God Demands Child Sacrifice in the Bible

[@M.Linoge]

You gotta love a Word of God so crystal clear in its message that people are unsure whether it says to kill your kids or hand them over to strangers. Priest strangers, of all things.

[@Nebulax123]

Look how well that works for Catholics.

[@FerrariKing]

You have to have the holy spirit and are misinterpreting and all that other nonsense they claim.

[@PabloSanchez-qu6ib]

Of course, you unbelieving atheist. That happens because the word from a perfect god has to be perfect. A perfect contradictory obscure mess, that is.

[@Ex_christian]

@@FerrariKinghave to have something that isn’t real?

[@alanhyland5697]

Don't know what you're talking about. It's clear as mud.

[@demomanchaos]

Jephthah is all you need to point to, dude sacrifices his daughter to the petty one after making a deal of trading that which greets him when he gets home for victory in battle. He was hoping for a dog or a sheep, but the petty one knowingly made his daughter be the first to meet him. Also recall that bit about how if a child is disobedient you have every right to just kill it. The bible is pretty clear about how little children matter.

[@Ugly_German_Truths]

God gave you children, god can take them away again. Just ask Job.

[@demomanchaos]

@@Ugly_German_Truths No, a man putting their penis into a woman and sending a blast of DNA into her is what makes children. Have you never had "the talk" or had a basic biology class?

[@Rocchio753]

@@Ugly_German_TruthsYahweh is Satan. You were tricked

[@HillbillyYEEHAA]

And he shouldn't of made the pact to sacrifice anything

[@demomanchaos]

@@Ugly_German_Truths Fucking your wife gives you children, learn some basic biology. interesting to see that you are justifying child sacrifice though.

[@tabularasa0606]

The children are better off being sacrificed than given over to the priesthood. The suffering is shorter.

[@Reed5016]

Jesus Christ, that’s dark. It’s arguably true though.

[@yak596]

​@@Reed5016ahaahaahaaa

[@somethingsinlife5600]

In my personal and societal experience, it's an operating principle. Forget your children, serve god. No matter what happens to your children, all will be well if you just please god. They are also told that their children are meant to serve them, and they are meant to serve god. You can see what this results in. So yeah, god is always demanding child sacrifice. It's worse than actual sacrifice. Results in more suffering than an actual death.

[@Puta692]

Yes that is by Jehovah witnesses

[@somethingsinlife5600]

@@Puta692 Not just Jehovah's fanboys.

[@Ugly_German_Truths]

it's even possible that it is more sinister. if you are SUPPOSED to sacrifice your child, but redemption has become the only acceptable custom.... and the redeeming price is pretty steep so many couldn't automatically afford it... what to do? Can you really NOT redeem a firstborn son? Or will you maybe need to go into debt slavery as payoff for your child's life? That would surely take care of always ensuring a steady supply of the newly "indentured" Servants for Israel. Doing their six years unpaid work before returning to their families.

[@jamesduncan3673]

I love how Dr. Kipp Davis jumped in with a thorough and nuanced answer to what was obviously not a simple yes or no question.

[@Ugly_German_Truths]

Kipp and Dr Josh from Digital Hamurrabi have recently done a lot of work on the slavery subject with emphasis on the textual roots... it's probably very fresh in his mind and ready to be quoted.

[@ansuz5903]

"God loves violence. Why do you think there is so much of it?" -paraphrasing a guy in Shutter Island

[@resourcedragon]

What I was taught over the years was that the early Jewish religion arose in an area where human sacrifice was the norm. This is why (among other things), Abraham doesn't go *_"WHAT??? DA FUQ!!!!!"_* when God tells (or perhaps "tells") him to sacrifice Isaac after all the dramas Sarah had getting pregnant at all. When God gives Isaac (and I always wondered what Isaac was thinking about all this) a last minute reprieve, this was symbolic of God saying, "Don't do human sacrifice any more." God then broke his own rules with the death of Jesus - and again, the idea of a human sacrifice wasn't wildly foreign to the people of that region, even if the Romans were a bit shocked. Finally "Don't do human sacrifice any more," still implies that people were doing it. The story of Jephthah definitely implies that it was a reasonably common practice. I would be interested to see what the archaeological evidence from the area indicates.

[@anyob]

I was raised christian, and pastors explained to me that the sacrifices mentioned in Leviticus and, specially, in the story of Japhet's daughter actually mean giving them into priesthood or vowing virginity respectively. Seems very tortuous, but I think many would prefer it to being killed as a sacrifice.

[@anyob]

@@MostAmericansAreClueless1 Funny you mention some commandments as something they don't pick to interpret, and that's true but "do not kill" actually doesn't mean what it means, and I'm pretty sure many church leaders have argued that "it doesn't mean killing in general, it means [insert interpretation]". . . . Very psychotic if one thinks about it.

[@jakewhit9000]

Morning Aron ..nothing like making Christians cring in the morning...lmao u da man

[@trolljones4386]

Later parts of the Bible complain about the Hebrews actually sacrificing their kids due to what was taught to them early in the Bible

[@aetherkid]

The big problem was they were sacrificing kids to the wrong god. That's the worst part.

[@CB66941]

Could we have a verse for that? Is it Ezekiel 20:26?

[@thomasneal9291]

@@aetherkid no, the worst part is they interpreted "kid" to mean HUMAN CHILD, when clearly it meant goat behbee. I mean seriously, who would want BBQ human when you can have BBQ goat?

