Guild Wars: The Four Horsemen - Hero Guide under HM with a safer way (read description!)

[@hoffis4113]

amazing guide, helped me in 2024! thx man

[@Ask_Eric]

Thanks a lot.

[@lukaswebeer]

Amazing! Just did it. Thanks for the help. Greetings from 2024 :D

[@Ask_Eric]

Hey man, awesome! Glad it helped you haha :) In case you need more information there is a very lengthy discussion in this specific commentsection that goes even further under My necromancer video. Greetings back haha enjoy the Game!

[@lukaswebeer]

Nice thanks! Yeah I just did it with my Necro, so I guess it doesn't care which class you play? Warrior or Derwish probably the easiest

[@Ask_Eric]

@@lukaswebeer as caster I‘d say Mesmer because you can shut down and Focus on the dangerous enemies/get Most damage by placing rupts in a Ball but I Personaly enjoyed the necro a lot. Was really a lot of fun imo. Haha :D As melee every class should work fine. Dervish can get a bit unrelyable by playing the wrong Build cause in uw you lose the enchs (or at least there is potential) in 2/3 dangerous quests. War works very good too. :)

your balling of enemies is perfect

[@Ask_Eric]

Thank you Peter :) Glad you enjoy it.

[@Ask_Eric]

Also I have better balls in my 2. Uw HM Fullruns you may want to check them out but the way is almost the same beside the RN-Spirit at the spot.

[@exilia77]

Excellent! Can't wait to try!

[@Ask_Eric]

Thank you! Check out the 4H reverse strategy I explained on my pure Underworld video. This should be even safer because the fullteam is fighting against both sides and the splinter support is on the first side as well which deals huge amounts of damage!

[@dillinger9611]

Hello Eric, thanks for the video. Apologies ahead: long message : - ) I have watched your videos on Underworld HM including this video with a strategy guide because I'm currently planning my next challenge - underworld HM with heroes no consets But for now I am stuck at 4H for a week (roughly 30 tries). I ALWAYS fail (die) after porting to lab and back to the chaos plains - the first half (Kazhad and Ghozer) - is really easy by now but the second one (Madruk and Thul Za) seems impossible. Thus, I wanted to adress some questions to you and community in this section. 1. First Half (Kazhad and Ghozer) Is there any reason why one should not use 'Shadow of Haste' here? I'm trying to understand why you chose to show this strategy here and I guess it's just to 'flex' (no offense) / show, it's possible without. But is there any good reason not to use it actually? I feel like that the most optimal way is depicted in your necromancer video (kzbin.info/www/bejne/nKSlZ4yfq8yIb9E) 