HISTORY OF IDEAS - Manners

[@The_Catalyzt]

It's interesting to note that there are people you've never met, and died a long time ago, that influence your life down to the most minute details.

[@davidoluwadare2787]

@JUSTIN YE not necessarily, too many cons in our culture

[@AT-wj5sw]

Dela Flowers yeah because they had AI in the cave with them, that’s how they made fire right ?

[@serinadelmar6012]

Dela Flowers I am young and have immense respect I think it is always important to have respect and be kind, also appreciate the blessings from the smallest thing (which are of course not small things), there are kind humans. I think what is projected in the media and social media and especially the news makes it so easy to forget that there are good people doing good things with humility and joy. More so because the projected image contradicts this.

[@serinadelmar6012]

Dela Flowers I agree completely. It is so crucial. Having said that, I know of people who were profoundly let down by their parents, or absence thereof, who have hearts of gold and are raising their children beautifully but sadly it is a rare thing and the generational situation can replicate itself, though I think that is where governments should come in and help communities. So many things should be taught in school to add extra support but I digress. My point was more that it is so easy to become disheartened with this aspect of humanity, of all ages, and I think it is so important to remember that there are good people who are respectful, appreciative, compassionate and doing good things. Wishing you well.

[@serinadelmar6012]

Dela Flowers you too, I hope it is filled with unexpected joys. Your words really make me think. Obviously I am coming at this from a different perspective, a different generation. I imagine it must be profoundly unsettling to have the world to change so much in your lifetime, before your eyes. I can only imagine… but I think it is important to always be an eternal student, to try to understand, different perspectives, different lives. Just know that there are good people doing good things, longing for kinder times, and more humanity in our world. Where are you from if I may ask? I hope your day is wonderful!

[@keeperofthecheese]

"The duty of civilisation is to create environments where its okay to be fragile... moderation is admirable and elegant." - i love that. Top marks for clarity.

[@Subparanon]

04:46 anybody else see a single frame that looks like the word Manners in white type? I thought SOL was going Tyler Durden on us for a second.

[@CeoLogJM]

MIND CONTROL THE GOVERMENT CHEM TRAILS USING FRAMES TO TRICK OUR MINDS ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) v( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

[@wtfyourhigh]

Check

[@MatiasAlric]

+Subparanon lol i paused, and checked the comments to see if i was the only one. at least it wasn't a short porn scene.

[@bradgillap]

+Subparanon School of life has been playing with this idea of subliminal messaging in many videos but at the same time acknowledging how ridiculous it is in others. I think it's just a joke now.

[@christinalee5055]

+Bradley Gillap explain?

[@n.r.1085]

I like your videos, but they always seem anglo-centric to me. Asian and Arab cultures had a great impact in the history of manners as well. From the use of pefume to bathing, the impact of Arab and Asian cultures cannot be neglected when talking about manners. It would be nice if you can be open to other cultures in your next videos. Thanks!

[@n.r.1085]

You're clearly not a well-read person, nor well-mannered.

[@vivekshah7769]

+124Andro i'll be way harsher than the OP. You're an uncouth, uneducated moron. It was an Arabic traveler who documented the disgusting hygienic practices he observed amongst Europeans while on a Journey in the middle ages. Particularly, he aboard their bathing habits (or lack there of), their toilet habits, failure to use perfume, etc. It was Shah Jahan in the 1500s who remarked that the Portuguese were nice enough people, but they stank because they didn't clean themselves properly after defecating. The truth is that Europe hardly had a civilized culture until the colonial era, when they picked up good manners of hygiene from their colonial subjects.

[@vivekshah7769]

+Pearl Daisy indeed. It was considered normal for most Hindu, Buddhist, Jane people in South Asia to bathe daily - with some even bathing thrice during their twilight prayers. Before the period of early modernity, the general trend was that conditions got better the further east you went - with Western Europe being what we would consider Africa or some parts of the Middle East today. It was undeveloped, turbulent, lacking education, culture, or basic hygiene. The modern idea of the west being the best is really a recent development caused by the legacy of colonialism which gave the west the hygiene and culture it prizes itself on today.

[@richardwallace2182]

England is full of white people. He's saying what he knows. Not everybody is the United States. Not everybody glorifies the "melting pot". Europe is predominantly white, and I don't think they have an obligation to be inclusive just because they're white. That's a horse shit notion that has its roots in the U.S. for some reason.

[@OK-jy1xd]

@@Pentapus1024 not all arab people are muslim nor all of asians eat dogs. You should study more about religions and cultures because you are stereotyping a vast majority of the population of the entire world just because you've seen the news failing most of the time to people like you the right information doesn't make you any less or more educated about a thing. I suggest you do some research about your own ideology, read some books and not just throw back things you've heard on the TV. I hope you have a great day, and I hope you'll be less ignorant. (btw, you can hate on ideas, no one has the right to hate on people believing in those ideas no matter who they are)

[@christineveazey4345]

I wouldn't call having sex with an unconscious woman or beating a woman to submission forgetting one's manners. Manners and etiquette are one thing, depravity is something else.

[@communistsinthegazebo4457]

I think what they are trying to say is manners stem from morality and at certain points in history society did not treat these acts as immoral or wrong. In fact the bible never explicitly defines these acts as immoral, coveting someones ox is in the ten commandments but beating or raping women is not. In fact in one bible story a man gives his daughters to a mob so they can rape them(not as a moral lesson not to rape) Judges 19.24. I am glad we have developed enough as a species to realise how abhorrent this is.

[@ezquizanzlys4287]

that's because depravity is itself a moral question.

[@joquinr447]

What is depravity? What is wrong or right?

[@sierraroseprzybyla3333]

YES! Holy shit, I was stunned when rape was excused by explaining that the men had come of age in an era of more relaxed sexual attitudes.

[@amandacorrea2575]

12:55-13:06 he says it pretty clear here

[@89jinnah]

This video should be more precisely titled as 'history of manners in Europe'.

[@johnpauljones1528]

Yeah there is nothing about asia.

[@Brunixlala]

@@johnpauljones1528 or americas

[@DarkMoonDroid]

Yup. "Western Civilization".

[@bernardzsikla5640]

I agree completely agree. As a person those descendants came from Europe, I especially feel this subject is important to understand my own cultural heritage. I would love to see how other world civilizations developed regarding cultural standards like hygiene and respect for women.

