How Broken The College Admissions Process Is (HBO)

The Justice Department charged 33 parents on Tuesday in a massive cheating and bribing scheme to get their kids into elite colleges. Federal investigators charged 50 people in all, indicting test administrators, athletic coaches and a number of wealthy parents from across the country, including actresses Lori Loughin from Full House and Felicity Huffman from Desperate Housewives. So far, they have not made a comment about the charges.
According to investigators the scam, dubbed Operation Varsity Blues by the FBI, revealed a wide-ranging web of bribery and fraud, including cheating on admissions exams, faking involvement in sports by photoshopping students onto the bodies of athletes and even falsifying learning disabilities.
The pressure to get into elite institutions is high, and the main gatekeepers to these competitive universities are admissions officers.
Sara Harberson, a former Associate Dean of Admissions for UPENN and former Dean of Admissions at Franklin and Marshall College told us, "What would always helps students if they were tagged and their family had a lot of financial resources. You were really looking at seven figure donations 8 figure donations. But sometimes six figures plus a connection with someone on the board was even more powerful.”
VICE News spoke to five of them to find out what it’s really like behind a process that remains closed to most people.
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[@VICENews]

Former college admissions officers tell us just how broken the process is. WATCH NEXT: Expelled From Every Other School - bit.ly/2NY2ADP

[@ms.rstake_1211]

Ok, but will they also explain how Trump got into Wharton? Could you? Try... Thank you.

[@sirloxleymendoza972]

story not about Trump.. Story is about rich lefty Hollywood committing crimes @@ms.rstake_1211

[@helmutichberg1842]

VICE News couldn't have reported this 5 years ago huh? Man y'all would've been so ahead of the curve fox would've shut down. But nope. waited till it was convenient. Typical millenials.

[@helmutichberg1842]

Oma Rumunna Could it be that because he was able to turn a million into billions where many others had failed he may have been smart enough to get in? I mean.... he has been the smartest president we have had since Kennedy. The best thing Bill Clinton did was build part of the boarder wall. Never saw vice touch that. THE CLINTONS BUILT THE WALL BEFORE TRUMP DID! Lol. No wonder y'all are called fake news. That's not the right word. It's Satans news. Like Lucifer you only ever give half of the truth. Like when he told Eve "surely you won't die" and true enough physically she didn't. She died spiritually. Don't worry vice. Journalists are always the first to be killed when a free nation loses its democracy. Have fun with that knowledge.

[@cydoman8014]

Not much interest in the victims here, is there? But, gosh oh golly, friends, there are buckets of blame pouring out. To what good purpose? The story I want more of is how the investigation started, how it grew and what it means in considering paths to balance and improvement. Must that wait while the blame teams finish their competition in the Divide and Conquer war?

[@TalkAsSoftAsChalk]

"Just because you deserve an acceptance, doesn't mean you're going to get it" Then, what does? THE AMOUNT OF PERSONAL BIASES THESE PEOPLE HAVE IS RIDICULOUS!!

[@eni3246]

ikr. that woman said if u r black i like u more. like wtf

[@kristenwright5281]

At the end of the day they're just people. Everybody has biases.

[@nata6025]

@@felixoesinghaus but white people already are this ethnocentric, it's a given even if they didn't mention it. Probably because they don't think they have it but they probably will root for applicants whose names they can pronounce without difficulty, and usually those names are pretty white

[@nata6025]

@@felixoesinghaus I'd like to see how those studies were conducted because self-reported results are not reliable and participants can alter their behaviour in such studies to achieve results that reflect more favourably on themselves. However way you slice it, minorities are "ethnocentric" as you say because they know they have to look after each other to succeed. Unless you're a minority yourself (and I don't mean a white minority), I doubt you've experienced racial abuse and discrimination like Latinos, Asians and Black people have on an institutional level - from schools to colleges, to employers to the justice system. It's undeniable that white people favour other white people - studies are nothing compared to the cold hard facts of reality.

[@nata6025]

@@tomw485 I definitely agree with that, and I do think that HBO purposely selected a diverse group of administrators that misleads viewers to think minorities have a chance, so idk what the white outrage is all about, they still have the advantage lol, chill

[@aidank7090]

“Get good grades so you can go to a good college” “Just because you get good grades doesn’t mean you’re going to go into a good college”

[@alek488]

These admissions people are so biased. Like all of them were saying they don’t want to admit white people

[@mehmeh1999]

Bruh, so my entire life is a lie.