2. Preperation I really like the setup with the Spirits beforehand. I also add Pain / Bloodlust at the crossing point of Thul Za and Madruk to gain a little more time and found it rather helpful. Is there a reason to not do it / does it bear disadvantages? Before I leave for placing the heroes at the 'right crossing where the heroes and me fight Kazhad and Ghozer, I usually drop a Pain Spirit on that path to delay any leftover white dryders / skeletons (got that from a nother youTube vid: kzbin.info/www/bejne/amrUZnWFo7F0oaM - Time: 24:00). 3. Second Half - Madruk and Thul Za near Shrine This is where shit goes down for me and I literally have no idea what goes wrong. So far, there are only 2 scenarios: 1 - I get blasted by the dryders on the spot ( I tend to think its when I am a bit late and Shelter and my heroes are on the same spot and get 'fireballed') 2 - I kill every Dryder on the second side but do not have enough damage for Thul Za and Madruk and then 4 Skeletons kill my group and the Reaper I am genuinely amazed / curious on how the f you are able to kill everything before even 1 single skele arrives. I tried summoning a Legionair to assist me but it went wrong anyways :D Any tips on that issue? How important would you evaluate microing painful bond? For the first half, the SoS does that quite well on his own. THe second half is really micro-heavy already and thus I didnt do it so far. 4. Builds I analysed different vids / approaches and for me the following setup made most sense: I. D/A (me) - Scythe PR: Ogej8hpL7SihbXPXCYvl2k0khOA | SM15 - M12 - SA8 II. N/Rt - BiP / Main Heal: OAhjQkGZIP3hhWzWaOMncjzLGA | BM13 - SR10 - RM12 III. Rt - ST Protter: OACiAyk8gNtehzvJ00ZGtvYA | C16 - SP13 IV Rt/N - SoS Support: OASjUoiMJSYMeTlTXTKTKgfBVTA | CM16 - RM9 - DM10 V. Me/P - PI: OQljAsCspNhwpXOw0NEKCXAfMA | DM16 - FC13 - C6 VI. Me/P - ES 1: OQljAoCsJOngpXOw0pBKCXgdMA | DM16 - FC12 - C8 VII. Me/P - ES 2: OQljAgCspOngpXOw0NEuA07dMA | DM16 - FC10 - C10 VIII. Mo - RoJ / Off-Heal: OwAT0UHDRynZhQN6iYjoBc6beAA | SP16 - HP10 - DF9 Hero VIII (RoJ) is most discussion-worthy imo. I also tried an E/Rt Stone Sheath / Off-Heal and a N/Rt Icy Veins / Off-Heal where my SoS takes Strenght of Honor and Smite Hex. Somehow I still found it most optimal especially since it should be great for pits and generally for each and every skeleton. Kiting is a bit obnoxious sometimes but workable. In the end it all comes down to the question: Is there a scenario in which this hero will be more useful than another ES? But then I would need my SoS to take over the Off-Heal thingy which is a bit meh. What would your suggestion be?

