Honda Jumps Into the EV War - AAH 704

[@kevtheobald]

Wish Honda would dump their hydrogen development. It is a money pit that has been getting moderate results at best. People scream EVs need infrastructure to support it, but not as many seem to acknowledge that issue with hydrogen.

[@stickynorth]

110 volts are what most people juice their cars up with, trickle style at night and each dwelling generally has dozens of potential outlets... Not much of an issue as long as you have some sort of plug in point. Even my old 70 year old bungalow in suburban Alberta has indoor and outdoor outlets capable of charging an EV or a block heater for an ICE car since we have to do that 6 months of the year generally speaking.. So it's not a foreign concept to Canadians at all. Plugging in your car is what you do if you want to drive at -35c...

[@kenspurr9605]

Please, if you are going to ask about hydrogen cars, ask why they NEVER make it to mass market. It's a red herring and more over it's insulting.

[@jamesvandamme7786]

Walk up to a H2 station and look at the price.

[@unclezeppy]

Here is a thought from a used car sales manager in Shenzhen. "The reason MB and BMW have a bit of a problem in China is that compared to Tesla their design is outdated. People look at them as grandpa cars. The EQ series cars lose almost 50% of their value in the first year even though the cars are very good. Tesla models have borrowed their design idea from the London taxi cabs, which is Elon's goal anyway with the Robotaxis. We have sold many Teslas. One customer commented of the looks of the Model Y saying he doesn't think its an atcractive car but he likes it because like the Model 3 he knows the facelift version does not make you feel bad because suddenly your car looks old. That is a sad truth with many other cars." What I have learned in Shenzhen is, if you own an ICE Mercedes people think you are poor. The reason is the trade-in value on those is not good because people want EV and there is less demand for them. Therefore the owners just keep their cars and often times they are the only blue license plate (ICE) cars on the parking lot, all the others have the green EV plates. My neighbor bought the Xiaomi SU7 and said he was about the buy a new Merc but after seeing the EQ values dropping very fast he decided to buy the SU7.

[@JT_771]

The way these guys speculate-as-fact, sometimes, really cracks me up.

[@daves1646]

Success is ALWAYS an ‘on-purpose’! Why hybrid popularity?? With the high price of ANY new vehicle, consumers are laser focussed on any/all ways to decrease their monthly overall cost, IF they can afford a new vehicle.

[@daves1646]

Sedan ‘revival’ with EV’s... Really? The manufacturer would have to make VERY low profile battery packs (like original MS packs on 70mm high cells) or it will be a crossover height ‘sedan’.

[@jamesvandamme7786]

@@daves1646 My wife won't get into a sedan. That's why they sell so many CUVs and even trucks.

[@user-to2rf1rj5v]

35:11 The Model Y is going to be receiving similar significant upgrade to styling that the Model 3 just got. A five year old design is not that old.

[@danmobile]

Build an EV van, Honda! Why is nobody doing this yet in the USA, meanwhile all over the world other countries have several options. Some people do not want an SUV or truck.

[@user-to2rf1rj5v]

32:27 I know you know better here John. Go seek out a Model 3 pre refresh, and a 2024 Model 3. Put them next to each other. They are pretty significantly different. They do not need to be *radically* different. Just look at the 50 years of the Golf, or the Porsche 911. They aren't doing anything radical. When you create throwaway styling, you need to change it frequently. When you create timeless design, moderate progress is all that's needed.

[@pspublic13]

You speak the truth but people don't perceive it like that with Tesla sticking with their "timeless designs". A lot of people think these are old designs. It doesn't matter if every internal part is updated, since the customer controls the money here, they are right.

[@jdcarguy1242]

46:08 When refinery rates hit 50% and gas goes to $6/gallon I believe more will convert to EV.

[@frankcoffey]

The only reason gas is not $6 a gallon or more is support from governments.

[@AuralioCabal]

Already more thân $6/ gal in Canada, my EXXON has gas @$1.80/ liter regular grade , $1.90 for 93 Oct, $1. 99 /liter for 94 Oct..

[@rok1475]

@@AuralioCabal if you want universal healthcare and affordable education AND set low corporate taxes, money have to be collected from individuals to pay for those frivolities. Americans lowered corporate tax from 52.8% in 1968 to current 21% and shifted the cost of healthcare and education to individuals so they pay less taxes but spend more on health and education.

[@jamesvandamme7786]

@@frankcoffey It pays to buy all the congressmen you can in the name of "energy independence!".

