Gen 4's Battle Arcade Fooled EVERYONE For 16 Years. Why?

[@James-vc1kc]

During his streamed attempts of the Gold Prints HG/SS speedrun over 4 years ago, Werster actually went into a lot of detail about how the battle arcade’s system worked. Essentially, it’s possible to manipulate every single battle you get in your run for the gold print, between knowing which teams you’ll encounter and which trainers you’ll be able to skip. However, you need to perfectly execute choosing all debuffs on the board. I don’t remember if he fully talks about it in his recorded uploaded on KZbin but it was a fascinating demonstration of rng manipulation and skill to hold a manip for so damn long. Always love hearing about the battle arcade, looks like solid team recommendations too

[@magpielabs]

This tracks with what I know about gen 4 RNG manipulation also; but this kind of manip is explicitly banned from winstreak leaderboards because the focus is on the intended strategy for the facilities.

[@sky_pirate]

​@@magpielabs... what? How would anybody even know?

[@Chibuga]

This was actually my favorite facility as a kid because it had the least rng of them all. The opponents not having items got rid of so much bs that makes you lose like bright powder, focus band, etc. Plus the roulette was very easy to time. Funny that the "luck" based facility in concept was actually the least luck based one in practice.

[@magpielabs]

As a kid you were a long way ahead of the ballgame! I totally agree with how getting rid of the items is actually a serious buff to the player

[@rogue1248]

honestly i love the battle arcade, and even arcade star dahlia.

[@Chibuga]

@@rogue1248 both are great

[@fun2building]

Factory and Arcade are the only ones I ever finished

[@DuskoftheTwilight]

15:52 Clearly the AI was going galaxy brain and assuming you'd knock out one of the slows, so it figured whoever survived would set trick room up!

[@medichampion328]

15:30 Slowbro: I reversed the polarity. You reversed it back! We're CONFUSING the polarity!

[@alpacaAnarch]

Ohhhh when you first mentioned that player performance affects the way roulette tiles are generated, I guessed it would be the opposite: that performing better would make the roulette harder. Someone at Game Freak decided to be merciful!

[@DrachenIvy]

(before clicking the video) "it's rigged, isn't it" (after watching) "oh so it IS rigged but in a very weird way"

[@tristancam7219]

Interesting! You nailed the obscure nerdy trivia vid style

[@axeltheking4157]

this backhanded ahh compliment 😭

[@tristancam7219]

@axeltheking4157 wdym 😭 I genuinely enjoyed the new content xd

[@Reefer-Rampage69]

@@axeltheking4157😂😂 fr

[@BluesGold.]

Everyone I knew HATED this battle facility. It was my absolute favorite as a child. What you said at 6:07 brought it all back to me. This is how I always won and got a ton of BP.

[@Lightstation_]

It was always my favourite as well. Factory was my least favourite. But if I played it today I think I would love factory

[@ProtoDemnProductions]

The double AI Trick Room at the end of the video gets a rating of 10/10

[@csilval18]

I'm so here for this type of content. I love emerald battle factory runs, and demystifying niche mechanics videos. I hope you do more things like this.

[@Darkxellmc]

Ah yes, the facility where you can immolate or electrocute your opponent before you fight with him. The good old times.

[@hitkid2456]

Sounds so wild putting it like that!

[@robertmadden7427]

This is a banger video, I hope it pops off

[@robbiegarber898]

Arcade's always been my favorite tower. The music is a jam, the gimmick is great, and Dahlia may be the best-designed character in all of gen 4's post-game.

[@moshejong]

Well explained and you've got a nice voice to listen to!