[@Ask_Eric]

Hey dillinger9611 youre welcome. (: Thanks for your question/s, Ill try to answer them all, if something is unclear: just let me know. Might take some time for me to answer, but you will get a response for sure.

[@Ask_Eric]

1: Question: - Is there a reason why one should not use 'Shadow of Haste" here? - Mainanswer: Yes! Even if it looks very risky/weird, in this case the build wouldnt work that well. The warriorline got some great speedbuffskills and this builds maindamage outcome is based on adrenalin. This skill allows me (in combination with "For great Justice!"), to get out "Whirlwind Attack", after the first contact with any enemy. Another advantage by using the strengthline: you dont have to invest atributepoints in another atributeline, so all your points stick to two attributelines, which makes them much more effective! Overall, I think "Shadow of Haste" is great in Underworld, but unfortunatelly, its a dead skill during 95% of the run. So on the warrior the skill I brought (forgot the name tbh.) is way better, due to it giving me the ability to move faster and buff my own build by a lot. Sidenotes: As you noticed: after placing the heroes correctly on the first side and taking the quests they are able to deal with the first rider and the spawning dryders pretty easily. You dont have to fight with them but for the second rider on this side, its best for you, to be there. If you got a speedskill with you your, timing wont be messed up. The only problem is, that you have to get a feeling for the timing, when its best to run back to the reaper. I never got a timer or anything like that I just deal a few hits, give him deep wound, and run back. Also: taking agro from the second group on the first side is pretty important, in my opinion, because they will cast the "Meteorshower" on you and not in the middle of your heroes. Just make sure the Horseman is in range of your heroes, before taking agro of them otherwise, the heroes might be way to far to reach them. it helps to set them on "Attack" so, even if they are not directly in the aggrobubble, they might be able to get there. If you want you can reverse this, like I did in this video here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/e5qnYX2aodiAqpI This is pretty huge, in my opinion, if you run back in and the timinig is correct, because: the full party is able to fight the first side + you, as the player, got skills heroes are unable to bring (PvE's) which makes it much easier + you can call the targets. I brought "Make haste!" on one hero, so the way back is faster + I dont have to bring another speedskill on my own. ------------------------------------------------------ 2: Question (in my own words): - is there a reason, why I dont use spirits at the crossing? Does it give me a disadvantage?- Answer: I think, I did this too in one of my videos, but to be fair Im not 100% sure. You can definitly do it like that, there is no disadvantage, as long as both spirits, the "Bloodsong" and the "Pain" spirit, are on the second side like you see in the video (8:23). I usually tend to forget that I can place something there too, because the second I place the spirits, I just try to rush as fast as I can, to prepare the heroside for the fight. After the teleportation, there is usually enough, to delay the enemies, anyways due to the placed spirits. ------------------------------------------------------ 3: First scenario: - I get blasted by the dryders on the spot (I tend to think its when I am a bit late and Shelter and my heroes are on the same spot and get 'fireballed') This is 100% because of porting back to late to the reaper. Second screnario: I kill every Dryder on the second side but do not have enough damage for Thul Za and Madruk and then 4 Skeletons kill my group and the Reaper I think you can fix this too, by porting back the right time. The spirits you place on the 2 side, for Thul Za and Madruk, are on a good spot to kill this big group right on the spot. If you arive early enough, they still try to kill at least the last one and are balled up and this is the biggst chance of winning the fight on that side. A few advice: - 1: dont waste to much time on the first side, just deal a few hits. Usually if you see that the second horseman is around halflife, you can run back. - 2: do this quest as the "first one", so you dont have 3-4+ reapers and you have to find the right one in a hury. This avoids the chance of missclicking and failing the run because of that. - 3: you play a scythe so youre able to hit many enemies if they stand correctly. I highly recommand spiking the dryders always first, because they deal the maindamage, the horsemen themself only got a lot of HP and might block some skills, but they dont deal nearly as much damage as the dryders. - 4: You prolly know it, but keep in mind, that the placed spirits, that delay Madruk and Tul Za, share the agro with the rithero, that set them there, because the spirit and the rit act like a party. In some cases 1-2 enemies tend to let lose from the spirit thats still alive and run directly to your hero, because after the teleporting back to the reaper, he is in agrorange. If this happens, still try to focus on the mainball of enemies. If you can, try to place the rit/s a bit apart from the group but still in agrorange of the fight. In case you make it in time: If timinig after the teleport is correctly and they are still on one of the placed spirits/are on the way to you but still have no reaperagro: place "Shelter" right away and focus on splinterweapon, run into them as fast as you can, (click C+Space or set a target on one of the enemies, before teleporting, so you just have to press T). This side is a lot about having agro, so they focus mostly on you. If your HP gets low (which it will, because of the "Lava Font") they tend to focus on you anways, because they try to spike you. It helps too, if youre a bit faster as the heroes, so you are in front and they can focus on you. Your builds also need a bit more singletarget damage, but I go into that by talking about point 4. Feel free to use the Legionar, it can only make things better beside the fact, that he might need some healing. Question: - How important would you evaluate microing painful bond? - Answer: Very important, especially for this quest. You can kick it, but its pretty much always worth it, because, the horsemen got a lot of HP! So this skill will finish them quickly.

[@Ask_Eric]

