Hornsent & The Crucible | Elden Ring Lore

[@notsmough]

Thanks everyone for checking out this video. The Larger original can be found here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/gYurlaiMlJdqe7s

[@nolat9279]

These kinds of videos are just what I need. I just want someone to start yapping about elden ring lore while I work lol

[@notsmough]

Appreciate that! Glad you enjoy it!

[@Eizengoldt]

You will love Crunchy and Jack is a Mimic then, hours and hours of lore talk

[@longlostluggage4604]

While I second your notion, mark my words; the proliferation of the word "yapping" as a derogatory term for deep analytical digressions is a harbinger of the psychosocial decay of the zeitgeist. With all due respect, for both your sake and everyone's, please keep that evil out your mouth.

[@Eizengoldt]

@@longlostluggage4604 you are spot on, the gen zers have no respect for the way they speak

[@stashboysinc]

Bro I do it all the time glad I’m not alone 😂

[@cabbagedemon5944]

I cannot get over how similar the symbol of the spiral incantations looks to the godslayer greatsword. The lack of any content related to the black flame and the gloam eyed queen makes it hard to come up with anything substantial to connect the two. Nevermind how the blackflame seal also looks like the fingerprints. I feel like this dlc explores a lot of stories never explicitly told.

[@theeldenenthusiast]

The Spiraltree seal is even more striking in its resemblance to the GEQ's sword as well

[@theredknight9314]

Eh. Maybe it was just coincidence or over sight or cut content. Seems like black flame has 0 to do with anything important in elden rings past

[@AndrewBenningfield-ji3iw]

Not to mention the Sacred Relic Sword's spiral shape.

[@midnight6284]

​@AndrewBenningfield-ji3iw and the same spiral shape is seen on the finger slayer blade. Perhaps this shape truly is divine

[@cardgameenjoyer7446]

Blackflame seal. Is metyr

[@randywilliams6248]

Mimic Tear Smough. Never knew I needed it until now. Damn you Golden Order!

[@notsmough]

Hahah - thank you so much!

[@randywilliams6248]

@@notsmough no, thank you for the content!

[@boris-dragosani]

Is it possible that the Crucible is multiple trees? Like Pando, the 47,000 aspen trees that all share a interconnected root system. It could have one central "great tree," the original tree that all others grew from, and it would explain why the Death Root has spread so far so quickly. It's all just one root network for the same trees, with a central tree that was burned down and grafted onto.

[@saiuan4562]

I believe that is very likely. I can't fail to notice that the trees found in Altus plateau look very much like the tree shoots from the pando

[@notsmough]

Hmm good shout, and that would explain why its influence still persists in certain places

[@llab3903]

@@notsmoughI mean at the end of the day the trees that you and I see are just snorkels for the roots

[@themaniae4803]

Possible, but a correction. In original Japanese, is not roots of the Great Tree, but Great Roots of the Tree or Great Tree-Roots, and all the roots we see are connected to the Erdtree as the Catacombs are used to bring back people to it. At the same time, possibly all roots are connected as we see one little Erdtree corrupted by Deathroots.

[@thatshiftyboi8593]

Youre very close. It is implied that the scadu tree and erdtree were planted directly next to eachother, and then sent into seperate dimensions by the sealing tower. This is also supported by the fact that godwyn is connected to both trees, although he was stated explicitly to be buried at the base of the erdtree. That could only be possible with a connected root system

[@itzamedio5427]

Don't forget that the hornsents symbol for the crucible can be found within the ancient elden ring at Farum Azula. It is the helical middle portion and bottom middle part of the ancient ring.

[@elijahherstal776]

On Marika 'slaying the Hornsent god'... Remember when Hewg was talking about how Marika wanted him to make a weapon to slay a god?

[@themaniae4803]

Finally people are understanding Crucible-Elden Ring are connected and not "Elden Ring parasited something." About this, two little ints i want to share with you, Darling. First, if you look at the Dragon Elden Ring, possibly it's first version, in teh middle you can see a Spiral with the same design of the Hornsent spiral. Another point is, the system of the Hornsent probably treated not-horned creatures like slaves. In japanese, the clan who became the Bloodfiends it was said to be a clan of slaves, and they don't have horns. Also, in the talisman is not the corpse of their ancestor, but the corpse of An ancestor. And the last part: In original japanese, the One Great is not the name of something with a own name, and the fact Chaos in Greek Mithos (Something Elden Ring takes a lot very directly, like Alecto and Charo) means Void, specifically the Void before Creation.

