Jim Ross shoots on Ric Flair leaving WCW AS CHAMPION

[@justafanofnerdculture7602]

I still get chills today when I think of or see Bobby Heenan holding the big gold belt on WWF TV. Very, very surreal.

[@mmabuff101]

I was born 10 years too late to understand the significance of it

[@PontFlair]

It was one of the craziest moments in pro wrestling history. It was not only that it was Flair, it was seeing the big gold belt, the NWA belt, on WWF TV. Unless you were a smart mark, in the know, it was RIDICULOUS to see that. The only thing that could've compared would be Hogan showing up in wCw w/ the Winged Eagle belt.

[@brianholt-ic2jx]

one of my favorite moments ever!

[@nealfeldpausch715]

As a kid this was crazy when he shows up in WWE with the big gold belt.

[@CraigSmithII]

I was shocked when he showed & I thought we were gonna have the long overdue Hogan vs.Flair match at WM but from what was told depending on who you believed, when these 2 wrestled at the house shows, they didn't draw well. Luckily we got one of the Greatest Royal Rumbles ever because of Flair & a damn good WWF Championship match at WM8 against Randy Savage

[@PontFlair]

As a kid, I said "how does The Brain (R.I.P.) have the NWA belt in WWF?!? How??" Then Ric Flair popped up w/ it and I'm still like "how'd the NWA belt get on WWF Saturday morning TV?!!?"

[@PontFlair]

@@CraigSmithII neither wanted to "job" for the other. Ego stopped us from having the main event of the CENTURY

[@Padge112]

@@CraigSmithII Imagine that? I'd give my left bollock to watch them two go at it in their prime. But hey ho I had the attitude era at least, you have to be in a Taker entrance to truly feel it.

[@period8705]

I remember when Flair first showed up on WWF television with the big gold belt I thought I was going crazy. Then the next couple of weeks the blurred it out so I didn't know what I saw. Very confusing for a child.

[@Daniel-hn7nd]

Remembering when Larry Zbyszko won the vacant AWA Heavyweight Championship of the World in the 1989 battle royal on ESPN. Larry was awarded Greg Gagne's AWA International Television Championship because Jerry Lawler did not return the AWA title belt. In an interesting side note: Larry also left the NWA, taking a championship belt with him. The Western States Heritage Heavyweight Wrestling Championship.

[@williamthomas5215]

I think as a kid watching WWF and seeing Ric Flair it was cool, but as an adult seeing Flair in WWF with the belt is just so awesome

[@Bryan8329]

He had some classic moments in that run. The Rumble being the tip top.

[@Goldnfoxx]

I get that from a business standpoint, the situation would look bad to guys on the inside. But as a fan, I'm glad it happened. That ending segment where Bobby Heenan is suddenly standing there with the Big Gold Belt was easily one of the best surprises (out of nowhere), and best overall things to happen in 1991. That was a BIG momeent.

[@MrDagosti]

Conrad was "falling over the edge into Shitland", until he released this good longer video with JR, without bad editing in his loan company every few minutes. : )

[@joemamaluke]

What's he supposed to do? Pay all these washups loads of money for free? He needs to pay bills so fans like u and I can enjoy hearing these stories

[@Matt-cr4vv]

Wash ups? Most of the guys on these podcasts are some legends of the business. Many are even still involved. Woof what a take.

[@ryblack5032]

15 Year Old ME was Marking Out Bigtime when Bobby The Brain Heenan Showed the Big Gold Belt at The End Of Wrestling Challenge in 1991! Hearing Bobby Say Ric Flair is coming to the WWF as He was Holding The WCW Championship was Surreal!!!!

[@PontFlair]

It was one of the craziest moments in Pro Wrestling history. To see the NWA Title on WWF Saturday morning TV was INSANITY!! And then, as a kid, I thought "if the NWA Title is in WWF, then that means wCw has NO BELT". And that thought was a WHOA moment.

[@PontFlair]

It makes your company look like a JOKE when your belt shows up on somebody else's tv. Difference here is it wasn't a lower tier belt or a woman's belt. IT WAS THE NWA BELT!! wCw looked MEGA ULTRA FOOLISH!! Clown college!! Not only did it happen, but then they had to makeshift a belt that they couldn't even show us on TV. wCw ate SHIT on this one. To F around RIC FLAIR, and he takes a belt HE PAID FOR to WWF, puts it on TV AND has a great run in WWF TOO?? Yea wCw shit right on the bed linens!! They really, truly, NEVER overcame this event

[@lloydsharpe7641]

Flair showing up with that big badass gold belt and calling himself the "Real World Champion was the coolest thing that WWF ever did. I loved the old NWA and never watched WWF until Flair went there.

