HEART RATE ZONE TRAINING FOR RUNNERS: MAF METHOD, AEROBIC PACES

A rant about maffetone, sub 2hr marathons, heart rate zones, and how you should train with aerobic paces that legendary coaches have defined for decades.
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A video by SageRunning.com . @SageCanaday on social media.

[@birdy93]

Sage: "to crack 2 hours in a marathon ... it will happen 10 to 20 years at least!" Kipchoge: (4 years later) "Hold my Zoom Fly"

[@samuelmorrison148]

Birdy NinetyThree I was about to make this comment. Lol

[@daceuro]

same

[@HumanoidTyphoon91]

I mean it's not yet an official race time

[@Gatcombe]

He did add if they've got springs in their shoes !

[@glennteler3932]

Springs in shoes and down hill (or optimized race course)

[@timjones8084]

As someone who's learned a lot from HR training through the MAF method but always had questions on elements of it that I've never had satisfactorily answered, this is the best critique I've heard yet. I think MAF has a lot to offer on an overall holistic, healthful approach, particularly to older runners, but if you're chasing a PRs I think you've hit the nail on the head. Really enjoy and trust your videos - thanks for sharing

[@MsSupaflyguy]

I can't stop watching your videos! As a recreational runner who is had started to dabble in a few races over the past few seasons I am really learning a lot from watching your videos! Thanks for sharing your knowledge Sage, it is really appreciated!

[@jonalbert4927]

This is one of my favorite videos that you've posted! Thanks for sharing your years of experience and insight!

[@arjunmoorthy6126]

Probably the best running related channel on KZbin. Keep up the great work!

[@nimbuscapitalsolution]

130 HRM at 7min pace. wow..... when I run 7min pace my HRM is at 180-ish

[@ielle.]

The bpm isn't an indication of fitness, though, at least not in comparing one runner to the next. 130 for one person and 180 for another person could be about equivalent efforts if these figures represent a similar percentage of each runner's max heart rate, which is highly variable from person to person. If the person running 7min pace at 130bpm has a max HR of 152, and the person running the same pace at 180bpm has a max HR of 210, the two runners are working just as hard. A self-comparison on the other hand is where bpm can indicate fitness. If you're at 180ish now at 7min pace and let's say a couple of months later you're able to do 7min at 170ish and at 180 you're moving faster than 7min, that's likely an indication of improved fitness, and I say "likely" because of other variables such as the conditions, whether you're running on the same course, etc. Disease or some other issue notwithstanding, your max HR isn't going to drastically change in a couple of months, but if the self-comparison involves comparing a runner to their heart rate data from twenty years ago, at that point it's like comparing two different runners again.

[@therugbysaundi]

Good luck for the weekend Sage... Looking forward to the VO2Max / GingerRunner collaborative video of the race :-)

[@gillcal]

After watching confusing videos about this all day I come here for a Sage synthesis. Thanks for clearing up the mud in the water!

[@nicolaupais8682]

Sage, just kee'em coming! :) I'm from Portugal (just across "the pond" from NYC :) ) and I really enjoy your talks - the content is awesome (you actually read the books!) and your communicating ability only makes it better! Really well done!

[@reycampos7887]

Yer freaking awesome dude, great thorough breakdown on all aspects, rants are good, when the content has quality!!!

[@roddruce]

This video is NOT a rant. Or if it was, a very accurate one. For a young fellow, I think you are spot on.

[@flatline1970]

Hi Sage. Love the way you say "page thirty-eight" @ 11:41 and how your disagreeing with what is written there sounds through simply by stating that page number. :-) On the topic of this 'rant' : I also find it much more enjoyable to "feel" that I'm training in the right intensity zone, rather than checking a heart rate on my watch frequently. Have a good run in LA!

[@TheMasnart]

Great video Sage. I think what I took away from this video is, there are certain things you can learn from Maffetone to help you be a better runner. However, following 100% of what only 1 guy says isn't a good idea in almost anything in life. It is wise to explore many different fitness experts (Daniels, and etc) and analyze your own running program and determine what is working for you, and what isn't.

