How Dumbledore MANIPULATED Voldemort from the Beginning - Messed Up Harry Potter Theory

[@HarryPotterTheory]

Thanks for watching folks! Check out my last 3 videos as well!: Why Didn't Dumbledore HUNT Voldemort Down?: kzbin.info/www/bejne/nmPbna2Pq6mniJo The Story of Voldemort's Daughter: kzbin.info/www/bejne/fny2fXV6aNyFkNE How Harry Resisted EVERY Unforgivable Curse: kzbin.info/www/bejne/kF68q4x-ociNarc

[@briesullivan883]

Note: Dumbledore had zero say in whether or not Tom Riddle attended Hogwarts - he wasn’t even the headmaster. And not even the headmaster gets a say. That is up to the Quill of Acceptance and the Book of Admittance with the Book of Admittance getting the final say.

[@lio1234234]

I'm just thinking that this probably wasn't the case. Because if Dumbledore had put that book about Horcruxes for Tom Riddle to find, then why at a later point would have needed to search for Horace Slughorn's true memory of the encounter?

[@saswataroy4099]

Hey can you please tell me the name of the background music you used in this video ?

[@saiyanwarrior3895]

lets not forget dumbleedore had other thing on hand tobeside riddle jr like help newt scamander and friends and hendry potters dealing with his from lover gallert grindelwald who had start revolution army call alliance was also add power durring those times 1942 until 1945 add world war 2

[@seankenno7]

The theory of dumbledore raising Harry and controlling his life isn’t really a theory, it’s the entire plot of the story

[@Larka661]

Dumbledore didn't tell Harry much because Dumbledore was afraid certain knowledge would corrupt Harry. Kinda like Riddle. Plus Dumbledore noticed that Harry shared a core with Voldemort, most likely in the second book, when he learned Harry could speak to snakes. So he was also trying to keep secrets from Voldemort.

[@sandro5535]

Hired Lockhard just to teach Harry a lesson. Screw every other student and their learning.

[@Larka661]

@@sandro5535 actually, Dumbledore hired Lockhart to hopefully get him exposed. Because several things Lockhart claimed to have done, Dumbledore knew who actually did them, thus knowing Lockhart was a fraud. After all, the defense against the dark arts job was cursed, I'm guessing Dumbledore was going to use that to expose him. But Harry and Ron ended up doing it for him 🤣

[@sandro5535]

@@Larka661 Guess thats kinda fair. Also why Snape was finally allowed once his use was over.

[@mlgmeistros4278]

​@@Larka661also, Harry does have a dark side. Think about him mutilating Malfoy or using the cruciatus curse on multiple occasions. Dumbledore didn't want to tempt him in any way.

[@harrigan4162]

I think it’s way easier to just kill someone than guide them to near immortality to kill them later

[@paulkiltie9388]

But didnt it have to be Voldemort who killed him to fulfill the prophecy?

[@abraham2172]

Dumbledore could not and would not kill a child or anyone else for that matter.

[@rahullak]

Dumbledore probably did not want to kill anyone. Knew too much of what it would do to his own soul. So this theory makes sense. It's also possible that there was some hope that the child would change for the better in the new school environment. But if not, then the plan was always to (mis)guide him to his fate.

[@rikk319]

@@rahullak So instead, Dumbledore let a multitude of other people die by allowing Voldemort to murder them, or his followers to murder them. In the real world, you go to jail if you have the opportunity to stop a capital crime but don't.

[@rahullak]

@@rikk319 It isn't the real world is it? You don't have people able to do incredible dark stuff with immortality in the real world. Central to this theory is that Voldemort was so irredeemable that the only way to end him was to (mis)guide him to final death. Or face the prospect of his immortal self killing many many more and never dying.

[@rebeccaorman1823]

The first problem that I see with this theory is that it maintains that Dumbledore wouldn't kill a young Tom Riddle. However, he would stand aside and let Tom Riddle kill six other people. At least one of them, Myrtle, a child herself. Anyone capable of doing the second would have been capable of doing the first.

[@Larka661]

Myrtle was Riddle's first kill

[@zigster1298]

I agree. Dumbledore wasn’t headmaster when Tom was learning about Horcruxes. I think this is a very important fact J.K. shows us. I don’t think there would have been such information in the library with Dumbledore as headmaster. I also don’t think there’s any way he plants a book called ‘Secrets of the Darkest Art’ for a student to find.

[@Larka661]

Dumbledore didn't have enough evidence against riddle at the time. Plus he had already made Horcruxes. And when Voldemort started wrecking havoc, Tom Riddle basically dropped off the face of the Earth. Dumbledore knew almost everything from the beginning, but due to not fully knowing how many Horcruxes Riddle might've made, killing him wouldn't be very helpful, would it? Dumbledore wasn't a killer, he defeated Grindelwald, but Dumbledore didn't kill him.

[@sakshamchaudhary8594]

No, I don’t believe that Dumbledore planted the book in restricted section. The book was already there. Slughorn was aware of this dark magic before only and mentioned that Dumbledore was against the very subject of Horcrux. When Dumbledore becamethe headmaster, one of the first steps he took was removing those books from the restricted section and keeping them in his office.

[@nafemurray6417]

Dumbledore would have had no final say over the library content as Dippit was the hm at the time. He was suspicious of Harry being a horcrux from birth. Hence why there were no books left in the library.. he was already trying to figure out what riddle had did incase he returned

[@loganmason6076]

If Dumbledore manipulated Tom to use horcruxes. Why would he need Harry to extract that knowledge from Slughorn? Doesn't make sense.

[@BF-I-II-V-V-III-VII]

He didn't need it. It was to manipulate Harry! 😂

[@navis_6383]

He didn't want to tell Harry.. He wanted him to know it by himself

[@lio1234234]

@@navis_6383 This wouldn't explain why Dumbledore was after the memory even before Harry was born...

[@LeoVS44]

So many comments with complex args against this theory, but this is the #1 simple flaw of it

[@t.j.armendariz354]

@@LeoVS44 also the fact that Dumbledore wasn’t able to remove the books until he became headmaster, meaning until then, several books, including secrets of the darkest art were left in the restricted section available to anyone with authorization to go there

[@Larka661]

I know Dumbledore was a good manipulator, but i dont see Dumbledore setting Tom Riddle up to become lord Voldemort.

