Glenn Gould and Humphrey Burton on Bach - Part 1 (OFFICIAL)

[@marijane8665]

I could watch and listen to Gould all day, everyday! He’s genius both intellectually and musically. In 1966 he was the great predictor of what was to come. I am confirming this 54 years later! I can’t get enough of Gould...

[@dennispearson9287]

Yeah, Light Years Ahead of His Time !!!.....

[@HBoggggggggg]

He was also a genius physically. He could take interviewers much bigger than him down to the ground in a headlock easily.

[@marijane8665]

@@HBoggggggggg 😂

[@luffytsui1966]

Glenn Gould, you're gone too soon. Your genius innovative minds are always pointing to the future. You pursue of a sound that nobody can produce, you produce it, and don't care what people thinks. You are bold and your interpretations are crazy, yet, makes so much sense. Can't get enough of your sound. In 2021, we are watching this interview again and sounds like you are speaking for this very moment. Yes, a lot of musician now have suffered through the pandemic and struggle to put food on the table due to concerts being cancelled. But you are a revolutionary, a pioneer. So sad you died in such a young age. Congratulations to Sir Burton too. Would love to hear what you think of this interview after all these years.

[@JamesVaughan]

I think you mean Sir Humphrey. "Sir Burton" is an incorrect way to refer to a knight (you must be a yank!)

[@josephniepce7887]

Mister Burton is still among us as of April 2018.. Im super curious what does he think about that conversation after all these years.

[@xDomglmao]

Send him a letter and let us know! :)

[@phoebelinden9602]

He has a new autobiography coming out in May 2021!

[@GermanOperaSinger]

Gould was the antithesis to Sergiu Celibidache's opinion of recording. Interesting to hear his perspective. He boldly predicts the future of recorded music much of which proved to be eerily accurate.

[@davidmdyer838]

But it's NOT.

[@handavid6421]

Well, Bruckner symphonies are obviously meant to be played at a concert hall with it's acoustic effects.

[@davidmdyer838]

@@handavid6421 And I've played all ten of them, but in a cathedral, which is even better than a concert hall for those pieces. Musicians can't make it on recorded music alone anymore. That was only possible for a 100 year period or so in the history of music. It is the exception. A return to live music means better music making and recordings of live music making are usually preferred by musicians. They have the integrity of music that has been lived with for a long time by the performer, not cooked up as you go in the studio.

[@organboi]

But his prediction was WRONG.

[@day7two]

I love Gould but I don't have any desire to tinker with knobs, change speeds, etc., to personalize already recorded musical performances BUT, and it's a big BUT, Gould himself has motivated me to take personalization a step further to start playing the piano myself, where I can PLAY it the way I want. Playing with knobs is not enough for me. I have to have even more control. A dozen years or so I had never heard of Gould and saw a KZbin video entitled 'Gould plays Bach' with a still black and white shot of a fellow in his pajamas playing the piano. On a whim I clicked it and the best way I can describe my feelings when I finished watching it was as though I had just been on a thrilling amusement park ride and I wanted to ride again, and I started to watch everything Gould that KZbin had available and none of it disappointed me. There is something about the way he plays that makes the music accessible to the likes of me and everyone else out there to the point that as I watched his hands and his movements I thought I can do that too. Never with the same prowess, but nevertheless with the same perfect right to take it into my hands and interact with it and with the same conviction that I can coax something special and satisfying from it because I want to. And that turned out to be true.

[@s.l5787]

But it's not just about knobs. Mixing is a complicated process. IN recording engineering, there's so much room for complexity (e.g controlling reverb, frequency response of sound, etc.) . Gould was ahead of his time.

[@nickkoob3087]

Well said

[@drabs4960]

“Playing with knobs is not enough for me” - the take away point for me. (Can be drunk here)

[@puzzician]

"It's entirely possible to make all Beethoven symphonies sound like the Chipmunks." "Why not? Are you afraid of your own Beethoven?"

[@bargledargle7941]

I like that highlight too

[@hurricane_hazel]

This entire series of talks is a wonderful, informative document, that I am so grateful to have available. Yes. But I also love how at 4:40 Gould's utter square-ness is on complete display when he refers to The Chipmunks as a "rock and roll group." Oh Glenn, I adore you.

[@sibengerard1856]

A MAN; VIRTUALLY THINKING AT THE SPEED OF LIGHT.....

[@roel.vinckens]

Even now he's still ahead of his time. As a musician and as a human being.

