Is PLA for 3D printing really biodegradable? I've buried and drowned Benchy for 2 years to find out!

[@SirYenner]

I printed a "temporary" PLA thing to hold a small solar panel. So far it's survived 6 years of the Australian sun and still going well.

[@ncot_tech]

SirYenner I have a friend who printed some PLA light fittings for his garden, and they’re still fine having survived the British weather for a number of years.

[@butterparty]

What colour did you print it out of interest? I imagine white would probably avoid a lot of the temperature fluctuations of darker colours.

[@SirYenner]

@@butterparty it is a gold colour. Perhaps the gold pigment is proving some UV protection. There is some slight warping, it's seen some 45°C days.

[@Athiril]

Apparently heating and cooling over a number of cycles might actually make it stronger

[@funkysod]

Have parts for my caravan made in PLA. They've been outside, in all weather from freezing to hot, for almost four years. Both black and white parts. Not brittle, the black parts is a tiny bot sun bleached. Hardly able to notice.

[@Paratyphi]

There's no way i send my failed prints to a recycling facility. I prefer having a full bag of them waiting patiently for the day i'll be able to recycle them myself.

[@HobbyHoarder]

Me too, I have a huge bag filled with wasted prints. I'm looking at filament making machines and the only one that's relatively "cheap" seems to be Felfil Evo. Judging from the reviews, it seems to need a lot of tinkering before you get it to work though.

[@Paratyphi]

@@HobbyHoarder Yep. There's not a "perfect" product yet. Maybe one day we will have one that take every pieces you throw a it, grind them, melt them and extrude consistently a usable filament, without having to spend hours tinkering and monitoring it. Or we will keep our huge bags a few decades before finally sending them to a recycling facility.

[@The_oli4]

Just waiting for filabot to become cheaper or my uni finaly buying one i even showed how much it would save them as they print a lot of failed prints and prints that are used for short projects that can be ground up afterwards. no success yet tho.

[@pulsefel9210]

funny i came to this just after watching a video about recycling waste into filaments

[@amelliamendel2227]

Same

[@ColdFuse96]

The part with the plane at the beginning 😂🤣😂🤣😂

[@alunosouza8931]

Cool!!

[@macelius]

XD Great intro to the Stefan (Stephan?) colab.

[@umbratherios5614]

been using plain PLA in my aquarium for more than 2 years. specifically, I printed a filter... and its still working perfectly.

[@SEELE-ONE]

You printed... A WHAT!?

[@Ian-ff2hz]

How?

[@SEELE-ONE]

Dude! Don’t leave us hanging here! We need answers!!!

[@HeavyhandedDame]

I'm glad you mentioned you use it in an aquarium. I was trying to figure out if I could use it in mine!

[@GiovanniMorenoMusic]

How did u manage to pull that off?

[@ThantiK]

PLA is not _compostable_ it's biodegradable. Under very specific conditions, which require a lot of heat. In fact, in many instances ABS is actually better for the environment because many cities don't have the ability to recycle PLA, but they do have facilities to recycle ABS.

[@HobbyHoarder]

Yeah, that's a very interesting point. On the one hand, PLA is better at the start, as it's usually made out of corn starch, while ABS uses petroleum. But at the end, PLA rarely gets recycled.

[@MisterMakerNL]

Not if you print ABS, because the recyclers check the products with the ABS mark. We could start printing the marks on our printed parts, but since most part that I throw away aren't in one piece anymore it would be mostly useless. Also they don't know where to look for the mark on a 3D printed part. So they probably wouldn't bother with it. PLA is still better in my opinion because at least the production is more environmental friendly. Also we know from fumes test of printing abs vs PLA. That PLA has way less toxic fumes. So I think, (but I don't know for sure) that PLA burns way more cleaner in a furnace than ABS.

[@NullHyp]

You mixed up the words “compostable” and “biodegradable”.

[@wookie8975]

@@MisterMakerNL Aren´t reclycling facilitys just scanning the Infrared Transmission/Reflection for sorting plastic? At least that´s what I learned(Including the problem with different coloured coatings)

[@dibblethwaite]

It's degradable under certain conditions but not biodegradable. The enzyme required for the degradation process does not occur in nature so it can't be considered to be biodegradable imo. I suspect that you are right that the degradation products are not suitable for use as compost but I've not been able to find reliable source of this information.

[@killdeer]

"Don't print useless things" 1 second later "So I printed 24 hooks"

[@HobbyHoarder]

That's a very valid point. My hope is that the hooks will make up for it if this video convinced someone to print less stuff in the long term. I also didn't throw any of the hooks away, I have a large bin for all of my wasted prints that I'm hoping to be able to recycle or turn into new filament someday.

[@jblacktube]

It's a good thing that he's testing common assertions and revalidating his results in a rigorous way. I've been printing pla with impunity with the apparently wrong belief that it was going to fall apart in a decade or two.

[@NoraIconiq]

@@HobbyHoarder there is a way you can recycle your old or wasted prints and turn them into new filament spools its kinda spendy but certainly worth it. Theres a video on youtube I saw on it. I dont remember who did the video but its pretty easy to find.

[@captainboing]

Wow! Good work. "Don't print useless stuff you don't need" I wear it as a badge of honour that I have never printed a "benchy" in 4 years of printing and thousands of properly useful, small-run production items and tools

[@NightMind0]

I can't boast the same but I keep all my failed prints (all PLA) in storage and planning to get them either shipped to someone with re-filament machine or assemble one myself eventually.

[@LimabeanStudios]

I have no issue printing useless things but I also am saving my plastic to be reformed later on once I have more.