[@xaayer]

@@thomasneal9291 " I mean seriously, who would want BBQ human when you can have BBQ goat?" God lol

[@alanhyland5697]

@@xaayer He likes the smell

[@randolphphillips3104]

Interesting when "gawd's inerrent word" needs to "be interpreted" whenever it doesn't meet modern(ish) morals and knowledge. The "plain, unambiguous word of gawd" couldn't mean that! It must be allegorical or is just mean some other practice we do not remember. If it commands your first born and you shove priesthood or circumcision in there, please explain why church tradition doesn't have us all go out and buy goats for priests, or circumcize cattle to keep them kosher.

[@randelford5817]

I wonder if it's because it's just BS?

[@Ugly_German_Truths]

Why CHRISTIANS don't do it is due to Paul who "dejewizised" Christian rites and allowed them to be believers without circumcission, sacrifices, the silly temple locks, not eating pork or shellfish and wearing two cloths... Why modern JEWS no longer do that is due to the Temple in Jerusalem being destroyed in 70 CE and the whole sacrifice business having been turned impossible since then as only the Temple was where htey could perform sacrifices.

[@thebadjew3136]

A few years back during our congregation morning torah study. When one of the new comers asked this question it was quite a joy too me when it turned into quite a fight between a few people who refused to believe this point. Despite the foot notes in many Bible and torah mizavteam that could support this point. 😅

[@GreatyMatt]

If the literature god was real it would be the most wanted criminal in the world government. It's funny how modern days we have a great understanding of morality from reason and psychology but a timeless god can't be as advanced as us. Good word from everyone on this subject

[@BeStill-zy5ye]

No that just ain't right. I'ma tell u true stuff. I'm self educated and basically I e self learned my self and God my main teacher but I came up with this prove okay.. A builder is proof of a building and a painter is proof of a painting 🖌️ so the creation around us is proof of God. Don't try to over complicate this stuff just trust me okay I would not lie to you folks trust me. Okay have a good one. Atheist actually worship Satan not know it actually and Satan want you to believe he ain't real so if u ain't believe him he already got u were he want so don't do that okay

[@kellydalstok8900]

@@BeStill-zy5ye “People said there had to be a Supreme Being because otherwise how could the universe exist, eh? And of course there clearly had to be, said Koomi, a Supreme Being. But since the universe was a bit of a mess, it was obvious that the Supreme Being hadn't in fact made it. If he had made it he would, being Supreme, have made a better job of it, with far better thought given, taking an example at random, to things like the design of the common nostril. Or, to put it another way, the existence of a badly put-together watch proved the existence of a blind watchmaker. You only had to look around to see that there was room for improvement practically everywhere. This suggested that the Universe had probably been put together in a bit of a rush by an underling while the Supreme Being wasn't looking, in the same way that Boy Scouts' Association minutes are done on office photocopiers all over the country. So, reasoned Koomi, it was not a good idea to address any prayers to a Supreme Being. It would only attract his attention and might cause trouble.” ― Terry Pratchett, Small Gods

[@JosephKano]

​@@BeStill-zy5yeif this god, this Abrahamic god was real it would be the moral duty of all humans to devote themselves to killing that monster.

[@KianaWolf]

@@kellydalstok8900 I miss that man. Discworld is one of a small number of reasons I have any sense of humor or joy in my life.

[@thomasneal9291]

@@JosephKano "if this god, this Abrahamic god was real it would be the moral duty of all humans to devote themselves to killing that monster." maybe someone did. maybe Nietzsche was being quite literal?

[@michaeldeaton]

Imma be real with you Aron, this 8 people all talking over one another format is hard to watch. No offense bro. Purely constructive criticism. Been watching your content for years. Love ya dude.

[@sagrawolf]

It’s very hard to listen to the conversation because everyone won’t stop talking

[@thomasneal9291]

@@sagrawolf they need to implement a digital version of the talking stick.

[@jursamaj]

Aron made a really good point: there is no way a bronze age society could survive while sending all 1st-born sons to be priests. That's simply not economically feasible.

[@jursamaj]

@@Peekaboo-Kitty That was mentioned in this video, including that it came much later than the original 'devote all the 1st-born' command.

[@lacielesueur1167]

I love the last sentence 😂 "if you read the Bible god loves dead babies, it's his favorite thing"...

[@AdmiralBison]

The irony is Christians use to refer to Atheists as "Baby eaters", when it's their damn god in the Bible that sustains on babies and children getting killed or sacrificed. Every insult and condemnation from Religion and Christians towards Atheists, I just assume there is a little projection in there somewhere.

[@EmeraldEyesEsoteric]

That's funny, because God saying in Isaiah 1 and 66 that he doesn't want animal sacrifice, nor to have anything to do with all the feasts and religious holidays. Just one of the 10,000 contradictions in the bible. I think it was 10,000. There is a website that lists every single one of them, the number is VERY high. The word of "God" is a flaming sword that turns in all directions to guard Esoteric Freemason Secrets.

[@Ugly_German_Truths]

@@EmeraldEyesEsoteric Nah, the most popular list which inspired the "Rainbow" style poster with the lines connecting the verse pairs that are contradictory has some number between 5000 and 6000 cases with slightly more verse examples as there can be 3 or 4 verses involved in some. And the majority is rather trivial so only 1000 or so stay that are really dealing with important things, but which include "can god lie" or "does god do evil things".

[@EmeraldEyesEsoteric]

@@Ugly_German_Truths I have no idea what you're talking about. I had to read through my own comment to try to make sense of it and I still say you're full of it.

[@meanscene914]

What exactly are these assumed freemasonry secrets 😂

[@gatorboymike]

God operates by his own esoteric set of rules that we could never understand when it's convenient for the radical right agenda, and God acts just like a human would act, in a completely predictable fashion, when it's convenient for the radical right agenda. And what's convenient changes on a sentence-by-sentence basis. And if you call that out, you're woke.

