This Component Will Change How Your MTB Rides

[@FatDadEnduro]

I have to say, Owen has quickly become one of my favorite presenters… keep killin it!!!

[@OwenBikeNerd]

Why thank you! Thanks for the feedback I'll keep trying to boss it! Cheers Owen

[@ikerteuscher]

Totally Agree!

[@AHappyZeebra]

yeah Owen!!!!

[@GoatRidesBikes]

I have hair envy. Owen is my hair hero.

[@jammerlr7780]

Couldnt agree more! I found that changing the stem on my bike made a big improvement in fit and comfort for me.

[@omahamtb6580]

The component that makes the biggest difference for me is the handlebar. Specifically, the rise of the handlebar. I'm tall (6'-4"/1.93m) and most bikes come with low stack heights and XL frames already require longer steerer tubes. I have 60mm rise bars on all of my bikes just to get the grips level with my saddle and this really helps relieve back pain and boost confidence on steep downhill sections. It's not for everyone but it works well for me!

[@grantnewby3756]

Totally agree. I'm 6' 3" and have 80mm rise and the weight I can take off my shoulders and hands helps so much.Best thing I have changed

[@jimm3379]

I’m hearing you! Had terrible back and shoulder pain on my new bike, coupled with crap performance. Upgraded to 50mm rise, and amazed at the difference. TBH, I could probably go up a bit more. I’ve noticed that the seat is still slightly above the bars. I’m 6’4” with long legs and shorter torso.

[@omahamtb6580]

@@jimm3379 I think we're built the same! 🤣 There's no reason for your grips to be lower than your saddle unless you're an XC rider. I get jealous when I see small/medium enduro frames where their grips are significantly above the saddle without risers! The stack on an XL frame needs to be higher!

[@jimm3379]

@@omahamtb6580 I know, right?! 😂 I have a terrible time fitting into clothes, cars, aeroplane seats - the list goes. Being tall isn’t all beer & skittles, when the world is designed around average heights.

[@omahamtb6580]

@@jimm3379 I drove a Nissan Juke for 3 years. That was fun 🤣

[@feedbackzaloop]

I found bars and levers rotation make a greater impact. They force change in palm rotation and elbow bend, which effect steerer to shoulder distance* in a much wider range than any mtb stem length variation could (I'm not talking switching from -17 deg 120mm road to +80mm riser 0 length mtb though) * and it is shoulder position and knee bend that drag your whole body fore and aft

[@left_foot_brake]

Should we use trial and error to get this right, or can we use some baseline standard?

[@feedbackzaloop]

@@left_foot_brake baseline is what the manufacturer/bikeshop does at initial build, then educated guess upon how your proportions fair against average (eg, shorter body, longer hands - rotate upwards/"towards you"), then trial and error until happy upon particular style and preference (maybe body is short, but you like more weight up front - rotate 'em against initial suggestion)

[@letsgoletsgoletsgoletsgoletsgo]

i found that the higher the rise , the greater the effect bar roll have on your hands .

[@letsgoletsgoletsgoletsgoletsgo]

@@left_foot_brake personally , i first set it up with the riser part perpendicular to the ground (ie straight up) only as a starting point , i ride around for 15-30 minutes focusing on comfort, and i tweak accordingly , then i will ride around focusing on performance (ie handling , fore aft weight distribution etc)

[@Milessongs]

Hey! Nice to see Owen out there on his bike!

[@OwenBikeNerd]

Thank you! Cheers Owen

[@bikesense3867]

Good advice. But let’s not forget that bar roll (which is free) also does something similar, albeit less extreme.

[@hrobjartursigursson8942]

I downsized when I got my last bike and therefore got a 55mm stem instead of a 35mm. I like the extra weight it puts on my front wheel for confidence in turns.

[@Cassienope]

What 55mm stem did you get? I was looking around for one and didn't find anything really.

