HHO Neutral Plates Explained

[@Kepelec]

Very nice video, well explained thanks for the info, don't know why people complain about videos like this, you are giving away your knowledge free, good job

[@Cloudy2Clear]

Excellent info. Will save my thousand questions until I've watched all your vids on HHO. Thanks for explaining a basic heat problem & how it's resolved. Now back to vid 1.

[@Bikandee]

You are a legend. Thanks for your hard work, my cell works perfectly. The neutral plates also keep my water temp. down. Just brilliant!!!

[@nasir110875]

so that is why my wire always getting hot, because my hho does not have neutral plate. thank you sir for the explanation.

[@donpedroarellano]

I'm new with this technology and no know-how what-so-ever about HHO generators but I am very much interested, It took me sometime searching for videos to explain how neutral plate works and here you simply explained it so well that I understood it quickly. Thank you so much, kudos to you and keep on doing videos like this!

[@50AHenry]

Thank you for a simple, straightforward and excellent explanation / presentation. Please be encouraged and do not let the inevitable negative people spoil your day. God bless !!!

[@David45Abq]

Great clips packed with info for novices, thank you! 1 issue I've discovered even thru my research EFI engines need O2 & MAS tuners. Wish I'd seen that earlier in my attempts to build HHO devices. I'm a bit discouraged now knowing I'll need to spend more for those devices. Also, noone seems to show or do "sloshing" test. ie: if the unit is operating on a vehicle while driving around and the solution is sloshing inside the containers, how that effects the HHO production.

[@mrfixit007]

Thanks Mike, I always wondered on the forums what the +nnnnnn- meant and I couldn't get it in my mind how they could get to 2 volts. Great video. Keep up the good work.

[@robbygill1]

Thank you, You just cleared up a big question for me. This should be elementary for anyone who understands series/parrallel. Much appreciated!!!

[@davestr2046]

Brilliat tutorials! Learned more from your vids than anywhere else.

[@AngPatGV]

Thank You for your Very Clear and Very Understandable Video! You do an awesome job of explaining it!

[@bladeproject1]

I run plus minus over 8 plates in my vehicle. My volt meter never seems to drop under 2 volts and max out at 30 amps. I use a stainless steel bucket as it syncs heat better from the water. It does overheat if i travel over 1 hour drive time and also starts drawing over 3 volts. Its when I turn it off. I use very little electrolyte. Sometimes I use tap water contaminants as electrolyte. Dont need much with plates in series. Great explanation.

[@centralcoastoffgrid]

@TheJimmax Yes for this calculation you only use one side of one plate to come up with the initial number that gets divided by two. Also, yes, I have shipped products to the UK but it gets expensive. A typical dry cell or kit is $45.50 - $58.00 to ship overseas. On top of that different products get shipped from different vendors so it can add up.

[@ThePresidentialTouch]

Good stuff! Well laid out and explained.

[@ioaircraft]

this is a very good video for explaining how to understand neutrals. thanks much.

[@HHOPWR]

Very nice explenation Mike. Perfect to send HHO newbies to. Larry

[@centralcoastoffgrid]

In my older videos of the EBN cells I was running 4 neutrals between each positive and negative plate. You can't tell because the tabs on the plates alternate. Count the actual plates (thin silver lines) not the tabs. Since those early videos all the cells have been running with 5 neutral plate configurations.

[@curtiskimble1062]

I have a motorhome with a 454 engine that I am looking into the possibility of running on HHO. There is plenty of space to work with, however I'm worried about my output of HHO meeting the high demand needs of acceleration/versus cruising at a normal speed. I'm thinking I'm going to have to find a way to store the HHO gas into a pressurized cylinder to be sure there is no drop in power when it's needed. Is this true? If so, where should I look to learn about storing HHO under pressure?

[@IdelcoEM]

really thanks! i love your videos and style. you´re very good teacher. you explain everything to understand for beginner people like me. i have to check better your channel but what do you think about who many hho its inyected to the engine? it dont take care of the rpm of the engine. im sorry for my englis im spanish and i´m still learning. thanks!

