History of WWI Primer 026: Austro-Hungarian Roth-Krnka M.7 Pistol Documentary

[@tfbtv]

Fantastic episode! Best gun channel on YouTu... Err, uh... Nicely done.

[@mattdickson2]

hahaha

[@Candrsenal]

OK but which one is you?

[@zman1508]

Im not so sure he hasn't done any top 10 or 5 lists yet even though the hobos keep asking

[@SlavicCelery]

Have you thought about run and Gun's with another gun channel?

[@Candrsenal]

Timothy Soen We're sorta isolated on the east coast. Not an easy trip to make when we're slammed with production.

[@ForgottenWeapons]

Great video! My only quibble would be about the clips. I have 3 clips for mine, and have found them to be the best type of stripper clip I've ever used, especially considering it holds 10 rounds instead of 5 or 8. Perhaps you had a clip that isn't in good condition? I found that with a good swift push, all ten rounds load nice and smoothly almost every time, even when reloading on the clock.

[@Candrsenal]

I probably should have specified that they really are better than most others by far. Mae just doesn't seem to care for them over all. You'll have to put this on display properly for us!

[@ForgottenWeapons]

I ran a steel match with my 1907 last weekend, and will be posting the video in a few weeks. :)

[@Candrsenal]

Forgotten Weapons Sweet

[@mooslionheart]

As Mae’s second it is hereby declared that “the gauntlet has been thrown” by Ian and demand satisfaction! A duel of loading - not firing per KZbin regulations - Roth Krnka M7s “space pistols” at dawn on Tatooine😀

[@86gwrhino]

I recently took a trip to the Heeresgeschichtliches (Austrian Military Museum) in Vienna, where they have several of these on display. None of the description tags said Roth-Steyr, but Roth-krnka, suggesting the Austrians refer to it as such. Side note, the museum also had an original girandoni air rifle tucked in a corner that I geeked out over.

[@MayheM_72]

In all the newer episodes, I miss Mae's commentary during the shooting stage. I still love her satisfied smile once the gun is empty.

[@dobypilgrim6160]

Some people may complain about the length of this video - but I congratulate you all for this episode. This has to be the definitive video on the Roth 1907 on KZbin. Congratulations once again on it.

[@Candrsenal]

Thanks! We just sorta write out the facts we think we can convey and are worth depicting (some nuance is abandoned or coalesced) and just film it until it's all said. Some longer, some shorter.

[@richardhsiung7007]

your light-box product shots, animations and drawings are great.

[@mo45327]

You sir have perfectly summed up Austro-Hungarian Empire in two sentences :)

[@nirfz]

I would say not only the AH Empire because in some cases there is no difference to today ;-)

[@SunnyAznable]

Always love these early European automatics, there's a charm to the clunky odd appearance of them- some like the Mars even manage to go so far down that road they genuinely look good. Amazing video as always. I've been watching these for a very long time as I type a lab report and my night has flown by!

[@Candrsenal]

You're going to be sad when you catch up. We're slow :(

[@SunnyAznable]

Not at all, I have a plan! Fanfiction. 'Thanks to a mysterious inheritance, today we shall review... the Paris Gun!' I mean if it's fiction I might as well shoot for the moon.

[@jmarriottc]

Supremely fascinating, honestly people would think 1hr on a WW1 pistol development would seem like a lot. It was awesome, great job

[@Candrsenal]

Thanks!

[@fredklein724]

Thanks for presenting this pistol. This was my grandfather's side arm in WW1, when he was an artillery man in the Balkans. His major complaint was the anemic cartridge, and it's lack of stopping power when the Serbians charged their guns!

[@aries_9130]

Oh boy, almost one hour of glorious, GLORIOUS weird old gun stuff! :D Joking aside, great episode, as usual :)

[@Candrsenal]

Thanks!

[@paullytle246]

vich is pronounced veach

[@mcfontaine]

So much brilliant research, well done guys. I love the episodes the longer they get.

[@Candrsenal]

Glad to do it!

[@raymondgill9796]

An hour just flew by in well presented and researched education/entertainment. Thank You

[@Candrsenal]

Thank you!

[@ThisSiteisCrap]

I absolutely love this channel and I'm reeeaaaaallly jealous of your collections. Thank you so much for putting so much effort into this channel. I for one really appreciate it

[@Candrsenal]

Thanks!