[@194misterx]

mohammed ali Jinnah what do you mean? What else is there outside of Europe?

[@cobalt1754]

5:34 The goblets were also fragile because no one knew how to properly anneal glass (slowly cool the glass over the course of several hours to equalize stress in the glass, the length of time depending on the thickness of the glass). Source: Bill Gudenrath from the Corning Museum of Glass explains this in his class on Venetian glassmaking techniques.

[@pelatho]

The lack of music and over-enthusiasm in this video is so refreshing!

[@Tinymoezzy]

It's just...so wonderfully straight forward

[@Jabrils]

The venetian glass just blew my mind. what incredible design.

[@satwikanmol]

Never thought will see you here Yaah

[@drjawad92]

I just love how this channel takes such very touchy and sometimes confusing contemporary topics, puts them into these digestible chunks, easy to understand and in the process gives us a holistic view of things. Its like they put things into perspective for a layman like myself. Next time I look at the news, I'll have a whole new insight to some of the things there!

[@michaelibidapo5397]

Coming from a guy who spends an ample amount of time watching all manner of educational videos on KZbin to the extent that I actually have a playlist dedicated to them, this is possibly the most refreshing, informative, eloquent, well executed, and reasonably easy to digest video I've seen. Well done old chaps.

[@alhadidi6]

I'm really surprised that you don't have people watching you by the millions! You make it both easy, and confusing to understand life! And yet that guides people to wonder! It's amazing!

[@helenzhou4718]

great video but i'm not sure i agree that sexual harrassment can be simply seen as "forgetting ones manners"...

[@bubbly7137]

But our avoidance of these acts stems from beginning to use manners.

[@tweaker1bms]

Yeah that seemed to go off into a tangent there more suited to 4chan incels...British accents can't hide everything it seems. Today I learned: where Bill Cosby erred was that he forgot to say "May I?" before dropping the roofie in...

[@addisonparsons1178]

Yeah I was horrified at that too. I think that was a pretty misfired attempt to say our manners are kind of an everyday manifestation/reflection of the moral compass that we- or more accurately, men- have developed over time. Very poorly worded.

[@maureeng.9749]

In this case yeah its about manners because the subject line is manners and them being examples of what it means to have manners and what manners are instilled in us at a young age as well as what "manners" means as we get older. Manners are constantly changing as we saw from this video but like how this video also tells us is that the idea of manners stems from kindness towards others as well as vanity and what front we are trying to put up, depending on who the person is they choose to practice manners from one or the other in any given situation. The idea of kindness being the force behind when said manners are used stems from love and we do it earnestly when displaying manners infront of somebody we may or may not know because we want to make feel comfortable. The problem is that love is a scarce resource nowadays so when most people are displaying manners its to put up a front or a "mask" about the kind of person they are and when the person doing this thinks that no one is watching the mask falls and the true self (or at least the force driving said choice they're making) is seen. In the case of these men their choice to harm these women was driven by a force they never truly controlled despite what manners (or "mask") they decided to display.

[@metalema6]

@@tweaker1bms Interesting that you compare the truth to being a "4chan incel"

[@peregrintookish1354]

There is nothing "unwitting" about sexual assault. It also seems to me that sexual harassment has more to do with violence against women, which supersedes simply the concept of "manners". This video illustrates a common Western misconception about the causes of violence against women- that it is a "natural", "unwitting" throwback to some kind of primal instinct. It's not. It's deliberate, and using the concept of "oh, he's forgotten his manners" lifts the blame from an individual's shoulders and places it back into the nebulous idea of "society". But it's just not good manners to shield those who commit violence against women. In fact, I think it's downright rude.

[@rfarrow3483]

Yeah exactly. That's a lot of historical inaccuracy in this video.

[@chrissiek8706]

@Katallylos men get assaulted too. Happy?

[@ravenclawauror4668]

I think there's a certain arrogance to think that moral attitudes that have existed either dozens, hundreds or thousands of years can ever easily undo millions and billions of years of natural selection where acts like overt displays of sexuality, rape, promiscuity, etc. were successful because they were either advantageous, or at least not disadvantageous to the survival and/or reproduction of the people doing those things. I think we have every responsibility as aware creatures to not violate others and should aspire to a more "well-mannered" society in the sense that we don't just act immediately upon primal urges, but those forces are powerful and have been a part of humanity far longer than any sense of morality, legal system, global humanity identity, etc. The grim reality is that many of our ancestors raped, slept around, engaged in conquest and slavery and many other evils because it kept them alive and led to them having more children (aka putting more of those genes into the population). Evolution doesn't have a moral compass, it's not as simple as the "survival of the fittest" it's really like "Whatever keeps you alive long enough to produce more offspring than your genetic competitors." It's a lot easier to have more kids if you don't ask permission unfortunately. In a modern setting we should be tough on these crimes because they are not necessary to our reproduction and we should encourage a culture of empathy and respect. But 700,000 years ago was a different world and it takes acknowledgement of our genetic foundation to effectively work around it. I think the quest to suppress or eliminate these aspects of humanity in respectable society have to swim with the current of human nature and not against it. Denying the fact that it can be simultaneously human behavior and inhumane behavior means you're approaching a misrepresentation of the problem and not the problem itself. It can be both a primal urge and a deliberate crime, to deny the anthropological trends of our sexual history is to deny a well-researched aspect of our evolution. We don't have to lose the moral high ground just because we admit that certain evils naturally occur when we think we can avoid consequences. The best curbs to our animalistic viciousness has always manipulate our bad habits, natural prejudices and motivations, and guided them to a healthier expression/relief/control. Manners should be part of the conversation in sexual assault. Because quite frankly, with sexual dimorphism as near-universal as it is, most men could physically take sex from most women if they wanted. Societal pressures and the benefits of good-will that maintain when we DON'T just violate each other recklessly do most of the work of preventing mass sexual assault. History shows pretty clearly that when men have all the say they have no problem acting selfishly. We've seen the pendulum swing back and forth before, but there's no one to hold men back from doing what they want they tend to go on blood and sex conquests. Humans in general are social creatures and people behave differently when their friends are cheering them on to go for it "even if she's a little drunk," as opposed to being shamed and told it's not right. This doesn't absolve our responsibility but culture shapes our morality 100% and manners is a big part of culture. If manners are intentional actions to display respect or pleasantries for the sake of good relations, I'd say that could easily cover sexuality. After all, the video talks about how manners can be it's own evil and I think there's a conversation to be had about the "nice guy," who really isn't as opposed the beer-drinker who maybes says some racy shit but ultimately would defend his wife or daughter to the death. People are weird. I just want to clarify that it's not lost on me why it's offensive imply lack of manners is a cause or underlying factor in sexual assault, but I think this is mostly a problem with colloquial v technical language. From a social science perspective, manners absolutely shape our sexual behavior, but when you talk about casual usage of the word, it quickly makes it sound like rape is a form of rudeness, akin to not holding the door open for someone, when it is much worse. I think we can both be right, in a way, and I hope we both take the wisdom and core of each other's message. It's a tough subject that can get hard to talk about productively, but I like reading different opinions and I think this helps people empathize with each other. I do hope though, that people don't think that trying to explain why rape occurs and why it might be a "normal" part of human behavior in the sense that it occurs in all cultures throughout history is a defense or attempt to absolve any of responsibility. I'd love to post a discussion about why men and women have different sexual cultures and how natural selection saw men become more promiscuous and women more relationship oriented, but this post is long enough. I suggest to anyone to read up on the biological and evolutionary aspects of our nature, they are powerful forces but that doesn't mean we can not be better people than our natural urges!