[@bigdrip4789]

I immediately subbed smough . I wish you great success my brother, and great video as always !

[@notsmough]

Appreciate you being here! Means the world!

[@DeywanLigma]

Bro it’s time to redo the Godwyn video, he is a constant and can break barriers, messemer couldn’t get out of the shadow realm but Godwyn exists everywhere. It’s gotta be at least 3 hours by now with all the lore and places he exists within the DLC.

[@notsmough]

You could be right

[@thatshiftyboi8593]

Godwyn obviously didnt do shit himself. He was buried into the roots of the erdtree, which are connected to the shadow tree directly, as they grew off the same original stump. This is implied with the +1 crimson and cerulean seed talismans you receive from the finger ruins, which are apparently the same spots that marika got the seeds for the erdtree and shadow tree

[@ReaverofSouls7]

Godwyn will be the antagonist of ER2

[@thatshiftyboi8593]

@@ReaverofSouls7 i think youre wrong. Godwyn isn't the night lord, he's the prince of death. The Night Lord is an entirely new character. Godwyn's role is to show how corrupted the elden ring world is from the highest boughs to the lowest roots, and nothing more. Really, the godwyn fanbase is almost as bad as power scalers or shipping communities when it comes to committing logical fallacy.

[@hythan9198]

Awesome video! One thing though about the Hornsent possibly having a god before Marika. At first I thought the same, but on looking at the trailer scene again, the gate itself is still red, as if it had just been made. By this I don't think it's possible for the Hornsent to have used the gate prior, unless their god ruled for a very short time, which I suppose is possible. I do think there was a god before though, but I think the Hornsent were trying to make their own, like the Nox are trying to make a Lord. Gold is imbued in lightning, wielded by dragons. Placidusax can become a thunderstorm. The storm and lightning is the ultimate form of divine unrest to the hornsent. I think the dragons god fled before this, and the Hornsent were trying to make their own, by building a tower into the sky, as if to symbolically reach into Farum Azula. The Horn Bairn looks scarily similar to a stone heart, like the ones used in ancient original dragon communion. I'm still working through some of it, but the connections seem eerie to me

[@notsmough]

Yeh it's a good point, whereas the gate seems 'burnt out' by the time we reach it.

[@JGabrielRonkainen]

I have this incoherent theory about the crucible and the origin of the hornsent people that I can't conpletely place in the context of the rest of the lore, but... I think the Crucible is something rather quite literal. The videos by Tarnished Archaeologist on the flood myth and the stone coffin ships, and the videos by Jack is a Mimic on the people who inhabit Noxtella and Nocron got me thinking; what if the Hornsent are an artificial race as well? Just one created by accident. Why do the Hornsent think that they can create a saint by cutting up people and stuffing them in jars with animal parts? Because that's how the Hornsent were born. The coffin ships were made as arks by a precursor civilization to survive a cataclysm. These ships were filled with people and animals, and as the cataclysm hit, some of those arks were buried underground by the molten rock, and the people inside them became trapped. Those people died along with their animals, and their remains melted together to create the Hornsent. How do the hornsent know that the shamans have flesh that melds harmoniously with that of others? Because somehow they know it happened before. Marika's people, the Numen, are direct descendents of the people on the arks which didnt become trapped, but who founded the Nox civilizations. So the Crucible was the literal coffin ship on which the Hornsent people's ancestors died and where "all life was once melded together". There is even that strange group of animals just chilling in the Coffin Fissure, which I at first thought were there because of Miquella being a disney princess, but now think that were placed there as a hint that the coffin ships were the original jars. The Omen on the other hand are just Hornsent DNA popping up in the Erdtree people because Marika messed up by removing the rune of death which caused everyone to reincarnate through erdtree births, and everyone's DNA getting mixed together in the process. Another thought I had, was that maybe Marika intentionally removed the rune of death in hopes that maybe his people, the Shaman, could also be reborn through the Erdtree, if the jar saint jars were smashed after the rune of death was removed. She did try to find a way to cure the jar saints basednon what we see in the Shadow keep basement afterall. Anyway, these are just some random thoughts I've been rolling around in my head for a while, and this felt as good an opportunity to release them into the wild as any lol. Love your videos. I hope you all the best!

