Haas VF-2YT Cutting Steel - Demo Day Live Focus Video - Haas Automation, Inc.

We took our Demo Day Live streamed video and sliced it up so you could get right to the meat of the presentation. Here John and Bryan take a look at the VF-2YT in action while they discuss aspects to consider when setting up to cut tougher materials. This is the first machine we watched in action on our December 2nd live show and we'll be posting the ST-30LY and VF-3YT50 segments over the next week.
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[@johngamal141]

Great technical info, you can own the best machine in the world, but without support, knowledge, or practical experience, you get nothing. HAAS really knows well what real customer support means, and always teach you, gives you more confidence in your machine. 👍

[@vincentbernolin1943]

Haas post videos, dealing with problems we could experience... This is simply the attitude I want to see from my next machine builder. Nice and interesting video .

[@104kenneth]

Thank you Haas! Thanks to your youtube-videos I was today able to clear a spindle error, post a new program to start up again and run. All this the first day in a new company. And I have never touched a Haas before

[@redhousetn73]

We have a TM1 at work and I use it to build hard tooling, top to bottom. Even the die shoes. I cut 4140pht & various tool steels almost daily. I have used it to hard cut with a DOC of .005. Fine machines that will do what you need it to do if you run it accordingly. And use the speed to make up for taking a heavy cut. Haas ALL DAY!

[@WCGwkf]

I've cut steel on an old minimill on my first attempt learning cnc, it was slow but the finish was excellent and it worked out great. Just bought 2 machines and will be cutting stainless. If my Chinese manual mill can cut it with an excellent finish so can a haas.

[@135SoHc]

2018 VF-3ss, aluminum all day long no problem. 304ss or A36ms it struggles, whole machine vibrates and hums like crazy. Recently I had to re-indicate the spindle probe and with a NOGA mag base stuck on the table and the test indicator running on the ruby tip. Kept getting changing readings, when I realized that myself @ 200 lbs leaning against the outer sheet metal enclosure was enough to cause the entire table to saddle to base to column have enough flex that the test indicator could easily pick up the deflection.

[@marcinwarmuz3646]

The speeds and feeds charts for inserted face mills are under shell mill bodies, not under inserts, in case someone is wondering where they are.

[@antshark]

I was really surprised that the machine took those cuts. I'd personally never cuts steel with traditional milling methods. Way better to use highspeed machining methods. Very informative video though.

[@user-tw9io9nz2m]

If I can cut steel on my bridgeport, you can cut it too on your haas

[@antshark]

Yes, a Bridgeport can cut any material my Haas can cut, but it all comes down to effeciency and precision.

[@franciscoanconia2334]

could you repeat the speed and feed of the endmill cut? Spinlde Vf.... ?

[@meddlingwithmetal7153]

quick question was the through coolant pressure 300 or 1000psi on this demo. Thanks for the vids

[@mattdroneon58]

I cut steel every day on my DMs. I have no issues at all and we run this little guy lights out. Just auto check the rougher. Definitely just stay within your machine parameters and it just works.

[@Kizmox]

We used to run VF-2SS and VF-3SSYT taking cuts like these in series production and we went through spindles. Bearings were fine but tapers got bell mouthed and tool contact was bad. Some brand new spindles didn't last one year.

[@Foomanlol]

How long ago and what tooling did you run?

[@Kizmox]

@@Foomanlol 2012-2018. We ran 1-2" inserted tools in steel. Feedmills were fine but 90 degree shoulder mills and grooving cutters gave us trouble.

[@haasautomation]

@Kizmox - We can’t speak to your exact issue, but bell mouthed spindle tapers are often caused by allowing cutters to chatter without correcting the underlying parameter causing the chatter. For instance; tool gage length is a critical variable in this equation. A 20-hp cut with a 2” shell mill that has a 3” gage length is completely different than the same cutting conditions at a 6” gage length. The longer the tool, the more leverage the cutting forces have, and the more the cut will try to pull the tool shank out of the taper. This is typically what makes the taper fret, makes the tool stick, and then eventually bell mouth the taper.

[@Kizmox]

@@haasautomationFretting was indeed first indication of bad taper contact. As well as SUPER loud tool change bangs, we had to perform dummy tool changes in the middle of the program to keep the tool from sticking to the spindle. It was not chatter issue but those cuts did make the enclosure rattle/shake similar to the face mill cut and drill in this demo. Other brand 40 taper machine with same tooling and programming running same parts without excessive taper wear. My best guess is the spindle draw bar force is not high enough and the taper material is SOFT in these machines. I would much rather wear out tool holders if something has to give. It was always similar wear pattern, the big end contact area fades away and tool makes good contact only at the pull stud end. But yeah, will Haas cut steel? Yes! Your mileage may vary though. We ended up adding extra passes here and there and slowing things down a bit.

[@damientoomey1194]

@@Kizmox haas have a pneumatic drawbar unclamp cylinder therefore the drawbar clamp force is likely limited by this. We have an older mazak with pneumatic drawbar cyl and clamp force is about 1800psi, our other bt40 mazak machine with hydraulic unclamp cylinder had a drawbar force of about 2400psi and being horizontal machine we run long tool holders with very hard cuts and have no problems with taper fretting. The other machine does fret tools when pushed hard.

