Game of Thrones - Top 10 Best & Worst Changes from the Books

[@Deifendorf]

"When that showdown happens -- dragons versus walkers -- they're going to deliver, because, how can't they?" Oh my sweet summer child.

[@jrthe2nd494]

Lmao

[@PowerofRock24]

Lmfao, my exact line of thought when they said that. The biggest tragedy since the Red Wedding...

[@HobbitGaming]

I came for this comment

[@ce666isa3]

But they did deliver in battle 😅😅but storywise nah

[@48917032]

What do you know about fear? Fear is for season 8, when writers as dumb as bricks rush through the story.

[@Bayuuk]

"the night king is the best villain in the show" oohhh this didnt age well.

[@TamagoSenshi]

Well, was and could've ended as the best, but someone got the idea that subverting people's expectations is better than good writing

[@rdizzy1]

Still remains the same, the "best villian" doesn't mean invincible. I consider him to be sort of a "glass cannon", and he has never had to fight for himself, considered himself to be untouchable due to massive amounts of bodies always around him.

[@veloce5491]

In what fucking definition is a flat ice zombie a good villain?

[@ratlord6192]

Chidz Hustle someone hasn't even watched the show.

[@edwardv1255]

I think the concept of the Night King had a lot of potential. I have this image of the Night King in King's Landing, crushing a frozen iron throne into a million pieces. Dunno exactly what would lead to it, but... They built up this whole thing of the power struggle not mattering, because the real threat is the malevolent forces of nature, the white walkers. But nah, let's just get rid of the white walkers easily, then hurriedly close up this whole game for the throne by undoing 7 seasons of character development in favor of the mother of dragons having a poorly explained hissy fit, Jon being an in-love coward, and Cersei and Jamie whining under a ton of bricks.

[@professornumbnutz5474]

15:30 "they're going to deliver because...how can't they ?" Ehhhhh

[@turtleanton6539]

Loool

[@Gravuun]

it really hurt me hearing him say that... How could D&D do this

[@LL-tz3oy]

why did they say it, I hold them at least 1.5% responsible

[@37Kilo2]

They really dropped the ball there. The show has gone down hill for the last several seasons, but I hoped they'd redeem themselves with the battle of Winterfell... They ruined that, and now I don't even care how the show ends.

[@icecoldfire25]

@@37Kilo2 seriously. Other than the ridiculous amounts of plot armor the episode was great until that ending

[@AvernoGaming]

Hard to judge Varys and Little finger in the show since they lose 15 IQ each season for no particular reason.

[@romulorafael5563]

kkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk yes

[@peterparker9214]

Characters can only be as smart as the person writing them...dumb and dumbers stupidity really shows when they run out of source material.

[@Mizraab2912]

Not to mention the genius Tyrion- "And who has the best story in Westeros....Bran!"

[@joemame4572]

that's only starting in season 5 though

[@ping4d064]

Thomas A. Anderson wonderful, he knows that, and so? Knowing someone’s secret doesn’t make you smart If you don’t do shit with that information. If he knew, isn’t “chaos a ladder”? I think spreading this as a rumor would generate quite a lot of chaos...

[@ambrr8894]

"The White Walkers" section didn't age well haha

[@turtleanton6539]

👏👏👏👏👏

[@evoxghiretti]

I was looking for someone to say it

[@johnflumph8835]

"Their going to deliver... because how can't they?" well now we know

[@ArchangelV11]

I looked into the comments to find just this

[@laurocoman]

@@johnflumph8835 Aaron is in such denial, he thinks The Long Night was great. They guy really convinced himself that it lived up to his own expectations LOL

[@JayBigDadyCy]

The fact that Ghost is so prominent in the books and seems so important yet in the show he's nonexistent. That's the one big difference I hate.

[@johnnyappleseed4279]

They’re saving that CGI money for the dragons

[@aaronm8143]

@@johnnyappleseed4279 really or are you joking? I'm reading this comment 2 different ways lol

[@diskeyes]

Aaron Mooneyham he’s being serious. They put they’re CG budget into the dragons and bullshit like the undead bear from last season. The show runners completely missed the boat on the wolves.

[@jasonmars3708]

Natty Bummppo that stupid ass bear fuck that scene and fuck this season so far

[@johnnyappleseed4279]

Aaron Mooneyham half joking, half serious lol showrunners have different priorities

[@warl0ck_st0rm7]

15:24 "they wont let us down. How can they?" Easily apparently.

[@bdfornies]

This is actually sad

[@notbothered7510]

HBO: Hold my beer

[@chargersfan0560]

Barely an inconvenience (pitch meeting voice)

[@cesaralvesdemoraes3187]

Actually super easy, barely an inconvenience

[@codycomstock3260]

Seasons 6 and 7 were butt cheeks. Season 8 was butthole.

[@nicoleyoung0511]

The honourable mention for best change in the show is definitely the aging-up of the younger characters. GRRM himself regrets making them so young because he had intended to do a time skip at some point in the books so that it would skip forward and they would be older, but it didn’t end up happening.

[@saranemcova5448]

Well, for Robb being 16 works. Sansa at the beginning makes sense too. But now... Jesus, it is very unsettling.

[@alexandraolvera5903]

Don’t mind Daenerys, Jon, and Sansa ages in the books. The biggest problem is Bran and Arya ages, we got a 9 year old boy with a adult brain and 11 year old killer who is learning to use her femininity as a weapon/femme fatale (Mercy chapter). I think George wrote that chapter back 2003 when he had the 5 year jump in his mind and Arya was 16. Makes a lot more sense for a 16 year old girl doing those actions that a 11 year old. I wish the show did the Mercy chapter and Arya whole braavos storyline to get a good picture on a 16-17 year old Arya.

[@SacredDaturaa]

I think an instance where the aged-up kids didn't work so well is Jon. He is a whiny, entitled lil bitch in book 1, which is kinda understandable and even relatable coming from a fifteen year-old boy. Much less relatable when he looks like Kit Harrington, a grown-ass man.

[@niranjanrajesh1058]

@@alexandraolvera5903 ye arya using her femininity to her advantage shocked me.

[@niranjanrajesh1058]

It sounds bad to us,but back then it was normal.

[@bicnicky]

"When that showdown happens, the song of ice and fire, dragons vs walkers, it's going to be that much better because we've been patient and we've waited. They're going to deliver because how can't they." Well you'd think that but...

[@Galamothofso]

scrolled down to see if somebody posted this

[@xaph5575]

I mean I liked that episode

[@mockcosine4479]

XD

[@PowerofRock24]

I paused at that exact sentence to check the comments for this very comment.... it's so fucking disappointing this happened. It makes these 8 years almost not even worth it. The writing hasn't been that good in a few seasons now :(

[@unnanointedonesufi]

@@xaph5575 it was good just not worth all the build up

[@michaelhrbypedersen4936]

Really surprised the change made to Tyrions and Jamie's conversation wasn't mentioned. I thought that was one of the worst changes in the show, how they omitted Jamie confessing to Tyrion, that Tysha, the girl he had married, was never a prostitute, that Jamie had not hired her, but that Tywin had forced Jamie to lie to Tyrion so Tywin could have the marriage undone. Its the whole reason why Tyrion kills his father Tywin in the books and gives him a much better reason for killing his father, it just seemed so random in the show when they did not include the reason for him getting so angry.

[@Jamesmac95]

Michael Hørby Pedersen glad I'm not the only one who thinks this! I have always had the same thought, it just seems out of character for someone as smart as Tyrion to randomly go to see his father when his main goal at that point would be to escape. Would make the tension between Jaime and tyrion even greater if they'd had the line of tyrion telling Jaime he killed Joffrey

[@unluckygamer692]

Michael Hørby Pedersen I've personally not read the books and that part makes way more sense now.

[@bradwright9477]

I think Jamie and Tyrion's bond in the show is one of the strongest dynamics and the books kinda shit on that. I fully believed after all the hell Tywin put Tyrion through over the years, mixed with the revelation and murder of Shae, that Tyrion would want to kill him

[@Justifyingrandomness22]

Just to be clear you do know that Tywin slept with Shae before Jamie and Varys helped him escape.

[@michaelhrbypedersen4936]

Yes I do know that Carlos. In the books, Tywin forced Tyrion to watch the rape of an innocent girl that genuinely loved Tyrion, and then made Tyrion rape that crying girl, who genuinely loved Tyrion for who he was, after all of Tywins guards had a turn raping her.

[@CidsReality]

I actually forgot that in the books they were all Wargs. Now that I am reminded, I am annoyed that they took all of the Starks abilities.

[@TheTerranscout]

@Robin Banks I would have liked them to be wargs because that would have forced them to make Bran even better/more powerful

[@taciturn1290]

So thats why they kept talking about Robb turning into a direwolf..

[@rhaevan.maniyara]

@@taciturn1290 yes... It is shown in the show that they're wargs.. But not exactly like they did with Bran.. You can see Robb making Grey Wind scare Jaime without saying a single word or giving any sort of signal except for just touching him.. Lady died so early... Rickon and Shaggy are invisible in the show.. Jon and Ghost always had a great connection.. but Jon never really tried that much to be with Ghost.. But he has that ability..

