How bad is Windows spying?

[@jooch_exe]

AMD, Intel: "IPC has increased!" Microsoft: "Good, let's waste that IPC with telemetry and tell users they need to upgrade their hardware so they don't notice."

[@macicoinc9363]

It’s really quite beautiful isn’t it? The decades and trillions of dollars in hardware research just being thrown away to give you utter garbage.

[@deathhog]

​@@macicoinc9363Not thrown away at all. It gets daddy Microsoft more money. They love it.

[@TheBigLou13]

All in the name of Privacy, Security and Safety!

[@davitdavid7165]

I am sure Intel and amd don't mind

[@hcolider2817]

​@@deathhog achieving valued goals and desired outcomes is more valuable than any amount of profit ever could be

[@CuteSkyler]

With computers getting more powerful, the OS's on them seem to be running slower. Such a weird coincidence.

[@Doomsdayparade]

Linux is significantly better in that regard. Even on the more heavyweight distros.

[@kevinrineer5356]

I'm going to echo @Doomsdayparade that I've noticed Microsoft Windows has quite a few design decisions that make it run poorly. The stuffing ads, recommendations, ai, and a whole bunch of other features while the Microsoft kernel already isn't good at handing starting and stopping processes quickly is my guess as to why. I think the Microsoft kernel is an unwieldy Frankenstein of engineering make up decisions that the technical debt of the kernel is probably insurmountable. I don't work at Microsoft, so I I'm only positing my guess based off being IT support.

[@p0xygen]

​@@kevinrineer5356It's to be expected when Microsoft keeps building upon a system that never had a good foundation in the first place, while trying to keep everything from 25+ years ago compatible with today's systems.

[@TharanakSpada]

Windows 11, still compatible with Windows 3 applications[Windows 3, still compatible with QDOS applications!]. This is what we like to call the "tower of bubble gum and popsicle sticks"

[@Nikolai508]

By OS you mean Windows, Linux these days is so easy I don’t know why more people haven’t moved to it.

[@littlecake453]

.... So remember how pirating adobe products is morally correct (currently even encouraged)? We should add Windows to that list.

[@luipaardprint]

I mean you’ll get it for free if you want to, the problem is they should be paying you to be able to collect all that data.

[@IIlIlIlIlIlIlIII]

gl getting ratted

[@Chaosweaver667]

​@@IIlIlIlIlIlIlIIIThere are ways to activate windows without actually downloading a cracked version of Windows.

[@antipsychotic451]

All piracy is morally correct. There are no good or benevolent corporations that deserve your money.

[@alihanserikuly7186]

@@antipsychotic451 yeah, fuck those poor indie game developers

[@chamber_hiro256]

What a waste of bandwidth

[@matthewrease2376]

I mean the packets probably aren't huge. I'd be more concerned about the principle of data collection than the bandwidth it uses.

[@5Hydroxytryptophan]

​@@matthewrease2376 I think the comment was about the video.. it is Rather lacking content and advertises a paid tool.

[@lmaoboxuser]

paid??​@@5Hydroxytryptophan

[@xXRealXx]

@@5Hydroxytryptophan O&O Shutup is free

[@5Hydroxytryptophan]

@@xXRealXx Okay, good to know. I'm not using Windows anymore. But still, the video has really little information.. the telemetry is not immediate, so he should have invested more time into research.

[@doughnut_panda]

We get robbed twice. We pay a bucket load of money for a OS and then we get our data stolen.

[@debrainwasher]

This is the Economy 4.0 according to its inventor Klaus Schwab (also founder of the WEF): Everything is turned into a service. A purchase does not longer constitute property, but is in fact a license to use a particular good for a limited amount of time and in accordance with the marketing concepts of the supplier. Therefore, you own nothing. Not even your data, your time and your attention. But you will be happy. Welcome in the really existing neofeudalism!

[@Tantaku]

who tf pays for windows?

[@doughnut_panda]

@@Tantaku my company.

[@steel5897]

I don't pay a cent and I block 95% of the telemetry (the 5% is required for some core stuff to function). I'd have dropped Windows for Linux if didn't use my PC primarily for gaming.

[@doughnut_panda]

@@steel5897 if I get a inspection you know what happens.

[@raul0ca]

I expect the camera on my Windows laptop to follow what I look at and lower my social credit score appropriately

[@Lord-Sméagol]

That's sure to be the case in China!

[@DuncDog]

If the cameras on the majority of Windows notebooks weren't dogshit, that may actually be a threat lol.

[@SirRichard94]

​@@Lord-Sméagolthat is already a thing in america. Many jobs require you to be tracked like that.

[@Cybercerialdestroyer]

@@Lord-Sméagol dude stop deflecting all of this on China this is about America

[@frizzyfrank2985]

@@Cybercerialdestroyerum last time I checked China legitimately has a social credit score program and the US does not

[@DarthSack]

Every breath you take And every move you make Every bond you break Every step you take it'll be watching you

[@themirrazz]

every file you make, every registry item you break

[@SuperStarMan62]

every search you make, every feature you break

[@morgan_bowe]

Oh cant you see, you belong to me-icrosoft.

[@Kinetic31]

How my poor servers ache With every packet I take

[@gusfring8451]

-rep furry

[@Acetyl53]

The future turned out not only malicious, but kind of braindead too. The sheer waste, the sloppiness in obfuscation, the passivity of the general population.

[@mekelopte7071]

Unwashed masses accepting malovent rulers to guide them through age. Classic

[@macicoinc9363]

@@mekelopte7071 You smite the people, and not the oppressor? It sounds like you are no different than then those responsible for this mess.