[@Charky_Creations]

I do have one (1) benchy, but he sits on top of my printer like a hood ornament and won't be going anywhere anytime soon :)

[@khatunamna]

I'm doing a PhD on biodegradable microplastic and the reference you used are the ones I have read. The surface area to volume ratio is small if using whole piece to test, maybe grind it to smaller pieces you will see some changes

[@HobbyHoarder]

Good luck with your PhD! I'm sure that's true to an extent, but I doubt most people would be willing to grind down parts before throwing them away.

[@reinux]

@@HobbyHoarder I wonder what would happen if we used the sink waste disposal to grind it up? It'll then go into municipal sewage management... not sure if that's good or bad.

[@lynn6799]

@@reinux I'd suggest using a blender or food processor that you don't care about and won't use for food again.

[@reinux]

@@lynn6799 Before returning it to soil or something?

[@lynn6799]

@@reinux smaller pieces of anything break down faster than larger pieces. I wouldn't use the kitchen disposal to grind plastic. If you do any resin crafts, or even painting of any kind, or make models, you can use the ground up bits to add texture, or create unique color effects in resin. Basically, use it the same way in resin you would glitter or metal flakes.

[@dr_j0nes]

Thank you! This opened my eyes. I will now start to collect my failed prints in a separate bin and contact an PLA recycling service when it is full.

[@ajlbeer]

Thanks for doing this. It's really something I feared was the case. There should be stricter guidelines on marketing claims like "ECO friendly".

[@justin_time]

Thank you for presenting the facts, especially in an unbiased manner!

[@tistione]

Now that's priority mail! Great special effects with the plane, really improved since the previous video.

[@jolio81]

I'm using 3D printed PLA parts in a product I'm selling. The "biodegradable" aspect of PLA had always worried me until I watched your video. Great information! Thanks!

[@essentials1016]

What product are you selling

[@nicholasweiss4662]

Even though PLA is pretty much not bio degradable it is still better than other plastics like ABS because it is made from renewable resources and apart from processing almost co2 neutral. Even if you burn PLA you only add the co2 that corn plants took from the atmosphere before. If you burn ABS on the other hand, you add co2 that was sealed in the form of oil for millions of years.

[@fsix3451]

Thank you! That is important to know. I always thought it is biodegradable. The video quality is excellent too🙂

[@HobbyHoarder]

Thank you, trying my best :)

[@tzisorey]

I'd be curious to see if mycoremediation could make a difference - bury one in one of those Grow-Mushrooms-At-Home kits, and see how it goes. Maybe try that with different types of plastics - I know that certain mushrooms (oyster mushrooms in particular) are good enough at breaking down hydrocarbon bonds, that they're sometimes used to treat soil that's been contaminated with diesel.

[@DoctorNemmo]

I made a filter holder for my thermos flask and discovered that the PLA filter became brittle after a few days. Hot water made it very easy to break and decompose. So, if you want to get rid of your PLA... boil it.

[@thezen9]

like most plastic.

[@marutiroma6295]

A thousand thanks !!!! I was afraid that this would be the case and you had great courage in making this video. I will follow the Project Plan. Thanks again.

[@jarrenvanman2570]

Thanks for the description update. So many creators don't bother to go back and update their videos. You are awesome!

[@HobbyHoarder]

No problem at all, it's the least I can do :)

[@tombert512]

I wonder if part of the reason the results were underwhelming was because the filament is densely packed, with a very low relative surface area for degradation to kick in. I would be interested in seeing how the material degrades if you shredded it into a powder first.

[@jeffl6394]

I'm 19 months into a two year experiment myself. I knew PLA wouldn't break down in water, since I've had PLA in several aquariums for more than two years and they show no signs of degradation or changes in water parameters. There isn't enough heat or bacteria in my yard to promote degradation either. However, I put a full Benchy and multiple pieces of support scrap into my 120 gallon composter, where the temperature often reaches 150F or higher. I've checked it every six months. After six months, the PLA scrap was brittle but otherwise intact. The Benchy was pitted, but otherwise whole. After a year, the scrap showed noticeable degradation and the Benchy was falling apart at the layer lines. At 18 months, I couldn't find most of the scrap and the Benchy was in multiple pieces. I expect the Benchy will be mostly gone by the two year mark.

[@HobbyHoarder]

That's actually great news! People have been commenting that I should have used a composter as well, so it's great to hear it actually works if the conditions are right. How about you upload a video about it, we'd love to see the results!

[@GabrielAlejandroZorrilla]

Jeff, really interested in your experiement. Would like to see a video or paper!

[@gladiatormechs5574]

are your AQUARIUM PLA parts still holding up now 2 years again in the fish tank water ?

[@jeffl6394]

@@HobbyHoarder I actually forgot all about my experiment. The composter has been sitting in the back field since I checked at the 18 month mark. I will try to find the time to open it up and take pictures once the weather calms down.

[@jeffl6394]

@@gladiatormechs5574 I have a lot of PLA prints in my aquariums. I've found that they last for years if undisturbed, but after a couple of years underwater, they become very brittle. A few months ago, I tore down an aquarium I scaped with printed pieces in 2019. The prints all looked as sound as when I added them to the tank, but when I moved the largest piece it broke in multiple places. The only issue I've run into is a piece I printed with PLA+ last year. I put it into an established tank and the following day it was covered in a weird slime and my TDS was extremely high. Whatever Inland adds to PLA to make it PLA+ was not suitable for my aquarium.