[@user-yw9qq3yb9m]

@@alek488 are you being dense on purpose?

[@jasonlee6227]

@@alek488 Strange. Aren't these white people usually the ones who can afford to go to these elite schools?

[@daniellee3507]

Getting good grades is the base. Extracurriculars, essays, community service is what gets you in

[@hosono3918]

I can't choose my race, I can't choose my sex, I can't choose where I grew up, I can't choose my family's social rank, I can't choose whether my parents accepted to let me learn an instrument (*In my case, they didn't*), but I can choose to have good grades if I work hard enough. What are college looking at? Everything but your grades. Nice one America.

[@iandawunamugerwabyenkya7526]

but all of those things, statistically speaking, have an extremely significant influence on the grades that you get.

[@cruziero15]

Right, because a teenager in Baltimore who has to worry about getting murdered on his way home from school and has to maintain a job to help support his family from getting evicted has the same opportunities as an affluent teenager in Beverly Hills. If only there was a way for a university to judge someone's work outside of school. Oh, wait that's what they're doing.

[@yak2425]

Hosono, very TRUE!!!!

[@Aaron565]

They shouldnt look at grades either, since prep schools boost their students grades, and poor students often get worse teachers meaning easier classes. Grades are a horrible way to compare competency unless they are standardized tests.

[@jaydenroberts2615]

I agree 100%

[@busbystandup1337]

Next can we address $450 textbooks, exorbitant parking costs, prison-style student bunk bed dorms that cost more $ than an off-campus apartment, ridiculously expensive dining plans, and of course, the insane expense of tuition? Oh, nevermind... I forgot student loans will cover it on a non-bankrubtable indentured servant payment plan... we're good, nothing to see here. But don't get me started on the billion dollar college sports industry that doesn't pay the athletes, and doesn't allow them to accept money for endorsements or make money off of their athletic ability

[@onebuffalo5402]

Idk what BS classes you take but as a stem major the most I ever paid for a textbook was my oragnic chemistry book that was about 250$ and was for Orgo 1+2. Maybe a lesbian dance theory text book costs 450$ but normal useless degree textbook aint nearly that much. .Hell I think my physics book was 45$ and its like 600 pages.

[@mpacino1224]

One Buffalo that is what you took away from his comment? Just the text book thing? You must be a pretty tolerant person.

[@busbystandup1337]

@@onebuffalo5402 So I guess you didn't purchase the study guide or the automated quiz clicker. And how about your additional technology/lab fees? Or how about the fact that your $250 book (pretty cheap for Orgo) will be replaced in 2 years. But that's ok, until then, the University will offer to buy it back from you for $25. What a bargain. You seem to have the whole world figured out... why do you even go to school? Hell, you could just teach people in the comments section of KZbin. By the way, a Physics book hasn't cost $45 since the early 1990's, even if you bought it used. Re-read that book and learn the physics of how to pull your head out of your ass.

[@onebuffalo5402]

@@busbystandup1337 We had the option to run our clicker questions from either our smart phone or you could buy an iclickr (used) for 50$ that would last you all 4 years. "Buy study guides" Um if you're a good student dont need study guides. They're 3rd party optional for people who dont actually try to learn the material in lecture/online/thru the textbook. So acting like buying study guides is necessary is moronic. Lab fees? Only lab fees i ever had was buying a labcoat and scrubs + the fee if you broke shit in lab. "College Physics Paul PeterUrone is now 29$ vs the 45 I use to pay. So you're somewhat right, the book I used is EVEN CHEAPER NOW. So stop talking shit and talking bullshit you highschool Pleb

[@onebuffalo5402]

@@mpacino1224 WEll hes talking about the prices being too high and he is hyperbolizing textbook costs by a county mile. So yes. Textbooks ran me 300-450$ a semester on average. Most text books for the bullshit classes were in the 60-80 range, you had outliers like Orgo, Bio and Biochem that were 200-300 (for some people physics may be in here too but our professor basically said they're a waste of money buy the 50$ book its just as good) However these books price is /2 because they always applied for both sections/semesters of the course (meaning Orgo 1+2, Physics A+B, etc..). So this fallacy of 500$ per textbook is innane and makes the poster look like an imbecile. Once again. Unless you're talking lesbian dance theory and have a BS professor who authors their own BS textbooks and then forced you to buy them you aint paying 400$ per book. Which again tells me the OP is someone in a BS major paying for a degree in a non STEM field that put him in debt and he now doesnt have a job cause of his moronic collegic career.