[@philthyphil3324]

Stem is usually the first thing i swap on a bike. I've tried to turn my x caliber into a roscoe-ish bike with a shorter stem higher rise bars, 120mm fork, and a -2 degree headset.

[@ksnax]

Riding mostly DH, stretching the wheelbase with more slack in the steering has been my go-to change. Adding 20-30mm to fork travel with an offset headset can throw the front wheel out there by a similar amount to significantly shift weight and handling rearward for steep descents.

[@ArkUSAbikerchick]

Great video! I may not change my stem, but this video did make me think! Very good video Owen!!!

[@brianrivasoconer5543]

My TREK MARLIN 8 2ND GEN ...I CHANGED THE STEM SHORTER AND IT MADE IT SO MUCH BETTER

[@gravity667]

I find 60mm rise bars work great for me. I’m about 190cm so keeps me in a comfortable climbing position plus keeps my head up on steep descents

[@chickenclips]

when riding your BMX?

[@rip.tear.]

Handlebars are actually really variable, width/rise/sweep and most importantly stiffness. Getting them right makes a huge difference to speed/comfort

[@winklertribe5268]

Thanks Owen! What a fun video!

[@ChristianPareATLAS]

I need to do that, making sure my stem length fits me. Just got a new bike but am waiting for a work injury to heal few more weeks before

[@grantnewby3756]

I changed the Specialized tires that came on my Turbo Levo Alloy Comp to the Pirelli and the difference in rolling with the same tyre pressure was amazing. They just roll on for ever compared to the Specialized Butcher tires. Also a 80mm rise on my bars has helped take the weight off my shoulders and wrists as I am 6' 3".

[@Emtbwebb]

Im changing my tires on my levo, 🤟🏼

[@paulthompson6357]

Stem length minus bar setback to get as close to matching fork offset as possible makes for ideal steering in my opinion. Longer stem pushes the steering center forward slowing steering response but also weights the front wheel a bit more. The opposite is the case with a shorter stem. I tie a string at the center of the grips from one side to the other and us it as the line of reference. From there measure from the center of the stem to the string. It makes for easy and repeatable measures when making bar and stem changes. You would be amazed how much flipping a stem or rotating the bars adjusts the steering center.

[@Unamatrix01]

Great video.I would suggest videos on handlebar and lever positioning,along with crank arm length and seat positioning.

[@OwenBikeNerd]

Thank you - Yes you're right bar width, height and lever position are great positioning changers - too - ooo maybe I should break out the scales on trails again! Thanks for the feedback Cheers Owen

[@Montytobin]

never realised how good owen is!

[@OwenBikeNerd]

Why thank you! Cheers Owen

[@Jellytaco.]

Pedals!! I swapped mine and it made a huge difference

[@wotyla13]

dropping my stem from top to bottom position on the steerer tube made my trek remedy (2019) a different bike, better for climbing as well as descending in my opinion

[@Emtbtoday]

My new emtb came with a 50mm stem over fox 38 170mm was to far over front end tried the 35mm stem to far back then Funn came out with the new V2 Equaliser stem in 42mm its absolutely spot on for my weight distribution! It looks as short as a 35mm and can be used upside-down if need a higher rise but the down position with burgtec ride high 38s really got it dialled over the front end like and now corners like it's on rails haha but getting abit more brave into corners don't want to get to cocky 😂

[@JanZbinden-r3y]

At some point i realized that i Ride more efficietly on a seatpost without setback. I feel more on top of the pedals instead of behind them. Being seated that also moves your weight foreward.

[@TheoTheodoroulakis]

Probably has already been mentioned, but I need to note that Owen sounds a bit like Richard Hammond... and I like that.

[@OwenBikeNerd]

If you like Richard Hammond I'll take that as a compliment - for sure! Cheers Owen

[@northwestmountainbikeaddic6874]

Raceface turbine r 35x32 I love it !!