[@AudreyRobinel]

I printed multiple aquarium filters in PLA. The held perfectly for years (i replaced the ones i don't use anymore with something better, not because it failed : a few years after designing stuff i progressed in CAD :)) I also have PLA meshes to support aquarium plants, no change after years (up to 4-5 years now). Aquariums are heavily filled with bacteria and microfauna, so it's a really active ecosystem, that should alleviate the "you used tap water" comments. Plus the filters are the part with most biological activity on it in a well established aquarium... I even have some PLA parts buried in the substrate of my planted aquariums, so they see aerobic and anaerobic conditions. In all cases, no change after multiple years (more than 2 years in that case).

[@gladiatormechs5574]

are they still holding up in your AQUARIUM now again 2 years later

[@AudreyRobinel]

@@gladiatormechs5574 The did hold for quite some time, until i decomissioned the aquariums. I still have some bits of it, but i don't have time to maintain aquariums as of now.

[@gladiatormechs5574]

@@AudreyRobinel would you say that they held up until you took down your tank , or did they fall apart and then you took down your AQUARIUM ?..THANK YOU.

[@AudreyRobinel]

@@gladiatormechs5574 They definitely held up fine in the tank! No degradation notable after removal. I have a friend that also print stuffs for his aquarium, no issues either. I did also print PLA parts that served as soil holder for an aquascape, so they were burried in the soil. No damage after 3-4 years at least. My friend had the air driven filters with some parts made of PLA; we tried loads of stuff, nothing to see as much as an issue. We printed twinstar like structures, the metal degraded, not the plastic.

[@gladiatormechs5574]

@@AudreyRobinel thank you for your time.

[@c.j.1089]

You should print a single layer and bury that. That will get you a much more accelerated idea of what is happening. Even heavily biodegradable products would show little degradation over such a short period of time.

[@KimOyhus]

Decomposing of about 50% was what I got when I had a PLA print in my aquarium for 3.4 years. The oxygen in the water might help a lot. Anaerobic rotting is slower.

[@revimfadli4666]

Maybe your aquarium somehow has the microbes that produce the specific enzymes that could degrade PLA?

[@pointyflyer155]

Did the aquarium have any animals in it?

[@KimOyhus]

@@pointyflyer155 The aquarium had fish in it. The fish did not touch the PLA.

[@pointyflyer155]

@@KimOyhus I wonder why. If it gave off some sort of aura that the fish didn't like?

[@KimOyhus]

@@pointyflyer155 No. The fish treated it like any irrelevant stone.

[@lynn6799]

Thanks. You just saved me a lot of time, money and work because I was looking at spending money on aquarium safe resin to coat my pla in so I could make unique plant support structures. Now I know that I definitely don't need it.

[@timderks5960]

I've actually experienced PLA degrading myself, but it was very minimal under pretty extreme circumstances. It was a shield for an impact sprinkler, printed in the cheapest possible black PLA. As such, it got wet pretty much every single day during the summer, and got pounded by the sun. With it being a very thin part (just a couple of mm), it started deforming and splitting between layers pretty quickly. Probably for a large part, this was down to the PLA getting soft from the heat of the sun. It was also more brittle, probably due to UV radiation. The water didn't really seem to have an effect, except for putting a rusty coating on the plastic (rusty groundwater). In reality, I suspect that the most damaging thing to PLA would be the sun, mostly UV radiation, and the absorption of that heat and radiation is heavily dependent on the color of the material.

[@HobbyHoarder]

Yep, that's a very good point. It probably got "sanded" away by the water force as well. I saw someone make a filter for fish tank and it got ruined pretty quickly. They thought PLA degraded, but in reality, it was simply sanded away by the small particles in the water.

[@themecatronicaproject1670]

A great video! A sad conclusion though. PLA's degradability was one my proudest reasons for using it on my prints.

[@HobbyHoarder]

I keep all of my failed prints in a large bag. I'm hoping that someone will start taking it and turning it into new fillaments. Or if nothing else, that the filament making machines will become cheap enough that I could buy one and re-use all the old waste.

[@jun9098]

good video. After I made a part for my saltwater aquarium, I searched it because I didnt think pla is going to biodegrade under normal condition. Some People are spreading false info about pla. Pla is plastic, so it is chemically inert, which means it is hard to get biodegrade. Glad I found this video to check the facts.

[@alexanderthomas2660]

I have stuck a PLA print in the soil next to a potted plant that has been sitting outside (during the months when there is no frost), in rain and sun, for more than 3 years. The part still looks the same… I have collected almost all my 3D printed waste so far, with the plan to either try to extrude it into usable filament, or at least deliver it somewhere it can be processed.

[@whatsername101010]

I've been collecting all of mine also. Let me know if you find a place to recycle it! I have nothing locally.

[@Jackson_Zheng]

The fact that pla was biodegradable was the reason why I avoided using it for my prints! If I spend money printing a part, I want that part to last. It's such a shame I didn't find this video earlier. I would've wasted a lot less time with other materials like PETG (too sticky) and ABS (too warpy), and just printed all my parts out of pla

[@HobbyHoarder]

Yeah, PLA is really easy to print with. PETG still has its use when you need a strong part, but for something that will sit on your desk, PLA is good enough. A variant of the ABS that's also very useful is ASA; it's strong like ABS, but has high UV resistance so it's perfect for things that will be left outside in the sun.

[@brawndo8726]

Thank you for making this. I was already aware of the disingenuous claim, but it's fairly obvious it hasn't become common knowledge.