[@filomenasantos676]

That royal rumble when he won the strap was awesome

[@ChaddMichael]

I love everything about everything Conrad does. He’s an inspiration honestly. I am getting a lil worried about him and his weight tho. Seems like he’s getting bigger. I know he’s getting older. I just worry about him. And I hope if he sees this, he isn’t offended.

[@toomuch9762]

Ya the way he’s going he probably has ten years tops

[@CuteLesbo69]

Unless you type this up in a Cracker Barrel menu he won't see it.

[@prestonbaldwin796]

He’s ric flair son in law. He doing ok. I like how he made his own name and niche in professional wrestling thou

[@ChaddMichael]

@@prestonbaldwin796me too. But what’s that have to do with him being fat? Being Ric flairs relative doesn’t make him automatically healthy. They ain’t blood

[@andrewjones3295]

I'll never forget being a 13 year old kid and at the end of WWF Wrestling Challenge seeing Heenan with the big gold. It was unreal

[@stephanielopez6275]

I loved the big gold belt so much. Easily my favorite title belt ever!

[@nealfeldpausch715]

The big gold belt is my favorite from nwa\wcw and the gold winged Eagle belt from the wwe.

[@stephanielopez6275]

@@nealfeldpausch715 In WWF my favorite was the old school Intercontinental belt from the early 90s.

[@nealfeldpausch715]

@@stephanielopez6275 I must agree again. The belt honky tonk and warrior had. Yes!!!

[@Mongo42089]

WWF Undisputed Title for me, but the BGB is a very close second.

[@taylorscrews2284]

The big gold belt just seemed like a big dawg belt. It commanded attention.

[@azapro911]

Say what you will about WWF creative in those days, they played it well by having Flair bring the actual WCW belt with him, then pairing him with Heenan and Perfect.

[@pulsarstargrave256]

UPDATE The discussion got off track a little. Flair was prepared to drop the belt as he did for Sting in 90! This time to Windham or Sting again but he wanted his contract nailed down first! When Flair was fired he insisted on the return of his deposit which was $30,000 plus interest and Herd refused; that's how the NWA\WCW belt appeared on WWF television!

[@billybadass3056]

"you're using logic and reason in concern with wcw booking during the early 90's and this is why you're *confused* "

[@chadk890]

I would take 1991 WCW over 3 hours of RAW anyday

[@philipbolin6776]

@@chadk890 lol ok enjoy robocop and oz🙄

[@maxxdahl6062]

@@philipbolin6776 That wasn't 1991. lol

[@philipbolin6776]

@@maxxdahl6062 lol so 90, one year off of robocop, but oz was near then if not later, so it sucked that period, better? 🙄

[@maxxdahl6062]

@@philipbolin6776 Not really. Oz was on the undercard where you'd forget about him 2 seconds after he's off screen.

[@SSJ2Phenom]

I remember that "Big Gold Belt" was and still is my absolute favorite championship belt in wrestling history. I have a replica of that one with the light brown leather. It just makes the gold pop even more. Love it. Still think WWF dropped the ball with Flair vs Hogan at Mania. If I had a time machine that'd be the first thing that I'd change.

[@IrishCarney]