[@buddy7136]

I'm between the medium and large frame sizes. I chose to size down my Roscoe to the medium. It felt fine in a seated position but i felt almost over the bars when out of the saddle. Added 50ish mil stem (don't remember exact length) moved the bars out just enough I love the fit.

[@sethrich5998]

Is that an older generation Roscoe? Everything Medium and up comes with a 50mm stem now. I’m also between the M and M/L on the Roscoe, for me reach is too long on the M/L but frame maybe feels too small on the M, debating on just getting a M or swapping a 35mm stem on a M/L, which would be the same reach as a M.

[@buddy7136]

@@sethrich5998 bought it last year front and rear through axle. Mine came with the 30ish length stem.

[@buddy7136]

@sethrich5998 I replied then it disappeared on my side if this is double posted I apologize. I bought mine last summer front and rear through axle. My med frame came with the 35 mil stem. For me at 5'8" the M/L felt just a little too big. Went with the med, on my second or third ride I had a decent length out of the saddle climb that's when I felt my hands were too close and decided to add stem length.

[@sethrich5998]

@@buddy7136 Oh interesting, I wonder if Mediums coming with a 50mm stem is a newer change. I do really wonder what the handling characteristic difference would be between a M with 50mm stem, and a M/L with 35mm stem. They’d have identical Reach; but M/L would have a longer wheelbase & steering behind axle, the M would have shorter wheelbase & steering in-front of axle. Not sure what that changes in ride feel though.

[@buddy7136]

@sethrich5998 I have been laid up the past few weeks. I was finally able to go an actually measure my stems. My medium Roscoe came with a 45mm stem I replaced it with a 60mm. Cheers.

[@_TheDeanMachine]

For me the two biggest changes for ergonomics and comfort were high rise bars (40mm) and Fat grips

[@vashon100]

What fat grips did you get?

[@01FozzyS]

Lol @3:05 My old bike I submitted some years ago! Long gone.

[@lebowskiunderachiever3591]

Very 👌

[@ish474]

I think tires are the number one thing that affects how your bike rides. As far as feel if you've ever ridden downhill casing tires you really begin to understand that your tires are part of your suspension even if it takes an extreme change to really notice it

[@thecakeisalie7070]

Don't forget the mixed result of setback of the handlebar. If you change stem and handlebar at the same time, your changing two variables and you may have just undid the reach adjustment with the backsweep of your new handlebar. Not all backsweeps result in the same setback, so it's important to know that spec of your changing both at the same time.

[@OwenBikeNerd]

Howdy, Your right the bars and different bars can make a difference - down to sweep - rearward and upward and rise will make a change too - with these on trail changes in the video we just changed the stem - the bar stayed the same - just so you can see how just one component change can make a difference - but yes your right playing with all the components to hand stem and bar can added up to a bige difference! Cheer Owen

[@tomaszkpl]

I'm pretty sure that's not what you had in mind, but in my opinion, the biggest confidence booster is the dropper post. Great video BTW ❤

[@KevinT3141]

I got my first mountain bike 15 years ago as a rugged commuter (a 3x9 mild XC hardtail with 80 mil coil fork), because I was almost 300 lbs and tired of warping rims and breaking spokes. I didn't think I'd ever actually mountain bike with it. 10 years later I stumbled onto my first green trail while camping and fell in love. Two years or so later I added a dropper to it and my world changed again. I've changed tires, dropped pressures, upgraded bikes, and lost 70 lbs since then, but no change has ever been as dramatic as adding that dropper to the first bike.

[@erwinhonoresvicencio6872]

Great vid to explain the effect of stem on geometry and riding. However just to be more precise in the measurements you shouldn’t use the stick so that changes the distribution of your weight causes a % of your weight goes to the stick

[@diejeekoen]

There is another point to the stem length you did not mention. It changes the angle of your arms to the bars. The angle of my arms while riding downhill felt rather steep. On fast downhills I moved back ( and down) from my knees to lessen the angle and to not get thrown over the bars when the frontwheel got a backward impact from rock gardens or roots. Because of that I could not last long as the deep position was extreme tiring for my upper legs. The longer stem solved the problem, No burning leggs anymore. More weigth on the front is good for slow steep downhills to control your speed over mainly the front brake to get more grip on the front tire. One could also argue my bike has a to short reach..

