Have We Lost Sight Of What Makes Classic... Classic? | WoW Classic

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Cataclysm Classic, Season of Discovery, Hardcore AND Classic Era. There's never been so much choice as to where to have a Classic WoW experience. But are things starting to move away from what made Classic a "Classic" experience in the first place.
Whether its from Blizz or the players themselves, things have changed a huge amount over time.
Today I want to talk about Have We Lost Sight Of What Makes Classic... Classic? | WoW Classic
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#wow #classicwow #mmorpg

[@WillEmmo]

Click this link sponsr.is/WillE and use my code WILLE to get 25% off your first payment for boot.dev. That’s 25% your first month or your first year, depending on the subscription you choose.

[@kohlerk30]

Give me CRED

[@Ryan_hey]

10:35 This is definitely an exaggeration. As we pointed out years ago, WillE had not logged on the correct realm group for the given region (i.e. Whitemane for US, etc.). The realms were rural, of course, but they were still multiple guilds raiding all tiers, including sub-2 hour Naxx runs. Showing an empty city has never been truthful to the state of Era. There was always gonna be a small group of players who didn't want to move on to TBC.

[@dbix11]

If it wasn't for ai automating code I'd be all for learning it

[@ian5066]

I've learned as time went on that what I like about classic WoW is the classic experience itself. Long leveling, tons of dungeons with nice lore backstory's, lots of travel and difficulty to accomplish anything. They could add 5 or 10 more levels to classic zones by fleshing out more of the old world and just push the raids to 70 and I'd love it and add raids onto that and so on. It's a journey that is not at all replicated in expansions. Expansions from TBC onward if I wanted to play them, I wouldn't mind just starting at 70,80, etc. and doing just that content. Don't lie to me having me quest ever faster in the old world just to spend my remaining time in expansion land. The expansion raids, quests and dungeons are fun on their own, but they are not an embodiment of how classic old-world WoW played.

[@peterman8848]

Agree wholeheartedly. It's so refreshing meeting people in questing zones and just playing the game with them, chatting, gathering a fungeon group together. It's so much better than what happens in retail or even cataclysm onwards. Don't get me wrong, cataclysm pvp is probably the best there is, but still not the same leveling experience at all

[@weatheredseeker]

Agreed. They don't even have to push to 70. They could keep level cap the same or they could even just make the level cap 61 and add Kara and some quests

[@DirtyFan2]

No lol

[@benfrost91]

The knowledge that classic era is preserved forever brings a sense of comfort I can hardly explain.

[@zipzzo]

Yea I mean except for the fact they've changed a bunch of stuff in concurrence with SOD release (Pvp ranking mechanisms are unrecognizable).

[@benfrost91]

@@zipzzo yeah it’s going to be a shock I’m sure. I’ll try and keep an open mind 😅

[@thehashslingingslasher6443]

Dark portal pass ruined it 100%

[@heyhelmar]

does that line up with Activision taking over?

[@weekendjail1417]

Started playing from day one of WoW, have come and gone many times. The largest thing BY FAR that people miss about vanilla (and the first couple expansions) seems to be the mindset of the player base. People seemed much friendlier back in the day, there was more fun to things, both guilds and groups of players in general were more inviting. It's difficult to even describe. Basically the opposite of the groups of people that will rage if someone doesn't have the best gear, that kind of stuff. Maybe I'm viewing the old days through rose colored glasses, who knows. Blizzard can mayybee do is make a new server type for people who are just more laid back. IDK how that would even play out, though. IDK, unless I'm pretty much forced to because of friends, I stick to RP servers generally. Those seem to have the friendliest people.

[@candlestyx8517]

I do feel old, cata was released when I was 20 yo and going through basic training; I'm now 34 and left the military two years ago. Brings back memories of raiding on a laptop late at night while on deployments

[@Vagitarian01]

hahaha I remember bringing a laptop with WoW to Iraq and being able to get on just long enough to tell my guild there was no damn way I was going to be able to play.

[@LittleJohnaton]

I was playing wotlk when i was living and working in the middle east as a 20 y.o. (but not as a soldier) - we kinda have shared mems in a weird way!

[@RoniWoodward]

Very interesting, Cata was actually my first expansion after I got out of the military as a 25 year old, and had the same wow experience on a laptop overseas, though I imagine the internet was just as bad and made raiding impossible for me!

[@paulwalther5237]

I was ready to go back to TBC as soon as my toons hit level 80.

[@PheonixT-ki8rx]

same

[@dosbilliam]

Kind of wish there'd been a version of TBC with Dungeon Finder; that would have eliminated the reason for dropping the attunement requirements from Revered to Honored entirely. :P

[@brandonkruse6412]

For a few months. TBC was fun while it lasted but let’s be honest, the (sun)well is dry

[@datolicious4832]

Hell yeah, would love tbc fresh servers

[@zankom417]

​@@brandonkruse6412sunwell was the most fun ive had in a raid ever.

[@darkstar2205]

The game hasn't been classic since the playerbase ruined it

[@ahoyforsenchou7288]

Which happened towards the latter portion of WotLK. Disagreement = you are a tourist, enjoy.

[@darkstar2205]

@@ahoyforsenchou7288 Yeah the wow community is garbage. Literally the worst of any game

[@Lua64]

@@ahoyforsenchou7288 no u

[@Krooic]

you are completely right. The people the complain about retail are the same people who made retail what it is today.