[@chris1cc]

Excellent video! I've gotten the gold print in Arcade before but didn't know it went this deep

[@squilliams]

6:33 I know atsync had also looked into the roulette auto-stop mechanics years ago, so he also deserves some credit for this. 3:17 I mostly agree with this tier list, but I think the self-item tile should be worse than the neutral tier. It’s true that the item you get will often be inconsequential, but occasionally it will be outright detrimental to your team (choice item/lagging tail/etc). Not to mention that you’re also forced to keep the item for the rest of the round. I personally try to avoid the tile almost always. Overall, great video. This was a very good breakdown of the arcade, and congrats on the recent world record

[@magpielabs]

Yeah I agree that self-item is worse for a lot of the more optimised teams. Choice items in particular drag it down a lot. On streams I basically always avoid it. I guess "worse teams" (meaning no offense) that are more straightforward would appreciate them more I've updated the description to credit atsync - thanks

[@dramaticScar]

I’m glad people are talking about these facilities… The Battle Castle is very broken too with that Skip battles mode they had. I would however like to know some sort of way to beat the Battle Factory… it’s the only one I have left and I have been over this for more than a year now

[@kurenian]

Very cool that Dahlia’s ace ludicolo is relevant for a potentially innovative team.

[@robertlupa8273]

I was much more fascinated by the team building you showcased in the latter half of the video, to be honest. It was very interesting to hear about all the different approaches to the Frontier.

[@badatit576]

Loved this, great vid

[@dylan-nelson]

have you heard of werster? hes usually the most in tune with making predictions for gen 4 mechanics in his several hour runs. he prolly has commentary on this

[@katekat7804]

great vid !

[@HoneyStarfall]

This was so cool!! Such an interesting topic, loved the video!!

[@Ryano35]

The Battle Arcade is my favourite facility. The music is so catchy

[@davidtoomey4712]

I loved the Battle Frontier in gens 3 and 4, but definitely played gen 4 more via Soul Silver, and managed to get the gold winstreak in all of the facilities (except maybe factory) after much grinding. The Arcade was the most fun to me because of the variance and the skill expression via picking clusters of benificial / less risky buttons to aim for. Castle was fun but stressful budgeting HP, PP and healing items. Dome was slow and tilting with bad luck. Tower is good but a bit repetitive. Factory was beyond my skill level at the time

[@magpielabs]

Congrats - back in the day all golds was not trivial, particularly when getting a hold of perfect IV pokemon was rough I will eventually cover it (I promise) but our understanding of Factory as a community is much better than it was. It remains (specifically g4 factory) easily the hardest facility despite this. Tower is also my least favorite but I have mentally committed to a certain goal so I will have to drag that out. At least the simplicity means i can play it faster

[@Grencham]

Dude awesome video I learned a lot!

[@skadiorcanic]

This is really like it!!! Dang it!!! Its sooo arrghh thank you thank you FOR DOCUMENT IT. !!!! It was so cool..the fact that people are sleeping on it still.

[@MrCoolSponge]

very cool actually shocking well done for someone with so little views. Good job brotha

[@peterholmes7440]

It is such a shame that game freak doesn’t want to bother coding an end game challenge like the battle frontier or even something as simple as the battle tree from Gen 7 anymore.

[@3neoexodus]

feel bad for the dude that found that shiny Skarmory in the Battle Arcade at 0:30

[@magpielabs]

That's me! it happened during filming for the video haha

[@logolept]

Good and grounded-on the game, the art, rather than on the artists, the developers.

[@furball192]

I like the music in the background when you're talking, but i wish it was a little lower in volume compared to your voice. Love your video❤

[@sethdavis3046]

The way I’ve always thought about it is that when you are playing well youre on a “hot streak” like if you were at a casino

[@Quasartist]

I'm currently team building in my Emerald version to take on all the facilities I'm missing (other than the Factory of course) but after I do that I'm going to migrate some clones up to my Platinum and Soul Silver and see if I can get the fully upgraded Trainer Card on there as well. This video will be instrumental for my attempts at the Battle Arcade, I can already tell. Gonna be a big mountain to climb but it'll be well worth it. Currently tearing through Colosseum to try and land a good Raikou with HP Grass or Ice. It's going terribly lol but I did get a shiny Bold Suicune so that's neat.

[@magpielabs]

I definitely wish you good luck. in terms of gen 4 facilities difficulty, i would say Tower > Arcade > Castle. Hall is as hard as you want it to be; Garchomp/ Event Raikou are the main MVPs there. Factory is the hardest. For emerald, I would say Arena > Tower > Palace > Pike > Dome > Pyramid (if you are willing to fully abuse the pyramid and do early pickup strats + blissey). If you are doing pyramid with a more regular team, its a similar difficulty to pike.