[@brandonrenwick9125]

haas machines can cut steel easily, its all in the tools and toolpaths. We had a used 2001 vm3 cut 4140 pre hardened, 4340 pre hardened, 300m, and vascomax c300 for 4 years with no issues with cutting and very little with the machine, I replaced the drawbar springs once and rear waycover seal a few times all myself. make your tool selections and toolpaths for the machine you are using . dont take 50taper cuts on a 40taper, don't run a low performance machine like a high performance one and you will have good results. haas' machines are easy to work on and do not cost as much as others, do not expect a $120k mill to outperform a $220k mill of the same capacity.

[@weldmachine]

Very True.

[@guildtitan]

Tool breakage program P9853 is too slow. What can be done to make it a bit faster? As always your help is appreciated.

[@OakwoodMachineWorks]

You can find or write macros for fast tool breakage detection. 10/10 would crap their pants doing it the first time.

[@mannycalavera121]

HAAS are built to a price and a purpose. They're cheap and super easy to use. I love em. But they're not heavy cutters and you have to adjust to get good surface finishes. Horses for courses

[@williambedford4472]

We started off with a SMM2 which we traded up to a UMC500. We achieved faster removal rates with lower spindle loads on stainless 316 (Using MAFORDS V5LCB 5Flute & 380 9Flute Cutters). I dont know why more shops dont focus on waveform/trochoidal strategies, tools last longer & less pressure on spindles. 3axis /3+2 CAM is cheap we have Fusion 360 for 80% of our work. (We also use hypermill for the other 20%). Side Note: The High Speed Machining Add-on Is required in the Haas control for the look ahead to allow the above to work correctly.

[@claudiugalea3038]

what sim program do you use when you program in fusion for 5 axis?

[@williambedford4472]

@@claudiugalea3038 We only really use Fusion 360 for 3 / 3+2. We have the UMC500 CAD File. When we program a job we use the model of the bed and trunnion along with a model of our work holding ( We use a Mirco Loc 50 System, 100% recommend ). Above its all set to fixture in the setting of the fusion setup job Tab. After programing, fusion also has a basic simulation system which i have never had an issue with. Send to Machine and run 1st off with 5%Rapids and Optional Stop and Single Block when required to Prove. Cant go wrong unless someone skips a step or is not paying attention.

[@billstrahan4791]

Would have been just silly to take the part out and show off the surface finish. :)

[@AstroTools]

But anyways, about this graph... :P

[@guildtitan]

Do you mind sharing the macro program to zero out the spindle loads and DPRINT?

[@haasautomation]

Panzerclaws: Spindle load is measured by tool number. The macro variable numbers are #5801 (for tool #1) thru #5900 (for tool #200). The actual name of the variables are “Tool Load Monitors” and they record the largest load sensed while that tool number was in use. For example, If you use tool 6 and take a heavy cut, variable #5806 will record that load. Let’s say it was 104%. Then, for years every time you use tool 6 you take lighter cuts without resetting the variable, it will still be set to 104. I format the program this way. After each tool change, set the Tool Load Monitor variable to zero like this: T1 M6 #5801=0 ; ; T2 M6 #5802=0 ; ; Then, here is the code at the end of the program. The comments in parenthesis are just explanation and are not necessary: G103 P1 (Limit block look ahead to 1 block. Followed by 5 empty blocks) DPRNT[DATE /#3011[90]] (Outputs the date code, 2-digit year, 2-digit month, 2-digit day) DPRNT[TIME /#3012[90]] (Outputs the time code, 2-digit hour, 2-digit minutes, 2-digit seconds) DPRNT[TOOL 1 SP LOAD /#5801[30]] (Outputs the spindle load for tool 1) DPRNT[TOOL 2 SP LOAD /#5802[30]] (Outputs the spindle load for tool 2) DPRNT[TOOL 3 SP LOAD /#5803[30]] (Outputs the spindle load for tool 3) DPRNT[TOOL 4 SP LOAD /#5804[30]] (Outputs the spindle load for tool 4) DPRNT[--------------------] (Outputs dashes to form a line to separate the DPRNT output from the current run of the program to the next run) G103 M30 By default, the DPRNT output file will be written to the USER DATA folder in the machine control. The file name will be DPRNT.OUT and every time you run a program with DPRNT statements, they will append (add to) this file. You can change that with settings 261, 262 and 263. DPRNT.OUT is just a text file. You may need to edit the file name to DPRNT.txt (for example) so you can open it with a text editor or import it into a spreadsheet. Below is a copy of the DPRNT output file from the VF-2YT cutting steel. I ran the program 4 times. [John Nelson - Product Specialist] DATE /201123 TIME /124026 TOOL 1 SP LOAD /152 TOOL 2 SP LOAD /84 TOOL 3 SP LOAD /0 TOOL 4 SP LOAD /0 -------------------- DATE /201123 TIME /125351 TOOL 1 SP LOAD /152 TOOL 2 SP LOAD /84 TOOL 3 SP LOAD /109 TOOL 4 SP LOAD /6 -------------------- DATE /201123 TIME /141755 TOOL 1 SP LOAD /10 TOOL 2 SP LOAD /2 TOOL 3 SP LOAD /3 TOOL 4 SP LOAD /3 -------------------- DATE /201123 TIME /151306 TOOL 1 SP LOAD /155 TOOL 2 SP LOAD /83 TOOL 3 SP LOAD /110 TOOL 4 SP LOAD /6 --------------------

[@guildtitan]

@@haasautomation Awesome man! Thank you so much for sharing...

