Why Ollie Chose Rim Brakes For His New Pinarello Dogma F12

We're very lucky at GCN to get some amazing road bikes, and Ollie's choice of rim brakes for his Pinarello F12 has raised a few eyebrows. In this video Ollie talks about the reasons why he chose rim brakes over disc and gives a quick overview of the bike specs.
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[@bresley85]

Crank not in the 3 o'clock position, Valves not aligned, No gold chain, That's just nice Ollie mate...

[@adriancastellanos101]

Took the words right out of my mouth friend

[@rrobotman]

No depth of field - poor effort that.

[@Bilbo736]

dont forget that hes in the shot

[@robbchastain3036]

Such a pity, as the custom paint alone makes it a splendid.

[@dalezapple2493]

LoL

[@grimp53]

Rim brakes will be my choice for as long as they will be available. Mainly for the ease of (self-)maintenance. No fiddling with fluids and bleeding procedures. Beautiful bike BTW, Ollie.

[@williamko4751]

All I mean ALL disc brake have rubbing noise. No thanks.

[@Penta_Penguin_237]

​@@williamko4751 That is not true. I have a Canyon Grizl and a Canyon Aeroad in SRAM Rival Etap AXS and they both don't have any rubbing noise whatsoever coming from the discs. Plus they brake consistently better than any Durace rim brake I have ever had.

[@borislro6825]

I have bikes with disk and rim breaks. Although disks are good when doing off-road rides requiring big braking power, rim breaks are enough for road rides and races outside of mountains. Two points not mentioned in the video: 1. It’s easier thus cheaper to do maintenance in rim vs disc brakes; and 2. for amateur racers who do not have team support, it’s much easier to change fast a wheel with rim than disc brakes. It’s sad that manufacturers push for disc only nowadays. It doesn’t fit the market for casual Sunday riders who need easy to use and maintain bikes

[@martyweeks7594]

Rim brakes, clincher tyres & Ultegra mechanical is good enough for me.

[@madyogi6164]

Pretty much perfect. Fine for me is Tiagra, except support and wheels (Ultegra).

[@ViveSemelBeneVivere]

@@madyogi6164 ... but only _absolutely perfect_ with disk brakes.

[@Mr.Anders0n_]

@TheNiall not really. I avoid disk brakes when I buy a bike even if the price is the same. I don't do technical descents in wet weather and I perform most of my bike's maintenance (disk brakes are way more difficult to repair). So disk brakes? Thanks, but no thanks.

[@Mr.Anders0n_]

@Beelzebot no, i don't think they're easier to repair than linear pull. I'd say they're about the same, but i haven't had many linear pull brakes.

[@theemperor-wh40k18]

@@Mr.Anders0n_ disc brakes last much longer (not having to replace your brake pads every few months). They also brake smoother in my opinion. Both have their ups and downs.

[@Pierrrrrrrrrrrrrrre]

I'll save it for you "I choose a rim brake - because I already have a disc brake bike."

[@LarsRR]

Pierre F. Which is for me the ultimate reason to stick with Discs. I already have a disc, so I buy another disc. The advantage is you can swap the wheels.

[@Jabba1625]

I have both rim and disc brakes on the two bikes I own, cheaper disc brakes are rubbish, feel wooden in their brake performance, where as my rim brakes on my workhorse town bike bite so hard it's not funny. Only really need my disc brakes on the MTB for those hairy bush trails. Enjoy whatever your choice or budget allows

[@tbrowniscool]

Rim brakes are ok but paired with carbon wheels they are dangerous. kzbin.info/www/bejne/e4WUm4WMrtOCeKM

[@jamesward2141]

Yea that doesn’t really make sense as a reason...

[@dernils6176]

He actually gave a lot of other reasons

[@10ktube]

I'm still on rim brakes for the road mainly because I have so many spare wheels and brake parts for them, if I switched to disc I lose my stash of backups. It's basically controlled hoarding.

[@mrd691]

This is my reason. I have 3 road rim brake bikes, all running shimano 11 speed. So wheel swaps are simple. Plus they all fit on my turbo without fiddling with adapters.

[@innismor11]

Well, it's basically pissing off the bike manufacturers and retailers is what it is, basically. You're costing them your money.

[@phillip2169]

Lol yeah that's why I stopped buying extra stuff for my bike. I gotta get disc just cause I ride through winter and rain and go through too many pads. Not rims yet because I brake the rim well before that happens 😔

[@deane9050]

haha good reason mate

[@alg3n320]

@@innismor11 cry more

[@onilovni1234]

Stop apologizing for preferring rim brakes bikes, some people are still riding steel fixies.

[@MrPutman]

and some, penny farthings

[@rudyraymos1757]

Go rim brakes. ..

[@hec_3549]

Now don't go spreading hate to us fixed gear riders. To each their own.

[@SiklistaRepublika1987]

i uses rim brakes for my MTB

[@rollinrat4850]

Hec _ They can hate all they want! I’m going to keep rockin my old steel fixed gear ‘cross bike. It even has canti brakes! I ride it on most of the rocky trails Id ride my MTBs on. Im having more fun than should be legal! I dont care what anyones thinks about my bikes. Im having fun! If my bike makes you cringe, thats your problem. Meanwhile, try not to get dropped!

[@markkennedy1022]

Nailed the balanced argument - well reasoned and presented. Especially right on about choosing a setup that reflects where you live and the kinds of rides / roads you go for. Enjoy the bike - it is lovely!

[@DEAR7340]

Yep. I also appreciate the balance. I live in the Appalachians (US) and, for me, that tips the balance towards disc brakes. Weather and the long steep downgrades are just easier with disc brakes. If I lived in flat-to-rolling terrain, I'd certainly stick with rim brakes.

[@philjewell69]

Just got a TCR rim brake because my last bike had discs and proved to be more hassle than it was worth. I still have a disc brake road bike for commuting and winter rides(TRP cable pull) but I have to say as soon as the TCR arrived setting up rim brakes was a joy. Everyone to their own 😀 #lightweight #simpletoadjust #easylife

[@beatenbytheclown]

Pretty much my experience too. Have discs on my commuter bike but rims on the weekend bike. Commuter bike is a upgrade that’s only a couple of months old so I’ll see how the discs hold up. But my previous experience of discs (from 2011 admittedly) was like yours, way to much trouble in comparison to rims, outweighing the extra stopping power.

