Gettysburg Wargame at Lee’s Headquarters

[@bazd884]

I’m an Englishman living in New Zealand who is fascinated by the U.S civil war. Very enjoyable watch, well done.

[@T--commanderIvan]

Me to but i’m dutch

[@michael7324]

Thanks Baz, I'm an American who is fascinated by British war history. Please to meet you.

[@bazd884]

Michael 732. Up the RED COATS and down the colonials! Went to Boston many years ago which was fascinating and then went down to D.C. I didn’t realize how close Gettysburg was and didn’t go. Definitely on my bucket list.

[@michael7324]

@@bazd884 DC is just a walk down the road. A 3 day march.

[@lordofromuluslordofromulus8375]

May I know why?

[@jellybeany3120]

"I intend to pressure those people east of the city on the flank unless ordered otherwise" *reads orders* "i have decided, otherwise"

[@stevefe8522]

My vote for a second battle would be Antietam. Lee's first invasion of the North. Can the Union army use the two unused corps to finish off the Army of Northern Virginia?

[@HyperK7]

Stevefe Little Wars TV did Antietam a while back but I agree it would be interesting to see them do it in more of this format. *Game Spoilers* Their Antietam game ended in a complete rout for the rebels where there army was almost entirely destroyed.

[@ajs4287]

Shiloh would be a good one too

[@Anaris10]

Do you mean SHARPSBURG?.

[@lukederkovitz2297]

Hyperkid7 the south would of won if some southern scout did not take a pee and drop lees battle feild plans

[@pershing6367]

Luke Derkovitz the union wasnt too weak on any area of their line, and lee still would have likely charged the middle

[@ylyassun]

Steve : "And take those hills... if practicable" Random viewers : "..... Okay" Civil war enthusiasts : "Man... that's deep!"

[@PeterEvansPeteTakesPictures]

Heh. This. I didn't know a thing about the U.S Civil War a few years back. Then I attended a UK re-enactment, wound up photographing US Civil War reenactors over a year (it's a thing in Britain too!) and next thing I know I'm flying over to spend a weekend in Gettysburg and walking Cemetery Hill. I wound up just completely hooked. And now phrases like, "Sir... I have no division," make my British stiff upper lip wobble. x

[@robinthehood223]

Peter Evans Pickett 👍🏼

[@billd.iniowa2263]

@@PeterEvansPeteTakesPictures Great wargamers you Brits. ;-)

[@TheClassicWorld]

@@billd.iniowa2263 Yeah, you may or may not know... we (the British) really like war, or used to from about 400 AD to 1950 AD, I would say. I guess others like war more, though... Rome has to take the cake, no? 500 BC to 1945 AD... or, Greece, I guess... 800 BC to 2020 AD (half joking, of course). Shocking to many, the French have started more wars than any other nation in total looking at the data, and America has not started many, stopped many, and has not invaded many other nations (though they are far away and, in theory, have only existed for around 300 years, but still, that's impressive given how powerful they are). Of course, Americans have been heavily into war since 1941, though it kind of stopped by 1980 other than a few things in the Middle East. But, I digress.

[@robertrock8778]

“If practicable.” Those two words.... And, yes, Hood to the right....

[@theduke7539]

"If practicable" General Lee himself said those two words cost him the battle. The order should have been at any cost.

[@trumanneill659]

I had been a tabletop general years ago. To watch this and the interaction with viewers is most satisfying wish my old keens worked

[@nazeonrave2501]

This actually looks like fun Hopefully they do WW1 and 2 battles

[@nazeonrave2501]

cristopher wong I know that

[@_MrMoney]

WW1 battles would be a little like this Option A: rush for the next trench Option B: wait the enemy for a rush Repeat by 75 Congratulations! You've won half a mile! Only 360 more to reach Berlin!

[@nazeonrave2501]

Mr. Money that would work but I was thinking more of the major battles like Verdun or the Somme or the Russian civil war

[@candyzoeyxxx]

I feel there should be a boardgame of this.

[@Strawberry-12.]