[@DarkaFire]

Excellent video and a great topic, thanks Sage!

[@VitorCaldeira1980]

I run by HR instead of pace. I AM always ajusting my pace according with my HR goal of that specific workout

[@MsCMR80]

Thank you for your great informative talks, Sage! I think that what definitely makes a difference - in my view - is that you talk about the Science behind all of these tips and that certainly is all I need to know you know your stuff. THANK YOU for sharing the science and the reasons for things!

[@Blackaudix]

Great video! Sage can you talk about overtraining ️plz!

[@isaacgallegos3663]

Thank you again for your time and wisdom.

[@MrColossalfart]

You're great man thanks for all the advice!

[@maximuz7375]

Thanks Sage, Another great Video. I guess, your next topic video could be Before, During and After LA Marathon. I also saw your interview with TheGingerRunner, very interesting!. Keep moving, Sage. Cheers!

[@jessiejiang7669]

MAF method can only help to build aerobic base. For Sage obviously, he has have a strong base already (7min/mi at 130ish HR).MAF method is really good for beginers or athletes who never build their base.

[@amblincork]

I think it probably will be bad for novice runners and encourage the ide thay dont actually have to work hard at training - yes I know not all runs will be done at high intensity

[@YeNZeC]

@@amblincork with the 80/20 rule you're not running that much hard...

[@mmj1342]

Sage, I downloaded your HR Zones and Aerobic Base pdf--totally helpful! I'm over 40, working to get into serious 5k/10k training for the first time--got some overuse injuries last yr when I jumped into your 20+ mile base plan too quickly (too many lower mileage weeks with interval workouts for 3 months prior). I generally follow MAF heart rate to teach me to keep my easy runs easy. MAF is great to train/teach consistent and sustainable running, but it does not seem applicable to peaking for specific races. I don't think I could stay motivated to run more than 4-6 months without adding Tempo or Fartlek runs, which is why I love your Aerobic Base plan.

[@kc3718]

50 years old and my max heart rate has never decreased for atleast the last 20 years, still 194, still winning. Been in the lab for gas exchange and all that, raced from ironman distance to 5 k.

[@maple13ca]

thanks sage.u r great

[@benjaminhowells9721]

thanks for the info, good luck in LA!

[@nursing.questions911]

Base training is not new, but most runners do not know how to do it. It's amazing to put a name to it and why it need to be done in a early stage of new runners journey

[@CoolInOlympia]

Awesome training talk! Thank you! Love your insight into the MAF method!!! Very interesting!

[@Riccardo.Andreotti]

Maffetone formula is what is called an empiric formula, which is a formula based on experimental data. So 180 is not "an arbitrary number", it is instead a parameter of a very simple linear model. It is obviously something highly approximate to give an indication fitting most of the runners. It is simple and it gives results together with the diet proposed. If you are a topo runner you hopefully don't need MAF method to train, but I know amateur runners who made impressive improvements just by following that simple method. People who train after work with PR 2:18... If you are largely outside the range of effectiveness of the fomula that doesn't mean that in the vast majority of the cases the formula works well. As far as I know, MAF method changed for the better the life of a lot of runners. More performance less stress better quality of life.

[@philippides]

He called the maffetone formula number arbitrary based on his own experience, which obviously is not going to conform to experiential data. He's obviously an outlier, probably in the top ninety-ninth percentile of all runners. But he did go on to say that it varies widely for different runners depending on their fitness and experience. my own experience with the maffetone formula has varied. When I was in terrific shape leading up to the Honolulu Marathon a couple of years ago, keeping my heart rate in the 130s or even the 120s was not difficult at all. I've had a rough last couple of years, emergency surgery, weight gain, etc so now, my heart rate is in the 140s even on my easy runs. There are a lot of variables that can affect whether or not the maffetone method is right for someone. People should try a few different methods to see which is the right one for them. I will probably use the maffetone method for a while and then transition to keeping my heart rate more in the 130s.

