GM GDI RICH codes P0172 P0175 (Diag & Repair)

This 2013 Chevy Impala has some rough idle problems when hot, and is setting the Fuel System Rich codes P0172 and P0175. 120k miles on the clock.
The engine oil reeks of gasoline...not good.
What's the issue?
Repair footage included :)
Enjoy!
Ivan

[@cullenmiller8170]

Nice easy one when you know common failures. Glad to have you and Paul and Eric O teaching me things on the new cars. My cars are all old and I try to keep them going.

[@ozzykrahn806]

he knows common issues because its a gm product

[@jeffjankiewicz5100]

Nice fix Ivan, thanks for sharing. Royal purple is supposed to be really good, but out of my budget. I use Castrol Edge now, GTX has served me well in the past. If my oil starts to get dark, it`s gone.. changed and new Wix filter installed. 91 Silverado(5.7L) has 300,000 on the clock, STILL runs strong. Stay safe Ivan, God Bless.

[@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics]

The 5.7L will go a million miles even on molasses haha

[@jeffjankiewicz5100]

Yea, too bad the swirl port heads are junk. Looking for a set of vortec heads now. Heads, intake, and slightly better cam can get 364 hp cheap. At least 350 with tbi junk. Engine Masters ep 24. They used a 650cfm carb too...364 hp on a stock bottom end.

[@lustfulvengance]

Those Impalas with that 3.6 are complete sleepers! WAYYY faster than you would ever think they would be!

[@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics]

Yeah it's ok I guess. Transmission was kind of lazy haha

[@Kieva_Storm]

Back again! The reason GM says to replace the high pressure fuel line is because (allegedly) they can leak. When you back the line nut off it distorts from torque. Haven't had one of these for fuel in the crankcase yet, though I've had them set codes on newer cars. Good stuff and good information for when I do!

[@mikechiodetti4482]

Tight fit with that pump. It's amazing how we use sockets, universals (wobbly's) and extensions. Good diag and good call on the pump. I'm sure that little jewel wasn't cheap!

[@htownblue11]

Nicely done Ivan. I had a tough P0171 and P0174 code on a Lexus RX that was a tough diagnosis that had the polar opposite problem than you had but those fuel trim codes are kinda fun to try and diagnose sometimes. You are a true Pro man. Always learning something from you.

[@AndyK.1]

What was it in that case?

[@htownblue11]

@@AndyK.1 turned out to be a major vacuum leak that only showed under idle through the intake manifold butterfly valve (shaft was leaking) that is used to regulate air flow in the intake manifold itself. I wrote what ended up being a research paper on LexusOwner’s Forum about it long ago.

[@abdul-kabiralegbe5660]

​@@htownblue11 Interesting. I take it it wasn't the RX350 (2GR-FE)? Thanks.

[@AP9311]

Wow, holy royal purple. Never used it. Be interesting if i used it. But i only use quaker state high mileage oil for my gm vehicle! Nice call on the HFP replacement! Looks pain in the butt to replace it

[@iduimovic]

Personally I'm not a big fan of Royal Purple, if you are going from the shelf oils at the local auto parts store Mobil 1 is the one to go, but if you are looking a top tear level high quality oil I will suggest Liqui Moly with Molygen new generation. That is next level oil that will do extra protection on your engine plus it has a neon green color that will glow on the dark with UV light to easily spot oil leaks sources on your engine.

[@kenhardy4167]

Royal Purple is top notch fully synthetic motor oil often used in racing and high tolerance engines. I use it exclusively in my 2016 NISSAN 370Z Nismo Tech and in my modified 1985 Trans Am.....it is quite expensive. The blue dye is just to validate that the oil is completely fresh. It becomes the exact same clear color as regular oil after the engine has run for just a couple of hours. I intensely dislike GDI fuel delivery systems and would never purchase a car that utilizes it. Give me multiport injectors any day of the week to keep my intake valves clean, happy and healthy.....no walnut shell blasting ever necessary. This video was very informative but closer attention to videography would be appreciated. Also, the roller mentioned during the injector removal was not clearly shown during the disassembly, and not at all during the high pressure injector installation. GDI newbies like myself have no clue what that roller does or where it goes....that would have been very informative. Nice trick with the PCV Valve and the fuel trims to validate the GDI leak into the crankcase.....not something that would ever occur with an MPI fuel delivery system. Very informative overall with a great diagnostic hunch from the outset proven correct after repairs. Thanks. Dr. K.