[@magoleo-pr7if]

Dumb people being dumb and evil corporations being evil are not mutually exclusive things

[@mekelopte7071]

@@macicoinc9363 How can single man rule over so many people sounds like all of them are NPCs and deserve it. Nom im sayin

[@CloudObsolete]

Brazil, the movie

[@Corteum]

9:36 _"I'm not personally worried about all this information"_ It's not just about the information, it's also about the fact theyre using your computers resources/cpu/memory/bandwidth, and also what theyre doing with the information they collect.

[@parzival8108]

we really should be billing Microsoft for all of the data and all of the CPU cycles they've stolen from us

[@LegoMaster5197]

What do you think they are doing with the information collected?

[@Corteum]

@@LegoMaster5197 Something dubious

[@LegoMaster5197]

@@Corteum may as well visit no websites then, they’re all collecting your data and using it for advertising

[@smailydude]

​@@LegoMaster5197storing it in a jar! Make a great snack for my gpu :)

[@JV-pu8kx]

The fact that it sends something to their servers while I am _not_ doing anything that would require access to a server somewhere not on my premises is enough for me!

[@gabriel55ita]

Literally requests for windows update or apps install and update related. It's not new ms collect a lot of data but you can disable it and it won't anymore. Telemetry is good when it is clearly stated what it does and what data it collects, with the possibility to disable it. For example for an application crash report it's very useful to the developers because most of the time a user won't send it manually

[@IntensiverPinguin]

App updates.

[@linuxramblingproductions8554]

@@gabriel55itathats not really true Microsoft has been caught collecting telemetry with settings disabled

[@gabriel55ita]

@@linuxramblingproductions8554 for legal purposes it's not something sensitive obviously, you know that would cause them a huge problem. It's probably something more bland like crash log/defender asking the server if it knows a suspicious file for example

[@delofon]

​@@gabriel55itaNo, it should be the possibility to enable it instead. Opt-in is far better than opt-out for the consumer in this regard, and it's what I also like about KDE.

[@elmariachi5133]

It doesn't matter what information Windows is publishing. What matters is, that it does without us wanting to and without us having another choice than not even using a PC anymore - unless we are using Linux.

[@woodsmn8047]

also the slowdown of your system while it's collecting this data ...that's the part I most dislike !

[@felixjohnson3874]

"Ignoring the alternatives, there are no alternatives!"

[@nolram]

Or BSD :)

[@whoman0385]

​@@nolram"damn linux is becoming too popular, time to switch to bsd"

[@nolram]

@@whoman0385 nah I just like BSD :)

[@kmg501]

There should be zero collection, your tolerance is the problem.

[@Max15691]

Problem is that most software do this stuff already, even the beloved Firefox, so I can get why he has some tolerance 😢

[@TVPInterpolation]

depends on the perspective. im against how microsoft is handling the data, not that they collect data. users usually dont do proper bug reports, so telemetry for this case as an example would be beneficial.

[@Carlos-kh5qu]

​​@@TVPInterpolation funny enough, a gamedev on reddit said that despite being only 13% of the playerbase, Linux users were responsible for 60% of bug reports on his game and would go till the end to help out

[@ilonachan]

​@@Max15691 but that's not really an excuse, is it. First of all, non-optional telemetry is ILLEGAL. Just plain up not allowed under EU law, and they do that shit anyway. Second, even open source software that has telemetry will by necessity be more transparent about it, and more open to allowing the user to disable it, which already improves the situation.

[@LilZesty]

@@Carlos-kh5qu this is nothing more than a reference to a racist joke. that 'gamedev' aint telling the truth

[@magatamass]

As a personal user you at least have a choice. Imagine large companies in sensitive areas like medicine, which are basically forced to use windows to maintain compatibility.

[@marschallblucher6197]

Most of the computers used in those situations use either: Pro/enterprise windows where you can disable nearly all telemetry Linux, BSD, or some other open source Unix-like system. A _really_ old version of windows (I've seen some stores use windows 98 for their POS)

[@EbonySaints]

Unless you're working for a small "family" business where using anything other than Windows Home is going to either bankrupt you or confuse everyone but the boss and you, and the boss was a god tier Windows admin... in 1999. Also, you deal with the Chinese on a regular basis, so WeChat gets thrown in for good measure. I was seconds away from not taking the job, but I've long given up my right to privacy thanks to stupid actions, so I stopped caring for a long time. I even stopped running Linux at home for a long while. I wish I had the money for a burner phone though.

[@swagmuffin9000]

@@marschallblucher6197seriously!!!! I've even seen hospitals with 98

[@itskdog]

Most of the changes that ShutUp10 did were just registry tweaks that businesses with set with Group Policy.

[@magatamass]

Yes, it is true you STILL can disable telemetry, but (1) you wouldn't have to if it wasn't there in the first place - it costs additional time and money , (2) at some point you might not be able to disable these settings due to terms and conditions, yet you will be forced to use this particular system and have no other choice in order to maintain backwards compatibility.

[@CoolJRT2009]

If you don't trust a command prompt window that you CAN see open when you run a cracked game, you shouldn't trust any of the silent shuffling of data that's going on in the background of Windows that you CAN'T see.

[@te-wei]

The real problem was that all these data are binded with your Microsoft account, which is being forced on, no local account allowed. Every pieces of data can be used to profile an user all together. They know your name, location, when to use what software and device with what behavior. The OS SHOULD NOT transmit anything encrypted to any server when running a local app without a need of internet, if it's encoded with some string that you don't know the actual meaning, you don't actually know what they transmitted. And, all these should be DEFUALT OFF, and ask if users are willing to share the record of their behavior to "help improving the development". The enrollment should not be default on. Even you thought some should be turned off, and yet, they're default on.