I totally agree with wanting to rectify the mishandling of Flair's arrival. Vince threw Flair almost right away into house-show dark matches with Hogan to test audience reaction which was lukewarm, and then canceled the Hogan-Flair main event for WM8 as a result. But this was a wasted opportunity that could have been better taken advantage of with proper planning and patience. WWF had the ability to competently lay down and follow a long-term plan, never better shown than in the WM4 to WM5 Hogan-Savage era. That was a full year, and more when you count the preceding Hogan-André feud and the following SummerSlam etc. The problem WWF had to solve was that, despite years of hype in the independent wrestling magazines and among NWA/WCW fans for a Hogan-Flair “dream match”, many WWF fans, and (outside the South) most non-wrestling fans, had NO IDEA who Ric Flair was. Furthermore, they had been trained by years of WWF programming to regard only huge men as credible contenders for the world championship - either musclemen like Hogan, or fat/tall giants like André. To solve this WWF had to do the following: *Show Flair as an arguably equal world champion.* Abandon (at least in this case) its policy of refusing to acknowledge the existence of other promotions and the pre-WWF history of newly-arrived talent. Flair needed to be portrayed, not merely as a “self-proclaimed” champion toting a random belt, but as a legitimate claimant to the title. It was crucial that not just Heenan or other heel voices, but the babyface announcers and even WWF officials, explicitly state that Flair had wrestled successfully all over the world, had won a non-WWF world championship, and that Hogan not having yet faced him had been an asterisk in his claim to be the undisputed champion. *Show Flair as a legitimate threat in the ring against bigger men.* Require Flair to drop his partying lifestyle (though not necessarily in kayfabe) and fully commit to an all-encompassing, grueling regime like that followed by Ultimate Warrior or Lex Luger, designed to shed flab and add as much muscularity and definition as possible. While Flair would never be remotely as impressive as those men or Hogan, due to height and age as well as genetics, the gap needed to be narrowed from the vast chasm it was to something more manageable, with Flair being pushed to the physical maximum his body could achieve. Then *portray Flair as specializing in defeating bigger men.* Show him, again and again, beating big guys, including jobbers, but also big guys like Rick Martel, Dino Bravo, Warlord, Hercules, maybe Paul Orndorff, Davey Boy Smith, etc. This would be part of Flair chasing Hogan for the title. Protect’s Hogan’s image as a fighting champion by having Hogan accepting Flair’s challenges but then be frustrated by WWF authorities (kayfabe) refusing to allow it or recognize Flair’s championship or even contender status and demanding that Flair work his way up as if he were a rookie. By having Hogan argue and vouch for Flair’s status in vignettes and promos, this would also give Flair credibility to the WWF-only fans, “sprinkling Hulk dust” on him. *Have Flair’s bag of tricks* that never worked in NWA/WCW (such as flipping over the turnbuckle and running along the apron to jump up on another one and down onto his opponent) *succeed hugely in WWF* with the announcers acknowledging that he’d used it outside WWF and that WWF wrestlers needed to do their homework and be ready for him. That way, when he tries it against Hogan in the WM main event, it would cause a huge pop when it finally failed because Hogan had prepared.

[@somescumbag]

that's cuz u a loser

[@randallwells9800]

Boy...... I really miss The Big Gold Belt...... WWE should have never replaced it... so much history and memories shot to hell.......Slick Ric made that belt what it was....and the wrestlers who won it knew what a holy grail it was.Wrestling has not and will never be what it was , until it realizes that to move forward , you have to go back.......

[@tafariali-alkebulan3325]

Flair going over to WWF with Big Gold was the moment NWA/WCW lost the 80s wrestling "war". Flair winning the rumble for the WWF title is the moment the WWF title became THE world title on this side of the globe, kayfabe and shoot. This was the real moment a wrestler became the undisputed champion of American wrestling historically speaking, way before Jericho beat "austin and rock in one night".

[@hubertgreen]

Think wwf got the no 1 wrestling company at wrestlemania 1 and cemented it on wrestlemania 3. But sure was a big event when the current wcw champ came to wwf. Think wwf could made it even bigger.

[@franciscouch8378]

This is a good post.

[@Redhotshawntexas]

The whole Flair being WCW and NWA Champion sinultaneously and being stripped of the WCW Championship-who named a new Champion-while still being recognized as NWA Champion until he signed with the WWF thing blows a hole in your posit but ok

[@Redhotshawntexas]

Not to mention that Buddy Rogers was the NWA Champion when he was made WWWF Champion

[@bkap1905]

first time viewer, sick strap case cuz

[@sjpence]

JR just blows off the Goldberg remark. Lol

[@billybadass3056]

he didn't blow him off.... there would have to be at least some kind of acknowledgement for that to happen..

[@gregkennedy3736]

Sign me up first class to Shitland!! Just when I think I've laughed as hard as I could, enter another JR-ism. I'll buy the shirt. Love the show guys!!

[@the-Salty-Slayer]

There is no WCW or NWA without Flair. Once he left the went belly up. The man , the legend, the chop. Wooooooo

[@Matt-cr4vv]

How do you figure they went belly up when their biggest years were still to come? Lol

[@boosh90]

"Falling off the edge into Shitland". JR has become a real life Jim Lahey.

[@kptyler5]

Great memories!!!! I remember Brain gorilla and anvil the first time I seen it heard he was coming!!!! I went crazy as a kid

[@Jukeboxster]

Undertaker didn't come into WWF with the lightning and supernatural powers. He was a tall guy in a trenchcoat and hat that was very resistant to pain, looked very scary, but Undertaker was never unbeatable. He could be hurt, it just took a great deal of effort to do so. All of the powers and the ministry were things that evolved after there was already a strong following for him.