[@fe12rrps]

‘You’ve satisfied all of my biases. Congratulations! You’re accepted!’ ‘You’ve exposed all of my biases. We’re sorry. You’re rejected.’

[@yck16]

teddy toto “And best wishes for your future endeavours”

[@xxmike112xx]

Notice the “diversity” on the panel which all of them OPENLY expressed extreme biases towards their own race, ethnicity, and culture ties. This is exactly the thing white people are criticized and called racists for. I don’t like it either way, but it’s how the human mind works and everyone knows this but only the minority of individuals can come out and say these things. People identify with other individuals who most closely resemble themselves or their interests. If I am an African American and I walk into an all white school but I see a single table where African Americans are sitting, you can bet your ass I’ll go straight to that table, and vice verse for ANY race, religion, or nationality.

[@pencilmein6646]

@@xxmike112xx Tom Weiss bias is one thing, straight up racism is another. There is nothing wrong with being biased and having your own personal opinions/inclinations but there is something wrong with allowing those opinions to become violent and hostile. I agree that race plays an inextricable role in our society. But it's not just about cultural biases. It's the fact that people who are of a certain race are given certain privileges while others are not. That is the issue here. Don't like being treated "unfairly"? Don't like being "uncomfortable"? Well I guess white people finally have somewhat (if at all) of an idea of what it's like being a person of color in America.

[@jeffsmith1284]

Pencil Me In how about we consider merit and not race? I know meritocracy is not easy to realize in life, but focusing the admissions on either bias or race is far less preferable than merit.

[@fe12rrps]

Jeff Smith excellent point. One of the main problems in college admissions, if you normalize for non-criminal behavior, is the assembly line effect. Most colleges get so many applications that effectively they cannot succeed at spending the time needed to understand each applicant. At some point, it becomes too easy to just revert to their own biases even for the well intentioned college application reviewer. This video is particularly interesting to me because it (unknowingly?) exposes pure bias, well intentioned or not, on the part of these particular reviewers.

[@Zdabest_]

Gossip girl already had taught me that this kind of stuff happens.

[@JA-ul5ue]

YUP. So happy Nelly Yuki got into Yale based on her merit

[@asiacarey7732]

I know right... but before I was applying to those kinds of schools I really wanted Blair to finesse her way into Yale :/ now I'm on Nelly Yuki's side, but hey, Blair eventually ends up at Columbia anyways

[@cutienerdgirl]

@@JA-ul5ue Yaaassss!! I love Nelly!!

[@cutienerdgirl]

@@asiacarey7732 She flunked out.

[@chericarichae2458]

YUP!

[@tonis1983]

"Legacy students", "donations"... call it like it is: CORRUPTION

[@raulantunez4228]

Legacy students have to be the stupidest idea I’ve ever heard of.

[@kingrazor5280]

@Melanated Princess yes, but it's only beneficial for their family!! What's in it for others? It's unfair for others.

[@ionizedwater8589]

"Ok you meet all of our requirement but your great-great-great-great grandfather and his entire bloodline up to you didn’t get in 165 years ago, cry about it idk."

[@brittxnyakawaii12]

😂😂😂😂

[@jim8937]

None of those admissions officers even come off as qualified to review my application. Just speaking the truth.

[@orlandobrown8190]

@laura marrero fabian this dumbasses? Oh god.

[@HotTea1111]

Believe me, they are not. I have worked in Higher Education Admissions for a few years now and most of these Admissions Committee Members and Officers I've worked with are incompetent.

[@Aaron565]

This is the correct thought process, if you are getting hired by an HR department, its time to evaluate their qualifications to be evaluating anyone.

[@nataliya2593]

😂😭

[@wishIKnewHowToLove]

agree! it's scary! they are not even intelligent!

[@burkey8037]

I tried to bribe my way in to college but unfortunately a used 96 Honda and a discount coupon for Dominoes pizza wasn't good enough.

[@broadwellr9667]

You got reject by Phoenix University? Ouch.

[@burkey8037]

@@radiobaked that's exactly why I need a bought education, I don't bribe so good 😜

[@SandStormXII]

Sounds like me lol

[@williamparada4630]

I feel you bro drop out class of 15

[@Soapluvva]

I turned down Princeton, but accepted MIT, and then watched loads of soap operas in my dorm room at MacGregor House during all four years of college.