[@johnfry9010]

Thank God for young smart guy's like you , nice job on the repair .

[@dans_Learning_Curve]

Interesting! Things have gone full circle with a manual fuel pump with the direct injection! Same issues too with the possibility of fuel in the oil when they fail!

[@bigdaddymak1439]

There's an electric one in the tank to feed the mechanical one too

[@prmayner]

UPS did me the same way, I live in East Texas, I ordered a part from Tennessee it got lost and 10 days later it showed up in Oregon. I think somebody stole it took it home decided it wasn't for them taped it back up and put it back in the system. LOL!! Had a customer who loved Royal Purple, I've been using Pennzoil Platinum. Love your videos Ivan your my Fav. Peace my brother!!

[@andrewmarkland9411]

Super skills. Nailed the diag from the start.

[@chrisfreemesser5707]

Great diag Ivan but mentioning Royal Purple is gonna trigger another motor oil holy war ;)

[@NoWr2Run]

VERY VERY SURPRISED AT SEEING ROYAL PURPLE BEING PUT INTO THAT CAR.

[@Mr2004MCSS]

I would use it over Mobil 1.

[@stealthg35infiniti94]

Just look at Project Farm for independent results. Too many people fall for manufacturing hype and blindly follow a brand. In my extensive research, most 100% pure synthetic oils are very close in performance. Amsoil might inch ahead of the others but the cost is double the others. Most normal operating vehicles will never know the difference but your wallet will.

[@Mr2004MCSS]

@@stealthg35infiniti94 I only use synthetic blends and they work fine for me. I had a negative experience using Mobil 1 back in the late 90's and early 2000's in my 98 Chevy truck which I still own today. Mobil 1 and the 350 in that truck did not work well together. I really don't think it really matters what you use these days as most top brands are very good oils.

[@stealthg35infiniti94]

@@Mr2004MCSS Synthetic blends are only 7 to 10% synthetic. Not much better than conventional oils. If you had a bad experience with 100% synthetic oil, it was your vehicle that already had a problem. Most common issue is an engine with compromise seals that held in placed by the sludge of conventional oils. Then the owner switches to a high detergent synthetic oil and cleans the sludge off the seals which now it starts leaking. I've been using 100% synthetic oil since the early 1980s and never had any engine problems. Ofcourse after a decade or more of driving and 150k 150k miles of driving, gaskets and seals will start to leak.

[@damonbrenwald4209]

Im so thankful that a fuel pump for my old chevy is 25 bucks and takes 5 min to fix

[@billsmith2212]

When you did the diagnosis , it looked like you were missing a " high-tech " tool . Some people take a cigarette lighter and see if the oil on the dipstick lights up . I bet Snap On charges $ 100.00 for the disposable model . Great diagnosis and fix !

[@robertmoura6336]

Hardest part of repairing a vehicle is explaining to customers the oil gimmick sale, to me Mobil, Shell, and Quaker State does the job well. And for Rock Auto they are great at least till now, and they ship down to Brazil when I need parts for American Cars. Good job!

[@RJ-vb7gh]

I miss the old days when a shot mechanical fuel pump only dumped fuel onto the ground, not into the crank case. Royal purple is supposed to be pretty good, I prefer the Mobil 1 20,000 mile oil. First it's easier to find almost everywhere when you need a top off quart. Second, 2 of my cars don't have working odometers, so I haven't a clue how many miles I put on between oil changes. Third, I'm lazy and there's always a time lag between when I decide to do an oil change and when I actually get around to doing it.

[@bigbird3497]

Thank you very much for making this video. This issue is scarcely covered by any diagnostic steps and it ended up being the problem that I had. Very well described. Thank you again!!

[@momentumtintdetail]

Not far from you (17870). Great to see someone local making great content.