[@idolatrystudios]

This was ABSOLUTLEY fantastic. He's basically predicting the invention of both Hip Hop and EDM music decades before it happened, as they're both (in essence) electronic music. And he was correct, the recording DID in fact diminish the concert hall in the minds of the listener. I'm going to devour his interviews now. My goodness what a great video!

[@organboi]

No, he did not predict hip hop and whatever else you said. That's just not accurate to say.

[@idolatrystudios]

@@organboi Who responds to a 2 year old comment? I would fire back, but you kind of just did my job FOR me. LOL! Touch grass bro. Have a good night/day

[@vintagebikes4215]

He was right. Now, 56 years later, as he said- popular music is electronic, people have veritable studios in home, fiddle with recordings, view much of classical music as museum pieces, and seldom set foot in a music hall.

[@newaccounter]

I’ve never actually considered this argument in terms of music as a whole, only with classical music. It makes a lot more sense now.

[@КлиоКлио-н7к]

Спасибо огромное! Глен всегда в моем сердце. С любовью из России!

[@sauldinglesteinlll9543]

He was right in his predictions, although I disagree with regards to it being a good thing. Perhaps it was a good thing before the year 1999, when musicians actually made decent money from records but in the age of the MP3 and the free music we enjoy on KZbin (which is about the only thing preventing many people from stealing recordings outright ) the live concert is what keeps musicians fed and being fed is about the only thing a modern virtuoso can realistically expect these days. I suspect most classical pianists of today are living in small apartments.

[@s.l5787]

He wasn't against musicians getting paid, that's a totally different matter. He couldn't have predicted recordings would be outdated for more digital media. But he was correct in the sense that there's a massive decline in orchestra demands for technological media, there's a reason many are going bankrupt. Only a select few virtuoso can make a living reliably as soloists.

[@phoebelinden9602]

@@s.l5787 orchestra members make good union wages.

[@ephemeraforever4580]

@@s.l5787 I don't know where you live, but where I live, entire seasons are Sold Out immediately after tickets go on sale. Season ticket holders get first choice (as they should) and individual tickets are quite expensive but always sell out. It's going to be a great year for selling out live performances. Cannot wait to buy my season tickets! Also, one of the non-profits I support gets called if empty seats are available and they notify volunteers, often at the last moment -- so there is hardly an empty seat for anything. Musicians I know belong to the union, are well paid, get per diem while on the road, decide how much or how little they want to travel, and love their jobs.

[@timm6892]

He wasn’t “right in his predictions,” the New York Philharmonic Hall is still going strong and people are still going there to see the works of Tchaikovsky, Bach, Brahms, and plenty more, on a regular basis-24 years after he predicted they wouldn’t. He was right about most everything else though.

[@jjgeoffphhcinkkllee]

@@ephemeraforever4580 As far as I know, the only places where this occurs are in Western European social democracy states where the arts are heavily subsidized, but I may be wrong I guess

[@ivatorres4515]

Well, l am very thankful that a genius such as Glenn Gould decided to leave the concert halls and record his performances. He explained why, l gave us the oportunity to listen to what is best in Music. Live concerts are not accessible to most music lovers - distance and cost. So, let us just be thankful for what is offered to us and accept the reality. Music is always live if you know how to listen to it.

[@David-wj8tt]

Gould was a hell of a smart guy.

[@louisvalencia5244]

Fun fact: Humphrey Burton was recently knighted for his services on classical music

[@chickenflavor9880]

Who?

[@dennispearson9287]

Like Most Prophets ( And Most Great Men , In General, ) Gould Was Light Years Ahead of His Time !!! The Pin Point Accuracy of Many of His Predictions Make Him Almost the Nostradamus of Classical Music !!!...

[@gopalkambo5885]

If only Mr Burton had pushed further regarding Gould's remark at 11:37; Gould does not really appear to have talked or written about this anywhere else in his recorded output to my knowledge.

[@artygunnar]

I do think recording is the future/present. but there's still something about the power and effect the concert hall has with live performed music, even listening to a harp or organ live is breathtaking...

[@JanetESmith-er8sk]

There’s a huge difference between playing in front of beating hearts 💕 vs playing in front of knobs and dials. Mr. Gould and I will part ways at this point!

[@ephemeraforever4580]

We do not have to decide!

[@johnvalentine4720]

@@ephemeraforever4580 Exactly. We can have the best of all worlds.