[@htconatser]

The meta-gaming ruined it for me. Same with SOD. It feels like a job now and not something that can be enjoyed.

[@burntfish123]

Wotlk has *always* been the most popular xpac for private servers, kinda wild theyre not leaving a permanent server for it

[@glentor3]

Activision hates it’s customers.

[@Sly_404]

@@glentor3Blizzard is owned by Microsoft by now.

[@peterc2672]

Cause the classic player base didn't like it

[@gx92muc]

Man, nostalrious, lightshope and all the other Vanilla pservers before, wotlk was Not the Most popular with only warmane

[@BrentHollett]

​@@Sly_404Microsoft didn't make the decision though.

[@lycaeo]

Easiest way to put it regarding SoD: There is no discovery. There is no capturing the essence of WoW. It's just rushing to level cap to raid log which is why people started to leave the game in the first place.

[@Domaister420]

Yeah... its more like a new era-parsing season instead of true discovery.

[@skycatlive1576]

best most astute comment here couldnt of said it better, church, GONE BY LEVEL 40

[@bmo14lax]

I still don't even understand what season of Discovery is. It's classic wow But they added new things? What Even is the point then?

[@Domaister420]

@@bmo14lax yeah well... Some runes, just to improve your class... some pvp events and they changed some dungeons to raids. Wow. Oh and i forgot that ppl milking the shit out of it. Try to find groups that dont require all possible WBs and Cons, oh and i forgot. X/x Boss experience. So basically a season to gatekeep the casuals

[@bmo14lax]

@@Domaister420 whats next? Every expansion will have a new "theme" to it? Endless random changes to old content instead of just more retail content? Mangggg

[@hizzousekakashi8836]

HAH! I already felt old when classic came out, I logged into retail and my rogue was STILL getting the brewfest booze of the month over 10 YEARS after I had completed that quest.

[@Quick-Silver206]

In my opinion, Classic, Progression, and Modern are all we need. Classic for the comfort of always staying the same, Progression for the feeling of going through it again, and Modern for the newest stuff. Just never take away my beloved Classic.

[@Arcexey]

@Quick-Silver206 it needs to be classic with changes or else the playerbase will split between the progression servers

[@Quick-Silver206]

@@Arcexey classic has shared servers. Progression servers are separate.

[@Arcexey]

@@Quick-Silver206 I'm saying there's too many versions of wow right now for classic to be truly viable.

[@LittleJohnaton]

They probably overcooked the nightmare incursions a little, people dinged 50 within a few hours haha

[@Mrgearzz]

10 hours

[@chrismcaulay7805]

@@Mrgearzz 4 hours is all it took me (but that was after it was refined).

[@Mrgearzz]

@@chrismcaulay7805 ok you win the smallest cock competition well done x

[@simonholmes6473]

I feel like a lot of people are hoping SoD goes permanent and becomes the start of a continuing new direction.

[@randomshouse266]

Need sod 2 with how much they messing the economy up.

[@brandonsaffell4100]

@@randomshouse266 My gamer, the economy isn't ruined. Though I suspect your inability to view anything in other than the most extreme way may have ruined yourself.

[@ez6791]

No way. Let them do a couple seasons to keep cooking

[@RichSmithson]

Nah after the fiasco of yesterday its obvious this will just be a seasonal thing and they will try do another version of classic in 2 or 3 years.

[@Asubatsu]

Nah, at this point I just want classic to make it to Legion again so I can actually enjoy it this time.

[@user-up8pd6id9s]

TBC has always been and will always be peak WoW for me, if they released it it would probably be my forever home for WoW and I'd dip into SoD every so often

[@benny7555]

STILL angry there's no era servers for tbc. I'd have never even gone to wotlk, I'd still be on tbc.

[@andromidius]

So long as its fun I don't really care. If we're being true to the past then it comes with all the negatives - and I'm not about that anymore. I just want to replay good times with current knowledge and have fun with friends.

[@drewneale3675]

I would give cata a try again but they really need to sort the servers out, pvp servers that are dominated by a single faction is not a pvp server.

[@Jaricko]

Pve are largely the same. Both are caused by the players.

[@dontreplytome5665]

Your best bet is grobb if you want true wpvp

[@drewneale3675]

@@dontreplytome5665 im eu pleb :(

[@drewneale3675]

@@Jaricko blizzard sure don't help, they should do what they have done with classic era servers imo.

[@korkron8756]

Could they "buff" the less played faction as an example? Let's say that on "X" realm which is currently dominated by the Horde, players will receive a buff for playing in the Alliance instead. Simple but effective? As long as it doesn't become anything unfair that breaks the balance. Just wondering here.

[@Dreakx1]

Long live Turtle WoW and Project Epoch

[@LittleJohnaton]

my thoughts exactly!!

[@fredrikstaffansson4473]

Classic: Slow-paced, you're not a hero from the start but you can become one, the game is about the world. Retail: Follow the meta, crunch numbers, collect everything

[@ernestphillips761]

I'd love for a server to go through progression again since i missed classic to tbc I would like that experience

[@krucible9369]

With each phase SOD grows closer to retail

[@LittleJohnaton]

The latest update is INSANE the emerald thing is just plain bonkers.

[@jointser1008]

oh noooooo, who cares as long it get closer to a good retail expansion like mop or legion?