[@cyb0rgirl]

Rich people have been doing this since universities have been accepting money lmao it's the "secret" we all already knew about

[@lokalkakan]

This is different from the donation bias, this is literally cheating rather then paying on college

[@Gee-xb7rt]

this is different in that they even tried to make a tax scam out of it, they set up a fake charity to transfer bribe money. its the white mafia in action.

[@Gee-xb7rt]

@Jack Shite wow, white boy is triggered.

[@spencerruss7421]

Have u considered the expectation from rich parents to their kids? As someone from a fairly wealth background, even if my parents are not pushing me to academic success, dayum it sucks when I feel I will never be as successful as them. Therefore the haves got their own pressure too. And I am getting judged because my parents are rich, despite my grades, my hardwork and my lost sleep times. It is not scary that others got richer parents, it is scary when the rich kids work harder than u are

[@sirloxleymendoza972]

Mentioning skin color makes you racist ...........Have you no facts to refute him? He pointed out there are rich democrats that profit from crime. He pointed out that there are many persons of color , gay etc that are rich and nobody holding them back.. Still no facts? crickets. You should stop advertising your limited vocabulary and low IQ @@Gee-xb7rt

[@KP-dd2ci]

"This is not donating a building so that a school will more likely accept your son and daughter" - yeah, that's so much more equitable. Smh.

[@jocelyncooper1738]

When multimillion bribes become publicity acceptable

[@joaoboscolucena9775]

From a purely utilitarian perspective, a donating a building will benefit the university, the students, possibly staff; whereas a straight up bribe is just benefiting the student and possibly his parents. I do believe both are unfair, as it is only a possibility if you are well-off, but they are different things-both in law and in practice.

[@ShaneyHwang]

@@joaoboscolucena9775 Though donating large sums of money may be legal, that donation is essentially serving the same purpose as cheating your way into the school. Sure, anyone should feel free to donate to the school because it does help the students and the university but.... why does that get noted in a student's application then? SIMPLY because money = advantage and privilege. Students who don't have the means of doing either are at a huge disadvantage. Whether one is illegal or not, being able to do either thing screams privilege and it's unfair for the kids who don't have the same benefits.

[@vkeeblerelfv7643]

They probably mentioned that because Trump did something similar for his kids www.inquirer.com/education/college-admission-scandal-trump-donald-jr-university-pennsylvania-wharton-kushner-20190314.html

[@1gaia]

Right, and the graduates of these rich parents, who attend these supposed "prestigious" institutions (that are so mercenary that they'll take bribes), end up in positions of power and perpetuate this nepotism and classism.

[@efthymiosn3381]

Lol. The title should be: We ask biased college admission selectors which category of students they root for.

[@thatonekidisback9223]

So this is why I couldn't get into Hogwarts

[@TheRazorTongue]

Heard some kid named Potter stole your spot.

[@visibletoa11usersonyoutube]

Lmao 😂

[@904czv4]

Damn muggles.

[@brittenyevans1101]

😂😂😂😂😍😭💀

[@mrs.stewart6833]

Exactly you were used to get rid of affirmative action now turn that same energy into fighting the rich cheaters

[@hansmntfr]

What I gather from this is that is not ok to bribe specific memebers of the admission process, but it is ok to bribe the entire university

[@GY-hd4br]

But it’s okay to bribe congress and make them multi millionaires

[@solomonarbc]

Yeah, it's ok to build and equip universities. Literally everyone benefits from it but some MORONS who feel rejected.

[@meiyuan2134]

hey it's not a bribe it's a D O N A T I O N! look at how generous these rich folks are /s

[@Cosmo1093]

It's definitely unfair, but I also don't see why people care so much about rich people buying their way in. "Donations" are where a lot of funding for scholarships, research, and building projects come from. Admitting a handful of under-qualified rich kids seems like a small tradeoff in the grand scheme of things, and is probably a net-win overall. By comparison, bribing individual coaches or administrators does literally nothing to benefit the university as a whole.

[@jjsc4396]

solomonarbc - the morons can often be the children of the specific donors to whom you allude.

[@obione6560]

The NYU lady is a little worrying, too many biases.

[@estephaniegamez3635]

well when all these student have the same grades, test scores, extra curriculars, leadership roles, but there's still such a limited amount of spots, how else are they supposed choose who gets accepted? they have to rely on subjective qualities, especially when a lot of spots are taken by legacy students/students whose parents donated to their school/etc.

