What if 1960s F1 Cars Had Slicks? - Assetto Corsa Experiment

F1 cars from the 60s and earlier famously have hard grooved tires, but what if we mounted supersoft slicks from the 80s instead?
0:00 Intro
2:32 1967 Tire Hotlap
5:54 Slick Tire Hotlap
8:23 Final Thoughts

[@michaellorenson2997]

The tires of the 60s needed rock-hard rubber compounds, in order to cope with racing temperatures. This is also why tread grooves were necessary, even after the introduction of specialized rain tires. The grooves created FAR more tread surface area than any 'slick' could possibly have, though not all of it in contact with the road, obviously. But the combination of reduced contact patch area to generate heat, and dramatically more surface area for cooling, allowed the tires to survive well enough to work. Tire engineers were well aware that slicks would offer more dry grip, but had to wait for improved rubber compounds to make them viable.

[@astorMorisson]

thanks for the insight

[@johngalt97]

If cutting grooves managed to reduce total contact area, wouldn't the additional weight per area cause some extra heat? I'm sure there were many nuances to pushing the racing-tire making envelope with the technology they had.

[@michaellorenson2997]

@@johngalt97 Yep, there are always nuances in tire design, no question. They had to balance the amount of rubber in contact with the road and generating heat, the amount of surface cooling area, the total mass of rubber available to absorb and dissipate overall heat (affects rate of overall temperature rise and fall), and tread stability, just to name the most proximate variables. Fun Fact: There were major tire wars in the 1960s, involving companies like Avon, Dunlop, Firestone, and Goodyear. Bruce McLaren, Jim Hall (Chaparral), Dan Gurney, and others used tire testing contracts to help fund their teams. It was perfect; they tested and developed their cars while being paid to test free tires!

[@michaellorenson2997]

@@johngalt97 BTW, I read Atlas Shrugged four times, cover to cover.

[@henrysal69]

I read that they cut the grooves in because they believed that the shear forces generated grip - is this untrue?

[@canon1753]

Jim Clark ran 1963 on 1 set of Dunlops except for the last race, where they went to a new set, just to be careful... (Doug Nye)

[@GPLaps]

Very interesting, thanks for sharing. Crazy sounding with a modern mind!

[@Kacper_Kolodziejczyk]

The only thing about 1963 vs 1967 is the fact they ran 1.5l engines with a far lower power output until they relaxed the regs for 1966, I'd say that helped him manage that feat, still very interesting

[@RalonsoF1]

@@GPLaps Yes, indeed!

[@duckheadgaming]

What really? Amazing!

[@hjvggdvjbnb9509]

@@Kacper_Kolodziejczyk seeing how calm Clark's driving approach always was (from what I've seen), I'd say Jim himself also made a difference in that regard

[@ianhowlett4682]

Watching this historical Monaco track, I can see how Monaco used to make sense back in the day for an F1 race.

[@biketech60]

Yes, much better looking track back then . Cars got so much faster the track became dangerous .F1 should reign in cost , eliminate wings & "software" .

[@Nereosis16]

@@biketech60 "eliminate wings and software" umm no why the hell would you do that. The cars would be crap and the whole point of being 'formila one' would be gone

[@Mi6AgentSavileMBE.]

@@biketech60 I get your point and agree somewhat. The money aspect has turned me away from F1. Great brains, passion and bravery made it what it was, now it's corporate psychology with science and technology. I have no time for F1 at all now. This video is more entertaining than modern F1 by far, imo.

[@verscy8726]

@@Nereosis16 itd be better of everything wasnt about money, i enjoy how it is now but i find it ridiculous to have to pay millions despite being extremely tallent to get into f1, f2, f3.

[@ebob4177]

Just look at how "racier" Formula E is at Monaco. No wonder Monaco became legendary. Imagine racing in 10 Sepang-width circuits and then going to one much narrower, like Nurburgring for example.

[@macordior]

Again another true testament of how great those drivers in the 50s and 60s were :-)

[@Kurosaka]

Fr Idk how they drove those 130 mph death coffins

[@legm5298]

@@Kurosaka No common sense and MASSIVE BALLS

[@matthewrabel5035]

@@legm5298 That's how they kept above the weight limit

[@TestarossaF110]

Literally/Physically impossible to compare, so don't compare em... that's an insult to any F1 driver ever, those of the 1950's and those of the 2020's. Yes respect them but simply don't compare em.

