General Motors Was Foolish For Getting Rid Of These Cars

[@BrianHoff04]

Pontiac.. for the fun stuff. Saturn.. for the value. Nice video. Thanks!

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Yep, Pontiac was a fun brand. Thanks for watching!

[@Lovemonkey2005]

I'd like to see Oldsmobile and Pontiac come back so we have more choices.

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Definitely. A Pontiac revival would be cool.

[@athoshadjiantoni6403]

If I have a choice I like to see Pontiac, Oldsmobile, Saab and Holden coming back again.

[@CJColvin]

Don't forget Pontiac's Canadian Sub-brands like Acadian and Beaumont as well.

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Pontiac without a doubt.

[@SomethingAboutCars]

Me too!

[@gp-tr3cu]

Just Pontiac, Holden, and Saturn.

[@danielthoman7324]

​@CJColvin my aunt in 🇨🇦 Canada had an Acadian. First she had a yellow one than traded it in on a newer Green one. I always thought they were nice little cars. This was late 60's.

[@craighanks429]

Pontiac was always GM’s performance division & I was surprised they axed it & kept Buick, Oldsmobile. As teenagers in the 60’s we always thought of Buick & Oldsmobile as “old guy cars”. I bought a used 67 GTO in 72 when I got back from Vietnam. It had its whole drivetrain replaced & ran like it was new. Fast car, 400 cid 4 barrel carb & 4 spd manual. Still kicking myself for trading it off. Worth a helluva lot more today.

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Thanks for commenting. Yep unfortunately Buick and Oldsmobile had that stereotype of being an old guy’s car. I guess that’s why they tried to bring out cars like the Aurora to attract younger buyers.

[@ce9345]

Pontiac and oldsmobile would be my choice. My mother owned three Pontiac's over the years. My grandparents owned 2 oldsmobile's. I own two buick sedans.

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Cool. Which Buick sedans do you own? Such a shame they no longer produce Buick sedans for the American market.

[@pilsudski36]

This is the natural result of accountants running car companies instead "Car Guys."

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Excellent point.

[@athoshadjiantoni6403]

What a shame, all the car brands are now gone GM ruined everyone of them.

[@spencerolson1532]

And people lost there jobs because of general motors killing off all those car brands

[@taniabanes4707]

Always blame the company, it’s easy, why don’t you blame the a-oles who bought Camrys and Accords?

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

😂

[@mr.slim6188]

None of them need to come back. Because who the hell wants a rebadged Equinox or Traverse with a Pontiac or Olds badge?

[@eddie9591]

Pontiac would fit in, in today's power obsessed car. I can see the Grand Prix competing with the Charger if they adopted a RWD platform. They could have made the Firebird way more competitive with the Mustang and Challenger. At some point we'd probably have a varient of the LS that would be pushing the same numbers as the hellcats and demons from the factory. But GM being GM, they wouldnt have made them awesome cars anyway because itd take sales from the Camaro and Corvette. Pontiac had so much potential. Even the Aztek couldve been successful today, after a major redesign for tge second generation. All modern crossovers have that wierd split headlight look the Aztek pioneered in the early 00's.

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Exactly. A modern Grand Prix would be RWD and the higher models could’ve been a competent Hellcat competitor. A modern GTO/Firebird could’ve taken the fight to the Mustang/Challenger. A modern Pontiac brand could’ve been all about performance figures. Now that’s excitement.

[@dma124]

I kinda agree, though there should have NEVER BEEN a Grand Prix sedan. That’s when I knew hell had frozen over for good.

[@autochatter]

My quick takes: Pontiac...Too many fails before finally gaining some footing, and the Economic Crisis killed them. Saturn: Alot of R&D was spent making them different, and ticked off other Divisions. Eventually Saturn's were just clones of other GMs and rebadged Opels. Oldsmobile. Buyers were aging out and revival efforts didn't work.plus Olds and Buick seemed redundant SAAB: GM never made money with them OPEL: See Saab Hummer: Became the poster child for thirsty SUVs. Gas prices and preferences to more fuel efficient crossovers helped kill them. Wonderful vid Rob!