[@jontarling8232]

Threaded bottom bracket is reason enough, fit and forget, it just works!

[@rollinrat4850]

An English threaded bb should be the 1st thing you look for on a new bike. Without that, I wont recommend a bike no matter how ‘ awesome’ the rest of the bike is. Pressfit IS SHIT! I wrench in a shop. Press fit garbage is job security and more sales for me! You want to enrich your shop and lighten your wallet? Great way to lose weight!

[@ErzbergAdventures]

Pressfit is fine. Never had any issues in the 20k km and 3 BB I've replaced. It does come down to manufacturing tolerances though.

[@rollinrat4850]

Damag381 I think youre a very fortunate person, maybe lucky! Ive precision measured every PF bb shell Ive repaired in the shop, within tenths of thousandths of an inch. Not a single example met true industrial bearing specs. Not a single one! I wrench in a bike shop, I used to machine and install bearings on aircraft and spacecraft. Ive had inexpensive Shimano cartridge BBs last over 12 years, On an mtb ridden through creeks and mud. 4 hours is a short ride for me. I ride lots and everywhere, frequently camping along the way.

[@ooldmka]

@@rollinrat4850 what about bsa it? Is it that bad compared to bsa e?

[@lleweybyrne]

@@ErzbergAdventures I do 20K KM easy on one threaded BB. I agree press fit should work, but doesn't due to very poor engineering tolerances on BBs even on top end frames! Cervelo are very poor in this regard, Look and Time are amongst the best.

[@joegrossi4457]

Rim brakes for me. Ollie hit all the key arguments.

[@garyzimbric4055]

I live in the US Midwest and rarely venture out in the rain. And I love my rim brake Madone. But I also go to Northern California every spring and occasionally to the Alps and Pyrenees with wicked descents and wet roads. Love my disk brake Edmonda. Lucky to have perfect bikes for the where and how I ride. And I agree with Ollie on all points.

[@phillip2169]

Ugh. I feel like this should be me. I can't afford 2 good bikes though. Also N+1

[@gdevansh]

Can I also pick which Pinarello I want to ride, please?

[@bassbassbasser]

of course, but you have to pay for it...

[@gdevansh]

acid crayon would be really nice if they gave 1 away. I’m tired of riding my 12Kg flat bar

[@dalezapple2493]

@@bassbassbasser yep

[@MonteiroM]

Yes, please.

[@Afredericknyc]

order the frame from dhgate. Pinarello makes their frames in Taiwan. If you search hard enough, you'll find an F12 disc unbranded Pinarello frame for about $500

[@911rsr]

*Casually wiping tears off my eyes from feeling broke

[@brodie.969]

I can relate.

[@KimMoth]

You can build a lighter bike than this from used stuff for pretty cheap.

[@avinj]

Yes mate, RIM BRAKES ALL THE WAY!!!

[@mikestv3782]

Rim brakes for me, I have been cycling since 1984 in all weather conditions, descended the Galibier at 90+kph plus other mountains and have never once thought to myself, if only I had better brakes?

[@SlowBoyAthlete]

Dear Ollie, Thank you so much for coming out and supporting those who use rim brakes. I am a closet rim brake lover, but sadly, I have never felt comfortable in declaring my orientation to other disc brake users. But because of your openness and public support of rim brakes, I am encouraged and inspired to be proud of my choices, not to feel ashamed and to help advocate other rim brake users to be be true to themselves. Yours in faith. SBA

[@newttella1043]

The hardest part of owning rim brakes is telling your parents.

[@MotoLopez1k]

SlowBoyAthlete I’ve also been a closet rim brake lover til now

[@phillip2169]

👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾 /s

[@yamchabrotherofdora5171]

This is the Technology where I can't agree with... So I still choose Rim Breaks

[@razvanyke]

I like so much the calm enthusiasm of Ollie, now I want a Pinarello too .. thank you.

[@cliffcox7643]

RIm brakes for me. How many times will I be descending on wet mountain roads, at the limits? Zero. When it does get wet on the mountains, I slow waaay down as a matter of common sense.

[@cliffcox7643]

@@poxcr no, I do mountains only 2 days a week, The climb is 1 hour and the descent 15 minutes. Makes no sense to get disc in any way. Also they don't wear out as quickly as people think from the pads.

[@whatwelearned]

That's illogical. Everything else being equal you're saying you'd rather have inferior braking.

[@cliffcox7643]

@@whatwelearned No, rim works just fine as we still ride packs of 80 to 100. No brake differential issues.. Climbs here i SoCal and rim is lighter. Descents are in the dry.. Who's riding in rain in SoCal anyway, must be an outsider. They work great. .Also try changing tires on a group ride. and rim brake person is done in 1/4 the time of a disc person. There is literally no need for heavier, more expensive. Who cares about more braking performance. Who's braking anyway. LOL.

[@rxonmymind8362]

@@whatwelearned Inferior? How? You anticipate the need for braking and do so on both. I'll stop just as well on rims or disc. Not inferior by any means.

[@whatwelearned]

@@rxonmymind8362 No, you won't, as has been proven time and again.

[@cyclonutterd7075]

Stunning bike mate, I'd go rim brakes too, I really like the whole build, just about perfect.

[@cyclonutterd7075]

Full review would be great after a couple of months.

[@HenryAshman]

The big thing for me for disc vs rim brakes is I couldn't bring myself to wear out a £1k pair of rims, whereas even Dura ace rotors are less than £100 a pair, and are trivial to remove and fit replacements. Plus the roads are awful round me so 28mm+ tyres are a must

[@asiantrick24]

Henry Ashman people always bring this up but I don’t remember the last time I ever worn out a carbon wheel in my last 7 years of hard racing 🤦‍♂️

[@user-jv4fu9uc3e]

30 years of riding and never wore out a rim I have replaced wheels out of wanting something newer than wearing them.out

[@jkk916]

Don't try to justify discs with that, they will just cost you more.

[@richdyer2000]

It’s not the consistent and predictable wear that’s an issue (as with mountain bikes), but the risk of suddenly trashing rims by picking up some grit is enough to stop me investing in carbon rims for my current rim-brake bike.

[@doggdemuro]

Never seen anyone wear out rims. Carbon or otherwise. Do you ride with the brakes constantly applied or something?