[@GODZclaN11]

My Trek Fuel EX's steering in slow and uphill situations is very imprecise. The wheel flops around and I go off line constantly. Steering is very sensitive to mu inputs. Appreciate any insight offerred!

[@AHappyZeebra]

you forgot the raised reverse stem. saw that run person recently. rather interesting.

[@jez5180]

Good informative video 👍 When riding you play around d with your cofg and starting with the right stem for the ride helps alot.

[@OwenBikeNerd]

Awesome glad that the video and scales on trails helped! Cheers Owen

[@ericgelders]

My next MTB component purchase will be 2 weighing scales 😄

[@JEMTB90]

I'm all about the descends and tech, 32mm stem has been installed on my bike for a while now and love it! But that's after riding a Mondraker with 30mm stem and I loved the direct steering feel

[@TheAntoine191]

moving forward on steep technical hill is so 2000. Todays bike are so steep at the seat angle that you will lose grip at the rear if you do so in anything that has no perfect grip. Getting low works however. Put that chest on the stem.

[@justgo4033]

I just built up a new frame and usually run a 35mm stem but even though the reach on my new bike is longer it feels shorter and had to run a 50mm stem to feel centered on the bike . The shorter stem made it feel like i had no weight on the front and made the bike feel twitchy. 50mm stem and slightly lower handlebars feel better on the new bike .

[@rider65]

The reason why the 50 mm is more stable than the 35mm, i.e. Less Twitchy is because the 50 mm is lengthening the steering axis, it's simply physics 👍

[@justgo4033]

I understand , i also think that my old frame had a slacker head angle of 63.5 * . My new frame has an angle of 65*

[@RobHill00]

Quality video, would it make any difference if it was a n e-bike guessing it’s just the weight of the bike as a whole?🤔

[@tjb8841]

I’ve been meaning to do the same myself

[@CMneilB]

Of course there’s truth in this test but it’s really showing how vital it is to have the right reach and chainstay length. And head angle. (Plus bb height of course) Altering the stem length (or, to a lesser extent, bar roll) will significantly change the relationship between hands and steerer tube axis. How much this alters the ability to load the front tyre is a very important consideration here. (To be fair slowing or speeding up steering is mentioned) Body position and shoulder height (plus elbows out/ forward) on the right size bike is how to control load on the front tyre contact patch for turning, rather than doing that by making the stem longer.

[@WEMO11]

I would say 100% the component that changes your confidence while riding is tires, I used to hate any loose dust or mud while using XC tires once i switched to something with more grip it was game changer

[@Blooper24-7]

Thanks for this vid, I already know that this is going to help me with my setup

[@klstrucker930419]

Can you please do the same fo different frame sizes? A larger frame gonna have more stack and reach and longer wheelbase, but at the same time you are more stretched over the bike. Is there a huge loss of front wheel grip when going for a 1 size larger frame?

[@OwenBikeNerd]

Ooo thats a great idea! Watch this space! Cheers Owen

[@letsgoletsgoletsgoletsgoletsgo]

regular guy wearing glasses , very relatable !

[@OwenBikeNerd]

Thank you I'll say Nerdy Regular guy - but glad its relatable - thanks for the feedback! Cheers Owen

[@hallstewart]

The distance between hands and feet matters. But the distance from contact patches to feet matters more.