[@barbiquearea]

Its likely he was keeping a close eye on Tom and hoping to find any excuse to get him sent to Azkaban. However Tom Riddle turned out to be far more slippery than he could imagine.

[@kubamcmillan3078]

I mean I know he was trying to get tom caught

[@jayduffy5532]

Come on riddle was already a fledgling sociopath fits right there in his dorm in wools all he really needed was a teensy tiny little boost a nudge in the right direction riddle was a genius all the teachers fell under his spell and with his good grades and his silver tongue he could get away with anything think for a moment he could have channeled that into anything he wanted the world was his for the taking he could have became a member of society he could have worked under the government to become a high ranking member he could have discovered numerous things either forgotten or lost look at how he found the cup he sweet talked the old lady and conned her elf to take her out of the picture and poofed the cup away imagine how he could have used that tongue to sweet talk any owner to part with their relic he could have done who knows what but the display by Dumbledore on his dresser on his letter day of his few things that were exclusively his alone turned him away from positively channeling his illness into twisted hate for all and any other bumps and nudges the old man gave him set him on the destructive path that we know and understand

[@Hari-kx2er]

​​​@@jayduffy5532 The question is why?? Are you saying that Dumbledore was bored after defeating Grindelwald and he was like" lemme manipulate this weird teenager to become the next dark lord, it has been so boring in the wizard World without a great villain. I can then play the saviour again, who cares if Innumerable people die "😂😂 P.S: Actually on his dresser, many of the items belonged to other students and Dumbledore only asked to return what did not belong to Riddle

[@stephanielim7967]

​@@Hari-kx2er good question. Why? Let's say Dumbledore did set the clock into motion. What if some part of him (a tiny residual darkness) was curious about horcruxes and planned this whole experiment. Around that time, it was probably him or big G who can attempt such a thing, but why risk his own life for an experiment. This is where Tom comes in. Although this theory is quite off canon, it's fun to think about.

[@moldyketchuphead]

One point that weakens this theory is Dumbledore's strong insistence that Harry retrieve the Horcrux memory from Slughorn. If this theory is correct he wouldn't have really needed that and he could have tested Harry in some other way.

[@shadow-lr8xg]

It could be that he needed to know how many horcruxes Voldemort has made, and with that, he can plan accordingly

[@Larka661]

@@shadow-lr8xg yes, Dumbledore knew Voldemort had made Horcruxes basically from the beginning. He just needed Slughorn's memory to know how many Voldemort made. Hell, Dumbledore knew Voldemort could and would return at the very beginning. His killing curse may have rebounded, but his soul was safe, if he had no Horcruxes, Voldemort would've died and there would be no story.

[@DealerDream82]

He knew Harry held the Felix potion.

[@phiefer3]

@@Larka661 eh, I don't buy that. The memory they retrieved was from before Voldemort had made any horcruxes, there's little reason to believe that just because Tom mentioned making 7 back then that that's how many he was going to make, he could have later decided to make more or fewer than that. Case in point, as far as Voldemort was aware he only made 6, as Harry being one was an accident. Further, there's no reason that Dumbledore would know or think that Voldemort would have told Slughorn how many he was eventually going to create.

[@willnestor6422]

Yes. Dumbledore wouldn't go through all this trouble of puppeteering Voldemort to not knowing how many horcruxces he would make

[@TV-ge3uj]

Yes, Dumbledore didn't tell Harry everything, just like he didn't tell anyone else everything (just ask Aberforth). But there is an even better reason that this theory does not work out: It would require a *lot* of knowledge about the upcoming decades, it might even require Dumbledore knowing that there might be a prophecy coming to help put Voldemort away (it's not as if Dumbledore and the Order of the Phoenix were anywhere close to dealing with this problem on their own). Voldemort got far too close to winning that war, if it was all planned ahead there should have been some kind of fail-safe.

[@gargoyles9999]

Which is weird since he’s the strongest wizard in the world plus has the elder wand. Big D could’ve soloed groups of death eaters at a time so I don’t understand how they were having a tough time of it.

[@TV-ge3uj]

@@gargoyles9999 Dumbledore is a teacher, first and foremost. The Ministry was the "other side" of the war, and with Barty Crouch Jr., they had infiltrated the very family of the one who had to organize the fight. Whatever the aurors were planning, Voldemort would get informed in advance. And the Death Eaters would have been stronger if Voldemort had ever been willing to fight together with his Death Eaters, instead of either the Death Eaters fighting or him.

[@ovo5228]

I will have to say, Dumbledore definitely was manipulative, he's not a bad person so to say, but rather seems to try to do it for either the greater good, or knowledge.

[@melvynvanleeuwen6617]

An that verry thing say all villain to him selff😂

[@Arnabiett]

This speaks volumes

[@jbear3478]

Yeah he's neutral good I guess?

[@Zeke_O3773]

Until Harry’s 4th year, there was no scenario where Harry would be able to live if Voldemort would be destroyed. It’s harsh, but that was the reality. It was Voldemort’s foolish idea to use Lilly Potter’s blood that gave Harry a chance to live in the end. If you had been Dumbledore, what would you have done? Keep Harry safe while tons of people are killed by Riddle?

[@matthewv4170]

​@@Zeke_O3773 they used Harry's blood

[@patrickdematosribeiro1845]

I find the theory interesting, but I am not convinced by it. Firstly, I don't think it was really Dumbledore's decision to offer Tom a place at Hogwarts. There are a quill and a book who choose the candidates and Dumbledore was not headmaster yet. Could he really just come back and say: "I didn't like the kid, so I chose not to offer him a place at Hogwarts."? Secondly the idea of manipulating Voldemort into making Horcruxes would only make sense if Dumbledore kept a close enough eye on Voldemort to find the Horcruxes and destroy them. If Voldemort believed to be immortal but wasn't, then it would be a weakness. But this is not what happened. When Dumbledore died years after Voldemort made the Horcruxes four of them (five if you include Harry) were still intact. Thirdly when he discusses Horcruxes with Tom Slughorn says that they are a banned subject at Hogwarts and Dumbledore is particularly fierce about it. This makes sense if several teachers knew about them and Dumbledore didn't want the students to know about them. But it doesn't make sense if teachers didn't know about them. How would this happen? Did Dumbledore approach one day Slughorn and tell him: "Don't tell students about Horcruxes." Slughorn: "I don't even know what a Horcrux is." Dumbledore: "I will explain it to you in detail, so you know exactly what you shouldn't teach the students."? If Horcruxes were a banned subject and Dumbledore was responsibble for the ban and I don't see why Slughorn would lie to Tom about this, then it would be very suspiscous for him to explain them to Slughorn.