[@vhslostandfound]

Before getting into 3D printing, I was concerned about the environmental impact and was reassured by the ubiquitous 'biodegradable' claims for PLA-as someone who now LOVES the hobby, I'm bummed to discover it's pretty much a lie ☹️. I was relieved to hear about ProjectPLA.com but it sadly appears to be unavailable. Hopefully something similar becomes available soon. Thanks for the great information 👍

[@HobbyHoarder]

Yeah, same here, I now always think more about whether I really have to print something or not. As for ProjectPLA, I was sad to hear it's gone under. I guess too few people were willing to pay for the box. I did find another similar service, so you might have more luck there: www.terracycle.com I also began using more and more stuff from Filamentive (based in UK, but I think they sell worldwide). A lot of their filaments are made completely from recycled plastic and there's no loss in quality whatsoever.

[@Krytern]

John, it isn't a lie. What he did here does not test if it is biodegradable, he is testing if it is compostable. To biodegrade PLA you have to heat it up, very hot, as well as have it very wet. You don't just bury it and it magically happens no one claims this.

[@hammersbald7612]

This reminds me of the people who claimed to be able to compost all sorts of materials. Yeah by blasting the crap out of it with a military grade UV light, grinding it down and calling it done.

[@MyMiniCraft]

the pla its eco friendly because its a plant base material, not because its biodegradable. but love this test very curious to see what happen, thank you for the video.

[@catpaintypo8869]

I built a bracket for a drainpipe. The PLA one lasted 6 months in all weathers whereas the PETG one has lasted 4 years so far.

[@TheFloatingSheep]

I mean, its durability in itself is a good argument for switching from petroleum based polymers to agricultural feedstock based polymers. Ultimately the world will always need durable polymers. But we could definitely do with new alternatives for single use packaging. Though I suppose, ultimately, the majority of plastic packaging is expected to deal with high levels of moisture for relatively long times, and as such, it implies they must be waterproof, otherwise paper would be used, and waterproof materials are typically much harder to compost to any extent. Perhaps we should design polymers which are much more sensitive to UV light.

[@phoemur]

Look, if normal petroleum plastics could take up to 1000 years to decompose, than even if PLA took 50 years It would be considered highly biodegradable.

[@engineer3d]

Great informative video! More people in 3D printing should be aware of this and work towards more recyclable solutions!

[@brandielee7971]

Agreed. Ive been doing a lot of looking into wood filiment

[@mauriciobailey4725]

The biggest issue is that PLA is “biodegradable” but not “compostable” (I believe someone mentioned this before in another comment). The difference I image is that compostable means you can throw it in a compost pile and let natural plants and organisms (bugs and bacteria) break the material down, either consuming it or turning it into simpler macro-molecules. biodegradable is still safer for the environment when produced, and when it falls apart, unlike traditional plastics. But it probably still requires assistance to decompose (it needs to be placed in a specialized environment, manually sheared, and/or exposed to specific types of bacteria). If anyone knows of any natural materials that will degrade and are compostables please let me know, I want to start a list. I'm thinking certain types of glues combined with some cellulose might make interesting materials.

[@HobbyHoarder]

Yeah, you pretty much summed it up nicely. The bigger problem is I think that most people don't know there's a difference. If someone hears "biodegradable", I'll bet anything they don't think of large recycling plants. I don't think there's any compostable filament for 3D printing, at least I haven't been able to find it. There are more and more manufactures that recycle old plastic bottles into new spools though, so I think that's the best option right now. From what I'm seeing, PETG can be made 100% from old bottles, while PLA is a mix of 80% bottles and 20% new PLA.

[@luisfmoralesjr5221]

Great idea. Very informative. I can see you put in a out of time researching this. I’m very new to 3D printing and was excited to know that PLA was eco friendly/biodegradable. Now I’m disappointed that the manufacturers are misleading us. Sure it is biodegradable but only under expensive and unique conditions. Very sad. I guess the source (starch) of the material still provides some validity in being eco friendly. Thanks for the info and your other great videos. I am learning a lot from them. You have a new subscriber.

[@HobbyHoarder]

Thank you Luis, I appreciate your kind words and I'm very happy to hear you're liking my videos. Yeah, PLA seems better than ABS (petrolium based) in that regard, but we're not there yet. I've seen PLA used more and more in eco-aware restaurants, so I'm hoping this will also increase pressure for actually recycling it.

[@JesiahMac]

Burying something in soil is not the same as compost. A compost pile stays at or above 100F for a prescribed amount of time in order to break down organic waste.

[@HobbyHoarder]

That's true, but the point I was trying to make is that everybody likes to claim how PLA is biodegradable, which in theory it is, but as you've said, only under specific conditions in proper processing facilites, i.e. almost never.

[@Lew0t]

I would love to see a video on the second test with the hooks! Sad to see that you haven't uploaded anything in a while, but hoping that it'll show up soon. Currently considering getting a 3D printer for plant production purposes so this test and analysis is really valuable.

[@HobbyHoarder]

Thank you for getting in touch. Yeah, it's been a while, but I'm hoping to get the channel moving again. We've relocated and I'm still busy with renovations. If your only concern is printed items lasting in soil, then I wouldn't worry. I have a feeling you could do it for decades, as long as it's not too hot.

[@modellking]

I live in an area in Germany where PLA was collected separately until the beginning of the year... (I worked holidays at the collection thing: They have sold it separately, too) Yes they switched to one bag recycling for convenience...

[@HobbyHoarder]

Interesting, where was that? (I also live in Germany).

[@snakosaurus]

I printed some hose fittings and other bits for my fresh-water aquarium from PLA about a year ago. All submerged parts got discolored and started literally crumpling to bits recently. I actually had to re-print most of the parts from ABS. I wonder if there are brand differences. My spool of PLA would become brittle and would break inside the feed tube even before entering the extuder if left unused for too long. Or maybe aquariums do have the right mix of bacteria.