[@michaelholmes3724]

Just bought a Roth-Krnka made in 1909. Unit marked for the 8th Dragoon Regiment. I watched this video awhile ago, but had to go back and rewatch it after picking mine up. Awesome pistol. Now time to do the impossible... track down ammo and a stripper clip.

[@williamprince1114]

Well done as always. Your research and scholarship is great but your delivery makes it so understandable and relatable.

[@Candrsenal]

Thank you!

[@ZerokillerOppel1]

And funny...don't know if even Othias knows it himself but a great comedian has been lost to him....I hear so many one liners come by...btw.. Mae's funny as hell too...and...sorry Othias...more pleasing to the eye imo.

[@caseyreavis]

Othais hit the nail on the head as far as the size of that... thing. i'd only seen pictures of it and I never realized it was bigger than a 1911 which is insane.

[@Candrsenal]

Right?!

[@PositionLight]

You forgot that another reason for stripper clip pistols is that for the mounted soldier this was their primary weapon (I think Ian on forgotten weapons said each trooper was issued with two pistols). Loading a single feed pistol mag is a major pain in the ass. You will always be able to load faster and more efficiently in the long run with a stripper clip system. Today, pistols are purely backup weapons so nobody ever considers needing to shoot one in combat all day. Watch Ian's video because his Styer pistols load smoothly from the clip every time.

[@Candrsenal]

I'm not sure I've seen Austro-Hungarian cavalry without a carbine of some sort in addition to the pistol. I'd have to do some source checking to back that. To my understanding the slow loading was acceptable precisely because it was a secondary weapon.

[@markotesla2016]

The droid you were looking for is Vasilije Teodorovic (Vasa is short for Vasilije).

[@Candrsenal]

Thanks

[@taterporkchop]

Mae! Nice haircut! You too Othais! I miss my hair........but never a C&Rsenal episode.

[@robertneal4244]

There may be a later and more comprehensive comment from me...but just now as I was eating a tortilla chip and watching this. Your line about the "lazy and annoying empire" made me laugh and then clean up bits of semi-chewed tortilla chip from my screen and keyboard.

[@BikerJim74]

Great job. My last name is Roth, had no idea this gun even existed until today.

[@Candrsenal]

tsk tsk tsk

[@BikerJim74]

ikr?

[@ultramagnus4374]

The David Lee Roth-Krnka

[@raymondkisner9240]

🐈

[@kizmetmars]

Looks like you'd use it in a pinball machine. You know, to "shoot" the ball.

[@trenchfighter8778]

omg it does

[@Candrsenal]

I can see it

[@canicheenrage]

I was thinking about the pistol version of the soldering removal synringes.

[@chinesesparrows]

Shoot the ball like a mannlicher?

[@backblaise1255]

I am watching again from the start of Primer, living what I have not already; and adding comments to bulk up for the algorithm.

[@nordicnostalgia8106]

I had to pause and repeat when he mentioned kroners. That's neat. They too used kroners. In name only, probably. The Scandinavian kroners have more in common, such as currency strength.

[@Candrsenal]

Yeah Euro's weren't ready until at least 1930

[@tmikesecrist3]

the striper clip seems to work better in a rifle then in a pistol?

[@Candrsenal]

Yup

[@milgeekmedia]

Could it be because it's usually 5 longer rounds in a rifle clip rather than 10 very short rounds in this pistol. I'm sure there are some physics/trigonometry at work here that explains the issue.

[@Taurevanime]

It is mentioned that the grips on the gun cause a little callous forming after a day of shooting. But as a cavalry pistol, and one from the early 20th century. It very well may have been intended to be used with a gloved hand. That may be a little more comfortable. But since this gun is a loan piece, there isn't really a way to go back and see if. Either way great episode, I learned a lot. Thank you.

[@robertl6196]

Nice episode guys. One of my favorite pistols in its oddball glory. The A-H Empire was fertile grounds for some unorthodox engineering.

[@Candrsenal]

I love AH everything

[@worldtraveler930]

@@Candrsenal You and me both!!! 🤠👍

[@AzureRoseMarshal]

@@worldtraveler930this can be taken another way…

[@Paragoth]

God damn, Othias. I may have just finished my bachelor's in history, and continued on from that point working a job that does not concern my favorite subject, but your presentation and reminders to FACT CHECK make me so giddy. My plan has always been to continue my education, in that regard, but having your example, among others, really help continue my drive. Cheers, man!