[@annavafeiadou4420]

100% agree with you plus If Dumbledore set Slughorn to give info to Tom about horcruxes then why he needed the memory and why even Slughorn had to modify it in the first place it doesn't make sense.

[@NikoJokipalo]

Agreed. Also, why would Dumbledore spend so long gathering the memories to figure things out, if he was the mastermind all along? He didn't need them to persuade Harry either, as he could've just told Harry who blindly would follow his orders regardless

[@LQTu]

@@annavafeiadou4420 IIRC Dumbledore wanted to know how many horcruxes Tom intended to make. And Slughorn modified his memory because of shame. If Dumbledore explained to Slughorn about horcrux and told him not to teach it to students, and Slughorn did just that because he liked Tom --> Then it's understandable Slughorn would deny everything when Dumbledore asked him.

[@jenlfpotter3870]

Couldn't have put it better myself. The whole of Slytherin house wouldn't have attended Harry and co's 7 years at Hogwarts save one, Malfoy, if Dumbledore had been in a position to choose who went to Hogwarts and who did not.

[@Tasha9315]

Also, creating a horcrux invovled murder, so I don't think Dumbledore would purposely place a path for Tom Riddle that required him to murder others. Plus, if he made Slughorn give the info to Tom Riddle, he would have conversed with Slughorn about Sluggy's conversation with Tom Riddle way back when Tom was still in school.

[@evelyngrammar]

Yeah - this one is really out there. I am no fan of Dumbledore. However, I think the time when Dumbledore visited Riddle in the orphanage he figured out he was a trouble kid but I don't think he had any clue how far it would go. I can't imagine that any teacher (he was not yet the headmaster) would willingly invite someone they knew was destined to be a dark wizard to a school for children. I believe he thought the school could help the young orphan and direct him to a better life.

[@PaintingMeJosh]

My issue with this theory is: what's the point of the entire The Half-Blood Prince book/movie then, if not to retrieve Slughorn's unaltered memory for the pensieve? How does that play in?

[@Larka661]

Dumbledore knew about the Horcruxes, but he needed Slughorn's memory to have an idea of how many Voldemort made. Plus, since Harry was (unknowingly) a Horcrux, he could Sense the others. Harry got more information in the 6th book than any of the others. That's why he basically sent Harry to find and destroy them.

[@PaintingMeJosh]

@@Larka661 I've been rereading the series, and when I got through Half-Blood Prince I realized this is true. I've watched the movies far more so what I was remembering was how the fake memory in the movie muffles the word "Horcrux." I was just assuming it was the same in the book. As for this theory, I do still question why Dumbledore would intentionally allow any student, especially one he thought would grow up to become a dark wizard, to learn about Horcruxes.

[@BruceMount]

While I love your videos and applaud you for coming up with this theory, I just don't seen how it's "easier" to eliminate Voldemort after letting him get horcruxes. It seems it would have been way WAY easier to remove Voldemort if he never had horcruxes. Still, I love your channel!

[@djb9267]

Dumbledore didn't have evidence to lock him up.

[@LycaonsMemories]

@@djb9267 there are more ways to "eliminate" than just imprisonment also i imagine in a world of magic and prophecies, there is a way to check the probability of the future.

[@djb9267]

@@LycaonsMemories Forgive me if i am wrong, but Mcgonagall said that Deviation is one of the most unexplored Branches of magic. I don't remember the exact quote, I believe it was in Half blood prince.

[@LycaonsMemories]

@@djb9267 i think mcgonagall said it was worthless lol, and whatever its teacher said that. so yes i imagine that was said. but that still doesnt change my comment

[@djb9267]

@@LycaonsMemories we have seen in trelawney's classes that there are ways to tell the future. But it's very open to speculation, it wouldn't be enough to just expell one of the best students of hogwarts.

[@zeals936]

I don’t see Dumble getting bored since Grin went to Azkaban so as to create this situation for fun. He wanted everything for the greater good. Killing hundreds of magical folks doesn’t mix with his morals. His sister died and grew empathy for love and life. Muggle or magic. Plotting evil seems to be far fetched. Especially if it leads to his own death. It would be the most dramatic death taking as many as he could, without it being him.

[@MitchMitchellStories]

Well... I have a few things to say. I'm going to start with this, something I've never uttered in person before. No matter what Dumbledore said to Snape, I think he knew all along that Harry wasn't going to die. He knew there was a horcrux inside Harry, and there wasn't anything written that said when someone broke open a horcrux that if it was something alive that it would die. We've had multiple stories of people who said they felt like they were in limbo before coming back; that's where I think Harry was, and since he was able to answer every question he asked Dumbledore while he was in there, I think it was his imagination that figured everything out before he awakened. Second, I have multiple problems with this current theory. True, Dumbledore could have manipulated Riddle in some way, and possibly also Slughorn, but it would have taken a bunch of coincidences for any of those later events to come to fruition. He didn't seem to know about the diary until Harry gave it to him after killing the spirit of a young Voldemort. I have the feeling that it wasn't until after that situation is when Dumbledore decided to study up on how horcruxes were created, at which time Slughorn would have already been gone... and we have to add that the book on horcruxes never mentioned what would happen after one was cracked open, since the guy who created the first one never had an opportunity open his, which means Dumbledore was actually the first person to crack one open and that's when he learned what had to be done. In general, not a bad theory; I just can't see it happening that way.

[@miriamshv]

Dumbeldore invited Riddle to school because it was his job. Boy was a wizard and it was their job to send a teacher to every muggle born to explain and invite. Dumbeldore hid books when he became headmaster. Slughorn was a knowledgeable capable wizard probably also knowledge in dark arts. After all, he was a slithering head.

[@robertmartin4449]

It’s not a “theory” that Dumbledore manipulated Harry and Snape, He did do that.

[@MarkvanBuskirk]

Dumbledore did keep the idea that Harry would have to sacrifice his life from both Snape and Harry. Seems like it was necessary though. Also he kept that Harry might live if he martyred himself. Once again that was probably necessary, Harry had to believe he was sacrificing himself in order to survive potentially?