[@marvintpandroid2213]

And how fragile they were and how many people they killed.

[@flush972]

In the sixties those mirrors was made to make the pilot always remember how the exhaust system was a piece of art

[@jr-qj6xw]

Logically, the next video is a Lotus 98T with Firestone bias-ply tires. Awesome vid, sir!

[@SOIBand]

My god this will be pure pain :D

[@tomanderson6335]

Jake: "Hello, Kunos? I'd like your entire stock of wheelspin."

[@keeganfennec8514]

It would wheelspin up to 300 kmh

[@Skydrag.V60]

Oh no

[@david_pana]

Now I wanna see a modern F1 car riding on 60's tires...

[@ErikGPL]

Really cool, also made me realise how much the older tyres contribute to the look of the car. I wonder how it would drive with all Tyrell P34 tyres haha... (the small front ones.)

[@GPLaps]

I actually really like the look of it, maybe im not alone?

[@yhaustein38]

@@GPLaps You're definitely not. It looks meaner than before, I like that look a lot.

[@psicogames5509]

@@GPLaps i love the original look, but with these tyres the car looks anger

[@EddieOtool]

A car from the 60s with tires from the future? S(l)ick.

[@sule.A]

Underated ony 6 likes

[@timford3599]

1960's & 1970's the true "Golden Era" for F1. The sound of that Cooper is intoxicating. Great Video, just found your channel & immediately subscribed. Thank you & keep up the good work!

[@mooreanonumbers]

Interesting experiment. I'm glad you're making more Assetto vids. It has so many great historic mods nowadays. Loving the old Ste Devote with the crazy late apex btw.

[@daren42]

Important work has been done here. I thank you for your efforts.

[@jeffro5032]

@GPlaps ; I gotta say , I had never seen this channel until just a few days ago. And after watching a good dozen of your videos , I really , really enjoy your channel. Especially the history on the West Bro's in GP legends. I have learned quite a bit with your channel , and very much appreciate your content. Thank you.

[@tradesman1000]

Great stuff mate 👍🏻 really enjoying your content.

[@Markos681]

Brilliant video !!! I really love this type of experiment because, and this is a purely personal opinion, it is how you can really compare such different times and techniques. Please CONTINUE MAKING MORE OF THESE VIDEOS !!!! Greetings from Argentina!

[@bobmcl2406]

Off-the-wall stuff like this is one of the big attractions of sim racing for me. Thanks for making the effort to try this mod. I'd like to hear what was involved in editing the files to make this work, or maybe you could point us to some good tutorials on the physics side of modding.

[@TenorCantusFirmus]

Pole times were back then around 1:27, with fastest race laps being around two seconds slower. 1:23 is an absolutely impressive improvement, but even in 2001, when the "tyre war" between Bridgestone and Michelin was beginning, lap records happen to be broken after almost a decade.

[@joshanemunro]

Awesome video mate. NICE👌👌👍👍

[@gseric4721]

That's an insane difference there. That's literally insane.

[@i0like0water]

Your lap commentaries are so enthusiastic!

[@sebastianwlazlak8042]

Wow what a pumped up version of monaco and the car. Looks amazing

[@fredscratchet1355]

That's amazing I thought there might be a couple of seconds in it.

[@OneLiterPeter]

Same here, I guessed that it would be around 2 seconds.

[@davesouthword1298]

I think the real gap would be 6-7 seconds because he wasn’t committed on the Firestones (2nd gear through Casino Square etc) - should be a 1:30 ish vs 1:24

[@mbgmadbull1141]

Fun fact about this experiment. You can fit the lotus 49 with slicks in project CARS for a similar type of experiment.

[@jimhunter4999]

Hey, this was a cool presentation.

[@s4cells4cell7]

Kurasawa tried for best motoring an old skyline gtr of the 60s with nowdays slick tyres. He said that the stiff tyres wall and the grip offered overwhelm the chassis balance and introducing shake oscillation that the chassis cannot damp.

[@Lancista]

*"Only the lightiest mistake and you will meet the Creator" - Juan Manuel Fangio. 1950 - 1960 is the deadliest Era in the motorsport history! In that decade 58 world class drivers lost thier lifes driving this exact machines ...*

[@clayjee]

Love the experiment! Brave enough to go the opposite direction and throw the '50s tires on?