[@ChinweDJohn]

Great discussion! In my mind, when Gould describes Electronic Music, and welcomes it for its ability to draw the listener into the Musician/Composer's world by providing an avenue for more intimate listening, he isn't referring to the Artificial Intelligence generated Electronic Music of today. He was thinking of EM driven by musicians, as opposed to AI music which is driven by corporations to the detriment of artists, especially those in the classical music industry. Anything which brings people together in a harmonious environment, is much needed, so if I could travel back in time, I would suggest to Gould that a combination of concert music and EM would be the way to go; give the live concert with all its flaws, and sell the record at the end of the concert.

[@paolabartolini36]

I love Gould... 🙂✨💫🌹

[@mishasawangwan6652]

quite visionary

[@Christopher.Gontar]

In On and Off The Record, seven years earlier he had said he liked the cinema (and theater?) because it is darker, but here he says that the concert is made more dramatic by dimming lights over the audience.

[@kenray5776]

the level of prescience here is spoooooooooky "ELECTRONIC MUSIC IS THE FUTURE"

[@chicagotouch9319]

And his other predictions. All have come true.

[@GuddySmith]

A visionary who was far ahead of his time and foresaw the current situation.

[@stevenmoss1474]

I can't remember the last time I was a listener without stereophonic dials.

[@danielmcdonald3527]

Looking forward to Part ll.

[@PointyTailofSatan]

Even in 1966, "the chair" is bordering on collapse. lol

[@mcrettable]

Didn’t know Glenn could impersonate that accent so well lmao

[@talastra]

This was really interesting, but they forgot to talk about Bach.

[@m.a.3322]

Glenn Gould eerily predicts the popularity of music sampling & music streaming!

[@ranchopatriot]

Gould would have been a great KZbinr.

[@timm6892]

I honestly couldn’t hear but the tiniest bit of difference between what he played at 16:42, and what he played at 17:09. The biggest difference was the humming. I like Gould, and he was more talented than I could ever be, but he could be so pretentious. Also, I notice a lot of people are giving him credit for predicting electronic music, which I guess he sort of did, but he also predicted the fall of the concert hall at 0:58. He was definitely wrong about that-the New York Philharmonic Hall is still doing very well.

[@antoinepetrov]

Very strange how you can't "hear but the tiniest bit of difference" for me, because I can hardly find a similarity between them

[@grahamcombs4752]

Incredibly prescient. In 2022 all the orchestras are struggling and at risk of closing. At 6:46, the interviewer points to something he would not see coming -- sampling in hip hop to the point of appropriating and jamming that sample into spoken (angrily often) words. When "playing records" is literally manipulating the turntable. I suspect Mr. Gould, who died in the early days of hip hop, may have recalled this conversation. Who knows? Needless to say, Mr. Gould has actually thought about music; and the moment moving into the future.

[@maulcs]

Gould gave the average person far too much credit. What he's talking about here are a vast minority of people who are actually conscious about these types of decisions, the rest couldn't care less.

[@WaldoTW]

A musical prophet

[@LordGreystoke]

Not sure his dateline regarding the decline of live performances, circa 1999 proved accurate.

[@francescaemc2]

Grazie

[@bobsmith-ov3kn]

also you should really re-name this something click-baity like "GLENN GOULD PREDICTS ALL MODERN MUSIC" or something because Bach isn't even part of the first 15 minutes of this whole video

[@charlotterose6724]

Except, inexplicably, they cut off the variation from the Goldbergs right at the beginning of the video. :(

[@dylanmorgan7900]

yes, but what about Bach?

[@SinanAkkoyun]

He was so right, astonishing

[@francescaemc2]

Grazie.

[@dudaz_music]

He was right in the sense that we can pick and choose different recordings to make the music, but it’s producers and DJs and not listeners. Wether DJs are just good listeners instead of musicians is a different debate but he underestimated how lazy people are about listening to music. People would rather just put something on than have to create a new thing

[@davidmdyer838]

I don't understand why people are saying he was ahead of his time, he was completely wrong. Very few people have stereos anymore and twidling with EQ is NOT the way to improve stereo listening anyway.