Mr. Money and you lost 50,000 men

[@b1laxson]

Fascinating to integrate people into history. Voted key decisions, well-dressed re-enactors, quality table layout and so forth help bring into the modern mind the fog of war and uncertainties that surround pivotal battles

[@jalratke]

I'm such a geak. I watch the entire video talking to the screen. Arguing even. Would love to see this once a year. Or other battles.. Fredericksburg perhaps???

[@TheAdambetz]

This is absolutely incredible! What a rush that must have been!

[@NeoConNET7]

Wow! This is really great content! How does one vote for the decisions? It's so interesting to see how different people in charge make different outcomes. Oh my god I love that Ewell guy's attempt at a Southern accent.

[@cbowser3]

I’d love to see another one of these at a different battle site. Maybe Chancellorsville.

[@AmericanBattlefieldTrust]

Check out what Little Wars has to offer on their channel: kzbin.info/door/D6gPsr1xdvT9F4dntRAJ5gfeatured?disable_polymer=1

[@dougreid2351]

Outfu@ki*gstanding! Truly a remarkable half hour of "What might have been!" Thank you so much!

[@anumeon]

To anyone who likes to do "what ifs" on the Civil war. I highly recommend the pc game "Ultimate General: Civil war" Or if you only want the battle of Gettysburg. The game "Ultimate General: Gettysburg" They are really good indepth tactics games..

[@papovka]

Too bad Civil War abandoned the system where you completely control what you do on the battle & instead have to follow scripted events, but it's still a good game

[@anumeon]

@@papovka agreed

[@j.franklin21]

@@papovka I agree

[@PeterEvansPeteTakesPictures]

Can I also recommend 'Scourge of War: Gettysburg' which you can play in 1st person on 3D terrain and in which you have to rely on the reports brought to you by either your AI or human officers in ordering your units? Played a multiplayer game where as a newbie I was asked to hold the northern end where no significant action was expected, and where the Rebs attacked in full force. A three hour battle in which I was sweating bullets, begging for reinforcements from my three human allies, and now-and-again intercepting equally desperate demands from captured couriers between the human confederate officers opposing me. Old but brilliant game.

[@derrickdinwiddie8759]

I would love to see something like that happen again! Such an interesting way of going about it!

[@Redbirds1100]

this was a fantastic game you guys played. Thanks for playing this great battle.

[@Tankbattlion761]

This was very entertaining. Could you do one about a different battle. Like Fredericksburg or Chickamaga Creek.

[@AmericanBattlefieldTrust]

Check out more wargaming from Little Wars TV. They cover battles from all over the world, including the Battle of Antietam for our Civil War fans. kzbin.info/door/D6gPsr1xdvT9F4dntRAJ5gfeatured?disable_polymer=1 Rules Website: www.6mmacw.com/ - Rules Video Review: kzbin.info/www/bejne/rmjLfoyPrLuHgdU&

[@svenrio8521]

Always love coming back to watch this video.

[@logicaredux5205]

Lucky ducks! Getting to war game in Lee’s headquarters!

[@marcojacintodecamillisbuen3935]

Very interesting the analysis of the battle. Good wishes!

[@PeterEvansPeteTakesPictures]

Kent Brockman: "At the risk of sounding controversial, I'm placing the blame squarely on you, the viewers." This was brilliant, so much so I kind of wish it was longer. Got shivers seeing the Confederates claim Cemetery Ridge with their colours, then grinned like a loon with Sickles just throwing himself about like a madman. And that poor John Reynolds? Man, guy can't catch a break. And if you're pondering visiting the battlefield but never have, I say definitely do it. Fulfilled a bucket-list ambition last year flying over the pond and seeing it for myself. Incredible experience. (And also, some really good bars in Gettysburg. How was the Confederate advance not slowed by that?)

[@rangergxi]

I'm surprised that Sickles didn't violate every order.

[@samsquanch4201]

I had this board game from Avalon Hill and refought the battle many times with my friends. Brings back memories 👍🏻❤️

[@jacksont.7792]

I'm pretty sure you're thinking of the game called Johnny reb, this game is called altar of freedom

[@samsquanch4201]

Comander Bacara no the game i had was called ‘Gettysburg’. Don’t recall a Johnny Reb game. They also made one called ‘Chancellorsville’ if I remember right

[@addtexthere7823]

I looked up modern war footage and it gave me this. Thank god i love these guys

[@loyaltyisroyalty5616]

What a cool episode! Awesome work, guys!