[@kuyt3400]

correct. They removed or replaced most of the classic content already. The questing, the itemization, a lot of the dungeons.

[@MikeyPaper]

I like the direction theyre taking. Its new but still classic. Quit whining you stupid doomer.

[@thomaskoltiska6825]

Wtf when the last time you played retail. 😂. So me be in a guild and talking to people on discord out of raid yeah trust me that has not happen to Me in years in retail

[@MrTheFrankMan]

Last time I was this early we were demanding no changes

[@alexsnow652]

Cata was so awesome that It lost 4M players

[@jorrelerivera3777]

I feel like classic went wrong with including Warcraft logs, I believe that should be a retail measurement for raiding. Where dps/healing checks are required. Classic was the place for everyone to be included, you didn’t need everyone in your 40 man raid to be orange parsed but that’s what was required.

[@Blubking1]

You do know that logs existed even back in tbc?

[@i.m.3940]

Not true at all, you could get in pretty much ANY guild on Classic without having all orange/pink parses, the only exceptions were maybe the top 20 guilds or so. I feel like the people that constantly complain about this are literal grey parsers who expect to show up to raid and not press any buttons or something. If you simply played the game like a normal person without any sort of tryharding and sweating, you were guaranteed an 80+ and access to like 98% of all guilds, all that was required was just pulling your own weight, nothing more. And that really only became a thing during BWL, pre launch and phase 1 MC literally nobody cared about parses whatsoever.

[@noble61483]

​@@i.m.3940 if everyone got on and pressed thier buttons those 80+ parses would turn to a 50... you do realize that right? 🧐 since your score is based on how well you do against others of the same class and role

[@i.m.3940]

@@noble61483 Since you want to go into the "what if" territory, if everyone got on and pressed their buttons, guilds would be clearing all the content with ease and people wouldn't care about parses nearly as much, if at all. Its crazy the lengths people will go to just to make excuses for and justify their obvious lack of care for their performance. I get it, some people just don't like parses and thats fine, I'm not the biggest fan of them either but saying you need all oranges or pinks just to get into a raid/guild is simply lying and has never been the case in Classic except for some very few extreme examples.

[@mikeoxlong3676]

Further proof wow players ruined the game and not blizzard.

[@pppoopoo4514]

I could literally play nothing else except TBC and I'd be happy. Give me TBC SoD with the windfury druids and a raidwide bloodlust with sated debuff and I'd die happy.

[@MikeyPaper]

Didnt most people stop playing in TBC though?

[@dontreplytome5665]

​@@MikeyPaperthat was in the later half of wrath and in cata TBC popped off

[@thomaskoltiska6825]

Then this is not tbc anymore lmao

[@zacharyblossom9469]

I'd love for SoD to make it through BC and Wrath, then start from the beginning again (and they can change shit around each time they restart the cycle... Maybe different raid for each phase during the second cycle)

[@electricwizard5747]

this mindset is 100% part of the problem. this whole "oh just give me X buuuuuuuut maaaaaybe add Y to spice things up a little". no, just no. you don't want the original thing to begin with. where you draw the line when it comes to which changes are acceptable and which ones aren't is absolutely arbitrary. while you might find it negligible that druids are getting windfury, someone else might not see it that way and wants #nochanges tbc instead. or maybe someone wants vulpera to be playable in tbc or have garrisons added to the game which YOU might not agree with. so who gets to say what's still acceptable and what isn't? everyone has vastly different visions for the game that it's impossible to find a common denominator for everyone, except for one instance: no changes. no changes is truly the most neutral solution that should satisfy most people equally, after all, if you hate the base game in the first place, might as well play something completely different like dragonflight.

[@reaperbot5226]

I would like to see them do a season server where players can't use third party add-ons.

[@brettprickett4146]

I'm all for that except when i start think of non combat things like auction addons. The default Auction menu is awful.

[@reaperbot5226]

@@brettprickett4146 well I did say third party add-ons. so they could add some minor quality of life improvements to the base game itself or come out with official blizzard approved add-ons even.

[@artemd2025]

Haha, you'd play alone there

[@DR-lh5vm]

Imagine in a couple of years you buy wow as a new player and you have to choose between 15 different game modes.

[@elxjasonx]

Those 100k logs of icc are mostly ppl raiding with 3 chars, some with more

[@vulture27fm]

Absolutely. This phase has been out WAY too long and the Cata beta is still a complete mess. The hardcore players are still around but the more casual players are dropping like flies.

[@MoonTurky]

​@@vulture27fm Why in gods name would anybody who casually plays a game pick world of warcraft for their game of choice? I think i would rather put my dck in a pencil sharpener than play world of warcraft after work.

[@WillEmmo]

Could be the same for classic era with how long everyone has had to get 60 / gear up. Its just a gauge of player interest in the scene really

[@krispy4605]

The xp boosts and incursions killed this phase. We want classic + but some people want retail + which is what is being delivered.

[@troublegamingclips1059]

Yeah it’s gone a bit mad tbh

[@raminMTL]

Take it easy

[@snuggles3277]

the wow token being added in wrath killed it overnight

[@crowykop]

This

[@ClassicTophatGaming]

What a bad take, it did very little. If anything SoD killed wrath overnight.