[@Quasartist]

@@magpielabs I've already got a handful of Silver symbols in Emerald but honestly I find Pyramid to be the second or third easiest. I somewhat pioneered a "Regular Show" strategy utilizing a Pickup Linoone and a Runaway Dodrio, aptly named Rigby and Mordecai lol I know that Runaway doesn't work as intended very consistently in the Pyramid, but it still lets me get past Wobbuffet and such when necessary which is convenient. I have an Aromatherapy Blissey but the few times I used her she didn't seem worth it so I've put a mixed attacking Explosion Metagross in the final spot as I farm up items on the early runs. I know Garchomp is a beast but I didn't even consider the event Raikou. Definitely going to finagle with my phone to make it a DS hotspot for event downloads because I'm pretty sure I had already migrated my beasts up to White/White2. Perhaps not though, it's been a long time since I've looked. I appreciate the detailed input as well!

[@magpielabs]

@@Quasartist awesome, you clearly know what you are doing

[@tagukami]

The shiny skarmory at the start physically hurt me

[@backpackerraden6268]

Always been my favourite of the battle facilities. Loved the breakdown

[@eddiebeaver7313]

5:20 is that N.Gin Labs 😎🎶

[@SuperSdm7]

Although I might be cooking with this strategy, it would be interesting to use the invisible pokemon strategy with a weather nullifying pokemon (which is only golduck this generation). The idea is to set up just a little bit with calm mind then sweep (+1 Golduck should be enough to take out at least one pokemon). If statused, golduck can easily use refresh, the last 2 moves being ice beam and surf. Team switches would not be a problem because the AI would not waste turns setting up which golduck needs. Most statuses don’t matter due to refresh. Getting burned wont matter because you are a special attacker. weather becomes irrelevant. Golduck is also middling in speed making trick room not as impactful. With that, it allows you to ignore a majority of negative effects on the board itself (barring 3-4 tiles).

[@ac31048]

Last year I got a 272 streak in the Battle Tower doubles.

[@Ultimaximus]

Every pokemon discovery reveals something over 10 years old, the age doesn't mean anything at this point until every game's decomp has been fully analyzed

[@vanesslifeygo]

Looks fun, there should be a simple Platinum mod that's only the battle arcade, but that has all the Pokemon you need for it so you don't need to spend hours raising them yourself. Maybe a save file for it , at least

[@EthanKironus8067]

Could you please do a video on the Battle Factory? I don't have optimized 'mons for this kinda stuff with the other facilities, plus I like the way you have to select your team from random offerings rather than just getting to come in with a few cheesable 'mons you've probably already used to the point of apathy. P.S. I guess the Battle Tower, primarily the partner battles, is my second pick, partly because of the variety of possible teams the NPCs can have giving a bit of the Battle Factory feeling, but mainly because it has Riley the Sir Aaron knockoff and to choose someone else would be a stain on my conscience.

[@magpielabs]

The factory is my favorite facility and i will get around to it; but its a tricky video to make because the knowledge buy-in is very high. If I had a clear idea about how to do it effectively, I would do so immediately

[@Mike_TGL]

I used a Guts boosted Facade from an Ursaring holding a pink bow. I could land on the burn tile somewhat reliably at the beginning. It was damn fun.

[@DoctorSpacebar]

Mirskle's gym in Unbound has left me acutely aware of what Fog does. Bulky pivots with U-Turn would probably be solid, especially if you can find one with Guts. Also, Aura Sphere might be valuable in Fog; mixed Lucario or Togekiss could potentially turn this normally bad tile into an advantage. Ambipom, Scyther and Scizor could get a similar benefit from Technician-boosted Aerial Ace. EDIT: Had an idea. Maybe run Bug Bite or Pluck, so if an enemy gets a berry tile, you can take their berries! Again, Scizor could possibly use this pretty well.