[@Niall001]

Coffin ships as coffin ships is a good call.

[@katze9834]

@@Niall001lmao 😭

[@tarnished-ml3fr3jq8w]

Re: your 3rd paragraph on the hornsent themselves being a race of melded flesh - the statues at Enir Elim come to mind, with the figures wrapped in horns, almost as if telling their origin story.

[@EpicSpence]

After learning about the mindset of grrm and Miyazaki, and also their fascination with symbolism, mythology, philosophical standpoints, the mind and the soul, and of course Miyazaki's obsession with the metaphysical, I would go the opposite way to literal. In fact I'd go way past literal, zoom past fantasy and smash straight into the 4th wall. I think that's where the primary thread of this story will be resolved, in a decade or so.

[@joedominguez8064]

“Cleanse away the strumpets vile progeny” is such a smackdown 😂

[@humanname5684]

Damn bro, you are sending these out faster than I can watch them

[@ben.o1156]

The Bolt of Gransax is also spiral.

[@ValyeriasCorner]

I love how quickly you're getting videos out 🥰💜💜

[@callumhughes5486]

Amazing video. Loving the second channel

[@Hexmoneyman]

Based on the Godslayer's Greatsword design, it looks like a spiral that instead of reaching the gods burns them, and the spiral tree design reminds me of the sword as well.

[@CheckersMcGavern]

I've been thinking about the sun a lot. Here's a few key observations I've made: -"From higher sphere delivered" sounds an awful lot like the sun, doesn't it? -There are only a few mentions of an eclipse in the game, total. -Elden Rings sun is VERY small when compared to the moon(s).... -Considering the size difference, solar eclipse would be *significantly* less visible, if not completely blacked out all together. My theory: The sun is the Crucible, and Marika stole the suns energy in order to get more powerful. While doing so, she significantly shrunk the size of it (which is why they never see an eclipse happen again).

[@Kaaldozin]

I think the Sigil of the hornsent’s incantations and the symbols used on Siluria’s helmet and spear are more similar than initially assumed. The symbol of the crucible is a spiral helix. What is a spiral helix? Two paths, that eternally both fly away from each other and towards each other, so in addition to the dna symbology, it also represents (if imagined 3d) an orbit. An eternal fall, of divergence and convergence. I believe that Siluria’s helmet and spear are the same way, as you see the horns (or branches) initially springing away from each other, only to immediately curve back towards the center, as if drawn to reconverge. I also think all of the symbology used by all the major factions are intrinsically tied to each other, as smaller pictures of the greater whole. Serpents, spirals, rings (ouroboros?), fire, stars, moons, orbits, aren’t they all intrinsically related? But this could just be me reaching lol, I’m just obsessed with the hornsent and the lore in general. In fact, I’m doing a hornsent/crucible only run right now, and I’m also roleplaying a hornsent in baldur’s gate 3 (surprisingly easy and fun!)

[@ben.o1156]

Also spiral shaped is the God slayer greatsword. And Placidusax's remaining heads and necks form a spiral shape. The spiral motif is so prevalent throughout the game from the very beginning and I think it is significant that such symbology is missing from the erdtree faith.

[@DyHi_]

It’s possible that the tree that is often shown in depictions of the crucible could be a representation of the branching out of life through evolution, like a family tree of sorts. It would make sense given the crucible’s association with evolution and the progression of life in general.

[@boris-dragosani]

This not Smough guy sounds really familiar, but I just can't put my finger on it... WAIT, I GOT IT, ARE YOU VaatiVidya's IN DISGUISE???

[@neilmclaughlin2347]

Just a good ‘ole Scotsman

[@FullMetalElric]

Always thought the Farum Azula depection of the Elden Ring was that of Root System overlayed over the concentric rings+Marika's seal (or the aspect of the elden ring which she subsumed/repalced/took on). Figured that the root system+the tiny top of a hexagon overlayed onto Marika's seal was the Crucible and it being the Stump of the Greattree.