[@lightdepdoctor179]

Rockauto used to be my goto... not anymore. I ordered a total of 6 parts, 5 for my diesel and 1 for my gasser. The parts had to come from 3 different warehouses. 3x the shipping?? FORGET IT. I never goto the dealer, but I checked and (before shipping!) my thermostat was CHEAPER at the DEALER!?! But wait, this story gets even harder to believe, this dealer has a 3 pointed star as their emblem. True story.

[@theadventuresofjavier8698]

Excellent diag Ivan.

[@Paul1958R]

Ivan, That Royal Purple stuff sure looked pretty dark - like used oil. I guess it has silly purple dye it it to justify its higher cost. I use Castrol Edge and it has a light golden color out of the bottle like oil should. Paul (in MA)

[@crbourret]

I was thinking along the same line, it would be hard to tell when the oil is getting dirty if it starts out that dark of a color.

[@bigdaddymak1439]

@@crbourret dark oil doesn't mean dirty on synthetic oil. That's and old wives tale about oil from before oil filters and detergents. If it were true then diesel oil would be dirty from day one

[@billsimpson604]

I guess you could say, 'it didn't pass the smell test'. Adding dye to oil to get people to pay triple the normal price ranks up there with the idea of selling bottles of water.

[@Sagittarius-88]

Ranks right up there with the illustrious "cold air" intake. Marketing 101 proving that a fool and his money are soon parted.

[@bad05ford]

Royal purple used to be really good when it was a small Texas company. Calumet lubricant bought it, kept the name and dye and cheapened the additives.

[@JimmyMakingitwork]

Except it won’t make nearly as much money as bottled water does.

[@mikeaho4143]

Great vid Ivan. Very comprehensive and love the repairs included !

[@mmichaeldonavon]

Ivan. Watching you use that torque wrench, with the crow's foot, reminded me of something important. If the Crows Foot is attached to the wrench "straight away" from the torque wrench drive, the torque set on the wrench, and the torque applied to the nut will not be the same. (The nut will feel a greater torque due to the increased "arm length." ) To see the same torque, the Crow's Foot would have to be turned 90 degrees from the wrench drive. Or, like you probably did, recalculate the torque wrench setting to compensate for the additional length of the "arm." Love your videos - I never miss an episode. You are "da man." Thanks.

[@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics]

Very interesting comment! The added arm of the crows foot is negligible compare to the length of the wrench itself 😉

[@mmichaeldonavon]

@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics Agreed. Might be germane to the subject if we were using a torque wrench calibrated in Inch Ounces. (have seen those used in the "old style" Inertial Navigation" systems," "back in the day." :-) Thanks, Ivan.

[@themechanic6117]

Nice diag and repair. Common problems, I already knew where this video was going lol 👍

[@zx8401ztv]

Well done, nailed it in one. If everyone was as easy as that, you would fall asleep with boredom :-D The throttle body looked very clean, i expected a bit of crud.

[@kevinbarry71]

I enjoyed the video; and yes it seems FedEx is getting extremely good at losing stuff in the past couple of years

[@kennethbode2017]

Royal Purple is a hi quality oil. Usually quite a bit more than Mobil 1 in price.

[@jimkillen1065]

I appreciate the videos . If i even suspect there is gasoline in the oil i change it as soon as possible. It can cause a lot of damage.. ..

[@DaddyBear1971]

Not sure if you noticed but you said “Twerk” instead of “Torque” - LOL I had to listen twice, but you did... I mix words up when talking too, but that was a good one. Also, was not expecting you to say “click” in place of the torque wrench. I literally LOL at that. Your great. I always learn something from your videos. Thanks.

[@golfnut533]

Excellent video showing the problem and then the fix. 👍

[@bobparrott8130]

Thank you for your great videos... Very much appreciated !!!!

[@dans_Learning_Curve]

Like #166 Thanks for the video! Life is a learning curve! Hindsight is 20-15!

[@InsideOfMyOwnMind]

I first read that as "Hindsight is 5W-30."

[@dans_Learning_Curve]

@@InsideOfMyOwnMind LoL 🤣😆 too funny! I'm going to try and build my channel around the saying...