[@hopeherschman5691]

Thank you for doing this! What a different way to see another option on this battlefield. Yes General Sickles that whole damn field is your monument!!! One of my favorite generals.

[@snake316171]

Amazing, as a living historian myself. I'd love to see more of these.

[@aaronfield329]

Thank you for sharing this experience!! It was a very interesting presentation. And it was cool to see the alternative choices results.

[@acfake7858]

imagine there are actual general commanding the whole military drill irl , that will be sick

[@jaredeggo6611]

I love civil war history, as well as alternate history scenarios, so this was an absolute treat for me to watch. Please do more of these.

[@maxspeed8556]

I watched it several times and still enjoy a great job guys

[@17Watman]

This looks like so much fun. Lucky guys.

[@eoincampbell-flyfishermana4737]

Very much enjoyed this, guys! Keep up the great, interesting, entertaining work... all the way from North Wales, UK.

[@petermcmahan4975]

Great video guys, love watching these.

[@producerjjones9976]

I'm also going to Gettysburg at the end of the month

[@PeterEvansPeteTakesPictures]

Ooh, hope you enjoyed. I went a few weeks after you. I found it incredible. Stayed at the Farnsworth. :)

[@producerjjones9976]

@@PeterEvansPeteTakesPictures it was incredible! We stayed at a bnb. It took me and my family about three hours to get through the museum. The cyclorama was also amazing.

[@taylorshorey4411]

Do you know what guys I’ve been watching a little wars TV for a while now As well as loving the American battlefield trust videos it does my heart good to find this video although it’s two years after it’s debut love you guys keep up the good work!

[@AmericanBattlefieldTrust]

Check out our Brandywine collab as well!: kzbin.info/www/bejne/r6OVZaqJr8tnl9k

[@komisar3937]

I would have really enjoyed just being in the room while this happened. Thanks for putting this on.

[@sparkey6746]

Okay, watching the player run across the road with his hat on the sword made me laugh out loud. Good game guys; however, what is the rule set?

[@JacksLastCracker]

Altar of Freedom. $15.00 US for PDF.

[@devyncampbell3210]

I like how ewell treated this as the prime opportunity for some Gettysburg (1993) memes.

[@richardstarkey2247]

This was awesome and I really liked how everyone got in character to an extent.

[@ianfurness8875]

Thank you. That was wonderful.

[@jasonwhitaker4883]

An 2nd Pickett’s charge would happen because the confederate government was pressuring Lee for an victory to settle for peace since the confederate armies were losing in the west and south.

[@SilverFox-fq7xi]

Where was all the union guns? This was fun to watch. I missed the live feed.

[@JacksLastCracker]

The Union had 13 gun models on the table which represent 156-364 guns. So they're out there.

[@zenonpiotrowski4425]

Awesome exercise, very interesting to watch and excellent presentation.

[@lexchaotica190]

An army outnumbered 3/2 should not assault defences and entrenched troops who have a height advantage as well...no matter how desperate the cause or how great their personal elan is .

[@stevep5408]

Lee thought he needed a decisive offensive battle on northern soil to end the war!

[@lexchaotica190]

@@stevep5408 -Well that decisive battle on northern soil did effectively mark the end for the south .The combined July 4 1863 defeats at Gettysburg and Vicksburg cost the south international recognition by Great Britain and France.

[@martynspeck]

Yeah, I think it's clear that Lee's strategy should have been to get the Union to attack his entrenched troops rather than attacking the Union entrenched positions.

[@j.franklin21]

@@martynspeck No, Lee's army was outgunned and out supplied. How could he entice the union into attacking? The union would just sit there and bombard him. If he were to retreat, the union would be able to attack him easily, as they were not far apart, or, at the very least, they would send dragoons to harass them.

[@lexchaotica190]

@@j.franklin21 -The Anaconda plan suggested by General Winfield Scott had largely isolated the south economically.While it is true that the federalists enjoyed a tremendous logistical advantage the popular pressure for swift and decisive actions often forced their hand.