[@Paragoth]

Also, lazy, annoying empire? Sounds about right! Up there with the Holy Roman Empire, known because it was not holy, nor Roman, nor an empire. I salute thee.

[@Candrsenal]

Oh no, we meant pistols.

[@Paragoth]

Now I want to hunt down a C-96 just to see the difference.

[@worldtraveler930]

I've always enjoyed the architecture of this particular model so much I would love to see this brought back as a double stack 45 ACP!!! 🤠👍

[@Lomi311]

Love getting to play with odd guns like this in Tannenberg.

[@GR46404]

Thank you very much for this video, which is a fascinating trove of information that I had never heard before about the Roth 1907 and the history of Austro-Hungarian pistols. It is a a delight to find videos that so match my interest in both the history, mechanical design, and shootability of pistols. I would also like to say two things I have have always thought about the Roth 1907: 1) The trigger mechanism is a precursor of the Glock's, in that it relies on a long springy pull for safety, and dispenses with a manual safety. 2) As far as I can tell, the tubular housing that encloses the barrel assembly is MACHINED FROM SOLID, even though it is the thickness of sheet metal. I could be wrong about this,, because it would be fantastically laborious to make if I am right.

[@Candrsenal]

I too believe it is machined

[@worldtraveler930]

I had an opportunity to buy one back in the eighties at a gun show for an excellent price but stepped away from it because of its lack of ammo in that day and age!!! 🤠👍

[@shawnbane585]

Saw you guys on Indy's great war page. Always liked the old guns and how they work.

[@Candrsenal]

Glad you're enjoying it!

[@alexruddock9596]

Othias, it is the hair on your face that counts! Another excellent video. Keep up the good work.

[@Candrsenal]

Thanks! I keep extra food in it.

[@twistedsaltypretzel7727]

Gotta love the style of late 19th century autos. Very cool!

[@CyLonFPV]

Almost a hour long vid from C&R! what a treat! What a interesting way to approach a auto loading pistol. Its really kool that you give us the opportunities to enjoy and get educated on some of these unique weapons. Like you I always thought this was just another small European pistol something like a .32. boy was I wrong! That thing is a beast! How long did it take you to get it back together? I sure wouldn't want to be a cavalryman trying to do a fast reload on that thing while at full gallop, reigns and pistol in one hand, stripper in the other, trying to keep the horse going where you want while forcing that clip would be a real challenge. Mae's hair looks great! :)

[@Candrsenal]

Thanks! Actually assembly was quite easy. The gun is very simple and wonderfully pain free to use.

[@nirfz]

Well there's a video from forgotton weapons where they say that cavalry men were equiped with 1 pistol on their hip and 2 on the front of the saddle (i hope i remembered that right) So no reload but reholstering and getting the next one.

[@CyLonFPV]

Thanks for the reply nirfz, I forgot that cavalry soldiers usually had more than one weapon, probably a carbine, couple of pistols and a saber.

[@nirfz]

You're welcome!

[@morriganmhor5078]

If you trained with Colt SAA, you would be OK.

[@feldweible]

Yay! I was hoping that you'd get to this one. I have an original that was carried by a relative in the Austrian Army in WWI.

[@Candrsenal]

Lucky

[@evanulven8249]

That is an outright Star Wars looking pistol. I love it.

[@MRbreakthroughx]

Yeah more austro-hungary!

[@Candrsenal]

So weird

[@MRbreakthroughx]

+C&Rsenal okaaayy

[@soylentgreen7074]

I know this channels just getting started and we have lots of WWI weapons and history left to learn(which is awesome) but , do you guys thinks years down the road you'll cover WWII? And once "The Great War" channel is done will he move on to WWII also? No rush love the videos, not as much out there for WWI. So many crazy things happened no ones knows about. Keep up the great work.

[@Candrsenal]

Sure, once we have this wrapped up.