[@gonzgarr1592]

you are giving me so many tech tips thank you

[@JimmyMakingitwork]

Mmmmmm, I love gravy jobs! Gas in the crank case is bad for the rings, but it will help DeCarbon valves. 😎

[@JamesLee-oe7mt]

Internal engine probably pretty clean now 🙂

[@donaldisrael7147]

Awesome-intake valve cleaning system. doesn't need those pesky walnut shells.

[@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics]

Good point!

[@jyao5409]

That was what I was to say as well

[@mag1vl]

Nice one Ivan and did you clean the throttle body as it looked really clean..

[@jamespn]

It’s also a good idea to keep the fuel tank full and use quality top tier gasoline.

[@ozzykrahn806]

trick is to know its good from the refinery

[@breikowski]

Really nice camera work!

[@baxrok2.]

Good job Ivan. Thanks!

[@ericcorse]

Well done Ivan and pretty easy to get to.

[@johnl3230]

What a surprise, a GM on your channel xD

[@jakeelenbaas971]

Ive used royal purple for over a decade with 0 issues, took a few cars well past 200k miles. I once went 15k miles between oil changes and cut the filter open, not a spec of metal. I did however switch oil brands in my truck recently after watching a head to head oil testing playoff on another youtube channel. Royal purple made it to the second round while Pennzoil Platinum was right there with amsoil in the championship finals.

[@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics]

How did Mobil1 stack up?

[@kc360awareness]

@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics he’s probably referring to the Project Farm oil test. In my recollection the Mobil1 faired above average as always. Personally I buy and use Total oil in everything I am responsible for... about 30 vehicles. Everything from School buses, 15 passenger vans, pickups, foreign and domestic, all the way down to a 2002 Focus. Great results, of course buying in bulk makes the budgetary concerns weigh in pretty heavily.

[@jakeelenbaas971]

I believe kevin is correct in it being project farm's channel

[@VWWRENCHIE]

Gotta love those GM engineers with that lower bolt access on that pump.👺

[@grahambate3384]

here in Australia the motor north,south i think be easier. But the thermostat is a 10 hour job, as right up near the firewall.

[@roxanneabbott8424]

Keep up the great work Ivan!!!

[@johnwaby4321]

Nice repairs there ivan 👍👍👍👍

[@allenleavell2847]

Wish I could have you look at my 2015 Impala... It's been throwing the lean codes (p0171,p0174), but unfortunately most of the "mechanics" in my area are nothing more than just parts changers. They don't do all this in-depth analysis and diagnostics like you do...

[@georgeshadrick640]

Good job Ivan peace out

[@RexenPrime]

I think any newer gm vehicle is some real hot garbage. As Eric would say: "it lives to die another day"

[@Garth2011]

Mobil 1 works all the time. Amsoil is good stuff too but more $$.

[@johndickerson9328]

I've never used Royal Purple personally, however, I have heard good things about it.

[@UNEEK_LOGIK]

Didn’t like the MAF g/s readings was a lil too high @ idle Was like 7.53 g/s @ isle when it should have been 3.5 - 3.7ish maybe cleaning of the MAF with sum CRC Maybe nothing reason fuel trims took awhile to get back/near Zero

[@somerandomguy3868]

Royal purple is certainly a good oil, little bit pricey but some swear by it, I'm still using Toyota oil and filters in my 2018 4runner, probably will continue too at least for the foreseeable future

[@int53185]

These engines are fussy about oil condition. I change mine every 3K miles with full synthetic. 138K miles and no problems whatsoever. Also, never run them low on oil! You will be replacing timing chains and tensioners.

[@mmichaeldonavon]

Same here - every 4K miles. My GM 3.6ltr has 165.000 and still doing OK. I use Valvoline High Mileage - OK so far. Yes, I constantly think of those 3 timing chains, tensioners, etc., 4 cams and 4 phasers.

[@timzauto]

Usually they will also diesel,run on,with gas still being burnt with a leaking gdi,but I've done so many GM direct injection pumps I don't even have to hook my scanner up anymore,lol.

[@dc5723]

I use the same as you Ivan, Mobil 1 motor oil, Red Line for diffs, transfer and manual tranny.

[@agostinodibella9939]

Nice job 👍 Ivan!

