Heresy Hammer Ep8 - Warhammer The Horus Heresy IMPERIAL FISTS Legion Rules Review

[@PointyPaints]

"you dont have to bring 20 man squads.... i fucking would!" Lee is my spirit animale lol

[@DECKTRON5001]

Night fighting would make more sense if it was appropriately renamed and represented some sort of preliminary bombardment by either side kicking up dust and has everyone shaken up for a bit at the start of the fight

[@heresyhammer]

That's actually a great shout, I just find it daft that genetically modified super soldiers are essentially scared of the dark 🤷‍♂️

[@jackgunnell4442]

Absolutely love the content guys. Thank you!!

[@heresyhammer]

Thanks mate, glad you're enjoying it 😊

[@remusventanus5341]

Alright! One of my 2 legions getting some love today! Wasn't expecting to see one of mine so soon. Cheers guys! Keep it up!

[@heresyhammer]

No worries mate, what's your second legion?

[@remusventanus5341]

@@heresyhammer Super Loyalist. Lol. I main IF and I'm working on an Ultras army on the side. So much damn resin with 30 breachers and 10 Invictarus Suzerain. My bud runs IW so, the first 2 legion videos have been very fitting for us. Haha! Im afraid future videos will tempt me into another army though... Is it Instagram where you guys post on? Might have to make one to see what this community is up to. Hope Paul is working hard studying the Salamanders for next weeks vid.

[@heresyhammer]

@@remusventanus5341 Yeah Instagram, follow and use the #heresyhammer, Rob is currently working on some Ultramarines and they look hot , love the Roman aesthetic👌 Paul? Working hard? Never gonna happen....😆😆😆

[@NapGod]

On the subject of broken wargear loadouts: Castellan rocks up with MC Autocannon and Nemesis Bolter (both gaining extra shot), and a thunderhammer with Vigil Storm Shield. Some humorous possibilities too: Champion consul with a pair of lightning claws (somehow) holding a paragon blade and still juggling a storm shield, A Predator with twin-linked turret-mounted IACs, pintle IAC, and sponson IACs aka "The BRRRRT Bus". If an IF character is rocking a combat shield, boarding shield, AND vigil storm shield - Should he count as a fortification? Great Video, excellent deep dive. I've watched so many of these at this point I almost didn't give this a chance, but glad I did. Gave me a few ideas on alternate builds for my Fists, and y'all are entertaining too. Sub'd and looking forward to more content.

[@heresyhammer]

Yeah I've never worked out how you'd actually model some of the load outs!!! Powerfist holding a bolt pistol in one hand with a boarding shield in the other?!!! 😂 Glad you enjoyed the video, plenty more content to come 🤙

[@ObjectiveAnalysis]

Awesome breakdown guys, best on KZbin in my humble opinion! Keep feeding us this awesome content 🔥

[@heresyhammer]

Thanks mate 🤘

[@rychardharris3934]

Great episode guys. Thanks for the shout-out. Totally agree with your thoughts on Night fighting. Seeing Recon squads pop up in nearly every list at the mo and it's sad that they are seen as an auto include. Sniper is just to strong a rule. Fists for the win.

[@heresyhammer]

Thanks mate and no worries. Yeah it says a lot when you literally never saw recon squads and now they're all over the place!!!

[@chrisgibson2774]

On the points of Nemesis Bolters, I regularly run 2 units of 2 recon marines (with Aug scanner) in my Alpha Legion, which is themed as the Assasination strike force. They don’t always work well, but having the freedom to choose a target, to drop characters and give that -1 LD is a big effect.

[@Quillpaints]

Great discussion with some well reasoned insights :) Inspired me to plan out my fists and get cracking! Would really appreciate time stamps for the various topics and units etc Keep it up guys :)

[@heresyhammer]

There should be time stamps but half a job Rob forgot!!! Never fear he shall be beaten and time stamps will be added 👍

[@WarmasterPainting]

Great show guys!

[@heresyhammer]

Thanks man, loving the Sisters of Silence diorama so far, gonna be 🔥🔥🔥

[@WarmasterPainting]

@@heresyhammer Thank you!