[@OdrikT800]

or maybe throw slicks on a 50s era car on.

[@seamusmckeon9109]

Or bicycle tires on modern f1 car

[@bernardjazz6344]

Or the tyres from the Honda Racing Mower?

[@rogergavind6279]

Wow, they change the look of the car a lot more than I imagined

[@Deathss81]

Listen to this special engine sound. Wow!

[@Bzking23]

Very interesting experiment, I wouldn't mind seeing more projects like this!

[@Tom-zc9gs]

That's a really cool test, that kinda explains why they usually bolt on wet tyres for drivers who are unaccustomed to driving F1 cars for private runs. Grooved tyres tend to have a bit more slip angle, depending also on the construction and overall stiffness/softness, while slicks have definitely more grip but can't take as much slip before they stop gripping and send you in the wall. Definitely requires a totally different sensibility, and a different engineering approach for the car as well.

[@elikedrowski6181]

They're also the softest compound which helps the average driver get some heat into them. A normal person won't push hard enough to heat up a set of slicks

[@RalonsoF1]

Extremely interesting! 👍👍👍

[@fillman86]

cool video, buy if you are using something like OBS to record, then you can record your mic separate from the game audio on separate tracks like I do. That way in the editor you can turn down the cockpit volume, and we'd be able to hear you clearer :)

[@POCKETofTROLLS]

That was awesome!

[@MrStabby19812]

I'd like to see the same with the Auto Union type D

[@SALEENS7GTR5]

Not at all surprised at the results, as people will spend thousands of dollars on suspension and aero-mods for track day cars, before realizing a change in tire-compound will shave equal to or more seconds off a lap compared to any other mod (perhaps besides weight reduction.) Tires the most important part of a car for sure.

[@leo1fun]

Lovely content.

[@danielsgrunge]

What about modern cars with those thin motorcycle-like tyres

[@billr8667]

Imagine what the 1923 cars would do with decent tires? :)

[@1mariomaniac]

Heh, an Auto Union Type D with modern racing slicks would be something.

[@glennwiebe5128]

@@1mariomaniac my favourite car!

[@claywoolcock3034]

This is what modern F1 needs to be. Soft slicks, no aero at all, four wheeled MotoGP. Imagine the racing!

[@thenewmedic]

And shorter races, 45 min like MotoGp too.

[@jonlawrence6338]

So like karting then?

[@claywoolcock3034]

@@jonlawrence6338 I guess sort of. More like a high powered formula Ford - no wings. FFord always has spectacular, close racing, with slipstreaming battles everywhere. That would be great F1. Slower than now, but better

[@RhodokTribesman]

@@claywoolcock3034 F1 NOT being the fastest machines in the world would be very disappointing

[@JURacing]

Great experiment. I always wondered how different these Avon retro-tires are, that are used on cars like this today

[@PiousMoltar]

Love these sort of vids. Now do an old car with modern wings 😅

[@DELIGHTFULDORITO]

Super cool!

[@gerdhaase5413]

Seems to be realistic. Good video.

[@SOIBand]

Very cool, I often thought about it haha.

[@sch3ffel]

1960 F1 with slicks would be insane fun to drive in an oval like Daytona or Talladega... in a sim of course... irl would be suicidal at least because of yes levels of grip and no downforce whatsoever. not to mention the amazing fireworks of exploding tyres on the first lap.

[@xTaRiizZ]

very nice video

[@alpha007org]

Do a reverse: Modern Car (2007 McLaren is still considered modern?) with 1980 tires.

[@zacharyclarke4240]

1980 is late enough that they had soft compound slicks not too different than what are on the 2007 mclaren car

[@alpha007org]

@@zacharyclarke4240 I know. I researched before I posted that's why I posted those years. And because of the fact that after 197X they introduced slicks, I think it would be a cool experiment to see how they progressed.

[@BansheeNT-D]

The F1 cars from the 60's looks absolut fantastic.

[@DSG-br5lk]

I imagine, in real life, the Lotus would have folded up its A-arms in turn 1

[@antispeed]

I wonder if it would feel better if you cranked the suspension stiffness up.

[@KrazyKanucker]

Good idea. 25% less width in tires might be closer to ideal.