[@claire3614]

Last word Jon spoke before death was the name of his direwolf, and Robb did the same thing... In the books we learn from a Warg POV that when any warg dies their consciousness can travel and inhabit the body of a beast they had a connection with, and in Jon case that's how we know he is going to "come back", having his body reanimated somehow (that Melissandre in the wall is not burning Princess Shireen to stop a freaking storm, iykwim) and his consciousnesses or "spirit" can come back safely, Ghost will basically by a soul jar. Now one of the saddest theories in the fandom is thinking that probably it happened with Robb as well, he died and his consciousnesses went to Grey Wind, and the he was instantly butchered for a second time. And you thought the red wedding was sad in the show...

[@nickgennady]

@@TheTerranscout Bran the most powerful person alive, but does nothing. Imagine if we found out Robert died from the hunting accident but it was Bran controlling the deer. He could also control dragons to kill Danny at any time. The ultimate assassin.

[@mischitary]

I actually think that no. 1 is spot on. A lot of the problems of the final season I felt were a negative consequence of not having the Young Griff character. Like, imagine Daenerys' whole "they don't love me, they love him" schtick being about someone who actually WANTS the throne and is actively trying to get it instead of some knucklehead constantly going "buh i dunt want it" over and over again. It also makes so little sense. The people of Westeros don't love Jon Snow, the people of the North do. The populace of King's Landing probably don't even know who Jon Snow is let alone love him. The only thing I really disagree with is the White Walkers being done better in the show. I feel like this is mostly just a consequence of us not really having seen much from them in the books thus far, but at any rate I vastly prefer the mysterious and ethereal quality they have in the books. For example, one of the coolest details they explain about them in the books is that when they walk on the snow, they don't sink into it and leave no footprints. Just how they sort of feel like they're the cold incarnate.

[@lorenegross8120]

Not to mention Jon Snow in the books as a child did want the north, wanted to be legitimate, and he absolutely wanted power and a family name. The thing is he wanted to earned on his own merit not because of birth. GoT need Aegon young Griff. Jon as the threat as KitN and YG on the IT with the south rallying round him. I see YG and Dany wed. Yet she loves him he uses her as a tool add in wanting Sansa Stark and there's a recipe for disaster. As I do see YG headed north if he finds out about Jon and his identity. Joncon very well could assume jons the son of Lyanna. On Jons part he very well try and be a brother to YG in an attempt to replace Robb

[@noorablack6810]

What I love most about the interactions between Lady Arya and Lord Tywin is how those scenes allow us to view Lord Tywin differently. To me, he goes as far as to appear kind to Lady Arya.

[@Avatarbee]

Well if he ever realized who she really was his kindness probably wouldn't have extended far beyond marrying her to prince tommen

[@professornumbnutz5474]

He is very decent to her and you can tell he is fond of her. She is what he wishes cersei was . Charles Dance is incredible

[@beck242]

you mean after five books and eight seasons of arya telling everyone she's not a lady, there's people out here calling her lady arya?

[@AnAverageBoss]

Arya is NOT A LADY!

[@bloodmime]

He has her eat the food after a believed attempt on his life to see if it's poisoned. His kindness isn't really kindness.

[@VelkanKiador]

I miss one of the funnier parts of Bronn's story in the books, now that he is a knight he just goes around knighting his friends and acquaintances to the point of making knighthood mean nothing. He probably takes a bit money for knighting people too. It is funny as hell and such a Bronn move XD

[@nibo4185]

VelkanKiador also callimg his son tyrion, loved that

[@mankytoes]

Yeah, it's a shame we don't see him "in person" in the books, but it's better than shoehorning him into pointless plots. He's like a counterpart Sandor on this- Sandor hates the hypocrisy of knighthood from the outside, Bronn mocks it from the inside. He's Lord Bronn now, by the way.

[@wafflingmean4477]

I think Bronn might come back into the lives of POV characters eventually. The Stormlands are currently under attack by the Golden Company, and if they get a strong footing Cersei will have to gather her armies against them. Now with Kevin Lannister dead she can fill the power vacuum again. With her constantly driving a wedge between the Lannisters and Tyrells, it's possible they will choose to support Young Griff. Although if the Dornish join them that becomes less likely. Willas Tyrell seems far more level headed than Mace Tyrell, and he's the heir to Highgarden so if Cersei kills him (and Varys is likely going to at least try to manipulate her into doing so) he might make that call. Meaning there will be a massive force bearing down on the Lannisters. Bronn will be among the Lords summoned to fight, and facing all that he'll probably switch sides. And if and when Tyrion finally returns to Westeros with Dany, then Bronn will likely seek him out to make a profit amongst the chaos. I don't think it will be soon, but I think he may have a background mention or two in a Griff chapter, and come back into play when Tyrion's story interacts heaps with southern Westeros again.

[@TheJas20]

i dont remember that in the book

[@noneofyourbusiness43]

Bron is Eternal. No matter if its in the books or the show. The Bron is always Bron!

[@winkblue6851]

Ollena has to be one of my fave from the show. Even her death was boss

[@batgurrl]

Wink Blue she was one to notch character and actress. What a sassy bitch when she wanted to be one and her final moment was so well done

[@skyanaugustus3513]

Absolutely!

[@Zilivat]

Same, I wasn't even mad at her death bc of the way she dropped the mic 😆

[@stefanfilipovits21]

RIP Diana Rigg

[@Channel-ji3ly]

@@stefanfilipovits21 Really

[@rawreviewsii6044]

The difference between Stannis in the show vs. The books should have been included. Stannis is still an essential character in the books pushing the northern forces towards winterfell. He was disliked in the show because he murdered shereen, however this is inaccurate via the books. Stannis deserves a lot more attention and respect than given. Long live The Mannis aka The One True King!

[@Fleet_Admiral]

One year later, but yeah i love books stannis, i read the books first and watch the show after, i was disappointed by what they did to my boy. The only and rightful king stannis the mannis!

[@redrave404]

@@patflannery832 Inaccurate. The note was Shireen is burned alive, not that Stannis does it. In fact the Wind's of Winter section George released has Stannis order his men that in the event of his death they are to fight on for Shireen's claim on the throne, plus he is miles away from her (as she is at the wall and he is fighting various northern lords). She is likely to be killed by the Red Woman and Stannis' wife, and that event is probably what breaks him.

[@chuckles3116]

@@redrave404 it’s possible he may order her to be indirectly burned to fight white walkers due to the fact that Melisandre has an insanely good track record as far as he knows, sacrifice is the first part of Azor Ahai to be emphasized in Davis 1 ACOK, and the fact that sacrificing her to save the realm completes his arc of prioritizing the realm over the throne. But it’s definitely a massive misinterpretation on the part of D&D to think that Stannis would burn her for good weather when he explicitly rejects the suggestion of burning a few troops for good weather.

[@Miuranger1]

They gave stannis plotline to robb

[@xxgamin6986]

The biggest thing is they hired mercenaries armies to hire not his own troops that believe so that was stupid

[@mcdaviddeservesbetter8]

So it’s a blessing and a curse. POV book chapters let’s you live in the character’s head, but the show gives you interactions you could never have in the books POV format.

[@professornumbnutz5474]

Best name ever 😂. Damn right C McD deserves better

[@stocktonlord24]

I think Stannis' season 5 arc should've been in the worst list.

[@AnitaClue]

Yep. Total character assassination on him (and Ellaria).

[@Miller09095]

For sure. Great military general decides to siege larger force with 1,000 tired infantry... Why?

[@Caladras]

Why? Because it was different from how the books portrayed him? I think his storyline was handled perfectly.

[@Caladras]

I didn't realise that about the sword, but it adds a nice bit of irony. I don't know which key character moments you speak of, but the way Stannis' character develops in the show makes perfect sense. He's so consumed by the idea of being the chosen hero that he's willing to go to any length to ensure that the prophecy is fulfilled, culminating in the burning of his own daughter at a stake. Sure, he becomes a villain, but a tragic, almost Shakespearean villain. This makes him one of the most interesting and compelling characters on the show. I can't imagine a better way how his character could develop.

[@Caladras]

The Bastard of the dread fort Way to dismiss someone's opinion. I have read the books by the way.

[@morgothlannister9299]

You forgot about MANCE fuckin RAYDER surviving in the books due to Melisandre using magic to make the lord of bones look like Mance and burning him instead.

[@morgothlannister9299]

Sepak Yes, but what happened in the book was much more interesting.

[@hbn6064]

Hasn't been confirmed yet, I doubt he's going to die, the women that he brought with him are dead but I'm guessing he is still alive. Their is a theory that Mance wrote the letter but the readers will have to wait and see.

[@AnitaClue]

Sepak, only if you believe what's in the Pink Letter. Even if Ramsay actually wrote it (which is debatable) that doesn't mean he would be telling the truth in it.

[@HamzaMohamed-dr1ds]

Viserys Blackfyre Lannister

[@yvesgomes]

That works well in the books, because they're not showing the reader Mance's face all the time. I guess I was lucky to be dumb enough to realize it was him. In the show, it would have been pretty bland. I think the cut was also a matter of just being one of the necessary cuts.