[@kentnilsson9757]

👍I am 59 years old and whats made me angry, was that advice you got when you where young and whanted to by a MTB. That edvice you got to by, was the TO small frame size you get instead for the size that you feel where right for you. This probably because there didn't exist any short stam at that time😂😂😂. I even stops riding MTB just because it didnt feel right, but now I have 3 Enduro SL Emtb's and 1 full power and 1 one Enduro MTB, 1 Trail MTB, and I feel like 30-years younger/new-born😂😂😂

[@kentnilsson9757]

👍"Send you over the bars"🤔. Finally have the MTB people hwo by been send over the bars, noticed tha a shorter stam and one size bigger frame solve that problem😋

[@devonswindell9735]

I went with a 15mm longer stem to counteract my new bar that has 3° more backsweep. The bars ended up where thwy were before.

[@andrewwelbourn9577]

What about saddle position fore and aft? That will make a difference to weight over bottom bracket, but surely pedalling efficiency. Is t there supposed to be the vertical line from front of knee through pedal spindle at 3 o clock? I suppose it’s personal preference and what you are using the bike for.

[@chdu7414]

Changing saddle position fore/aft

[@OwenBikeNerd]

yes that a great discussion topic - moving where you sit bones are - does move you weight around too - but it can impact ergonomics - too far forward over the pedals can load you knees too much - as I hopefully touched on bike fit is a complex topic - and its all interlinked to the specifics of the rider and where you're riding too! cheers Owen

[@christopherbouman160]

My girlfriend left me because she said my stem length wasn’t long enough.

[@masterchief5437]

lol

[@vidsamaadhi]

@christopherbouman160 No, she left you because you don't listen to her. What she ACTUALLY said was "Stop playing with your stem length and take me for a ride."

[@christopherbouman160]

@@vidsamaadhi she left me for a unicyclist. Can’t make this stuff up.

[@harrykriftel]

Interesting subject!

[@OwenBikeNerd]

Thank you - hopefully it got you and other folks thinking about weight distribution in a new way! Cheers Owen

[@felipenavas]

As far as I know there is only one book on bikefit and it is very focused on road bikes. I think that if the industry wants to be taken more seriously it needs to show theory and studies, not just products.

[@OwenBikeNerd]

Greetings, Ergon make a Bike fit guide book for Mountain biking - its got set up guides and steps for majority of mtb disciplines - its good - and of course we have - GMBN's Essential MTB Maintenance - which whilst not a bike fit guide covers a heap of MTB bike set up skills! Cheers Owen

[@BounceBackWesterner]

What about Lee McCormack's book, Dialed: the secret math of a perfect mountain bike setup? It's totally based on math and his concept of RAD. He backs up his theory of bike set up with math.

[@tim__sadler]

Completely agree - but running bars and stem from different manufacturers does decrease your style by -17% - don't ask me for the science though

[@OwenBikeNerd]

ha ha ha - but also wheres' the science on a call this big? Cheers Owen

[@tim__sadler]

@@OwenBikeNerd you are just going to have to trust me on the science. I heard someone actually broke the space time continuum by running a combination of different manufacturers' stem and bars, different tyre brands front and rear, different brands for brakes and drive-train and what made the real difference was different brand fork and shock.

[@stujm8376]

What about handlebar width when changing the stem, shouldn’t that come into consideration?

[@OwenBikeNerd]

Howdy, thanks for the feedback! I did try to mentioned - that yes bar width, bar shape - how much sweep upward and rearward and bar rise can all effect body and ride dynamics - but often people reach for a fresh bar - when potential a difference stem length can make a difference - that doesn't mean to say that bar width isn't a factor! Have you switched stem's or bar's to improve the fit on your bike? Cheers Owen

[@Yhoda.PsyTrakked]

I only like proper sized bikes for long rides for short fun techy rudes i prefer them slightly smaller as they are more playful, im a freerider at heart going off into the rough and big bikes i detest,

[@lcc8394]

a bike fit only really works if your going to spend all day sat in the saddle and not move around the bike otherwise it's kinda wasting your money just go with your ball park frame size and tune the components to get the fit you need.....how the bike feels is way more important - i'm 5'10 and only ride small bikes - 70mm stem and 125mm dropper

[@OwenBikeNerd]

Great feedback and insights! Although - bike fit matters for xc, dh and enduro racers - yes you right that the dynamic ride feel might trump the ergonomics advantages - but that hopefully conundrum i was trying to flag again great to read you're insights into the bikefit world Cheers Owen

[@Dann651]

Scales should be level for more accurate results

[@andreasbrandstetter9221]

88 you AND the bike😂 omg i have to loose some kgs😅

[@kaneda4102]

I don’t know but the component that would improve my riding the most right now would be my left knee

[@feedbackzaloop]

But the main question remains: is this the closest to Owen actually riding we will ever get?