[@Riccardo.Andreotti]

@@philippides yes, basically what I don't like is when experts argue on non-experts contents as "too simple": if you know exactly what your ideal heart rate training range because you are a pro and you perform lactate tests and vo2max tests periodically, then MAF is not for you, but if you are a couch potato willing to have a general rule to move your feet then MAF is good for you to run comfortably and safely and it gives an upper limit, so the argument that Sage runs at much lower HR than MAF is misleading in my opinion

[@roustabout4fun]

Enjoyed your rant...Insight and Appreciate your sharing! I use an Epson strapless and it seems high so...I use common sense and Kentucky Windage but I get your points I think... Good Luck and sm00th cruzin in LA!

[@Nexeq]

Thanks Sage for yet an other great and informative video. I do have a maby future topic you could talk over. I offent hear people talk about why or why not to use diffrent supplement in endnurace sports like running. Some people praise using protein power after there training and other stick with stuff like water mixed with sugar. Some people dont use any at all or only use it from time to time. Then some people stick with stuff like Green grass powder for everyday use. What is your point of view on supplement in distance running? are there any need? And what if why?

[@flashybuddie1147]

can you talk about peaking and how to do it at the right time?

[@heirtothepwn]

agreed!

[@amblincork]

Glad to se this - some many runners seem to treat Maffetone as some kid of guru and his heart rate training asthough it were gospel

[@erick222]

You, running at a 130 heart rate as you mention, is in fact in keeping with the MAF approach. His general philosophy is to do a lot of easy, aerobic training which is what 130 would be for you. Much of the MAF method is to prevent a person from training too hard in order to do more volume and to avoid injury.

[@hsujim]

+erick222 : he's not doing the Maf method if he uses his HRM to keep easy days easy. You don't need a fancy book to know that's what an HRM is good for. He's also running and training based on pace.

[@therunningmonk6428]

Well u need to understand why 180 minus age ..its making the body adapted to tap energy from fat instead of glycogen..as 99%of most long run is aerobic and almost1 % is anaerobic..so if we can make our aerobic system more dominant and train on that we stay injury free and the aerobic training feeds the anaerobic training too...body take time to adapt ..and his training is mainly focused on taking the energy from fat instead of glycogen stores...he preaches ketosis with the training...its very monitored training and if takes some time for body to adapt as most of us are sugar burner...and all of us agree our body perform better on fat than glucose. .buf we need to make the body relearn this...rest we all are wise enough...

[@jacobschenkel1010]

12:40 classic comment, aged pretty well..."you could do it on a downhill course with springs in the shoes..." not exactly done downhill but done with springs in the shoes on a special course set up just for Kipchoge...was a thrill to watch. Beautiful execution. Now waiting for it to happen in a full on race.

[@fdtlkj]

Do you now the intro song?

[@philippides]

Excellent, thorough breakdown, Sage! All of your videos are great. The maffetone method is a real mixed bag. It would either work for me really well or not work for me at all depending on where I was in my fitness journey. I'm 34 so following the maffetone method, the high end of my easy days should be 146 bpm. A couple of years ago leading up to the Honolulu Marathon when I was in excellent shape, my easy days were more in the range of 120 to 135. I would crack 150 bpm only on tempo runs and race pace focused long runs. I've had a rough couple of years, weight gain, dad passed away, emergency surgery, etc. So now I'm in terrible shape and on my easy days, my heart rate easily spikes to 156. On my hard days, my heart rate spikes to.... Well, higher than it should be able to get. Well above what should be max heart rate for my age. Maybe my watch is broken. It all depends on one's experience and training, and you gave a great explanation of that.

[@zonqoh]

I'm also not in shape... I started running May 1st and my heart rate shot up to 207bpm😲. It's slowly coming down now, today's max was 187, but I walked a lot too, trying to calm it down. Will see two months from now

[@zonqoh]

I'm only 35 years old by the way. 70kg and 155cm tall

[@Audit_Reactions]

Hi Sage, what are your views and experiences from using bicarbonate soda for buffering? Would you recommend? Thanks

[@paulhartnett1704]

Great video

[@mikexhotmail]

very nice sum up!!