[@Villoresi]

Makes me wonder just how many places you'd get air at the 'Ring with this kind of a setup. Jeez, that would be scary. I'm not sure you'd even want to use the concrete, lower portion of the Karussel in that scenario. And yeah, I wonder how the proportional difference would be to lap time if you went to a higher-speed circuit. I mean, it wasn't just Station Hairpin, Ste. Devote and Massenet were decidedly quicker as well.

[@gucketjug]

how did you get this done? i would love to try it (it just seems so interesting!) would there be a link to where i could get this? or if i can just modify a car myself or something

[@Raven86_]

any setup wizards wana tame this beast ?

[@calaiscruiser]

Would you be happy to make this car with slicks available to download?

[@MichaelRoma91]

I read in road and track where they test drove a lotus 49 around COTA and it mentioned if they used racing slicks or even very soft tires the suspension arms would be ripped off

[@GPLaps]

I wouldnt doubt it. I cut out many a highspeed over-correction into the walls here. With the high-grip slicks when you move the wheel quickly the car immediately darts in that direction instead of initiating a slide as it does with the normal tires. I bet that would damage if not destroy the suspension in real life!

[@copisetic1104]

I’m surprised the suspension would take the forces of the slicks

[@EddieOtool]

Can we appreciate for a moment how big of a performance gap there is between cars from 1967 and 1988, when compared to 2000 and 2020? What if regulation changes had not been nerfing cars performance continuously for the past 20 years...

[@1mariomaniac]

*TL;DR: No* We'd quickly run into the issue of human tolerance. Fictional cars like the red bull X2010 and SRT Tomahawk are great examples. Both cars could actually be constructed and raced but due to the fact that these cars are freaking insane it simply won't happen. The cars use advanced aerodynamics and/or immense downforce to achieve outright ridiculous lateral G's, so much so that drivers would need to wear G suits like bomber pilots. Not only that but both of these cars have outrageous power figures, meaning ludicrous acceleration and speed. To match said speed there must be incredible braking force. Both the acceleration and deceleration would put torturous strain on drivers after a long time. This isn't even taking into account the fact that on tight/technical courses like the Nurburgring GP and Nordschleife the drivers would hardly be able to react to what's ahead of them and what the car is doing, and if something were to go wrong, a collision would most assuredly be fatal. These cars (at least in the real world) could not be driven by human hands, they're simply too dangerous.

[@EddieOtool]

@@1mariomaniac I was told that when they created the first train, they did extensive studies to try and evaluate whether the human body could withstand speeds in excess of... 50km/h. Now, we have spatial shuttles. I think the limit of what is "impossible" is harder to determine than we think, and seems to be always further away than what seems reasonable. In sports, many records were thought to be lasting forever; alas they've been beaten. I think the true limit of the human mind and body has yet to be seen. Dangerous, yes; impossible... that remains to be proven IMHO.

[@Gustinelli]

I missed the option to have this car avaible for download, would be cool to try it.

[@jeremychambers7861]

Are there any decent track packs out there for AC F1 1960's?

[@jorgebecerra4102]

The old Monaco is great. 😀👌

[@ThePoison38]

Have 1 race a year where they put Modern F1 cars on bias ply tires. Would be quite the show!

[@C.I...]

Take the wings off too.

[@blazethefox1621]

wasnt that turkey this year?

[@C.I...]

@@blazethefox1621 It was my favourite one this year - simply because the cars actually moved around for once.

[@blazethefox1621]

@@C.I... can't argue there. certainly the most exciting race weekend in recent years lol

[@Sn0w_Official]

@@blazethefox1621 Yeah, unless you were lewis hamilton where your worn intermediates became your soft slicks for the whole of the race as it dried up while everyone changed tires.

[@luigisergi3469]

Try again but in a fast circuit like monza to see if the larger section makes a difference in air resistance

[@christopherward5065]

Brilliant. Though I think some of these cars used to be airborne on certain sections.

[@zincfive]

This is cool, Try a faster track like SPA...

[@benjaminanibalmanzoni3655]

El mejor espectáculo de la historia de la F1. Los autos de los sesenta, simples y hermosos. Jim Clark en su Lotus Cosworth, Jack Brabham en su Brabham Repco, Jean Pierre Beltoise en su Matra... El mejor ruido, la mejor competencia... El piloto era el 70% y el auto 30%; no como ahora que los autos corren solos...