[@goodolmeplant5809]

@@chrissiek8706 it's not JUST unmannered to rape women,it's much more than that, same goes for men. I think you missed the point of that comment and only saw "man hating feminist" or something.

[@Pam27778]

Agree. Rape is an expression of power over someone. He may as well start talking about other behaviors that stem from a need for power such as bullying, assault, torture all the way to murder and then start talking about how our manners are what is what is limiting those behaviors and that those manners may well go out of fashion in a hundred years. It really got me when he said that those rapists fell for the idea of "sexual freedom" from the 60s. Sorry, but sexual freedom and liberation is an idea aimed to take away the power of slut shaming that enables sexual predators to get away with their behavior and enable people to talk more openly about what they want and discuss consent more easily. It is not a movement that enables abusive behavior. I subscribed and then quickly unsubscribed.

[@thesuperjohn57]

can we have a history of manners in the east please?

[@-ahvilable-6654]

No

[@celt2453]

No

[@faithlesshound5621]

Yes, as soon as somebody writes it.

[@iilluminumooconfirmed1676]

We need to wait the concept of manners to arrive here first.

[@jiggeys20]

The irony of these replies is almost unbearable.

[@ionasingh3178]

I think people in caves would have had their own etiquette, traditions, expressions and even movements that was expected of them and was normal for them. That part of the video is modern-politeness-centric.

[@Sandra-lu3ri]

Because it is less than 15 minutes long lol And most of the data in English ia about Europe No wonder In the East there is more material about the local traditions, you would expect

[@mathieust-louis2893]

Anyone noticed the flash at 4:46?

[@ringozeitgeist]

Manners are important, etiquette not so much. A decline in manners can lead to rioting, a decline in etiquette has led to our no longer eating bananas with a knife and fork.

[@sharmanitascos]

Etiquette is respect and class, disagree

[@etiquetteconnoisseur6184]

I beg to differ. A decline in etiquette has encouraged people to lean back in their chairs, burp and pass gas in public, and put on lipstick at the table.

[@manueljoseruizabondano321]

It all depends on the class you belong to.

[@noel9351]

@NothingButTheTruthInChrist barbarian haha

[@ChickenMcThiccken]

manners are not burping while eating. etiquette is using the right fork when eating.

[@larryermanajrrocksit]

I don't know how I feel about this video suggesting that sexual harassment/sexual assault is the same as "forgetting one's manners"... maybe I misinterpreted, but it seems to me that that's what it said. What do people think?

[@jackson0335]

No, it was a bit off putting.

[@bubbly7137]

I think it just meant our avoidance of these acts stems from starting to use manners, however sexual harassment is never seen as “just forgetting one’s manners”.

[@amandacorrea2575]

12:55-13:06

[@nozecone]

He was exaggerating to make a point. It was rather unmannerly of him to trigger us all like that.

[@SA2004YG]

I don't think they're using "manners" in the limited context of our modern understanding of it but rather tying into the broader morality issue. Positive actions are moral and negative are immoral. Manners are positive actions

[@keeperofthecheese]

I actually like ties. They communicate a certain amount of responsibility, professionalism and civility. I don't find them oppressive in any way - they are more decorative than anything else. A nice way to break up the often dull but functional suit.

[@josexaviergallegos]

i don't find them oppresive either, just uncomfortable and useless

[@user-vg7zv5us5r]

You can be strangled with a tie by an envious coworker

[@Chase_baker_1996]

This is why I absolutely love history 🌏🌍🌎📔📕📖📗📘📙📚📓📒📃📜📄

[@ziffulmyer]

Did I ever mention how much I enjoy and learn from your videos? 7 thumbs up. No, make it 10 thumbs up.

[@baldbinch8480]

i wish they wouldve talked more about areas other than france and england and italy

[@saipandit9268]

why are most 'history of ideas' missing Asian countries??

[@saipandit9268]

Nice of you to respond so fast but this doesn't answer my question I never said that there isn't one 'history of ideas' about Asian countries I said that most should have relevant eastern ideas in them but haven't

[@JellyWaltzov]

+The School of Life Sai Pandit said "most" not "all", and they have a point. Not just Asian POV is missing, but many others. These videos are very Eurocentric... (and very good and thought provoking nonetheless)

[@captainrem]

+sai pandit Asia had/has no influence on Western manners - just look at how shocked people are when European go to China or Japanese go to France. They are separate worlds but European ideas have been spreading everywhere while Asian culture has had very little influence on the Western world.

[@essennagerry]

What about Africa? What about the Middle East? It's Euro-centered because that's just what it is guys. I don't think you understand just how much more work it would be to investigate the whole world. Just search for it specifically.

[@maguetteniang1273]

+sai pandit Africa also is missing. Egyptian civilization was at hand in this case. I guess eurocentrism is a common thing

[@danielthompson6207]

Chivalry was a code of expectations concerning how a man should compose and conduct himself in regards to mounted combat, i.e. general riding abilities, skill in using various weapons from horseback, knowledge of formation tactics, etc. There was no singular code of chivalry, nor was the concept of chivalry meant to be a guide for men's manners.