[@user-to2rf1rj5v]

9:26 why would you want 50 MPG, when you can drive a Tesla and get 132 MPGe? Oh, and you won't be poisoning the air you and your loved ones breathe.

[@kevtheobald]

The whole Tesla getting too old seems to ignore how Tesla gives older models upgrades after their bought for years. My M9del 3 has had blind spot detection added, camera image quaity upgrades, and many more features over the past year. People who have owned their Tesla vehicles longer have mentioned how their vehicle keeps getting upgrades. These software focused vehicles are going to need to be thought of differently than the older gen vehicles.

[@nathanahubbard1975]

They literally said that someone like you would say that. As for the rest of us, their cars haven't changed in forever.

[@Carguytct]

So, people like you just want the car to look different instead of actually making a better car, which is what Tesla does.

[@nathanahubbard1975]

​@@Carguytct People like me have been following the industry for our entire lives, and know that you have to appeal to people to sell cars. People want to be seen in something new and cool, not something better. Are people dumb? They sure can be.

[@deanmitchell9568]

You didn't mention the number one reason to bring back sedans. They are just more comfortable to drive than a SUV.

[@JD-yx7be]

suvs are so much refined from the past they drive like sedans. I have a 1995 f150 and a 2020 tacoma and they are night and day difference in handling

[@davestvwatching2408]

I think sedans are more uncomfortable in traffic and nerve-wracking because you can't see through/over traffic. Plus you get cut off a lot because nobody can see you.

[@blakeanderson9479]

The EV slowdown is nothing more than the legacy OEM’s losing so much money per unit, the fact that the product is not very compelling and that they simply have not done their job of supplying charging infrastructure.

[@edornelas8275]

Problem is most folks have not driven an EV & seen how much savings you have with low maintenance or no maintenance for the most part. I have had an EV for 6 years & best car I have had. Insurance has been high but that’s been the cost. Charging at home for the most part has saved me a lot per week compared to my ICE car & truck.

[@jamesvandamme7786]

Selection sucks, prices and "luxury" are too high. Detroit management is fighting to keep the olde way going. Without getting scale they'll never get out of first gear and when Sino-Mexicans hit the market they are screwed.

[@frankcoffey]

Everyone I know that understood hybrid cars but still hated them and thought they were a stupid idea are now having to evangelize them, that must sting. But the important thing for them is to fight the EV transition as long as possible to preserve the tailpipe cars and the fuel market.

[@michaeloreilly657]

Why?

[@frankcoffey]

@@michaeloreilly657 Guess they just hate change.

[@JD-yx7be]

@@michaeloreilly657 people were very against airbags in cars, now noone gives them a second thought

[@jamesvandamme7786]

@@michaeloreilly657 Preserving dealer service profits.

[@Cyrribrae]

Haha yep. It's funny to see them have to shill so hard for the hybrids they hated just to have a somewhat reasonable alternative to continually improving EVs

[@MikeCasey311]

Hybrid is the gateway drug to Electric Vehicles. Hybrid is also the worst of both worlds.

[@jamesvandamme7786]

I looked at hybrids years ago and it wouldn't pay off for me. Most of our driving is at medium speeds in the country, no stop and go. Then there's the extra cost, weight, service and complexity for little benefit. Next car will be an EV. If somebody makes an affordable one. Mary? Jim? Carlos? Elon? Anybody??

[@rok1475]

John is a product of automotive marketing from 50’s and 60’s that pushed new model on the market every few months and brainwashed the public into buying new model because it was the new model. Younger car buyers hear that the most important component of the EV (or a smartphone or a computer) is the software. Tesla has a proven record of updating the software for all their cars, not just the new models rolling off the assembly line now (just like smartphones and computers). The fact that new and old Tesla looks nearly identical (just like smartphones and computers) doesn’t matter that much for the new generation of car buyers because they know the software is up to date so the car that is a few years old is almost as good as the new ones ( just like smartphones and computers)

[@JD-yx7be]

Modern cars will have the same problem as phones and that is updates will make the car worse over time. I have a smartphone that can't use the browser or any apps anymore because it is no longer supported.

[@jamesvandamme7786]

@@JD-yx7be That's another concern that AAH needs to examine.

[@kevtheobald]

Love John, but the Camry has long been not the most fresh looking vehicle and people keep buying them. Toyota has tried to spice up the looks of the Camry with the tecent version, but vehicles are more like the appliances industry than fashion industry. Most buyers go for what works more than what looks the most modern or trendy. Boring but works well at a good price is usually a formula for success.