[@DrJRMCFC]

loved hearing Ollie’s views on choosing rim brakes. Personally, i would always go for rim brakes. Work brilliant any long descent including the high mountains (the only time i’ll ride in the pouring rain in the mountains is if i get caught in a thunderstorm or it’s a passing shower). The travelling issue is a huge one for me and also the lack of rubbing. Superb frame but looks even better in the galaxy blue fade scheme. Threaded bottom bracket is the only way to go too.

[@HarryFlashman.]

Aesthetically you made the right choice as well. That is a beautiful bike.

[@njm3211]

I'm a rim brake guy. I go for the light weight and simplicity. I ride aluminum Mavic Ksyrium UST tubeless wheels. Not worried about overcooking carbon rims LOL. BTW all the GC contenders at the three grand tours and their climbing domestiques continue using rim brakes.

[@1afterthep]

pros don't have to pay for their rims and they got mechanics preparing their tubulars, so it's not really an argument

[@njm3211]

@@1afterthep So what's your point?

[@matthewlewis2072]

1. Pros race on closed roads 2. Pros don't need to worry about wearing out rims 3. Weight matters to pros

[@fukawitribe]

@Norman "BTW all the GC contenders at the three grand tours and their climbing domestiques continue using rim brakes." Not this year they didn't.

[@njm3211]

@@fukawitribe The winners did.

[@TroggyPK]

My beef isn't with discs. It's with manufacturers refusing to give us the choice. The customers a choice between rim and disc. Now most top end models come with discs only

[@RadCJ33]

Trogg there will be choice as long as there is enough demand. But apparently the demand for rim brake bikes is rapidly going down (for whatever reason, I certainly think most riders would be better off using rim brakes), so it is hard to justify parallel development, production and warehousing. In the end, someone has to pay for it.

[@TroggyPK]

@@RadCJ33 specialized rubaix, merida ride, giant defy, cannondale synapse, focus izalco ergo ride just to name the first off the top of my head. Each where by far the most popular models in their line up and all of which have been replaced by disc only builds which don't start at £600-£700 which is where most road bike sales will be.... Are now £1000 to £1500 to start at... Now that's taking the piss. Alienating entry level cyclists and pushing them away from want to purchase bikes. All because "discs are better" at an entry level, no they are not. Stop forcing people to buy disc equipped bikes.

[@TroggyPK]

@@bikemike1945 and so is creating a 5 part drama/advertisement series professionally filmed edited and payed for, all in house. Now how's about we waste less money on marketing bollocks and just give the people what they want which is a choice.

[@user-lq6vp9el6l]

Trogg even aero bikes... sad

[@scoopermg8226]

You can have this bike in either brake type, dickhead

[@mattgies]

Very rarely do I thumb-down a video, but I did on this one. And this excerpt is why: "I have to stress that I do believe disc brakes are for better braking performance in all conditions. But, I'm not being paid to race, if I race, and I don't feel like I want to take unnecessary risks when the roads are slippery." If the disc brake is better in all conditions, then *riding with rim brakes is, itself, taking an unnecessary risk*. Just don't allow yourself to ride more aggressively on account of having the disc brakes, and you will be safer by having them. Or, in other words, don't succumb to "risk homeostasis".

[@OllieBridgewood]

Matthew Gies better at braking, however inferior in other ways outlined in the video. For The racing I would do in the UK I wouldn’t require disc brakes. If I were racing down mountains, I’d quite like them!

[@para7843]

Very good presenter very natural and relaxed and you know your stuff.

[@OllieBridgewood]

Carl Seddon thanks mate. Appreciate it

[@para7843]

@@OllieBridgewood no worries mate

[@madbiker9494]

To me direct mount brakes are the best option, I wish more bikes had them more than enough power

[@phillip2169]

Depends on how/where/when you ride though. Not enough in mine for a lot of instances

[@bobqzzi]

The only times I've ever wished I had disc brakes were descending Mauna Kea in Hawaii and Jefferson Notch Road in New Hampshire, -the latter of which was loose dirt at over 10% for miles. Oh, and coming down Lolo Pass in the freezing rain in 1998. Mostly, even super cheap rim brakes would be fine 99% of the time for the riding I do. Just don't see the need on a road bike. Awesome Pinarello.

[@ooldmka]

Do you ride in the rain?

[@bobqzzi]

@@ooldmka Sure, I commute year round, rain, snow or sun.

[@graphics_dev5918]

@@bobqzzi Then either you obviously haven't tried discs or you're trolling.

[@bobqzzi]

@@graphics_dev5918 Discs work fine. As I said, not remotely needed for the miles I do. They may offer some small advantage in the rain, but in the dry they don't stop any faster since bicycle braking is limited by flipping over, not brake strength or traction.

[@graphics_dev5918]

@@bobqzzi I mostly agree with part two, but the difference in the rain is not at all small IME. I hate riding in the rain with rim brakes (still do it sometimes, but it feels real sketchy). Maybe that's because my first nice bike had discs.

[@carlandre8610]

A good set of Campi record brakes are super and all I need.

[@katherinelangford981]

I just bought pedals for my mountain bike after breaking one last weekend on a ride. They just came in, aluminum, because I was tired of breaking plastic ones. I'm pretty sure they weigh more than your whole bike, disc or rim brakes. The tech in your bikes is awesome. That's a beauty of a bike. Rocking rim brakes on my CF road bike as well, and am a little envious of disc brake folk, but they're adjustments and care intimidate me and I can do rim brakes so I stick with those.

[@DanuelNuel]

GJ Ollie! For me rim brakes have one big advantage - they require less maintenance, are easy to replace and set and cost less.

[@helphelpimbeingrepressed9347]

That's four. ;-)

[@Dazbog373]

Less maintenance? You've gotta be kidding

[@invictus3663]

DanuelNue when the rim wears off your dead lol it costs more then disc brakes

[@Numeriwar]

Rim brake slowly destroy your rims. Switching from narrow rim to larger rim, alu to carbon is a mess, plus some wheels are off center. Sometimes the caliper will move during a crash or simply putting your bike in the car, of course tightening the bolt move the caliper so you have to readjust. Braking power from hood is shit and dangerous in wet and steep descent.

[@jen3800]

@@Numeriwar i disagree. in 20 years i have yet to crash on a descent or in the rain due to brake performance. my bike can stop on a dime.