[@cutekanjii]

He was still supposed to be supernatural at least somewhat. I mean he was dead or at least the question was asked whether he was a dead man zombie type thing and that's why he didn't feel pain. And the urn had some sort of powers over him too.

[@gregorylevi1826]

I don't know what compromise JR thinks Herd & Flair could have come too. I don't blame Flair for not taking a paycut, I wouldn't have either.

[@Inflames420]

The compromise would have been how to drop the belt in a meaningful way and not have it show up on WWF tv.

[@gregorylevi1826]

@@Inflames420 Herd refused to pay Flair back his deposit for the belt. There was never gonna be a compromise

[@chrischar9428]

@@gregorylevi1826 Jim heard may not have even known about the deposit

[@gregorylevi1826]

@@chrischar9428 no he knew, he told Flair to go screw himself when he asked for his deposit back. That's what made Flair go to WWF

[@raulo19999]

There was no chance to compromise. Flair absolutely hated Herd and Herd was a complete mark. Name 1 heel that he didn't emasculate, screw over, or hold back. He wanted to pay the babyfaces more money and wanted them to always win.

[@UnHolyWible]

Isn't funny Vince thought it was acceptable to have Flair bring the WCW world title on wwf tv, but WCW trashing the women's title or The idea of Bret showing up on nitro with the wwf title was dirty lol

[@ronniejdio9411]

This thing opened the door for the issues in the future

[@pandavelli8176]

Vince has been good at simultaneously painting WCW as bumbling incompetent fools who never got anything right AND evil villainous masterminds! 😝

[@chadk890]

@@pandavelli8176 He did push WCW guys like Foley, Taker, Austin, Hall and Nash ( Oz and Vinnie Vegas)

[@pandavelli8176]

@@chadk890 right, I’m just complaining because I was a WCW fanboy as a kid lol so I can’t stand how WWF has rewritten the story about them during the 90’s

[@TRivera13]

There was some differences. #1 Flair owned the belt after the return of his deposit was refused. He was essentially allowed to use his property as he saw fit. #2 WWF didn't disrespect the belt. Bobby Heenan held that thing like it was worth $100,000. Ric Flair was on WWF TV calling himself the "Real World's Champion" and calling their champion and their belt fraudulent.

[@Mechtrekica]

I was watching Clash of the Champions 7 on the network and had completely forgotten this is where the Dingdongs debuted! My sides were hurting from laughing, that kind of crazy booking is still funny after all these years!

[@ChubbsTheCat]

Funny, everything he said about the WCW booking committee is how AEW is set up now, it's just Tony Khan instead of Jim Herd

[@creoleDJ]

Besides myself, who else thought that at first, this was going to be the lead up to some long-awaited “Battle Of The Belts” styles WWF/NWA unification bouts?

[@johnfalcetta5431]

Ole Anderson had the best reply to Herd, " ok they can't be pinned I'll slap a submission hold on em"

[@adriancarlos9155]

I popped when Bobby Heenan showed up on WWF TV with the big gold, stating the real world champion is coming Ric Flair... the selling of Neidhart and Monsoon made it more special

[@mikehiggins5088]

As a kid, I had no exposure to wrestling other than wwf. I had no idea who flair was when he showed up with the belt.

[@TK-mf2fr]

Jim says some stuff here that maybe was prophetic about what's going on now about current talent running the show

[@ECW5320]

I think Flair had every right to take the title with him; he didn't get his deposit back so why not?

[@TRivera13]

Once his request for the deposit was refused, the belt became his property. I saw nothing wrong with what Flair did. Flair would've never left with the actual belt had he been allowed to lose it to Windham or Luger. Herd didn't want that.

[@ECW5320]

@@TRivera13 Herd wasn't the brightest crayon in the box.

[@jeffjackson9679]

@@ECW5320 Jim Herd "We're bringing in Robocop...the real one!"

[@nunyafuckinbizniz]

Yet Flair makes fun of Bret Hart for Montreal 😆when Bret had reasonable creative control. Flair is trash.

[@PontFlair]

@@TRivera13 he didn't wanna drop it to Luger. Herd suggested it & Flair said nope, how about I drop it to Barry Windham? Herd said no. So, he said I'm out. I know people don't like him taking the NWA belt to WWF, but had Herd done business right, Ric Flair would have too. People cannot say Flair wasn't willing to do the right business, check his track record. I agree w/ you, I saw not a thing wrong w/ The Naitch leaving w/ the big gold belt.