[@crimsonclaw8145]

What about Tyrion and his wife Tysha. The story that changed Tyrion’s Character in the book that was only mentioned in a couple scenes of the show

[@jennaleclaire2654]

Agreed. I loved that part. It really makes his murder of Tywin hit harder. The show's handling of Shae was bad too. In the books everyone can see she's just a whore, using Tyrion, and even he knows it half the time and yet his craving for love and affection keep blinding him. When he murders her too, the show made it seem like self-defense, with her reaching for a knife. But it wasn't. Book Shae was just a whore all along, she never pretended to be anything otherwise, and Tyrion was a fool for making her out to be what he wanted and not what she truly was. And when he murders her it's just a moment where we can see Tyrion isn't a hero - he's hurt, he's angry at his own foolishness, and he kills her out of anger. I like Tyrion being morally ambiguous and not just a white bread hero. His motivations are clear and believable and we can emphasize with him. His first wife had truly loved him - and all this time Tyrion sought out whores, thinking that he could never really be loved, thinking that Jaime and Tywin were right, that his first wife was just a paid whore because nobody would ever marry him for love and not money. Oof. Right in the feels.

[@str8kronic]

I dont think they ever mentioned that tysha wasn't actually a whore in the show right?

[@phil8821]

@@str8kronic No, that's what was so powerful in the books. Jaime Tells Tyrion the truth when he helps him escape. That makes him furious and he then seeks his father to confront him about the truth, which Tywin then admits, just before Tyrion kills him.

[@EJD339]

@@jennaleclaire2654 man, I respectfully disagree. I thought they made Shae a much more interesting character though it didn’t quite make sense slept with Tywin in the show.

[@jennaleclaire2654]

@Kenny McCormickShe was a teen or preteen who was rescued, and then her and Tyrion got drunk off wine and also hit it off right away. What's there not to get?

[@user-dn1ks9kw3m]

Rickon’s death in the show pissed me off. They literally just wasted a whole Stark heir away.

[@niccipenn136]

I totally agree. He could have been wounded!!

[@Grassrope123]

That was Ramsay's point though of killing him. He was the only trueborn Stark male heir left, and since he was a threat to Ramsay's claim over Winterfell he was never going to live either way sadly

[@MrMineHeads.]

AND HE IS STILL ALIVE IN THE BOOKS WITH THIS WHOLE DAVOS PLOTLINE ON SKAGOS AND THE NORTHERN CONSPIRACY AND OMG THE BOOK IS SO MUCH BETTER /rant

[@nvmfirezactaylor6035]

He didn't even have a fucking line

[@laplacefourier4120]

Yep. It sucked to have a throw-away Stark on the HBO series and creating a side plot to kill him. The casting of Art Parkinson for the role was likely the contributing factor. They had quite a difficult time with him when shooting his minor scenes in season 1 and his stage mother on set didn't help matters nor her negative thoughts on the series he talked about publicly. They should have found a better replacement pronto. Not trying to be harsh on him as it's not an easy job any kid could do. The writers gave him a fitting tongue-in-cheek end having him be too stupid to not zig-zag when Ramsey was shooting arrows his way.

[@bvyner5727]

Ilyn Payne, Wilko Johnson is still alive! He beat his battle with cancer..... The Headsman is alive!!!!

[@jeffzsk3037]

cool I miss his menacing scowl

[@parmesanstark2875]

I know why did they say he passed?

[@fraserwatson3034]

B Vyner yeah the Dr even said he feels good now

[@simonthomas5113]

He was diagnosed terminal, did farewell tours, but thankfully made a full recovery. Wiki has full details.

[@sambog9t]

Ser Ilyn brought us cancer's head

[@thusspokesarathustra3814]

I know this is old, but I was really disappointed they took the Lovecraftian element of the books out of the show: the things that made Euron Greyjoy so terrifying and Patchface.

[@madelinegarber7860]

I agree. In the show Euron is just a creepy thug who’s kind of sadistic. The book Euron... different story entirely. He might be worse than Ramsey. There’s a sample chapter out from Winds of Winter from the damp hair’s point of view and it really shows how twisted Euron is.

[@megakirbyx]

@@VanArkride And we haven't gotten enough of the lame-ass dick joke characters?

[@reecerife7839]

Damn dude.... Euron in the books is a way more interesting character than the show Euron.

[@denjamin2633]

@@VanArkride What? Really, what? You take a mysterious, imposing character like Euron, who in his first appearance completely twisted the kingsmoot in his favor after Asha had won them all over, with chests FULL of valyrian steel, and a magic horn that kills people. Hints that he is a blood mage, brings primal fear from everyone that knows him, with a plan to ensorcel Dany's dragons and bring ruin to the world. A character who is probably going to wind up as the main human antagonist after Cersei finishes destroying every chance she ever had. And you think "AND ME BIG COCK" is a GOOD change? How? Literally, how? Explain yourself.

[@sacredxgeometry]

@@denjamin2633 👏👏👏👏👏

[@alefiyah1163]

"They are going to deliver because......how can't they?" Dumb and dumber :- "I'm about to end this man whole career"

[@Den.Vos.Reynaerde]

And their own careers as well.

[@mellemadswoestenburg1296]

@@Den.Vos.Reynaerde well, karma is a bitch.

[@Imgema]

Stannis burning his daughter alive was the worst imo. They only did it for the shock value.

[@paultanzen9434]

Pretty sure she is gonna die the same way in the books

[@veloce5491]

@@paultanzen9434 why? He was very reluctant to evem burn the son of a brother he didnt even like. I dont see how he could burn his own daughter.

[@paultanzen9434]

@@veloce5491 guess we will see

[@paultanzen9434]

@@veloce5491 one day

[@Juancilra]

That seems unlikely. Stannis leaves them all at the Wall when he marches south in the books.

[@bushbear7074]

What about Rickon? HE just showed up and died in the show, but his status in books is so much cooler. He could be riding unicorns with Shaggy Dog on Skagos.

[@coots007]

Bushbear shaggydog's name is a reference to the type of role Rickon plays. he was never meant to be a big character he was meant to have a shaggydog story "In its original sense, a shaggy dog story or yarn is an extremely long-winded anecdote characterized by extensive narration of typically irrelevant incidents and terminated by an anticlimax or a pointless punchline."

[@bushbear7074]

Wow that's actually really interesting, I didn't know that. Thanks.

[@Lekjih]

Which makes the others really interesting. Sansa's Lady is killed - death of her ladyiness or death of her prince-and-lady dreams? Jon has a Ghost that his ghost apparently wargs into, Bran's Summer dies at the hands of the White Walkers (is that in the books?), and then Arya names hers after a warrior queen, Foreshadowing?

[@AnitaClue]

Lekjih, in the books Summer is still alive and well. Sansa doesn't really give up her dreams about Joffrey until he starts being cruel to her directly, ordering her beaten and such. But some theorize that she's lost part of her "Starkness" in losing her direwolf.

[@Lekjih]

Ahh, thank you~

[@dgmetalhead]

Also they dumbed down Roose Bolton into a generic Tywin-lite who was sentimental and dumb enough to hug Ramsay. Seriously go look up Roose moments and quotes from the book, they're some of the best of the series.

[@AnitaClue]

They've eliminated a lot of the nuance in a lot of the characters. Dany is more complex in the books, and I know there are still people who can't stand BookDany but you have to admit she has moments of doubt, and is more of a leader on the page.

[@Zagora1655]

Roose got killed off because they wanted to show the Ramsay actor and make that season about the battle of the bastards, so they killed him off in a way that didnt do his character any justice, because the showwriters thinks that random deaths pleases the audience It's so stupid.

[@moomimi]

NesTea It's like the actors leads the story now not the fuvking plot and the characters. They don't want people like Arya and Sansa killed off.

[@blackfyre5158]

Bloodlines he's a boss in the books! The actor for roose in the show is damn talented though. He so was underused

[@noneofyourbeeswax01]

The actor does a brilliant job in conveying the creepy, cold and understated Bolton. But getting stabbed by Ramsay while hugging him? Do me a favour; Roose only had time for Ramsay when he thought he was his only offspring - when he subsequently married Walda Frey he even said that so long as Ramsay lives, his true-born sons will not be safe. Roose is way too fly to be taken out like that.

[@dannysampson615]

I also thought Kevan Lannister was really nerfed in the show There's this one great scene, that the show missed out on where he came to visit cersei in the sparrows' dungeons after her Trainwreck of a reign and says pretty much "your reign is over" then precedes to tell her how he fixed pretty much all the the crown's short term problems Then there was the brilliant epilogue in aDwD, where Varys kills him simply because he's fixing all these problems and poses a serious threat to Danaerys and Aegon. This also adds a lot to Varys as a character, making him seem more willing to go through with getting his hands dirty for the good of the realm.

[@henryjohnson3703]

"The Good of the Realm" Yeeeeeeah, no. Varys in the books very obviously doesn't ACTUALLY care about the good of the realm.