[@guest_informant]

This is a really well thought out video. I've got discs on a city commuter. And I would never change back. They're perfect for that. But...I'll probably upgrade my 5yo road bike next year, and rim brakes feel like the right option. I couldn't work out why though, this puts that into words.

[@chrisdahms9682]

Lovin' my rim brakes, no plans to change to disk anytime soon 👍

[@howardkaye6104]

Best of luck on your new bike Ollie

[@apojoga]

Congratulations on the new bike! Slick as a whip.

[@greengonzonz]

Agreed, there's a time and place for each brake type.

[@Muppetkeeper]

I like a rim brake, and my best bike is a rim. However having picked the wrong bike for the UCI Yorkshire Sportive yesterday, I'd have swapped a coffee morning with Matt Stevens to have had my disc brake bike. Even with the Mavic textured rims, I had no brakes at all down some very steep Yorkshire hills. Only the bib shorts can tell the whole story. Rim for summer, disc for winter.

[@DSKHo1968]

Yep! Almost pulled the trigger on a second bike yesterday! The only thing stopping me was that it didnt have disc breaks! I already have a very nice Cannondale Supersix hi mod Sram red road bike that currently weights in at sub 6kg, so didnt feel the need to buy another rim bike no matter how good and nice it is! I want a bike for the winter. Still toying with eMTB or disc break bike. I unlike Ollie like to go as fast as possible even in the wet! Moisture and carbon rim breaks is not the ideal combination!

[@anthonyholmes1704]

Cyclist 40 years, I ride rim brakes whatever, just got a Colnago C64 with direct mount, rock solid stopping. road bikes don't need discs.

[@davonpointer2310]

Great ride 👍🏼 For me what I love about bicycles is the simplicity, having dics goes against this... prefer a light as bike as possible.

[@polyrhythmia]

One nice thing about rim brakes is you can use radial spoking on the front wheel.

[@cup_and_cone]

You can do a half lace on disc front wheels. 2x or 3x on disc side, radial on opposite. Only real point to do so would be very marginal weight savings...wheel would be stronger with uniform pattern.

[@rollinrat4850]

polyrhythmia What is great about radial lacing? Its weaker laterally. Triangulation increases strength. Many hub manufacturer’s warranty is voided by radial lacing. Weight savings? Haha! LOL! Ive built wheels for over 30 years. If my customers demand radial, they dont get my lifetime truing policy.

[@cup_and_cone]

@@rollinrat4850 - For a "30 year" wheel builder you are misinformed, especially on your "triangulation" claim (the radial is actually stiffer laterally than 3x because of this; diagram below). A 3x wheel _may_ potentially be stronger, but it's not laterally stiffer. Radial lacing is *actually* laterally stiffer if built equal (same hub, rim, count, spoke ga/style, tension, etc). This is a fundamental fact that cannot be ignored, and why it's taught at the Bicycle Institute. It boils down to Ftu and trigonometry. For the sake of argument, we are ignoring hub flange damage and blowout (why Shimano doesn't warranty radial lacing). There is no reason whatsoever a 3x would be laterally stiffer, because the hub flange distance and offset remains the same. One of the reasons 3x is not laterally stiffer is because its spokes introduce more tensile elasticity due to their longer length. The spokes also sit askew at the cross points and will pull straighter under load as that slack is removed (offer more deflection). Lastly it's just trigonometry (your "triangulation" claim): Take a cross section of identical wheels in 3x and radial and examine the rim's top spoke hole. On a 3x wheel the spoke is jointed to the hub flange further away near the axle area, which creates a shallower angle to the rim than a radial lace (where the spoke is jointed at the top of the flange). Here is a diagram I made a while ago of your misinformed "triangulation" claims: i.postimg.cc/nxwf9WnR/3xradialcomplat.jpg Not pictured, but if you note the third cross point in a 3x is always contact with a sister spoke on the same side hub flange, so there is no false assumption of the geometry changing or moving to the outer cross point. I see this as a counter argument all the time until the party realizes this.

[@rollinrat4850]

Cup & Cone Those are some interesting concepts, Ill admit I cant and wont argue theory. Im not a know it all by any means. Im willing to listen and learn new things. But I have many years of practical experience. I’ll stick with what I know thats functional, reasonably affordable and practical for everyday riding and abuse. I usually don’t build ultra light high performance wheels. Its not my niche, they dont serve my customers needs and They don’t last long! They’re for racing. I build the wheels that the majority of commuters, tourists, randonneurs and off roaders should be riding. Conservative, strong, reasonably light wheels that can last a lifetime.Sometimes they can be fairly heavy because thats what lasts in the real, rough and tumble world under heavy loads and hardcore abuse. I use commonly available components and stuff thats simple snd easy to maintain out in the field. My wheels rarely break spokes or require truing. I build what is tried, ‘TRUE’ and proven. I repair low spoke count and radial laced wheels all the time. I frequently replace cracked rims from over tensioned ‘stiff’ wheels.I see proprietary parts and ‘reinvention of the wheel’ frustrate many riders. Usually its because riders use these wheels for every day riding that they never were designed for. I taught myself to build wheels using Jobst Brandt’s book and with some critique from old and established builders. I just stick with what I know works, lasts and keeps my customers happy. Im a retired machinist and mechanical inspector. Ive built maybe several hundred wheels, maybe not as many as you. I build wheels for fun and to give back to the sport I love. Im not really doing this to make lots of money. I just help riders ride more and wrench less. Thats MY thing. Every one has been happy so far!

[@polyrhythmia]

@@rollinrat4850 I used to build wheels for my own use, but nowadays, it's harder to find the components. Earlier this year, I bought a new set of inexpensive Shimano wheels, to replace worn-out stupid light wheels. The front wheel is radially spoked, by the way. Going to replace the brifters with downtube shifters. Building wheels sounds like a really nice retirement job.

[@RoyAH.]

You are very lucky to have this bike, I appreciate the modesty Ollie! Wonderful review, thank you for sharing.

[@gcntech]

Thanks RAH

[@JimS870]

I'm just getting into cycling (since July). I don't know a lot about bikes. But that is one of the NICEST bikes I've ever seen in my life. Just stunning.

[@mazuelle]

Beautiful bike. I‘m living in the alps, doing long descends and still loving my Cannondale Supersix Evo from 2016. I had never any problems with my rim brakes and Lightweight Meilenstein rims, weights about 6,4 kg.