[@HobbyHoarder]

Few brands seem to be much worse in this regard, I'm thinking they're using some other type of (cheap) filler that gets brittle very quickly.

[@brontosaurusburger]

My experience with running a pool, lots of things sitting outside in the sun, is that plastics that are colored break down much slower in the sun than plastics that are white. I assume the darker pigments protect the plastic somehow. I'm curious to see if you get the same result with the white hooks stored outside.

[@PotentPrintables]

Great video and very eye opening. Thanks for sharing this information! It will also be interesting to see what the tests in a year show.

[@HobbyHoarder]

Thanks! I'm 99% sure the hooks will stay exactly the same, although I'm expecting at least a small amount of warping.

[@pooson]

Great work! Can't wait for hooks test result.

[@asalottin]

Excellent work there and very relevant to put things in perspective -- thank you for sharing. Just subscribed!

[@HobbyHoarder]

Thank you, I really appreciate that!

[@madkvideo]

Whoa, what an eye opener! We have to be more careful with our prints then

[@independentthought3390]

Yes definitely, however, there is still a big difference between PLA and other plastics, PLA is not as toxic as most other plastics.

[@mgoh1984]

That is good to know, but what about the carbon footprint from the ingredients used to manufacture PLA as opposed to other filaments?

[@HobbyHoarder]

I think PLA is still the best in that regards. PLA made from recycled bottles is also becoming more and more common, so that's probably even better. If you can justify the cost, recycling and making new PLA filament at home is probably the best in regards to environment, but I haven't found a machine that's cheap enough yet.

[@qdmc12]

This makes sense, about two years ago I printed a hair trap for my shower drain. I recently had to replace it after had become very brittle and cracked (and been repaired) several times. It was in the perfect condition for biodegrading - heat, moisture and microbes.

[@wolf2965]

Soap + water acts as a weak alkaline (basic) solution - PLA is weak to it, and it embrittles them. Unlikely to be caused by just heat (unless showers you take are 55+ Celsius...) or moisture, let alone the microbes.

[@qdmc12]

@@wolf2965 Hmm, I'll have to test this further.

[@ThanosSustainable]

You should also throw a bunch of hooks into a compost bin.

[@KarlLew]

PLA is great. I use it for garden fittings with full sun exposure. Earthen colored PLA lasts longer than natural, even longer than white HDPE. Broken PLA goes in the garbage can. I therefore use it sparingly. I dont have the space for wood CNC.

[@OWLyMULLET]

5:23 beautiful '8" last digit to the right

[@HobbyHoarder]

Hehe, yeah, like most engineers, my handwriting is terrible :D

[@NefariousElasticity]

Well, now I want to build a compost bin for PLA that would provide the proper environment for it to biodegrade. Six months in a bin in my garage isn't nearly as bad as several life times in a landfill.

[@VoltisArt]

60 C / 140 F or higher is fairly energy intensive to maintain for six solid months, even in the hottest deserts on Earth. That's not including the special bacteria or high-oxygen environment. ( 7:20 ) This is likely to be much more expensive than any recycling method, and both composting and recycling may be much more harmful to the environment than the _mostly_ toxin-neutral bulk added to a landfill. This isn't an easy problem and unfortunately an easy solution hasn't been introduced. Only time will tell if that changes; hopefully this and other environmental issues are brought into better balance before we hit a point where we can't thrive on this planet anymore.

[@maurofoti526]

Anything that is biodegradable in a couple of years underground would also be on a shelf. Imagine if every plastic object you have around the house had to be replaced every 3 years. One of the best (and worst) aspects of plastic is that, whilr being cheap, it is incredibly resistant to the environment, it does not rot like wood nor it rusts like metals. Of course such an important and dangerous resource should be handled more responsibly, but it would be impossible to get both benefits

[@HobbyHoarder]

Yeah, plastic is really both a blessing and a curse. I'm switching all of my filaments to ones made from recycled plastic or bottles. The color selection is getting better and better as well.

[@andresouza2314]

Some parts in my bathroom loosened strength in about 3 years. I also lose a roll after the same time(stored). I live in amazon jungle. Here is very hot and humid.

[@CoreMaster111]

Even my PETG parts in heat and humidity lose strength and start deforming.

[@pawpatina]

Biodegradable means years.... Like nuclear half life. Only the newest most cutting edge Bio materials dissolve that fast and they are basically made of mushroom and sawdust...

[@DrazCreates]

Was this test even necessary considering the chemical composition is know and also the conditions needed to make it biodegradable: "Industrial composting conditions, i.e. controlled temperature and humidity in the presence of micro-organisms, are necessary for PLA to be truly degradable"

[@HobbyHoarder]

Nothing is necessary as such, but how many people will actually go look online for journal papers dealing with the subject? I wanted to present that in a more approachable way.

[@DrazCreates]

@@HobbyHoarder true, i thought it was common knowledge ... The place where I buy PLA have that message as a warning sign do you don't just discard it thinking it will degrade anyway.

[@DerEineDaniel]

I am wondering if it's enough to put it in your own compost. The conditions are very similar and I can imagine that micro organisms adapt while they're at it. It would surely take more than 6 months but I think you could see a difference at least at very thin parts. Will test that.

[@dl5244]

Any results?

[@MrLukeSatchell]

Have you tried Autoclaving any PLA parts prior? Ones that I have put in an Autoclave have came out whole but are extremely fragile and turn to power if a slight amount of force is applied,

[@HobbyHoarder]

I haven't tried that, but I doubt it helps with degrading. Just being brittle and breaking down into smaller pieces doesn't necessarily make it much better.