[@Carl_Z]

GM never made money directly from Opel, but it used its platforms and industrial developments to generate profits through Chevrolet in Brazil, Mexico, and other brands like Holden, etc. In other words, it used Opel's resources to develop products for Latin America and emerging markets like China and South Africa and even usa (via saturn) but did not reinvest the earnings in creating new products. This strategy ultimately destroyed Opel, as the revenue generated was used in other GM markets but was not reinvested directly in Opel itself.

[@autochatter]

@Carl_Z You are quite correct actually! There was also many Opel bits and platform designs that found their way into U.S. models over the years. I guess I was referring more to rebadges and original Opels brought here. Shame Opel was kind of wrung out like a sponge.

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Thanks for sharing your perspective and thanks for listening to me chime in.

[@autochatter]

@MotorMaster_Stunticon Oh you know I always do!

[@michaelm3381]

I miss Pontiac. I still have my 2002 Firebird Formula I bought brand new, and I also have a 1999 Trans Am that I take to car shows.

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

That’s awesome. The 99 Trans Am is a great looking pony car.

[@jonw6262]

I miss Oldsmobile. Had a 98 Regency and it was a fantastic car.

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Oldsmobile was great.

[@chadenglish4169]

I wish they would bring back Pontiac. My mom had a Pontiac 6000 and Sunbird. My brother had 2 Grand Am GTs. I had a Sunbird, Bonneville, Grand Prix, and Grand Am GT. I loved that car.

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

What year was your Grand Prix? That’s one of my favorite cars.

[@danielthoman7324]

5:47 Who didn't like Pontiac Trans-Am?

[@2W3X4YZ5]

Those who knew the Formula was always faster than the T/A?

[@dma124]

I did not, with all respect for those who did. Give me a Jim Rockford Firebird Esprit from “The Rockford Files” any day of the week.. I HATED the TransAm.. to me, it SCREAMED “REDNECK” because of “Smokey and the Bandit”.

[@levyoliver5363]

@@danielthoman7324 i like the Pontiac Trans Am. Could be a twin of the Chevrolet Camaro...

[@minivanmaster]

I drove an oldsmobile for 9 years and my mom drove one for a long time too... we won't forget how nice they were. Those 90s GM cars are so nice and simple and last forever

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Agreed. Thanks for watching.

[@SomethingAboutCars]

I don't understand why GMC still exists. Pretty much every single one of their vehicles has an identical Chevy equivalent (apart from the Typhoon/Syclone). At least Pontiac had its own identity. As for Holden, in 2020 GM decided to leave all right-hand-drive markets entirely, so they sold off Opel/Vauxhall to PSA (now Stellantis) and cancelled Holden because Aussie car manufacturing had already died out. (But now they're bringing Cadillac back to Oz and NZ. 🤦‍♂️)

[@johnnymason2460]

I have said for a long time that GMC is no longer necessary. Chevrolet can sell luxury trucks now and actually do. I would rather have an Escalade than a GMC Denali.

[@cheepda]

Because gmc is still popular and still gives them sales so why cut the nostalgia from people who love gmcs and only sell chevys there are gmc fans and chevy fans like me would be disappointed and if they remove gmc's division it would cause sale drops

[@johnnymason2460]

@cheepda Oh, please! They would have gotten over it. GM truck people are still truck people. They would have been just fine. Ford didn't create an upscale truck brand. Why should GM have one when no one else does?

[@cheepda]

@johnnymason2460 because they're GM

[@gp-tr3cu]

@@SomethingAboutCars GMC only exists bc Pontiac dealerships wanted to sell trucks lmfaooooo. You're right they shouldn't exist

[@Lovemonkey2005]

GM ruined Saturn. They were quality vehicles on par with Honda and Toyota when they were on their one. When GM bought them and just rebranded their already poor quality cars Saturns went down fast. I hope the government does bail GM out again. They need to just fold as a corporation.

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

I agree ☝️

[@Romiman1]

But GM never "bought" Saturn. GM founded Saturn.

[@dma124]

GM bought Saturn? Boy, are you WRONG there. Go back and do your research.