[@AntonioPiccolboni]

The last time I had problems with rim brakes was because I also had tubulars, that was some 35 years ago. The glue softens as the temperature of the rims goes up and the tubular starts rotating, until there is a valve explosion followed by face plant. Hot days and steep slow downhills are the killer combination. I am not sure you can get in trouble with clinchers, I've never had, and I hope there's better glue for tubulars these days.

[@sbsb4995]

Rim brakes is the way to go. Well done.

[@heinz-dieteroelmann9960]

dear Oli, I love your clips, your presentations and your comments... thanks - you gave me inspiration to take part in the Fred Whitton - I really love the Lake District and hope to see Yorkshire next year - possibly to take part in the White rose classic... I love my ax lightness with rim brakes and my Rose x-lite with disc-brakes as well... please stay as you are...

[@OllieBridgewood]

heinz-dieter oelmann cheers pal. Will try my best!

[@bwlucas]

I've been rocking mechanical disc brakes all year and so far its been great. Easy to pack in the bike box, not difficult to maintain, and they stop better than my older RIM brake system, especially in the wet. Watching my friends deal with setting up their hydraulic systems, bleeding brake lines, caliper adjustments, seems like a hassle.

[@paulcuthbert]

I agree with Ollie. I chose rim brakes on my new bike, for much the same reason as he stated. Another reason I chose them is I know how to maintain them, and can't be bothered to learn how to maintain disc brakes! As an aside, doesn't Ollie just seem like a top bloke? Would love to go for a ride with him - and then for a brew!

[@jackglossop4859]

Maintaining disk brakes is really easy. Just watch a few KZbin videos and then start working on yours before finding that they don’t behave the same as the ones in the videos and now you have a bike where the fucking brakes are fucked and you’ve got to drive the twat to a pissing mechanic to get the fucking bastards sorted for the third fucking time this bastard year.... Then revert to rim brakes.

[@Vii_DT]

#SaveRimBrakes // I feel like the industry is forcing the adoption of disc brakes, with a lot of brands releasing new models with disc only. Giving Cannondale SuperSix as an example of disc being lighter than rim is unfair though, because Cannondale intentionally offers rim brake model with 2nd tier, heavier frames only.

[@gdevansh]

I think rim brakes should always be an option, why can't we just have a rim and disc version of each bike?

[@waldimuller4911]

They can make more money out of disc brakes, that is why

[@polychromatism3078]

@@waldimuller4911 Disc brakes are just objectively better. That's why. Most people want rim brakes because they're used to them. As you can see in the video, even Ollie said disc brakes are superior and if he could only have one bike, he'd choose his orbea.

[@Agent-vj3ns]

@@polychromatism3078 yes. And more parts = more money. They don't make the brakes. They purchase from a supplier (likely Chinese, dead serious) then grossly mark it up for immense profits. The frames too. My f12 chinarello fools pro's.

[@polychromatism3078]

@@Agent-vj3ns I don't know much about their manufacturing process and where they source their parts. I was mostly referring to the "GiVe RiM BrAkEs A cHaNcE" argument. It's fucking dumb.

[@brucelee2309]

Got my first real road bike 2013 it's a giant TCR compact 1, aluminium frame, carbon forks and seat post, 105 groupset, 12-28 rear and 52/39 front. Served me well. Still use it most weeks currently it's my only bike and for the past 7 years I never once thought I'd need another bike or a bike with disk brakes 😂 so if you don't need it you don't need it.

[@omarayala1820]

I just ordered a new road bike with direct-mount rim brakes. All I have ever had since childhood is bikes with rim brakes. It is not broken; no need to fix it. Multiple bike shop owners and mechanics have consistently suggested to stick to rim brakes. Extensive review of the pros and cons all suggest that rim brakes are the simpler & more practical option. I don’t ride on any conditions requiring specialized brakes or disc brakes. As I read once about disc brakes, to me they seem to be the answer to a question I never had. I love Ollie’s point: “I am not getting paid to race. I don’t need to push my bike (life) to the extreme requiring special braking performance.” Brilliant argument, in my opinion. Also, it is possible to swap wheels with my other bike maintaining the same rim brake systems. I virtually never ride in the rain. My biking is on flat roads, not off-road. Simplicity seems more reliable to me. Easier to service by any shop or oneself, if necessary. I really hope arguments such as “disc brakes are the way of the future” cease. I don’t find it accurate. That is not the future I want to be buying a new bike in, or riding my bike. I want a future with freedom and options. Just like I just bought a new rim-brake road bike, I want to continue to have that options or as long as I choose to. I feel there has already been too much pressure trying to convince people disc brakes “is the way of the future”. It is a vain, illogical, unsustainable argument. Frankly, it is insulting. Enough already!

[@jonhh6918]

Ollie part of the weight weenies, oh that's very surprising 😂🤣. He is a great advocate for rim brakes. P.S. love my rim brakes.

[@seanfrancesstanhope4797]

This is interesting because I picked a disc break bike specifically because I'd ride my brakes down descents trying to stay safe. I would go through brake pads so quick and in a hot day the rims would heat up like crazy and I even melted the tire coming down vontoux. I found rim brakes soooo dangerous for someone trying to go slow down a hill

[@ltu42]

True that! If you rely more on the air resistance by going faster, your brakes get less energy to dissipate, and the faster airflow cools the rims better.

[@giusepperusso9513]

Your explanation on rims vs disk is the best ever listed... I do agree with all your comments... I will go disk as it will be the only all around bike... so I am in agreement with you

[@norberthorn3989]

I only use rim brakes for different reasons; I am convinced that with disk brakes there is a risk to braking too hard in a sudden, surprising situation. So the risk of an accident caused by "over-braking" is high. I suppose you can see this even in pro races. I have good experience with my rim brakes, I am using the front brake only in 95%.

[@JogBird]

Its too bad direct mount brakes didnt come out earlier, theyre so good. Theres really little need for disc brakes for most people.

[@samuelsmith6281]

I disagree, for riding in traffic and on a wet commuter ride they're life savers. I wouldn't go back to rim brakes now.

[@henriks5008]

JogBird NOT correct. How long does the break-surface on a rim-brake carbon wheel last?? What happens when you have to change the wheel cause of brake-wear? Its gonna cost you a brand new set of carbon wheels! How much does a carbon deep section tubular wheel-set cost?? With disc brakes that is not a problem. Money saved..