[@Governothing]

The godslayer blade is a spiral too Not only is spirals godly But they can slay the very gods

[@xXDarkflowerXx]

Honestly I just listen to this to fall asleep

[@theredknight9314]

Huh. My biggest question based on all this information is, what exactly is the erdtree and why have it be venerated instead of the crucible during merikas reign. Like sure the hornsent were bad to merika but if it is the crucible that allowed her to become a god at the gate of divinity. Why did she replace it with the erd tree? Was the Greater Will trying to stop using the crucible and use the erdtree as a different means of divinity?

[@christophercranor8079]

6:48 There is a crucible knight in farum azula as well could this one be like devonia, trying to be closer to the crucible or being somewhere that relates to a more crucible era

[@Daytona_Tay]

I honestly think Marika is the saint the Hornsent we’re trying to create in the jars, that could explain why she is multiple people. She could’ve been reborn from the jar seeing there is no evidence saying she never was put in a jar. Maybe she is the last of her people because she was the success they needed to make their new god. So the Shaman Village was never repopulated because they all got moved to Bonne Village. Once she gained the love and trust of the tower folk by being said saint, she was chosen for godhood being that she was made in the likeness of the crucible(a reborn being made of a melding pot of life quite literally). Once she got to the divine gate she likely contacted the Greater Will instead of the Crucible, and made the Elden Ring. Hence the “subduction and betrayal” , so maybe by her faking like she’d be the crucible loving god they mixed with Erdtree society before she ordered the crusade. Just a thought yk😅

[@weeville]

Omg incredible channel find, its smough² Unrelated, but i rlly wish we would get more elephant designs in souls, i adore the mastodon knights of ds2 and for a game full of so many tusks and giant beasts its baffling how theres not one elephant design in all of ER If theres a animal that SCREAMS crucible, its the elephant. Whats that one blind men adage again? Tail, tusk, tendril, fan, insane animal design to not take advantage of. I mean a boss has a tusk motif, gigantism, and flat feet(thanks to undeath) and hes named the lion??? Cmon

[@ashtonfeatherstoneandersen4783]

Hey all, I have an interesting theory: Kings field the 1st souls game tells us an interesting take on the Great Tree, the tree chooses a champion to battle the seed of darkness which inflicts all the land even the demigods with evil, this evil is caused by all the disparity of mankind, it would seem we awoke to early as a race. The champion possesses the ancient blood of the golden dragonknights who were sent from the heavens to subdue the evil. The thing that strikes me as a huge parrellel with Elden Ring though is the similarities between the said golden dragonknights and the Champions of Elden Ring. Godfrey was Marikas champion and before was Horah Loux meaning he was made into a Champion possibly after he died a warrior. Radahn is another example of this. The same way the Crucible Knights were made. Its logical they were created as champions through the crucible. Similar to how Miquella is made demigod to a god like Marika herself. Perhaps the crucible is the gates of divinity. You die under certain requirements, sacrifice pieces of yourself, also using quite a bit of blood, soul recycled by the tree and are reborn suped by divinity and primal vital energies coming out the gate. Really gives the Crucible knights a more impactful presence to them looking at it this way. Think about it. In kingsfield its implied creation ended up being a mistake to the creator god and had to have divine intervention to kind of reset things using the tree as it's catalyst, which we find out in ER DLC isn't too much different. The hornset possibly angered the one great, woke evil, and it sent its star to correct things. The cycle repeats because its an imperfect world with a creator god with no control while it's vassal gods(the outer gods) wrestle for supremacy. Apparently in Kingsfield gods can't kill God's so they need a champion. Thats where we come in as the player possesses all the neccessary traits, magical blood, godslaying swords to then rise up and set things anew, ablaze, or let the cycle repeat. What makes the Tarnished special as well as the KF protagonist is that these champions, lords, and crucible knights all possess the crucible blood. In their dna, Which my friends is the blood of dragons, or at least the Crucible possesses the aspects of a dragon, which probably goes into the whole divine Dragon creator god thing..Not to mention the Elden Beast was a little on the nose with its design trying it's hardest not to resemble a dragon. It is a lot like Arthurian legend with the champion possessing the blood of dragons and their other half who possesses the blood of the fair folk. Much like King Arthur "Pendragon"(Dragon blood) and Morgan "le faye", Guinivere the fair. (fairie blood or more like a vessel for a divine spirit) We even learn of Marika's origin coming from a people who commune with sprites further cementing the similarities.It's also likely king Arthur was a warrior king like Horah Loux last I checked. Fun facts :the demigods in KingsField were divine dragons, Seath the White Dragon, and Guyra the Dark Dragon. Guyra being the "shadow" of the Divine Tree. The big bad of the series antagonis turns out to be an abyssal entity known as the seed of evil, also shares quite a few similarities with the Prince of Death entity spreading deathroot which is no surprise learning about the seed in KF. I think Elden Ring is a dramatic intepretation of the prehistory shared in the Kingsfield games. Just rehashed, reworked, and retold. We got a taste of this in the souls series. I tried long and hard to connect these games mythos and lore and this is my best take so far. Not connected in an official timeline but connected spiritually through retelling of the stories they are trying very hard to tell. .