[@THEPete_]

Completely agree

[@candlestyx8517]

The same way it fucked up retail, i highly doubt retails economy will ever recover

[@mandurrudnam7632]

i actually loved the wow token, it gave me the chance to dump my gold and play the game for free for the next two years

[@louisnel894]

I want TBC Era so badly :(

[@yourdreams2440]

TBC is the perfect mix between classic and retail, but needed some refinement. Even though it's flawed, I'd play the hell out of it again.

[@kuyt3400]

I wish there was TBC era servers.

[@Arcexey]

@yourdreams2440 I played a few months of vanilla and then all of TBC, and looking back TBC was seriously flawed. Flying mounts, arena, heroic badges, vehicle/pick up quests, daily quests, heroic difficulty helped ruin wow and TBC started all those. TBC is in my heart forever but it really was the beginning of the end, I used to think Cata was, then Wotlk, now I see TBC did harm.

[@hockeyplaya1155]

TBC was boring quit that shit so fast

[@matthewkeating-od6rl]

This new sod patch is a retail patch released on clasic. Where a simple idea of just have a beta with nda could have saved everyone making 50 in 1 day.

[@Zutang777]

Can you explain? In More detail?

[@randomrandom7208]

why is this a problem? Anyone who wants slow and methodical leveling can go to era/hardcore, SoD is for people who want to play with shiny new toys in a familiar environment rather than replaying old memories once again.

[@RichSmithson]

"Making 50g in one day" I was making that in 45 mins lol.

[@billlange9408]

@@RichSmithson Legit. I did two rounds of quests with some guildies and made around 120g.

[@radenkovic2856]

@@randomrandom7208 yep. i really enjoy a raid looking finally a bit difficult. gnomer and bfd were boring af and i stopped early in both phases. Healing those fights in farm with cutting healers is gonna be hella fun

[@newworld8546]

i just want a 2019 fresh not retail lite

[@Arcexey]

@newworld5846 2019 is retail bro. everything after vanilla/tbc is wow 2.0

[@StickyBuns1390]

blizz slicing the wow pie up too many ways lol

[@edmontonlivermoore4935]

5d chess it’s their move to combat private servers, and it’s working. they are generally ghost towns and cata pservers are up next. Imo the true dream is all of these servers hosted by blizzard will have sizable populations

[@lucaschebance3135]

yes that's true, the community is cleaved => servers are dead

[@bushido-z-8400]

Would be good to have 1 server for each version of the game. Rotate "fresh" launch every few years then dump them into the ERA version of that server.

[@thelegendarydeikay3071]

@@Medio2507 you mean those guys that were abusing female workers that got found out couple years ago and got removed from blizzard team? alot of the old blizzard are old and out of touch with current gaming market, everyone has a shelf like

[@Alex_Was_Taken]

​@@thelegendarydeikay3071I'd buy a game they made in a heartbeat. They were the ones that made blizzard's golden games that are still loved today, not whatever is in control now that tries to "reforge" old stuff for a quick cash grab

[@joshyman221]

I don’t understand why people lump wotlk with classic and tbc. Cata and wrath are very similar. Tbc and classic are similar. Mop and wod are similar. The game is more naturally split into pairs not trilogies (imo)

[@WingTzu343]

Yeah I agree. I didn't realize it back then but it's super obvious to me now. WRATH was the changing expac not Cata. TBC was literally vanilla+ in a new continent. Wrath completely changed the style of the game, Cata was Wrath+

[@tjlehn3157]

Yeah I agree except for MoP/WoD, I think MoP/Cata/Wrath could all be lumped together. WoD feels like the starting point of modern WoW, at least to me.

[@conormaher2283]

Agree with this take

[@haldir108]

@@WingTzu343 TBC and Wrath are more similar than Vanilla and TBC are similar.

[@Toini01]

Sort of, the big change in WotLK was basically difficulty. In phase 1, everything was made face roll easy (quest mobs were 2 shots, elites were soloable, HC dungeons a joke and Naxx super easy too, rep grinds were much faster, etc.). But at its core, WotLK still had all of the mechanics of original WoW in the way the quests are made, the talent trees, the mechanics, the progression of the game, the professions, etc. The only other notable change, which really wasn't "classic" was the threat generation of tanks becoming a non issue. But overall, it was more of a tuning issue than an actual shift in WoW all together. Whereas for Cataclysm, the issue was significantly more linked to core mechanics (portals everywhere, LFD from the start of the xpac, LFR, flying during questing content, talent trees, smaller dungeons/raids, even more focus on "esport" content, etc.). Personally, I would love to one day just have a TLK server, but with all of the mobs (in and outside of instances) highly buffed. Make the kill time of an average quest mob the same as in TBC and maybe reign in a tiny bit the classes. With this, I feel like TLK could be the best WoW version because it just had such an immersive world, technically a lot of content (with TBC level difficulty) and lots of nice small additions (achievments, more collectable, more quest diversity, best lore, lots of fun seasonal events that have you do stuff, etc.)

[@radguy72]

I think I want something in between classic era and SoD. I like the different abilities but I don't like breezing through the content. I'd like a modification of the talent trees too. Not too crazy but something to spice it up.

[@lucaschebance3135]

If you want the abilities, why don't you play retail ?

[@SomeHarryGuy]

​@lucaschebance3135 you didn't read his whole comment you rube

[@Schwanken]

Cause retails content is a completely different game?​@@lucaschebance3135

[@Zhohan-]

Turtle/Epoch and my personal favorite: WALLCRAFT

[@randomrandom7208]

@@lucaschebance3135 Because retail are either completely casual or extremely competitive, with very little in between? And retail doesn't just add abilities, it fundamentally changes classes.