[@sandk75]

Great video Sage and good luck in LA. One question, if you follow the Jack Daniels VDOT training pace, when should you increase your pace? I am week 2 into the heart rate easy running in Z2 and I have already seen my pace increase while staying in that zone, but staring at my watch as I run is annoying..haha. Thanks Sage!

[@TheMoonSeesMe]

Hi Sage - great information as per usual. I have been a off and on again runner since my early 20's and finally have taken the plunge to run my first marathon. I'm now in my mid 40's and I have found that my heart rate is way higher than yours (and others) for even a lower pace than what you run. I find that if I run at slower than 140 bpm my pace is to slow for any kind of non-embarrassing speed. Is it more running time that I need to decrease my heart rate that will ultimately increase my speed?

[@solvalou7]

I think the takeaway from MAF is to simply make your easy days easy. Even if you feel good don't run faster. And continue doing 5 - 10% weekly mileage quality training (threshold, intervals)

[@violetaheisler9449]

Very close on your prediction of the marathon under 2hr. Spring in his shoes lol

[@thomasgreen8180]

Hey sage! I'm in grade 9 and was wondering how should I train differently compared to an adult. Since the body of teen's are still developing how does this impact training? Thanks and keep up the awesome content, good luck with your marathon by the way!

[@giovanbattistafichera8439]

the only difference worth mentioning is that while you're young, you can recover quicker from speed and high-intensity sessions.

[@LouisEguchiWale]

great video i like your sunglasses tan line : )

[@isaacmoats4055]

Would this type of training work for specifically a cross country 5K? All of the videos I have found on HR training in zone two have been for marathons, triathlons, and Ironman races.

[@JamesScottGuitar]

Sage, what is it about Hoka that you like so much? What brought you to their shoe?

[@realphysiotherapy606]

thank you for the analysis. was always feeling something not right about what he put on his sites: Dr title without credentials, perfecting LCHF diet, criticizing "food industry" poisoning people but pushing his own supplements, engineering our own physiology...with your video, had better understanding of his thinking traits reflected in his training theory.

[@joel_poindexter]

I recently re-watched this one, and something that stuck out to me is the criticism that 1) for an elite runner, the MAF pace is too high, AND 2) that a sub-2 hour marathon (or significantly below 2 hours) is unreasonable. It seems as if an aerobic base would have to be fast in order for an athlete to sustain a sub-2 pace, right?

[@calebhoo4193]

I guess it's terrible that i'm running at 170s on "easy days" then... My max reached recently is 206 and I'm 15/recovering from an injury, and just got a heart rate monitor. I didn't realize I lost so much fitness or just never had a good base because 170s is almost 9 minute pace and that's strange to me.

[@ryankrook4046]

Not to discount your opinion but that's what this video is, your opinion which is clearly shaped by how you've been trained. You say, "I've never agreed with positive split workouts", but offer no support - I'd guess that that is just how you've trained and what you're used to. just be aware of the bias in your opinion.

[@04004]

Because your HR is going to increase during a higher intensity workout. Sitting at an arbitrary level means you will actually be slowing down over the course of your run. This defeats the entire purpose of the 'workout' and means you are neither running 'hard' or 'easy'. Therefore you are not getting the best returns for time and energy spent. He explained this in the video. I would think if you look at pro/elite runners then you would be hard pressed to find anyone that trains under the MAF method. You have to add in intervals, lactate threshold sessions to improve speed and efficiency, and also to get your body used to running at higher intensities. That is if you want to improve your race times.

[@exerciserelax8719]

Another thing to point out is that the MAF test is not a workout but, as the name implies, a test. It's used to see if your aerobic fitness is improving and only done once a month or so. Still, it's probably true that many of your daily runs on the Maff. plan would also be positive split in order to keep your HR in the correct range. Is there any evidence that's a bad thing, other than tradition? Maybe the idea is that it establishes bad habits for racing since even or positive splits generally result in the best times. But has this actually been tested/proven? I guess I disagree with the previous comment because it seems to me that if you start off on an easy run and slow down, you're still going easy. I don't see how that changes it to neither an easy nor hard run. I don't follow Maff. in my own training currently, but I think he has some interesting ideas that I'd like to see more discussion of.