[@PapaVamp]

@@henryjohnson3703 Yes he does, he just thinks that having Daenerys and the Targaryens is the best thing for the realm

[@Blackhawk211]

@@PapaVamp he's working with Young Griff not Daenaerys in the books

[@PapaVamp]

@@Blackhawk211 I haven’t read the books in years but I thought Varys was just trying to help any Targ in general. I don’t remember scenes between him and young griff though. Can you give me a few examples

[@akd.29]

@@PapaVamp In the epilogue of A Dance With Dragons, Varys tells Kevan that he's been preparing fAegon for years since he was a child. Making him learn the faith, having a maester as a teacher, and other things so that he can ascend the Iron Throne before killing Kevan

[@eizhowa]

I think the descision to age up characters like Dany was the best one. It would have been creepy as hell if Dany was 13.

[@travissloan5296]

eizhowa they had no choice there. It’s not allowed by censors to have characters who are underage have sex, even if the actors are above the age of consent

[@travissloan5296]

And if one character had to be aged, everyone does, otherwise the timeline wouldn’t add up

[@darKILLusionnn]

I think that was the easiest decision actually.

[@ramonserna8089]

It would have been too much for us spectators actually watching the scenes, but it's more realistic in the book since in the Middle Ages people married at that age.

[@emocomebackfromhell]

It's only creepy because of your state of mind. Had you not been raised to believe such things then you wouldn't be bothered by the idea. So stop thinking about things that do not matter. What was done is done, but leave your silly idea's of morality out of it. Different place and times means different morality.

[@Y05H13]

Surprised you guys didn't mention the Stannis' character assassination and the switch of arcs with Jon

[@adriang2544]

Josh Ladigus Agree The battle of ice is completely different they even changed the name.

[@unc54]

Stannis is a similar character in both the books and show. You guys make it seem like Stannis cured cancer in the books.

[@adriang2544]

Hemanth Swarna He did his daughter had grey scale an incurable disease and he saved her life by never giving up!

[@unc54]

Stannis giveth and taketh

[@ArdoBlueMoon]

He is far more just, rational and competent in the books.

[@hobnobhead4043]

Joffrey isn't a psychopath? Doesn't he cut open a pregnant cat in the book and show one of the babies to Robert?

[@danbrown5736]

Robert kicked the shit out of him lol

[@giantotter319]

Maybe he just wants to be a surgeon

[@HAL-vm3wn]

@@wshakamalaka7232 dude, it's Adolf Hitler, you should not expect anything less

[@taikajorma7276]

Adolf Hitler Wtf is wrong with you

[@irrelevant1242]

HAL 9000 Adolf actually liked animals lmao

[@TVJUNK85]

"they're going to deliver....because, how can't they?" *Dumb & Dumber* : "Allow us to introduce ourselves...."

[@Oyunacorn]

😆

[@ortasian]

D & D: "hold my beer"

[@danieldaw1778]

Dumb and dumber isn't accurate enough to describe the sheer enormity of their ineptitude. More like Dumbass & Dipshit.

[@kj2532]

Who’s dumb and dumber in GOT?

[@creepymaster9584]

@@kj2532 the writers

[@fraserwatson3034]

I prefer the book white walkers they are described as beautiful etc where as they look like ice devil's on the show, quite a nice twist having the main threat be these beautiful unreal creatures

[@derrilazkia1002]

it's easier to hate ugly things

[@dernvader6876]

'DARTH MAUL ON ICE'

[@catonkybord7950]

I agree! When my Dad watched the show, he kept mixing them up with the wights XD

[@factbeaglesarebest]

Absolutely agree. The entire concept of the Others is that they aren’t freaking Sauron... they are the product of misguided magic. They appear beautiful

[@elixorvideos]

The Night King, not the Night’s King. The Night’s King is an entirely different character.

[@missdire]

Thank you. I was scrolling through for this specific comment. I'm glad someone said it.

[@parkeydee]

The knights king was 13th lord commander of the knights watch

[@DietEllie]

I GOT SO ANNOYED BY THAT SINGLE THING

[@Divinemakyr]

@@parkeydee He was called the "Night's King."

[@davidworrall4899]

AKCHTUALLY

[@funnysarcasticguy7388]

Another GREAT scene was the one between Robert and Cersei in Season 1 Episode 7,where they talk about their personal feelings.

[@st3vie]

I agree! This scene was so well written. In my opinion the best of the first season and one of the best of the show!

[@nolanfields2239]

Funny Sarcastic Guy that was episode 5. Robert goes hunting in episode 6. It was giving Cersei another reason to want him dead. But they messed up the timeline on the show because Cersei plans Robert’s hunting accident after Ned confronts her about the incest but Robert had been hunting for some time by then.

[@theomegajuice8660]

Another great change that wasn't mentioned is Oberyn Martell. In the books he's not given much build up and you don't really know much about him until his fight with the Mountain. The show puts more effort into characterising him and choosing his charm and charisma so it gives the fight the added tension above how it will affect Tyrion's fate.

[@henryjohnson3703]

Don't forget combining his two speeches to Tyrion and changing it from "A poor sort of monster" to "That's just a baby"

[@factbeaglesarebest]

Maybe I misunderstood… but there are PLENTY of references to Oberyn… how he fights with a poisoned (at least suspected) weapon, how lethal, and loved/charismatic he is prior to the duel. I would say it doesn’t matter because the destroyed the whole Dorne plot. I honestly would not have mind more battles shown after the fact (like Tyrions fight when they fight Robb Starks smaller army at the Fork) and added the cast needed to involve both the Dorne plot line, and the Aegon/Faegon plot line. They are so crucial to the plot. What about what Tyrion is doing (he’s become a lot less depressed and nihilistic in Dance and his relationship with Penny, I feel like, inspires him to start negotiating with the mercenaries; it shows he’s back to being witty and cunning). They removed and destroyed so many great aspects of the last two books, even the first three… and then when they had no more material? They just were awful.

[@TheKosmicGladiator]

Imagine the battle scene where Daenerys and the Dothraki fight the Lannisters, Jamie rides on the attack Daenerys but Barristan is defending her and they are forced to battle, and Jamie is forced to kill his mentor and most looked up to the person apart from his father. Like, they both wouldn't want to do it, but they must. Missed opportunity.

[@aidanmcmanus7478]

the problem is Jaime could not kill Barristan. It would have been a close fight when Jaime had 2 hands, but Barristan could have easily defeated him then.

[@klondikelegitski675]

Yeah, Barristan would've stomped Jaime in the nuts.

[@r.b.4611]

@@aidanmcmanus7478 Though Jamie still had youth on his side Barristan was old.

[@wafflingmean4477]

@@r.b.4611 Barristan still kicks arse even despite his age. He goes up against one of Meereen's best pit fighters ever and barely breaks a sweat.

[@mr.forbes7300]

It would be like star wars episode 3

[@sambog9t]

I actually don't agree with Ramsay's change being better for the show. To me it's a more neutral change. I enjoyed Ramsay in the show, but fleshing him out came at the cost of Roose Bolton's character development, who I thoroughly enjoy as a villain in the book. Because while Ramsay is a psycho, Roose is a genius!

[@Just.Kidding]

Ramsay's change in the show was definitely not for the best. They completely erased all his subtlety and turned him into a b-movie horror villain. Granted, in the books, he isn't the most complex of characters and most of his depth is subtextual. You have to read between the lines to pick up on things like Roose pulling the strings and likely commanding/acting through Ramsay. Show Ramsay is simply ine-dimensional. You can watch any single scene and pretty much understand his entire character.

[@DeathofInk]

The poor handling of the Sand Snakes and Ellaria really depressed me as a book fan.

[@thezerowulf507]

I liked Arrianne as well.

[@turtleanton6539]

Yes

[@sonofjack6286]

Yeah, they completely ditched like 90 percent of the Dorne plot

[@JoshuaRellick]

In the books, the Sand Snakes spend most of their time under house arrest. I'm not sure why people are complaining about the Sand Snakes when they got far more action in the show than they did in the books.

[@ProjectMayhem4Chaoz]

@@JoshuaRellick because they completely butchered their characters. In the books the Sand Snakes are violent and headstrong women who want to avenge their father's death, but they respect their uncle Doran, and even love him, even though some of them consider him weak. And Ellaria Sand, a kind, gentle woman, who after Oberyn's death wanted nothing more than stopping the bloodshed, she would have never killed Doran, nor Myrcela. And if she had (which she wouldn't have), the Sand Snakes would have slaughtered her. The changes they made in the show demonstrate a complete and utter lack of understanding of the characters and their motivations

[@InsertNameHereBoi]

8:03 Wilko Johnson, the guy who played Ilyn Payne, is still alive. He got cancer, but then fortunately recovered from it.

[@JoshuaRellick]

I wish they had brought him back into the show.

[@Sbm1399]

This video is old, but I was hoping this comment was somewhere

[@Richard_Nickerson]

"The only good part about Dorne is Oberyn." Yes!

[@raini0705]

I was really sad over Margery's death. I actually liked her character.