[@WeinerTouchy]

There are still ways to enable local accounts only - which I agree are hoops that shouldn't be forced to jump through - but at the same time it's a beast of two heads. I'd say that 90% of users got an upgrade to Windows 11 for free - free software isn't free. You're going to pay with data. Apple has collected the same data for decades across their entire ecosystem and no one throws a fit about it the same way they do with Microsoft. At the end of the day, if you really don't want to send data, pony up the extra $50 and upgrade your Windows version and run a local account from the start.

[@te-wei]

@@WeinerTouchy 1. If the local user needs a workaround, then 90% of the user will be milked, workaround exist doesn't meant it's not a problem. And, even if you activate local user, it only solve half of the problem. 2. If you pay for a new license, you won't get a different windows, they're the same. I just set a media machine for elder relatives last year, I bought an official license for them, and it's the same. You paid and you still get milked. 3. At the end of the day, I really don't want to send data at this level, so I migrated to Debian, FYI. Microsoft can do whatever they want, and you can accept it if you like to, it's not my problem anymore.

[@WeinerTouchy]

@@te-wei No one said anything about buying a new license. Buy the Pro edition. Solves all your issues. Local user and fully able to disable telemetry. Otherwise, enjoy your free upgrade and send data. Really no further discussion to be had.

[@computernerd8157]

​​@@WeinerTouchyApple does collect data but its no where near windows bull shit levels. Last I check key loggers were not included on Macs but Windows have them since 10. Make a video proving it just as bad then I will shut up, but I used Apples before and I never had shit like this shoved down my throat like I have endured when I switched to Windows xp, Windows 8 and breifly 10 on a hp stream lol. I stopped using Windows because they flat out said Windows is a services. 8 was already forcing Windows account down my throat which is funny. Every new version, Microsoft gotta force some new thing. I used Mac classic all the way to 10 and no, I never had shit like this forced on me. Linux was totally freedom until Ubuntu Amazon deal. I swicthed to a Ubuntu Mate because I liked the interface better at the time. However the Mac os 11 Might require an account for certain featured similar to Windows but if they did, its to make the walled garden work better(Not sure if they actiually do) not just to force something with absolute no benfit to the user unlike Windows. I quit using those systems as my primary a long time ago. All I can say is if you have no interest in the mac eco system then their no point to it but Micrsoft does not even offer an ecosystem at all so it only befits Microsoft to be fair. The only thing I like about Apple is their computers but planned Obsolences is the one thing I hate about Macs.

[@gabriel55ita]

The majority of applications and systems have telemetry default enabled and ask at initial startup if you want it or not, macOS same thing (it asks for a lot of shit that is enabled by default so you need to disable it on the setup page, just like windows)

[@itzarty]

This is insane. The sheer volume of information transmitted is insane. Just using and navigating the system shouldn't make a single call in my opinion.

[@lanatrzczka]

As a user and admin of Windows machines for a small company, I was really surprised when Windows 10 seemingly "backtracked" to users finding apps on the system by typing in the name. It seemed to be the opposite of the intentions of a GUI. I see the reason now. It's tracking and sending, silently in the background. Can I just get a security-patched Windows 2000 again please? Back when everything wasn't a damn keylogger.

[@Monody512]

I mean… It is also genuinely faster and easier to press a couple of keys than to scroll through a list or grid with a couple hundred entries. It basically turns the keyboard into a shortcut board for instantly navigating a ~46-item-per-layer tree. Them turning it into a web search is where I object. The spyware behavior would've happened even with a standard list or grid, but the web search function gave them the perfect excuse.

[@GeorgeTsiros]

Have you noticed how the new GUI style in windows 10/11 has _no_ keyboard shortcuts? It forces you to use the mouse for everything except typing text.

[@SpaceCadet4Jesus]

​@@GeorgeTsirosyour information is incorrect. I have three pages of keyboard shortcuts printed and stapled for Windows 10 and 11. At first I thought it would be helpful, but found out I tired of looking through three pages to try to find out a stupid shortcut for a simple thing that I can merely Mouse click.

[@GeorgeTsiros]

@@SpaceCadet4Jesus it seems you did not understand what i am referring to. The shortcuts I am talking about, you do not need to remember: one character in each control that can be activated is underlined. You press alt+that character and it's as if you clicked it with the mouse.

[@kmg501]

I permanently switched to Linux over four years ago. My only regret is that I didn't do it much earlier.

[@Holahelloholahello]

What distro?

[@kmg501]

@@Holahelloholahello Linux Mint.

[@TwstedTV]

I did the same thing as soon as Windows 10 came out. I used Manjaro for a long time. Now I am on both original Debian KDE on one computer and the other on EndeavourOS KDE. I had to change that purple blob though. To a normal background and look. 😋👍

[@te-wei]

@@TwstedTV Debian KDE, too. It's simply better. 👍

[@c101vp]

Same here, did it a year ago, wanted to like three years ago

[@chri-k]

The thing with the XML messages not showing up correctly is because Windows still uses UTF-16 for some godforsaken reason.

[@pawer_organos]

"CoMpAtIbIlITy!!!!11!1!"

[@KSPAtlas]

And they passed that fucking idiotic behaviour onto UEFI which makes it a pain to deal with

[@chri-k]

@@KSPAtlas i did not know that.