[@smallpandochka]

Blizz can just do their version of *certain private fresh servers* with tbc and wotlk. Reset it every 1.5-2 years, and they'll have the crowd willing to pay subscription over and over again

[@datolicious4832]

This!!! Dont know why they just put a fresh server out...just one wouldnt take much work tbh

[@Moredhel83]

@@thomaskoltiska6825 crowned, like royalty? ;p

[@michaelmller4582]

I just wrote this.. I thought i was smart! xD It's good stuff! :D

[@michaelmller4582]

Maybe make like an "Eternal" realm for excisting chars, that way - they dont just get deleted.

[@candlestyx8517]

I agree, reset the servers every two years and put everyone on an even slate again. Finding a group for anything is impossible between the boosting meta and the fact that everyone is maxxed and wearing raid gear.

[@Bottlekiller]

I would really like to see Wotlk Era servers too :(

[@celestiangrimjawz3902]

Haha I told people this back then! I knew this because I asked them to release cata because I never got to play it back then. I have pull there. :)

[@IMForeman27]

As someone who never played Mop, Wod or Legion back in the day I reallllly hope these happen, though I imagine Classic Wod will probably announced with Legion with both on the roadmap.

[@quinn562]

5:24 not sure if it was just my server (pretty sure it wasn't) but ironforge was the place to be back in the day - the layout is superior and honestly was probably just better for the computers of the day with how wide open it was lol

[@zipzzo]

Yeah SW only became the city to be because IF cannot get Dragonslayer and wbuffs were exponentially more popular in Classic than original vanilla (for obvious reasons)

[@thearbitersteven6503]

SoD if permanent can show us different ideas that didn't pan out in the old days, old dungeons that got halfway and then got cut. It would be awesome. Mist Classic is probably a possibility.

[@Sammysam1231]

I had several toons in classic vanilla in near phase 6 BiS (my mage was only missing Ariesh). I advanced them to TBC and then quit. I wish I’d kept them in era. It’s been a few years and I’d absolutely love to revisit Naxx, even some ZG or BWL, just raid log and play a few nights a week.

[@The4Dev]

Yes, give us TBC please!!

[@kbredstar529]

counter point to what youre saying around 5:00 ... if you played back then and continued to play, if you leveled alts that doesnt mean your doing cata stuff for the first time in 14 years, we were doing cata stuff for years until chromie let us pick a different xpac. ive done cata dungeons so many times, id rather put a cigarette out on myself than run Vortex Pinn one more time. some folks have done cata crap hundreds of times until chromie showed up and gave us a way out that didnt involve seppuku.

[@Laborchet]

My Guild fell apart at the hands of ulduar in WOTLK. Life got busy and I stopped playing because I didn’t wanna start building a raid team from scratch… then SOD dropped and I was so tempted to go back. But vanilla is such a time sink… if they did TBC era servers I would be on that INSTANTLY. The problem is how do you launch that? Nobody has their lvl 60 character anymore. So do we all just start at 58 in blasted lands?

[@astralfields]

SoD is significantly less of a timesink than nochanges vanilla. I'd say it's around the same as TBC. Yeah you still need to earn gold, you need to farm some things, but the raids are easy, you don't need much gear, prebis isn't needed at all... it becomes as much of a timesink as you want it to be really. Personally I just play 2-3 times per week and outside of that I play other games.

[@koffin522]

​@@astralfieldsTBC rep grinds way more of a time sink than SoD

[@undacuvabrotha]

Isn’t TBC more of a grind than Vanilla?

[@jesseperez4185]

Getting rep with warsong and arathi is way easier

[@zepho100]

Why have such a comment without trying? You’ve made assumptions on what SOD is without even playing it. That’s a weird take and it’s casual friendly.

[@SmoothjazGamingTV]

Certainly feel a bit stuck in the middle of where to be between SoD/Era/Wrath recently - previously wasn't too keen on the idea of Cata Classic but as we draw near to release I'm more & more looking forward to it.

[@Coriore445]

I was ready to go back to tbc in early wrath, realized I didn't like it as much as I thought.

[@Coriore445]

Id be stoked if they did a SoD tbc

[@Zajedwabisty124]

​@@Coriore445Why everyone want Sod tbc they just add spells from retail. Sod tbc will be the same awful like Classic Sod. Just add some content maybe 2+3 new spells from trainer class , no fck runes. In Sod world is complety fucked with new spells they too much powerful. Pvp never looks that bad. New raids is only good thing in Sod.

[@JBayerBB6]

Just quit my guild and probably SoD altogether now that they released incursions and no one else is doing anything else and my guild has their alts nearly leveled already. Stupid decision servers gonna be raid logging in 3 weeks

[@LittleJohnaton]

give turtle wow a whirl if you haven't - its pretty cool!

[@corvuscorax8459]

@@LittleJohnaton Yeah im about to swap back to turltle. It feels way better than SOD. That's the true classic + experience.