[@closmasmas9080]

Am I running too hard for easy days if after my first week of getting back into training, My perceived effort pace is getting slower?

[@suwarnpant]

Hi, Have question... I am c25k runner,started running about 3 months back and have couple of 10ks under my belt. My 10k times are pretty amateurish ...they hover arnd 60 min mark. I have heard a lot about aerobic training but it's really hard to maintain my heart in zone 2... What should I do in such cases..should I switch to walking to bring HR rate down and this would result in switching to walking every couple of mins.

[@MrPridizzle]

Would I get a speeding ticket if I was running in Zone 69?

[@MrDRock-rc2tz]

Hey love your channel! I am getting back into running after a long time off. For the past three years ive actually been powerlifting. I am currently 6'4 270 lbs. I have been doin c25k for the past month slowly building my cardio back up. Anyway, I have a 4 mile race I am doing in June and my goal is to do that in under 30 minutes. Do you think that is an achievable goal from where im starting? Greatly appreciated if you can respond. Either way great channel!

[@MrDRock-rc2tz]

Just a little bit more info. I am not gonna be lifting weights. At least for awhile. I had been losing motivation in my weight training and just feeling unhealthy. I want to feel healthy again so I am just focusing on running and bodyweight movements for the forseeable future.

[@FPrimeHD1618]

That was tier 1 music at the beginning.

[@fieldwalker]

I was equally confused with the MAF method. (A friend recommended it). At 45yrs, my max HR is 185+. 135 bpm is walking speed. I'm aerobic running at 155 to 165bpm (tested). His HR formula has me at walking speed for months of workouts??!! Didn't make sense to me, cheers for addressing.

[@PauloALopes]

how can 135bpm be your walking hr?

[@ramblinman7153]

Poor aerobic base

[@420jettt2]

Bro idk if you’ll see this but your aerobic basic is dog shit. “poor” like this guy said would be an understatement.

[@fieldwalker]

Ha - harsh reply! KZbin emailed me so I saw after all. Yes, prolly crap aerobic, at the time. I think I only ever ran intervals. Current aerobic is 135 to 145: little better. but at age 50 now that’s nothing special. Do way more slow and fasted running now. I could always do a 16 or 17 min 5k but it took some serious training changes before finally getting a quick marathon

[@420jettt2]

M Fieldwalker cool. Not gonna lie I need to build my base as well. 145-160 is mine (I’m 17) and my pace for those runs is like 8:30

[@contador8197]

But for a beginner, is it really truly an “easy intensity” if his heart rate is at 130, 140 or even higher at 10, 11, 12 minute mile pace? It’s easy for a long time runner, who by default has a substantial base whether built correctly or not. Determine by how many injuries he has, true?

[@gbgb1295]

Hi, Sage. Sorry mate I can't locate the pdf about intensty zones on your wen site. Can you help me on this. Thanks for your time.

[@burritojimmy526]

What if someone had a pacemaker that made the heart beat at 180 for the entire race time? Do you think this would help get below a 2 hour marathon?

[@MrPridizzle]

BurritoJimmy what if I have a disorder where I have 2 hearts can i still go running at max speeds in like zone 69?

[@annnnn9074]

you said running at your MAF of 150 beats per minute is to fast. I put it to you that if you want to crack a 2 hour marathon then you need to train MAF so that 150 beats is aerobic and becomes easy. Doing intensity workouts where your HB is 165 or higher for short amounts of time is largely a waste of time

[@mintheman7]

I think Sage is misunderstanding the MAF method. According the MAF method, 180-age+adjustments is the MAX heart rate you should run to keep the training aerobic, not the pace you must run. If it is too high for you, by all means slow down. I do agree intervals, threshold work and other "quality" work outs will help push your fitness further, but they must be done on top of a solid aerobic base. I personally think the 80/20 ratio of easy/quality split advocated by Matt Fitzgerald has the best balance.