[@KevinT3141]

Did you miss his bike-packing trip with Blake a month or two ago? Fun romp!

[@feedbackzaloop]

@@KevinT3141 wait, whaaaaat?! I remember Blake with Rich and Don, but I'm sure I wouldn't miss Owen featuring

[@KevinT3141]

@@feedbackzaloop Lol, it was a main channel video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/oHquc2CrhrOJpMUsi=9AjqXAIawXtrFAEr

[@OwenBikeNerd]

Howdy I did another riding video too - kzbin.info/www/bejne/aZTai4KknqyHrrM Oh yeah and that epic with Blake! More to come soon too! Cheers Owen

[@KevinT3141]

@@OwenBikeNerd Thanks for that one Owen, somehow I missed it the first time around! Great video, and I really appreciate you having come around to the front side of the GMBN cameras.

[@Laliluluullaal]

I think that the main things that change the riding are : suspension, tiers, handlebar, stem and brakes ( maybe )

[@nomad-pq4yw8iy7v]

I finding my self wanting to take some weight off the front end. Granted it is a E so the battery is putting some of weight there so the same bike in non I'm pretty sure I would setup different. That would be interesting to do a video to do due about bike fit and setup on something like a Reign and Reign E or other bikes that have E and non E version💡

[@tmill2001]

Doesn't moving the seat fore and after do the same for weight distribution?

[@TheRoyalSh0t]

You're out of the saddle half if not most of the mountain bike trail

[@OwenBikeNerd]

Yes it can effect weight distribution - it will also effect your seated pedalling position and power - and it won't effect the steering dynamics as much - thats not to say it won't effect it but not as much as stem might! Cheers Owen

[@qwasd0r]

People seem to be talking about crank lengths now.

[@OwenBikeNerd]

Agreed - Crank length is important - it does effect both on bike ergonomics and ride dynamics but I feel potentially not as much as stem length - but its bike fit factor for sure! Cheers Owen

[@jacospreeu]

Please do a video about Ochain

[@OwenBikeNerd]

Ooo - that could be super interesting! Cheers Owen

[@Emolokz]

It seems you neglected to mention stack height/stem height

[@Emolokz]

Higher or lower rise bars, raising or lowering stem height via spacers, combinations of these with various stem lengths. Could have made this video quite a bit longer and more comprehensive.

[@mikestivers8302]

assuming a stem length of 40mm, most important is to fit the bike per your RAD/Reach. then cut your bars, if applicable, to your height in cm x 4.4 (example: you're 170cm tall, your bars should then be 750mm wide) face the elephant in the room, fellas.

[@jusfc]

The component change you can make which affects ergonnomics, confidence AND efficiency of energy is raising the angle of your brake levers so you aren't reaching around the bar for them. A higher position matches the angle of your arms during serious decending, increasing ergonomics, decreasing reliance on your thumbs to stop you going over the bars by placing the grip back into your palm again, giving you confidence. Arm pump is also decreased which means you can ride better for longer or more aggressively instead. By this rationale mind, you should be adjusting your levers depending on the general steepness of each track you 're at. Not sure I could be added with that...

[@cwtoyota]

The mountain bike industry is wrong about stem length. Stem length should be a function of steering geometry (PERIOD). Change your bottom bracket position and reach instead. (yes, a correct sized frame). Most of your body weight should be transferred through the bottom bracket, not the stem.