[@tylercafe1260]

What's interesting is the use of dual meaning in elden ring and it's choice of subjects. For instance the "Primeval Current" could also be viewed as the "Greater Will". Since all life came from it that either means the Greater Will itself came from the Primeval Current or are actually one in the same. I feel like the crucible is nearer than we think. So quick history tidbit all religions are built on each other. In Egyptian Lore the Christian God slit the Egyptian Gods throats. Things like this fall into occult obscurity but it's very important to understand what Elden Ring is showing. The Greek Gods are just the Roman Gods. I feel like whenever we see them talk about anything even when they say it's separate they're all joined together. Even the Erdtree and Moon are deeply connected and explicitly told so multiple times. Things like this just go over our heads on a first playthrough. Like what do Ants have to do with Numen? Let alone ancient civilizations? The fact there's even an elevator connecting the surface to the underground... So much is just not explained.

[@vindurza]

I still think the gate of divinity is the crucible because it literally looks like a forging crucible

[@805Peej]

But the tower that the gate is built upon is a spiral. Seems that it would have gone: crucible > spirals > inner Elim > gate of divinity

[@zachariahjonahmaldonado5897]

Once again, note that Primordial Crucible is not capitalized in the item description. This is because it is not a proper noun. They are adjectives. This is because the crucible is not it's own seperate and distinct thing. Marika did not become a 'God, in Truth' through the Greater Will, or through the fingers. She did it by her own will through the Gate of Divinity. She used them more than they ever used her. This shouldn't be confusing, the claric in the Roundtable Hold says straight up that the Golden Order is rooted in the belief that Marika is the one, true God. Note the lack of mention of the Greater Will. In a thematic reading, the Hornsent are pagans worshiping stupid trees and rocks and horns, Marika is the force of organized religion and theology, with proper gods. The Minor Erdtree miracle spells out, to me, that the Erdtree, or at least the spectral erdtree that dominates the Lands Between, is a Marika thing, an ability possessed by the Shamans. Not a Greater Will or a Lands Between thing. It subsumed the 'crucible' (whatever that even is) and clarified its laws, and is an extension of it. It's not its own thing. The Spira miracle is first and foremost a Final Fantasy X reference, read no further into it. In a narrative reading it's just an allegory to the Tower of Babel and highlights Miquella and I guess also Marika's blasphemous intents. The Hornsent were trying to obtain Godhood, again, Tower of Babel allegory. Hence the experiments on the Shamans. But they could not, because they suck. The Lamentor is what happened when they tried to do this. The Lamentor is what happens when a Hornsent obtains divinity. The culmination of crucible worship is... whatever that thing in the Gaol is.

[@rafsandomierz5313]

What if the divine beast is crucible? You know like horned beast covered in flowers and trees with wings, tail not necessarily a tree if we take into the account that Crucible was everything melted with each other. And if not it is at least an part of it.

[@lloydfrazier3682]

Until i see a picture of miquellas hornsents horns WITHOUT his mask. Then ill believe he has horns... until then tho, ill always see him as just a human that wears horns

[@sarahthesarah2850]

Mohg also grows wings from the Blood/Formless Mother.

[@jonkorpi]

Pretty sure the Hornsent created Merika to be the God, they would have provided the Elden Lord in able to maintain control on power.