[@827shunbun]

Do keep in mind that in order to create a horcruxes, one also has to murder someone. With that being said, Dumbledore in the end condemned 7 people to death.

[@super_capybara1]

idk if you noticed but I saw your old video of you explaining how Ms Weasley killed Bellatrix Lestrange, and I think I know what "spell" Ms Weasley used in the new Hogwarts legacy game your character can weald an "ancient magic" and in one of the start boss fights you use that magic to do a "finisher" that looks just how Bellatrix Lestrange died.

[@KvDenko]

I think the thing about Dumbledore is that he never truly left the ideology that him and Grindelwald started, he just rerouted himself but still working "for the greater good"

[@LycaonsMemories]

was Dumbledore a manipulator yes, did he manipulate tom.. most likely. did he set tom on the way of horcruxes, i dont think so. when we find out that voldy is doing horcruxes, it is expressed that Dumbledore was also surprised. why would he act surprised if it was part of his plan from the start? it does nothing if harry knew dumbldeore knew or didnt.

[@LKGaming69]

Love your videos please keep them coming

[@Pfiffo922]

i like to think that dumbledores plan with tom was to create a new strong ally like he had with grindelwald. in order to pursue dumbledores former ideology of beeing supreme to muggle born . But tom as grindelwald before took it way to far so dumbledore had to screw that plan . So late on he needed harry to make up for his mistake of creating lord voldemort

[@jkrause365]

It's all very interesting. The theory also sounds plausible. But I question if Dumbledore was that much of a gambler, a risk taker. There seems to me to be too many turns of events that could have turned the tables against Dumbledore. For instance what if Draco Malfoy had succeeded in murdering Dumbledore? What if Riddle/Voldemort had decided to mark Neville Longbottom instead? What if Voldemort had decided not to murder James & Lily Potter, but to bide his time instead?

[@SerathDarklands]

I know killing a child is distasteful, but Voldemort filled literal graveyards with the people he killed. From a cursory look on the internet, he killed at _LEAST_ 170 people, and that's just confirmed kills. I absolutely think Dumbledore should have executed Tom Riddle the moment it became apparent that was the kind of path he was on. Sure, he wouldn't have known right in the orphanage, but given Voldemort's complete lack of empathy, it was likely fairly clear quite early on that he was going to be a horrible dark wizard.

[@mlpfanboy1701]

You cant kill someone strictly on what they might do.

[@SerathDarklands]

@@mlpfanboy1701 No, but once his first murder came to light, Dumbledore should have hunted him down and executed him. To be fair, though, that's a whole other discussion. If you could prevent a tragedy, should you? That's hard to answer, because what if the prevention of one tragedy allows for an even greater tragedy to happen? So yeah, it's possible that without a Lord Voldemort, an even more evil witch or wizard would have risen.

[@rahullak]

Dumbledore probably did not want to kill anyone. Knew too much of what it would do to his own soul. So this theory makes sense. It's also possible that there was some hope that the child would change for the better in the new school environment. But if not, then the plan was always to (mis)guide him to his fate.

[@real90sjesus]

dumbledore was an Alchemist at heart. He didn't do things for "good" as we first understood as pre-teens and teens. He did EVERYTHING from little TR to little HP simply to watch, document, analyse and resolve things as they unfold. A great example of this is the aftermath of harry's name appearing on the goblet of fire.

[@eranshachar9954]

WOW! I love that theory or at least parts of it. No doubt Albus Dumbledore was a master manipulator but I don't think he intended to make Tom evil on purpose. Yes I know Tom was already evil but I think that in the beginning Dumbledore hoped to give the boy a chance for better life. Only when he saw in what direction Tom is marching he manipulated and annoyed him a lot. And if your theory is true that means he also manipulated Slughorn in the process. But I think Slughorn may had dark wizards in his family and therefore knew about dark magic and decided to be different.

[@HarryPotterTheory]

Thanks Eran! Bit of a stretch but it was fun to think about

[@eranshachar9954]

@@HarryPotterTheory You are a brilliant man. And I am surprised you never run out of ideas.

[@allgomesareevil6121]

Nah Dumbledore is not this cleaver, neither this cruel. He might have had his suspicions about Tom from the start. But hope he would be proven wrong by Tom. Like of his friend Grindelwald. But it is interesting he would put so much stock in the prophecy about Harry. That might be a fault in D character, It make him free of responsibility in his inaction and action he would do with Harry and distance himself from things as it was with Grindelwald and death of his sister.

[@annavafeiadou4420]

Lets accept for a moment that this theory has some truth then it's "I'm going to take this untrained wizard who if stays in a muggle world will be able to do some nasty things but will stay untrained and his magical abilities will be dull compared to an educated wizard , then educate him perfectly well giving him all access to the most powerful normal and dark magic, refine his abilities , socialise him with fellow wizards which can manipulate , make him prefect so he can have even more influence to others ,let him roam the school open the chamber of secrets set up Hagrid , then roam the magical world set up his network of nazi-wizards let him gain immense power terrorise torture and murder for years, have magical items hidden who knows where that keeps him in this world which he murdered real people to create just because one day I might have managed to manipulate another underage wizard to destroy his horcruxes if he finds them and finds how too do so and then after all those horrible years and stuff the soul of the dark wizard will be fractured and weak." ain't that completely stupid an uneducated Tom might have become a dangerous thug maybe even a serial killer but the educated one was a dark lord a dictator who terrorised a whole country and this because of those things he learned and the socialising he did in magical school. A good "manipulation" tactic for avoiding dark lords would be better guarding the restricted session in school library , not allowing prejudiced ideas as "pureblood" ideas are to be spread at school and having a curiculum to oppose them and also keeping an eye on students antisocial behavior and act to correct it p.e. like not let them bully or curse one another for fan or any reason those would be a good start. What I would consider possible is that Dumbledore saw Tom as a troubled youth but not evil , and wanted to reform Tom , make him good and manipulate Tom to use him against Grindelwald whom he didn't want to duel himself , maybe even teach him about horcruxes in the fear that Grindelwald had already made one himself so that Tom would manage to destroy it but when he saw that Tom became more evil the more magic he learned, and also was so intrigued by horcruxes in the bad way then Dumbledore saw how evil Tom was and abandoned the plan and faced Grindelwald himself but as about giving Tom the tools to become a new dictator the harm had already been done and there wasn't a way to undo that, like a failed manipulation effort that gone bad (and proves why manipulation is a bad strategy)

[@LordChaosHavik]

"Ha! Just wait till Tom gets to the part where he kills Lily and James. He'll realize his error all to late, all according to keikaku."