[@colinschmitz8297]

I enjoyed the video! The pair of divisions that I would revive would be Pontiac and Holden. With Saturn I think GM should have instead of badging opel models as Saturns, I think Saturn should have been the corporate template for GM's compact car program. Some uniqueness would be lost in this, but they could have kept the plastic door panels as a Saturn exclusive and kept their dealership model for those who wanted it that way. The opel models did not work out at all. I think part of the problem that Pontiac had was they wouldn't restrict Chevy. One of the biggest logical fallacies of General motors is this idea that the appliance division of the company is the division that gets the fastest coolest car and nothing may top it. This displays a severe lack of vision that the management has over this considering that Ferrari, Lamborghini, Porsche, and other exotic sports car and supercar divisions have varying levels of performance and numerous models to pick from. They could have kept the Corvette the Corvette being a front engine pushrod V8 car for the traditional sports car for a price point and not worry about petty things like sharing a steering wheel and other bits and pieces with cheaper models. Then with Pontiac they could have made a mid engine supercar with a more exotic powertrain and given the Pontiac a bigger budget for the interior as well with the goal of this model call it the banshee or the fire hawk with the intention of competing more directly to the Ferraris and Lamborghinis of the world. Doing this would have added much more cache to the division as a whole. From here they needed to make the ordinary models from Pontiac stand out not only in the marketplace but within General motors themselves making models like the Grand Prix GXP exclusive to Pontiac and not offer a Chevy of equivalent. There should have been exclusive versions of the firebird offered in every single year of its production not just a one-off SLP firehawk every now and then to solidify it as the superior pony car. The Chevy would need to be powerful enough to beat the mustang which throughout the '90s was not a difficult task. They also needed to make more performance focused versions of the Sunfire / sunbird to offer a competitor to the likes of the eclipse and the lancer. They just needed to be America's performance division and not just rely on a couple models to carry the weight just to have Chevy undercut that move. Also whenever they decided to get into the SUV / crossover market, styling was only half of the mistake that came out of the Aztek. The other major mistake with the Aztek was there was nothing at all exciting about it from a performance standpoint. With BMW, Mercedes, and other divisions known for performance getting into the market, that was the direction Pontiac should have aimed for. They needed to have a SUV that was focused on on road performance Not a pop-up tent in the back.

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Great comment and thanks for taking the time to type all of this. Lots of logic here. GM should hire you to run things. And the pop up tent had me laughing!

[@SomethingAboutCars]

I agree; I've never understood why GM is so protective of the Corvette to the point of paranoia. That's why they shot down the Buick Reatta and Pontiac Fiero, even though those cars weren't even in the same universe as the Vette.

[@colinschmitz8297]

@@MotorMaster_Stunticon thank you! I appreciate all the time that you put into putting together your videos and sharing your perspective.

[@colinschmitz8297]

@@SomethingAboutCars My theory is the dealer's might be part of the problem. I know that some big mistakes such as the Cadillac cimarron was rushed to market due to pressure from the dealers. This is where I think GM needed to work out deals with the dealers that they could have more than one franchise but that certain models or trims were going to be superior in the superior divisions. Otherwise it undermines the whole idea of having different divisions.

[@joellamoureux7914]

My mom's manual shift 1993 SC2 went to 600k without even having to get new gaskets. It did need new everything else. It was a fantastic little car. So I gave it everything it needed at about 250k after the Saturn dealer absolutely infuriated me refusing to sell me the only ion redline they had. I left there telling them they were going to bankruptcy. I wish I was wrong honestly 😊

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

It went to 600k?! Now that’s what I call reliable!

[@dmandman9]

I never got over the fact that GM let Oldsmobile die on the vine. During the 1980’s they had the Cutlass as GM’s best seller. Then it seems as they just gave up.

[@courtneypuzzo2502]

I wish Pontiac and Oldsmobile would be revived the first car my mum owned was a used 1977 Firebird Esprit 400 with T Top roof and there were models from both I admired as a child Hurst Olds 442 Pontiac Catalina etc. though I can also understand why the brands were cancelled for dwindling sales and not being able to attract younger buyers who may have associated Oldsmobile with their grandparents even I'm one of those my late maternal grandmother drove 2 Oldsmobile Delta 88s in the 1970s one of which had a 7.4 L V8 under hood and the other had a 350 CID V8 under hood where as the biggest motor GM currently has is a 381 CID or 6.2 L that's used in the Corvette and the Cadillac CT5 V Blackwing though the Blackwing has 173 more horsepower from factory than the Corvette

