Hammers of War with Ben & Tom

Your weekly dose of Warhammer with Bem & Ton!
Be sure to check out the gang's personal channels:
Bem: / bedgars
Ton: / angorytom
#warhammer #yogscast #livestream #gaming
▬▬▬▬▬
:sparkling_heart: BECOME A MEMBER: / @yogscast
:shirt: Buy Yogscast Merch: store.yogscast.com/
▬▬▬▬▬
Keep up to date on The Yogscast here:
Twitter: / yogscast
Instagram: / yogscast
Facebook: / yogscast
Watch us live on Twitch.tv every day! / yogscast
▬▬▬▬▬
Production music courtesy of Epidemic Sound
Business enquiries: [e-mail]
Want to send something to us? Here's our address:
Lewis & Simon - The Yogscast
4th Floor - King William House
13 Queen Square
Bristol
BS1 4NT

[@xxlerroyxx]

Stream Starts at 12:05 Break ends at 1:42:21 I made some fun re-edits of the Warhammer trailers a year ago if you liked the first part of the stream.

[@kdhlkjhdlk]

"Not many people know this, but that is **the** warhammer." - 23:05 Sure, for fantasy, where they're allowed only one. But in the grim dark future, there are 40,000 warhammers.

[@MrCunningham4]

I really don't know if this is true or not

[@orangesilver8]

Oh wow that is actually very confusing that Cathay and Kislev aren't going to be in The Old World. That was like... what they all said it was going to be.

[@kamikazesopp]

2:33:40 all of this ball-joint chat just made me think it would be pretty rad if somebody made a Bionicle-version of a Necron. 🤣

[@Party4Lemons]

Stream starts at 12:00

[@valerieblackwell5765]

Break ends at 1:42:15

[@PokeNewbie]

So you're saying Lewis, who opens all his LEGO bags and puts all his pieces together in one pile making building LEGO exponentially harder, makes building Warhammers exponentially harder by clipping all the parts off the sprue and putting them together in one pile? Shocked Pikachu face.

[@totallycarbon2106]

Honestly if you are building a whole box of minis that's the way to do it - once you've built a couple to figure out how they go together

[@HPugwash]

The chaos warriors in Mark of Chaos are actaully just the knights who say Ni

[@NummiAFI]

"What's the deal with Beholders are th-..." "Lasers... and eeevil"

[@NummiAFI]

I was watching live but missed the first hour of the stream. Regarding Cathay and Kislev: I think Bon and Tem are conflating two separate issues here. It might just be personal taste, but I think design-wise both factions are generally great, with some shards of brilliance sprinked about here and there. The way armored Kossars are unique in both Warhammer and Total War for instance, with their short-range pistol lineup before receiving a charge. The way Kislevite units are missile/melee dualists is flavorful as well. Some of the missile and special units of Cathay are great designs, which would have blown us away as miniatures, if seen separate and before the game release. Same goes for Kislev I think, we would have loved them as a faction with models back in the day. It's just that mechanically we are VERY fatigued with Total War's campaign and battle systems by now (now being release of TWW3 and beyond). The grindy, repetitive campaign design, coupled with battle gameplay for both factions which just felt like you were playing High Elves & Empire with a different coat of paint on them really made the whole thing fall flat on it's face on impact. I think this is the major confusion though, as that feeling of frustration and a sense of being "scammed" with the new factions bleeds over to their narrative and visual design, which I feel is almost completely unwarranted. If both these factions were released separately as mini's unstained by the Total War gameplay mechanics, I genuinely think there'd be a lot less of this complete disregard for their design merits. I don't know, I feel like sometimes Tom and Ben can be a bit harsh of parts of this nerd space that don't necessarily need it. Mouth off on giant corporations as a punch up, but it feels bad when we're basically belittling the work of 30-50 designers and artists who probably had nothing to do with the negative aspects of the mechanical side or how the product turned out as a whole. (e: I know it's not mean-spirited, we're all just passionate about the fantasy world we fell in love with as kids.) I might just be a outlier with this though! What do you all think, how much have you enjoyed the Kislev and Cathay additions outside their gameplay aspects?

[@ioffdatiga]

I think you've hit the nail on the head (at least for me). Both factions could have made for fantastic miniatures, but good Lord, are they dull to play in-game. And, of course, TWW3's poor reception on launch didn't exactly make the best first impression. Without that association, Kislev and Cathay might have done quite a bit better.