[@mynameismin3]

Thanks for another great episode

[@Justice-ian]

Love the video (all of them, really), but strongly disagree with your assertion that the cartridge is "underpowered" or disproportionate to the locked-breech action. 8x19 (115@1090) is close on the heels of the classic 9mm ball load (115@1150) despite: -1mm less diameter (smaller powder chamber) -Less outward taper toward the base (further reduction in powder chamber) -Same-weight (despite being a full millimeter smaller in diameter) bullet - therefore longer in a similar COAL; therefore, significant further reduction in powder chamber. -None of the above derived from some proprietary, controlled-burn unobtainium 2015 powder from Underwood or Buffalo Bore, but first-gen smokeless! All of this adds up to equal (or likely greater) pressure to 9mm Para, i.e. at least twice that of the contemporary .45 ACP - hardly a creampuff.

[@BattleManiac7]

This gun looks so cool! I think its one of the nicer looking guns featured on the show so far.

[@Candrsenal]

Apparently its appearance is divisive

[@haboob308]

Thanks for another great video, Othais and crew! I am with Othais, it reminds me of NERF gun.

[@burkefj]

Great videos, I've found that using the manual slide lock before trying to use the stripper clip makes it much easier to use and manipulate. In fact with the manual slide lock you can load the magazine directly without using a stripper clip, I do the same thing with the steyr-hahn using the slide lock. Also, I find it interesting that nearly 100 years before the glock, here is a striker fired austrian pistol....

[@Candrsenal]

Definitely easier

[@cariboupetepeterson3711]

Excellent series! Well done!

[@Candrsenal]

Thanks!

[@InfBerBat143]

9x19 para is not deadly, i carry the war proven .32 ACP! Thats the minimum of manstoppower.

[@Lomi311]

I wonder if Mae ever got to try a different stripper clip with a 1907. Ian’s on Forgotten weapons were pretty slick.

[@chriscoop81]

Looks like something Marvin the Martian would have used

[@Lomi311]

The 2 stage trigger in a pistol is just wild.

[@cannonlove2]

othias love the vid man excellent narration

[@Candrsenal]

Thanks!

[@epone3488]

I don't understand all the hate for the striper clip - its sloid tech and a tiny tiny amount of training can make you very clean with "stripping the clip". there is simply a manual of arms to process through and become familiar with. Id love to have seen the cavalrymen of the AH empire with these I bet they would have just smashed out the reloads.

[@Matt_The_Hugenot]

Getting better and better.

[@Candrsenal]

Thanks

[@Jamz-]

Video was interesting. Thanks C&Rsenal keep up the great work!

[@Candrsenal]

Thanks for watching!

[@Jamz-]

+C&Rsenal Always Welcome! 😃

[@mattabesta]

I'm not sure if this a terrible suggestion or not but I'd like to see you guys do the bit where May shoots the gun a bit more in the open, wider angles, have Othais there and talk about the gun with it there outside. I don't know maybe it's too hard.

[@Candrsenal]

I'm afraid keeping the shooting and history separate have been really helpful in splitting up the labor on the episodes. More angles we can always work on. We're in the middle of re-standardizing rifle shooting shots and then can go back and review both them and pistols for better stuff.

[@HuizeFRoos]

I second the suggestion on wider angles. Mae is shooting because of size comparison and especially rifles would show this better at a wider angle. It would also show the recoil better. ( Also keep up the good work! love the show.)

[@mattabesta]

Thanks for the reply :D. Tottally makes sense with the shooting and history, I mean this channel might not have the largest number of videos on youtube but it's probably some of the thickest and interesting material on yt.

[@Xeno426]

The light grey of those metric values on the ammunition graph are still rather difficult to make out against the white background. Perhaps a dark grey would be better. Still, good episode. And a LOT longer than normal. Quite surprising, really. :)

[@Candrsenal]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@pilgrimm23]

Thanks; I own thos pistol. Othas you are the first I have seen strip it RIGHT. Did you know that the stipper clips are more rare even then the gun? I have looked for a clip for 20+ years with no sucess. WELL done episole with excellent information. you hit it out of the park. AGAIN

[@Candrsenal]

THANKS!

[@Jesses001]

It really did not pay to be a firearm designer in Europe during that time that is for sure.

[@Candrsenal]

I dunno the rock stars did all right

[@Jesses001]

Yes but they sure worked for it, ha.

[@thurin84]

excellent as always! love this bizaro guns!

[@Haydn8oR]

I know this videos old, but I saw "499 comments" and figured I'd unofficially be the 500th. Interesting video, hope to see more Austrian weapon videos, expecially after binging a Mauser playlist and combining it with their German playlist for my own enjoyment

[@maxheadspace2975]

Excellent priduction! If you would PLEASE include a list of all related patents in the description of each epesode it would be very much appreciated. Thanks.