[@Siamect]

Many of my PLA parts I printed a few years ago and that has been in my living room the whole time has turned into fragments, simply falling apart by themselves... I think some manufacturers are using additives to prevent this from happening because some of the parts I printed has survived fine...

[@HobbyHoarder]

I've found cheaper brands to be flimsier to work with. Maybe they're mixing some cheaper, lower quality plastic with their PLA, which is what causes the degradation.

[@TheSunriseAnimation]

nice video, if you have a compost pile, or know someone with one, you could burry a few of the hooks in there too, see if it makes a difference to just the dirt underneath your lawn.

[@HobbyHoarder]

Yeah, I've received several suggestions like that, it's a shame I didn't think of it earlier. I'm hoping someone else does a similar experiment and includes that as well.

[@RoamGaming]

the "biodegradable" plastic bags that every city seems to change too are only biodegradable in a professional compost heap because it requires the higher temps. in a home compost you won't be able to get those temperatures and so it doesn't break down. it might be that PLA also needs those higher temps in the correct bacterial environment to break down. a standard plastic shopping bag will actually break down faster than the biodegradable ones outside of the professional compost pile. too many of those bags in the professional compost pile will actually stop the composting process as well meaning that they are only compostable in small numbers at large facilities. but because they are marketed as "biodegradable" people keep demanding that cities switch to them and consequently make their plastic bag problems worse.

[@revimfadli4666]

If it's _oxo_ biodegradable, then it needs to be burnt or exposed to UV before being biodegradable(which might happen on the ocean surface or incinerators?)

[@andrewogas828]

I'd argue that not being biodegradable makes pla better for the environment. Pla, as far as I'm aware, is produced primarily from corn. Since corn pulls carbon out of the atmosphere, effectively pla stores sequestered carbon indefinitely, thus lowering atmospheric CO². Biodegrading would just release it again, maintaining greenhouse gas levels.

[@HobbyHoarder]

That's a very interesting idea, I was thinking about it for days now. Sadly, after doing some reading, processing corn into PLA seems to produce much more CO2 vs recycling. It kinda makes sense when you think about it. Growing corn requires land, lots of machinery, pesticides, irrigation, harvesting, processing it into PLA and all the combined transportation between it all. Whereas recycling "only" requires transportation to the plant and some recycling plants have started capturing CO2 and turning it into other byproducts (I've seen methanol and some sort of plant growth mixture). So to the best of my searching skills, recycling is still a far better alternative over producing it from scratch.

[@ArjanDuijs]

So, a little over a year has passed. what are the results of the tests with the hooks hooks?

[@HobbyHoarder]

I'm really happy to hear you're interested in more. I'm sorry to say that video will be delayed. It's been a weird year (my last video was uploaded about 8 months ago). I can't promise it will be out before summer. To be honest, I don't expect it to be different as with the first test, I'm not inventing anything new here.

[@ArjanDuijs]

@@HobbyHoarder yeah dont expect much difference, but still, this vid feels a little incomplete without closure ;) it has indeed been a weird year, for everyone i guess. in anyway, looking forward to some more vids

[@3dpprofessor]

Excellent video. The argument that I've heard (from Adrian Bowyer, actually) is that PLA can be made from renewable resources, and not petrolium products, and is therefore a win for the environment in it's production. But that's *if* they create it from natural sources, like the alge created PLA you showed. Is it still a win overall? That's difficult to say. That said, I know people with a composing pile in their backyard that could probably break it down. It's just a question of getting a living composing pile and turning it regularly. I live in a rural area, so those folks have chickens doing the turning for them.

[@HobbyHoarder]

Yes, production is definitely in favor of PLA in terms of raw ingredients. Hehe, how about you throw something on that pile and then make a video about it? I'd love to see your experience with it.

[@3dpprofessor]

@@HobbyHoarder The problem with a proper composting pile is finding it later. Those piles are in constant motion and, like you said, it takes 6 months. Still, I'll ask and see.

[@JoakimGulbrandsen]

Seeing this made me ass, that I can't watch part 2 yet....then happy that the video is already 10 months old 😅

[@HobbyHoarder]

I'm afraid part 2 will be delayed a bit, as we're in the process of moving. I think spring/summer is more realistic. Sorry to keep you waiting!

[@JoakimGulbrandsen]

@@HobbyHoarder I'll add it in my calendar 🤭

[@victorlin4645]

Thank you for doing this. Unfortunately, Project PLA doesn’t exist anymore :(

[@HobbyHoarder]

Yeah, I'm afraid they soon went out of business. Check out TerraCycle, it's the closest thing I could find.

[@adhdartist1994]

Like so many labels show, they have to go into very specific conditions, and usually none of the items get collected by the companies at all.

[@danielguy1891]

I appreciate this real-life test.

[@yetbog]

Great video man! this 11 minute video felt like a 3 minute video: well timed, nice editing, clear and straight to the point. You have a new suscriber! I do 3D animation and I was really tempted to buy a 3D printer because of the "biodegradable" PLA plastic, but now I'm hesitating... do you know if there is an affordable compostable or eco-friendly filament? Or, in your opinion, what is the less pollutant filament? Thanks for sharing your knowledge :)

[@HobbyHoarder]

Thank you Juan, I'm very happy to hear that and I really appreciate every subscriber. I haven't come across any filament that would be easily compostable at home. I'm actually thinking of trying that in my further tests, but I doubt I'll have any luck. As mentioned in the video, you need a constant heat of around 60'C for months, something that I can't imagine being feasible in a garden or house. However, that shouldn't keep you from buying a 3D printer. While the plastic itself might not be as eco-friendly as you hope for, it's still better if you print something yourself vs. ordering it online and having it shipped to you across the world. There's also the option of grinding down printed objects and creating new filament from them. It's not cheap, but you wouldn't have to throw anything away. Here's a great video on this topic: kzbin.info/www/bejne/rKK6qIiubdGSf9E

[@yetbog]

@@HobbyHoarder Thank you for the response, that was really useful! Keep doing great videos, cheers from Colombia!