[@krynioooo]

Yeah Right one Part Show Off , I`m just wondering how long spindle will last with 95% spindle load when drilling.....or rough and finish with same cutter, perfect maybe for tool room not for big runners .

[@ostry599]

Right. Its machine for toolroom. For production are compleatly diffrent machines.

[@rossomyman]

100% load will run forever it’s 100% duty cycle. Any more over 100% load and it effectively lowers your duty cycle so you can only run 150% for maybe 30 minutes or so at a time. And then maybe 10 minutes or less at 200%

[@reallytiredmachinist]

What about stainless

[@dsfs17987]

notice the loss of deflection at around 12:58 at the end of the cut there when less flutes are engaged, it does clean up with the finishing pass, but still, seems quite a lot for a supposedly 30hp machine

[@M413]

they run on 30 Haaspower, not horsepower. two different things.

[@metzenw86]

Haas is the only machine builder that rates there spindles at 200% spindle load. They are really 15hp continuous spindles. The industry standard is max HP at a 30 min duty cycle. Typically 150% spindle load. That deflection has nothing to do with the spindle HP. It has to do with how unrigid these machines are. Poorly designed castings and still using Ball Linear guides instead of Roller guides. Also not offering a Dual Contact spindle is crazy. Most machine tool builders have been offering one for over a decade. Almost everyone has it standard now. A Haas will make chips, but I'd never build my machine shop with Haas. Maybe start it, but never build.

[@Foomanlol]

@@metzenw86 What you say about the spindles is definitely true an I agree, but as far as rigidity goes, yes they aren't rigid as other more expensive machines but the ROI and total package is what counts at the end of the day. They are offering HSK spindle options with most of their machines now. If you need to plow in tougher metals all day then maybe its not the right choice of machine. A friend paid 20k for a spindle change on their dmg mori after a crash while a Haas spindle is about 7k. Haas actually bothers to make videos of their products meanwhile competitors sit around in caves all day too scared to even share the price of the machines.

[@haasautomation]

@jz1199 - There is some spindle/tool holder/cutter deflection but this will be the case whenever you are pushing any machine in a heavy cut. There is always deflection to some degree. That is what finish passes are for. You need to take a finish pass if you are holding tolerance across a run of parts, so deflection becomes a non-issue.

[@haasautomation]

@Richard Wells - Our continuous horsepower is 22.5 hp (150% continuous) but the point is you can still run between 150% and 200% for 30 minutes. When was the last time you were in a continuous cut for more 30 minutes?

[@gertkristensen6451]

MAZAK AND DECKEL/MAHO MAKINO OKUMA WORKS FOR HEAVY CUTS

[@warrenmasters3036]

We cut 4130, A2, CPM3V, and aluminum all day long... 3 of our machines were made before the millennium... And I'm just an idiot button pusher who can adjust feeds and speeds based upon performance and sound...

[@ipadize]

is this a reupload?

[@capnthepeafarmer]

yes, it's a clip from their demo day.

[@rossomyman]

A 15hp spindle can easily cut steel fairly aggressively

[@Hendreh1]

Hello 🤠YT stands for KZbin?

[@vilts]

Extra Y travel

[@Hendreh1]

@@vilts ah nice

[@weldmachine]

LOL.

[@Charliechorizo]

Say no to Mazepin.

[@neobikes]

my forehead is too small for latter part of this video, especially that i am european and i cant calculate footpound per torque please, make more graphics for explanation. only talking is ... not enough :D

[@paulunglaub8427]

WOW Haas guys shitting on their customers

[@GuyFawkes911]

I feel really cheated with the 200% spindle load curve. Yes its the maximum, but you can only run it for 3 minutes. A better way would be to show 100% and 200%.

[@ostry599]

Trust me. Its very, very hard to make that 200% for 3 minutes.

[@vinnie302]

I program and run newer Haas VF2YT SS everyday and it’s driving me bonkers how this “engineer” is scoffing at 30-40 percent spindle loads. How much tool life is he expecting with that kind of axial and radial cut? At the end of the day it is possible to do this but to do this with any sort of tool life is laughable. I get it. It’s a good marketing technique. But what’s better is HSM and chip thinning. It’s fast, it’s fun, and it’s more efficient.

[@ralfsautomotive]

If the Machines are made for cutting Steel why are you putting these tiny T-Slots in there. 1/2" Fasteners for a 84" 60HP Machine?? Are you for real? True 60HP should be a minimum of 5/8" Hardware but 3/4" be best.