[@mo45327]

That would be awesome!

[@Candrsenal]

Sure, I could start keeping a list and some espace links. I'll build it into the planning/writing phase.

[@mo45327]

C&Rsenal Thank you!

[@umjackd]

Hey Othais, just a little tip for Balkan Slavic names. I don't have the character on my keyboard, but the c at the end of the name is pronounced like a ch. Great episode! Thanks!

[@Candrsenal]

Thanks

[@mo45327]

The name Vasa Teodorovic (if that's what you were saying) sounds very Serbian/Montenegrin.

[@Candrsenal]

It very much does.

[@mo45327]

I'm only guessing here, but I don't think he was from Serbia but rather a Serb from Vojvodina region which was part of the Austro-Hungarian empire. If I understood correctly, his first patents are from Austria-Hungary so that would support my assumption. Also, there weren't a lot of gun designers or even engineers in Serbia at the time and we would definitely have some information on him if he was living and/or working in Serbia. Also Teodorović is the surname of one of the oldest families in Vojvodina (today part of Serbia). But still, it's just a guess. I'll try to find more info in the archives here in Vojvodina.

[@Bojan_Kavedzic]

I posted above what is known, his full name was Vasilije, his father was Milan and there was possibly third Teodorovic working in same business, but only thing known is first letter of his name (A). Vasa died 1927 or 29, and lived in Vienna, working at Stery and Roth companies. His father worked for Gasser, and A. Teodorovic worked for Steyr.

[@mo45327]

Bojan Kavedzic Thank you, where did you get this info?

[@Bojan_Kavedzic]

Long time ago, from a local Forum, I think info originated from Branko Bogdanovic.

[@spigotsandcogs]

Welp, you did it. You found a pistol more awkward looking than the Bodeo.

[@evandaire1449]

And also larger than the reichsrevolver at the same time too. That's quite a feat.

[@killersauresrex]

You could dig deeper for the Kolibri pistol

[@jackandersen1262]

spigotsandcogs you sure you’re not forgetting the Frommer 1901?

[@beargillium2369]

Maybe I watch too much forgotten weapons... Looks totally normal to me 🤠

[@ZerokillerOppel1]

@@beargillium2369 🤣🤣Same here...there is a reason why some weapons are forgotten...but they are so interesting to watch....this time frame especially has my deepest interest: say roughly the 1880's - 1920's...so many evolutions and inventions whether they be dreadnoughts, (naval) artillery, bolt action rifles, revolvers, automatic pistols/rifles,etc etc.. watch Drachinifel here on YT if you're interested in naval stuff.

[@mencken8]

Love the animation.

[@strangefolkprimary4837]

Picked up my Steyr Hahn, the thing barely works. But man, can't help but love these old Austro-Hungarian designs.

[@Candrsenal]

What did you do?

[@gunslinger2172]

This gun reminds me of the Ruger Mk1 or MK2 22 LR auto loader in a strnge way , especially with that bolt!

[@WildBillCox13]

Seven in the heart . . . . Mae . . . . I'd be smiling, too.

[@DennisBozic]

Another great episode in your outstandig series. Will there also be an episode on the Frommer Stop in the near future?

[@Candrsenal]

Hopefully

[@DennisBozic]

OK 👍

[@MRbreakthroughx]

Interesting episode!

[@Speetqq]

when i will get back budapest i will go for the hungarian military museum i think they have more source of these topics

[@loranzobaker7293]

That does make me wonder what cartridge would be better suited for the action. I get they’re a piece of history and could be somewhat rare. But i would love to see a modified one with a cartridge that would be the best viable option for the gun. That would use it for it’s best potential.

[@bunk95]

To do what?

[@Procket12]

There was a stripper clip fed pistol that actually had a guide piece on the back of the clip that you could push down on to make loading it easier but I forgot what it was.

[@Candrsenal]

what?

[@Hsutheguard]

Yeah! New episode

[@Candrsenal]

How did it go?

[@Hsutheguard]

C&Rsenal finger lickin good

[@monkeyabattoir8501]

the wheeler gunsmith screwdriver set is the best for the $$$$. I think i paid $14 for mine.