[@jhamish1]

Some interesting points lads. I think nemesis bolters work because of the points cost and the fact they're heavy, I don't think vets should be able to take them. Limit them to recon/scout squads and a handful of specialist legion units. Augry scanner rules seem to be written to counteract entire armies deep striking en masse and being able to assault on the turn they come in. Make them a bit more expensive and take away the night fight mitigation rules. Make night fight a 4+ and take away the -1 to leadership.

[@heresyhammer]

Yeah agreed mate, fuck knows why vets have access to relentless Nemesis Bolters 🤷‍♀️ and -1 Leadership to astartes is just dumb!!!

[@Valfodur]

Huzzah!!! Keep them coming!

[@olliep158]

Augury scanners definitly need a points increase - 25pts seems sensible, as it would take an army with 5 of them down to an army with 2. I think Helical Targetting Arrays are in a similar position to Augury Scanners, they give too many buffs for their points cost. The result of these is HH2.0 is becoming a no-fly zone as flyers just get blown out the sky as soon as they arrive from reserves and there is nothing you can do about it as it's a result of a reaction. Flyers need "something" to be able to deal with these attacks.

[@heresyhammer]

I think Helical Targeting Arrays are a perfect example of the minor issues with the new edition. You just get so much with HTA's!!! Why doesn't the target get a Damage Mitigation roll? Why doesn't it count as part of your reaction allotment for that turn? They just seem to stick so many rules into Augury Scanners and Helical Targeting Arrays and Night Fighting that it becomes a bit silly. Like I've said to others though I feel like these are all easily fixed issues.

[@Ethan-jg9sw]

Attribute Gained: Hatred (Imperial Fists)

[@heresyhammer]

😂😂😂

[@abowley]

Awsome show guys and a must listen while painting my world eaters! I'd say do a traitor legion next and just go back and forth between loyal / traitor. But for the sake of my legion, world eaters!!!

[@heresyhammer]

Hmmmm World Eaters you say....

[@jeremypalmer1012]

Great show! I would love to see the Sons of Horus… I’m working on a big SoH army right now.

[@Leonidas2499]

Loving the content!! Just wanted to point out that the Castellan, with the Assault Cannon, doesn't get the extra shot, because it isn't Heavy, so it's only 4 shots not the 5 you said in the video

[@heresyhammer]

Classic Rob the cheating fuck!!! Thanks mate I'll put this in the rule's correction for the next show 🤙

[@jackfrew-brown1005]

In relation to most expensive legion Terminator, I believe that belongs to the Death Guards Deathshroud at 70 pts per model, but the unit starting size is only 2.

[@heresyhammer]

Holy shit 70 points!!! That's insane, yeah fair one Deathshroud must take the crown!!!

[@ObjectiveAnalysis]

Sorry I’m new here and don’t know anyones name (great show by the way, really enjoyed it!) but at around 18:40 when you said that you don’t use rights of war very often arr they optional? Or did you mean that you don’t use the legion specific ones very often? Apologies I’m just getting back into the hobby and I’m a little confused 😅

[@heresyhammer]

Rites of War are optional mate, you can use them to add theme to your army, but there's no requirement to use one 👍

[@ObjectiveAnalysis]

@@heresyhammer oh cool, everything makes more sense now haha! Thanks for taking the time to respond, much appreciated 👍

[@ellisowendaniel]

I recommend putting assault cannons on terminators. I have two in my squad of ten BA terminators.

[@heresyhammer]

Yes mate, assault cannons on terminators look fucking awesome too!

[@greyknight8192]

I find it amusing that statistically speaking, he can take out Sangiunius in a 1 on 1 combat lol

[@thecuttingboardforge8464]

In regard to huscarls being your warlord & taking a warlord trait, I’m pretty sure you need the master of the legion rule now in order to take a warlord trait??

