews then the gentiles called to be more loving that critical? Defending the faith is important, but not at The cost of Re-presenting Christ poorly; the Rock of our salvation

[@AstariahJW]

@@deanandthe word was is pass tense So almighty God wasn't almighty God anymore? You think he can turn himself off and on? John also writes word was with God Someone with another person can not be also that person John is talking about 2 distinct individuals Not 3 . Not 1 but 2 individuals The word which is Jesus and almighty God Jehovah which the word was with Jehovah God sent his word (jesus) to the earth