[@lucasvillarreal6691]

linda chan yeah it sucks cuz they werent planning on killing her but Natalie Dormer wanted out of the role so she could pursue a different role. The show writers were forced to kill her off

[@Noctsire]

Lucas Villarreal nope you're wrong, she asked to be killed off earlier but they denied it

[@CrowzEye]

why did she want to be killed off?

[@robertlaurensnrgaard5178]

+Heathcliff So she could have time to be in other movies/shows.

[@savageblackfish5117]

I was also very dissapointed, she was so believable and had great screen presence.

[@sonofjack6286]

Books: Barristan arrests Hizdarh zo Loraq and is a good fighter Show: Barristan gets killed by a bunch of rich terrorists in an alley

[@Carlos-ln8fd]

His fight with the guard at the end of Dance is so badass

[@sonofjack6286]

@@Carlos-ln8fd Damn straight, one guy made a video named "Barristan the Badass", and it's about that specific chapter.

[@Carlos-ln8fd]

@Kenny McCormick yeah it wasn't a bad death scene i agree. it's still a disappointing for me though. It's like, when the show didn't know what to do with a character they'd just kill them off whereas in the books, George would always find ways to make them more interesting and give them more to do.

[@sonofjack6286]

@@Carlos-ln8fd Yeah, I mean they couldn't have included the Brazen Beasts, I'd even settle for Grey Worm being put in charge of them.

[@PK-ql5en]

“They are going to deliver because how can’t they”. I am here after season 8 episode 3 and 4 to tell you that they CAN’T deliver....

[@damienhine1861]

Arya brought out a warm side of Tywin we didn't see at any other time.

[@amberkelly3187]

Oberon was such a great character. Damn! I could have watched him for years. That was a brutal loss.

[@nunliski]

Yeah I fucking love Shakespeare too.

[@Miller09095]

I thought they kinda hurt Varys and Littlefinger as characters. Littlefinger was made creepy and untrustworthy when most book characters actually trust him. Meanwhile Varys was "yeah good guy Varys" instead of "I cut out the tongues of my little birds so they can't spill my secrets" Varys.

[@wanderingrandomer]

I feel like that goes all the way back to Season 1, where the show tried to subvert the expectations that Varys was not to be trusted and Littlefinger was.

[@de4084]

@Australiantatious In the real world as well.

[@BingBangPoe]

Watching this video after the show's finale just makes me sadder.

[@BingBangPoe]

@Kenny McCormick Exactly, makes me even sadder we didn't get what we deserved.

[@raymond-reviews]

Honestly Dorne and Stannis Baratheon were gutted like fish in the show. Stannis was a loving father and he would NEVER sacrifice his daughters for stone dragons, let alone good weather in the show. Total Bull$h!t. Also, they could of easily made a scene were Doran pulls Ellaria aside and tell her "Hey I have a plan, I've met with Varys and were going to support Dany Targaryen. Were going to usurp the Lannisters, just wait!" That's all they had to do, but instead she decides to kill the family of the man she loved. WTF!

[@RachelG1979]

Raymond Reviews will be interesting to find out what happens to Shireen. GRRM has to have a book come out eventually.

[@alonreshef8315]

Raymond Reviews you know nothing GRRM confirmed that shireen will die the same way And sadly the same with hodor

[@Dreamfyre_]

Lmao I love to break it to you, Stannis ia going to do the same thing in the book, watch.

[@weiyin8046]

i wouldn’t say stannis was a loving father but he was a dutiful father

[@mihailodjordjevic2191]

noder nedarim be-aba and TAZY No, you misinformation-spreading jackasses, you know nothing. Martin said Shireen dies in the next book. Now if you'd actually read the books, you'd be aware of the fact that it's physically impossible for Stannis to be the one who burns her. It's 100% going to be Melisandre acting out alone.

[@MrTedOffensive]

Wilko Johnson who played Illyn Payne is not dead. He was diagnosed with cancer and had radical surgery and is in recovery.

[@shmooveyea]

Dude, rad surgery, bro.

[@411marcos]

Well the point about the WW didn’t age well

[@turtleanton6539]

😂😂

[@lorduxas3908]

No. 1 Best change: ageing up all of the main characters No. 1 Worst change: Euron Greyjoy

[@connorclark8100]

Agreed, ageing them up by a few years, just made the stories in the show slightly more realistic. Bran being 7 at the start of book 1, as opposed to 10, and Rickon being 3 as opposed to 6.

[@lorduxas3908]

Connor Clark also it would’ve been so strange for Jon to join the Nights Watch at 14 goddamn years old

[@kensho4623]

Jaime: *standing over Lannister army* Euron: “FINGER IN THE BUM.”

[@nottopcat5956]

Connor Clark relatable rather than believable. Kids started young back in the day

[@aarondubourg3706]

If you you NEED to work to survive you will even if you're a child. We live in a world where its possible for you to survive your whole life without working, sure thats the 1% but it is possible. Most of us still NEED to work to survive, its just we can we have the luxury to wait a few decades.

[@joelara1652]

I also hate how they didn't make all the Starks wargs. Jon was one , of course Bran, Rickon too but he's too feral, Sansa was , Arya was and it was part of her training, and Robb was one because it was said he would be in the war room for hours just staring at nothing

[@mphcox2277]

Joe Lara that would be overpowered

[@mathewperryfan]

MPH COX arya is really op now anyway. The way she easily killed all the Frey's

[@paradox5672]

Joe Lara agreed.

[@nikolaradojevic7]

Sansa isn't because her direwolf died way too early to establish a psychic connection, but everyone else yeah.

[@TheNyuuHime]

Yeah, in the books Arya used her warg abilities when she was asleep, so when she warged to Nymeria she even took her dead mother out of the water. If she wouldn't do that Catelyn would never become Lady Stoneheart

[@MrMineHeads.]

Why did they NOT include the Tysha twist when Jaime releases Tyrion. It makes Tyrion's killing so much more understandable, and develops him even further. God, what a let down the series has been past s5.

[@hansmahr8627]

I think they left it out because the Tysha story didn't really play that big of a role in the show. It was told one time and there are some references here and there, but overall, it's just part of his backstory. In the books, it's much easier to give it a more prominent role because we can read about what Tyrion thinks, not just what he says or does. So in the show, Tysha isn't really a character, she's not really present to the viewer. Because of that, making her the key motivation for Tyrion's actions would not have been as effective dramatically. And I also don't think that it was necessary: we have seen Tyrion's relationship with his father, we have seen Tywin's contempt for him and then of course we see him sleeping with the woman that Tyrion loved. That's enough motivation for Tyrion to kill him, especially if we consider the mental state he's in at that point and the fact that his father still continues to berate him.

[@ryansarratt7520]

@@hansmahr8627 I would disagree, the tysha confession would make sense as to why tyrion makes mistakes after leaving kings landing.

[@mmg0067]

Tywin was also much better in the show

[@whoknows7968]

The show just gave us more time with Tywin during the Arya storyline whereas in the books we only really see him hating on Tyrion

[@kaiforward7843]

I agree, the main reason being Charles dance acted it better than I ever imagined Tywyn when I read the books, he's one of the perfect castings the show has done

[@brendanmcnally1098]

MMG 006 years old o

[@squamish4244]

A lot of the characters are much more interesting on the show - and not just because of acting, but - gasp! - writing.

[@warfriday]

I also find tyrion's trial in the show to be better than the book.

[@MrFarnanonical]

8:15 Wilko Johnson who played Ilyn Payne didn't die. He was diagnosed with terminal cancer so he left the show. He only had a few months to live but the time came and past and they eventually found out that he was misdiagnosed. His cancer was much more treatable than previously thought. He's still alive actually.

[@rishwiz9]

Passed away last year

[@arthurmont-morency5027]

It's funny to imagine that he got both annoyed that he was misdiagnosed and happy he wouldn't die

[@joaorenz7784]

Update: the show didn't deliver the White Walkers and the Long Night. After 8 years of mystery and tension building, the Night King finally stormed Winterfell! To kill Theon Greyjoy...

[@loriannwhite8384]

...And got knifed like a punk a$$ bit@h. No battle. No great fighting. Since Arya Stark first stabbing/killing she has never been shown to actually have the required skill set, of fighting & killing.

[@epiphany7189]

it was really f*cked up to kill Barristen Selmy lile that.

[@NaderRaafat]

A terrible change you missed out imo is the Tyrion's trial/discussion with Jamie in the cell. Like in the show it sort of seems out of the blue why Jamie saves him/he murders Tywin, and Shae's betrayal is a lot less impactful because it already seemed like they were 'on the rocks', but in the books it's just so much darker when Jamie explains his 'debt' and he goes to murder Tywin. I just felt that was so much more depth to Tyrion that they took out in the show

[@joy_choe]

Don’t forget about Jaime’s confession of Tysha, Tyrion’s character arc just felt kind of stagnant after fleeing Westeros

[@shannond7437]

Joy Choe Yeah they didn’t touch the small but important notes. Macabre Storytelling here on YT did a great job pointing out these small but important details. They all add up!