[@tepes578]

Its a pity how you seem to have ignored that manners were comparably demanding for both sexes while these days they seem to focus more on the behaviour of men. People are ok with the strict dress codes which men have but freak out about less restricting dress codes for women. Things like ShirtGate, ManSpreading, HeForShe, et cetera come to mind.

[@trudyandgeorge]

I don't know why your channel doesn't have more subscribers. It's a real gem in KZbin. Keep it up!

[@sierraroseprzybyla3333]

Um, prolly cuz he goes all rapist-apoligist toward the end.

[@celt2453]

@@sierraroseprzybyla3333 lol

[@ioanniskaminis8702]

The personal table fork most likely originated in the Eastern Roman (or Byzantine) Empire.Princess Theophano is credited with introducing the fork to Western Europe (though some sources credit another Byzantine princess with this, Maria Argyropoulaina who married the son of the Doge of Venice in 1004). Theophano’s arrival on the Rhine created quite a stir. Dressed in silks, she insisted on bathing daily, was quite literate, and most upsetting of all, she used a fork. Chronographers mention the astonishment she caused when she “used a golden double prong to bring food to her mouth” instead of using her hands as was the norm. Theophano was also criticized for her decadence, which manifested in her bathing once a day and introducing luxurious garments and jewellery into Germany.

[@98giordano1]

Concise, witty and balanced, as always. This channel is a positive force in many lives. Love it.

[@koolwond4264]

I don't think that ruso is saying that not having manners is better than having manners he is says that, damage individuals who are trying to manipulate will use manner as a show of competence, and not the other way around competence showing manners, also I am referring to competence here as understanding society, and creating system within society to optimize the well being of society with his understand of it, otherwise known as manners.

[@phoenixgrove]

Thank you for speaking on Manners, Alain. We need it in this time and age.

[@BaronLipton]

I use your videos in my lessons now and then. Cheers to you brothers and sister, here's to many years of your content.

[@katatarot597]

That's a big statement 'primitive men don't do manners'! I bet they were the manners of the day 👌

[@marksteed9022]

I agree but I can imagine the manners being a lot less refined or delicate..Like "If you're going to burp, don't do it in someones face. Turn away and let rip ". lol

[@banzy3]

I don't think manners would have existed, but there must have been a tacit code, a line you cross at your peril.

[@olliefoxx7165]

They had their own version of manners. They were different but expected and transgressions were punished.

[@The-Athenian]

YES GUYS WE ALL NOTICED THE QUICK SHOT AT 4:46 GODDAMMIT

[@AudreyVictoria]

Seriously

[@somegreybloke]

+Ricardo Camacho And it was a mistake. Not an attempt at a subliminal message, nothing with any meaning whatsoever. Just a mistake.

[@nothingtospiffy1104]

what was it I couldn't tell

[@tylerv6341]

+somegreybloke what did it say?

[@AndreyEvermore]

+Ricardo Camacho LMFAO so i wasnt the only one thought i was being brainwashed huh The clip that was inserted for that half second is actually the same one as the opening. but a man is covering the ner of manners to create the word man. plus the photo is creepy. Thought i was the only one, luckily im not alone, as i thought for sure i was being silly trying to stop at the right second to catch it

[@julinhaf89]

The proposition that sexual assault would be a lack of manners also assumes that this behavior is something natural for a man, but it could be equaly a fruit of an education. Not because there's evidences that relate the behavior to some nature condition, it cannot be manteinned (or set by) a cultural condition (like sexism). This assumption seems a little reductionist for me, trying to justify the events of assault.

[@hangukhiphop]

Nature may not necessarily be 100% behind it, but we see coerced sex all throughout the animal kingdom, today, even in our primate cousins. Of course, females of all species have evolved various strategies to filter out unwanted males' genes, but none of them have ever been foolproof. Therefore, it's probably safe to assume the human state of nature permitted rape regularly. Our legal system is the best protection available yet, and even that's not foolproof. Think of it this way: The default behavior of a child is to follow its innate impulses, and it can learn to suspend gratification through good parenting and socialization. If those influences aren't present, the child will grow into an adult which by default follows its innate impulses. For an adult male, this could mean assaulting a woman whose appearance arouses him, and he wouldn't give it a second thought because he had never been warned about the impact of such behavior.

[@tweaker1bms]

Seriously, the author definitely had a personal bone to pick there. So much for staying objective. Up until that tirade I was going to save this, but...yeah.

[@gaebitch3200]

dude of course it’s education if your brought up around that kind of behavior it will be normal not only that but if it’s never taught to your ancestors for generations it will become natural and instinct so I don’t think he’s trying to justify the history of sexual assault just giving the hard truth of people really didn’t care

[@BlueCheese747]

8:31 - loved how you contrasted those two portraits of Goya's.

[@nat6106]

Brillant case going against the surge - thanks! I really do appreciate the conclusions you recently included at the end of videos. As youtube videos are more often than not just seen once, summing up the key elements as takeaways the audience can remember is a smart move.

[@micahbenally5139]

The thing is, having decent etiquette actually helps a lot since to know how to treat people with honesty, respect and consideration (which really is what all manners boil down to anyway) not only gives you an idea on how to act given a particular situation, but it gives you a way treat those you love the way you think they deserve to be treated (and since you love them, why would you want to treat them any other way but the best?). Oh yeah, and it gives you a way to treat people you hate so they can't complain (seriously, what are they going to say? You're too nice?).

[@selimfer1]

waw. fascinating video, however, this video is talking about the " evolution of western europe's manners" only, not "the" evolution of manners as a whole

[@SenhorAlien]

Indeed, innit?

[@Jabrils]

The Northern Ireland ties also blew my mind as well. I've always had this stance, but never knew of this practice. I am very appreciative of this video. Thanks for it.

[@GianJin]

Fun thing is that I was picking my nose in the exact moment this video mentioned it. LOL I felt so rude.

[@strawberrilyfresh]

So the assumption behind men who sexually harass/assault women is that they did it bc they don't have manners? That the desire behind sexual assault is natural and intrinsic for men and can never be changed but only hidden and refrained??? So we should teach them to have better manners but not to respect women as human beings and not sexual objects??? And to the comments defending the lack of Asian philosophy/history/culture in SOL videos - I would be okay with it if they clarified it by labeling this as EUROPEAN HISTORY, but no, they discuss this(in this video and many others with exception to a handful of videos discussing most well known elements of Asian philosophy) in terms of the WORLD. Never specifying or making the disclaimer that things are different on the other side???