[@RFGfotografie]

Very interesting theory, almost being told like it is fact. Very well made.

[@zendoargos4988]

Dumbledore was certainly manipulative, there is no questioning that. To have secretly guided Tom Riddle to making Horcruxes though? That's a very interesting idea. To believe that, you would have to accept the idea that Dumbledore knew Riddle was both capable of and willing to comit murder and that Dumbledore was willing to accept those murders. For the greater good is a phrase that haunts Dumbledore and this theory sounds like a perfect example of that. Dumbledore accepts that Riddle will not only murder people to achieve his goals, but he will do so in ways that he is able to get away with. That's a pretty big leap of faith by Dumbledore that allowing Riddle to get away with murder would make him easier to defeat in the longrun.

[@eevvaann11]

I believe it could work. If somehow Dumbledore had knowledge of the future events like the seer prophecy for harry.

[@nickp8117]

the only flaw i see in this…why did slughorn not blame dumbledore when harry wanted the memory in half blood prince if dumbledore told him everything about horcruxes

[@ot.fa.7862]

Did Dumbledore actually place a book about horcruxes for Tom to find? That means Dumbledore was fine with Tom killing others before he is defeated

[@chinlin8933]

I never saw anywhere that he did that. On the contrary, he hid the book in his office. It was not in the restricted section. You are right. He would not have planted a book so Tom Ridle could become so evil and kill lots of people so that more than one of him had to be killed. I don’t get it.

[@brianarnold8666]

Its theorized that the horcrux books were already in the restricted section when armondo dipit was the headmaster. Dumbledore took it out when he took office

[@JohnDoe-zw8vx]

"Raised like a pig for slaughter" is always taken out of context. Those were Snape's words, not Dumbledore's and Dumbledore didn't correct Snape because Harry needed to believe he was going to die. The look of triumph Dumbledore gets at the end of book 4 when he finds out Voldemort used Harry's blood to complete the spell only makes sense if Dumbledore wanted a way for Harry, the "pig", to survive the slaughter.

[@barbiquearea]

Its possible that Dumbledore being the visionary that he was, saw that the Wizarding World needed some drastic changes. After all the MOM was corrupt and ineffectual, most wizards were racist towards muggle-borns and non human magicians. And then we have to consider that Hogwarts itself was pretty backwards and stuck in tradition. Things needed to change. And while Dumbledore might have been able to make sweeping reforms as minister, I think even he realized it would take more than him stepping up into a position of authority to bring lasting changes to Britain's wizarding society. Something drastic had to be done, that was to create a great enemy the Wizarding World can unite behind and defeat.

[@Turtle-k4x]

Well, firstly, that makes sense. Slughorn told Tom that Dumbledore was fiercely against knowledge of horcuxes not be even discussed at Hogwarts. How would Horace know that? He would know it if he had had a conversation with Dumbledore previously. Secondly, Merlin's saggy boxers! Have you ever heard of a long term "plan" where more things could go wrong? What if Voldemort',s horcuxes couldn't be found and destroyed? Like if he made an empty Coke can a horcrux and then dropped it into the middle of the Atlantic ocean? If Dumbledore was playing a long game of manipulation with either TR or HP he was willing to accept an almost astronomical number of things that could and probably would go wrong. Not a good plan at all.

[@TheWanderingFire]

This theory would indicate that Dumbledore was always a dark wizard; manipulating Riddle to learn about horcruxes guarantees at least one murder by him, and the possibility of several. Everything about Dumbledore indicates a person who has made mistakes in the past and has firmly rejected the philosophy that caused those errors. I agree that Dumbledore was keeping an eye on Riddle, but I don't believe he would deliberately make him a worse person.

[@FallenxMalo]

He could have also walked inside the orphanage and bombard Tom Riddle with Avada Kedavra a bit. Just a few dozen times to make sure he is dead. Problem solved.

[@madelynpryor9797]

I think your theory is correct. In 'the half blood Prince' Dumbledore tasks Harry to find out Slughorns secret. When they do, Dumbledore seems shocked to learn Voldemort made horcruxes. But in 'Deathly Hallows' we see in Snapes memory that Dumbledore knew all along that Harry was a horcrux. Now it's possible that he thought that it was basically an accident and Voldemort didn't even know about horcruxes. But in 'chamber of secrets' he says Tom Riddles diary held apart of him, (a horcrux) and he knew enough to destroy the ring, and look for the locket. If Dumbledore did indeed know about the horcruxes and only feigned ignorance then he had Harry "discover" the secret and set him on the mission to find and destroy the rest so when Harry realizes that he is a horcrux he'll be more able to accept that he has to die. It would also mean that he knew from the beginning that Voldemort was using horcruxes but he sent Harry to find out /how many/ he had created and Slughorn confirms this with his memory in the pensive when Tom asks about how many times the soul could be split and he gives the "theoretical" number seven to Slughorn, who is rightfully horrified at the thought.

[@huckleberrydew5079]

I think some people in the comments may have the wrong idea. From a few i read i get the impression that they think op is implying that Big D pulled the strings that made tom riddle into voldy. However i think what op is getting at is Big D knew tom would become evil and get immortality regardless of what he did, so he put the book there so that when the time came he would know what kind of immortality voldy had. Magic is very hard to defend against if you have absolutly 0 clue about how and what that magic is. He purposfully gave him this book(put in library) so he COULD be defeated.

[@theoncomingstorm8009]

If only Dumbledor had been a posiive role model in Tom's life then Tom may not have become so evil. Tom could have just become a wizard like Sirus Black. I know. Let's leave the restricted section unguarded and allow the most powerful wizard of that time to be tempted and coruppted. This is bad for Dumbledor.

[@LucaNoire]

Ahh yes, Albus Percival Wolfrick Brian Dumbledore. The Benevolent Machiavellian..

[@brianhartling7767]

Oh, there is no doubt that he manipulated Harry and Snape to bring down Voldemort. It is also highly likely that he actually knew the road ahead to some extent though his crafted actions. The part that doesn't make sense is why they went down that road when there are some many other ways to go about taking down Volemort.