[@hansonrm]

The Tesla buyer is after improvements, not simply frills and new grills and new tail lights the old approach. I’ve just changing the looks of the car and putting the same old crap underneath it is a dead deck.

[@Ianmundo]

great job inviting the world’s most boring man on to tell us absolutely nothing 😂

[@jamesvandamme7786]

Had to sell his boring cars.

[@mrallelectriccarlunacy]

That guy is a royal waste of time. Didn’t answer a single direct question. I guess that’s how you afford an ugly Watch Ultra.

[@ricktotty2283]

I’m a loyal Honda owner. My dealership never has what I want on hand. Still waiting on Civic Hybrid. Would like to buy a fully electric Honda. Not a GM. The dealership where live is still asking $3,000 dollar addendums. For now I’ll stay away. I own Clarity 2018 and Civic Hybrid 2007.

[@user-to2rf1rj5v]

34:28 Just this week Tesla reported that 75% of buyers in Q2 were *new to Tesla*. So, you tell me Gary...have they?

[@jamesvandamme7786]

"Nobody wants them, clogging up lots, etc."

[@ItsBondoBaby]

How can these guys continue to say “serious competition” year after year after year and yet…there is no serious competition. Their solution is “new models!!” Dinosaurs.

[@dmere123ify]

The main reason for the EV growth slow down is the technology to reduce the cost of ownership below ICE for almost all users is not quite there. Interest rates will fall back and the new technology is coming to clearly pass the value tipping point within a couple of years, leading to a much faster transition. Reliable charging everywhere will help too.

[@JBsC6]

As unit volume increases of course the percentage of increase the following years will decrease. The media is creating a false public perception that electrics are not succeeding or wanted. Electric vehicles are superior to ice vehicles in many ways. Two car families who own a home can easily live with one ice vehicle and one ev and that would be a dramatic transition.

[@BobQuigley]

Used EVs selling like hotcakes where we live. Moron Musk inadvertently drove used EV prices down. The Chevy Bolt and Bolt euv is crazy cheap. $10-16k. They're great cars

[@hansonrm]

You guys should discuss the design problems that causes excessive repair costs on engines transmissions, etc. some of these problems are due to simply stupid engineering decisions such as burying water pump inside engines, etc.

[@jamesvandamme7786]

Ford Focus has entered the chat.

[@RonnieLeeDuck]

Personally I think Hyundai is starting to look a bit ridiculous with the all fashion variety in their vehicles. Particularly with the EVs. But maybe that is just me.

[@pspublic13]

The Hyundai cars look fantastic from the front and hideously ugly from the back. 🤷

[@lifeisfuneh]

Any chance Honda will make cars that can't stolen in 2 minutes? Insurance rates I out of control because of this.

[@InternetDude]

I first drove a Prius back in about 2005 loved the tech, later bought a new one in 2008. I can't believe it's taken so long for hybrid to be appealing to the masses.

[@llee4225]

The price of gas has gone up substantially so people are desperate to reduce. As well, manufacturers had pushed hybrids to higher price bracket so had less interest.

[@Carguytct]

With the exception of Toyota Prius, most Hybrids hasn't been that good. The only reason all the big car companies are making hybrids now is to avoid making EVs.

[@hoffinger]

It is outdated tech. BEVS are simpler and cheaper to buy, maintain and fuel.

[@JD-yx7be]

@@hoffinger You can get many hybrids for around $30k very little EVs under $40k with decent range

[@AuralioCabal]

Legacy auto BEVs as rare as hens teeth where iam in Calgary, Alberta, Canadas Oil country, and Teslas all over the place.

[@MikeCasey311]

New car sales are down because of high interest rates and it is difficult to get an auto loan. If you are considering the purchase of a Tesla, I advise you to buy it this year while there is still the $7,500 federal point of sale discount.

[@jamesvandamme7786]

And if Trump wins, do it quick.

[@highlanderapparel]

Union welfare labor that’s what’s wrong with Ford and I’m a union member

[@bhmbill]

Bring hybrid to Acura.

[@hankmoody7521]

What I don't get, why still in the US people argue there would a 'business as usual' path past 2030 for ICE sales. Climate scientist clearly say, global societies have a co2 budget in accordance to Paris goals of sub 1.7-2°c, which is going to reach zero maybe rather around 2035-40 than 2050. Further emissions will not be beneficial for any US citizen besides oil and gas folks - costs from climate change will hit hard in the south of the US. This is not belief - it's fact. Governments in Europe and China early saw the need for public investments in fast charging infrastructure. I think the US is 5-10 years behind on that topic (and might even fall back further depending on future political decisions) and is now relying on foreign investments in tech but also monetary (Ionna, Mercedes, EA) with Tesla limiting its CapEx on the Supercharger network.