[@Vaithegamingwarrior]

Friend 1, a Heartgold Hearth: "Battle Factory is the best!" Friend 2, a Soulsilver Star: "No, Battle Castle, you dunce!" Me, a Battle Revolution, Platinum, AND Johto remake player who should probably be in an asylum: "I usually go for the Battle Arcade though???"

[@SalcranVGC]

Aha, double Trick Room XD A joke if done outside of TR, but inside is galaxy brain lol

[@jamesflynn932]

Im was casually doing the battle arcade today (finally got gold!) and had some thought about how the clock stopped. I didnt do any calculations but thought there was some thought on if it could work. Not sure id say i got the same idea but its nice to think about

[@jansonshrock2859]

This was always my first silver and gold prints i got when I was clearing the battle area places as a kid. I understood the system i guess because i would only miss a spin like 1/30 times and in the later runs getting the speed down powers is crucial. I got to realizing that in each round at WORST there is an ability that has null effect on the battle i can't remember getting a board that was all bad options

[@Sakaki_Hime]

Polly put the kettle on, but it's Slowbro and Slowking 😂

[@maridiancrest243]

My 9 year old cousin discovered this mystery years ago!

[@MrCrossmoss]

I was using guts because of the chance of status. Xd

[@magpielabs]

Nice - This is another very legit arcade-specific strat that i didnt have space for in the video

[@Nosretep]

Imagine if Hex was introduced in Gen 4.

[@okeanos317]

It's funny,cause I think this was the only facility I could get the gold print from,and thought it was easy,the others I know I could only get the silver print

[@KusogeMan]

can you find a way to easily beat battle factory? it's the last challenge i'm missing on platinum

[@magpielabs]

I do have the battle factory WR and I do plan to do a proper video guide at some point. For now the most I have is this www.smogon.com/forums/threads/4th-generation-battle-facilities-discussion-and-records.3663294/page-12#post-10151435 Which might be too heavy in terms of reading and sudden flow of information. Apologies for that. I agree it would be a lot better in a clear video format! Unfortunately there is no easy short solution. Gold in the gen 4 factory is easily the hardest challenge in any vanilla pokemon game. Even if you know exactly what you're doing it takes a bit of luck. So I can at least validate you in that it is very hard

[@salmonella7993]

This is the equivalent of someone getting stoned off their ass, walking outside and realizing the sky is blue.

[@monster25man]

I see my gal Dahlia, I click

[@ScaredJade]

is the +3 levels tile permanent or just for the round?

[@magpielabs]

Just for the battle! Almost all of the tiles are just the next battle. Only ones that stay for the round (up to the next 7 games) are the tiles that give your pokemon an item or berry

[@edibleteddybear]

wait enemy pokemon can be shiny in the arcade???

[@magpielabs]

Yep, regular 1 in 8192 chance. Good spot

[@Ryano35]

Yep, I found a shint voltorb there

[@RikuGenshin]

Can you still get the frontier brains if you do doubles?

[@magpielabs]

No Frontier brains in doubles :(

[@thegatekeeper9702]

What a cool vid! Is there any way to get involved in this?

[@magpielabs]

All you need to get going is a way to play either Platinum, Heartgold or Soulsilver and to play through to the postgame where the Arcade is. If you just want to mess around and have fun - thats about it. A decent ingame team can get the gold in the arcade (its hard but doable). If your focus is on winstreaks above 100, going for records, etc. - I recommend bringing up the resources linked in the Smogon records thread ( www.smogon.com/forums/threads/4th-generation-battle-facilities-discussion-and-records.3663294/ ) for the generation 4 frontier. This includes things like; a spreadsheet with all possible trainers/ pokemon; a damage calculator that is pre-set to load up these pokemon; and a lot of write ups and information about previous teams. There is also a discord linked in the OP there which I am active in. A lot of newer players do something in-between. e.g. maybe you do a bit of reading and research, but then dive in before you are "properly" ready and prepared. It is all about having fun and I think this is a sensible approach as there are things you can only learn via playing. Usually I say Records are not realistic without quite a hardcore level of investment BUT as mentioned in the video; someone with incredibly good mechanical timing skills (e.g. someone very strong at hitting RNG manip seeds, or maybe a Geo Dash or OSU player, etc) has an actual shot as you can rig a lot of games with perfect roulette micro.