[@dyanaprajna4556]

I need to get something off my chest. I don't have social media, so this seemed like a good place to post it. It's going to be a bit long, and I'm not concerned about likes and comments. I just have to say this. I'm 43 years old, and spent about 30 years of that as a Christian. I left that, tried a few others, and settled on Buddhism, which I have been for the last 11 years. After much thought, study, and self reflection, I've come to the decision that it's time to reject all religion. It's all bullshit. So here today, now, I formally reject all religion, and declare myself an atheist, which I guess I've kind of been headed toward anyway. It's just time to recognize reality. And that reality is all religion is made up nonsense with the sole purpose of control. Thank you for letting me vent. I feel a little better now.

[@playinragz8183]

So you got more foolish as you got older. Great

[@arrivagabry]

Welcome to my world just that it took you so long to get here. I figured it out way before you did. Why people need to worship some god I don't really know, maybe because they don't accept death and want to hope there is another life after. When it's over it's over.

[@outhousephilosophies3992]

I think what everyone overlooks that stoning for a slight against god ( perceived) is a form of sacrifice

[@dnaann1867]

Yes i indeed can and above all SHUD confirm that that thing has hereforth has bEen overlooked

[@JesusIsTheSaviour-hr7pj]

#JESUS FIRST The Lord Jesus Wants You In The Kingdom Of Heaven

[@FrozEnbyWolf150]

So are all the wars and genocides that people claim God ordered them to carry out. Not just in the Bible, but throughout history.

[@derekallen4568]

​@@JesusIsTheSaviour-hr7pjso does allah and brahma.

[@fredriksundberg4624]

​@@derekallen4568 But But But you're persecuting jesus saves now just because you're bringing up diffirent gods/deitys/concepts. Because of reasons. 😅😅😅😅😅😅😅😅

[@Marniwheeler]

But just because it literally states god demands human sacrafices doesnt mean god demands human sacrafices.

[@CarlosSanchez-dv1ew]

What ???

[@kellydalstok8900]

Sarcasm, right?

[@AdmiralBison]

Just realized the one thing similar between Atheists and fundamentalists is they/we both interpret the Bible more literally and not so wishy washy like liberal Christians. Sorry to bring up such a disturbing and uncomfortable observation. Fundamentalists are "solid" but brittle when hit with enough truth bombs, but when it comes to more liberal Christians it's like nailing jelly to a wall.

[@yak596]

😂 you tell em!

[@JesusIsTheSaviour-hr7pj]

#JESUS FIRST There Is No More Need For The Blood Of Goats Since Jesus Was The Sacrafice For You To Pass From Death To Life

[@laurajarrell6187]

Every time I read the bible, different versions, there were definitely parts that clarified the first thing coming out of the the womb. And it said in a couple places both animal and human. At least that was obvious to me reading it. I'm talking 40 years ago. Later both sons and daughters were given to the priests, as children, not babies. It angered me that girls were worth much less yet the mother was twice as 'unclean' after.👍💙💖🥰✌

[@hardermusic]

To the point of Dr. Kipp at the end - could this have been an "out" for parents who had a child with e.g. birth defects or that appeared really weak after the first week of life? "Well, they're supposed to be a sacrifice anyway, so..."

[@rhondah1587]

Sacrifices had to be perfect. Doubt any defects would be allowed. But I get your point.

[@ShadowPa1adin]

Kind of like how European folklore about "Changelings" was used by medieval parents to justify abandoning their unwanted special-needs children in the wilderness.

[@thomasneal9291]

maybe it's a mistranslation and it originally said "kid"... meaning goat behbee. I mean, really the entire religion schtick was invented just so some clown could con his tribe out of some free goat to BBQ.

[@thomasneal9291]

weird... I've been typing all night and just now noticed my handle has changed to my name plus a number instead... *sigh*

[@jamescaulfield6632]

I'm pretty sure it says sacrifice. It doesn't say sacrifice to the church. Or for the church So instead they try to special plead all of the bad in The Bible away. And this is just the prime example of that. When I went to church as a kid the preacher tried to say that God turned water into wine but it was non alcoholic wine. But that's not what the book says. And all I could think of is. Wouldn't that make it great juice? But it doesn't say grape juice it says wine And these are just some of the reasons why I'm an easiest today. And here they are trying to do the. Same thing here. Just food for thought.

[@Robert_Browne]

If I had a time machine I'd bring Jesus back and show him four hours of the 700 club and an hour of Fox news. Then we'd pick up an eight ball and hit the strip clubs.

[@kellydalstok8900]

There would probably be nothing to bring back.

[@Simon.the.Likeable]

Jesus could get you a whole ounce of the real devil's dandruff for free.

[@Robert_Browne]

@@covertgreen It's under weight and cut with baby powder. Forgive me.

[@JesusIsTheSaviour-hr7pj]

#JESUS FIRST i Had A Dream The Other Night As Well Of This Huge Portal Being Open To This Demon Speaking Through Artificial Intelligence

[@JesusIsTheSaviour-hr7pj]

#JESUS FIRST So The More Technology Advances The Closer It Get's To The Lord's Return Because Man And Woman's Desire To Aquire The Intelligence To Be Like God Will Be Just Like The Garden All Over Again

[@williamwilson6499]

Expert class in special pleading. John 3:16 settles the issue…it flatly states god sacrificed his so-called son to atone for sin. Child sacrifice.

[@resourcedragon]

The idea of sacrificing your first born* (goats, sheep, sons, cattle, etc) "to God" to get better "luck" in the future almost sounds like an early form of prosperity gospel. "Give me your munnies and God will give back tenfold" or somesuch. Funny how it seems to be the priests who ended up eating all the veal and lamb - on a nice barley bread bun, perhaps with ranch sauce? rather than God. * Don't forget your first-hatched!