[@JD-yx7be]

look at past predictions of the climate and they were all wrong. Once ocean front property drops in value i will start believing the doomsday predictions

[@AuralioCabal]

Just wait when everything coalesce in Elons. Grand plan , AI, Opotimus Robots , Unboxed process, FSD, Tesla Energy+Autobbider Software,Tesla SC Network Infrastructure, Starling availability/ connected cars.

[@LionheartLivin]

What are they gonna be talking about when autonomy actually arrives?

[@jeffgorchynski]

Lol the only thing Honda is doing is shipping a box of badges to the GM factory and saying "Please stick these on the equinox"

[@pspublic13]

Yeah, what happened to Honda in the last few years is a real travesty to the legacy of great engineering feats Honda used to pull off regularly.

[@jamesvandamme7786]

@@pspublic13 They're an ICE company.

[@mrallelectriccarlunacy]

30:47 can’t quite place what changed in the conversation but it’s better than whatever it was before that timestamp

[@ksairman]

Here is the critical question, what is the impact on Honda retail sales with the success of robotaxis?

[@joscubadiver]

Dear Honda electric "prelude" thank you

[@mbeliv3763]

old analyst just forgot the past . volks beetle was number one for so many years

[@RobertJemison-YouTubeUser]

How rude of the Honda man to leave after his chance to sell his boring products was over… disgraceful!

[@jamesvandamme7786]

That was the gig and the other guy got to talk about something different. Reliability and quality is boring but something USA oughta learn.

[@bobbammerlin6757]

I don't like infomercials, don't watch infomercials, and didn't watch this after a few minutes.

[@billroush2520]

Speaking of strategic errors, Tesla had the opportunity to own the profitable mass market pick-up market and they blew it. Launch delays, production costs and slowdowns have given Silverado and F150 time to create compelling EV pickups. Will they?

[@HairyCheese]

Wow, this podcast had autostarted and I thought it was playing something from 2018 😮

[@cassidybb10]

Love the history Gary

[@user-to2rf1rj5v]

39:46 That's a weird thing to say. Has this guy never heard of the Cybertruck?

[@urbanstrencan]

Another great episode guys😊❤ Hopping that Honda brings Ridgeline to Europe perfect for our market 😊😊

[@jdcarguy1242]

34:34 phones change little. Cars soon won't be different. The question will be, "you still drive your own car?"

[@frankcoffey]

Will BMW change their slogan to "The ultimate riding machine" ?

[@Gadfly2025]

These guys will have a nostalgia meeting remember theV8 V6 2.0 4 bangers and most of the American auto companies taken by China . Ooops those union high paying jobs dwindled away since 1990

[@davestvwatching2408]

Tesla Model 3 and Y equal VW Beetle and the Beetle never really changed.

[@davestvwatching2408]

The Santa Fe changed to quickly. I like the 2018-2022 model better

[@mbeliv3763]

Honda build great but its in big trouble

[@richardknapton7016]

OEMs didn’t take account of political influence on consumers regarding EVs.

[@ksairman]

You guys really need to spend some serious time on the impact of the overall new and used market due to robotaxis.

[@kevtheobald]

Honda has a well proven engineering team. They do everything from gardening tools to jet planes, but I do think they have too many partnerships. I would think they are learning things from each project, but I do believe you can spread resources or talent put too thin.

[@AuralioCabal-nl8gi]

Honda and Toyota still playing the FCV àka FOOLCELL game a joke that's not going to end well, Toyalready facing a Class Action suit for it Mirai not getting the promised availability of Hydrogen and Shell pulling all its Hydrogen filling stations out of California is an omen for By powered cars.

[@mrallelectriccarlunacy]

Why is everyone in the room acting like it’s 2004 and celebrating 90s hybrids is good and that cheering on the incredibly marginal improvements in hybrids nowadays is fine 20 years later? Every company that didn’t push hybrids big time 15 years ago should be ashamed of themselves. Every company that now finds themselves behind the curve and making excuses about EVs, shame on you. The world is burning. The western US and much of Canada is burning. I may not get to live to be the age of the experts in this show thanks to the constant excuses being passed around.