[@hockeyplaya1155]

Sod is not classic. It’s a meme twitch hype mode. Huge cope player base. Adding abilities from established expansions because vanilla classes are trash

[@bChuraful]

People talking down on players that initially wanted “No Changes” and now wanting something different don’t understand the larger picture. At the time people were trying to safeguard as much as possible against any corporate butchering of the Vanilla launch. Also, it was also a good way for the players to organically come together and decide which parts of Vanilla aged well and which aspects did not. Players should not be shamed for supporting changes after a while of enjoying “No Changes” Vanilla. Classic is vastly different than Retail and as long is it stays that way then it will maintain a role in the community. The “No Changes” movement was to establish nostalgia, allowing the community to compare and contrast from old with new, and it also gave us all a metric of how much Blizzard was willing to listen to the community requested project. Turns out, the Classic team listens and is attuned to the community more than the bloated Retail team. Edit: typos

[@nickapeters7]

I'm happy they are doing cata,I worked 12 hours a day back in 2010 and never got to play it

[@Arcexey]

@nickapeters7 this is like saying 'I'm happy they're re-doing the holocaust, I wasn't alive back then and didn't get to experience it.'

[@SenipLuff]

I'm super curious how the later phases for classic are gonna look: when AQ releases, are we just gonna be doing AQ with some changes and a different (more powerful) class meta? Or will there be actually new content? Super excited to see what happens.

[@gscgold]

Man 5 years ago unbelievable... I originally started playing wow only 3 years after the original release of the game.. And here we are 5 years after the second release of the original game I need to stop playing wow 😅

[@mcfarvo]

Get into lifting and some "cardio" modality or sport, definitely a better use of time if you aren't doing so, hut videogames can fit into your rest/recovery time

[@BluuSkyz]

I should have came back to try classic BC.. thats when I started. I pretty much missed Wrath. I could get the leveling experience but no ones really playing I hear. If you would have asked me when cata came out I'd probably say 8 years ago lmaoo! When you said 14 years I couldn't believe it.

[@fizkarn6358]

Im gonna play Cata, i love playing a healer in that expansion. Actually having to manage your mana and not just spamming heals

[@noobarium]

you do already have to manage mana in wotlk but yes it does get much more exciting in cata

[@fizkarn6358]

@@noobarium as a holy pala in a good guild with fast kill times im just spamming holy light lol, no care about mana

[@Hundreddollardolphin]

Always liked D2’s ladder system with the ability to craft rune words being locked behind it. Would be interesting to see something like that.

[@kyleellis1825]

I really wanted them to do Vanilla/BC/Wrath as Classic+ content. With Cata/MoP/WoD getting it's own set of servers that added in the cut content. Legion/BFA/Shadowlands could eventually have gotten it's own set of servers.

[@svens3722]

í miss my tbc p1 warrior with 2x blendstrike hoj and extra hit talent.

[@dwelldex1708]

I want tbc! Tbc hype, tbc hype!

[@geneabrego9759]

6:28 this is pretty crazy to think about in this way...but at this point, we could have Legion:Classic and after BFA and Shadowlands and even DF to some extent, I bet it would be pretty freaking hype for a little bit!

[@Yamstarch]

They should do a Classic+ where they release previous cancelled content and zones that were the initial idea. There is still so much broken lore and unfinished areas within Vanilla WoW and I think Cata was a way for them to kind of take an eraser to all of that in the first place and "redo" it without completing it. Sadly they will never take the time and resources to do it.

[@whtwolfgames7983]

Tbc was my fave expansion, but sadly I don't think we're ever getting a legacy server for it

[@Hunrakku3]

It's been years since I played WOW, but my friend and I were talking about re-upping on a Vanilla server... but now I'm confused. Is there a server where we can go back and play early WOW close to as it was? Not sure what hardcore is but we'd rather not PVP. We just want to explore the old setting again... though I guess I wouldn't mind if it were to include BC and WotLK. Does what we're after even exist?

[@Vhite]

SoD might be a path to more permanent Classic+, but so far it doesn't feel like a good one. As for Cataclysm, I'm looking forward to it, but I wish we had a different name for expansions from Cata to Legion.

[@kuyt3400]

Many people saw the writing on the wall with SoD before it even came out and were ringing the warning bells but noone wanted to listen. Fast forward to the end of SoD and everyone will be complaining about it.

[@mcfarvo]

Yeah, it's not "Classic" it's the Middle Age, maybe just call it "mid" lol

[@ghstproject]

10:56 made me wanna go and level a new character somehow

[@Chopep_]

Classic clips always make me want to come back

[@everydaybodybuilding2282]

The seasonal idea works fine for testing new things

[@LuisHernandez-nu1es]

SoD is very lame in P3, it's just incursions until level 50.

[@rolfgautier5540]

Levels should literally take 4 times as much time. Fast levels ruins character progression, RPG feel, and satisfaction. Now leveling is a boring, spam this incursion chore.

[@monocerotis6917]

Nightmare event destory whole wow classic sod!!!

[@cactuss33ds]

​@@rolfgautier5540oh sure, because it being 4 times as long would definitely make it not a chore anymore. be honest with yourselves, would you really wanna spend 400 hours leveling and gearing characters in a SEASONAL game mode? I'll admit that incursions are boring (and are now nerfed), but realistically, is it any worse than spamming ZF and Mara for hours on end(and at least THOSE give wild offerings now.)

[@Kensber85]

I think what i love about complaints like this is that no one is forcing you to do incursions. I still see lots of ppl trying to do ZF and mars and even uldaman

[@rolfgautier5540]

@@Kensber85 You don't seem to get the point that there is LITERALLY almost nobody leveling in the open world. It has killed open world leveling. Believe it or not there are alternatives to dungeon grinding.