[@thack57]

Flair said he had to put down 25Gs as a Bond of sorts and said they didn't want give him the 25 Grand back. If that's true who would blame Naytch?

[@period8705]

Thank you Conrad for being brave enough to tell the truth about Ric Flair vs Jim Heard and Hart vs Michaels issues. Because either everyone is a face or no one is.

[@Matt-cr4vv]

I'm on the side of nobody is a face, which is why I hate the Montreal Screwjob. I think both of these situations are easily avoided without major egos. I could lean Flair being the face if his claim that Herd wouldn't refund his belt deposit was true.

[@cutekanjii]

The reason Meltzer & others portrayed Bret as a babyface for it whereas others not quite so much. Was that Bret was one of his biggest informers or whatever word you'd use for giving inside info. Bret was/is a notorious mark for himself and probably loved nothing better than to read about himself & see his matches all get the most stars in the magazines.

[@Ramenshea83]

So many things happen in a decade , or a ten yr gap. 1991 flair with the belt on WWF tv. 2001 the Belt returns to WWE TV

[@McMahonHater]

Jerrett wasn't the Heel in his situation, he was an avenging angel.

[@nicholashurst780]

If I recall correctly Ric Flair did offer to drop the belt before he left he just wanted his cash deposit back like everyone else who had ever been the NWA Champion. When they wereIf I recall correctly Ric Flair did offer to drop the belt before he left he just wanted his cash deposit back like anyone who had put a security deposit down for something

[@nicholashurst780]

You know the funniest thing about the Oz gimmick is that the books are in the public domain anyone could have done that at any time

[@taylorscrews2284]

Roll tide

[@donaldsp360]

The problem is the fact that you guys haven't brought up the $25,000 deposit that Ric Flair had put down on the title and was never given back. At that point that belt becomes his belt not the companies. Bret had Vince McMahon's belt.

[@nunyafuckinbizniz]

Jack-off....Bret also had creative control.

[@donaldsp360]

@@nunyafuckinbizniz Fuckwit Bret did not have creative control .. He had 'reasonable creative control' in final 30 days of his contract.. so I understand business might not be something that you're familiar with. Salt spring first things first reasonable creative control does not mean absolute creative control. And number two , being released from a valid 20-year contract, that still have 19 years left usually applies as a special circumstance leaving that clause inoperable until the contract has been fulfilled. So think about maybe another 19 years when his final 30 days kicks in, then he would have reasonable creative control. You know like how he wants to plan his retirement. But that didn't happen so he didn't have created control.

[@kyledamron]

I remember the ppv with the white castle of fear that was some of that fantasy island bs Jr mentioned

[@TRivera13]

It's all Herd's fault. What Ross or Thompson are not mentioning is that Flair wanted to lose the belt to Windham or Luger before leaving. Herd nixed those ideas.

[@rondoughhowell6442]

Comparing the Ric Flair and Jim Herd situation during the 90s is like comparing the Micheal Jordan / Chicago Bulls and Jerry Krause situation during the 90s Bulls run

[@QuentinDude]

WCW really had egg on its face having to redo the PPV and having the champion bail and while WIndham was a really great worker, he just wasn't a main event guy. Having Luger turn heel and align with Race was a nice twist though. Also Flair showing up in WWF with the WCW title and basically acting like he was still the champ was genius. WWF actually didn't not capitalize on this very well. They should of had a special PPV to have the first Hogan and Flair match. Then do house shows after.

[@HBKStyles]

Okay, Dave

[@ronniejdio9411]

Hogan screwed it up . Should have been a mania match Hogan vs flair

[@rolltide9547]

Plus fans chanting we want Flair at the ppv.

[@chadk890]

The house shows didn't draw I was there and besides, Flair vs Savage was better anyway

[@ronniejdio9411]

@@chadk890 they didnt run a major angle. Mania would have drawn great but your correct. Savage flair was great. Savage is one of the goats

[@dachronicalalittlebitofeve6630]

The oz character was a great benefit to bash, he was as green as the cape and he needed a gimmick to hide his identity while he leaned what little he did.

[@TL2354]

Why bash it if it’s great?

[@jennifertimlin1371]

Bret still had 30 days before he would even go to WCW. Vince screwed him over. Bret was not the bad guy. He would never have taken the belt to WCW. Vince lied when he said that. Flair actually taking the belt is totally different.

[@TL2354]

Bret was 10000% wrong. You drop the belt when the boss tells you too. You think Bret’s father would have put up with what Bret was doing? Fuck that

[@jennifertimlin1371]

@@TL2354 He was willing to drop it the next night on Raw. He wasn't going straight to WCW and that is the part you and everyone else keep being in denial over. Bret was an integrity guy, unlike Shawn Michaels.