[@ETERNALXGAMEPLAY]

I think the crucible is simply where the golden Star Landed creating all the beasts and bringing life to the dragons

[@Raven501th]

think it possible that Serosh is a holy beast of the hornsent since there are no iconography anywere in the lands between except with the hornsent with fx the lion dancer

[@Governothing]

The sculpted keepers that grandam speaks of… Are they the people woven into the foundation of enir elim? Are they the keepers

[@Governothing]

The bodies making up the foundation are way larger then hornet large enough to be divine beat dancers

[@Cybernaut21J]

Hornsent is like Ancient Buddhism across Asia.

[@owentinker5969]

I feel like there is a lot of symbolism in fromsoft games of mortals trying to change the order of the world. To break and bend the rules of nature to their whims. I think the horn sent were doing that, albeit unintentionally. Think about it, if the Crucible was said to be where ALL life was blended together, why would horns rise to the forefront in the Land of Shadow? I think it’s the doing of the hornsent. Through their worship, their repeated invoking of the power of the horns, they dragged that aspect of the crucible to the forefront. Empowering it above other aspects. Hence why the beasts in the land of shadow grow horns randomly. I imagine if the divine bird warriors had risen to prominence we could have seen a Land of Shadow dominated by all manner of winged beings rather than horned ones.

[@Saphedon]

Is Empyrian Grandam a hornsent finger reader? What is up with the race of the immortal grannies?

[@SnazzyFox18]

why the alt account?

[@sicilianmammalian]

Money

[@nemesisundead83]

Wait what is this 3 video's 3 days lets gooo

[@Greaseball01]

I've just had a thought - Godfrey and his lot are associated with the crucible but they're definitely not hornsent, all evidence points to them being from the highlands originally - which it's unclear if that's in the land of shadows, stormhill, or a third location. They alligned themselves and aspects of the crucible with marika and interestingly (as you point out) had unique depictions of it from the hornsent. So, with this in mind - were they maybe an oppressed population because of the hornsent's inferiority complex? It seems to me they had somekind of caste system in the areas they controlled and evidence seems to suggest they were contemporary with the astrologers and giants etc. so did the Godfrey and his crucible knights maybe allign with Marika in rebellion against the hornsent? Like that's why they got in with her in the first place? I do also want to say - if there was a separate hornsent god that Marika overthrew isn't it a bit incredibly strange that we hear absolutely nothing about them anywhere in the DLC?

[@Saphedon]

Godfrey and the Crucible Knights are Kaiden, it makes sense

[@aggger1]

🎉🎉

[@blackironseamus]

"Empyrean" grandam was a mistranslation that they corrected.... It's just hornsent grandam

[@kwaki-serpi-niku]

Oh AYE, laddie.

[@lunausagi8495]

Why do you still refer to her as Empyrean Grandam even though it was corrected?

[@mannytprimeministerofthemanate]

Day 3 of asking the channel name to be changed to oresntville

[@notsmough]

Hahah I might give in eventually

[@mannytprimeministerofthemanate]

@@notsmough keep these daily uploads up and I’ll keep reminding you

[@sixxplays612]

Wait… who? What? Where am I? This isn’t Smoughtown!

[@unsealednardo9965]

Why different channels?

[@ome5688]

Lion? Godfrey?

[@strawhatrore2072]

Hello my new favourite channel

[@t-mango2491]

I’m not gonna lie, I have such a hard time watching your videos after what you did to nth apple without ever issuing an apology, I would love to watch your stuff again but I can’t help but remember that whole drama, it’s pretty screwed up to attack a channel much smaller than yours and do reputational damage and never correct it at all, you actively chased someone away from the community with that video and shouldn’t continue to have this big a name in it when you do things like that

[@BoRice82]

Marika that BM that got everything she wanted and still wasn't happy, so she crashed everything out. Smh

[@lugiya6768]

that makes 0 sense

[@BoRice82]

And Miquella was raised by a single mom. So of course he crashed out tryna be soft. And threw off the lands between even more. Manipulating ppl. Lls. Durrrrr

[@capjax8370]

nah.

[@_Fr0stb1t3_]

i love u @notsmough

[@BoRice82]

Don't block me. 🤣🤌🏽