[@Liquidtank]

Imagine a future when the books are finished and someone with a lot of money makes an animated series where it mostly follows the story of the books while keeping all the good stuff from the show and casting all the available show actors to voice themselves. I think that'll be amazing

[@lathanandrews417]

Liquidtank MY THOUGHTS EXACTLY!!! In several years, I could see this happening. There are so films and tv series (too many to count) that have multiple adaptations throughout the years. Most of them based on books too. Just look at ANY story from BritLit and there will be 5 versions of it. I think it’s only a matter of time before animation makes a bigger splash in the more adult content arena. And financially, I think it would be more logical too. Great idea!!

[@thekub32]

I don't think I'm ready for an animated version of George's world. It's an emotional thing. It would be ridiculous to me. Also, I think it would cost WAY more.

[@jwafflepants14]

I think that an anime for game of thrones would work pretty well, they would be able to go into different characters' back stories and such in the form of fillers.

[@RobinDavey-ge8vn]

Kalem Babar do you mean it would cost more? Because I don’t think that would be true. Even discounting the CGI and how famous the cast are in the later seasons (meaning they probably get paid a tonne more than they used to), the sets and the cast of Game of Thrones have been pretty great since the beginning. Whereas an animation wouldn’t have to deal with actual physical stuff like that (e.g. settings, shoots/reshoots etc...) so the story could be much less inhibited from the very beginning. Just look at the budget of some well done anime compared to the budget of most GoT seasons.

[@LaughOutFrikinLoud]

If it were to be animated, I would love for the animators of Netflix’s Castlevania to produce the show

[@valentin-cristiansoare1452]

Ser Bron of the FOOKING Black Water.

[@EnderWarden]

Jamie FOOKING Lannister.

[@ForsakenDreamer7]

@@EnderWarden Podrick FOOKING Payne.

[@hecticscone]

Ser Bronn Reyne of the FOOKING Blackwater*

[@mnmmcg3543]

I actually prefer the Others from the books over the show.

[@MasterPoppers]

+MNM mcg Ditto.

[@nicolasguzman519]

but they haven't had so much plot in the books....they are just there walking and that's it

[@jimmymcnulty4304]

In the books we haven't seen them really but they are described as elegant, inhumanely beautiful, in the show they're kind of just generic ice zombies. Old looking. I don't dislike them, they're just more intriguing in the books so far.

[@CommunicatorJosef]

I agree, sure there was less action, but its about the threat, I remember reading the letter from the people at hard home about the creatures of the sea coming after them and thinking that the others were completely unstoppable, no one would survive them

[@cyril3395]

The Dorne story is the one that literally gives me sleepless nights! Like why would they???!!! Dorne has great stories!! I wish they did the dorne story and Griff's story!

[@vglalves]

One of the changes I hate the most was Stannis burning his daughter and the Davos arc (making lord Manderly a more active character and not just that fat guy who agrees with lady Lyanna Mormont)

[@pimpdaddyg2081]

GRRM already said stannis is gonna burn his daughter

[@mysouptoocold1656]

Ethan Gick we could have seen Skagos and unicorn cannibals

[@mysouptoocold1656]

Ethan Gick not stannis. Most likely his wife would. He left the fort having his men promise to put shireen on the iron throne if he dies

[@mihailodjordjevic2191]

Ethan Gick no he didn't you lying sack of shit. He said Shireen dies in winds. Not how, or who kills her. It's physically impossible for stannis to kill her and you would know this had you actually read the books, instead of just reading forums and spreading misinformation.

[@darknevermore3]

Euron is my favorite character in the books. Smart as Tyrion and as evil as Ramsey. The show is such a letdown.

[@evoxghiretti]

Much more smarter than Tyrion definitely as evil as Ramsey but possibly more sadistic.

[@darknevermore3]

@@evoxghiretti Have you read the Euron chapter in the bit of Winds of Winter that was released? Finding out Euron had Valyrian steel ARMOR gave me chills. The places he must have gone; secrets and dark magic.

[@evoxghiretti]

Jack Legion no and I had not planned on finding that out until the book. So thanks I guess.

[@darknevermore3]

@@evoxghiretti ...sorry. If it's any consolation it's the first chapter in the book and was put online by G.R.R. Martin as a teaser. Go read it! It's from Aeron's perspective and fleshes out Euron a little more. Read it and tell me what you think!

[@darknevermore3]

@@evoxghiretti docs.google.com/document/d/1TOzYKnHHFS87I2B1Mx1xaF0zoR5pjdl5bLh9Fzi6Dts/edit If you're interested. Again, sorry. Wasn't thinking about spoilers.

[@Juancilra]

I think Yara’s (Asha’s) raid to free Theon should be remembered as a terrible invented plot twist by the show. It was the first real instance where the show seemed to completely disregard the realities of the world of the books - especially geography and time frame. It was contrived mostly for the sake of some Hollywood-like action / fight-scene and some unimportant plot / character points. In the books, sailing from the Iron Islands around to the east side of Westeros and up a river to the Dreadfort would be a journey of months - unthinkable.This effing with the map and the timeline accelerated in later seasons. By season 7, all sense of time and distance were out the window and it really undermined the important world-building aspects of fantasy. We all know that by Seasons 7 & 8, the action was jumping around across all of Westeros - with certain characters crossing the continent and appearing in scenes in multiple distant locations within a single episode. In the early seasons, there was a proper sense of time - a trip up/down the King’s Road from Winterfell to King’s Landing took weeks, even in peacetime with the best of horses. Same for Dany’s travels across Essos. The audience felt this because it would take several episodes for a character to arrive somewhere and stuff usually happened along the way. D&D totally lost that side of the story by the end, and Yara's needless raid was the first time they allowed themselves to ditch that part of the books.

[@LukeJones-ib5mq]

I think my least favourite change was Robb's marriage storyline. It was handled much better in the books where he had to abandon his oath to protect Jeyne and his honour as opposed to just putting everything at risk because he fell in love

[@vin8754]

It really helped show the relationship he and Jon had growing up without just telling it to your face. Robb knew what Jon had to deal with growing up as a bastard and would have never wanted that for one of his sons, he doesn't just forsake his oath to the Freys for some idealised version of 'true love' that the show tries to tell, he does it for the sake of his unborn child. Also kind of helps tie him to Ned, who had similarly forsaken his own honour to provide Jon with a home

[@Avatarbee]

I love that moment where Jon clashes swords with a white walker. First Jon stares at his sword. Then the walker stares at the sword. And then they give eachother that confused look.

[@ortigasraymundo]

I ilike arya with tywin...i like arya with the hound...i like arya with the faceless man. Arya is a whole story herself.

[@travdye347]

Ortigas Raymundo until she goes to Bravos and her whole story turns to shit...In the show I'm talking about

[@echs457]

travdye347 yee

[@richardsantanna5398]

travdye347 Eh, it's also shitty in the books so far.

[@travdye347]

Richard Bahena some may find it boring but it least at makes sense...you definitely cant say that for the show. Her story since first leaving Westeros in the show is laughably bad

[@jkl799]

Ortigas Raymundo: The great genius of George R.R. Martin is that there are so many unique and amazing characters anyone can find a character that they love for a variety of different ways

[@OneOnOne1162]

I think Jon in general is done better in the books. There's so much politics in the Night's Watch too that just get completely disregarded on the show. And here's a thing about the Sansa-Ramsay marriage... I think that in itself was not a bad idea. But I think we should've seen Sansa pull a Margaery on Ramsay. Have her control Ramsay like Margaery controlled Joffrey. Because in my opinion, that's where season 4 left her. It left her in a position where she seemed like she was going to become a player. Destroying the Boltons from within and preparing Winterfell for a Vale take-over would've been great, imo.

[@OneOnOne1162]

Overall, I thought the show did a good job adapting the books... until season 4. After season 4 it goes downhill, imo.

[@SonGokuSleepTherapy]

ramsey is too smart for that

[@Argos-xb8ek]

Also its weird thinking that jon is only 15-17 and is leading the watch

[@kovu1530]

meh, its not taht weird, imo.

[@berniehoe9960]

OneOnOne1162 Joffrey was more impulsive and dumber than Ramsay, that arc they did with Margaery and Joffrey would’ve made Sanaa’s character better, but it would’ve dumbed down Ramsay’s character. There really was no way for the Jeyne Poole story line with Sansa to work.

[@sonofjack6286]

She protecc She attac But most importantly She make Tywin Lannister laugh

[@sonofjack6286]

@Austin Downing Why OMG, is it good or bad?

[@Veniuu]

@@sonofjack6286 I was goin all ''awwww'', I liked it

[@sonofjack6286]

@@Veniuu Oh okay.

[@kyidyl]

Yeah I was so confused by the exclusion of the young Gryff story. Because eliminating him and Quentin takes away some of the tension of "well, Dany's coming for Westeros, but Westeros is coming for Dany". It weakens her connection and lessens her impact, because in the show no one knows WTF Dany has been up to.