[@akuseru85]

11:05 It was never "no changes classic". It had loads of changes, game (vanilla) breaking changes. That's why most vanilla players quit a month into classic and never looked back.

[@dansmith8417]

"You think you do, but you don't" turned out to be prophetic, no?

[@TheJadedRaver]

Think its worth some people here trying 'Turtle wow' if they havent already. I personally really enjoyed the classic + experience.

[@LinksterGames]

Cata is the first time I stopped playing WoW, I didn't return to WoW until WoD came out and we all know how that went. But Legion was super fun. I didn't experience Cata too much and honestly when it was announced my first thought was "Who asked for this?" but now I kinda want to try it out, at least for a bit just to see what it was like. Who knows, maybe I'll enjoy it this time around since I didn't play it too much. In regards to Classic Era I hope they do new progression servers at some point, I love Vanilla but I'm awake at odd hours so trying to level up on Era is like walking through a ghost town, I wouldn't even be able to find a Deadmines group. So, I'd love it if they released some Vanilla progression servers again at some point.

[@mmmpancakesmmm]

Nice to have other classes have their fun now too. As an exclusively Druid player in vanilla and classic, I really wish I could play WoW at this point in my life.

[@styx953]

Kinda wish runes were disabled in pvp, it is a shitshow. Otherwise SOD has been a blast!

[@AverageYTcomment]

cant wait for dragonflight classic

[@GenX_GamerDad]

What I have noticed is that it seems like many SoD players are leveling as quickly as possible…I think the journey being more important than the endgame seems to be going away. Zip through the content to play the level up raid.

[@Peetskeet]

yep PVP is a joke, speed thru to max level. Play the best part of the game (the ST raid) get loot and raid log till next lockout. Go play a better pvp game in meantime rinse and repeat

[@hockeyplaya1155]

Sod is not classic. It’s a meme twitch hype mode. Huge cope player base. Adding abilities from established expansions because vanilla classes are trash

[@sorakibr]

Going to play devils advocate on SoD. None of their world events have panned out. Locking runes behind reps or grinds, especially key role ones, is not garnering any good will. The change from 3 days lockouts to weekly I think will be a good thing and will see if that improves peoples opinions. Big fan of the rune system, but they've fumbled parts of it. Also agree with WillE that ive felt most people are done with the phases. It makes sense organizationally, but this points to another issue with SoD. It works, it's gotten people interested, but does it have staying power. What WoW established back in 2004 had staying power in that it carried it through to today. I think blizzard iterating is a good thing, but you run into the same problem some other media is having right now. Throwing shit at the wall to see what sticks is good sometimes, but there needs to be someone or some team with a plan. Or it will get old fast.

[@chrismcaulay7805]

SoD has been a major letdown. I only keep playing it to spend time with family and friends that no longer live near me.

[@Bongoslam]

The simplicity and difficulty of classic is what I love. It creates a much more fun raiding atmosphere because there is room to goof around.

[@Dom-si1mn]

I played the hell out of TBC classic. I quit after TBC transitioned to Wrath classic, came back a month or so later and rejoined my TBC guild, but Wrath just didn't do it for me and I quit again two months later. TBC is by far my favorite version of Wow and I'd kill to have it back.

[@michaelmller4582]

I feel like 2-3 realms per expansion would be a good way to "please" everyone. Maybe make a "seasonal" system, where the patch cycle works around a year. And when it's done the server resets, and your chars get moved to an "eternal" realm.. Much like Diablos system, except seasons are Waaaay longer ..

[@jamesofallthings3684]

What we really wanted was our golden years back instead of facing the harsh reality that we're aging, balding and spent our prime inside drooling over pixels.

[@ukdoomer2082]

i just want a tbc server.... Wasnt the whole point of classic so we would have a permanent vanilla/tbc/wrath server?

[@preslim84]

As a vanilla Andy, I actually like Cata the most of all the expansions because of the raiding

[@nat040496]

Yeah, this is precisely why I wished they'd gone the OSRS route and just made new content instead of following the timeline we already went through. I guess that would mean making a new story and lore, but at least it would have stayed "Classic"

[@noname-gp6hk]

MC and BWL were my favorite raids. Everything else was too complicated. I don't want mechanics, I just want to hang out in discord with the lads while barely paying attention to what's happening on the screen.

[@unlawfulbl9516]

So modern lfr

[@OrchinX]

This is what nobody is going to understand until it’s too late. People don’t want knuckle-scrapingly difficult encounters with 0.3s reaction times, wipe mechanics, knockbacks, mechanics, etc They want something thematic, satisfying, and fun. This is why nobody raids on retail. I say this as a 95 parsing uhdk clearing heroic LK

[@Blubking1]

@@OrchinX95 parsing in wrath us nothing and many people raid in retail, no idea where this tinfoil hat theory comes from

[@jointser1008]

skill issue

[@jointser1008]

@@OrchinX interesting that you play wotlk and yet dare to make a statement about retail lol.