4: I took a look over all the builds and they are not bad, but still got some room for optimization. Unfortunatelly, due to my PC situation, I only could check out the builds but wont be able to build you new ones (sounds weird but trust me :D). Here are a few changes I personaly would make. Please keep in mind, that this is only based on my personal opinion and someone else might say something else. 1: Your build: You should definitly bring deep wound. Its prolly the best condition in the whole game + it makes you kill enemies MUCH faster. Especially during 4 horsemen this might change a lot for you, if you place it on the horseman you attack. I recommand "Finish him!" in trade for "Asuran Scan", if you want to play this build and only make some changes to it. Underworld pretty much only got casters, so you dont get blindet that often + the times you can hit through a block is very minimal. I would definitly kick this one, because its close to a wasted skillslot and on top it blocks one of the very good PvE-Skillslots. Overall a good skill, but not very good for underworld. If you dont want to bring "Finish him!" bring "Find Their Weakness!", from the paragonline. Pros/Cons by bringing this one instead of bringing "Finish him!" in your own build: + you can always use it/hero can always use it + deep wound gets dealed 100% and its not limited to the enemies health + your own build got more energy to work with + got another potential PvE skill you can bring with you - hero uses it kinda random and it might get on the wrong target (15s cooldown), can and will make a huge difference in this specific quest: make sure deep wound is on the second horsemen on the first side and run back, heroes have a much easier time finishing that one of. - you have to invest atributepoints, because its from the commandline, which makes other skills weaker - damage is worst, compared to "Finish him!" - more microing, if you want to have it during the right time I saw that you have something that makes you attack faster, which is very good! If you consider bringing alcohol I would recommand "Drunken Master". Even without, its a very good skill. Faster you attack -> faster splinter/SoH/Vamp/Zeal from the scythe triggers -> higher is the spikedamage -> faster hero gives you splinter again -> and so on. I never ever played this elite tbh, but I know, that its quite popular. Even if there are more enches in the build, I recommand checking out my nm video and maybe try this build. It got burn/deep wound/weakness and a lot of spike potential. You dont even have to bring another skill for deep wound due to the elite. Try not to rely on enches, because in underworld they get stripped almost always during the hard quests. This build got some flashenches they make it playable, but derv might have a disadvantage, because of the enchstripps. 2: The Bip: I think overall this one is fine, but I still have a few notes. The second skill (I forgot the name): this one only works for you and you alone, keep that in mind. In order to heal/trigger this for the heroes they have to stab the enemies, which is pretty rare and is pretty ineffective. It also got a pretty high casttime from a second if I remember correctly. Does not sound like a lot, but if your party gets spiked and he is casting this skill, it might be to late. If you only bring this one for yourself its: fine, I guess. Same with "Flesh of my Flesh": if you put this res on a healer/the ST always keep in mind that they are unable to do anything for 5 seconds. I always recommand putting atleast one copy of this skill in a mesmerbar due to the fastcasting aspect. Mesmer got this done in half of the time + your healing/prot is saved. The third skill is ok but also had 1 second casttime if I remember correctly. If you want to switch it I recommand "Soothing Memories". It also got the chance to give back a bit of energy which makes this skill pretty much for free and the casttime is a bit faster which makes it a bit more relyable for the horsemen quest because they can also rupt skills. 3: The ST-Ritualist: This one is fine. In case you have another Ritualist hero you can bring: I recommand a "Signet of Spirit" ritualist. I played one in the video I linked above and I also wrote a comment/in the description what would prolly be optimal, if I remember corectly. Maybe check this out too, otherwise, this build is fine, beside the "Flesh of my Flesh" stuff I mentioned on the BiP too. 4: The SoS-Ritualist: Would keep it like that, but in case you want to go for more mesmerpower, I recommand making this one an Rt/P with anything "Find their Weakness!" and something you prefer. Mesmers also deal more damage, which the Rit isnt that good in anyways, beside prepared spirits. You can switch skill 6 for "Essence Strike". This one is always great and its singletarget damage, that has no requirement + it gives you pretty much always a free hit, due to the energy you gain if a spirit is nearby! Makes the horsemen quest a lot easier too, because if you say you cant kill them: mesmers almost always deal a bunch of damage, but it always requires the enemy to do something like casting/attacking etc. Due to "Energy Surge" they dont have much energy left to cast something, so the damage isnt that high anymore and so on. Also: use a staff that gives the hero a +1 chance for Channeling magic. Splinter got a break with 17 channeling and if youre lucky, you have 6 instead of 5 hits that the skill will trigger with! Also: I would definitly keep "Painfull Bond" for the spirits. This one is massive if you get it on and 100% worth it because the spiritdamage will get very very high!