[@nursing.questions911]

I agree with you. He don't understand it. The calculation does not give max HT. Please coach SAGE, your audience are not just elites. Your videos miss a lot of runner spectrum because you give your opinion and experience and are not open to scientific ways of running and give all runners approach to running

[@JohnAdams-rm7zm]

Nice job, great info 👍🏻

[@thepatternforms859]

My long slow pace is 10:00/mile… my heart rate is around 160 average for that… I have to stop and walk occasionally during the run to keep heart from entering max zone 4… so basically my long slow pace IS my threshold/tempo pace. They are the same

[@giovanbattistafichera8439]

Sage, I believe that anyone who's not a complete doofus understands what a "talking pace" is. Now, if the 180 formula doesn't actually work, it's for the same reason the 220 formula doesn't work. When an athlete falls at either end of the spectrum, i.e. quite low/high max HR relative to the average of athletes, it doesn't matter whether the formula comes from this or that coach, you're a special individual who'd benefit from either learning to pace yourself carefully (which is an acquired skill) or periodic lab tests. Since many of use do not have the time (or the means) to get tested so often, I think that beginners should seek advice from advanced runners. That said, the MAF formula seems to work for me as I can converse at that pace range, though it's early to say. What I can say from my first impression is that it is VERY slow compared to the paces I used to run and for this reason seems like a much more manageable training intensity.

[@420jettt2]

This dude knows wtf he’s talking about

[@metjushfromcave]

Finally someone who also finds the MAF threshold to be too high. I am 22 - it would be about 158 for me. That's super high! I run my long runs between 130-140, and my tempo runs between 155-160 usually. Maybe I should run tempo runs a little harder, but still, 158 as my aerobic level to run all my runs at is ridiculous... Thanks for these detailed talks Sage!

[@metallica4869]

Sage, love the vids great job. My coach and I have been playing with the idea of incorporating some HR monitoring into my training and I think I have a pretty good handle on the zones. I am curious about how other factors affect your HR such as weather (too hot or too cold) and also, if you consume caffeine within a certain amount of time before your workout or run, would that affect your HR as well? Keep it up bro, good luck in L.A. Anthony

[@brucelin5842]

If u train at this hr zone will it burn fats?

[@fdtlkj]

Does anyone know the intro song?

[@averagesquares9140]

I think percentage of maximum heart rate to figure out zones would be more accurate for an individual rather than a generic 180 as in the Maffertone method

[@ianwithers7395]

Good video but as I understand the MAF method does not say that all of your runs need to be 180-your age bpm. This is what you should use when you are building your base, after this in order not to plateau you can do interval training, speed sessions, progression runs, etc. I think the MAF method is just to enable you to build mileage without getting injured, it has had success with elite athletes such as Paul Allen who has won the iron man 6 times.

[@SneakySteevy]

For a beginner his training is good. Cant really overtrain, give time to focus on the form (instead of focus on catching your breath), out of breath you loose form, create an anaerobic base etc! Maybe for an athlete is not the best training?

[@mzs321]

Saying Maffetone doesn't want his atheltes to focus on speed work shows that the ranter has pretty limited understanding of MAF method. Not to say his method is always right or Jack Daniels is wrong but few things said about MAF method in this video are also absurd.

[@annab4389]

Ok. I have a question then. My HR is crazy. When I go veereeery easy and slow it goes up(and stays) around 170-180 bpm. When I do intervals it jumps to about 200. According to what you said it's way too high. Any idea why? My resting HR is low 48-50ish. It is basically not possible for me to even do a short workout and have my HR lower than 150 xD

[@cinupinu]

I have this problem too. Would like some info on this as well.

[@carinamaren7779]

train easier. you're going too hard. and be patient. let your body adjust so take your time.