[@jkk916]

@@henriks5008 I have made almost 20000 km with my carbon clinchers and rim brake surface still looks good. It may last 100000 km, who wold knew. I wil have to find another excuse to change my wheels.

[@henriks5008]

@@jkk916 If i could choose, the wheel-set i buy for 2500-3500 $ would last for way way more than 4-5 years without any wear. Ive ridden deep section carbon tubulars since 2012 and had to change once. Maybe your standards are lower than mine? When i measure 0,5 mm wear and a concave brake surface its time to change. I live in a hilly area therefore brake a lot.

[@jkk916]

@@henriks5008 That is crazy amount of money for a wheelset so I would think you are all about performance. But what if a bicycle with half cheaper wheels and rim brakes would be faster than a bike with discs and your wheels? Discs are heavy and cause some aero drag. You could buy cheaper and quite heavy deep section wheels and still have lighter and more aerodynamic bicycle. Also, if you have expensive hubs it would make sense to rebuild wheels with a new rim. I don't know why people act like rim brake wears off their cartilage, it wears off rim only for a gods sake! I cannot even measure wear, it is too minute. I don't live in flat area either and I occasionally ride on bad weather. But to be fair I rarely ride steep technical descends. Maybe you should try some other brake pads...

[@durianriders]

I approve of this video

[@OllieBridgewood]

durianrider good to know! 😉😂

[@seanyu7851]

I knew you'd be here , Harley haha

[@taranhase7057]

No rub

[@sephiroth7818]

GCN just needs to do an epi with Durianrider already

[@cristibaluta]

I'm building a road/treking bike now and wondered which way to go, but weight, price and the fact that i'm an amateur convinces me i don't need disk brakes.

[@joseluisrodriguezvazquez6082]

Neatly explained. I couldn't agree more. Those same reasons apply to 90% of cyclists out there, who don't need disc brakes either and even pay more for a heavier trickier-to-adjust bike. But that's how the industry works. Selling stuff to people who don't need it and even making them believe they're better off with it.

[@danc1829]

I've just swap from a tcr disc to a tcr rim. Everyone goes on about better braking yes... safer In my experience no... i had the R8020 levers and over 12 months had not one but 2 leaks from the master cylinder (both replaced under warrenty) once while the bike wasnt even in use... the second time in a fast decent lucky for me there was no cars as I totally lost my brake! So imo they may brake better but they arent as reliable making them not safe! Disc is the future yes..... but it's still got a long way to go. I'm back to a tcr rim brake bike now with a set of alloy clinchers and personally feel safer now as I dont need to worry about a leak at 45.6mph 😂

[@djkhmor4538]

there's a reason cars got dual systems ;-)

[@adnartmadmartm8718]

Personally, I'm in love with mechanical discs. I find them to be the best of both worlds. However, both my road bike and one of my commuters have rim brakes, which for the road bike is just fine, since it sees little action. However, I've recently had to replace my commuter's front rim due to wear. Relacing a wheel is definitely more difficult than swapping a disc out. Now, mind you, the main reason the rim required replacing on my commuter is the mileage AND the lack of care I give it. After all, that IS the point of a commuter bike. But the rim replacement is certainly not one of my favourite parts.

[@danc1829]

@@adnartmadmartm8718 yeah its horses for courses I only use my tcr for club rides and sportives. I'll be lucky to ride 3000 miles a year. With 2 wheelsets that should last me a long long time. I brought a disc as I was told it's the "future" and that's exactly what it is imo the technically just isnt there yet. Rubbing discs is normally user error but 2 failing master cylinders is not. I'll stick to rim for now does all it needs to for me :)

[@stufftie88]

Rim brakes for ever!!! Easy to fix, easy to handle, easy to refresh, light weight, easy to clean, no overheating problems aaaand ... cheaper. Also I can't find anything good about blocking weels on descending rides. I need turning wheels even in panic situations. And even the rim brakes manage to block. So: no difference between those two systems here.

[@matteocamilleri9013]

totally agree 🤘 here other good rasons to choose RIM 🙌 kzbin.info/www/bejne/gqmwgX6Ahah3apI

[@someguy9520]

I got an 13' specialized shiv tri version. Snatching up rim brake components for real cheap now. Used and new stuff since many people in my area are changing to disk brakes cause they "need" them I also get quite cheap 11speed components, since everyone pushes 12/13 speed drivetrains

[@brendanpotash]

...and I always appreciate your pragmatic and very helpful explanations of all the bits of tech that no one talks about (except for my very talkative bike mechanic).

[@Wildschwein_Jaeger]

Weighs less ding Less friction ding Not being paid to race ding Easier to travel with ding Easier to adjust ding Cost lower than disk brakes ding Allows customer choice ding Sound like good arguments that will keep rim brakes alive.

[@adityawardhana6066]

Ding ding dong ding!

[@SuperEarplugs]

Easier to adjust? I haven't needed to adjust my brakes ever since I switched to hydraulic disc brakes!

[@P373RV2]

SuperEarplugs whait for it.... and wait for the shreeking and squeeking and the ffft ffft ffft at every wheelturn after you dismounted the wheel.... xtr discs on an canyon for 2 years an never again... i just dont need the brakepower.

[@iberiksoderblom]

Exactly !!!

[@Max_Mustermann_]

rimbrakes can be spoked radially (looks better, lighter, more aerodynamic)... ding rimbrakes don't need as much spokes as discbrakes (looks better, lighter, more aerodynamic)... ding

[@tomaldous5641]

Disc brakes are a good idea if you're pretty heavy so need the extra stopping power or you're cool with riding a £10,000 bike in bad weather. I use Hydro disc brakes for the winter bike/commuter but the fast, light and fun bike which I use in good weather will always be rim brakes. Nothing beats the thrill of riding a light bike.

[@deltafoxtrot2]

I remember the halcyon days when I was a Postman in the 1980s riding my Pashley steel delivery bike. Memories flood back with the sun warming my face, my blazer gently flapping in the summer breeze. I pulled my Rod brakes making the rubber blocks sound like a skylark dancing in the clear blue sky as they softly gripped the rims, my eyes would gently dilate with the sensation of been at one with the world as I tumbled over the handle bars into a stationary car at the lights.