[@paddotk]

Don't try to understand Microsoft's ways. They are devoid of logic.

[@SpaceCadet4Jesus]

Solve your headaches with this. 1. Settings > Time & Language > Language. 2. Click "Administrative language settings". 3. Click "Change system locale". 4. Check "Use Unicode UTF-8 for worldwide language support". 5. Restart your computer. There you go!

[@LessThanPeachy]

I think the biggest issues are that it's opt-out only and that a good chunk of this data collection cannot be toggled off by a normal user. You either have to dig through registry entries and hope you don't break the whole OS or rely on a 3rd party tool, which, of course, is all by design.

[@SpaceCadet4Jesus]

Nothing wrong with relying on a third party tool. If it wasn't for third party tools I couldn't get my job done.

[@rtl8814au]

If you really gotta use windows, disable as much telemetry as possible, and use a dns sinkhole like pihole on the local network with a telemetry block list to block incoming and outgoing telemetry requests.

[@CentreMetre]

Is it possible to run the DNS sink hole on the windows machine? I imagine its easier (and is cheaper) than setting up a separate network attached device

[@rtl8814au]

As far as i know most if not all software runs on linux, but you can just get a cheap raspberry pi for this​, even a pi zero w works, if you dont mind it having no lan port, but using wifi doesnt affect performance at all anyway. Im personally using an old celeron j1800 board i got for 10$ with a 10$ ssd. Dedicated device approach also lets you have a 24/7 on blocker that works network wide.@@CentreMetre

[@friendlyfirecriticalops3771]

How to disable?

[@Caved111]

Win11 literly forced me to exchange the perfect standard email app i had for outlook and now there is adds in my mail program disquised as regular mails. I mean are they for real? I seriously need to concider using linux.

[@TVPInterpolation]

definitely worth to do so

[@simonmaracine4721]

100% recommend. I have been using Linux for the past six years.

[@dazperson8228]

A temporary solution is Thunderbird, have been using it for a while now and it works well.

[@Blankult]

Linux makes me want to carve my brain out

[@karsh001]

If you are serious about switching. Get an easy-to-use distro on a thumb drive and try running it for a bit. My favourite is Mint, and my kid is using Nobara as his daily driver.

[@VirtualAxiom]

While I do need Windows for certain things, the fact that it's collecting anything at all without my permission is enough to keep it confined to a virtual machine with GPU passthrough to do what I need it to do, then go dark until I need it again.

[@maalikserebryakov]

There are debloated versions of windows OS. People analysed and stripped away the stuff that doesn’t need to be there

[@VirtualAxiom]

@@maalikserebryakov I'm aware, but I'd rather just use Linux and only pull up Windows as-needed. I don't trust it.

[@cltuxunink]

its not without your permission lmao you literally signed up for it

[@IshayuG]

By 4:10 I'm like... dude, you're just opening paint. What in the absolute heck. This is crazy.

[@ferabon]

But I mean, who the hell cares whether or not Microsoft knows if you've opened Paint? Why should I care about this?

[@IshayuG]

@@ferabon because them caring about something so hilariously trivial begs the question of what they have enough control to do when the stakes are higher. For example on iOS it was discovered that they constantly read your clipboard with linkedin and sucked it up into the cloud, after which we have no idea what happened to it. This is potentially outright dangerous. For example it may contain a password from my password manager, and then there’s political espionage. This sort of trivial info can be used as secondary information, too. For example, a declaration of war can be predicated through a large amount of pizza deliveries to state offices in DC. In this case it’s probably a signgature check, but I don’t like it. Apps I open on my device for local use should not be hopping onto the internet.

[@everypizza]

@@ferabon they don't need to know when i open up paint let me paint in peace please

[@romulo2714]

​@@ferabon Why should they know I'm opening paint? Also people who got nothing to hide did get screwed over data collection before, don't think you're safe just because you're a saint.

[@Tiishen]

​​​@@ferabon because why would they want/need to know your every click? I mean, forget the fact this telemetry data is being used for profit in some way (like selling to advertisers, etc.) and the fact data can be mishandled or stolen. Even if they weren't doing anything besides collecting it - it's the principle Think of it this way: You rent an apartment and there's cameras and microphones set up by the owner, which record everything 24/7/365 and send it to his personal PC. They're in every single room, even the bathroom and your bedroom. Would you really be okay with him having your whole life recorded on tape, even if you're not doing anything illegal or questionable?

[@gregcampwriter]

No kind or amount of collection is acceptable. Every time I see something about Windows, I'm glad I switched to Linux.

[@Slugbunny]

It's been a load off my mind, too. No system is perfect, but I can easily choose my battles and who to trust on Linux. Microsoft left me no choice.

[@TVPInterpolation]

i would totally agree if user would be easier to deal with when it comes to bug reports. for such cases, i think its totally fair to collect data.

[@gregcampwriter]

@@TVPInterpolation That should be solely the user's choice. No corporation has any business making that decision for me.

[@TVPInterpolation]

@@gregcampwriter i see what you mean, but this is only properly possible in a perfect world where everybody reports bugs in proper fashion. do we want buggy software? no. do we want bugs fixed fast? yes. then its just a necessity in many situations. im not happy in how microsoft handles the collection of data, but can atleast see a few reasons aside from ad businesses in general.

[@norger]

@@TVPInterpolation don't be a shill, there are better and more straightforward ways to report bugs

[@thedanyesful]

That 404 for the tip retrieval is pretty hilarious. Reminds me of how after a few years, Windows Vista's link in the desktop context menu for 'Windows Gadgets' would lead you to a 404 page.