[@MorrisMJ872]

My dream is just a fresh classic era server that does its own thing and eventually after Naxx, they try to release a phase 7 and then we'll go from there

[@Arcexey]

@MorrisMH872 it will happen because that's the dream of so many of us. they add new things that doesn't conflict with the old (extremely difficult to do), change a few quality of life things, ban all the bots, ban quest helper mods. the places in the old wow which were cryptic and unfinished, just finish those. =)

[@terry9819]

I started SoD recently and knew nothing about it. I was stunned at how with in the first few hours the magic was there. It was just a great gaming experience taking me back to why vanilla was so good and then changes started happening and at first it was interesting but as I am playing through it seems SoD is making all the mistakes retail made over 20 years and is starting to look like all the worst parts of retail in the vanilla setting. It amazes me that there still seems to be this complete misunderstanding of why vanilla was so great.

[@LittleJohnaton]

The 1-25 levelling experience was really cool I think.

[@hockeyplaya1155]

Sod is not classic. It’s a meme twitch hype mode. Huge cope player base. Adding abilities from established expansions because vanilla classes are trash

[@terry9819]

@@hockeyplaya1155 The classes needed some work but Vanilla WoW is a much better game than the modern versions where classes are even more of a mess.

[@dennisberg2474]

I agree, we need at least 1 classic server in the final patch to play whenever

[@derrickandrews1646]

I'm very nervous about how Cata Classic will pan out. SoD is getting more ridiculous each phase, Blizz seems lost on what they're doing. Give us Classic Era TBC with one change : shaman totems and bloodlust/heroism go raid wide. 😅

[@alex-suciu]

why is SoD getting ridiculous? just curious

[@kuyt3400]

@@alex-suciu When all the classic quests and zones become irrelevant and obsolete because youve funneled everyone into some cheap half baked content that looks like it was made by some kids that is located in a few small areas of the game world that let you bypass the whole leveling process so you can rush to max lvl in less than a day while making insane amounts of gold.... ya that is ridiculous. Objectively bad game design.

[@Quadromil4]

Cata classic can't go wrong. Another thing is that classic cata is aimed at more skilled players, and there are always fewer of them, but thanks to thoughtful adaptation in game mechanics, serious problems cannot arise in classic cata.

[@m0zric]

@@kuyt3400There are no objective value judgments, you pleb. Objectively bad = Objectively subjective

[@theoutlander1411]

Yeah a few QoL fixes and TBC would be great.

[@wianrossouw3434]

I hope we’ll get MoP classic one day - that was the first version of WoW I ever played as a kid :)

[@jz3488]

I really enjoy Sod and think the raids have been excellent. I would love to see a follow up season where they keep the raid mechanics in but then tune them back down to 5 mans and work on the other untouched dungeons. I would be just as happy if they didn't make a raid per each phase. The fun of Sod isn't having a raid schedule it is having an excuse to test ourselves against new content while making the chase for new items worth it because future upgrades are still locked behind the next phase. Would be great to also see these changes come with a shift back to smaller server populations.

[@CexCells]

Wrath baby here. Loved Cata. Excited to go back. Also would love a Wrath/Cata seasonal/SoD.

[@pate7816]

Yes we have if you look at the new phase 3 event they added in sod especially

[@josedavidmunozmartinez4722]

The best part is when Arthas widows are claiming that they "LOVE CLASSIC TO DEATH" but Classic is only Wotlk for them lol... They would never play Vanilla as it is... Face it, Wrath is as far from Classic as Cataclysm ;)

[@fakemanky6838]

I dont know man. Taste can change. I was a arthas widodw ( started wow in tbc prepatch). 2019 showed me a better game. And in wrath classic i got to level 76 before i quit.

[@josedavidmunozmartinez4722]

@@fakemanky6838 Sure, but you would be a very small minority compared to the huge majority of Arthas widows.

[@Arcexey]

@josedavidmunozmartinez4722 Wrath is wow 2.0 just like cataclysm. it's an entirely different game from classic, a bad one. I loved wrath but looking back it was fun because it was addicting in the way a gambling machine is, or a cheap mobile game.

[@drizzho]

Even TBC felt so much different than classic because of flying and being only in Outland.

[@Arcexey]

@@drizzho I loved TBC and thought it was a perfect expansion to vanilla. and now I see TBC was really part of the problem, flying mounts were just a terrible idea looking back. Having the expansion be some other new area disconnected from the original was also a terrible idea. sigh. Also daily quests, badges of honor/multiple currencies, easy-ish epics, and ARENA. pvp should've had more of an emphasis on open world, not less.

[@Armakusify]

The only classic I've played is the original and it's variations (Hardcore, SoD). I have extremely fond memories of TBC and Wrath but in my head I just see it as nostalgia for a different era rather than a desire to play a certain version of the game. Legion, however, I will absolutely come back and play. It may have set WoW on a pretty disastrous course for a few expansions but man, that first time they tried it just worked for me.

[@unexplained_entity7514]

I'd love to see servers for both TBC and WOTLK, I'm going to miss them for sure.

[@LuxMori]

I think some of the people who played classic at launch are now okay with the game changing because they never actually played vanilla back in the day. I feel there's a good chunk of people that played Classic just to see what the hype was about, and then stuck with it because they got that unique sense of being part of something when it started... and continued. I have friends who will try every new MMO not because they like it deeply, but because they want to be apart of the next Big Game. The founding community, so they get to enjoy their seniority and reminisce with others about their history in the game. Still know a lot of retail players who are like that now, haha.

[@saintuk70]

Classic should have been created within an epoch - maybe vanilla, tbc, and wrath. When are they going to start back and create Classic Classic WoW....

[@adamford4167]

I always go back to classic just to fish. I don’t know why but I miss it from time to time.