[@JBattler]

Thanks for this..first time I have heard it so clearly. I assume from this then that one does not need a PWM if you can get it down to two volts? The other question I have always wondered about is the thickness of the plates. What is best and why. What are the consequences of using thicker /thinner plates. What is optimum? Thanks very much...you are a great teacher JB

[@yobrojoost]

Thank you very much for this explanation! I've been wondering what the N plates were for, even asked the suppliers of my system. They couldn't give me an answer, great,eh? That's what I call after sales service! NOT! So thanks, I've subscribed to your channel.

[@centralcoastoffgrid]

@31saint31 Like I explain in the video as long as you keep it in the 2v - 2.2v / plate gap range then you will be fine. If you are running 12v - 13.5v and you have less than 5 neutral plates then yes adding more neutrals will lower the heat. Your cell will still heat up over time just not nearly as fast.

[@chavoya123]

this is very serious and informative, thank´s a lot man...you do a gret effort explaining the procces,and it is aprecciated..

[@lowhzaudio]

hello mike! can i use a combination of 2 positives and 2 negatives with 6 neutral plates in between? the total number of plates would be 22 in my proyect. there is no dry cell with 22 plates

[@centralcoastoffgrid]

@TheJimmax Take the total exposed surface area of one plate (lets say 4"x4" = 16 square in). Multiply that number by .5 (or half). We now have 8, so the maximum amount of amps that you would want to throw at one series (7 plates if running 5 neutrals) is 8 amps. Now say you have a 19 plate cell, that would be three stacks of a 7 plate series, so take 8 amps and multiply it by the number of stacks (8 x 3 = 24 amps max for a 19 plate cell ). Make sense?

[@intheFaceTrading]

Thanks for the information Mike!, can you please confirm the thickness for the plates?. Thanks in advance.

[@centralcoastoffgrid]

@shortyjk95 Glad to help. You are correct, 7 neutrals would be too many. Try 5 and if the cell gets too hot consider using 6. Remember you will need to add more electrolyte when you add neutral plates.

[@michaelkepler377]

thanks Mike, very well explained, question can this principal work in a wet cell?

[@originalCN4]

lol...a voltage divider through water...never thought that would work....i take it the neutral plates are free floating and unconnected?

[@EisBlade]

@Melvinizel Add more neutral plates between each + and - connection. While cars do run on 12 volt systems, the alternator actually produces about 13.8 volts with the engine running. Check yours. Based on an operational amount of 13.8 volts you would need 7 neutral plates which equates to 1.97 volts per plate. Excellent for HHO production and avoid overheating that produces steam. Use 6 plates if you prefer, but be sure to use a PWM as a control measure.

[@jerrymc777]

Excellent presentation! Thanks! I was just posting on HHOForums about using a -N+N- configuration with a PWM to control amps/heat. My dry cell is -NNNN+NNNN-NNNN+NNNN-NNNN+ using a 30A PWM. In your opinion, is this good for a 2.2L gasoline engine?

[@octavioramirez60]

Excelent now I understand much better the use of neutral plates. Thanks for this video

[@centralcoastoffgrid]

@quicksilverphil Yes, they are bi-polar plates meaning they make H on one side and O on the other.

[@jawbraeka]

this has given me a lot of insight and filled in some of the gaps (no pun intended)

[@gazath75]

Awesome vids Man. Keep up the vids mate. I'm new to all this and i have learned more from your vids than probably all the others that i have watched. I notice that most plates are about the same size. If i were using 2v supply and made the plates say 300mm x 200mm would that make much of a diff? or would i need to up the voltage.

[@tazer919]

Finally I understand thanks for the help!

[@Melvinizel]

@dgomezMentec I made a unit with 12 plates with a (+)(n)(-) connection, they heat up very fast seems like the wires were starting to burn, but producing a lot of hydrogen. I tried to make only 3 (-) and 2 (+) and the rest is neutral, the heat is tolerable and acceptable but the hydrogen production is compromized. What can you suggest? My power source is from a car battery with running alternator. Thank you very much.