[@cclngthr]

I think the shipping is ridiculous right now. Still waiting on the Ksport shock for my car. Called them and they are having production issues as well as some shipping issues. I personally like GDI fuel systems. I use it on my 1968 Chevy C30 that I custom designed and built. 572 big block with heads that I designed and cut with the CNC milling machine I have access to. 10.5 CR with 15 lbs of boost with the roots style supercharger. Has an Allisson 6 speed automatic transmission behind that. The only factory thing I reused is the cab and body. Everything else is not factory.

[@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics]

Sounds like a really cool custom build!

[@cclngthr]

@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics Yes it was. I built it in the high school auto shop when I taught automotive design and repair. I wanted the students to know what actually goes into the building of the truck and what they can do with the engine and drivetrain as well as suspension and frame. The motor has pistons with a 1.5 inch diameter bowl in the center like what is used on Skyavtive engines and diesel engines. The fueling is designed to have 2 prime sprays and 2 main sprays for each cylinder, which eliminates detonation to a large degree. We were able to program the computer that I got for it to accomplish what I wanted to teach the kids that year. It took from September to mid June to do all of that work.

[@jarrod8914]

There is a option to electrically depressurize the fuel pressure in most scan tools.

[@weshawkins7165]

How do you find out about all these vehicles and their particular issues and common failures.

[@overkill0074]

Royal Purple is the absolute best!

[@DIYDaveOK]

Ivan, I read that some (all?) GDI engines have fuel pressures so high that you're advised to wear heavy gloves when working near fuel lines because even a pinhole leak in a fuel line can penetrate skin. Is that universally true for GDI or just on certain engine types? And was the pump on this Impala just a bad design? Thanks as always!

[@RobertHancock1]

I think they are usually designed to bleed down the high pressure after the engine is shut off. Hyundai just advises to wait a while after shutoff before working on the system. Seems pretty clear this is a design or manufacturing flaw. GM cheaping out on parts as usual.

[@brianmason8400]

DIY Dave....to answer your question, yes, on all GDI systems, it is advisable to wear heavy gloves when working on them. While running especially, fuel pressure can be in the thousands of pounds, idling is still in the 400-500 pounds range. So yes, even a pin hole can pierce scan and if left untreated, can cause NASTY infection......I've heard of guys loosing digits (fingers) bc of being "macho" and not getting an injury from that treated properly....

[@throttlebottle5906]

"Guaranteed Destruction Integrated" ;)

[@johnfry9010]

OH , and I am an old guy and only use Amsoil , LOL .

[@agoodneighborautorepair2176]

Hi, how dangerous is that in direct injection, reducing oil viscosity, and future catalitics plug-in, and more, very nice analyzing in all you videos, congratulations.. good job..

[@BruceAllentools]

Are you able to tell looking at the old one if it was indeed leaking? I'm guessing that if there's any fuel coming through around the spring area of the pump that it was indeed leaking. Wasn't sure if this holds true or not or if anyone knows.

[@daveyio87]

I use royal purple in my manual trans vehicles and in the differentials. Mobil 1 Oil all the way! I go 5k on an oil change and when i had my malibu engine to do the timing chains and water pump the inside of the engine was like new. 130k. I did the chains as preventitive maintenance. The chain had 80k on it cuz i did it at 50k because it was slow at work and the car was under warranty lol. anyways 80k later i compared the chain to the new one and there was little to no wear on the chain. and you know chevy's and the 2.4 engine.

[@sinegra30]

Thank you Ivan!

[@jesusmalagon4336]

Thanks Ivan

[@worsttintentions]

I had a HP fuel pump for a 17 ats come from Florida. The box was stickered that it contained toxic items so it wasn't allowed to fly. 2 days turned into 3 weeks in my case. The OEM pump had sheared it's bolts off and killed the pump.

[@frankrizzo893]

Wow. Thanks

[@mikefoehr235]

I would say ROYAL PURPLE is for BARNEY lovers. I like Castrol Syntec.

[@slocavky]

Amsoil is way better than royal purple.... but great video none the less..

[@thingserik7269]

In CT I have never had an issue with FedEx or getting parts from Rock Auto.

[@davide.s.9880]

You said something like you want to or should change the PVC. Was it changed or was it one that was part of the intake or bigger more expensive part or harder to change part?