[@heresyhammer]

Not quite mate, (page 284, Armies without Characters) if you choose a non-character model or a model that is not part of a HQ choice as your warlord then that model does not receive a Warlord trait. As the Huscarl Master is a character and a HQ choice he would be entitled to a warlord trait. You need Master of the Legion to be able to take a Rite of War...Unless I've completely mis-read that!!!

[@lloydmitchellnineone]

I think a great thing to do would to put the Instagram username of the people from the start in your description!

[@heresyhammer]

Yeah that's a good shout mate 🤙

[@MikeJones-jn6qj]

Another great episode! Augury Scanners definitely need changing somewhere, whether that's a points increase or just stripping out some of the many rules they have. I kind of like what they did with Night Fighting, however I play NL so I'm biased. The leadership penalty on Astartes is ridiculous though, its insane to suggest they're scared of the dark, as you say, it would make sense if it affected militia only.

[@heresyhammer]

I'm not mad at it from a gameplay point of view, it seems a bit weird that space marines can't see in the dark etc. However, the negative to leadership for Astartes just makes no sense at all, fluff or gameplay wise!

[@MikeJones-jn6qj]

@@heresyhammer Yeah I found it odd at first to have to buy night vision for NL when it's supposed to be a genetic thing they have. Totally agree though that in "reality" every organised military force would have access to some form of night vision, and the leadership penalty is absurd.

[@jackfrew-brown1005]

Great episode! Please do Death Guard next

[@Jackalos1]

Pretty sure, relentless on vets is to replace suspensor webs. Also, would love to see you cover Emperor's Children!

[@heresyhammer]

Probably, but, in my opinion, there wasn't anything wrong with suspensor webs that required changing and would have stopped the whole sniper vet fuckery 🤷

[@Jackalos1]

@@heresyhammer Yeah, I don't know why they did it. Some unique units even get relentless when it has no effect (e.g. Palatine Blades)

[@heresyhammer]

@@Jackalos1 I'd like to say it's future proofing, but we all know it isn't....🤷‍♀

[@petercarlson8240]

Yeah, this is a great show, highly recommended. Lee is the f*cking top dog too.

[@heresyhammer]

Thanks man, and you are correct Lee is a fucking legend (It's definitely not Lee writing this.....) 😂

[@CaptainPlunk]

Thanks a lot for this vids Amazing to listen while painting 👌 If feels too much imo, everything is combining to make them the best legion Their shooting is wayyy too strong their defensive buffs are stupid (you don't kill anything in the if....) and you forgot to mention you can have the 3++ reroll able when taking a praetor with warden is stone gauntlet. This fact is also stupid, Custodes got this in v1 and it was nerfed... Cause it's too much The sniper topic I agree they are too much, maybe only rending on a 6 or precision shot on a 3 They dont kill a lot but what they kill can make you lose squads as the moral is quite important in v2 Scanners needs a nerf, they are the main item that ruined the deep strike/outfiank armies... Which is a shame as they are super thematic Night fighting is indeed probably a bit too much but I think this was done to restrict the first turn syndrom: first players shoots first and wins first

[@heresyhammer]

Yeah agree with all this. Agree that the night fighting rules are probably for gameplay rather than fluff, but I still can't understand the negative to leadership. But I would say that I think a lot of these rules just need minor tweaking rather than complete overhauls.

[@warpaintjj]

Space Wolves please Gents.

[@andykopach4718]

Fafnir is even crazier because with the boarding shield in stone gauntlet/phalanx warder units the bonus applies to the model not the shield itself. So his iron halo becomes a 3++ rerollable.

[@warpaintjj]

I hope you know what you’re talking about cos I just spent another 3 hours absorbed by your content!!!

[@heresyhammer]

Ha ha have you not seen our rules correction section?!!! We have no idea what we're doing!!!

[@tomaveryta]

Great stuff as always gents! Makes me hate IF even more, just waac garbage! And fuck Augrary scanners, they’re ruining the game. SoH deep dive please!! 🥰

[@heresyhammer]

😂😂😂

[@jkillerb]

😍😍

[@jonathanaskham3333]

Terrible episode. 1 star.

[@heresyhammer]

Sorry who are you?!!! 😂😂😂