[@ringo8410]

I don't want my OS spying on me, even if it's - allegedly - to send bug reports. I also want choice in the matter of what my OS is doing rather than having that choice taken away from me. These are big reasons why I use Linux.

[@macicoinc9363]

If it was for bug reports, then Windows wouldn't be a steaming pile of fucking shit that never works properly.

[@FloppaTheBased]

what exactly linux? Most linux distros collect data just like windows does lmao

[@unicornpoo7441]

@@FloppaTheBased me when i spread misinformation on the internet

[@FtE1]

only Ubuntu does that

[@linuxramblingproductions8554]

@@FloppaTheBasedbro hallucinating harder then chatGPT

[@JessicaFEREM]

You should activate differing of updates for the average user, because it differs security updates for a few days and feature updates for 1-2 years. this will make a windows system dramatically more stable over time as it's forcing your PC to not be a beta tester, plus it'll be less annoying since the end user will have to change their workflow less and won't have to reboot as often. I personally want as much performance as possible and having useless telmetry hits all the time is wasting bandwidth and cpu cycles for something I don't want.

[@JessicaFEREM]

the chris titus toolbox does do a lot of debloating that oosu10 doesn't, it does use oosu for part of it's telemetry disabling, but it also sets a ton of services manual so there will be less CPU cyles to run and a smaller attack vector because there's less things running in the BG.

[@dennysgrimaldi9623]

@@JessicaFEREM if you don't want telemetry, and an easy tool to manage this is WinTools, is simple with a good interface and it rember your choice even after an update from MS, so you don't have to disable telemetry all the time. Plus everything is well written so is not hard to use or understand, and it can performe other task other then this.

[@KolaFiend]

at that point it's worth it to just switch to LTSC windows 10 and receive only security updates + years of extended support. no app updates either cause there is no app store included. run the christitus debloat script for good measure

[@PITZ24701]

Or have a registry hack that can defer Windows Updates to decades.

[@everypizza]

I call it "Winbloat"

[@dsobransingh]

based pfp

[@Foga001]

Let me guess, what do you use.... Mac os, right? XD I use Win 7 btw...

[@KingPotato2]

​@@Foga001thats an og os. The good ol days of win7.

[@Hejkal_123]

@@dsobransingh ummmmm i use arch btw 🤑🤓

[@Krrly]

amazing pfp

[@golemwire]

Given that the Windows search bar is *supposed* to search the Internet, it makes sense that it would be sending information about your query to the Internet.

[@Rainbro359]

There are legitimate concerns about privacy and surveillance, but its sad how much of the discussion on this is just fear mongering. Like, yes, Windows is sending your internet searches to Bing. Thats...how internet searches work? I think the paint stuff stemmed from it being unclear that the search bar also searches the internet, but if you want a search bar that does everything with no additional user input, thats what you get. Reminds me of a popular Reddit post about how much Discord spies on you. Yeah, discord 100% does. But this post was just like "discord logs your username and the messages you send!" and, how exactly do you expect the chat platform to work if it doesn't know who sends what? And people just uncritically eat it up.

[@evanhuizenga8626]

​​@@Rainbro359I don't think it's very sad. Everyone could do with using less technology these days, even if their reasons for doing so are not actually valid. Besides, I think you're missing the point. Why do you think Microsoft put Bing in the start menu? It's to force people to use Bing if they want to search their own local system. This not only allows them to increase the influence of Bing artificially, but also allows them to collect information on users making local searches. It's an intentional design decision, not just a coincidence. And while using Linux this will not happen to you, unless you want it to. Same idea with Discord. Sure, they need to log things if they want users to be able to search them later. But why are these things being stored on Discord servers? Why not locally? Why are there other messaging apps, like Signal, which do not store your information, if it's so necessary to log info? None of this is being done for the benefit of the user, it is all entirely for the benefit of the company. And while it might feel like there is no real downside for the user, that is not the case. This info can be leaked in data breaches, and used against you by bad actors for social engineering, as just one example.

[@realityescapemusic]

​@@Rainbro359 amazingly well said.

[@CentreMetre]

This sort of shit is why I'm "paranoid" when it come to typing anything in anywhere, you truly dont know if that data is being recorded even if you dont press the enter key.

[@hylianbran7273]

I hate Microsoft. I want to use a different OS but there's no real alternative. I need windows to do a lot of things. I'm not smart enough to use Linux and I don't trust Apple either. As far as I'm concerned, this shit should be illegal.

[@aras_aras_aras_aras]

If you are worried about telemetry, why are you using Chrome that was collecting data even in the Incognito mode?

[@irishwolf2390]

I just cant believe with all the information coming out as well as being crippled with use and account creation there has not been any kind of class action lawsuit yet or at least the starting of one.

[@DictateTempo]

That was an interesting watch, thanks! I found your channel from your single GPU passthrough video which was very useful. Do you still plan to do a video on kernel level anticheats? I think that'd be a good watch!

[@EricParker]

Yes I do! Would love to know if there's anything specific that you would find interesting. Doing this level of analysis is tricky becuase I don't think vanguard uses HTTP to communicate.

[@Leonard_MT]

​@@EricParkerWhat about EFI based cheats? Those sound extremely interesting .

[@WhoooshyYT]

Cheat-related stuff would be cool

[@DictateTempo]

​@@EricParkerYeah, it'd be hard to determine what kernel ACs are actually doing, you pretty much have to trust the privacy policies on that. I think an overview of the main ACs (such as whether they run at boot time etc), the associated risks (Genshin is a good case study) and any mitigation steps (dual booting if you daily Linux?) would make a good video. Either way, keep up the good content, it's really engaging.