[@angelgomez5612]

But if Dumbledore planted the idea of Horcruxes why would he need to get Slughorn’s correct memory :|

[@Yeahnotgonnahappen]

Love it! Not sure dumbly knew it was horcruxes though. Not sure WHY there WOULD be a book on them at all but it makes more sense that it was planted than it was JUST THERE. but manipulation of harry to manipulate slughorn JUST to find out they were infact horcruxes after he destroyed one seems far fetched. And him destroying one not knowing what it was leading to his death kinda disproves he planted the book. But, i do buy he setup Tom, not to make him easier to kill but bc Dumbledore wanted fame before his death. he recruited Tom before he knew his lover was gonna be his biggest opponent so my guess was he was constantly recruiting potential opponents so that he could make a name for himself before his own death, which he did. So i think his entire tenure at Hogwarts, including harry, was all to recruit potential opponents for him to famously duel with his secret Elder wand

[@DefiantSix]

About the only way this theory makes any sense is if after the conflict with Grindelwald, Dumbledore never abandoned his Wizard Supremacy doctrine. What if, he used this orphan child of a love potion as a means to cull from the wizarding herd many of the most obstinate of the "blood purity" fanatics, in favor of magical meritocracy regardless of blood status.

[@mcathawk1490]

One question I’ve always had…if Voldemort intended to make 7 horcruxes, why did he stop at 6? He did make 7, but one of them unknowingly.

[@Dilmahkana]

Isn't it 8 with Harry?

[@mcathawk1490]

@@Dilmahkana book, ring, locket, diadem, cup, Nagini. I can’t think of any more. I could be wrong though.

[@jimsullivan696]

Perhaps Dumbledore knew that if Tom Riddle never split his soul, he’d have been too powerful to defeat. So the theory makes sense to me. Plus we all know that Dumbledore craved power, but like a former drinker with alcohol it was best not put directly in his hands.

[@andrewposner6703]

This theory doesn’t make sense at all. One thing that is always bothered me is why Dumbledore feels that getting Slughorn’s memory is so important in the first place. It’s pretty clear that Tom asked him about Horcrux‘s, And they don’t think hearing Slughorn’s answer matters at all. The only thing that I can think of is that it needs to confirm what Dumbledore thinks is the modification to the memory. If Dumbledore was behind it, he would just need to explain what a whore crux is, and he could use the fake memory and fill in the blanks for Harry. I also don’t think that Dumbledore ever planned on Harry dying. He needed Harry to believe that he would die to be willing to die in order for his plan to work. That’s why Snape had to think that he planned on Harry dying.

[@riffbw]

If Dumbledore was guiding Tom into dark paths, it was to further the collective knowledge of dark magic. He himself couldn't push any further down that path, but he could guide others down the path. I completely reject the theory proposed as Dumbledore is a Gryffindor. Had he been a Ravenclaw, then the theory would hold more weight with me. Seeking knowledge, even through manipulating others, of the unknown is a Ravenclaw thing to do. Someone with the evil tendencies/nature of Dumbledore would absolutely consider the route in this theory. When going down this path, you should also highlight how Dumbledore's Order of the Phoenix are doing more than the MoM to stop Voldemort. Given the idea that Dumbledore is responsible, he would also feel responsible for keeping Voldemort in check. Putting innocents in harm's way is not in Dumbledore's nature. I also think this would answer the question of "why didn't Dumbledore confront Voldemort directly?" He refused to confront him because he wanted to see how far it would go. Only after seeing the final results, did he have to take extreme measures to defeat Voldemort restore peace. PS. I generally despise Dumbledore and love the theories about his evil nature, but this one is too much for me.

[@24934637]

Sounds convincing to me. Ever since I got a bit deeper into HP than just watching it at Christmas, I've always thought that Dumbledore was FAR from what he seems on the surface. He's former leader of the Wizengamot, and NO ONE gets far in politics being honest and trustworthy! He once was in league with Gelert Grindelwald, and despite them having a lovers tiff, there is no reason to believe that he actually changed his views, he just kept them secret. I suspect that he didn't want any other 'dark wizards' around because HE wanted to be the one with ALL the power, even if he didn't use it or show it!

[@zibertscream]

If Dumbledore was responsible for setting up this Horcruxes trap for Tom, then why on earth did he need the Slughorn's memory of telling about Horcruxes to Tom? This just doesn't make sense, Dumbledore could just tell Harry about Tom's Horcruxes without bringing Slughorn into this story. He could explain this knowledge to Harry, literally any way, cause Harry by that time trusted Dumbledore 1000%. So, I think this storyline with Slughorn and his memory denies the part of the theory where Dumbledore sets up the Horcruxes trap for Tom

[@baraka490]

This would be actually pretty cool they should make a game where you play as Dumbledore as a kid throughout his life you see what actually happened

[@WaggaDaBagga]

There are many mistakes here! Albus Dumbledore is not a manipulative man, he is a good wizard and very wise by nature and had a wise mind. in the head. He was the headmaster of the school of witchcraft and wizardry in the castle "Hogwarts". He had the Vulcan (bird) Phoenix. And the hat that chooses houses. And the Sword of Gryffindor. His best friend is Professor of Dark Arts (the half-blood prince) Severus Snape (Slytherin). And all the teachers liked Albus very much. The only one who didn't like him is: Tom Riddle Junior (Marvolo) a family member of the Gaunt family (full blood witches). Like, for example, his birth mother (biologically) Menrope. His Father a Muggle blood born. Tom Junior who changes his name to Prince Voldemort (evil wizard) Also known as the Dark Lord. With the help of a drop of blood from Harry Potter, Tom Riddle Senior bone(scaly bones). Under the direction of his help assistant (loyal) Peter Pettigrew also known as worm tail (Vormtail). (Gryffindor). Tom Jr. (Riddle) is the true Manipulator by nature. Because he has no empathy and care for others (those he naturally hates and dislikes). Especially Muggles. He also knew Parseltongue (snake language). Hear them and understand them. (Which are the abilities in the Gaunt family). The only thing Albus Dumbledore did was visit him as a young boy at the Orphanage he was born in (birth home to Tom Jr. (Riddle)). And welcomed him as a student at Hogwarts. Everything else that happened, Tom Jr. (Riddle) did all by himself out of free will. Because he wanted to eliminate everyone he hated and didn't like. By Nature.