[@Ask_Eric]

Quick note for all the Mesmers before I move on: - bring something to get energy back, like "Power Drain/Leech Signet", this takes some pressure from your BiP and he doesnt have to heal himself, so he can focus more on the party. - If you split your atributes from fastcasting: make sure to always go down two points instead of one. The breakpoints for fastcasting are: 15-13-11-... otherwise, points are wasted. I highly recommand playing 16 Dom + 15 Fastcasting, just because they get a lot stronger, especially with a 40/40 set. An Esurge is on 7.5s~ cooldown and its only one of the skills. Damage will get through the roof + other skills are faster avalable too! - bring "Spiritual Pain" on 2 of the 3 Mesmers! This one is very good because, of same reasons I wrote before in the SoS-herotext above. - bring only one copy of "Fallback!" - its a bit slower overall, but beside that, this skill wont help you during the fights. Block the one copy and micro it, in case you have get out of a Meteorshower + heroes wont use 10 energy for pretty much nothing, during a fight. - for more atributepoints on the mesmers: play the Rt/P so you can run the skills on a higher lv (9-10 command) and you got some space, for a few more, strong mesmerskills 5: Psykick Instability Mesmer: This hero brings "Never Surrender!" with him which is not sooo bad but I promisse you he will always use this one the moment your BiP is halflife. What I want to say it that this skill is pretty much always dead because he will use it pretty much for the BiP alone or any other partymember that crosses this line. So 5 points for +3-4^ heal for only one partymember is...meh. Unlike you as a player heroes are unable to use shrouds during the casttime which makes them much more ineffective. You can see them as something that will get used after the casting is done. I brought this one too but this was more because I didnt had any other good solutions. I recommand kicking this one and replacing it with "Flesh of my Flesh". Make sure to use all points in Dom and Fastcast only (beside the 3 leftovers - if you got new Inspirationline skills still use them there and not in resto) 6: Esurge Mesmer 1 + 2: You can leave it like that, if you want too (already said everything above, that I would change in the part "Quick note for all the mesmers, before I move on". :D) 8: Monk: I agree, this one is the hero you can switch out the easiest, BUT you have to make changes to other heroes too in order to keep the healing at a high level. I think 100%, that beside the fight against Dhuum himself and wastes, you dont need any smitesupport for your dervish, or for underworld in general. It speed a few areas up but thats pretty much it. Spliter is much much more important + it get get stripped. If you got coverenchs, its fine but otherwise, the skill will get stripped and its dead for multiple seconds. So yeah you can keep it but its definitly not necessary + if you want something that works almost the same: bring "I am the Strongest!". Cant get stripped + you can use it before the fight and during the fight if its about to run out. Its a great alternative, because the damage you deal is pretty much equal to "Strength of Honor". Only downside is, that you have to sacrifice a PvE-slot. I too didnt use "Strength of Honor" in the video I liked above. Its a bit weird first, but trust me its ok + You dont have to micro that stuff too. Its more important that the team as a whole works and not that you can deal high damage "if everything works out". For the skelletons and pits: I agree. Smite is great, especially "Judges Insight". But you really dont need it, you got "Empathy" for the skelletons. They count as rangers so they deal physical damage and "Empathy" is very, very strong against them. The weapon they use is a bow, so in case there is a wall in front of you, they wont hit you + you can fast to the left n right to dodge the skills, but this is no that easy and only works if you run away from them, or up to them. The problem with monk is, that he is quite slow in casting + has often very high cooldown times for damage, that is not even that good. RoJ also got the additional problem that enemies kite like crazy! The skill is very very good in nm but for HM its more like a gamble. If enemies cast "Meteorshower" or anything and dont get rupted: the skill is fire. But if they kite immediately its a 20 second cooldown and a wasted elite skill, for litteraly nothing. Question: -Is there a scenario in which this hero will be more useful than another ES? - Answer: No, 100% not. If youre able to make some changes to the builds and put the healing from the monk somewhere else. Mesmers are just way to strong. In the video I linked above I had a BiP, the SoS and the ST-Ritualist with healing. This sounds like overkill, but it worked very good tbh. If you can bring another Mesmer that would work well, I guess. Or another "Signet of Spirits" ritualist. I really hope this clears a few things up. You can optimize a lot of small things and if you get the timinig during the teleportation correct, I'm sure that you can finish this quest. Wish you the best of luck, dont give up.