[@FadyFTJ]

Giving up your privacy never benefits you in any way.

[@klenha]

that is unfortunate. i'd love few guides on setting up something as this. i can't express how valuable your youtube channel is to me.

[@RomanianProductions]

What you forgot to consider is requests and data sent through other protocols such as TCP, UDP, SMB, etc. and not just HTTP or HTTPS

[@Wahinies]

It is unanimously HTTPS because it sails right past firewalls unless the performance killing HTTPS inspection is in use AND this traffic is explicitly blocked. You wont see that scenario in a home setting for example.

[@paprikar]

Why the fuck this comment had 0 likes?

[@dishcleaner2]

The EU needs to sue Micro$oft so there is an option. I wish I could just say "use Linux", but that isn't realistic for everyone yet. Only reason I stay on is games

[@animeworld2005]

Actually agreed with you

[@arfazero1]

next minute, hacker hacks Microsoft by typing into notepad on his computer...

[@MMadous]

Did the Microsoft robots take over your body at the very end there? What in the world happened with how you said "collect" at 13:11 ? Haha

[@louiel8711]

Interesting video always good to see what goes on behind the scenes, makes it easier to figure out what to disable.

[@flynn3649]

New subscriber. Would you be willing to do a similar test with Ubuntu, (modern versions of Fedora Workstation), and PopOS? I think tons of people expect MS to be bad, but we're slowly experiencing this in mainstream Linux desktop distributions as well. It's not talked about nearly as much tho.

[@CentreMetre]

Exactly. Considering the whole mission of linux, I'm surprised Ubuntu is so widely used considering its data collection and its past with data collection.

[@LunaticEdit]

That smug feeling you get when you fullscreen the video and there are no black bars.

[@austinbaccus]

Ultra wide gang

[@hupe5836]

They will also collect the event of me downloading linux and ditching windows🗿

[@realityescapemusic]

Fyi, the thing about network requests being sent every time you type something in the search bar can be pretty easily explained. the windows search bar doesnt just search your computer, it searches the internet, you can effectively use it as a bing search bar if you want to. and if you pay attention you'll notice that it constantly displays new suggestions as you're typing. when it's sending requests as you're typing, it's checking if what you're looking for is something on the internet instead of something on your computer. that's why the data sent back resembles the data you'd get typing something in a web browser, the search bar in windows 11 is basically doing the exact same thing. it's not doing anything behind your back, the data it's getting back is given to you in the start menu search results.

[@SuperMewio]

Future reference, you can use ctrl+esc in windows to open the start menu that way you don't accidentally open KDE Plasma's application launcher lol.

[@AndiRizkia-hv9wc]

No wonder my laptop run so laggy since every background of telemetry and Spyware are running so predatory on the background, yet they also say that Win 11 is the best OS for gaming (yet the telemetry)

[@aldo6532]

Taskbar Search includes web searches, so I don’t really understand why that sending calls would be a surprise.

[@Rainbro359]

Me when using the internet requires internet >:(

[@peterscasny2803]

Because it does so even when you disable searching the web.

[@Rainbro359]

@@peterscasny2803 do you have a source for that claim?

[@DanielClear2]

​@@peterscasny2803 The whole "Search" app is a webpage since it's decoupled from Cortana. There is no disabling web search. You just hide web results via a registry hack.

[@codinghuman9954]

"how bad is windows spying" asked by a guy who literally has google chrome open is so funny to me. Like I don't mean to sound like one of THOSE Linux users but please, use Firefox or Librewolf if you care about your privacy.

[@gorillamasterofgaming5525]

Firefox isnt good for privacy either.

[@gorillamasterofgaming5525]

unless you mod it.

[@Crackie]

What a useless video till 6:26 at least. And the comments show that clearly everyone comes here with their bias and they don't even watch the video. This guy literally searches something in cortana, and cortana makes an API call each time he presses a letter IN ORDER to make live search suggestions and he shows it as if Microsoft wants to steal his data. Then he rumbles and talks like he's having a stroke and gets surprised at any API call. Let's be a little clear. Of course we don't want them to get our data... But for fssake your search being saved for them knowing what is popular or your choosing of the taskbar placement being sent to microsoft isn't really spying. It's developers wanting to know what matters to the end user. It is statistics kept. It is not personalized or at least it doesn't need to be. Chill out

[@xcoder1122]

Just imagine you'd be charged per MB data transferred or had a very tight data limit per month. This is why big tech advocates for flatrates; it's not because they want something good for you, it's because they want to be able to waste as much of your bandwidth as they like to.

[@muhevend9181]

why is it that I have to go through 1001 buttons to protect my privacy, but to lose my privacy, I only haw to click "I agree" 🤣🤣

[@J0nes111]

Just in case you read this: Peer-to-peer distribution of updates makes a lot of sense if you got multiple computers / laptops at home. Most people and even lots of small businesses can't or can't afford to setup an update server. So every Windows machine will download the updates on its own. However with peer-to-peer distribution enabled, only one machine needs to download it and can then share the updates to Windows, Office, drivers etc. to all others. That can save a ton of bandwith even with only a couple of devices. Also, this can speed up the time you need to take when you install a new lapop or computer.

[@1marcelfilms]

I miss being able to select what updates I want and only get those.

[@user-a0d9w0ec9wiej]

I think Linux does that

[@omniton4106]

O&O software offers a utility called Shut 10-11. It’s a tools that configures the many setting to stop as much as possible Windows from data mining you.