[@chefman45887]

15:00 mark absolute facts!

[@AnEternalEnigma]

Even as a kid, I saw that "backup belt" and was like, "What the heck is that and why is there stickers on it?" Why on EARTH would they do a camera close-up on it?

[@FforFake]

Thompson was going out of his way to kiss Jim Herd's ass in this portion of the episode.

[@ADAMdinho1]

This was so cool and in the WWF they had Flair come out with one of the tag team belts but blurred it out 🤣👏 I loved Flair in the WCW but his run in WWF wasn't as good overall.

[@chadk890]

It wasn't THAT bad.

[@leifnielson6849]

WAIT!!! is JR a Tide fan!??? OU???

[@KaitoRyuga]

And this thing happened with Madusa too. But in her case she throws the WWF Women's Champion in a trash can.

[@HBKStyles]

Duh. Dumbass. Everyone knows that

[@KaitoRyuga]

@@HBKStyles Relax Karen. This info is for fans who are not familiar with the 80's and 90's wrestling. Moron.

[@lucag.lisickza425]

@@KaitoRyuga i jacked off madusa once

[@frankmc73]

Hogan-Flair was initially scheduled for WM8 but they changed it to Flair-Savage Hogan-Sid. It was never confirmed but you logically guess that the real reason for the change was that Hogan was leaving after WrestleMania 8 so you can't put the belt around him and he's not going to lose to Flair at the biggest show of the year...WrestleMania.

[@Ken-uo7iw]

Hogan/Flair match took place 10 times around the Country. WWF had a couple of excuses why it didn't headline WM..

[@lokeyz83]

How about spreading the paycut equally throughout the company. A temporary %10 cut for everyone is a team effort instead of targeting your top guy.

[@kyledamron]

You have ric in his prime still and you let him get away and go to your top competitor. Flair was still having bangers with sting, and even Lex

[@Dakatari]

Lol Flair already had the soccer mom haircut anyways so he was half way there as a member of Spartacus.

[@ronniejdio9411]

The horsemen could have all called themselves Spartacus. I AM SPARTACUS

[@Dakatari]

@@ronniejdio9411 Lol.. Possibly

[@deelove7518]

😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@thegrapevine10]

750k to 700k a year back then? That's a lot of rolexes, alligator shoes and jet flying for the Nature Boy.

[@Kingofhemluck]

Freaking flair making 750,000 a year in the late 80s and found a way to be broke in his later years, if i could only get paid that once and i would be more than set in good time.

[@Matt-cr4vv]

I think he gets by for doing this largely because of how disliked and inept so many people saw Herd as. I think if he had done this when someone was in charge that wasn’t so disliked by people in wrestling he’d get more flack for doing it. I think how Herd handled Ric adds to that as well. Ric was getting boned a bit by trying to cut his money in half. I think Bret gets more criticism because he was leaving for greener pastures in a sense in his scenario. I think guys have a harder time feeling for a dude who is leaving to make almost double the money and refusing to lose versus a guy who’s being strong armed into having his money cut in half doing it. What’s ironic though is that if Herd had gone to Flair respectfully, explained the business situation, and asked him to take a reasonable cut in his money he may have actually done it. There’s so many stories of Ric being a company guy over the years to his detriment. But the way Herd treated him was always disrespect from the jump. If he had been respectful and asked him to take a reasonable cut respectfully I bet he’d have done it. But after being aggravated with him for years already and then being told to take half there wasn’t a chance he’d agree to doing that. Flair had tons of years where he didn’t make the most on the roster but being treated well and respected for what he’d done is a big difference in Herds approach. The cost cutting management so many in WCW had was always so idiotic. Sure they needed to reduce their expenses but slashing wrestlers pay to do it was never the move. Bischoff in the other hand cut costs from various wasteful business areas he’d seen that didn’t involve slashing peoples pay and it actually worked. Never understood how management ever thought slashing everybody’s pay was a good idea

[@max__p1765]

It seems that wrestling is easy - but the surroundings are complicated....