[@CubeMontster17]

What an amazing speaker. So articulate and intelligent. Having said that, I disagree with most of what he said

[@justinmusicandskateboardin9282]

Gould never seemed to have come to the relatively obvious realization that no speaker setup in the world can and ever will possibly emulate the experience and indeed the SOUND alone of hearing a real acoustic instrument versus some recording of it, no matter how immaculate the recording or playback equipment is. Pianos in-particular are a striking example. Other instrument sounds may be captured more easily but the richness, depth, and sheer size of a full sized grand piano's harp ringing will not ever be 100% reproducible through recording equipment

[@waterdragon2012]

I wonder what he would say about AI

[@Twentythousandlps]

Imagine GG experiencing today's youtube - his head would have exploded... But of course his gleefully dogmatic proclamation of the "death" of the concert hall has been proven wrong.

[@nihilistlemon1995]

Concert hall will always exist like rock live performance will always exist . But i do think that the buisness of concerts will be under threat in the future , maybe not completely destroyed but i'm willing to bet some halls and orchestras will disappear in the future . We are already seeing this threat with the French radio Orchestra .

[@kylej.whitehead-music309]

He was wrong only because the concert hall was put on life support. I can say for my country, at least, that without government handouts the maintenance of 95% of concert orchestras would be impossible. Live classical music has essentially become a government institution and I find that unspeakably shameful. What's more shameful is just how zealous classical institutes are in begging for more. Don't even get me started on contemporary music.

[@teeple1877]

Glenn was definitely right about the trajectory of music.. definitely sad in alot of ways but there are still some great compositions being made/recorded. Sadly it’s not what is popular tho.

[@martinarthur2597]

Way ahead of his time and smart with it, incorporating the recording studio and the listener into an essential component of composition as Frank Zappa often did. Check Gould on , How Mozart became Bad Composer, hope for us all?

[@Robertbrucelockhart]

It seems odd that Gould didn’t feel the superiority of the live musical experience. It seems almost inhuman, like preferring a zoom meeting to a living gathering of your family at Christmas. Perhaps he related to music on a more deeply intellectual level than most listeners. His perspective rather belies the idea of music as an affair of the heart.

[@ephemeraforever4580]

Gould found the recording studio to be the place where he could be safely intimate with music. There he felt free to expose his private passions for the music he was recording. He knew he was recording for future listeners -- he just didn't need to be looking at us while making the music.

[@maulcs]

@@ephemeraforever4580 Yet most people would absolutely choose a live performance of Gould over a recording, if they had the chance.

[@nikolasjames6217]

I love Glenn as a brother...but with deep fakes looming ominously, I find a rising contingent saying "if it didn't happen live, it didn't happen..." He was in a sense overly optimistic, and being interrupted by the algorithmically chosen KZbin ad of halfwits being their own creators--making their hair in extravagant shapes and rainbow colored tacos--brings me to parade my own cynicism with Auden's when he spoke to McLuhan: "the audience should NOT be the artist." The muse may be commanded when she willingly puts herself on parade, but the W of Babylon has no off position on her switch. Thank you! Goodnight!

[@yushen508]

Which conductor is Gould referring to at 5:29?

[@yushen508]

Thanks!

[@pobinr]

As good to listen to talking as he is playing. Hyper intelligent

[@randycalifornia]

they barely talked about bach...

[@bobk4402]

I love the atmosphere of intellectualism of the 60's! But I'm on the interviewer's side the entire time. Gould is stressed out by live performances and is struggling to justify his focus on recording in a million ways

[@sofiakhalkhodjaeva6521]

♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥

[@pponpp-v8i]

1999 predictions haven't aged well, have they

[@valentinmosterj.junior5884]

problem is people is not more qualified, is less and less qualified indeed. Knowledge is stigmatised and study is considered an option and people don't have the instruments to became a positive factor in the music making process, hence the music that comes out is worst and worst. Is there still hope for the future of music?

[@thealexanderbond]

I'm always surprised how English his accent is.

[@bobtaylor170]

Ultimately, I think he's wrong. He's as wrong as if he said that eventually almost all people would prefer to be alone than to be in a committed relationship. There are some people like that. And there are some people who will prefer to listen to music alone than in a concert hall. But it's human instinct to want to sit in an auditorium and hear an outstanding group of performers, whether orchestral or vocal or both, or a single superb performer, in company with several hundred other thrilled souls. Look, Gould clearly was a psychological mess, afflicted with anxiety disorder, and unmaliciously, I am sure, was voicing his deep hope for a population which would accommodate his illness.

[@bobjones-bt9bh]

he may not have gotten the timing right, but he was actually mostly right in his predictions. Music is dead...not just classical. Stations have closed, symphonies have abandoned actual classical to try to broaden "representation"- I've watched string orchestras scratching their bows on their music stands and this is called now "composition." Popular music is almost made now totally by machines. I don't know if it will be possible at all in 30 years to even see much of a symphony. And he's right- there are now 100 indistinguishable recordings of Chopin made by people you could not tell the difference between even if you were an autist

[@SZ-wb1qb]

Well, he's wrong. The concert halls are still alive.