[@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics]

Actuall turns out that there is no PCV valve!! Just a small orifice...GM cheaped out.

[@davide.s.9880]

@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics Imagine me with a surprised look on my face. GM cheeped out ! Hahaha !

[@aymenmohamed1134]

👍👍

[@grahambate3384]

great video Ivan. I live in australia my son has 2012 commodore, look like pontiac G8 (2008) LFX 3.6l V6. few months ago it threw O2 senor a couple times, but he deleted the mufflers and after put it back to standard. Couple times engine has kept running after stop, if was hot or he was giving it a bit race. the other day threw p0172, ran rough and stalling. as i only change oil 2 weeks ago, i check oil and notice it was over full and strong smell of gas. i check the code and pump is one of the things on it. Do you think it the pump as it only throw the one code. pump around $300 for a cheap one. My son think it the injectors or O2 senor. He only had the car 11 months. cheers Graham.

[@danielmoore8538]

I use Walmart supertech and Mobil 1 filters

[@heartlandmechanic]

Nice job .

[@4WDIESEL1]

royal purple is very good oil.

[@carlm2590]

Rpyal Purple is good but unnecessary and overpriced. You can get great synthetic for much less and you won't know the difference.

[@rickharper1497]

Custom high performance or severe duty engine application, high price!!

[@RicardoPCGamer]

Royal Purple is $34.99 at Walmart. Just buying oil from Walmart is so much cheaper. Because oil from auto parts stores cost $10+ extra.

[@rafaelmarin1963]

I’m a junky and this is my drug of choice. (My fix!)

[@northernpatriot9078]

Dood I'm jonzin got any good diagnostics I can use

[@rafaelmarin1963]

@@northernpatriot9078 I was rewatching SMA’s last video when this one popped up. I simply love these videos! (I wish I had this level of skill and tools.)

[@solardiyhobbyandrevies8118]

Royal Pricey Oil.

[@abdulb7178]

Thanks

[@rafflesnh]

What in the name of all that's holy was the rationale behind that curious marketing decision with the Royal Purple oil?!

[@jasoncassidy2517]

Does a car normally have a MAF and a MAP sensors? I thought they were one or the other? Please excuse my ignorance, I’m a heavy truck tech I don’t know much in the automotive world

[@ldg332004]

This Impala isn't a flex fuel compatible vehicle with a ethenol content calculator I assume?

[@JD-yw2be]

Not sure if anyone can give any advice. Having issues on a 2012 Nissan Rouge. I pulled codes and it only comes up with a P0175. Fuel system rich bank 2

[@Kolmax1992]

Camaro 2010, 3.6 llt, system to rich -25%, change fuel pomp? Code 0172 system to rich of idle

[@stealthg35infiniti94]

Are the high pressure fuel pumps in GM cars more prone to failure compared to other Makes?

[@jasoncruise5949]

👍👍👍👍

[@Chico-td2fy]

I was guessing stuck purge valve...parts cannon miss 😅

[@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics]

That would be a good guess, but the diluted oil was a big clue of raw gas leak vs just vapors :)

[@mmichaeldonavon]

@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics Have changed two purge valves on my GM 3.6 ltr. Wish I had that 3.8 - I know Ivan loves it and says it's bulletproof. If only they had used metal elbows, originally, for the heater core lines. Sigh....

[@jp9579]

Haha this is rediculous. I own a nasty plow 2004 dodge dakota which i plow with and tow way over the limit. No problems and i live in the northeast! This direct injection is bullshit. I get 16 mph woth a 4.7 liter towing hard. Im not complaining! What we thought was garbage before is now the simplest vehicles to work on

[@jp9579]

Fucking rediculous. These vehicles today make me laugh

[@jp9579]

Old is gold!

[@jackwood8307]

👍

[@wolleysegap9740]

So Ivan, what do you check for on a Chev that is not DI but FI ?

[@nbassmusky]

Just before ignition: Maybe we should let the engine cool down.

[@AndyK.1]

Hi. I’m a big fan. What can cause these error codes on a non DI engine ? Thank you

[@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics]

A leaking fuel pressure regulator or leaking injectors. Also stuck open EGR on MAP engines :)