[@HobbyHoarder]

@@yetbog Thank you, and also for being the first (as far as I know) subscriber from Colombia, I'm very excited about that!

[@jolio81]

I don't believe a better alternative exists. There are bench-scale machines available that allow you to convert scrap PLA (or other thermoplastics) back into filament. If you bought one, you could be your local PLA recycler! ;)

[@92weru]

Thank you for this video and proving the fact! Have you tryied similar test with hemp based filament?

[@HobbyHoarder]

No, I can't say I've ever heard of that type of filaments.

[@NoraIconiq]

This is good information as I wanted to make some pla prints that would be exposed to bioactive enviroments and was worried they would break down rendering them unusable over time but seems that might not be the case.

[@aleximichaud5889]

Cant wait to see the results. Very well put together experiment.

[@HobbyHoarder]

Thank you, doing my best :)

[@jamiedubs8582]

Ey thank you all for the nice Comments, it really helped me. And thank you so much for the Video.

[@pugnate666]

Project PLA was news for me Thank you for pointing me towards it! Sadly the website is just saying "coming soon" and all other links are broken. Is it dead already?

[@HobbyHoarder]

You're right, there's definitely something going on. I haven't heard anything about them going out of business, although I've just checked and the Twitter account is gone as well. So I'm sad to say it does seem like it's over for them. There's also another service doing something similar if you're interested - www.terracycle.com

[@lacikeri3102]

What happens if you burn the waste PLA? What gases are produced?

[@HobbyHoarder]

I don't know, I wasn't able to find any sources on that, but it's an interesting idea. Please be sure to come back and let us know if you ever get the answer.

[@TheStuffMade]

I've had PLA prints break down after just 5 years under "normal" conditions (highish temperature and high humidity), I did a short video on it.

[@HobbyHoarder]

Yeah, UV will certainly make PLA more brittle (which is why I'm repeating this test with Stefan and actual numbers), but that doesn't mean it's biodegradable as such.

[@TheStuffMade]

@@HobbyHoarder In my case there was no sunlight/uv light involved. And not just a specific filament, some of them didn't just become brittle, they had started turning into a corrosive liquid.

[@HobbyHoarder]

@@TheStuffMade That's very interesting, I've never heard or seen anyhting like that happening before. Might be related to PLA brand. Would make for an interesting experiment if you still have it.

[@Lola-qw1ih]

This is great stuff, thank you for this experiment!

[@dragonskunkstudio7582]

The only way to make 3D prints biodegradable is to make them out of pasta. :D

[@HobbyHoarder]

3D printed pasta doesn't sound that bad :D

[@potatosordfighter666]

I do take some issue with your claims at 7:50. You can break down most PLA on your own at home by keeping it in water at around 70 degrees celcius for a week. It won't fully break down, but it makes it far easier to biodegrade it

[@ivans3806]

One way to tackle the waste might be including filament recycling device with every 3d-printer sold. There's this Russian guy on KZbin called Brother. He prints with different wacky/crazy stuff: strips cut off of PET bottles, filament extruded from disposable plastic cutlery etc. If someone would improve on his designs and more people would recycle their failed/old prints in place - it would be better for the world.

[@HobbyHoarder]

Yeah, I really wish there were more local options that would take waste prints/filament and recycle it into new spools.

[@jothain]

PLA's hydroscopic properties are also generally speaking under estimated. When I moved I temporarily printed customized bottle holder right between two showers. Didn't have anything else than PLA available at that moment. Now that stand/holder has been loaded constantly with roughly 1to2kg load and has obviously gotten soaked with water multiple times per week. It's still ok and though now showing mild symptoms of degradation. It has been printed three years ago! By general opinion what I read I was expecting it to last maximum of six months. So in my experience it lasts way better in water that is generally speaking said. Only problems I've experienced with pla in some situations is poor heat resistance,around 60C and uv seems to degrade it quite fast.

[@HobbyHoarder]

Yeah, PLA starts to deform at around 55'C and UV certainly doesn't help. Good to hear your print is still holding up after a few years in use.

[@jothain]

@@HobbyHoarder it would be quite interesting to see how water changes properties of pla in long run. Haven't found any actual long term test about it. I guess most criticism comes from moisture in filament during printing and I've experienced this in some extent myself when I forgot one spool of pla in humid balcony for few months. Though I think there's quite much of deviation in pla quality in general by different manufacturers. At least on my old printer there seemed to be quite prone to stringing difference in printing temperature if I changed it on around 30C scale between manufacturers. I suspect that this previous cheapo printer had quite bad heat brake as I haven't seen nearly as much difference on my prusa. That or maybe there's just more consistent quality overall available these days.

[@matoumakes]

Nice video! Thank you for calling attention to this! Unfortunately it looks like the ProjectPLA doesn't exist any more. The website doesn't work and a google search doesn't really give useful results on it. Is there any alternative?