[@sharonmiller2224]

Inhibition is tricky. Those with what neuroscientist Jim Fallon calls warrior genes who manifest sociopathy (however mild or high-functioning to extreme psychopathy) are not going to be influenced by social pressures for manners or what religious cosmologies framed as "sinful" behavior in the same way that sensitive or inherently more empathetic people will be influenced. More rigorous levels of education and pressure may only inspire neurosis in the sensitive and still not be effective at influencing the behavior of those with more Teflon coated sensibilities. Those who actually may need to be less inhibited will pay attention, because they are the ones paying attention at all anyway. How do you influence the rest? Although that being said; education and repetition are indeed powerful and should be encouraged, especially if done in a rational manner. So this project has my esteem for that. To answer the original comment, I agree that The School of Life should address the implication that rape is generally and universally instinctive. That is a huge claim, backed up by limited and unimpressive evidence. I don't think half of humanity is struggling to not act on assumed cave-man instincts, this is ignorant and dangerous bias at work. That assumption is really very harsh toward men. Does the evidence suggest that our Paleolithic ancestors were inherently more violent in their cultures? That they had less respect for women? That is interesting, and the jury is out. Some hunter-gatherer cultures seemed to have a higher respect for women that the Modern West, and many scholars accept as fact that early agrarian cultures were matrilineal. Do we struggle now with a rape culture that is a metastization of Modern troubles, not merely a legacy of "cave-man" genes in a space age world? I think addressing psychopathy should indeed be somewhat encapsulated, not addressed in the same vein as that which applies to society as a whole. The issue is much more complicated and does deserve more discussion, to state the absurdly obvious. Thanks!

[@hudyjopps5391]

Surely it would be folly and fallacious to assume that all possessed violent sexuality back in the day (and by extension today), would it not? Manners helped to temper the behavior of people as well as elucidate on matters of morality. But like matters of morality, the degree to which it applies to guiding the behavior or one depends on person to person (different people, and by extension cultures, believe different things to be right and wrong, although not exclusive to one another such as in Reform Judaism vs Orthodox Judaism). What of criminals who've been subjected to chemical castration? Such criminals have been documented committing future rapes in prison, and studies have shown castration to only slightly impede their impulse to rape. [1] Rape, for many of them, is a psychological tool used to dominate others and feel in control (the matter of which is subjective from individual to individual). The 'lack of inhibition' or other biological explanations go about the assumption that violence and sexual violence are inherent in men and some women, fails to take into account the discrepancies above as well as the inherent empathy that some individuals possess which naturally inhibit and prevent such behaviors. Such an explanation ends up doing more harm than good by committing labels to individuals on the basis of gender generating instances of 'bad faith' (Sartre's definition in which an individual feels confined to their supposed role based on assumptions from society). [1] www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3824348/

[@mrthatguyam]

"So we should teach them to have better manners but not to respect women as human beings and not sexual objects" The goal of proper manners is for them to respect women as human beings.

[@orlando098]

I would think it's natural and normal for men to respect women as fellow human beings and not rape them for that reason. I doubt if as relatively recently as 13,000 years ago humans lacked empathy to the extent it would just be usual to act on sexual attractions by routinely forcing people to have sex. Maybe at some early evolutionary stage it might have been like that, but even in many non-human animals there's often AFAIK kinds of courtship behaviour and not just forced sex. So, I'd guess this video over-simplified a bit.

[@deckerbmx13]

Evolution through socialization

[@DanielFenandes]

I love this channel because it always impresses me with the most unexpected subject I could think of.

[@Willmolloy1]

Fantastic video, guys

[@davemarx7856]

+The School of Life all of your videos have been fantastic, but it seems there is a growing crowd who resent your noninclusion of other continents and cultures. I feel like this is a bit unfair, as you do in fact explore other cultures. just not nearly as often as your own. I think that this would only be natural, and find others lack of understanding and compassion towards the phenomenon confusing. it's like berating Stephen King because he doesn't write love stories.

[@DamienZshadow]

I started this video thinking I knew where I stood on the concept of manners. Half way through, I found I had changed my mind and found a philosophy on manners to subscribe to. By the end, I changed my mind again and didn't know what I believed about manners. Any video to illicit so much forethought and inner conflict is greatly deserving of my respect. I suspect I will many a sleepless night to you pondering my stance on the subject for days to come. Thank you for this.

[@fanaticalpotato]

+DamienZshadow I think that was the point of the video. "Manners are great. No, wait, they're bad. Meh, somewhere in the middle."

[@thiagoscout]

i found Alain's voice extremely soothing and pleaseant to her. it ads an extra touch of beauty to all of your videos. please, Alain, consider making audiobooks!!!!!

[@Reqcore]

good video but I do not agree that sexual harassment can be simply seen as "forgetting ones manners"

[@Wheyooo]

In modern days no, also sex is pure based on creation, we said somewhere the line is has to be fun and special, if we act to nature we actualy can jump on evry woman we want as a male

[@TheJohannastar]

Hennie Hådén thank you

[@aeircrown7994]

Technically it is, since mannerism are as same as taming a rabid dog, repression to a instinctual needs to the point you can be considered as a human.

[@sl57492]

If it's about "manners" not "enthusiastic consent" the person is a sexual predator. Normal people are not interested in sex acts that lack mutual enthusiastic consent. Only sexual predators are.

[@lapernice6978]

Sexual abuse is not bout manners, it is about power!

[@GordonGarvey]

Why is their a subliminal message at 4:46?

[@YE-mj1hn]

Manners

[@GordonGarvey]

4131 111YE I know. I read it.

[@CormacHolland]

+Jaqen H'ghar it says manners

[@GordonGarvey]

***** I'm not retarded. I slow mo'd it and saw it before making the comment.

[@Martenbiter]

+Jaqen H'ghar it is about manners

[@Retrogamer71]

Is there any one person more civilised and more delicate than Mr. de Botton?

[@mattgamin8729]

oh so...nobody except anglo saxons had ideas about manners and cultivating decorum. interesting

[@rowbearly6128]

Please give the timestamp for when this was said?

[@Sistadelphia]

rowb early He’d have to timestamp the whole video.

[@rowbearly6128]

@@Sistadelphia The video is specific to western audiences, but at no point was exclusivity claimed.