[@sasz2107]

It was the Corporate Average Fuel Economy, people. They had to make the cars smaller and lighter. They had to save money while doing it. So they shared car bodies and platforms with each GM division. Also emissions regulations, which led to underpowered cars for many years. Still as popular as Buick, Olds, Pontiac, and Chevy were, even well into the 1980s, it's within my memory. GM had a full 50% of the car market even in 1985. The fact that so few GM cars are now around just boggles my mind. Never in a million years did I think back then that the foreign car companies would take over the car market completely. I thought they'd join us, not replace the Big 3 completely.

[@timothykeith1367]

GM went bankrupt is what happened to Pontiac. It was announced in 2009 to shutdown Pontiac in 2010.

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Thanks for watching.

[@thecharger98]

Here’s how it should happen: Pontiac: performance Chevy Oldsmobile: budget Cadillac Buick: luxury Chevy

[@rodferguson3515]

I know it's not going to happen but pretty much mainly Pontiac and Holden would be the ones I would mostly like to come back also in a sense Oldsmobile and Saturn as well add four adults who like the import niceties of the Saab brand I would love to see them come back.

[@Gypsycat19]

Holden Commodores from VC to VL were my favourites

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Yeah the Commodore was no joke.

[@gregg9672]

Geo

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

I liked the Prizm and Storm.

[@OLDS98]

Great video. You covered the brands and told the stories of each. GM did not manage the brands properly. The market changed as well. There are other car companies with multiple brands functioning successfully in the market today globally. GM did not focus the brands and they may have fewer brands in 2024, they have lost a lot of global market share and shrunk to being almost regional. That is not competing. I saw Grand Prix and Bonneville from Pontiac, Oldsmobile Toronado and Ninety Eight and Holden Caprice/Statesman and Commodore. I smiled and in reference to the brands I would like to see return: Oldsmobile, Pontiac and Holden. GM does not have many cars anymore. Three at Cadillac( CT4, CT5 and CT6(China only)), Chevrolet Corvette, and Buick sells sedans in China. I can tell you when GM started making mistakes. It was the 1980's and they are still paying for them in 2024. Thank you for the video.

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Now is the time to bring back Pontiac. People want cars with crazy power numbers i.e. Mustang, Charger etc. A revived Pontiac could have some high-powered sedans. If people loved the V8 Charger and 300 I’m sure Pontiac could fill in a gap in the market.

[@OLDS98]

@@MotorMaster_Stunticon I think something like that just might be in the works at GM right now. I watched videos about on You Tube and there are hints about this very idea. If they bring Pontiac back it can be sold at Buick GMC dealers and not only that, GM has too many holes in its line up. On top of all of that, Cadillac CT5 and Cadillac CT4 need to share their platform with something to keep the viable. Know this, I suspect Pontiac would not be a full line brand. I see Firebird and Grand Prix returning and or maybe Bonneville. They will fill the slots nicely. The Dodge Charger is 207 inches long. That is why I said Bonneville. If Pontiac did return, four cars would work: Grand Am(small)( rear drive this time), Firebird( sports car), Grand Prix( medium) and Bonneville(large). You could put a GTO on the Grand Am or Grand Prix body. Just thinking out loud. This video is one I was referring to: kzbin.info/www/bejne/bGjPlniMp8mVfdE

[@levyoliver5363]

And maybe make the trade mark Chevrolet a name for high quality GM products..😂😅

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Haha. Good one!

[@levyoliver5363]

Yes!

[@seanm1319]

GM should bring back Pontiac to compete with Toyota and Honda. Pontiacs basically were rebadged Chevys, but they were much more stylish. Chevy just gives off a “basic” image that kinda turns me off. Pontiacs really were exciting looking. I had a Grand Am GT coupe and loved it. The car was practical, but it looked really cool, and was stylish. The G6 that replaced the Grand Am was so boring looking, and basically alienated the brand. The G8 was a great vehicle, but imo it was ugly. I know Consumer Reports shredded Pontiac on a regular basis for the plastic body molding (somehow they give Subaru a pass.. bias much), but it did add a cool racy look.