[@carinamaren7779]

+Carina Maren you also might be dehydrated, stressed out or overtrained. so just take it easy.

[@edscottdotblog]

It sounds like your body is jumping to use sugar as a fuel immediately instead of fat. Working out consistently for a few months at a low HR will change this, as will working out before breakfast if you don't already. It might even require walking but it is very worth it.

[@liverpoolguy79]

Any idea what your max hr is? I have a friend whose max hr is 221 and for him it is totally aerobic to have a hr of 170. If it feels relatively easy for you to breathe at 170-180bpm then it is totally okay to train aerobic base for you at that hr.

[@hsujim]

Until Boston Marathon gives out awards for "Most Consistent Heart Rate, Male 45-49," I'm training by paces. HRM is good to reference fitness versus pace ranges, but nobody cares about your HR....only your time.

[@justinhuddleston178]

I often feel that Maffetone doesn't quite cover the full story though I think it's mostly a good approach.

[@andyxyz6580]

Started off shaky but finished strong.

[@johncox00]

I hope you re-watch this video when you’re in your 50s and you’re running battles of attrition.

[@lipovsk1]

I disagree with Sage. I think Maffetone's method is very helpful for beginner and rookie runners. Most people falling into those categories will push their heart rates way, way past Maffetone's max calculated heart rate of 180-age. Maffetone's method is basically just that you should take the majority of your runs easy, build an aerobic base, and not push your heart rate too high, leading to overtraining. This doesn't mean you can't mix it up a bit (even Maffetone himself says this). As your aerobic base gets stronger, you can mix in higher speeds and more intense workouts with more frequency.

[@MrToirleach]

Rob yes and his main aim from what I have read is that you enjoy your runs and workouts. Relaxation and a quiet mind equals maximum running economy for your biomechanics. I do see Sage’s point though. Making the claims for a 1:48 marathon is not beginner or rookie stuff so the MAF method is going to get serious criticism if he is making claims Ike that.

[@PoetWithPace]

Totally agree Rob! Easy runs help build aerobic base for sure and has made me faster!

[@advex4428]

True, the method of only going slow is for rookies. Mark Allen, who worked closely with Maffetone, developed a more nuanced approach to it, that includes speedwork. But Mark Allen was a great fit for Maffetone, in my opinion, because he was all about being well trained and prepared via real high volume, like others too, but at the same time being rested better than anyone else. So he really celebrated his off-season, he did not try to smoke anyone at grouprides, he was known to sleep more than 9 hours, usually, and he did a much longer taper than the others. Well, it paid off. In short, going slow only does not make you competitive. However, if working with the Maffetone approach is good enough for Allen, its well worth looking into it. But one last thing: why would that not be the way to go for elite-coaching? One Theory: Take a conventional coach, training 20 athletes with the 80:20 approach of zone training. Let's say 2 of them become champions, but 1 of those two burns out a year later and quits the sport, the other has an impressing career and Drops out after 10 years of great victories with wrecked knee and a destroyed Achilles. The other 18 ran into injuries and burnout early in the game, and dropped out. Now take a Maffetone-coach. He might have to train 100 athletes for a champ. A healthy champ who might continue the sport after his pro career without staying an absolute champ. Of the other 99 maybe 60 are competitive and well, but not pushed all the way up to being champions. They stay healthy and in the sport for the long haul.Let's say the rest dropped out through an occasional injury, or other issues in life. Who will be considered the greater coach? Exactly, the first one, and maybe rightly so, depending on the viewpoint. But as a self-trained-person, who has seen the own body vulnerable at times in life, it stands to reason to give the Maffetone idea a try.

[@PoetWithPace]

@@advex4428 very well put. I have been talking about thios for a while with a number of people since reading about maffetone method and we all cam to same conclusion as yourself. The 1st cioach gets all the accolade, but some of us are here for the longhaul and enjoy our sport for long term. Not short term gain.

[@sachikoeubanks8906]

AdvEx っっっp+」

[@wasimahmed5941]

Thanks for talking against a cult. Appreciate your logical talk.