[@BewilderedDuck-e5l]

I look forward to your bike range with their “correct” sizing being released.

[@Andy-co6pn]

Makes me laugh when brands claim size specific geometry and change the chain stay lengths by 3mm between size med and XL 😂

[@jaad7562]

You should ride with "heavy feet and light hands" while descending, so your feet position should theoretically have more impact on a weight distribution than subtle changes in stem length

[@OwenBikeNerd]

Sage advice! Cheers Owen

[@matejoejo]

Yes. I think similar. Weight distribution is about FC/RC ratio while descending and about your saddle position while climbing. Stem length makes a big difference in handling. Short stem - more responsive, long stem - more forgiving.

[@adambarlev8992]

Ever since I got into mtb from road/gravel, that's the mantra that's been running through my head. Heavy feet, light hands... It's transformed my riding on any bike.

[@bitumen83]

90% of modern bikes comes with proper stem. Component no.1 that will effect how your bike ride, are tires. Invest in good tires according to your riding style.

[@KevinT3141]

Proper stem for whom though? People come in different proportions, and while the factory stem will fit an average rider pretty well on a properly sized bike, there are those out there that will benefit from a change. Hopefully your local bike shop has a fit specialist who can advise if your new bike doesn't quite feel right.

[@Lexis098]

There is no such thing as "proper stem". Everyone is different. What is proper for one person is obviously wrong for the other.

[@Velo1010]

That’s probably very true.

[@danielstormy3660]

Bought full sus with 45mm stem, changed it to 100mm stem.

[@devincook3278]

A proper stem for him but maybe not me. I have monkey arms and I am not a great climber so I lengthen the stem to help on the climbs. The sacrifice downhill is negligible for me. Tires are very important though, obviously.

[@28beerslater]

Dude is that a WHYTE Bar on your Canyon BIke :D

[@gregorgasparic6836]

wouldn't making your front end stiffer also move more weight back and vice versa? not sure, but I think motorcycles manage the weight distibution that way...

[@rider65]

You can raise or lower the fork legs to change rake, but stiffening or softening the forks are not going to affect static weight distribution. If you go to a softer Fork you will incur more brake dive.

[@Varaxis]

Old bikes have awful weight distro for us small riders (short and light). It's no wonder they were endo-machines, with so much weight up front, and why old coaches suggested that we hang our butt off the back in technical terrain. Shorter stems got offset by wider bars, not really making that much of a difference in the big picture. It's no wonder there was a period of people upsizing frame sizes, increasing fork travel, and slackening their HTA for trail performance, to get the front wheel kicked out further. Also, it's no wonder why bigger people (taller and heavier) preferred short travel bikes (too little weight up front on long travel bikes, compensating for it with super draggy front tires). If only mfgers paid more attention to this on newer releases, rather than spec the same setup on every bike, with nothing more than a difference 25mm in reach, 10mm in stack, and 40mm in STL between sizes. Size-specific HTA and mutator chips of the new Geometron seemed like a good progression from size-specific CSL. 60:40 to 62:38 (Rear:Front, level ground) seemed like a sweet spot setup, from my own testing with scales under each wheel. Too much weight on the rear made the front too easy to lift on steep climbs, with front traction not being as confident in corners. My next step after that was to retain that distro between sitting and standing position, which I tried to get by steepening the STL and pushing the saddle forward to reduce the difference between sitting and standing, and making up for the extra weight up front by pushing the front wheel out further with a more upright position from cockpit tuning. Having similar seated and standing position meant less compromise on suspension too, no longer feeling dive-prone up front when standing or not sensitive up front when sitting, or rear being too saggy when sitting. Having less weight up front makes sense, since we unweight the front so frequently when riding technical trails. I just kept experimenting with less and less weight distro up front, until the detriments started bothering me, then I dialed it back to discover the sweet spot I could settle on. With these experiments, I also found out that wheelbase dictated the ride experience a lot, with shorter promoting flickable riding styles with wheels often off the ground, and longer promoting plowing with wheels closer to the ground. It took more speed and fitness to enjoy the long wheelbase bike. I found that for trail riding, a wheelbase of 1230mm was my sweet spot, but if I were more fit, I'd rather move up to 1250mm than move back to 1210. I also found that 435mm CSL worked great with 1230mm WB, and that STA between 75-77 weren't steep enough for me, with 75-76 feeling so slack that it was better to push the saddle back, rather than try to emulate a steeper STA by slamming it forward. I feel that STA can go steeper than 81°, but a long travel dropper is an absolute must, as the nose of the saddle will try to occupy the same space as the spine if you try and put a foot down while keeping 1 foot on the pedal.