[@HobbyHoarder]

Yeah, it seems to have gone under a few months after I've made the video. The only alternative that I could find is this: www.terracycle.com

[@Oskimaa]

Some PLA actually biodegrades quite fast; I don't remember what brand it was but I printed some pump parts and a swirl filter for my aquarium and it started to "melt" in less than 6 months. Now I only use Real PETG Natural for those kind of parts and it seems to be biologically inert.

[@HobbyHoarder]

I don't know if it was your blog post, but I've seen it mentioned online about the fish tank. But it later turned out that PLA wasn't actually degrading, it was just being "sanded" by fine particles in the water. You can easily test this out; just print something and place it in the corner of your fish tank where there's not a lot of water flow. I'd be willing to bet nothing will happen with the object.

[@Occivink]

Ultimately, is it that bad that PLA ends up being incinerated? Seeing that it is made from plants and not petroleum, you're not releasing any trapped fossil fuel carbon (unlike ABS, or PETG). The net impact then strictly comes from production and transport, which is both difficult to quantify but can also be made carbon-neutral. Does it really make sense then to try to recycle or biodegrade PLA as opposed to just burning it?

[@HobbyHoarder]

It's hard to say, I haven't been able to find much info if burning PLA is more viable vs. recycling. But it's certainly an interesting idea and a lot of people have had similar comments.

[@Afaik777]

So, it's been an year, time for the hooks video! =)

[@HobbyHoarder]

I'm thrilled by your enthusiasm, but I'm sorry to say the video will be delayed for a few months. Hasn't been my most productive year and I'd rather do it right than rush it.

[@Afaik777]

@@HobbyHoarder no worries, this year wasn't kind on most people... I really like your videos, watched all of them now =)

[@HobbyHoarder]

@@Afaik777 Thank you, I really appreciate that :) Hopefully I'll manage a better upload schedule next year so you have something new to watch :)

[@dgurevich1]

I honestly think by far the better way is to just recycle it yourself into usable filament. CNC kitchen made his recycling rig, might as well do it.

[@HobbyHoarder]

@@dgurevich1 I looked into it a while ago and it doesn't make financial sense. Having said that, if you want to do it to reduce waste, then that's an excellent option.

[@St0RM33]

This video needs more views!!

[@1TW1-m5i]

So that's how airmail works!

[@HobbyHoarder]

Just don't order a washing machine :D

[@Shep01]

i figured this was the deal early on and have diligently collected every fine hair and piece of pla that had come out of that printer... there is a box of shame all the fails and outlines go in... i figured i will melt it in to a hammer head some day.. all types pla/ pla +/nylon/ PETG/abs all sorted. I recommend the same to anyone getting in to this hobby.

[@TheHDreality]

Can I suggest keeping one of the hooks wet and one dry in an achievable version of an artificially hot environment? For example near ceiling of a tall greenhouse can become >50C even as far north as my hometown. Basically if I could theoretically achieve any biodegradation at home with just the heat and moisture needed but not the enzymes, it seems like something worth finding out.

[@HobbyHoarder]

I've had several similar suggestions, so I'm definitely thinking of trying it out.

[@SianaGearz]

PLA is not allowed to be composted in Germany, because only soft material is composted, hard material is separated out and incinerated. Though where did you get that PLA - or anything for that matter - is simply shovelled into a landfill in Germany? I was under the impression that EVERYTHING that cannot be otherwise reused is incinerated, so that landfill material, by the time it's buried, is completely chemically inert, its residual energy is reclaimed, and it's much more compact than it would be otherwise.

[@HobbyHoarder]

It's much more complex than that. No, not everything that cannot be recycled is incinerated, about 20% of materials still isn't being recovered (that includes burning it up). Landfilling is still allowed in Germany, as long as it's been treated properly (untreated organic waste is banned, for example). You can see the official statistics here: www.bmu.de/fileadmin/Daten_BMU/Pools/Broschueren/abfallwirtschaft_2018_en_bf.pdf Another issue that hides the actual ammount of waste is that Germany "exports" a lot of waste to other countries that don't have such strict recycling policies in place. You can check the eurostat page and see that Germany exports hundreds of thousands of tons of waste to other countries: ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php/Waste_shipment_statistics_based_on_the_European_list_of_waste_codes#General_overview Here's another article: www.handelsblatt.com/today/politics/the-plastic-trail-how-germanys-recycling-ends-up-in-malaysian-dumps-/24037020.html So even though Germany is a world leader in terms of recycling, it's still far from being perfect. Exporting to other countries simply hides the real numbers, which would otherwise be much lower.

[@lautaromorales2903]

Try putting it in a vinegar solution. polimers made by esters like PLA (Poly Lactic Acid) Hydrolyse under basic or acidic conditions. putting it under basic conditions isn't going to do very much because the base is going to be neutralized by the lactic acid, but if you put it under acidic conditions the acidity will only increase as the lactic acid forms, so in theory after a long time (I don't know how much) you will end only with a solution of vinegar and lactic acid

[@technodrone313]

ive had some parts that i made and put on my bikes about 4 years ago that are still in rediculously good shape.

[@HobbyHoarder]

Yep, me too, I printed a mount for my cycling computer, good as new.

[@Giraldtec]

Wow! This really is eye opening! Great research!

[@20EsOfficial]

loved the 'air mail' scene!

[@王新-q3g]

Please let me know that you will update the second part

[@HobbyHoarder]

I'm sorry to say no. We moved to a new place a while ago and I forgot to dig out the Benchies. They're still buried there. Theoretically, I might get to them someday in the future, which would be very interesting, but I'm afraid that's not very likely.

[@tomekhekin914]

Very good video. A was wondering what to do with my failed prints. Thank you for explaining.