[@Poodleinacan]

@@rowbearly6128 Agreed. Most of the video isn't even about the English people.

[@alexander1955]

This is indeed a terrific video, and I know they're not referenced like an academic text, but I can't help wanting to say that this account of the history of manners rests to a significant extent on Norbert Elias's The Civilizing Process, although with Alain's particular spin related to more recent developments. If you're interesting in explaining this historical process, it's Elias you should read. And to explain what went on around the 1960s, the Dutch sociologist Cas Wouters uses the concept of an 'informalization process' that was a kind of internal development within the longer-term civilizing process.

[@randy9182]

Did anyone else see that random "MANN" picture at 4:46?

[@rudyliberato1844]

Manners

[@romchompa6858]

+Randy Espinoza if you saw it, why do you care if anyone else did? are you seeking acceptance by leaving a comment about something you observed? why? nobody cares.

[@randy9182]

Bro, I think you are over analyzing a simple comment. Don't bother replying, just go back and read your comment. It come's of very rude.

[@romchompa6858]

Randy Espinoza that was the intention. thank you for confirming its success as a comment. good day.

[@hailtz]

+ROM CHOMPA Congratulations for losing your time doing a stupid comment. Now we all know you are stupid. And rude. :) Good luck in life you are gonna need it.

[@SirAbraxas]

CORRECTION: On minute 06:15 about the history of the dining fork in European Courts. It was not in 1533, but 500 years before, when The introduction of the fork to Western Europe, according to theologian and cardinal Peter Damian, was by the Greek Byzantine Princess Theophano Sklereina, wife of Holy Roman Emperor Otto II, who at an Imperial banquet in 972 nonchalantly produced one, astonishing her Western guests. (Source - wiki: Fork)

[@dianalee7746]

The Venetian glass would last two minutes in my household. Just saying

[@clickprofileimage]

Your videos are the best. Everything from the calming aura in the voice of the narrator to the mastery of language and history is outstanding. You wish he goes on and on.

[@FefeTor4]

Are you saying sexual, rape, assault and murder are a matter of manners? Seriously?

[@3214lifelol]

Sexual murder?

[@FefeTor4]

John Murray Yes, I understand the point of view, but I still can't agree, specially the use of the word manner for these (as we know today) crimes. It’s a semantic problem I know, but to me manners are habits that may disturb others, but not harm them. People use them to set an hierarchy between the one in a privilege class “who have manners” and the rest of us “who don’t”. And that’s a very risky place to go, is like saying “a sexual predator or murder don’t have manners so obviously was brought up in a unprivileged home”, that’s incredibly wrong of course. And manners/habits can change with time, and something you do today could be a terrible habit in the past, and maybe could be a terrible habit in the future again. In the other hand the right of someone’s individuality, or right to come and go, right to his/hers own body, the right to live, is not something that change, it evolves, it’s not a matter of manners it is human conscious.

[@FefeTor4]

Lawrence D. You understood what I meant, I just misplaced the word assault, you got it...

[@MrThogin]

I was all in when you said No more Ties.... My old job forced us to wear ties.... I didn't mind it as much since I was never truly myself when I am at a job, but it was annoying.... I do agree ties are a form of oppression... DOWN WITH TIES!!!!

[@sharonmiller2224]

I am very uncomfortable with the conflation of bad manners and criminal harmful behavior. In my understanding, rape is not a manifestation of bad manners; if a very quantitatively extreme example, it is qualitatively different. Rape is about the will to harm, to cause pain, to dominate and control. Bad manners are about thoughtlessness or ignorance. Would you call murder an omission of manners? And if so, that changes the nature of how important manners are. It inflates and complicates the semantic cloud of meaning around the word "manners." Is minding your manners the secular version of avoiding sin? Who defines what is sinful, what is harmful, what constitutes good or bad manners, and how do we vet that authority?Interesting, but concerning word play you have here.

[@lazy_mr_fox]

You are right that Rape happens to harm, to cause pain, to dominate and control. But they also happen often just because the rapist wanted to have sex and does not care if the act is agreed on. And while rape and murder are horrible crimes they are to a degree accepted in same cultures today and in the past. And personally I would see murder as bad manners ideate.

[@lazy_mr_fox]

indeed

[@sharonmiller2224]

It is also really interesting to me to consider how we view rape as a behavior. Is it a general instinctive dark legacy of being a social mammal, is it a common underlying drive that most people with any testosterone in their make-up have to learn to suppress, or is it on a spectrum of psychopathy, however common or uncommon, an aberration of human behavior that manifests in a cluster of variables including genetic inherited susceptibility; and environmental stresses and traumas. Or is it a problem of culture, what is and what is not acceptable by the society as such? Do education and improved cultural messages address the issue, or should we consider gene therapy and other such approaches?

[@lazy_mr_fox]

Well I belief that as good as all human behavior is shaped by both nature and nurture. It is part of human nature to seek social interaction (friendship, love, sex) but it depends on both our personality and morality that was shaped by the society we life in and the individual nature we were borne with how we deal with our needs. Both education and manipulation of genes could probably solve our problems. The question is what is more ethical and a better solution.

[@sharonmiller2224]

Well said.

[@condorboss3339]

The necktie is the single most uncomfortable piece of clothing that men have ever worn. I am glad that it is disappearing.

[@Fearofthemonster]

+Condor Boss I reminds me a dog leash. Completely useless piece of cloth.

[@felixkovac701]

I think it looks pretty good though.

[@suyci]

+James Kerr You won't complain again when someone is trying to slice open your chest while wearing chainmail... Just don't let people stab you, that's all.

[@Fearofthemonster]

suyci Neck tie has the opposite effect. Somebody can grab it to use you as a punchbag.

[@suyci]

Or you are one step ahead of them and use your necktie as a lasso, and who is the punchingbag then, hm?

[@Chrisallengallery]

Everyone show good manners and give this guy a thumbs up.

[@jovialbard3001]

+HoldOnToYourHats Disliking something is not bad etiquette.

[@kingofwishfulthinking2490]

What I’ve learned is that human beings will spend centuries building something up - governments, manners, rituals - then spend centuries tearing them down, only to build them up again. It’s a cycle. Everything we believe in is just temporary, and is on its way out or up.

[@greenblaze9189]

would wish this wasn't so eurocentric

[@michaellamboi5088]

How comes? Europe’s history has likely been the most influential on western civilisations ethics and values over the past millennia.