[@Rubyboat]

idk man, call me complacent, but what i saw in this video was no surprise to me, and most of the calls make an alright amount of sense. I'm not switching OS as long as it doesn't get exponentially worse than this.

[@willtn]

in this video: man uses web based searching, surprised when it uses the internet

[@Rainbro359]

Oh thank god there's more than one person who points this out. Had to scroll for a while. Yeah, there are legitimate concerns about privacy but this ain't it. Now, the Windows 11 nonsense of taking a screenshot every few seconds to feed a LLM with? Yeah, thats just an obvious security exploit waiting to happen. Thats my red line, I'm on Windows until I'm forced to use that. But this is just...using the internet.

[@FlamespeedyAMV]

the best part is, it's only gonna get worse

[@k.chriscaldwell4141]

The NSA collects it. Windows just sends it.

[@ghost-user559]

@@tiaanbasson9092yeah and its also what Linux users don’t get. Why do you think those exact agents contribute and control the Kernel of Linux and the Linux foundation lol?

[@notyourfox]

@@ghost-user559 show me that extent of telemetry in open source Linux kernel

[@macicoinc9363]

@@ghost-user559 You are correct, but it is definitely to a far lesser extent. You'd have to be suffering from intellectual pride to believe that the Linux Kernel is not compromised in some way, whether Torvalds is aware of it or not.

[@domdomdomme1203]

@@tiaanbasson9092does that also apply if you are outside of the US and are not a citizen?

[@ghost-user559]

@@notyourfox “Disclosure of the nine-year-old vulnerability came the same week that Google researcher Kees Cook published research showing that the average lifetime of a Linux bug is five years.” “ *A ten years old Linux backdoor linked to National Security Agency of United States was detected freshly, and analysis confirmed that the backdoor was existing from the past 10 years. Dubbed as Bvp47 and linked to Equation Group-an NSA funded threat actor was first detected by anti-virus firm Virus Total in 2013. However, for reasons, not much was discussed or revealed about the advanced backdoor linked to Linux at that time.* “

[@mastermati773]

To be frank, it isn’t as bad as possible, based on the requests going during this video.

[@yeetisnomore]

Hi Eric, what a great effort! We would really like to see the same thing for macOS too!

[@itskdog]

Small correction on the Windows Update P2P, the default only does on your LAN, you have to manually change a setting if you want P2P Updates working globally. Very useful in a corporate environment (no more need for WSUS causing headaches for IT if you want to cache updates locally) or anywhere with a slow internet connection.

[@clocked2002]

O&O shutup 10: fighting proprietary software with more proprietary software lol.

[@CoCoDaCo241]

Are you able to share how you configured this demonstration? Im primarily curious about how you were able to MITM every connection, the proxy software you're using, and how you generated the custom SSL cert. @EricParker You don't have to go into too much information regarding your vm's. I see that you're using QEMU and I've installed win 10/11 numerous times. Just curious about all the proxy stuff and being able to decrypt the contents using the custom SSL cert. Thank you.

[@bepisdevs]

I’m confused. None of those API calls were really that suspicious? No doubt Microsoft collects everything they can but I didn’t see anything in the video specifically

[@catsandmountains]

It's the unnecessary data that's being sent almost constantly. It can be used for user fingerprinting and who else knows what. Telemetry data was a lead into a malicious Microsoft teams hack. Ideally you want to just have that activity only when necessary.

[@theultimatetrashman887]

Next video should be ''how bad is your ultra wide resolution on youtube''

[@ghoulbby]

I'm not sure what I'm watching. Background noise from a fresh install and you typing in a web search, because that's what the Windows search bar is nowadays? And device info going to Windows isn't weird considering they're dishing out drivers so... that's expected. None of this is 'spying'.

[@konstantintomilin1826]

Best ad for Linux I've seen so far.

[@KianFloppa]

Does he mention how much of the telemetry can be diusabled and how much the minimum still collects?

[@josephbryanasuncion4904]

Hmmm,did you see the actual pass 50% of the video? Because that is exactly what he do.

[@trignite]

What you covered is good, but you should explain - does this still happen if web search is disabled for the start menu? How much of this still happens if the telemetry service is disabled? And other similar questions.

[@fog1257]

If it wasn't for CAD-software I would leave Windows for Linux today.

[@Consural]

Switching to Linux permanently. I won't do any personal computing on a Windows machine ever again. Enough is enough.

[@konstantinsotov6251]

and then they say, "just use WSL!". Why, so that they could collect even my linux data? sorry, no

[@squirlmy]

WSL Kali in particular seems to me the biggest honeypot for scriptkiddies, ever. I don't trust "Offensive Security" at all anymore. How many users even know the parent company is called "Offensive Security"

[@e.corellius4495]

windows has had a steady reliable decline since XP, with every successive version being stacked with more and more bloat, and taking away more and more user control, absolutely maddening. windows (and the even worse apple os) are the best ads linux could ask for

[@planet_person622]

very informative video

[@razorhighflyer]

Wait, considering what happened with CrowdStrike, does that mean Microsoft now has the world's largest data monopoly?

[@vladislavkaras491]

Great to see practically how Windows collects data and how O&O can be useful! Thanks for the video!

[@eth0eduardo]

I’m a long time linux user… I just feel that I can’t go back to windows again. Having to use a third party app to disable an aggressive data collection is just a bad joke. The OS should be private by default, no telemetry at all.

[@GG22n]

No.