[@dillinger9611]

@@Ask_Eric No worries, I like big answers so I have something to dig in to :D

[@gndz7517]

I have literally the same build as you and kahzad dhuum never dies when I get to him. I precast spirits. What gives? Thanks for your help.

[@Ask_Eric]

Hey there, these builds are not optimal it was more an example. There are better builds to do this quest so probably the best one imo is the one that I use with my Sin in the "pure" video. There you have many many spirits and they are much better than 3. Mesmers. The dmg output is just way higher and you could easy play D-spammer on Warrior to if you want to. Maybe check them out and try again. Otherwise your position might be a bit wrong. You can precast some skills on the Mesmer too. I recomand to kick the Powerspikes and bring atleast 1. "Leech Signet" and 1-2 "Spiritual Pain" for more rupts/dmg. Put your heroes on "Attack". I also play with +3 Dom(1) and a +3 FC rune to keep the damage as high as possible and the cooldowns as low as possible. The Nec can be kicked for whatever you prefer. If you run merchs maybe keep the 3. Mesmers and bring him as "Signet of Ghostly Might" supporter. That would probably be ideal. I had the best results of this quest with lots of spirits and the microing from "Painfull Bond" on the horsemens on the first side. On the 2. one I never do that idk. It just never crosses my mind if I dont feel like the time is running low and the other enemies could arrive soon. The first thing I always do by running to my heroes is picking the 1. horsemen and use "Painfull Bond" on him. This is very very important otherwise the damage might not be high enough. If the 2. one takes agro I also put this on him but you dont have to to this right away he will rupt 1-2. times and you want to make sure this skill doesnt get ruptet. If the 2. horsemen stands "on the edge" I usually run to him to catch agro of the dryders in the back so they use everything on me. This way the heroes have only 1. target to heal+hex remove from the Mesmers deals maximum dmg If the dryders run to you/next to the 2. horsemen you can attack these ones to get rid of them Just make sure to not mess up the timing to run back to the reaper. I make sure to bring "Deep Wound" on him before I run back. Also a nice help against AoE-dmg is to use all 7. flags. You can use hotkeys for the heroes 4-7 so they are not balled up that much. The spirit NR-Spirit I support in this video is nice to have but not 100% necessary. It only helps to bring a few more rupts on point if the Dryders casts some hexes respectively the Horsemens. So you can definitely kick this one to have access to another secondary profession or bring another skill you prefer+rase some attributes with the "new points". If you just dk what to bring you can always add a "Leech Signet". Works always. :D I hope these points will help you to get it done. Sorry for the wall of text.

[@gndz7517]

@@Ask_Eric Thanks a lot for the detailed answer.

[@mathiaswunderlich2741]

Hi! Netter Guide zu der Quest. Eine Frage hab ich trotzdem. Nutzt Livia eigentlich den Verjüngungsgeist?

good job!

[@cp-tu8tb]

Hey Eric, Thanks for all the videos. Also all your video's are getting put under the category Guild Wars 2 not Guild War1

[@Ask_Eric]

Thank you for the nice comment aswell. :) Yeah I know some also go under "PerfectWorld" which is pretty strange. haha But ty for the information.

[@Krschkr]

Und so verliert eine Quest ihren Schrecken, die als eine der schwierigsten im Spiel gilt. Was kommt als nächstes: Kappa-Angriff? :p

[@Ask_Eric]

Dankeschön! Hoffentlich hilfts n paar Leuten! :) Mh gute Frage..Ich find Kappa Angriff garnicht so schwer habs allerdings auch nur 1. mitm Sin gemacht. Das ging eig. ganz gut. Mal schauen!