[@koldonn1111]

*When you don't have a Stonewall*

[@actinganimal885]

YOU AINT GOT NO BALLS WITHOUT STONEWALL

[@koldonn1111]

We need both Stonewalls. An actual stone wall, as any real total war player knows, and Thomas Jackson.

[@Winters1234]

I had the chance of Garry giving me a tour of Gettysburg a couple weeks ago, was pretty neat. I remember we went to Lees headquarters

[@JohnScargall1]

This was so cool, well done!

[@michaelcoatney2568]

LOTTA fun! Fun group of guys. God bless Dixie.

[@phillippeterman1051]

The major factor for the Army of the Potomac surviving and the Army of Northern Virginia retreating was the size of the armies.

[@JohnLaudun]

This was well done. Entertaining but also really illuminating.

[@SandyQueue]

Such devotion to detail! Well done!

[@johncrome1605]

It is nice to make decisions in Hind sight, but all those years ago it was a different matter. Very entertaining and thought provoking. Well done, and I look forward to more games like it.

[@wesleykamerer6154]

Please do this again with other battles. This was awesome to watch. A lot of the what the people voted for was very perplexing given the terrain haha

[@drfrogjz8280]

This is the Type of Video that my 2nd period Social studies Teacher would show The class

[@robertdavie1866]

Fought this on line battle, did what Longstreet said held the high ground away from town made the union attacked me, creamed them 🤠

[@aereszhou7292]

What did u play on

[@drsch]

Why on earth would the Union army attack Longstreet on the hills away from town when all the had to do was maneuver around them? You played against a poor general.

[@reidturing9208]

This is way better than all of the video game simulations that people have put out there.

[@donchichivagabond1578]

"You the viewers have failed us!" Aint gonna lie I laughed when the player said that!

[@NeoConNET7]

More battles please! Revolutionary War, War of 1812, and more Civil War wargames with fan voting on major decisions.

[@krixig]

A really neat concept and organized quite well. Good work, gentlemen. Looked like an interesting experience.

[@enginetruck20]

If you have a love of military history and would like to recreate battles and play the role of a field commander, please check out little wars tv or HMGS. This was a great pairing of two organizations that shed light on preservation efforts and miniature war gaming. Great job to all!

[@smokejaguarsix7757]

Wow! You did it! You changed history! Well done. Three more people died including the inventor of refrigeration. No matter, salt barrels work fine. I think you also got the guy whos grandson started the Macarena. So there's that.

[@alabamaal225]

My advice would have been after the first day for the Confederate forces to withdraw from the Gettysburg area entirely and establish defensive positions east of Cashtown, PA, about 6 miles to the west. The Union forces would have followed and on July 3 would very likely have battered themselves against the Confederate positions, in a replay of Fredericksburg. The severely weakened Union forces would be forced to retreat back to Gettysburg, perhaps as far as Hanover, PA, Littlestown, PA, or Emmitsburg, MD. The Confederate forces would then have the opportunity to advance on Harrisburg, PA, the Pennsylvania state capital. Defeating the Army of the Potomac and taking a northern state capital might well convince many Northerners that the war was no longer worth the cost, despite the Union gains in the western theater with the fall of Vicksburg, MS.

[@drsch]

You'd be forced to ignore the fact that Lee didn't know what he was facing. His cavalry were not doing their jobs. There's really no reason to think that Lee would have been any more aware of the Union deployment than he was historically. Also, there wouldn't be any reason for the Union to attack defensive positions east of Cashtown. They weren't hurting for supplies or needing to do anything but stay between Lee and Washington. Lee was under supply pressure, was losing the war in the west and couldn't risk being out maneuvered because he needed to be able to get back to Virginia eventually. Really, the Union held a fairly substantial tactical advantage during that campaign.

[@cbowser3]

Amazing video!

[@H3tz3r_ttv]

please do more of these!

[@2012photograph]

Interesting prospective see the battle in Gettysburg.

[@georgeking6356]

What a delight! As a cousin to Lee, Garnett, Armistead, Longstreet et al I had a great time watching. Just wish I could have been more involved. My vote for the next battle is Chickamauga where some of my grandfathers fought. Hurrah!