[@alanhyland5697]

I was glad to see Dr. Kipp jump on to help out.

[@ushmush4074]

Someone let the woman speak!!!😊

[@RegebroRepairs]

I know human life was cheap back then, but every firstborn son? That would be a level of human sacrifice unheard of in any society, and I'm sure their neighbors would be appalled and any mention of Hebrews would mention this fact in horror. So I don't believe that actually happened, which makes it seem like the text is some sort of mistake. But Leviticus 27:27-29 is crystal clear. Humans can be devoted to god, and they can be devoted to destruction, and that means being put to death. Those verses make it ABSOLUTELY UNAMBIGUOUSLY CLEAR that human sacrifice is acceptable to Jahve.

[@DrKippDavis]

I think the issue here is in extrapolating directly from the text what happened in real life. As I mention in the video, this was almost certainly not universally practiced, but the text certainly makes clear provision for it, and it is practically impossible to read Exod 22:28-29 as anything but a declaration of this clear provision. Having said that, I don't believe that everyone sacrificed their first born sons, no. But, importantly, it is also worth pointing out that given the extremely high mortality rate for babies born to first-time mothers, even if everyone in this culture did in fact sacrifice their first-born sons, it would barely have made any difference in the survival rate of the tribes in the first place.

[@JesusIsTheSaviour-hr7pj]

#JESUS FIRST Jesus Still Pursues You No Matter Any Where You Are He Pursues You

[@RegebroRepairs]

@@JesusIsTheSaviour-hr7pj Shit! Where is he? Tell me so I can call the police. This Jesus guy sounds like a lunatic.

[@RegebroRepairs]

@@DrKippDavis It might not have made a difference for the tribe as a whole, but when you are likely to only have one or two sons live to adulthood, you don't intentionally sacrifice one of them. And of course in Ezekiel, this is recognized, and there God supposedly states he understands this is an unlivable command, but made it to prove a point. I'm wondering if it isn't a 9th century copying error or something. Why would the priests who wrote Exodus have put that in if it wasn't being followed and they didn't intend it to be followed? But yes, of course, that's not compatible with neither an all loving god, nor an infallible god. So it proves bible thumping lunatics wrong.

[@RegebroRepairs]

@@Peekaboo-Kitty That excuse is debunked in the video. And, as noted, in Ezekiel, God explicitly admits that this commandment is unlivable, and that he gave it to the Jews as punishment. Is the Bible wrong?

[@thomasneal9291]

The interpretation offered by Lorence is common, but ignores that god HAS asked his followers to quite literally sacrifice their children for him. Isaac for example.

[@thomasneal9291]

Genesis 22

[@thomasneal9291]

also... how is anybody going to be able to ignore that there is ZERO evidence for the entire book of Exodus? there were no "israelites" in slavery in Egypt at the time, and none ANYWHERE until hundreds of years after Exodus was supposed to have happened. It's like arguing about whether the specific types of owls in Harry Potter actually mean something.

[@ChixieMary]

The Levitical priesthood was not about recruiting new priests, that was a lineage. Aaron was the first in the line. Sacrifice was about giving up. Burning or destroying the sacrifice completely. Burned to ash. Blood or bone. The Law that decree all first born sons, is just that. The firstborn of anything and everything was about the god getting the first and best as APPEASEMENT! The children would be used in whatever way the priests decided. Keeping in mind the terrible fact of infant/child mortality in that era. 50+% mortality under 5. The children died before they could be sacrificed. 😓

[@thomasneal9291]

it's too bad they had to convert it from getting a free goat to BBQ to forcing people to give up their kids. Kids are not very tasty. wait, I mean the human kind of kid.

[@ChixieMary]

@@thomasneal9291 They probably also found it a convenient way to keep people from going right outside their front door and taking a dump, or throwing their garbage out where people were trying to have a picnic. Regulation of social interaction. People will be much more effectively controlled if you tell them that an almighty God is going to smite them. Otherwise, just other people yelling at them is not much of an incentive. 😎

[@backinblack03]

I find creationists and Bible thumpers fascinating. How are these a thing in this day and age and especially in the States!

[@EmeraldEyesEsoteric]

Why would GOD have had his son, immortal ruler of the universe, be born as a specific person of a particular ethnicity? That isn't fair to all the other cultures. Even if you don't think it's a problem, it makes a clear statement that God chose one culture to be superior to all the others. In that case, why did God even create the other cultures? So long as Christianity exists, there can only ever be war in this world.

[@PabloSanchez-qu6ib]

God doesn't sacrifice babies? If you think so you might try reading that bit about the Egyptian children.

[@thomasneal9291]

those weren't sacrifices, those were outright murders.

[@vincentcomeau7844]

@@thomasneal9291 gawd sacrificed these innocent children to himself for his glory.

[@thomasneal9291]

@@vincentcomeau7844 no, not at all. it literally was the murder of the firstborn of Egypt as a supposed punishment. for the enslavement of people that didn't exist at the time.

[@arrivagabry]

@@thomasneal9291 then he purposely hardens the heart of the farrow so he can kill more people. god loves human blood the younger the better.

[@Amoth_oth_ras_shash]

sorry but an instruction manual can have as many chapters of '' that previous thing you where told to do tots realy 'ment' this '' ....but that dont change what it explicitly said before aka sacrifice in the KILL x in the name of imaginary friend , when its written by DIFFERENT persons , unless jawhee comes down and shows some id to EVERY police force in the world declaring the first EARLIER instruction was rouge actions of someone in its name ,then sorry but the bible demands you to kill your first born in blood sacrefice to it. it was not its god or priests that changed , it was SOCIETY that developed morally becoming BETTER then the religion in question ''as it was before it started dominate the society''

[@jenniferfitzpatrick7939]

“Good loves dead babies” needs to be on merch

[@JamesRichardWiley]

In his own words the biblical god is not your friend. The god you call your friend is your own imagination.