[@koenbouts]

very well balanced speech on the choice of rimbrakes vs disc. The only question I have is with rim brakes and carbon wheels. I ride aluminum wheels which I tend to trust more than full carbon wheels. I still hear from mates that rim brakes and full carbon wheels brake less good than aluminum rim surface (even with the specially designed brake pads) and then my preference would go to disc brakes. So my new bike will definitely have disc brakes. I ride the mountains 1/year and love using my brakes ;).

[@bee_whisper]

I have and prefer rim brakes both for the look and just the feel

[@bee_whisper]

@Phil Weatherley not really its like saying mozart was an amazing peformer and composer and that the limitations of the instuments meant it sounds the way it does today .

[@jimbojonesporfavor]

Each to their own. I find disc brakes much cleaner and better looking

[@tilldeathdowe]

Its awesome to watch another cyclist excited about their new bike... I love that buzz. Enjoy every mile Ollie!

[@brendanpotash]

It's really so beautiful. It's clear that you're thrilled and appreciative of this work of fine art and engineering.

[@tatters1232006]

I hired a pinerello in the French alpes this year and boy!!! What a responsive beautiful light machine I was in heaven

[@oreocarlton3343]

When in dry weather, rim brakes have a nicer feel, you dont feel the torque you get from discs

[@4vickiekaye]

Disc brake rubbing would drive me mad. I will stay with rim brakes for the conceivable future.

[@stevegeek]

Vickie Kaye Agree. I often find myself on club rides with people using discs and as soon as we hit some dirty roads they start sounding like cement mixers! Drives me crazy. Rim brakes for me.

[@4vickiekaye]

@@stevegeek Really? I haven't ridden with anyone on discs yet but I certainly believe it.

[@harrydelaney6623]

Yea it’s awful..soon as get slightly wet the noise of them 😩

[@Bayo106]

@@harrydelaney6623 youd think there was a train on the road

[@harrydelaney6623]

@@Bayo106 yea bog time like a train horn 😂

[@DMcTyke]

Good balanced viewpoint on the pros and cons of discs vs rim brakes. I've never wished for more braking power than my Campagnolo rim brakes and alu wheels provide, even when letting it rip down Alpine descents. I can't speak for racing cyclists, but I'm not aware of any pros complaining that their rim brakes aren't powerful enough (I could be wrong there). Anyway, I just don't like the cluttered look of discs on a lightweight road bike, especially the asymmetrical (dished) front wheel when viewed from the saddle, so it will always be rim brakes for me (even more so now with the direct mount option).

[@rudyelizondo1935]

Love your bike, perfect set up and fit!!! I would take it everywhere no matter what!!! Always rim brake cause I’m not racing and there are no mountains here in texas just big hills. I’ve never needed disk in my 35 years of riding!!!

[@andressuarezp]

Rim brakes for me !

[@physiciansassist1]

It's all in choice. I love disc because im a heavier rider and cunning driven the mountains is scary without disc for me

[@raidaman1]

A) I don't ride in wet conditions. B) In 40 years of cycling, rim brakes have never failed me. C) Lesser in weight. D) Lesser in cost. E) Lesser in maintenance. F) Rims are a no brainer...for me.

[@barrygoffe]

Nice video. really appreciate the pro/cons explanation. What a gorgeous ride! Incredibly jealous!!!

[@gcntech]

Thanks Barry

[@DrewKime]

The best argument for rim brakes (for me) is what he said about transport. I have my front wheel on and off multiple times per week to drive to a ride start. I'd be afraid of knocking something out of alignment and needing to bleed the brakes in a hurry.

[@andreyv116]

That feels like more of an argument against hydraulics than against discs (not that anyone except Magura makes hydro rims and even then it's more for trials than road)

[@DrewKime]

@@andreyv116 Fair point. I've mostly seen mechanical disc on no-name bikes on Amazon, so I've assumed it's not something I'd want.

[@MrPisuicas]

It is starting to rain and there is a technically descent ahead!, You: "damn i wish i got disk brakes that looks scary"

[@55whiplash]

somehow we survived long wet descents with loaded panniers on dirt roads forever and now we "need"disc brakes because the bike industry says so, or not.

[@johnwedlake5543]

Not when you actually know how to handle a bike, and when to brake on the road.

[@phillip2169]

@@55whiplash that's not an argument. Just because we had something in the past doesn't mean it is inherently better. Disc brakes are demonstrably better. I have had bad stopping experiences with rim brakes. Hills, snow, speed. They have worked for some and for other not. That isn't a reason to not innovate. If vehicles go from rim (drum) to disc as they get fast you think it's because it's a fad?

[@phillip2169]

@@johnwedlake5543 I do. And I ride at speeds and whether that most people shy from. @ me when your rims fail because its -20, snowing, and a hill

[@MybeautifulandamazingPrincess]

@@phillip2169 Just get off the bike and walk in dangerous descents

[@RichardMigneron]

Rim brakes for me, I only ride in dry weather. Lighter and simpler to adjust. On my previous bike, I had CLB short, single pivot and never had a problem bracking downhill from 70+ Kph to 0. PS: those brakes were the lightest ever, 80g per brake caliper and 45 g per brake lever (the shifting was on the down tube).

[@photopbaranyi]

I prefer the rim break, because radial and lighter spokes at front wheel and opposite casete side of rear wheel. More durable from road shocks like vertical and more aero . The disk break isn't allowed the radial spokes and required wider, longer, stronger diagonal spokes. Not so often mentioned it in rim vs disc topic! So if possible I avoid disc break more time. I'll see when I have no choice. I agree with you, all road bikers style, environment and requirement is different. So I hope not mandatory use for me disk break, because the market needs.

[@event4216]

I prefer my rims don't break)

[@ViveSemelBeneVivere]

As Ollie said, the difference may mostly be cycle-ogical!

[@easyx9mm]

I believe in simplicity, I just completed S-work tarmac build with rim brakes. Here in Florida, disc brakes make no sense.

[@choose6174]

easyx9mm I got discs in Florida because I get caught out in the rain so much... plus I’m a mountain biker so disc are just the natural choice for me

[@8rk]

Discs make no sense to me even here in California :)

[@moogiebowser4919]

Disc is the future and looks way better

[@8rk]

@@moogiebowser4919 Nah. It really doesn't look better at all. Yes. It IS the future. But the reason it is the future is not better braking, safety, aero, or any of the crap cycling industry and their pundits try to sell you. Reason is simply business / profits.