[@klocker1111]

Hey this was great!!! Make this a yearly tradition!!

[@spacewolves7253]

well I have found a new respect for mead after finding out about how a general in the civil war had the same last name

[@siouxwarrior5396]

That was epic! Loved it!

[@Ettrick8]

A great way to fight a battle. Nobody gets killed and wounded

[@CheemsofRegret]

Ultimate General: Civil War has prepared me for this.

[@gameingcenter5452]

it's pretty cool that they did this

[@GaveMeGrace1]

Thank you

[@mrvulture8981]

Now i need to watch Gettysburg again

[@richardcutt727]

Very good. There is no war gaming victory for Genl Lee at Gettysburg. The lack of Stuart's cavalry intelligence was pivotal.

[@Icemansam44]

Can you guys do another one? And do a long cut?

[@zift18]

Probably the biggest single move Jeff Davis could have made to secure victory for the South would have been to place NB Forrest in overall command in the West at the earliest possible opportunity..

[@jmupp2876]

Very cool concept!

[@russel9503]

It’s like little kids playing with legos but they are adults playing with realistic legos

[@xotl2780]

Poor General Reynolds, he could only escape death once.

[@producerjjones9976]

awesome wargame! I voted! It would have been a good decision to send longstreet to attack Sickles at the peach orchard, continue towards the round tops, and possibly flank the Federal army.

[@billd.iniowa2263]

Less player screen time, more map screen time. An overhead of the entire table shot in time-lapse would help immensely. I've done it and you can get a much better picture of the ebb-and-flow of a battle. Its very hard to get the whole scope when the camera can only cover a 3rd of the table at a time.

[@ETLee-db6cn]

Union Artillery MIA? Narration mentioned CSA Artillery several times, but no mention of the historically more numerous and effective Union guns. Both sides' Cavalry (but for Buford) also 'not mentioned in dispatches', though I suppose you can rationalize that as meaning they are off-map neutralizing each other.

[@BobSmith-dk8nw]

I would guess that this was an edited video where a lot was left out due to length. My guess would be that they just didn't happen to include mentions of the Union Artillery. It would have been included in the game each time there was a fight but only the most dramatic parts of the game - such as the deaths of Generals - made it into the video. .

[@ETLee-db6cn]

@Bob Smith -- Yep, that seems plausible.

[@jeigheff]

Great game, great presentation! What rules did you use?

[@JacksLastCracker]

Altar of Freedom. $15.00 US for the PDF.

[@vallergergo737]

I should mention that if any of you guys, the ones reenacting it included, wanted to do a digital version of this, there is a really great game called Ultimate General: Civil War, which is a table-top RTS, where you can rewrite the civil war from either side, including this battle of Gettysburg.

[@dboot8886]

"Man 40k isn't anything like what my friends told me it was..."

[@just-sumdude6823]

“Hay Daryl its Pickett’s charge,” (Pulls out gun)

[@rozlincoln3568]

Awesome! That looked fun 🙂

[@thomaspaine3394]

I actually enjoy this; thanks little wars t.v and civil war trust; thanks.

[@Hayden_981]

I wish their was a game like this

[@tylerjerabek5204]

They’re literally playing one It’s called altar of freedom

[@jacksmith1621]

As in life so true is it in gaming.... It's all about how the dice are cast.

[@outdoorlife5396]

I would love to play this game

[@Grumble_Jones_ASL]

Wonderful!!!

[@lesyoung1514]

So I am late to this party as I think I found it from your Gettysburg 157 series. I understand why you ended on July 3 but given Lee's goal to destroy the AOP, it would have be interesting to see a day 4.

[@lxtxlx2610]

I always wondered... what if JEB Stuart attacked in support of Longstreet last attacks on July 3, he could have covered that mile about the time of the high water mark to sweep to infantry lines, also some horse artillery could have followed in support...it its a rule of war that armies branches require support from each other, you cannot expect infantry to blow away other infantry lines in defensive position without support from cavalry of artillery. That is what happen at Waterloo. Also if the artillery did not miss the mark that would have been different but still branches support would have always been necessary in my view. Hard to make that happen in real life I guess but when it did happen such as Quatre Bras 1815 it made the difference.