[@gregsbest]

thank you, very clear.

[@centralcoastoffgrid]

@Dooobs You are correct, with 19 plates the configuration is +NNNNN-NNNN+NNNNN-. You have learned well young Jedi!

[@mahcir]

Thank you for this video. Well explained. How about the production of Hydrogen, thus this makes big difference compared to no neutral plates. like for example, 3 interval plates are connected to anode and the other 4 interval plates connected to cathode?

[@urzaspath1234]

GREAT explanation grasped the concept quicky

[@centralcoastoffgrid]

@HHOPWR Thanks Larry, I figured these videos would save us a lot of keystrokes on the forums when the newbies show up.

[@Schmed1988]

Great Video, thanks for this. I want to build an electrolysis rig to obtain oxygen and hydrogen separately. Most setups have two vertical tubes with a bridge tube between the anode and cathode that is below the hight... Anyways, I'm sure you know the rig. My Question is whether you could use neutral plates and still obtain separate gases? Are the gases still only produced at the anode and cathode or is gas produced by the neutral plates too? Thanks.

[@centralcoastoffgrid]

@31saint31 Yes, solid because the more holes in the plates (like a mesh especially) then the more current leakage you have. This means more heat and less efficiency.

[@centralcoastoffgrid]

@AQFearfullMage The electrolyte is distilled water and Potassium Hydroxide (KOH). You can use that or Sodium Hydroxide (NaOH).

[@ZeroMass]

Great video, but I noticed something you mentioned.. You first say that heat is generated by over voltage and is waste. At the end of the video you also mention that the addition of neutral plates also reduces current.. So my question is, aren't the neutral plates acting on limiting current? thus reducing heat ? If you take a specific sell and add neutral plates, how much current is reduced over that of 2 single plates? What si the difference in HHO production? Need to make one of these. :D

[@luisfilipe1983]

hello, ok that is for dry cells only...? and for wet wet cells is it the same? i have a wet cell 7 plate but i hooked up + - + - + - + with no neutrals in between...what would be the best configuration to get the best gas production?

[@centralcoastoffgrid]

You will still need a PWM in most cases because the cell will still warm up, just not nearly as fast. For your plates, use a minimum of 20 gauge if you are not going to media blast them and a minimum of 18 gauge if you are going to media blast them. Be very careful when media blasting because they will want to warp.

[@MB031]

Great vid.OK, katode produce 2H2 and anode produce O2,now,Which neutral plates produce hydrogen and which oxygen?Or one side of neutral plate facing to katode produce 2H2 and side facing to anode produce O2?Please explain.thank you.

[@aubreyholman]

I'm so glad you stood up for yourself. Much respect my friend. Thank you for the excellent video! People like that enjoy pissing people off. Probably paid to do so ;)

[@Bikandee]

Thanks, saw one of your other video's. One more question: Wouldn't you get chlorine gas when inducing a current though a salty soultion?

[@31saint31]

Thank you for your reply. Question. Would an increased number of neutral plates solve that issue?

[@nivek230]

I just made my first wet cell, temporarily running off a 18v cordless drill battery. Seems like the neutrals don't bubble much at all. Would it be more efficient to run a 3 volt battery off each pair of plates? Granted, I don't know where to find rechargeable 3 volt batteries.

[@eone2345]

Hi, this is great. I just tried to find an answer to these problem a couple weeks before from my friend but I found it today. I have one questions though, will the neutral plate produces gas just like the +ve and -ve plates. Can you please answer this. Thank you.

[@badblinco]

just a quick question could i use a voltage regulator 12v to 2v instead of all the neutral plates to get a smaller 2 plate cell?

[@AQFearfullMage]

I have a question, that electrolyte is composed of water and sulfuric acid as the car battery or something else.thank you

[@sosxbmx]

You don't have to be nasty about it! I didn't give you a thumbs down! I'm working on a dry cell right now. I wouldn't make a video because despite working on well cells for years, and making a hydrogen powered cannon, I would not pretend to know enough about this to teach people about the subject. Thanks for making the internet such a friendly place.