[@benmoore4324]

It's a good theory. I had a thought that Dumbledore set up the meeting of Harry and Ron on the Platform.

[@wanderhillen2435]

I must say I have my doubts. The entire theory hinges on the fact that Dumbledore somehow knew that Riddle would start murdering people in the future yet chooses to allow this because it would make him easier to defeat in the future. This leaves the gaping plot hole that Dumbledore is Dumbledore and he could defeat anyone at anytime. So why wait? Why not Avada Kedavra him in the orphanage, or if that is too much then why not kill him as soon as he starts a serious ascent into Dark Lord territory? Why wait until he has killed hundreds of thousands? Dumbledore has so many ways of dealing with an evil boy that don't include allowing mass murder, so unless he's doing it for the lulz I see no reason why Albus would ever choose this way over a more expedient one.

[@headstrongbachelor3152]

Why do people have such a need to discredit Voldemort and make Dumbledore as a villain?

[@ganrimmonim]

I really can't see Dumbledore doing anything as evil and cruel as this.

[@vegamctavish]

As much as I like Dumbledore as a character, he’s not the lovely, quirky old man as you might expect at the first instance. He was willing to sacrifice people for the greater good (Harry, Snape etc.) and it was clear that he put all this tokens into position during the whole series. I would say he was in general very manipulative.

[@grec.]

This theory makes a lot of sense. Specially knowing how Dumbledore manipulated Harry as well. Maybe Voldemort was a failed case that went out of his control and he carried on with Harry to achieve glory for himself, but ultimately his remorse for Ariana's death made him commit a deadly mistake and he didn't have any other choice than to change plans and let Harry be victorious.

[@adamross1596]

Dumbledire raised Harry the way he did for the right reasons. Harry went to the dark forest willingly, knowing his "fate." He lived to tell the tale, which Dumbledore also knew would happen.

[@TheRealCardoso]

I just thought of something but I could be wrong. Didn’t Voldemort go to school w some of his closest death eaters like Lucius & McNair? But if that’s the case shouldn’t they be much older since Voldemort died in his 70s?

[@drkrbrown]

The slughorn-dumbledoor part of the theory does not jive with the book six memory retrieval challenge ...

[@willnestor6422]

Good theory but I definitely disagree. Armando Dippet was headmaster at the time of Tom Riddle's attendance and although Dumbledore disapproved of the book he never placed it there. Horace was an extremely intelligent and competent wizard. Enough for Voldemort to want to recruit him. He was also a Slytherin and may not have dabbled in the dark arts but probably was certainly intrigued to study it. Can't say for sure but way more likely. Regulus knew about them as well so it's not unlikely Horace wouldn't. Lastly. Makes no sense for Dumbledore to manipulate Voldemort into making horcruxes, informing Horace but not manipulating how many he would make...

[@davidmiddleton7958]

A thought, if Dumbledor manipulated Voldamort, did Dumbledor manipulate the bearer of the Philosophers Stone to share some with Dumbledor?

[@jeiillson]

Dark wizard? I know Dumbledore did some dubious things when he was younger with Grindlewald, but he was never a dark wizard

[@jim2292]

Final battle Dumbledore, Voldemort, Snape vs. Harry, Ron, Hermione

[@mlgmeistros4278]

To be fair, Tom Riddle didn't say: "I like hurting other children" he said: "I can make bad things happen to those who were mean to me."

[@Lucian.L.]

Dumbledore played Tom Riddle like a Fiddle.

[@wildefice1]

Interesting theory but i dont think dumbledore would ever leave the book containing horcruxes in an easily accessible part of the restricted secion. Dumbledore has always cared deeply for and respected the power and sanctity of a soul, so i doubt he would ever lead a student, however indirectly, to follow such a path. Leading people to their deaths? Sure! NP 😊 Tricking a former enemy to serve you by promising to save the very people he was already protecting? Say no more fam! But anything regarding a persons soul is a hard line he has never crossed. Dude blew a gasket when he found out dementors walked around his school. He was furious when he found put Crouches soul was destroyed, and he willingly let Snape kill him, not only to weaken/confuse the elderwand, but to protect young Malfoy's soul. Dumbledore has always been very consistent with the preservation of souls.

[@davidmarsden192]

Very interesting! Well done!

[@antoinetteponzo1569]

Wow, this is really dark. I know Dumbledore was manipulative and shady but this is next level.

[@joshelias8472]

Something Im not clear on. If he knew about horcrouxes, how come he needed slughorns memory?

[@jessejohnson8365]

As grey as Dumbledore can be this is absolutely evil and vile for this to be likely Dumbledore planning to entice a young boy with dark arts facination to learn about something that requires that person to not just murder someone but to essentially damn themselves to hell in the process. All to defeat them they type of person that would plan and carry out this plan would not only be insane by assuming someone cannot change laying on them sins they havent committed yet but could one day as justification to influence them enough that they murder someone in the process splitting there self and condeming them to hell unless they can show remorse enough to heal the tear not die in the process before the heal is complete or they are doomed forever. Thats umbridge fudge levels of evil allowing dementors to feast and destroy imortal souls of there victims. No one has the right to pass a sentence like that except God.

[@AnhNguyen1986]

It makes no sense to lead Voldemort through all the Horcruxes thing and then let someone else destroy all of them.

[@MountaindewM]

If Dumbledore was ever a real gangsta he would have walked into Voldemort's room at the Orphanage and lit him up and left like nothing happened. Remember it's magic and there would be no visible marks on him.

[@scottwhite5937]

Why would dumbledore need slighorns memory so bad if he already knew about the horcruxes

[@simoxeh]

My biggest issue with this theory is that he wouldn't have done nothing once Myrtle died. Plus if he was really keeping that close an eye on him, even if he didn't notice Myrtle was his victim, he would have noticed when all of his family dies. This means either we give Dumbledore too much credit or he let's lots of people die for just the right moment to strike. I don't think he would have hesitated to subdue Tom if he had actual evidence and really knew.

[@michealmurphy8985]

I always thought they had like a father and son relationship. Thats why they were afraid of eachother and dumbeldore just used harry because he didnt have the hart to kill him. I think he was going to do it untill he found out about malfoy. And thats why he started showing harry the horcroxs

[@Didymus20X6]

"A lot more about Dumbledore than meets the eye." Is he Autobot or Decepticon?