[@cmbaileytstc]

Where did you get the track?

[@piccolo398]

Yeah I’ve got all season 235 wide tires on my 2020 mustang gt and in the spring I’m putting on a staggered set of rims wearing summer tires with 285 in the front and 305 in the rear I expect it to feel like this lamo!

[@sennasenna6023]

how do you put ddifferent tyres on cars?

[@andrieslouw6588]

I'd love to see this done in real life

[@dadjokes8963]

remember no heroics into sainte devote

[@cyberleone00]

Hey GPLaps will this be available for download, I'd love to take this for a spin or a full race with a field

[@GPLaps]

I'm not sure. I didn't create the original Cooper or the tires from the Mp4, so I am not sure its mine to share. I also have very little idea what I'm doing when modding so it might just add to the heap of poorly done content out there.

[@vins8819]

How to add slicks tires on old open wheels car ?? I want to try this !!! 😍

[@timonsolus]

This experiment would have been more interesting for me if you had used slick tyres from 1971 or 1972 - the first slick tyres used in F1. That would be only 4-5 years later from 1967, instead of 20-21 years later - so far more 'historically plausible' for the period.

[@joel.ew10a]

Is there any way to get this "mod"? Looks awesome to drive

[@Madhuntr]

i noticed that with the old tires you barely went over 9k rpm. and with the slicks you went easily up and over 10k rpm . Was that intentional or is it just not possible to put get it up on the old tires.

[@edwardburek1717]

Am I right in thinking that the 60's tyres were Firestone?

[@Chatta-Ortega]

I hate that tire wear is such a critical element in today's F1. I'd be happy if they did one set of tires per race like they did when I first started watching F1 in the 90s.

[@Ansiedade20]

please do an "what if f1 2000's cars had slicks?"

[@zrspangle]

See Nando's test at Abu Dhabi

[@Thunnini_Tom]

What about 2020 Pirelli soft tires on a lotus 98t

[@DimZ_F1]

The main question here is this: would a 1967 car create the necessary downforce levels to generate enough heat in the 1988 tyres? Because the tyre is indeed better all around, but only when it is used in it's ideal temperature window. Otherwise it will be like ice skating. Interesting experiment nonetheless.

[@1mariomaniac]

No. These cars weren't built with downforce in mind so they probably don't make much if any downforce. However their sheer power would probably be enough to get the tires up to temp. eventually.

[@tomtd]

Steel discs? Add some carbon. . Sequential box also possible even then. Modern dampers? Don’t do yourself down Incidentally I think you’re pretty quick

[@zacharyclarke4240]

possible to download the mod to try for ourselves?

[@hybridAbsol]

Why cant Asetto let us select which ever tyres we want for all car instead of going into modding

[@andrieslouw6588]

I'd imagine the rear tire would be on fire and the front cold.

[@gamerzone0764]

Do the same car with pirelli hypersofts, it would be ridiculous.

[@sugarnads]

I suspect suspension components might start breaking...

[@00Donkey00]

Is this a mod? How can I do this?

[@Barry843]

Hook a brotha up lol . Make it available for download so we can all see what it feels like . It looks like it would b more enjoyable to drive . Just a thought . . .

[@69sifu]

What's the name of this video game ?

[@chuckdraper7776]

Finishing order: 1) Bell 2) Bivens 3) Devoe

[@mvfc7637]

When did F1 teams migrate to slicks??

[@connorhoffmann7988]

Now try modern F1 cars with older tires

[@topfrag612]

tutorial?

[@SLYDIT]

I don't think a non down force single seater could heat up slicks enough in the real world

[@gold333]

Those rear slicks are not 415mm from the 80’s. They look like 360mm slicks used from 1993 to 1997. They look narrow.

[@RevoltingRudi]

wait they have the cooper and Monaco 67 in AC? since when?

[@davesouthword1298]

AC was built to be modded so you can get all sorts on the community - some good, some bad.

[@1mariomaniac]

@@davesouthword1298 yep. You can get a lot of neat historical versions like this too which I love.

[@lolshark99b49]

Well, I expected it to be faster, but not THAT much faster

[@frantiseklupinek6189]

I dont think you would ever heat up those tyres without having wings.