[@Marc816]

Nane any Oldsmobile model and I have either owned one or driven one!!!! All great cars!!!!! GM didn't see a good thing when it saw it!!!!!!!

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

That’s great. Did you own a Toronado or an Alero?

[@Marc816]

@@MotorMaster_Stunticon I got to drive them, but I never owned one. I have owned 88s, 98s, Cutlasses, 442s and now an Aurora.

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Awesome bro. Which gen is your Aurora?

[@zacharyvarnes1734]

Pontiac: Too bad they weren’t able to make a modern Firebird like Chevy got to with the “Bumblebee” Camaro. Lol. And I’m always curious how a modern Pontiac would look. Saab: Honestly disappointed such a quirky brand was diluted by mismanagement. Always loved the interiors, especially with the green lights, and every Saab I’ve gotten to drive I liked. Saturn: So much potential in the 90’s. I remember seeing a lot of them. But, GM seems to be unable to juggle so many brands and maintain each identity. Oldsmobile: I’ve driven a few and I even really like a few. But, I think they needed to be more unique maybe? The fact that Buick and Cadillac also existed while Chevy was there too… too much internal competition, not to mention the competitor’s brands. Hard sell. Hummer: Meh… not my kind of vehicle, but to each their own.

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Unfortunately I think a modern Pontiac would be mostly SUVs. Haha. Unless they get somebody in charge that is an actual car enthusiast.

[@johnfrank3642]

They also messed up when they did away with the saber in the Park Ave., Indian powers from the early 2000s those were nice looking cars what is 3806

[@zeeman857]

GM kills everything it gets its hands on. There's literally nothing truly interesting that they make anymore

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Unfortunately this is true, haha. At least we still got the C8 and the CT4/5.

[@TwoDollarGararge]

The chais was ancient, the 3800 would not pass emissions. By that point the w body was an ancient fossil.

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Thanks for chiming in.

[@spencerolson1532]

Agree

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Thanks bro

[@11ICE]

TK's Garage on KZbin seems to think Pontiac's resurrection is a done deal and Tim kuniskis from Dodge will lead the brand.

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

I guess we’ll just have to wait and see.

[@joellamoureux7914]

Daewoo is still making many GM cars. Alot more than you'd think, check your door tag for shock

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Haha

[@levyoliver5363]

Daewoo? That's a Korean Auto maker...🤣😆

[@stanwbaker]

@@levyoliver5363 Now General Motors-Korea.

[@sailingspark9748]

the Monaro Based GTO was rear wheel drive, not front.

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Well, when I said front wheel drive, I was referring to the Grand Prix and Bonneville, certainly not the GTO. Lol

[@nonic4vic600]

Gm should bring back pontiac and oldsmobile. They could make cadillac compete with rolls royce and buick would take over Cadillacs pricing range and oldsmobile for cheap luxury and pontiac for pontiac

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

That sounds like a great idea!

[@BausHogg]

They should've kept the 3800

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Yep that 3800 was bulletproof reliable.

[@levyoliver5363]

But they are all made by one auto maker company! And that is General Motors Corporation. So just GMC for a simple choice! 🤣😆

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Ha!

[@mr.slim6188]

A government bailout? Try two bailouts and selling majority stake to the government becoming Government Motors

[@dma124]

Yet nobody behaved so badly when Chrysler did the same thing. I didn’t get it.

[@mr.slim6188]

@dma124 that's because Chrysler was already a joke of a car company

[@dma124]

Pontiac created its own death by building some really ugly, plastic-cladded cars before their demise. To boot, you couldn’t get anything but a charcoal gray interior, which is the LAST thing you want in Texas. The death knell was of course the horrible Aztek, which got the reaction Edsel got when it was unveiled: an audible, uncomfortable gasp. I really liked Pontiac’s version of the Cobalt (the G whatever.. another mistake, killing model names), but by that time when I was looking, it was too late. As far as “saving” Buick.. I saw the vehicle they call a “Buick Envista” the other day, and it broke my heart. It’s more Kia and Hyundai than Hyundai itself. Putting the Buick Tri-shield (if you want to call it that) on it is a sacrilege.

[@MotorMaster_Stunticon]

Yeah it’s sad what Buick has become. Thanks for commenting.