[@centralcoastoffgrid]

Yes, that would work just fine but keep in mind that when you go with 6 neutrals you will need to mix the electrolyte very strong to compensate. Handle with care!

[@satyarx7]

Thanks hhoconnection for this explanation! I'm just started to build an HHO generator for my 93' Mazda RX-7 expecting less fuel consumption or some more power output depending on use. I also have to use O2 sensor extender along with the main and safety components as O2 sensor reads will be vary and I should run my engine with 12.1:1 air/fuel ratio. Would you have any technical info for the plates (grade of stainless steel, etc..) to use or else? Thanks again for this detailed video!

[@marshyman66]

Hi Mike, after all my research into HHO, you provide the best info. I really appreciate it. Just to confirm are you saying any voltage under 2.2 volts is best. My question is that on a 31 plate generator are you still using 12Volts?...or are they designed to use greater voltage?? Thanks again MM

[@rustyridenour2136]

Ok,would i get the same effect,of 2 volts per plate if i ran them as three positive and three negative?

[@Dooobs]

Cool, that helps. How do the poles work when your working with more then 7 plates, i.e. the EBN cells with 19 plates. How do the neutrals work then and where are the negative and positive terminals? So if 7 plates is +NNNNN- is 19 going to be +NNNNN-NNNNN+NNNNN- or would you have the positives on the edges and then two negatives in the middle? (Which I guess would render the central 5 neutrals pointless...)

[@hesh354]

Thank you for your video. Just a question, have you tried using coils instead of plates or mix of both? Would this give higher HHO output?

[@charmortega5361]

Sir what kind of gasket do you used? and where did you connect the positve and the negative of your plates?

[@01wizmiles01]

hi ive got a problem with my stainless steel plates turning brown and the water is starting to get dirty, any solutions. i herd putting a tea spoon of viniger helps but it didnt.

[@centralcoastoffgrid]

I'm not sure I understand your question but if you mean that it appears that I have more than one series of plates in a the cell then yes I do. What you see in the demo is one stack of plates or +NNNNN-. You can add 5 neutral plates and another power plate for a double stack like this +NNNNN-NNNNN+. A 25 plate cell would look like this: -NNNNN+NNNNN-NNNNN+NNNNN-. Make sense?

[@zeroxan]

assuming the plates aren't connected and they are "neutral" they act this way, is that the same case if you deliberately connect each plate to the original source? would it be any less efficient one way or the other? would less be produced?

[@JesseTheGameDev]

@hhoconnection How are the neutral plates bipolar? And how is whether they are negative or positive determined if they aren't directly connected to either the positive or negative end?

[@carl1095]

I've seen designs on youtube where the positive and negative plates are basically just alternatively stacked on top of each other, one after the other, positive then negative and so forth, with no neutral plates in between. What are your thoughts on those designs?

[@richard96816]

What are the advantages of neutral plates versus using a DC to DC converter to drop the main power supply to ~2 volts?

[@zaboky]

what metal are the plates made off? do you put regullar tap water or destiled?

[@flamedrag18]

so is this solely for dry cells or can this be employed on wet cells efficiently too?

[@oldskoolhead0]

could the plates be made from mesh?? or does each chamber between the plates have to be sealed from the rest for the nuteral plates to be effective?

[@centralcoastoffgrid]

Then how do you explain the voltage readings at the end of the video. Just so you know, this is not "my" theory. A lot of guys who really know their stuff taught me this.

[@centralcoastoffgrid]

That's an interesting idea. I don't think I have heard that one yet. Give it a try and let us know what you find.

[@lucienmacrose8567]

what electrolyte solution would you recomend for the plate configuration you just demonstrated?

[@gunawanwibisono9710]

Hi.. regards hho.. I have some question for my hho dry cell generator.. why my generator produced a little gases with high ampere? it produced about 0.5 LPM at 12 volts 40 ampere. i'm using 5 neutral plates, 121 cm2 of electrode wideness, total 22 cells. I've ensured that no leak in hose.. what exactly happened? thanks very much for your response..