[@semadragun]

I moved my seat back as far as possible and so much better, i have a better grip on the bars now.

[@OwenBikeNerd]

Interesting insights - Do be mindful that moving saddle position whilst yes does change weighting of the front wheel also changes how efficient your legs are - ok Knee over pedal spindle isn't perfect but its a good rule of thumb - erm rule of patella - Cheers Owen

[@semadragun]

@@OwenBikeNerd Hi Owen! Actually glad you mentioned that, i went for a long ride after the adjustment and it felt great. I was 20mm out for my RAD, and my stem is long already, so sliding that butt holder back really helped! ☺ Thanks for the reply!😎

[@helicopter12345678]

What about how the bike handles and feels with longer stem steering is less direct and acts like a yaw instead of a turn..if you get my meaning 😊

[@semadragun]

@@helicopter12345678 It's a factory stem on an XL frame but i have long arms and a long torso being 6'4 so it felt better to me.

[@LaurentiusTriarius]

Weight biais isn't that critical your body adjust your position following muscle memory to weight and unweight the front and rear when you ask it to. I'm often riding sitting back a bit but front wheel washout isn't something I ever get. It's more about having the space and willingness to be proactive and not be along for the ride...

[@jimwing.2178]

I agree with the principle of what you wrote. However, my experience with experimenting with different stem lengths (as the only variable) has convinced me that the real world is different. The best improvement that I've made to my bike is multiple-day trials for increasingly shorter stems. At some point I felt that the stem was too short for me, so I knew that the size longer was the best for me, my bike, and the trails I ride. Even so, I still have to adjust my riding posture to weight/unweight as necessary. Starting from a good average position allows me to adjust more quickly with less effort.

[@rider65]

😂🤦‍♂️ If weight bias didn't matter...then why wouldn't mtb's come 60% front/40% rear weight bias? Or 70 F/30R? Or 25% F/75% R... 🤣 Where did you get your engineering degree? A cearal box?🤣 omfg

[@E-MTBs]

Stem length is huge. If you bought a bike, that’s too big for you having a shorter stem makes it far more rideable.

[@rider65]

It's far from ideal, but works as a short term 'fix' with regard to reach, but it alters the steering axis

[@bf.258]

I dont trust whatever he's saying.

[@evguenistarikov9954]

And what does it mean to a regular, but not professional MTB rider? Nothing!!! I wish there was absolutely proved formula for creating your bike geometry and setup. But all this is so vague and uncertain… Hey, I’m still riding my hardtail 😅

[@OwenBikeNerd]

Thanks for you feedback - always good to hear different views. but yep to be very clear - I am a regular rider - not a Pro racers ok I've been a Pro mechanic but thats not same same. So why is this important - well changing the ergonomics and / or ride dynamics can boost on bike fit - so its comfy for longer - and or its easier ride tech terrain. I'm not sure its vague - but I'd intended it to help to flag that peoples body proportions are different and different bike are different - but playing with stem length is a great way of easily helping fit your bike for ergonomic and ride dynamic reasons. That will all apply on a hardtail or full suspension bike Again great to have constructive feedback and if you have any question do free feel to ask! Cheers Owen

[@danielmateusz9293]

nice1!