[@Charlotte-td8qq]

This is a british channel and we are Europeans lol

[@celt2453]

Were Europeans so hard luck

[@zhonlino]

Manners are simply doing thing wisely in order to achieve respect from others... btw great animation The School of Life! Keep it up!!

[@deelite19]

great video. would have loved to see some evolution of manners outside of europe though.

[@celt2453]

Doesn't exist

[@deelite19]

@@celt2453 clearly you've never been to japan. would make any european nation look chaotic in comparison

[@celt2453]

@@deelite19 Haha I was only joking. True that Japanese are very respectful

[@ultraboy99x]

So insightful,thank you for the video! here's a suggestion for another history of ideas: "History of ideas: Goals/Dreams/Achievements"

[@Acquavallo]

Very interesting, but what about the rest of the world, not Europe. Like Asia, Africa, the middle east, etc???

[@tepes578]

+Acquavallo Maybe TheSchoolOfLife does not think to be proficient enough to talk about these Cultures. 15min is a decent length for a short overview on "European Culture"

[@mh1ultramarine]

+Acquavallo I suppose cave men could count Africa, up until we stopped being cave men at least

[@Sikawi]

Emm the last time I checked Middle East is in Asian

[@Sikawi]

But yeah we want to know the rest of the world, Europe Africa and Asian they are not the same

[@DUDINCHI]

As much as this channel is good, but its very eurocentric

[@yuugiho]

refraining from sexually harassing women isnt manners, and most definitely isnt a return to victorian ethics! Its not playing sexual power games and degrading women! Sexual harassment is seen as anachronistic because the inequality that lead to sexual remarks in the work place is decades behind us, and just as misogynistic as treating women with kid gloves as they did in victorian times.

[@Loathomar]

+yuugiho Of course refraining from sexually harassing women is manners, as is everything else that is or is not social acceptable. Manners are not inherently good or bad and they are not something that "peeked in the Victorian age". Some people like the manners of the Victorian age and think they are more desirable, but that is subjective. But there a clear double standard of the treatment of men and women in western manners. Physical or verbally attacking a women is always seen as worse then doing the same thing to men.

[@annemaveera5112]

I always love your videos and it's amazing how 4-5 minutes video could change my world (in a good way)! Anyway, I'd like to see history of manner from eastern world. Hopefully you think about this.

[@Roshede]

Why would anybody even dislike this? this is a product I'm sure most of us would pay for and we're getting it free and I'm pretty sure they don't even watch it because what is there to dislike?

[@CoolFrog9]

everyone complaining about the rest of the countries not being mentioned, do research, ungrateful lazy whining children. Not everything is going to be handed to you on a silver platter, so annoying honestly. This was a well done video I really enjoyed it :)

[@vivekshah7769]

CoolFrog9 what the hell are you talking about? Of course those of us who are non-European our familiar with the manners of our respective cultures. The problem is that a video titled "the history of ideas: manners," only mentions European manners. What is the implication? That manners only developed in Europe and were then diffused throughout the world via The "white man's burden?" Honestly, anytime this channel does a video on another culture, it's usually the far east - as if it were the only culture somewhat comparable to Europe.

[@maxwright3797]

CoolFrog9 You say "do research", but is that not exactly what people are doing by watching this? We're saying that this video is a bad research tool, because while presenting itself as a short summary of the history of manners, it treats the contributions of all continents where white people don't live as minuscule, not even worthy of a footnote. Can you really call any video that leaves out so many important parts of its own subject matter good?

[@francoislamarre4706]

It's so nice to finally hear a narrator with a correct pronunciation for French names!

[@DakuHonoo]

+Francois Lamarre i don't know, as a person who doesn't speak any romance language and is not a native english speaker, i always find it annoying, except for germanic languages of which i speak none as well

[@BlueCheese747]

De Tocqueville wouldn't be impressed by Mark Zuckerberg's jeans

[@TheyCallMeNewb]

Well this was terrific. What a wonderfully laconic explication of the ebb and flood of the etiquette found {specifically} in our western history. Thank you

[@smol_chilli_pepper]

This is so well made

[@brassen]

+Shelobnagig I suggest J.M. Blaut's "The Colonizer's Model of the World", it gives us a very interesting perspective on "what's wrong with eurocentrism".

[@DoReMi123acb]

+Djamar Jr thanks. being looking for some good reading material and you just helped me out.

[@LimabeanStudios]

I get like why these manners help but like, does having my elbows on the table really fuck up someones day that much. Also not saying bless you, which comes from the plague and has zero relevancy to today's society, is seen as rude, somehow.

[@lisaperez8276]

This video is amazing and so relevant and so well done. Small problem: equating rape and sexual assault with a lack of manners is not only cringeworthy but problematic and it completely sidesteps the questions of criminality and intent as well as physical and spiritual violation. Could say the same for the treatment of race relations and economic opportunity.

[@Mbd3Bal7dod]

western history of manners

[@zacharyschabel7822]

From a western KZbin channel. Surprised?

[@badrm3272]

Exactly what I thought of

[@mh1ultramarine]

+‫سلمان الراجحي‬‎ Have you thought of doing your own, I'm sure if you did it well school of life would share it

[@peanutgallery7753]

+‫سلمان الراجحي‬‎ They never really developed anywhere else

[@mh1ultramarine]

Buck Shot 15mins is a bit short for world history.

[@alluvermin]

Subscribed! These are so informative and easy on the ears.

[@StrayCatMatt]

So whats with the subliminal millisecond shot of "MANN" at @4:45?

[@Kenny2100vn]

why though lol

[@banenareef1899]

5:49 "Use their fingers very tenderly" 😂😂😂

[@olliefoxx7165]

That's one way to teach an old dog new tricks. Especially in "delicate" areas.

[@graemeroberts2935]

Great advice and delightful animation, may I remark?

[@thomasdobson317]

That was so enlightening - you really reconciled both perspectives of manners. Well done!

[@CountBifford]

What's stuff about manners being an invention of civilization? Even primates display a form of manners, like waiting your turn as the alpha male distributes shares of the latest catch. All social mammals have manners.

[@simeon24]

+CountBifford Perhaps manners are more about considering the sensitivities of peers as opposed to those in power.

[@Kitsuneguma]

4:40 MANN!!!! we don't do know what we did!