[@__kms1212]

All that you touch And all that you see All that you taste All you feel And all that you love And all that you hate All you distrust All you save And all that you give And all that you deal And all that you buy Beg, borrow or steal And all you create And all you destroy And all that you do And all that you say And all that you eat And everyone you meet (everyone you meet) And all that you slight And everyone you fight And all that is now And all that is gone And all that's to come And everything under your PC is tracked And your data is stolen by MS

[@3AgL3DeeJay]

amazing! can you make a short tutorial about setting up the traffic listener for the VM? cheers!

[@ittadakimaho]

Sorry yeah .. the vid has the right idea .. but is sadly very .. waste of my time :(

[@JacksonNick-j6i]

Google Chrome open on the right side looking at Windows API calls: Look what they need to mimic a fraction of my spying power!

[@pid1790]

imagine accidentally type a password

[@jackie.dee.01]

All of this is encrypted, this person is using an SSL certificate to de-encrypt the sent queries. It’s the same as typing a password into any web browser. An OS still shouldn’t send anything without your permission.

[@pid1790]

@@jackie.dee.01 what will go wrong when someone doing mitm attack like this just like this person do with a vm?

[@AnttiPW]

@@pid1790 Unless you install someone else's root certificate (like he did in this video to capture the traffic) you don't have to worry.

[@jackie.dee.01]

@@pid1790 Given they don't have the correct certificate, they would only be able to see a stream of nonsense. However, fun fact, e.g. the NSA still collects this information to have it's encryption cracked later using quantum computers.

[@jcruz6888]

don't mean to sound rude but why did you not get to the sauce here? Where's the bad bad? so they are sending a bunch of data & the possibility of something more malign may be there COOL I'm not going to spend 13 minutes looking for that why are you not getting to the point faster?

[@GG22n]

There's no bad. You face 0 consequences. It's just a Microsoft hate agenda.

[@Wilhuf1]

I use Arch, btw

[@LukeLane1984]

Same, btw

[@Bunuffin]

Fedora BTW

[@josho225]

*generic mint user comment*

[@Gadoguz001]

And???

[@Wilhuf1]

@@josho225 Mint was my gateway through the Arch.

[@RudyM_EvelynAI]

Does the term "PC" even still fit? I guess we can omit the "P" in "PC" now... It's not private anymore at all...

[@Gaius__]

lol The _P_ in PC is for _Personal,_ not private

[@RudyM_EvelynAI]

@@Gaius__ Exactly. I quoted it wrong on purpose.

[@bhumiputra6108]

How did you create this setup? Is their any resource I can refer to?

[@cshairydude]

5:49 The packet sniffer is showing UTF-16LE one byte at a time, so almost every other byte is 0. The text editor correctly detects the encoding and displays it as plain text.

[@MurasakiShizu]

now teach us how to completely block all Windows tracker

[@Rainbro359]

Disconnect from the internet. Thats not windows specific, thats just how the internet works

[@roborob347]

This is one of the reasons why I am a radical Linux extremist

[@mz6301]

..microsoft is gone and done, good thing a lot of saints provide tools to debloat, block telemetry, remove sh*t like "the microsoft shop, maps" etc....and btw I think those data are sold to third parties, cause if they were used to tweak the os to the customer's needs, we would have stuff like "the porn organizer", a fking popup blocker that works, and something that would solve the videogame compatibility issue. ...and still to these days, got issues like "the ldkfdjflkjlldfk.dll is missing"

[@uooooooooh]

"Microsoft is gone and done, good thing there's tools to keep me dependent on Microsoft" I use Arch btw

[@guytech7310]

Would be curious if you type data into a application: ie word, notepad to see if that gets sent too.

[@atsizbalik]

at this point, to truly escape data collection you need to stop using electronics completely also is this with or without the permissions you change in OOBE?

[@jollygoodfellow3957]

Technically not correct because what about flashlights and dvd players?

[@computernerd8157]

Use Linux and disconnect from the web so your wrong.

[@zeenxdownz]

my flashlight sends data to gianthard​@@jollygoodfellow3957

[@domiibunn]

Better question though. What is the proxy you're using as it looks useful Edit: mitproxy

[@paprikar]

You need to use something like Wireshark in this case

[@roccociccone597]

And this is why I refuse to use Winblows

[@Chibibowa]

Use NTLite with a good profile. And all what mainstream media says falls out the window. Nothing he mentions happens on my images. And I currently use 24H2 LTSC. See windows XP+7? Well I have the exact same user experience. Even UAC is neutered and standard users can never elevate no matter what they do.

[@netoeli]

The fact that this much telemetry is being gather without being sign-in to a microsoft account and only using a local account is staggering. I wonder what difference using the windows 11 version destined for the european union that removes the build in apps such as edge and windows media player and teams and onedrive, basically all the stuff being shoved down our throats. What difference in telemetry gathering their is?

[@ThePlayerOfGames]

So glad I switched to Pop!_OS 😅, thank you for the video!

[@delicious_seabass]

This is web search and telemetry, and you can turn it off. Everyone should turn it off.

[@Omizuke]

Can you test this on a customized Win. To see if there is any one thats safe. I currently use a Win10 curomized using various tool. I tried with 11 once but disabled so many things I broke some of its functions hahaha. Went back to my own made Slim10. Or maybe there are better tools to modify 11 since I tried.

[@TheDecodedMatter]

Why is that no matter how new your hardware is, your pc always lags, always makes noise on windows?

[@4684peter]

haven't had a lag on my computer on the last 5-7 years with different hardware and all sub midrange