[@Candlemancer]

I still think Kislev goes *way* too heavy on ICE AND BEARS. The mod that makes their light sleds horse drawn and gets rid of some ice stuff makes the faction feel much more natural and makes those more magical fantastical units stand out better.

[@Patricius_Roboticus]

I think you've misunderstood the criticisms, they don't like how kislev is thematically weak (Just bears and ice, don't really have a lot going on besides that) and cathay doesn't have a lot of lore, also the unit designs and that interesting from their point of view. Ben has played their campaigns and didn't seem to find the mechanically interesting and tom I think has only played kislev when they streamed it. Basically they don't like the factions when they've engaged with them.

[@JackPorter]

i don't like the mindset of "belittling the work of 30-50 designers and artists". you can critique the final product without also inherently speculating if the artists were rushed or just lazy. even if you do know exactly how an individual influenced the product and can pinpoint their work as what you dislike, it's still just the work that's criticized. for example: people say that they don't like Michael Bay, but what they mean is they don't like Michael Bay's direction, he probably works very hard doing what he does and is a genuinely nice person, but just working hard and being nice doesn't mean you can't "belittle" his work if you don't like what he's doing.

[@NummiAFI]

​@@JackPorter Very good point! Obviously there is some room in-between, in the way especially the movie and video game industries very much like to obscure the work put by tons of people into them, and the public accredits the works only to easily identifiable people (like Michael Bay). Criticizing a work on its own merits disconnected from 'personal' insult is a good thing to strive for though, and I was a bit harsh in my language.

[@MisterTingles]

I regret nothing about my involvement in the balljoint controversy.

[@jonathaniwasczyszyn2876]

1:42:23 end of break

[@shanadir]

The balance of the lord-slayer traits is so bad. Thoreks was amazing(flat +3 ap damage for the whole army) but others have immune to psychology(for the lord) or local income +8%...

[@Candlemancer]

Immune to psychology for the 3 lords in the game that don't just have that anyway.

[@ivyartemis2431]

my favorite is getting immune to vampiric attrition on while playing as undead

[@jdrum8378]

Keep on keeping on boys.

[@Aussie_Archmage]

3:11:25 Tom wants head from Darth Maul confirmed.

[@taylorbrecht8049]

My favorite Warhammer cinematic is that blood angels one with them all dying at their standard then the steel rain comes. Can't remember where it's from.

[@Curs3dSw0rd]

I think you're talking about the original dawn of war intro: kzbin.info/www/bejne/nXPKiXttmt6FpZY

[@taylorbrecht8049]

yeah, that one, thanks!

[@taylorbrecht8049]

yes, that's the one, thanks! @@Curs3dSw0rd

[@totallycarbon2106]

Love the streams but can we get edited vods back, please?

[@Machine_Cult]

Prefer that the streams are immediately on KZbin, better than twitch and can skip breaks easily

[@Scaggler]

They do edit them, it takes about the same time that it used to

[@Scaggler]

(ie expect by the weekend)

[@librarianseth5572]

Someone should make a mod faction that’s just the discontinued factions

[@oliverknox4391]

Why did you stop editing out the adds for other streamers?

[@totallycarbon2106]

Because they switched to the feature that means KZbin just uploads the vod automatically... Presumably because it costs less...

[@splinte111]

@@totallycarbon2106 which then also results in lower quality vods lol.

[@totallycarbon2106]

@@splinte111 yeah it's not great tbh but I can see *why* they do it since they also stream on KZbin now

[@MasterAferit]

they come back and edit them out later, but its available in full right away

[@frankiecedeno3724]

They multi-stream on Twitch and KZbin now so this is a native live stream not an upload if an edited Twitch Vod. If you look for this video it’s under the live tab not the videos tab.

[@oscaranderson5719]

I didn’t buy Total Warhammer 3 ‘cuz I already have 2 and I know they’re just gonna churn out $200 of DLC that’ll get slashed to $60 on a sale. it’s just not different enough to be worth it.

[@tannermattingly4462]

Having owned it...yeah. WH2 is really, really great. WH3 is like a poisoned apple though, there's just enough legitimately great quality of life increases that it's hard to return to WH2.

[@murphy7801]

I mean it is a better game except for the main campaign. But definitely wait so you can get it cheap.

[@oscaranderson5719]

@@murphy7801 yeah of course, I plan to buy it in like, uh, three to five years from now lol. basically when TW4 comes out and I know they’re done with the DLC

[@Machine_Cult]

Thank fuck for KZbin streams, twitch is mega shite

[@RauMins]

gaaaah I just want the chat links, I'm being blueballed