[@GraniteQuarrier]

"Why not, are you afraid of you own Beethoven"? My god, lol.

[@andrewpfeiffer6218]

Gould feels so prescient-- at least I don't have any interest in going to concerts simply because I can indulge my perfectionism by finding just the right recording for everything. When you go to a concert even with highly skilled performers you're always taking a chance.

[@phoebelinden9602]

Yes, and so much of a live performance's overall quality depends on the behavior of the audience. Just a couple of loud or sneezing or jittery audience members will mar live performances.

[@masdranif]

You can agree or disagree with him, but he was wrong. Although it is true that the medium for music has shifted drastically since he spoke (from the concert to iTunes and KZbin), the statement "Concerts as we know it are dying" simply isn't true. Classical concerts are bigger than ever today.

[@dylangamble4810]

They are not. Many symphony orchestras are going bankrupt. Most ballets would go belly up if they didn't play the Nutcracker every year. Unfortunately most symphonies outside of Europe are forced to play the hits year after year just to scrape by.

[@s.l5787]

@@dylangamble4810 I would say much of it has to do with even less preoccupation with classical music now (aside from training young children for academic purposes). And less to do with the recording medium, which in some ways actually popularizes concerts.

[@17attewell]

Is his argument saying the quality of concerts is not as good as recording?

[@ephemeraforever4580]

@@dylangamble4810 Yes, and it is precisely the dependence of playing the hits that you mention that chased Gould away from live performances. Among other reasons. But very salient.

[@jjgeoffphhcinkkllee]

Um, what??

[@devilshark6694]

1999 he wasn't lying lol

[@bobsmith-ov3kn]

He says some incredibly profound and true things here but also some incredibly stupid ones. The idea that every person out there who listens to music is going to buy editing hardware or software and sit down and analyze dozens of recording takes of the same piece of music and splice them together and make interpretative decisions and edits is so laughably stupid I shouldn't even need to begin explaining why

[@charlotterose6724]

But we choose the speakers we buy, we choose our treble and our bass, and we choose which performers we listen to on KZbin and other places. He did say (here or somewhere else) that his predictions might not take the form he predicts, but it will happen in some way. And it has

[@Trk-El-Son]

Well, I think you can say, that he was absolutely wrong in the context of what the classical audience would be doing in the future. However, he totally predicted the development of electronic music. He did see the future, but just got parts of it wrong. 😄

[@drvonkrankmeister8094]

Not stupid, just inaccurate. He is articulate, urbane and astute.

[@ephemeraforever4580]

Yeh, I don't do any of that splicing, but I do listen to a variety of interpretations of one piece done by several artists. The opportunity for "compare and contrast" type of listening is where today's technology excells.

[@jjgeoffphhcinkkllee]

Calm down lol

[@organboi]

Once again, spewing his endless opinions and wrong predictions. This man could play Bach but offered ZERO amount of anything else to the music world. He also made many damaging statements as well, especially for young budding musicians to hear. I can't stand this guy talking anymore.

[@hallivigut]

He has a bit of Jordan Peterson in him when overintellectualizing minor issues.

[@rrrrrr-kb9sb]

He’s dead wrong in this interview

[@georgescompositions8872]

.

[@chel3SEY]

Clear it's not sufficient for Gould to simply not attend concerts himself because he dislikes them. He insists that no one should like them. Quite a narrow view, and overly prescriptive.

[@chicagotouch9319]

Something about 1966 was making him a bit cynical to the point of arrogance... He was also capable of great humility.

[@ephemeraforever4580]

As if no one has ever exaggerated an opinion before! Gould lived to provoke the musical establishment. He makes me leap with joy.

[@jjgeoffphhcinkkllee]

you silly

[@zweiosterei]

Glenn ended up being so full of himself. I guess that's what genius does to you.

[@ephemeraforever4580]

He was so full of himself he overflowed.

[@drvonkrankmeister8094]

Better than being a non-genius and full of yourself . . .

[@glenn-gould]

Thank you so much for posting; Saw that on DVD before ... would be interesting to ask Glenn today even about the transition in the dressing of some artists while playing still in Royal Festival Hall :) Totally agree with him (Stephan Zind)