[@sophiawilson8696]

It Quentyn Martell

[@silverprince2099]

And victorian greyjoy

[@cooperzero6070]

One of my favorite scenes in the books is when Selmy talks to Daenerys and pretty much says that you do not have the support of the common people in Westeros. It was a great growing up moment for her and I wish that they kept it instead of the whole break the wheel/but I'm still queen thing

[@nathanlandolt5505]

Jorah had that conversation with her in season 2

[@HaIfaxa]

He also has the conversation with her in book 1

[@Thrashmetaltherapy]

I wish Victarion was in the show

[@fontainus7302]

IceFyre Eurons character in the show is more like Victarion than Eurons book character

[@brettwilson2589]

Some Kind Metalhead I think they might have gone for a merging of the two, just like what they did with Gendry/Edric Storm. Especially since Euron has an axe that resembles Victarion's

[@mysouptoocold1656]

We miss our meat headed squid

[@ad0lfchrist]

I am very happy to correct you guys on something. Wilko Johnson, the actor who played Ilyn Payne, did not actually pass away. He was thought to be suffering of a terminal form of cancer but he miraculously got better. He lives to this day (at 73). I was very glad to learn that so I wanted to share.

[@jeffersonsantos4603]

After watching Season 7 and looking in retrospect regarding Ser Barristan Selmy's death, they had to kill the military expert off, otherwise all of Tyrion's and Dany's stupid decisions would be promptly rebated by him (more like laughed out at). What a cheap way to get rid of a character, but then.. there's Littlefinger's death that is even more ridiculous..

[@Floristini]

nosreffej I know this comment was done a while back but I see people saying Littlefinger's death was dumb all the time but honestly... was it really? I mean, you have to put yourself in the directors' shoes here. There's only one more season left, and it's going to be focused on the War for the Dawn and the conclusion to the Iron Throne dispute. What role does Littlefinger play here? What does he add to the show at this point? Just look at the characters left or those they killed off. They killed Olenna, they killed the Sand Snakes and they presumably killed Ellaria because they couldn't really be tied to the Daenerys/Jon plotline. Just like Littlefinger couldn't be tied to future plot points. This show is known for having a shit-ton of different storylines and parallel character developments, but now almost all plotlines have either been concluded or merged, just like how pretty much every character has converged this last season. They have also built Littlefinger to be this genius mastermind of a man who plans everything ahead so that he always is a step ahead of everyone, but how is he going to get the upper hand against a near-omnipresent entity? There was nothing he could've done to get himself out of that one. He laid traps all around until eventually he was trapped by his own traps. Littlefinger was a good character, but he simply had to go.

[@squamish4244]

D&D take a lot of shit for the more questionable narrative decisions made from Season 5 onwards, but GRRM had written them into a corner beforehand. By the end of the last book, he had set the stage for Danaerys to become so powerful that all dramatic tension with her human opponents would be lost. D&D had no choice but to make Tyrion look like an idiot so that her forces could be weakened enough so that Cersei presented a believable threat. It was important to keep Cersei alive into Season 8, because an all-out war with the Army of the Dead is less interesting than a three-sided war where one group of the Living is trying to fuck over the other, to show how humans will sabotage each other even in the face of dire existential threats (cough global warming cough). It also keeps the show more tonally consistent with earlier seasons while still allowing it to evolve. Now Dany has to defend herself from attack on two fronts, from two different kinds of enemies. Cersei's fall will thus be even more satisfying. GRRM simply left off with too many plotlines and characters to tell a coherent story in his originally planned six books. He should never have expanded the story into Dorne, and D&D did not intend to at first either. The Ironborn plot with Euron suddenly appearing as Westeros Hitler came out of nowhere halfway through the second act, so his character had to be reduced to his show status, which is more appropriate. Littlefinger's scheming had become so labyrinthine I don't even know if George knew where he was going to go with it, and the stage was crowded with too many contenders for top human villain. Cersei is better placed to serve that function, has had a better villain arc and also the powerful dynamic with Jaime, so he went. Etc.

[@squamish4244]

Yes! I agree on all points.

[@raynew720]

I was glad that Arnya & Sansa (mostly Arnya, tho Sansa finally started playing LittleFinger's game & using that game against him - I thought perhaps Arnya was going to kill Sansa for a little while!) were Littlefinger's undoing. He played 1 trap to many & he basically taught Sansa how to circumvent people's minds & actions to her. In end, he was his own worst enemy & was responsible for his undoing. Margaery's Grandmother, I can't spell her name AND I don't want to crucify it by attempting to spell it - This woman was an amazing teacher to her granddaughter. She clearly had an iron will but played 'The Game' with a soft silk glove - I LOVE THIS! She literally teaches Margarey how to manipulate Cersei's sons - ESP THE SNAKE & ABUSER JOFFREY! He didn't hurt Margaery the way he hurt Sansa & to be quite frank, the genteel touch hidden by a shrewd & wicked intellect often found among strong Southern women, did her a great service! If it wasn't for the sparrows & the court-trial, I think Margarery might have actually put Cersei down, with her grandmother's assistance... albeit, she would have had to find a way to deal with Jaime Lannister b/c I don't think she could have really taken out Cersei without first ridding themselves of Jaime. Gregor would have been easily put down once Cersei was dealt with but Jaime didn't seem capable of turning his back, or his loyalty, against the sister who clearly used him to serve her own purposes & quite importantly, as a means to indulge in her daddy-issues... I did enjoy keeping up with the silk-glove genteel elderly woman's manipulations b/c they had such far-reaching changes to the betterment of her granddaughter's advancement in power.

[@raynew720]

As a writer, I can tell you that it is ABSOLUTELY possible that George didn't know where he was going with the character of Littlefinger. ("Littlefinger's scheming had become so labyrinthine I don't even know if George knew where he was going to go with it"). Characters do take on a life of their own. It's why there are many reiterations of great advice written for aspiring and even accomplished writers with regards to, "Kill the Little Darlings." This is a part of teaching writers that it's often best to be prudent with simply killing characters & editing down for a final draft/polished work. It's hard for most writers to destroy some of their most truly diabolical characters & yes, they really do take on a life of their own. The writer IS showing the story; hwr, many characters literally take on a life of their own long before the writer realizes that the character has become far too complex and entangled through sub-plots, that are almost impossible to remove them from the primary plot of the story itself. It's why there are usually a handful of characters that die in an unexpected manner b/c they have become so cunning nobody thinks they'll be ensnared by their own trappings and/or the sub- to sub-sub-plot & characters' lives are left to the readers' imaginations.... the writers don't necessarily known how best to dispose of them so they leave their futures open-ended. This wasn't really possible with the MASSIVE ending planned for GOT. Too much is at stake to bring characters like Littlefinger forward & clearly, Cersai is much more of a foe & force to reckon with. Littlefinger had power thru manipulation. Cersai has power b/c she's not afraid of taking out anybody that stands in her way, INCLUDING HER SON...

[@malcolmmacinnis247]

Stannis isn't dead in the book. Read the winds of winter chapters. Stannis is going to use holes in the ice to trap Rooses horses it's weird

[@thekub32]

It's brilliant. THE KING WHO CARED!

[@noneofyourbusiness43]

The True King Stannis is going to take a page out of True History! en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_on_the_Ice

[@jackcoogan310]

I think Young Griff is just unnecessary for the show. It’s a great storyline, but there isn’t enough time to do it right

[@SchulzEricT]

I think Young Griff would've been amazing in the show; if you're Martin, don't you have them do the Young Griff storyline then reveal that Griff isn't actually a Targaryen? Then when the next book comes out, everybody is assuming he's an imposter, but in the books you pull a switcheroo and have him actually be a Targaryen. His character seems like a perfect way to set up expectations for the book to subvert.

[@factbeaglesarebest]

Faegon*

[@a_mage_as_old_as_joe1598]

That's what they say right? The storyline wasn't necessary itself but kinda ruined varys hole motivation I mean why he does what he does in the show? It actually make no sense.

[@IloveGorgeousGeorge]

And is it really even relevant? Honestly, it seems so,ambiguous who he really even is

[@KawaiiPockyEater]

Their optimism and hopes for Season 8 broke my heart...

[@bvyner5727]

I think all book readers and even most of the TV show watchers would cherish a fully adapted Animated Series that follows the books 100%, no deviations. It could only be done when the books are completely finished or 4 or 5 years after Winds Of Winter. It would be also cool if it was done in POV perspective.

[@NerdSoup]

Agreed. Game of Thrones would make a great anime.

[@dmitrigeorge8523]

Nerd Soup eh, maybe not anime. Just animated like Disney or Last Airbender stuff. But I agree. And, of course, add to it all without taking too much

[@afrosymphony8207]

It sounds like a great idea but trust me most of you will find it boring as fuck but will be in denial.There is nothing more boring than knowing 100% what will happen in every scene of a movie. Yes it would make a great anime but they better not stick to the story 100%

I would rather want them to work on spinoffs instead of animation. But still, its a good idea.

[@QueensBeryRules]

B Vyner Castlevania anime style 🙏

[@WingedBagels]

in the book, it's not explicitly shown to us whether or not the white walkers are evil and that's great. hardhome was such a great episode that I let it pass but having the walkers kill the three eyed raven is bullshit. it pretty much cements how evil they are.

[@tobiaskland2232]

Bananarama well in the show they were made by the children of the forest to kill all humans shit like that (they are telling two different stories)

[@nicolasguzman519]

such a shame so you will not like the winds of winter because that's going to happen in that book.