[@lordinfernape4753]

Here before 1k subs

[@jeepcommander6240]

Yeasaa

[@WalkerSunriseChannel]

Wait, did this confuse people? Seemed pretty easy to me, I played this the most back in the day because the roulette was so simple to game that it was the least frustrating, lol.

[@magpielabs]

I think the way the Arcade puts a lot more skill and responsibility in the hands of the player is good yeah. Main negative is that gen 4 does not run fast so these streaks can take a while to build up

[@relentlesszard8166]

We are still robbed with the lack of game modes in the new games.

[@jackmuir5314]

You said you were going to present information fairly to us but then cut away from all roulette options shown in Game 1 - if future boards are dictated by what you got previously then it is hard to notice a pattern.

[@terryechoes3192]

The Battle Frontier areas in each game have never appealed to me. I'm not a strategist. I prefer to win by effort. As a result, I have no idea which Pokémon I have that are any good. I have no idea how to identify which ones are any good.

[@1buszybudy13]

Except that everyone already knows poke-shit cheats like crazy especially in the facilities

[@nonplayercharacter12333]

I'd rather master this than play a second of vgc

[@magpielabs]

Haha i must say as a former VGC player that i know what you mean

[@SomeSprites]

I made the Battle Arcade fool y'all for funsies, my bad.

[@monopolyrubix1875]

Algorithm comment

[@Gnarfledarf]

Interesting video, but I hate the clickbait title.

[@legendaeri]

misleading title, just because you haven't found documentation on something you're interested in doesn't mean "everyone was fooled". easily could just swap it to something less aggressive.

[@legendaeri]

it's annoying because this video is interesting to me, i just hate it's clickbait. i love learning about gen 4 things i don't fully understand, but the title makes me hate having clicked on the video because it only just encourages you to keep doing clickbait.

[@magpielabs]

For transparency, I get it. I have previously spent hundreds of hours on videos (on this channel and completely separate channels with nothing to do with Pokemon) which have gone to get less total watchtime than I spent filming and editing alone. I don't do youtube to get rich or famous; but there has been something extremely depressing about doing stuff like that for years. I would like to say "I dont care" and know I mean it but it does sting. My first title and thumbnail for this video was "The secrets of the Battle Arcade" alongside a similar thumbnail saying "You saw through the roulette"? This got 9 views in the first 3 hours and (from what I know from previous videos) was on track to fail to get 100 in the first week. The CTR was under 2% which is usually algorithm death. Something that smaller youtube channels struggle with is competition in the space. If its not a recognised name or face, and if the video isnt so amazing that people actively share it (think e.g. pokemon blind and deaf), then it wont do well early. Doing badly early means it gets stuck in double or triple digit views days and weeks later; and the fact is that people are just less likely to click on a video with a lower viewcount as views are seen as a proxy for quality (to be fair, there is truth to this). It's also true that about half of this video isnt even about the mechanics of the arcade but the strategies used by players; I would like to think that even if you came in expecting X that if you are satisfied with Y then you are happy overall. I'm sorry the title ruined the video for you - and it looks like people agree with you - so I will try a lot harder to avoid anything like this in the future. If people don't enjoy the video then its a failure in my book regardless of what numbers say

[@legendaeri]

@@magpielabsi do appreciate this response. i do get wanting to be picked up in the algorithm as a smaller channel, and in general wanting videos you put a lot of care into to be viewed by others. but i also respect when creators describe what’s in the video properly. because the title was just misleading, it wasn’t just purely incorrect, but stuff like this is very “slippery slope” territory. while i do think i could’ve worded my comment nicer but i also do stand by what i said. and i feel it was valuable for me to post about this, because t’s disappointing when valuable videos are behind misleading titles because i want to support good research into a topic like this. i just dislike the idea of further pushing content that could mislead others. it’s just there’s so many people on this platform do misleading titles maliciously purely for clicks it’s hard to tell what’s what anymore. :(

[@jimimcmahon4522]

More clickbait garbage