[@fedupwarrior2ndcoming196]

I thought that was funny he showed up to wwf with that belt. Herd was a goof just on the ridiculous changes he wanted flair to do

[@guilhermemelo3760]

Now I really wish they had Kevin Nash packaged as Citizen Pain and he would hit people with a sledge

[@batty4jokes]

I want My I Failed In Shitland T-Shirt keep it going

[@PlasticFoods__]

15:00- the story of AEW and their countless EVPS

[@FrankC71]

Wrestlers having creative control will doom any promotion, Imagine Gino telling Fritz I will not lose to this guy or anyone telling Stu, I can't lose, no way

[@mattm6580]

As a kid who had only ever watched WWF, I had no idea who Flair was or what the significance of that title was. Flair looked out of place next to most WWF stars. Same for Backlund in 92. They had no gimmick, no colorful outfits, nothing. WWF's presentation at that time just wasnt conducive to incorporating the likes of a Flair. I thought his best rival during that period was Piper. Flair looked out of place fighting Hulk or Taker but his interactions with Piper fit like a glove.

[@McMahonHater]

I'm not a big Flair guy, but the way Heard treated him was wrong. He was the guy who kept WCW's head above water. At the same time, inevitably Sting or Luger or any younger guys would eventually garner more money just because age will slow you down.

[@markwint605]

Don't forget he was ric flair champion vince of course was going to use him well.

[@Bryan8329]

Anything betraying the least bit athletic quality of the product is anathema to the product.

[@attiepollard7847]

If only Hogan would have fought flair at wm 8 or 9 and traded wrestlemania wins and losses everything would have been fine.

[@edwardclement102]

Jim Herd was the pizza man, he made the Ding Dongs, OZ, he should have kept Ric Flair and ran. The fans of WCW from places like NC liked Flair. Flair vs Lugar should have happened at the Great American Bash. On Flair's second WWE World Title an injury put Flair down, from an Ultimate Warrior match, and he came back to WCW, with a great Barry Windham match for NWA World Title. and later Big Van Vader for WCW World Title at Starcade 93, a very good match. Vince used some good some bad as all promoters. Flair turned Vince down other times because he was NWA World Champ.

[@markmenning1804]

Conrad probably talked to his father in law before this.

[@JayTheAdviceGuy]

Even though JR is RIGHT, he sounds so bitter and ANGRY all the time. Wtf dude?

[@vanealmorrow6024]

WCW letting Ric Flair go to the WWF was like Cleveland letting Lebron go to Miami.

[@johnfalcetta5431]

That's a really good analogy

[@chadk890]

Exactly

[@tafariali-alkebulan3325]

No, bigger than that relatively speaking, sting was lebron, flair was Jordan, so it was like Jordan going to the Pistons, Celtics, or Lakers.

[@tafariali-alkebulan3325]

Flair going over to WWF with Big Gold was the moment NWA/WCW lost the 80s wrestling "war". Flair winning the rumble for the WWF title is the moment the WWF title became THE world title on this side of the globe, kayfabe and shoot.

[@kyledamron]

Where flair and Bret differ was flair paid a 10 grand deposit to hold the belt they didn't want to pay him therefore its his belt to take with him in my eyes

[@davidfrederick1971]

Among the first podcasts I covered this Flair-Herd'a argument over the $25K deposit. That deposit involved the "world title" and the "national wrestling alliance". NOW with zero defense toward Herd, Herd question the returning of that money. Well sorry Flair, this is WCW NOT the NWA, not JCP. That deposit I would believe to be null and voice he moment JCP was sold in November 1988. They are not longer affiliated with the NWA despite maybe a few times saying it on air. Heck this happens in real life too, when business's are consolidated and certain things and situations are no recognized or valid. That money was supposed to prevent the title from changing hands out of nwa board members knowledge. What do you call Singapore and New Zealand's title changes in 1984? BUT once JCP bought up territories, and as Ole Anderson said in his RF shoot interview "what was he world champion of?"

[@markdejonge937]

wcw was still part of the nwa territories upintill the first split in 91 the belt was still a nwa world title

[@SoloSeason]

How TF did he really get the big green belt??? How?

[@9952275]

red rooster was the best

[@AntonBProud]

JR'S TAKE ON HUNCHBACKS IS PRICELESS HE SOUNDS LIKE JIM LAHEY FROM SUNNYVALE HAHA ANYTIME YOU HAVE...IT'S SHIT HAHAHA THEY CAN'T BE BEAT BECAUSE THEY HAVE HUNCHBACK'S THAT IS THE MOST RRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR IDEA I HAVE EVER HEARD! HAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAH SO THEIR MATCHES JUST LAST FOREVER? JAJAJAJAJJAJAJAAJJJJAJAJJAJAJ IN SPANISH JAJAJJAJJAJAAJAJAJJAJAJJJJAJ