[@M.Linoge]

I think the root of the child sacrifice comes from a more primitive time when our ancestors were hunted by large predators. if your family was caught out, some men threw their child at the predator to ensure his own survival. You can always have more children. Like the saying goes, you don't have to outrun the bear; you just need to outrun your friend. Of course, that wasn't universal, but probably enough for some tribes to start a culture around this mindset that you need to sacrifice your child to.... something, "the powers that be", which in primitive times, usually included animal spirits. You can see it reflected in the scape goat ritual. You send a goat out into the wilderness, so that "the powers that be" will kill the goat instead of you.

[@Vadjong]

The first pancake from the pan is for the dog. It gets shredded anyways while getting it unstuck.

[@17...20]

Lilith needed to bullet point her comments because she had to wait so long. Dang y'all!

[@PhilosoShysGameChannel]

So... Not a Bible expert here but we ARE into historical traditions of the common folk throughout the world and the relinquishment of every first son to God sounds an AWFUL lot like the classical Tibetan second son tradition... Where any and all second sons were to be sent off to monasteries. In highly religious cultures where the church is considered the stabilizing foundation under all of society, as was the Case for early Christianity and Buddhism, certain numbered children are basically already slated for a career in the clergy upon their birth. Providing them to the church to become one of the clergy was not seen as a drain on society because the church was considered the foundation holding civilization up.

[@PhilosoShysGameChannel]

This is not an excuse or justification, for the record... It just happens to actually be a somewhat regular theme in historical religious cultures

[@DrKippDavis]

"but we ARE into historical traditions of the common folk throughout the world and the relinquishment of every first son to God sounds an AWFUL lot like the classical Tibetan second son tradition..." The problem with this is what the text actually says in Exod 22:28-29: "You shall give Me the first-born among your sons. You shall do the same with your cattle and your flocks: seven days it shall remain with its mother; on the eighth day you shall give it to me." First, the mandate is the same for both first-born sons as it is for the first of the cattle and sheep-there is NO distinction made between what is to happen with all of them, and this makes the idea of "relinquishment" for service already strained. But then, second, the very fact that weening babies will not survive after eight days if removed from their mothers-as stipulated by the text-makes it abundantly clear that the first-born sons are to be offered as sacrifices, just like the first-born among cattle and sheep.

[@PhilosoShysGameChannel]

@rboland2173 of course it doesn't add up! Religious numbers never do! But that was the style of the time regardless! For every family that eagerly shoved their kids off to a life in the clergy for a bit of notoriety there was at least one parent rightfully guarding their children from being yoinked up. It doesn't stop the fact that there was a cultural norm of giving up your children to the clergy.

[@PhilosoShysGameChannel]

@@DrKippDavis we can accept this logic with the exception that the church was, by and large, the provider of things like orphanage services and such at the time as well... They would have had wetnurses available for unweaned infants for that reason first and foremost. (tragically these may have been fresh nuns or the like having joined to seek forgiveness for getting pregnant out of wedlock or some shit) To buddhism's credit we BELIEVE the age of being sent off to the clergy was like... 4 or 6 so we'll freely admit that this passage does NOT line up directly! We just wanted to point out the similarities across cultures throughout the world; the idea that sending any given numbered child off to the clergy universally at a certain age was not unheard of or even unusual in most highly religious societies

[@DrKippDavis]

@@PhilosoShysGameChannel what on earth are you talking about? The text in question-Exodus 22-was written hundreds of years before the existence of ANY "church." There is no evidence at all of the availability of "wet-nurses" for the purpose of caring for infants in the service of YHWH-NONE. You are making the mistake of a totally foreign cultural extrapolation back onto an entirely different point in history, a different region with dramatically different traditions. NO. We know of NO provisions being made for infants in this period.

[@thomasneal9291]

"Get in my Belly!" no?

[@tekbarrier]

Excellent video

[@derpypanda7]

My favorite comedian

[@suntzu6122]

There is no reason for this many people on a call. At the very least you need to take turns using something you hold to symbolize its your turn then virtually pass it.

[@Nebulax123]

I don't know about cattle and sheep but Tink our old grey cat thinks she is a minor God at least and we are here but to serve her.

[@thomasneal9291]

you know how to break that? red laser pointer. who is your god NOW, cat?

[@thomasneal9291]

seriously, if you have never tried it... do. most cats have a supernormal stimulus response to a red laser.

[@longcastle4863]

How could the priesthood possibly have been able to afford, feed, clothe and take care of an influx of first borns from every family in ancient Israel that would apparently be placed under their care in that particular interpretation of the verse? Wouldn’t that result in possibly hundreds of thousands, if not millions of babies, infants and children? What would they do with them all?

[@andyferari6478]

All of the Tests Abraham went through were in order to show how great Abraham is and how loyal he was to God Yitzhak was not meant to be sacrificed of course only God Knew that the end justifies the means

[@wildernesshikingandfishing9193]

On the eighth day, the Hebrews would circumcise their male children as a dedication to God

[@rye-bread5236]

I'm going through whole religious realization if you will. I was once Christian but a lot of your videos and what I've learned in college has changed my mind. Christian apologetics still has one argument that I can't seem to find issue with so I've settled for Deism. But I'd like to know your take on the argument? Its a variation of the Leibniz Cosmological Argument. I could summarize it and explain it in the comments if youd like or something else. I just want your take on it. Also i think this video answers the Kalam argument. There are other causes with equal probability of being true just like a god. (We have no idea what caused the big bang)

[@elibonham4388]

You gotta hand it to these people when christians say athiests dont read their bible i woukd doffer on that

[@JohnBrown722so]

I love this. Because you actually agree that God is not good and we've been lied to a lot of things. Tricked.