[@peakoos112]

1:59. It will take 10 -20 years at least. Probably he will be running downhill with springs in the shoe or busted for doping... What do You think now Sage? :-D

[@FabioTicconi]

he's still "kind of right" :P considering he used high-tech "springs" in the shoe, and had to have a car and formation of pacers breaking the wind around him, Eliud's achievement is not in fact "legal". We still have to see a proper sub2 on legal marathon conditions.

[@MichaelMoore-hd9lo]

Hey Sage I want to improve my 24 min 5k, Im doing 30 miles a week, I doing hill repeats, tempo runs and long runs. Is that enough to take 2minutes off my 5k in 6 months

[@coldnights7505]

Im not Sage, but that goal is definitely possible if you put in the work. 6 months is plenty of time to get in sub 20 min shape if you work hard

[@SneakySteevy]

If you d run at 156 but less mileage...maybe that overtime you ll be able to run at 156 longer...! Now that you run at 135 you doesnt improve much. You have to run in higher zone to eventually be able to run easy in them. Thats his point!

[@cryptoauctica8676]

What I dont understand is if i take my age minus 180 i get 145, +5 as i been running for a while i get to 150. But my max HR is 199 on races, so running at 150 HR feels too slow, maybe its more like 150-160.... Surely Max HR comes into it to find max of aeobic

[@Readytogo11111]

MAF HR is for your easy pace not your race pace of course it's gonna be slow

[@jamieerossi3987]

found it

[@SamirMishra6174]

Very important advice, 🙏

[@eliseotanable]

Agee!!!

[@JJ-ck1vg]

must be sunny lol

[@franzbo79badasssubscribers12]

Vo2maxProductions Except for the cool down, I try to make all of my running negative splits. Jack Daniels has a free VDOT calculator on line, it's fun to play with and it's user friendly. runsmartproject.com/calculator/

[@71Darkone]

The MAF method is tried and test, no point in trying to reinvent the wheel! Of course there are some variables that contribute to lowering pace but overall MAF is another tool in the endurance runners toolbox..

[@DeadRoman]

Im 30, i WISH my hr at an easy 7:30-8min pace was 155. I am usually struggling to keep in in the 150's

[@closmasmas9080]

11:19 Kipchoge be like Ima prove you wrong

[@MrMcGuck]

With the top runners already being busted left and right for doping, the odds of someone breaking 2 hrs without doping is absurd.

[@jpod]

2.00 mark broken

[@yoso585]

Sage does not have a good grasp on the Maffetone Method. The fact the his MAF is 156 and is hard for him to run at demonstrates that his aerobic fitness is outstanding. I’m sure he runs 90% of his volume below that heart rate which fits the MAF method perfectly. Just sayin’

[@yoso585]

Maffetone also came to his conclusions by collecting performance data from many runners for many years. He’s not making things up.

[@mikexhotmail]

Spot on. Maffe also pointed that out in his book.

[@dannywhite8395]

Sub two hour happened bro!

[@Sharpie37377]

The World Record is 2:01:39.

[@dannywhite8395]

Joni Sharp officially yeah. That 2 hour barrier has been broken though.

[@Sharpie37377]

@@dannywhite8395 true, and it was an incredible feat and amazing to watch. But it was unofficial for multiple reasons, so Sage's statement still holds some truth.

[@k28hill]

I think your too hard at how your going after the MAF method. Been really beneficial to myself. May not be your cup of tea, no problem. It does work, look at elite runners who use it - Mark Allen was one example

[@420jettt2]

Elite runners have easy days (maf pace), and threshold/session days. They do take their easy days easy and hard days hard

[@sonsoftheedelweiss72]

Mark Allen might disagree with you, respectfully.

[@Adrian.M.Narine]

< 2 hours in 2019. 4 years after upload date, and not 10 years like you thought. :-)

[@redmax9700]

why don't you get tested in the lab? would make sense for you. while i'm sure you can truly feel your lactate threshold, you could probably profit from knowing your max to define all your training zones.