[@bobbybutler6501]

I love it. What u say is entertaining. That's why the raitings are the shits

[@lucag.lisickza425]

"its all about cash and creatity"

[@wildshetentertainment1821]

How is JR talking to himself? 😲

[@nothingissacred96]

I know so many bad characters I was watching this one show where they had a librarian shooshing people & a Lucha dinosaur

[@user-tz2zz5ij1s]

I’ll be honest as a wwf/wcw fan from the mid 90’s. Rick Flair was lame and the lame 4 horseman kept getting shoved down our throats. Once he got beat down by NWO, that’s what made him to the non 80’s generation and really made his legacy. He had that back storyline that honestly, no one seemed to care about from 94-2001, but he kept himself relevant and one hell of a last entertaining run. Which the end basically solidified the whole 20 plus years that no one really cared about. Hopefully that makes sense.

[@danielmenhart2410]

Always wanted Flair to lose when you were a young fella, eh?

[@attiepollard7847]

Man you must have been very young and naive back then I probably wasn't a wrestling fan if you think Ric flair was lame. Sounds like to me you was a Hogan fan back then

[@mike7676ful]

Flair has been lame exactly zero days in his entire wrestling career.

[@Tiffny16]

....GOLDBERG , GOLDBERG, GOLDBERG!!!

[@stevewarren4813]

Can JR honestly think of ANYTHING that Hird did "right?"

[@TL2354]

Who?

[@perfectblindguy]

The main problem was that Jim Herd did not want to return Flair's $25000 deposit.

[@hooskerdoo3130]

Wasn't it basically Ric's belt he bought it and didn't get reimbursed for it?

[@dr2jerzey]

“I fell in shitland.” shirts 💀

[@ronniejdio9411]

I still say Oz could have worked as a character

[@roobear78]

ric has already stated in a few shoots that he was done with heard and wcw it was the booking , arn being shafted when tully failed the drug test , and a lot of others who were there at time back ric up so there was no healing of wounds possible jr always plays it down middle when he talks about heard becuase he doesnt want to admit he had to work with him and the guy was a lunatic

[@Matt-cr4vv]

I thought Herd seemed reasonable after his interview with Conrad. I think a lot of it was just a crummy scenario more than Herd being a lunatic. I think the Arn scenario was bullshit. But I also think Herd was put in a spot where he didn't have a hope to succeed, and was told to cut costs, and there was no way to be the "good guy" in a scenario like that. Herd had his faults, that much is clear, but I think there's something to be said about landing in a losing scenario.

[@roobear78]

@@Matt-cr4vv dude the guy was a walking disaster almost everyone who is anyone in wrestleing agrees at how bad he was,yes of course he was directed to save money but not as much as he maintains the evidences is there by the way he paid guys or offered them deals then went out and paid tons to flops! christ even barry windham slated the guy and barry is the mellowest cat in the room and could work for most people! The ding dongs,the hunchbacks and the bullshit about wanting to turn the turner library characters into wrestlers sums up the guys label,he was an outside exec who should never have been allowed near wrestleing! now if turner had installed a duo team with equal parity one for wrestleing and herd as purely corporate then i think it could have been a good team up and fixed a lot of wcw issues but sadly they didnt

[@drackkor725]

Flair would have never been as big of a name if he didn't go to the WWF.

[@mexmexican8619]

Ummm Wizard of Oz was always in color

[@josephmiller9424]

Think Jim Heard thought ding dongs or hunch backs were good ideas so i can see Heard going to call him a movie name.

[@dr.roberts4508]

Yeah, Conrad I am sure you know what side your bread is butter

[@kevinlynn2456]

Flair wasn’t happy and didn’t get along with Jim herd not only he was under contract but they haven’t pay him the deposit of being the nwa world heavyweight champion. Many people don’t realize that that the first supershow in 1991 flair lost the nwa world heavyweight championship but took the god belt back because he was recognized as the first wcw world heavyweight championship so at the first superbrawl he regain the nwa title. I think flair feel disrespected by the office because not only try to change his image but disrespected the nwa

[@charlieward5476]

I remember it clearly when Flair made his debut on WWF Primetime while Bobby was holding the big gold and the first thing that I thought was what color robe was his hasbro figure going to have?

[@charlescox290]

Ok, you have a Save With Conrad spot before the end of the video and at the end of the video. How is this not marked as including a paid promotion?

[@KaitoRyuga]

Because Conrad owns it. To become a paid promotion, it should come from a different sponsor which has nothing to do with you but had made deals with you to advertise its product.