[@al4nmcintyre]

I love y'all but damn, sometimes you just need to let people finish making their point. I'll have to save this one to watch when I'm not frazzled.😉

[@amazonwater7778]

Human sacrifice was around the world. the Incas did human sacrifice young girls. They were coming for gold.

[@2ahdcat]

Theists! Sacrifice Your babies to us atheists (We like the meat) lol 😉

[@OpticonVeritas]

Genuine baby back ribs!

[@2ahdcat]

@@OpticonVeritas Fuck yeah! lol

[@jamesparson]

Show some respect. Some of use are vegetarian

[@2ahdcat]

@@jamesparson No-worries. We'll cook em in vegetables. We'll eat the meat, You can haz da veggies 😉

[@kellydalstok8900]

Probably not a good thing to joke about it, because the stupidest evangelicals already believe it.

[@carlanderson2468]

Only the descendents of Aaron were to become priest.

[@treykoyawena4443]

Yeah I’ve read the actual verse

[@ruleaus7664]

The Bible clearly forbids child sacrifice on numerous occasions in the Old Testament. You have to understand the difference between the Bible telling an account of an event and God condoning or forbidding it. For example, the first verse below clearly is God forbidding child sacrifice. The second verse tells an account of the Israelites disobeying God by committing child sacrifice. In the same way, you can express your moral stance about an action or tell an account of its occurrence. The two are not one and the same. Telling an account of an evil act or event is not the same as condoning it, and the Bible doesn't shy away from the former. The accounts of people's disobedience is included in the Bible for obvious reasons. Leviticus 18:21 - And thou shalt not let any of thy seed pass through the fire to Molech, neither shalt thou profane the name of thy God: I am the Lord. Jeremiah 32:35 - And they built the high places of Baal, which are in the valley of the son of Hinnom, to cause their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire unto Molech; which I commanded them not, neither came it into my mind, that they should do this abomination, to cause Judah to sin.

[@AronRa]

As was already explained by the panel, that was a reference to children being sacrificed to the wrong god.

[@ruleaus7664]

@@AronRa Sorry, I didn't watch much of the video. But my point was that God in the Bible doesn't condone sacrificing children to any god. It's condemned multiple times. What Abraham did with Isaac isn't condoning it, because God was in control and made sure he didn't actually do it. That was a test and also a foreshadowing of what Jesus would do for us as God's son. 2 Kings 21:6 - And he made his son pass through the fire, and observed times, and used enchantments, and dealt with familiar spirits and wizards: he wrought much wickedness in the sight of the Lord, to provoke him to anger. Proverbs 6:16-17 - These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood

[@AronRa]

@@ruleaus7664 As we explained in the video, the Bible god explicitly demands child sacrifice and there are other parts of the Bible that confirm thus interpretation.

[@ruleaus7664]

@@AronRa Maybe I'll listen to the video first before saying anything more except that I only read the KJV version as I believe that is the most accurate translation today. I'm not sure what translation you are using and how that might change the interpretation.

[@AronRa]

@@ruleaus7664 Every Bible scholar I've ever heard of, consistently had a low opinion of the King James Version as being among the least reliable and most politically embellished versions.

[@NubsWithGuns]

Circumstantial? Is that person for real? The rest of the bible is barely that and they thought it was the braniac thing to say? Furthermore give away an 8 day old baby to the church is ok also? That entire book is garbage when peoppe try and justify the crulest shit one can imagine.😅

[@00Skyfox]

So, if it was a sacrifice of firstborn sons, what happened when a mother gave birth to twins, triplets, octuplets, etc. and they were all boys? Did they sacrifice only the first one to fall out or were they chucking their kids into the bonfire like cordwood?

[@debatearchive]

Lets set up debate between you and Sam Shamoun on bible topic of your choosing.

[@kingalexandersgodshapedhol7514]

If you actually read this book, you will find God said Only Aaron's family decedent's could be priests. The first born were sacrificed. It's quite simple.

[@DrKippDavis]

Right, but this is also reading the text as a received whole. The text developed over longer periods of time, and the stipulation of exclusivity for the descendants of Aaron as priests is regarded by most scholars as a pro-Aaronic polemic that was intended to disenfranchise other priestly groups.

[@whatwecalllife7034]

Levites were the only ones supposed to be priests

[@DrKippDavis]

According to the Levites, yes. But then according to the "sons of Aaron," and then the "sons of Zadoq" it was only these groups that were sanctioned to be priests. There were in fact multiple priestly factions throughout Israel's history, and priestly polemics continued all the way until Herod's Temple was destroyed by the Romans.

[@whatwecalllife7034]

@@DrKippDavis interesting honestly I'm not surprised

[@thosethatcan]

4:50 w t f...🚫💩⚖️☕👎

[@arturopersenota]

yup; that's what happens when people connect Jesus to the OT - which is an unfortunate BS inherited from those who choose to write about this event several decades later than it happened. The authors of the NT - being Jews themselves and not being able to separate themselves from their 'laws' - misguidedly positions Jesus as the fulfillment of the invalid religion of the OT, not realizing that his message and him as the creator appearing among humans - taking on our human limitations and submitting himself to our will - was simply a demonstration of divine love for humanity that makes supreme philosophical sense! In this intervention we also received the guidance on how to reach our salvation (NOT done or performed for us by Jesus, but something we have to achieve with our lives): love your fellow human beings and reject selfishness. If one does this with their life, belief, belonging, heredity, loyalty to groups will not matter! This is what our evaluation is all about, and all the rest of the BS details can be safely ignored or publicly rejected.