[@aymanraouf1820]

2:05 You've completely dismissed the caliphates, the east asian and south asian history. If for anything, the ancient Greek and Roman manners were translated and resurfaced by the translation works of the Abbasids. From the video, seems not all the manners were translated

[@aymanraouf1820]

+The School of Life I'm an avid follower of your channel, and I hope you only accept it as a critique for future ideas on videos. I'm not a descendant of any empire, but I just appreciate a certain history that is lost and forgone. Especially in the divided times that we live in now, it would be a great contribution from your end to shed light and build bridges on some of the empires of the Orient and their thinkers and philosophers e.g. Avveroes, Ibn Sina, Sankha, Plotinus etc.

[@MillionaireDubMind]

+Aym Rao Seconded.

[@fmlAllthetime]

This channel is an aristocrat idolizing, feel good, pretty eurocentric channel. They're great at what they do, don't get me wrong, but that *is* what they are.

[@MillionaireDubMind]

+fmlAllthetime It's fine.

[@ODST316]

+The School of Life Don't be sorry. You should be proud of your European history. Do not let this cultural marxist have a jab at you.

[@danielwood2865]

Interesting, yet no mention of Norbert Elias or his analysis... For those interested in unpacking how changes in manners, shame and self-restraint are tied to the changes and development of the modern state, then Elias is worth a read.

[@Rockhug]

+Woodrick We should give some love and credit to Elias. His work is incredible. I was asking myself, why nobody did mention him.

[@EsyaFL]

Please don't compare picking ones nose to sexual assault. There are similarities and I see your point, but doing so is rather insensitive and trivialises the suffering of a lot of people. Sexual assault is a form of violence, picking one's nose is not, and a rapist is not simply bad mannered. If you are displeased with someone picking their nose, you can go to another room and they can continue. But if someone wants to harass you sexually, whether physically or verbally, you are the object of this action, it can't continue without you, so there is always going to be a victim.

[@MostlyLoveOfMusic]

In what way is "not touching strangers" progress exactly? The human body is a thing of beauty and intrigue yet we've been taught to fear it and supress our curiosity. Grossly misguided and regrettable I would suggest

[@MADHAUSMARKALLAN]

Well there’s the slaves of course, America has never really been a democracy really. Nice thought though.

[@Poodleinacan]

At least, they weren't getting castrated like with the muslims.

[@hermionefv]

These life lessons should be seen on TV or taught in schools. Greatly made and important information.

[@atikahrockslikecrazy]

It is really strange that a video who wants to dissect "manners" or refined traditions in history would only use Eurocentric examples, as though civilised communities only existed in one part of the world. A little bit more research would be great.

[@kawallabair3216]

+kikirockslikecrazy Western canon wins, because it is the origin of the current most powerful world empires. Your comment would have made about as much sense as a Roman asking why Germanic cultures haven't been used in the definition of manners, when the prolific empire at the time was Rome.

[@kawallabair3216]

+KawallaBair In addition, this video is in English, which naturally has western bias. I'm sure if you view a Chinese video, in Chinese on the same subject. You will find an Eastern bias.

[@atikahrockslikecrazy]

KawallaBair This is about history. Sure, you can cherrypick history as most Western communities do because they like to think they're the centre of the universe but don't get mad when people point out your bias. Also, this is the history of manners. You're saying you can't find any historical facts about manners from other parts of the world? I call that lazy research. Somehow, they missed out the part where Europeans were dying because they keep getting sick from lack of waste management. But I guess that doesn't fit with the "civilised" narrative.

[@kawallabair3216]

kikirockslikecrazy The internet is global, but you're currently in the western part of it. Western history has bias because the western canon dominates English and American education. People teach what is familiar and though I agree that other information could be provided from other sources, people have specialisations in history. Those from the West tend to focus on European history and philosophy based on the works of their culture. Likewise, Chinese scholars tend to focus on Eastern scholars and Eastern canon. I'd be surprised if you found people complaining about an Eastern centric video produced in Chinese. Complaining about ideological diversity, has throughout history, been a very Western centric concept. You have the Western canon to thank for that. Go to many other countries and you'll find their history is pushed just as strongly as the Europeans and Americans.

[@alg11297]

Actually chivalry was a court game invented by nobles to ward off boredom. It took the form of how much a man would suffer to earn his lady's affection. This became known as courtesy to our idea of what politeness might be.

[@forreal7403]

Apparently the Arab, Persian, African, Turkish, Russian, Indian, Chinese, and Japanese societies and kingdoms had nothing to do with the history of manners. If you meant history of European and western manners, good video

[@quinndiesel1977]

Ties are often required dress of physicians. I stopped wearing one 6 years ago because they are filthy. They are rarely washed, and carry all sorts of bacteria. I still wear them for formal occasions outside of the hospital.

[@barrygormley3986]

13 BC: you make an awful lot of claims considering this is a culture that existed before written language. We can't know what their customs were beyond what the artefacts they left behind (I.e. The skulls).

[@thefaceofawsomeness491]

+Barry Gormley There are the cave paintings to consider.

[@barrygormley3986]

+Theface ofawsomeness And that is not enough to draw any definite inferences about their customs. A future civilisation could end up with a very distorted view of our civilisation, if all they had to go on was a few surviving works of art. Just imagined what they'd think if Japanese hentai was all that remained.

[@creativesuit1930]

+Barry Gormley I'm fairly certain that if human bones with human teeth marks were found then it would be safe to assume human used to eat other humans. Not to mention these same bones would appear butchered. A little carbon dating and you have an approximate time. It's science...

[@barrygormley3986]

+Sean Mauws And if that were the only claim in this video, you'd have an excellent point.

[@creativesuit1930]

What exactly are you saying didn't happen?

[@TheSharonHarman]

7:55 Is that you, John Travolta??

[@HMKfilms360]

i use my hands to eat

[@fanaticalpotato]

+HMKfilms360 You savage!

[@HMKfilms360]

***** :)

[@rudyliberato1844]

you sir, are off the scales

[@brurcemuhammadmecca7154]

+HMKfilms360 In some countries eating with hand is considered as proper to enjoy the food more. In my country (indonesia) for example

[@HMKfilms360]

Brurce Muhammad Mecca im from saudi arabia makkah, i know hahah

[@prodipto]

can i also argue that manners are used primarily not to be considerate towards others but as a form of self aggrandisement ? showing that i am better than you who dont know the "proper" way to do something