[@JenniferinIllinois]

Do I see some CZs in the future? 😉

[@Candrsenal]

k

[@ScottRuggels]

like the C-96, I have always wanted one of these, because I love heavy, labor intensive, machining. Unlike the C-96, I have never seen one of these "in the wild", just in museums, or already "not for sale" in someone's collection. Thank you for the detail on the internals.

[@Candrsenal]

You'll find it eventually!

[@robertbenson136]

try gunbroker.com

[@TheWozWizard]

Roth Stery Model 1907 in the movies: "Stolen Holiday" 1937 with Claude Rains, Kay Francis, and Ian Hunter. Supposedly, Claude Rains uses a Roth Stery M1907 to kill himself at time hack 1:17:27.

[@curiobill]

Another excellent video on an amazing weapon!!! Many thanks!!! Are there any current reproductions of the stripper clips?

[@Candrsenal]

Not that I know of

[@XLesky]

Great work again guys

[@Candrsenal]

THANKS

[@TechNWRO]

I was not expecting that much muzzle flip with what appears to be a muzzle heavy design. What is the bullet weight and velocity of that cartridge?

[@Candrsenal]

same load as the data graph

[@jackalvzz]

Awesome video, keep up the good work!!!!!!!!

[@Candrsenal]

Thanks!

[@adminmod7837]

Great episode,as always!Any chance to see one regarding Roth-Sauer?

[@Candrsenal]

We left room if we can find one

[@adminmod7837]

Hopefully you find one, ``the thing `` is a work of art.

[@colnagocowboy]

i think, ive seen all of these now. not, on time and, not in order but i seen them all

[@Candrsenal]

Dang. How as the random quality?

[@colnagocowboy]

C&Rsenal. quality is fine but as ive said elsewhere im sort of lost in all these 32's an finial overall summary would be nice

[@colnagocowboy]

C&Rsenal no complaints with quality. just a little lustand envy.

[@johnaffleck6572]

I was kind of surprised when she actually shot it; I thought maybe it was an elaborate April Fool;s joke.

[@BATMAN777888]

Beautiful haircut Mae.

[@the_major]

I really liked that you compared the Roth-krnka price to those of other guns at the time. What a nice feature! If it's not too much to ask, could you do this for other pistols and firearms going forward (assuming it was sold)? I like having a cost comparison. If you could even include a dollar (and pounds for the british viewers) conversion, that would be fantastic! Again, a wonderful video!

[@Candrsenal]

It depends on if I have the data handy. Our sources are wide and varied and rarely include the same sorts of info.

[@the_major]

I understand. Thanks for the great series!

[@nicholasford4820]

Great video! I'm curious what you were using for ammo, and if you had issues getting the gun to function. The Fiocchi stuff I've tried in mine won't cycle the action at all.

[@Candrsenal]

Fiocchi was great for us!

[@worldtraveler930]

I have always found Fiocchi I to be Utter Trash and a Total Waste of money, Not Once have I Ever had success from that ammo brand!!! 🤠👍

[@gunslinger2172]

Cute hair cut Mae!

[@vaclavholek4497]

Karel Krnka is an example of what we call, "zlaté české ruce" - golden Czech hands 😉

[@piatpotatopeon8305]

In a video game, a random chance for your gun to fire a double shot would a bonus. I think Borderlands already has some guns like that, actually. And we all know how realistic that game franchise is.

[@engellenkatu]

another great episode. love these old guns. hans solo here's a pistol for you

[@stevenhoman2253]

Thanks for pronouncing Budapest correctly.

[@rektalmort]

As usual... Three thumbs up!

[@Candrsenal]

Thanks!

[@christhesmith]

How long did that white suburban last?

[@wangl601]

Finally! A nice video about this COOL pistol! Great job!A pre-set striker? Uh....Glock borrowed it from this gun, maybe? (they are both from Austia)

[@demos113]

Wonderful vid and good luck with your new Battlewagon. :)

[@Candrsenal]

Well we're 600 miles out and doing OK... except the power steering pump is pissed. But not leaking... sooo damnit.

[@mattdickson2]

may short hair is definitely you hun! you look FIERCE

[@johndallman2692]

The size makes me wonder if the A-H cavalry were still thinking in terms of clubbing people with the gun. That was standard practice in the single-shot days. How would it stand up to such treatment?

[@kalajel]

I like your new haircut Othais.