[@jbear3478]

Once again, the thin line between Gryffindor and Slytherin is so apparent

[@baraka490]

The thing that bothers me about Dumbledore that I can't stop thinking is that an oracle is making a prediction a prediction can change so my thing is why did Dumbledore not bother to even try to change what happened or what is going to happen why did he not try why did he literally make sure that this was how it was going to go down he could have prevented all of this at Tom Riddle but he did not he let Voldemort come in and take over Tom Riddle and make a monster he could have prevented all of it but no he did not care cuz if he did none of this would have happened

[@teddyhh9947]

To be fair voldemort seems like a much more talented magician than Dumbledore. Being on almost equal grounds with Dumbledore after only 50 years, where a large portion was spent either in childhood or regathering himself after the Potter family massacre. Also the Voldemort that were on almost equal footing with dumbledore had already split his soul 7 times

[@theghustler]

Nahhhhh I don't think so bro, if Dumbledore already knew about the Horcrux then he would not have asked Harry to make Slughorn give him his memory of Slughorn telling Tom about the Horcrux. What you said is partially correct but not entirely!!

[@jameswest981]

It matters not,what we are ,but rather what we chose to be Dumbledore sensed dark magic or evil in young Tom riddle,but gave Tom a second chance to see if he would turn away from the Darkside if u will.

[@diegomartinez7180]

I think there is a big flaw on your theory: Let's accept the fact that Dumbledore DID know Voldemort was the most dangerous wizard from the beginning, and let's also accept the fact that Dumbledore was a master manipulator. Then let's accept the other fact that he had so little regard for others that he would actually raise someone for slaughter. If those three facts are true, then what would make more sense is that he would have chosen to manipulate someone else (like Slughorn himself) to do the dirty work and actually kill Tom Riddle while he was just a little boy. Waiting for him to be in full power as an adult seems kind of clumsy, doesn't it? It makes more sense that Dumbledore was unaware of the danger Riddle posed when he was a small orphan boy, that it is actually very common for kid wizards growing within muggles to be mean to others who are mean to them and make them "hurt" using magic, unaware of their true power (remember the snake tank and Dudley ending up inside?). Then, once at school, Riddle was protected by the academic world where he was actually very proficient and a "straight A" student. Then, when weird things started happening (like the death of Myrtle), Dumbledore started to suspect Tom was behind it, but being a "good guy", he didn't just act on suspicion but rather kept an eye on the boy. He might have regretted such decision years later when that same boy became the most dangerous dark wizard ever. On the other hand, you might be right on one thing: Dumbledore might have known about the horcruxes (but not about the number of them) long before we are advised. That is because, as an adult, Voldemort visited Hogwarts more than once and met Dumbledore, both fully knowing who the other was, so, if Dumbledore didn't know about the horcruxes, it makes sense that he would have fought (and probably defeated) Voldemort right then and there, but knowing he had created the horcruxes, Dumbledore knew it was futile to simply defeat Voldemort "prime" without destroying the horcruxes first.

[@shawngriffin6985]

I like the theory, but the fact that in book 6, Dumbledore didnt know about the Horcruxes.

[@nafemurray6417]

Riddle made his first horcrux before he spoke to slughorn. Not after.

[@joshualonghi8313]

I always thoguht when DD met tom that he seen a 50 50 ...either he changes or goes bad! And at that point he prob didnt see how bad bad was but as soon as he did i mean it looks years but voldermort lost in the end! Great show great content as always!

[@LessaCaira]

IMHO there are so many wrong stated things in this that it fustrates me and I cannot keep watching. Dumbledore is a former dark wizard. What?? Where? He hung out with someone who became a dark wizard but it doesn't sound like the original idea, the "for the greater good" idea was about the kind of stuff dark wizard do. And when Grindlewald started talking that way Albus said NO and thus the fight. Albus raised Harry like a pig for slaughter... I've always hated this Snape line because it isn't true.Albus didn't know about the horcruxes until book 2, at the very earliest. Up until then he was just making sure Harry survived and was safe, like any normal person would. Whiles that does mean he did raise Harry to face Riddle after that I believe that it is more because Albus is a realist not cruel.

[@andrzejzborowski4920]

This theory is too complex to be true. First, he assumes that Dumbledore made Tom Riddle know about the Horcruxes. It is the creation of retroactive facts based on later knowledge. During Tom Riddle's time at Hogwarts, Dumbledore was not headmaster. Riddle had indeed learned about the Horcruxes from the Restricted Section, but Dumbledore couldn't have removed the books from there without the Headmaster's permission. Nor could he oversee it because he was not the head of his house. Going to the orphanage, he didn't know what kind of boy he would meet and he couldn't expect that he would grow up to be the darkest wizard. Slughorn may have read the same Horcrux books as Riddle.

[@BunBun299]

This theory does not work at all. For one, the book on Horcruxes was already in the Restricted Section the year before Dumbledore first attended Hogwarts himself. You can find it, though not read it, in Hogwarts Legacy. Dumbledore removed the book from the library after he became Headmaster. Slughorn probably just read it on his own. It's even stated that just because Hogwarts teachers don't use Dark Magic themselves, they still have a thorough knowledge of them. Secondly, this sort of planning ahead would require the planner to be the most powerful seer in history (and Dumbledore never even took Divination) or be a time traveler, or just to have read the books, like watching a copy of Spaceballs the Movie while you're in the middle of filming Spaceballs. Mel Brooks can get away with that sort of Fourth Wall break, but no one else can. Dumbledore recognized the Diary as a Horcrux when he saw it. He might have suspected before that, but he had no proof, that Voldemort had created a Horcrux. But the casual way I'm which this one was used as a weapon meant, there had to be more. He had no idea how many more.

[@Curtiz2008]

My theory regarding Dumbledore is he was driven mad by the death of his sister and desertion by Grindelwald. He should have been a permanent resident at St. Mungo's, not teaching at Hogwarts. But he was a master of deception.

[@Curtiz2008]

Only a madman would would direct someone like Riddle to learn about Horcruxes.

[@Foxfire-xq5ij]

Riddle would have been easier to defeat if he never had horcruxes, deatheaters, formal wizard training, and a wand…..

[@docbrown2045]

And yet.. A simple Avada Kedavra would have solved so many problems.