[@ChipArgyle]

Sacrifice doesn't matter all that much if there's an afterlife and your kid goes to Heaven, right? Care to roll those dice? Death cults... it's best to avoid them.

[@TheDanEdwards]

Recommend people to read Prof. Stavrakopoulou's book (an edited version of her dissertation) on the subject.

[@DrKippDavis]

Stavrakopoukou's book is very good, but as I mentioned in the video Heath Dewrell has done the most recent work on this topic, and it is excellent.

[@alasdairwhyte6616]

more biblical apologetic bull

[@pjaworek6793]

Despicable. It's fine with me though as long as they pay taxes along with all the other selfish and bordering and historically criminal organizations.

[@thosethatcan]

DEICIDE 🎉😂... or Obituary also Tampa.. FL😊

[@maddyboombaddybaddy6532]

NAH 🤘🏻🤘🏻 GODFLESH

[@jamescaulfield6632]

And this kids is why there's so many different denominations of the same religion on earth because nobody can agree with the What the 500 year old book says. So instead we get all these interpretations that try to not make the book look bad. But it doesn't need your help because it doesn't all by itself. Because it gets nothing about reality right? And every story and it has been Proved wrong and the only place to fact check it is with it. Because there's no historical evidence anywhere else other than it. 2 back it. And well that's just not how evidence works. And the mental gymnastics that people will go through to defend it is just absolutely absurd. The hate and discrimination That they will spread in the name of their deity. I guess one sexual preference or because you don't agree with their ideology. Is absolutely. Absurd. If there is an evil in this world religion truly is it

[@aaronshropshire8552]

👍

[@kaudsiz]

👶🩸🗡👌😇 💀⚰️🪦🙌🙏 🤘☹️🖤

[@billwalton4571]

It’s Gods child so what’s the problem? He asked for it then but not now.

[@Mr11ESSE111]

God didn't demand that then writters of that bullshit stories which was paganic oriented and always wants some sacrifice , they must sacrifice themself then but it was easier with someone else or kids

[@fooladoo1076]

Are there any pictures of aron ra in high school i imgine him as eddy munson but 30 times hotter

[@vilikatavuki5518]

I don't believe God wanted children sacifices all because scientific inventions exist.

[@davidguf579]

Hey guys how should i contact AronRa for questions/ debate? very interested in contacting him if possible thanks. Im a religious jew who is also an atheist and agrees with evolution ofcourse as well as all other notions of science but my premise is "religion has a place in our lives at certain times" id like to talk very much i think think this could be very insightful as entertaining to others too, also like to talk about how christianity gets many of its roots from my religion that the vast majority of people christians inculded do not understand. Maybe even delve in modern antisemitism and the holocaust but id like very much to make my first points pudent to a public audience first this can be saved for another time entirely first.Thank you i really hope to hear back also im 25 not that old pls don't judge again thanks.

[@KianaWolf]

"Im a religious jew who is also an atheist" Please explain to me how you reconcile following a religion based on worshiping a god while also not believing in any god. I genuinely can't wrap my head around how anyone could rationalize that contradiction, unless you're operating on an incorrect definition of atheist.

[@jameswright...]

You can't be religious and atheist. There opposite sides of the fence. To be atheist is not to believe in god and by default religion. Religion is at no point useful as it's based on lies, lies never win out in the end.

[@thomasneal9291]

@@jameswright... "Please explain to me how you reconcile following a religion based on worshiping a god while also not believing in any god." believe it or not, atheist jews are not uncommon. I have had two as friends in my life. Judaism is more than a religion, it is a cultural tradition. Atheist jews tend to focus on the cultural tradition part.

[@jameswright...]

@@thomasneal9291 I know many atheist Jews but they are not religious and do not have god beliefs. They have culture and cultural practices. The op says religious and atheist a contradiction.

[@thomasneal9291]

@@jameswright... true. I'm not going to assume he's another atheist judaist by tradition, and let him explain himself.

[@DesGardius-me7gf]

Really, in the Bible, Yahweh considers sacrificing children to Moloch to be an abomination, not because it's about children being killed. Oh, nononononono... it's an abomination because it's not being done for him.

[@dewo277e9]

okay, show the bible passage where God says that.

[@thosethatcan]

Then came the 1970-80s.. 🎉 alter males became opposite of...🛐☦️@ 🎸⚡😂

[@reefermonster9651]

these are the rejects of society tho look at this bunch

[@doctorpicardnononono7469]

Iesus radit, sed solum crura !!!

[@thomasneal9291]

makes sense. why would he shave his face?

[@hjorvarthvalamir2182]

yahweh is a cacodemon.

[@IosifStalin2]

first!

[@LoveDoctorNL]

..born child

[@NikkiDocherty74]

I was raised Baptist. No one I know has ever done child sacrifice. Neither have I. Although I don't follow religion or Bible and I'm not religious or churched. Child sacrifice is abhorrent. I don't do any kind of sacrifice and can actually prosecute civil fraud regarding my parents and childrens rights quite easily if that's the going bullshit Also...Nikki Docherty is my name....trying to find out what is going on with my account.

[@angelamaryquitecontrary4609]

Well, if you haven't witnessed it, it can't have happened, then. Case closed, QED.

[@NikkiDocherty74]

For starters, there is no one named Angela or Mary who I know or who my children know. So, not sure who you are or why you commented....you could offer an explanation there. If someone is sacrificing anything where MY children are concerned, the case will NEVER be closed and I will visit destruction on anyone who tries. Whoever has been involved in online fraud toward me and my children Olivia and Katie Docherty....will be prosecuted by me in a civil court for fraud toward me and my children Olivia and Katie Docherty and their father my ex husband. We are not Biblical or religious.