[@manilajohn0182]

Cavalry charges against infantry during the civil war were abysmal failures. The infantry were equipped with rifled muskets which were so accurate and long ranged that infantry no longer formed square. Moreover, 20,000 Union reinforcements converged on Pickett's charge. The Confederates were going nowhere- with, or without, Stuart.

[@lxtx99v12]

@@manilajohn0182 yes rifled musket where superior to smoothbore but to say that cavalry would have been totally ineffective against infantry I don’t think is correct. It’s the element of surprise and the use of it at the right time that counts the most. Although rare there were still possible. First Manassas for instance. At the Battle of Mars-la-Tour 1870 Franco Prussian war the French were using superior chassepot bolt actions rifles and still they were charged down by cavalry. It is speculative of course but not impossible IMO.

[@manilajohn0182]

@@lxtx99v12 My friend, I did specifically reference the Civil War, and never mentioned other conflicts. The fact is that Civil War cavalry made no decisive contribution to the conflict against infantry in anything other than a defensive role. Cheers...

[@StumpyNubs]

Hmmmmm.... Declining to send Picket against the Union center was the decisive factor in this version of the battle, and that decision was made due to hindsight, which the confederates did not have. If you were to truly factor in the personalities of the Generals, you would have to send in Picket. Because Lee's position in this version was stronger than in the real battle. If he sent picket back then, SURELY he would have done so now! And the result would have been the same- a Confederate loss due to Lee's costly error. Eliminating that factor (Lee's "dander was up") gives the CSA a huge and unrealistic advantage, which led to more or less a draw in this version of the battle. Honestly, if you aren't going to send in Picket in a situation that is at least as favorable to it as it was in 1863, you may as well just skip the whole exercise because the outcome was weighted from the start.

[@manilajohn0182]

Eliminating Lee's dander actually gives the Confederates very little. Lee's plan of campaign was ruined on 1 July- and he needed a strategic victory on the scale of Austerlitz or Jena. Anything less was a strategic defeat, regardless of how the battle turned out tactically.

[@StumpyNubs]

@@manilajohn0182 - Are you suggesting that the losses from Picket's Charge had no affect on the war?

[@manilajohn0182]

@@StumpyNubs No, I'm not suggesting that. I'm saying that Pickett's Charge was a long- odds action because it had very little chance of delivering what Lee needed. Moreover, Lee's had no viable alternative, because he was out of time both strategically and logistically- because his original plan of campaign was ruined on 1 July.

[@StumpyNubs]

@@manilajohn0182 - And yet he still ordered it! That's a fact. Lee's personality made Pickett's charge inevitable, despite the objections from his generals. To suggest that Lee would have declined to order the charge from a stronger position in the simulation than he had historically is not realistic, in my opinion. The gamers declined to play half the battle because 21st century hindsight told them that it would not go well. It was their prerogative, of course. But if Lee's "dander" is taken out of the equation, you give the Confederate side a big advantage in the simulation that I think diminishes the historical accuracy of the game.

[@manilajohn0182]

@@StumpyNubs Well, I never suggested that Lee would have declined to order the charge. That said, Lee's after action report makes it clear enough that his personality did not make Pickett's charge inevitable. The strategic objective of the campaign was to achieve a great enough success to force the Union to lift the siege of Vicksburg, but he (and Longstreet) made it clear that Lee intended to achieve this by maneuvering the AotP into attacking the AoNV and then defeating the Union attack. This alone precludes any notion that Pickett's charge was somehow inevitable. Pickett's charge eventually took place because Lee's plan of campaign was ruined by the meeting engagement on 1 July. The AoNV inflicted a minor tactical defeat on the AotP by assuming the tactical offensive. This precluded any reasonable chance that the AotP would carry out an attack on the AoNV and forced Lee to improvise in a situation where time (Vicksburg) and logistics (foraging) were already working against him. The result was further tactical offensives by Lee, which culminated in Pickett's charge.

[@sirxavior1583]

@26:00. I think that's wishfull thinking that Sickles whould do as Meade requested.

[@kevlarburrito6693]

General Hill with the Jazz hands lol