[@Gadfly2025]

Buyers getting hip. It’s a close to home 🏠 grocery getter that value drops like a stone

[@hoffinger]

The Rav 4 hybrid gets 5 mpg more than CRV city miles.

[@mattwill63]

crv is more simple design easier to repair. honda created the first modern hybrid incite before the prius.

[@AuralioCabal-nl8gi]

I think the market has got it all wrong, The Public wants EVS over Hybrids if the price was the same, DOLLAR FOR DOLLAR , for the same identical options.

[@InternetDude]

You are wrong. Hybrids require no driving changes for people used to buying gas, it gets better MPG with no road trip worries. BEVs have brutal resale and are basically disposable by the 10 year mark, take them to the junkyard.

[@AuralioCabal]

​@@InternetDudeLegacy Auto are crap, especially Toyota hybrids thàt needs that small HV battery replacement ,and that ICE will need rebuilding @ 200,000 miles like my friends Hybrid Camry,

[@johndonaldson5126]

​People forget that hybrids are ICE cars.​@@AuralioCabal

[@JD-yx7be]

@@InternetDude a major part of bad resale is people bought at the peak during a major global supply disruption and are not calculating the $7500 tax credit off the msrp. I don't think you will see the poor resale value of 2024+ EVs as you did with 2021-2023 EVs

[@theipc-twizzt2789]

the last few comments Gary makes about robots is so encapsulating of a boomer not understanding why you can't just throw in "look at what the others do/did!!" and believe you just made an convincing argument. On a very general point of view, by the same logic, humans would still live in caves. Humanoid bots were not done so far because they are prohibitively expensive to manufacture and lacking any kind perception and intelligence to be useful enough.

[@kevtheobald]

Why do they act like Tesla cannot develop or focus on multiple things? You do not hear them saying GM should not have developed the new Corvette because their trucks or large SUVs need help. Tesla is more than one person and they have many projects going. Sure, there is key talent Tesla uses, but it is not like they can only do one thing. I di agree the Hyundai Group has been doing a great job. Many models sharing the same platform but each comes across as unique.

[@danharold3087]

Tesla had plans to build 20 million BEVs. To sell them it lowered its COGS significantly. China simply said screw COGS we will price our cars below Tesla. "Xiaomi releases electric car $4K cheaper than Tesla's Model 3 as price wars heat up. Xiaomi CEO Lei Jun said the standard version of the SU7 will sell for 215,900 yuan ($30,408) in the country - a price he acknowledged would mean the company was selling each car at a loss" Tesla is building addition models on the existing lines which have 50% unused capacity. The Robo Taxi will use the unboxed methods.

[@Jasonfallen71]

Gary Gary Gary… Mr. Look Backwards…. How many robot companies say TODAY it is all possible because of electronics shrinkage and artificial intelligence. Where the heck has Gary been as all these humanoid robots are taking shape and being fully developed? Where was Gary when Elon said Tesla was designing Optimus to be made affordably and by the millions? Everything about Gary is looking backwards, even all of his opening remarks. I can say one thing is for sure: Gary will never see anything that’s on its way… he only knows what used to be. That’s very unhelpful in the modern environment where disruption is happening at blazing speeds.

[@mbeliv3763]

My question is...can a whale sales a Honda

[@mattwill63]

byd seagull in china supposed amazing 10k only has 114 miles of supposed range that is a joke.

[@nathanahubbard1975]

There is nothing about that vehicle that is a joke. Look into it more closely.

[@AuralioCabal]

The price and range is right for the Chinese market where there are Charging plugs everywhere , Do you realise China is well ahead of the Western world when it comes to EVs and infrastructure?

[@AuralioCabal]

The discussion towards the end just about dooms Legacy auto against the Chinese EV onslaught, not to mention our Governments who don't know what to do ,or make up their mind, just wish AD get Michael Dunne of Dunne Insights as a guest,he was a past GM executive and spent time in China.

[@JD-yx7be]

They have a 200 mile battery pack option for only a few grand extra, still cheaper than a nissan versa

[@evarlast]

most people don't drive 114mi commutes every day. If the car can charge overnight enough to drive it for daily commute the next day, then it is fine and a good fit. The $9800 selling price is good too.

[@ChicagoBob123]

Honda, overpriced chevys.

[@mbeliv3763]

lyric is shit and Hyundai is a cheap car. No alternative , only Tesla stand up across those cars

[@teslainvestor1743]

The Honda guy is a dinosaur. He will be out of a job in 3 years. Correction Tesla had record profits.