[@01wizmiles01]

hi its mile again, i just want to ask you where is the best place to put my hho output hose, i have placed it after the computer air throttle and before the accelerator manifold. no one really says where is the best place to put it. please help. thanks.

[@centralcoastoffgrid]

Sounds great, now do a video and share it with the world!

[@vibe3d]

Does it have to be stainless steel or can I use the top of a tin can like the ones used in sardines?

[@mr240kevin]

hello, which is better to use neoprene or pvc gasket? thanks

[@Bikandee]

What would be the best electrolytic solution? Sodium bicarb or lye?

[@saifullahiqbal5567]

Dear Sir May I know How you connect the babbler with the fuel cell as the piping goes from where to where?

[@nadeem5476]

Thanks - now it is clear what are the neutral plates :)

[@kf4dcy]

have you tried three phase power on the plates. like what you could get from an alternator like what's on your car. this would be before the bridge rectifier. you also spoke of adding more electrolyte if the spacing became greater. have you tried copper-sulphate which you can get at any home improvement store as root killer for septic systems drain field, for root incursion. copper-sulfate is a stronger electrolyte.

[@curtiskimble1062]

Never store HHO....Alright, but how would a person acount for the fluctuation in demand? Sometimes you'll have overages - where would the extra gas go? Other times (if not storing a small amount) you're going to have shortages - causing your climb up a hill ending in a stall. Any HELPFUL comments on this issue?

[@31saint31]

I have an idea for a genorator. Your knowledge is requested. Must the neutral plates be solid? If they are not solid, what happens?

[@harleydavidsonstreet5560]

Is the neutral plates connected to positive or negative. Are neutral plates just staked between.

[@AS881193]

ok.... so now I have a different question... you put a set of plates and continued with different series of them. and had more than one set as part of a cell...is there a particular reason for doing that?

[@01wizmiles01]

very nice video. you said that its best to have about 5 to 6 neutral plates, but in one of your videos i saw you had 1 positive then 2 neutrals then 1 negative then 2 neutrals then 1 positive then 2 neutrals then 1 negative then 2 neutrals then 1 positive. will that over heat. and is it best to have more positive or negative plates.

[@centralcoastoffgrid]

Yes, it applies to a wet cell also.

How about a 'many x 2V' power supply? Think like this: Switch-mode psu (say one single crappy tl494), has pwm, rectifying, filtering, galvanic separation, but the transformer has, instead of one secondary winding, many (as many cells are needed) windings of 2V each. With a diode and a capacitor. I guess only one global current sensing and one voltage sensing circuits are enough. The efficiency of the system is, at least, improved with some extra power-to-weight ratio ;)

[@centralcoastoffgrid]

It depends on how may amps you are drawing and how many amps your supply can handle.

[@JesseTheGameDev]

So, I do understand that the dry cell is bipolar and also that each neutral plate is bipolar. But how do you know which plates will be positive and which plates will be negative so you know up to which point O2 is produced and when the H2 producing plates begin?

[@JackRaven44]

My question is: Do the Neutral Plates have to be wired as well? or do they just sit inbetween the two that have wires?

[@75thibaut]

And is it more effective or less effective if instead of having neutral plate I link plate like + - + - + - etc ? ( with neutral plate it would be like + 0 0 0 0 - )

[@marklmansfield]

Due to budgit constraints; {i.e..if it aint free i cant afford it] i am working with wet jars. To help with leakage i am considering using progressively wider spacing , e.g.[ + n n - ] Using 2 seperate jars wired in series. Any thoughts? Yea or Nay? Before i waste a lot of time? btw, excellent videos

[@WillieStubbs]

I think vertical discs that are free to spin could help slough off the gas bubbles quicker. And if the spacing is a little bigger than the average bubble size that should help get the bubbles dispersed to the top quicker. Just an idea to throw out there.

[@jadeeyy_]

very nice and clear...thank you bro.. take care always...

[@Bikandee]

How do I keep the current low( under 10amps) and still get max HHO production? I Don't want to damage my car battery. Thanks!