[@godspeed2272]

Nicolás Beltrán maybe expand your point. Instead of unexplainedly talking in absolutes, say oh George confirmed Hodor dies the same in the book so the Three Eyed Crow must die the same too

[@spectrent9870]

Godspeed the three eyed crow don’t have to get killed by the others. He dies but maybe not the same way.

[@moola9755]

Margery and olenna are so excellent in the show, and I love their chemistry and how they clearly came in here to fuck shit up and keep each other safe. They always give a sense of being the most aware and the most prepared

[@sirjoey3137]

I love Brienne in the books, you get some awesome scenes (like Brienne vs Rorge/Biter. And Shagwell the Fool at the Whispers) but more importantly you get to see more of the world and the impact of the war which just makes the world feel so much more lived in and real.

[@keeganshigh]

Jamie ain't gonna be bangin her, that's for sure.

[@masterofdisguise1112]

I thought I was the only one that wanted Joffrey to come back to Kill The Sparrows 😂

[@queenlele6193]

Master Of Disguise Bruh I felt the same way

[@RachelG1979]

Joffrey would have stomped them in the ground!!!

[@NovaLena22]

I'm not so sure that Joffrey would have done anything about those sparrows unless they personally interfered with him. But they could have easily seduced him by appealing to his narcissism. On the other hand, Tywin would have completely annihilated them. He would have peeled the skin off of the High Sparrow in front of the red keep and littered the streets with the bodies of all the little sparrows.

[@laughsngasps]

Master Of Disguise I def did

[@jaydenp1747]

Omg same no way he would have stood for their shit.

[@trisbres]

It's over Night's King! I have the high ground!

[@edvard8449]

Dat Elf no man

[@zam9366]

Red Raven yes man

[@sephirothrikusora]

Night King: You know nothing Aegon Targaryean.

[@MasterPoppers]

+Red Raven No, Dat Elf is right. Night's King was the 13th Lord Commander of the Night's Watch, allegedly. The Night King is the first White Walker, produced by the CotF.

[@valarmorghulis7934]

Tristan Diogenes nightakin'

[@King_Stannis_Baratheon]

No mention Stannis Plot line Slaughter?

[@Snormite]

The One True King and a dutiful man...

[@ClaireYunFarronXIII]

King Stannis Baratheon Boooorrriiiinnnnggggg......

[@mohamedsalah2368]

"she was the only one who made tywin lannister laugh ." tywin's laugh : "HA."

[@kotrein9704]

i liked how they did robb stark in the show, kinda sucked that he was older but richard madden's performance made up for it

[@paradox5672]

Dutchstuff I hated that his wife was at the red wedding, and the show left out that her family was in on the red wedding ( She didn't know anything about it and lived Rob).

[@AnitaClue]

Her family wasn't in on the Red Wedding, if they had been none of them would have been killed at it. Her mother was conspiring with Tywin behind everyone's backs though. Robb didn't take Jeyne to The Twins because he thought Walder would take that as an affront.

[@mysouptoocold1656]

But they created a mary sue for him

[@thatsthat2612]

Jerome Flynn who plays bronn had a singing career with robson green who he acted with in London's burning. I knew he'd sing in thrones at some point, just a bit of random info for you guys :-D

[@nickd1870]

I was introduced and fell in love with the show way before I read the books. but After season 5 disappointment, I started reading the books and couldn't believe how rich and amazing the books are. I now understand why alot of book readers get so Frustrated with the show runners. unfortunately, after season 4 the show went on a completely different path from the books. I really don't understand why the show runners wanted to leave so much out from the books, while adding their own lame plots, plus speeding up the process. GRRM gave them pure Gold! but for some crazy reason the show runners elected not to use that gold!!

[@midlandsdruss6006]

Exactly! I would love to love the show, but it is soooo fucking frustrating to see your favorite saga being turned like that... Don't get me wrong, some changes were inavoidable, some were really good, but some were just absolutly shitting on the material.

[@Tomoesong]

If i remember correctly ..they actually wanted it to be longer but child actors were growing year by year.They didn't want to change actors or something like that not to dissapoint fans.But while speeding up they're killing characters by so easily which is stupid while giving more time for some boring parts of love and sex.

[@saltytattie833]

Nick D bro have you read FFC? It made me fall out of love with the book series and I can't bring myself to finish ADWD just because of how boring and Brienne FFC was.

[@EbuCallinav]

Really? I found the books quite painful to read. He constantly goes on pages long word fits of description to describe useless things. He doesn't understand how to use the phrase "It was all I could do to ______" correctly. And he introduces a lot of unimportant filler that seem to only be there because he wants to write a different story with them later.

[@RanMouri82]

11:38 Got to disagree with you about how the books portrayed Ramsay. For one, his treatment of Theon was more vicious in the books, and the show left out the original Reek, which showcased Ramsay's violent cunning. It will be interesting to see how things go down between Ramsay and Stannis in Winds of Winter.

[@MRJTD99]

Agreed. The whole scene involving Ramsay, Reek, and Jeyne was far more disturbing than anything Ramsay did specifically in the show.

[@realdavidjones1623]

@@MRJTD99 what happened in the books?

[@roronoalaw7772]

He didn’t castrate Theon in the books.

[@roronoalaw7772]

@@realdavidjones1623 He forced a girl called Jeyne Westerling to perform sexual acts with his dogs.

[@englishatheart]

@@roronoalaw7772 Because that's somehow worse than all the other shit he did. 🙄 It was awful, no doubt, but it isn't worse than raping his wife and forcing her to fuck the dogs. It isn't worse than flaying people alive. Men are not their penises.

[@edvard8449]

How about Rickon's fate and "the North Remembers" plot in season 6? When Smalljon Umber brought him to Ramsey with that direwolf's head even the director says "it looks small to be a direwolf" and I seriously thought that the Umbers were going to betray Ramsey and that the Manderlys were going to join Jon Snow mid battle, instead the Manderlys weren't here, Smalljon attacks and fights to the death and Sansa the White comes to save the day with the Knights of the Vale. It looks better in the episode, but it destroys the whole "the North Remembers" plot.

[@Sigismund-von-Luxembourg]

Smalljon died at the red wedding defending his king in the books now book version of the umbers could potentially get pissed off at Jon for letting the wildlings through because of the one old one thats in charge can't recall his name but his wife was stolen from him by wildlings and he really fucking hates them

[@swagatochatterjee7104]

U Sir are a true Northman, others are suffering from amnesia because "The North Hardly Remembers".

[@brandondano1995]

Jorah is one of my favorite characters in the show, and Ian Glenn makes the character.

[@Karifi]

For me is Jorah and Davos who made the show

[@pouncebaratheon4178]

What about Ygritte not letting Tormund finish his bear story??

[@johnnybuffon4623]

What about the Jeyne Westerling/Talisa change? The hints that Jeyne might have been a spy for the Lannisters, she didn't die at the Red wedding, etc. George Martin once said that she'll be the prologue character in Winds of winter.

[@SerPitr]

Also I think the show could have included Ramsay from the beginning, when HE was reek in the dungeons, and how he corrupted Theon, it really added more depth to the Theon&Ramsay ark in the books compared to the show where Ramsay just appeared out of nowhere.

[@MrTylerMatyas]

"They made the fans root for Cersei." I could have sworn I was happy watching her get beaten and starved, so if rooting for her death is what you meant then I fully agree.

[@dianasaur2442]

Because by "the fans" they mean "MrTylerMatyas". Because you speak for all GoT fans.

[@MrTylerMatyas]

*sigh* So, as I referenced only myself after I quoted them, it should have been clear that I was using my personal experience and wasn't speaking on behalf of a community with millions of people in it. So, I suppose I'll write out my thought process. 1 - I am, by definition, a fan so they mean me as well as literally any one else who falls under that category. 2 - I do not speak for all GoT fans, and following that statement they should not have made a blanket statement concerning all the GoT fans, and I was directly addressing that. 3 - I know zero people in my personal life who were rooting for Cersei, and that's a sample size of around 200. This is anecdotal evidence and cannot be used as an actual argument towards the amount of fans who possibly WERE rooting for Cersei (which I am not making), and this is not to say that no-one rooted for Cersei (which I am not claiming), nor that anyone was forbidden FROM rooting for Cersei, but merely that they did not, in fact, MAKE the fans root for Cersei. Sorry for your misunderstanding, dude.

[@dianasaur2442]

Jesus Christ man, okay. I didn't expect an essay hahaha. Thanks for caring so much that I understand you.

[@MrTylerMatyas]

Just wanted to clarify.

[@darkfox1605]

are u both serious? he is speaking in first person so he is speaking about himself... and why do u try to explain urself to dumb ppl? i hope u re not US americans... u re perpetuating a stereotype (or it isnt a stereotype and just true)

[@khalidsalameh9187]

The actor who plays Ilyn pain is still alive he beat his battle with cancer

[@ZigZag-mw9ir]

Hardhome hasn’t happened in the books yet...in a dance with dragons Jon is planning to go North but it hasn’t happened yet. So you can’t really compare them