[@JasonMatthewCrabtree]

@@moogiebowser4919 yeah I have to disagree with you on the looks. The main reason I love Rim brakes as you get those beautiful radial spoke wheels in the front! My only real beef when it comes to brakes is manufacturers need to move to the direct Mount system for Rim brakes! I sure wouldn't mind a giant TCR SL with some nice direct Mount brakes!

[@thomaskeenan2208]

Observed a rider packing his disk brake bike for bullet train. Had nice little covers for disks, sprockets. It was also a nice road bike, custom paint no labels. Rim brakes less susceptible to damage during transport. A minor consideration that of course can be managed with discs but a little more care.

[@rogersthilaire8179]

Got your point Ollie, but after meeting water on the way and having inclement weather approach from literally no where, after all I live in Indiana USA. I am disc all the way. I had a hybrid with a combo disc front and rim brakes on the back. Yep that was interesting in the wet. So after a few interesting experiences including almost meeting the pavement on one occasion, and some near misses with some trees and stuff. Yeah, I will stick with the discs ...

[@event4216]

I wanted to switch to disc brakes from mech V-brakes with crappy blocks. When I tried hydraulic V-brakes and proper Koolstop salmon blocks for wet weather, I just realized there's something I've missed in my life.

[@rogersthilaire8179]

@@event4216 Happy for you good stuff but I already have my discs and they work fine...

[@owenchuarbx]

I still prefer rim brakes because of their more ergonomic mechanical shiftier designs. The disc brake shiftier designs had bigger and steeper bumps which are borderline uncomfortable and unwieldy on long rides

[@pigeonpoo1823]

The disc hoods are so uncomfortable for small hands

[@shred3005]

Disc brakes on a road bike are just too finicky and fragile. I’m running latest Ultegra disc on one bike and Ultegra rim brake on my older bike and the little problems with disc rotor rub is driving me crazy. I don’t want to hear by brakes unless I’m using them and that’s rarely the case with disc. You fiddle and get them silent, no rub, then on the first heavy brake the rotors start to rub again, then they stop, then the rub again. Ching, Ching, Ching. The noises go away. Then they come back. You do a full adjust, spread the Calipers, all is good. Then as soon as you give the brakes a bit of moderate use, Ching, Ching, Ching. Rubbing rotor again. Goes away. Comes back. Again, and again and fcuk’n again.... that’s life with disc brakes

[@stevenleffanue]

Hi Brett. Align the caliper(s) first. Now take out the pads & spring. Pull apart the spring with fingers a tad which causes pads to come away from rotor more efficiently. Done.

[@shred3005]

oz cycle thanks. I’ve played with that before but I’ll give it another crack. I was expecting perfection with Ultegra 8000. My kids cheap Aldi MTB with Tektro hydraulic have no issues whatsoever!

[@shred3005]

oz cycle took your advice. I’d gently tried opening out the copier spring a bit before but obviously it wasn’t much. Pulled the spring open more this time and it seems to have done the trick. Nice tip thanks 👍

[@deltanovember2296]

They’re definitely not too fragile, don’t worry about that. Once you build confidence in working with them you will find that they are very mechanically simple. In terms of durability, I can only say that I have tried to destroy a set on my mtb and failed so far, so no worries there. The best tip I was given was that you must never touch them without gloves on, unless you enjoy hearing the death cries of a fox each time you pull up.

[@brucelangsteiner4599]

I’ve used rim brakes since I started racing back in 1979. I owned a gravel bike for a bit and didn’t care for the weight or handling. However, the disc brakes were quite nice. Maybe a lighter gravel bike is in my future. 😁

[@dirkbodschard3961]

Congrats for your new bike. Hope you will enjoy the rides

[@gossamersanchez4796]

Rim brakes every time I have a gorgeous team sky edition dogma F10 with.... RIM BRAKES and ksyrium exalith clinchers, it is totally superior to the disk equivalent

[@Karan02256]

Very good rim brake choose 😉

[@sunnyhu4855]

Nice bike Ollie. What a discovery. We are of the same height.. I can take the same bike measurements. Thanks for sharing your new bike. Awesome.

[@joaocastro924]

I will only say what I have experience on: I live on a volcanic island, so there are basicly no flats just up's and downs, i have been using rim brakes during. In here you can encounter steep decends that go for 200m vertical (avg -17%, max 23%) with tight corners and some long decends full of tight corners, I find that they are very good at breaking and I don't need disk brakes honestly, roads are sometimes quite bumpy so I suffer from a problem, every 400km I have to realign the front wheel because of the heat that the breakes grenerate, bumpy roads plus tight corners. But that is all the complains I have with it. I also have to say that I never used them in wet conditions because i don't need to ride in the rain LOL. I have also used brake disk from a bike of a friend, I hate when they get a mildly hot and start screaming, those were hydraulic too. They surely gave me more breaking power but I didnt feel the need for it, plus the breaks sounded like those coal old trains once they got to break on a train station they would just ear rape everyone nearby. I have never experienced such thing with rim breaks, when they overheat you can hear a suddle (sssssssssssssssssssssss) and not blow everyone's hear.

[@IanPayne]

Can I just have the £11,000 and just keep my bike? I will spend it on cake.

[@MrTripsJ]

Ian Payne I’ll spend it on epo

[@appa609]

That’s a lot of cake

[@thiosemicarbizidebenzoylal2921]

Java Suprema full carbon 1,500 bucks and every bit as good. Aliexpress.

[@phillip2169]

@@thiosemicarbizidebenzoylal2921 that is demonstrably untrue 🤣

[@phillip2169]

@@appa609 full Rihanna

[@kawakawa9451]

Rim brakes all day long 👍 one of my bikes is an F8 btw.

[@Vam1500]

I have disc brakes on my gravel bike. When I go back to my road bike which has rim brakes, the braking isn’t as strong but I like the road bike with rim brakes because it feels right and I never worry about rubbing. Kind of relief to have a simpler system for that bike.

[@kevin_du_92]

Thank you for a reasonable point of view on the question. What is unreasonnnable remains that manufacturers (Pinarello and others not included) kind of force us to get disc breaks, for their business model's sake and not for the sports's sake. That's a shame.