[@angelamaryquitecontrary4609]

@@NikkiDocherty74 Sorry, I was being a smart - arse. Apologies for any offence caused.

[@NikkiDocherty74]

@@angelamaryquitecontrary4609 personally, I don't have involvement with ass. And I am an intelligent woman. I'm also, 5'1, petite, small, heterosexual. I'm a mother of 2 children (daughters). My ex husband is a local card and coin magician. I am a natural intuitive from birth. I see through everything all the time. Really no need for you to be a smart ass here.

[@trolljones4386]

This is why we are talking about the Bible which these stories are from a time over 3000 years ago when people actually did do child sacrifices on the regular. In terms of history child sacrifice really fell out of favor quite a while ago in the west so there hasn’t been a legal one for a good amount of time.

[@Firestorm12345678910]

God sure has some wonky salvation plan for mankind. The first Adam sins so instead of God having to solve the problem of sin god puts that particular metaphysical(?) burden on mankind in the form of animal sacrificing. This obviously does not work so God devises another plan creating Adam #2 (Jesus) maybe he will do a better job at this sin thing. Jesus dies and that sacrifice takes away ALL sins (or so it is claimed) of the world and that apparently also does not work (war, death, suffering in general still alive and well the last time I checked...). The main excuse appears to be that the Jesus sacrifice is some sort of half done job(?) and that the entire sacrifice for sins will be completed sometime later into the future. Messianic prophecies are cut in half with near time and end time explanations whenever it is convenient to explain away the obvious contradictions. I too for instance could find the Messiah in Moby Dick (hint: the whale is the messiah!). Running in parallel with the sin concept are the metaphysical heaven/hell places concepts. So again in the beginning God creates the afterlife places (these places are actually borrowed from other "pagan" religions and amalgamated into the Hebraic/Jewish/Christian etc religions ideas about the good/bad afterlife places). These places yet again do not work (god actually has some problems with the deities ruling such places for no reasons given) so then tasks Jesus (descending) to get folks out of such "dreary" places into either hell #2 or heaven #2. So the obvious question is what the hell was wrong with hell #1? and why re-create heaven when heaven itself (all seven layers of it or how many more there may be) is supposed to be perfect that all of creation supposed to aspire to? Irregardless of all these fantastical metaphysical things happening nothing congruent seems to be happening in reality in this plane of existence. The small religious sect that called themselves Christians (with their many borrowed and evolving and still evolving and still borrowing ideas about god, afterlife life etc) became the religion of an Empire (because people liked it due to various reasons such as putting slaves, servants on equal footing with everyone else because everyone now had immortal souls even if they ended up in renovated refurbished hell #2) and the rest is history.

[@alexf6206]

Read the whole chapter. It describes God holding back over, and over and over again before making the decision to finally take action against His people. Do you make followers based on lying about the content of the Bible? And we should want to be like you? Why when you are a deviever? You only read what will support your hatred of God and ignore any context to the contrary.

[@PresidentOfTheUSA]

Let us sing the heretic anthem.

[@BeStill-zy5ye]

What daaa hah. Atheist know there is a God the Bible says that. Think about it this way listen up folks.......a builder is a sign of a building and a painter is a sign of a painting 🖌️ Likewise, all of creation is sign of God. God told us upfront about creation in the very first book Genesis in chapter 1 haha. God is like listen up hardhead I'ma tell y'all this right away. And people still are acting up and deny Truth. So you need to trust in Jesus and repent from this silly stuff.

[@KianaWolf]

This doesn't logically follow. If a builder is a sign of a building, a painter a sign of a painting, the correct order would be 'a creator is a sign of a creation.' Except that doesn't work either, because how do you know someone is a builder or painter unless they can demonstrate that skill? Unless they can show you their stock of canvas and paint, how do you know they're a painter? And then there's the consideration of how a painter could possibly paint without a hand to hold the brush... So, show me your god, show me your god's hands, show me your god's tools, or admit that it's a faulty assertion.

[@2shedsplaysgames530]

your reasoning is critically flawed at base level, nobody here is going to "trust in jesus" because you said so. This is a projection on your part, we are not as gullible as you clearly are.

[@jameswright...]

I do not know a god exist and neither do you. You have faith which by definition means to believe without evidence and exclusive to religion. I'm atheist and reject faith. It's the worst way possible to truth as it's auto deceptive and leads to confirmation biased. Yes a painting needs a painter because it's created. We are not created but evolved, no life you see today is as was originally. Genisis gets the order of how earth light sun animals plants came to be proven by cosmology and physics. You mythical man can't even get his own facts about nature correct.

[@thomasneal9291]

"Atheist know there is a God the Bible says that" circular arguments are circular.

[@vincentcomeau7844]

"What daa hah"? Is that some weird code that us atheist are not privy to?

[@edgein8632]

Aron, how are doing? I know it was tough for you to take the beat down I gave you on evolution. I’m still laughing.

[@yellowdudeswarthy9303]

Looks like someones still mad they lost lol

[@yellowdudeswarthy9303]

Sounds more like youre still crying about losing lol

[@edgein8632]

@@yellowdudeswarthy9303 I know you are always on the losing end so you don’t understand what it looks like to “take a victory lap” and taunt your broken opponent but that’s what I’m doing.

[@yellowdudeswarthy9303]

@@edgein8632 lol you crying like a child is you taking a victory lap? Lol homie ive been dunking on you for days, this is like my 6th victory lap around you, you really need to catch up

[@yellowdudeswarthy9303]

@@edgein8632 doesnt know what its like to "taunt a broken opponent" lol yet here i am, taunting my broken opponent, the coward lisr who doesnt know anything about what hes talking about :3