[@tchit8792]

NYU gets 85k applications each year, and admit such a big class, and so they have their pick of students and basically always end up with a diverse class. My guess is they have so many admissions officers they don't care about an extreme vetting process for each one lol. When I went for an information session I really disliked the admissions officer there who made fun of kids with cliche essays and bragged about how students have to have an amazing EC to get in....

[@longfordboy2538]

She is very bad. You don’t have a shot at NYU

[@ohdude6643]

@@estephaniegamez3635 Throw a coin? If all necessary points are checked, do not create new ones just to make a decision.

[@etchedinstone7562]

If you're a white male, chances are you won't be her first pick.

[@seanwalsh5717]

In the Ivy League - Dartmouth, Princeton, Yale, Penn and Brown - more students came from the top 1 percent of the income scale than from the entire bottom 60 percent.

[@Nmwhat]

Yeah. The video’s carefully selected admissions officers make it seem like all the slots are going to poor minority kids because of affirmative action. But an enormous proportion of the classes at Ivy League and similar schools are always - by design - the children of the rich, famous, and powerful. These admissions officers are talking about the process for filling the small remainder of spots, a process which values diversity in part to distract us from how ridiculously biased in favor of wealth the whole system is. And the distraction works: look at how many comments here are outraged by the idea that a poor black kid might gain admission over a middle class white kid with slightly better test scores, but then look how few comments are outraged that the obscenely wealthy, regardless of race, effectively receive a guaranteed fast track to a top-tier university.

[@st.valentineArt]

*pretends to be shocked*

[@ogot344]

@@Nmwhat well said

[@HeyKevinYT]

From my experience it does seem they took affirmative action. Some Ivy Leagues have become need-blind in the admission process, which means admission officers are prohibited from evaluating applicants based on their background income, if they’re even allowed to see it at all. I was accepted into Princeton and I fall under the lowest-income category because I just moved to the US not long ago. So maybe at least for Princeton, officers do honor the need-blind policy.

[@dathunderman4]

@@Nmwhat it’s not just slightly better test scores though, the gap on what’s deemed “acceptable” for a white/Asian student is SIGNIFICANTLY different that black students. For law schools specifically it can be the difference b/w a 98th percentile test score vs an 85th percentile test score. Same with medical schools.

[@meghasengupta8213]

As someone who just finished applying to most of the schools these officials came from.... it’s disheartening. Everything seems so arbitrary.

[@CaptainBones222]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/naDak2yNZ7esga8

[@gs7828]

@@CaptainBones222 But that's about investing money, not being an expert at something else. You can't "invest" money and become an expert through business. No programming career out of an entrepreneurial mindset.

[@fatimam5585]

Indeed it is! So sorry you’re sad.. but now you’re enlightened and now you can prioritize your self esteem and happiness on something other than what American students are programmed to. 🥳 congrats. In your deathbed you won’t give a dime what school you went to. These schools aren’t bigger than you!

[@UIAL570]

These admissions officers are hilarious. You’re saying how wrong it is to cheat to get it. Put you’ve left students with no choice. You say its all in the paper. But even if you deserve it doesn’t mean you’re gonna get it. 😂 absolutely hilarious. Do you know how hard it is to get in now? And now we have to fit you’re specific bias??😂

[@jonathanvillegas7570]

They said even if you deserve it you might not get in because there are only a limited amount of spots that people are competing for. Remember, they also mentioned that there are spots RESERVED, not being competed for that are already going to legacy students , donors and people with connections. The reason you can be a stellar student and not get in is because everyone else who applied to these top schools is also, by default, stellar. This is why they must employ their biases to make a case why they prefer a student over the other. Almost everyone else will have the same transcript. People will start to differ on their circumstances and what efforts they did outside of school.

[@UIAL570]

Jonathan Villegas I actually do get you’re point. Thank you for you’re comment but I think we can admit the processes for finding students is ultimately broken. We’re relying on peoples likes and dislikes to further or stop someone else career and life.

[@jonathanvillegas7570]

@@UIAL570 You're right but I do not believe there is a better alternative at the moment. The alternative would be that they only let in the elite students. The larger issue at hand is that there are not enough spots at these prestigious schools. The issue is that a lot of applicants think their life will be over or they will not get a good education if they don't apply and get into the top schools. There are numerous amazing schools that will gladly take them in if they let go of their ego.

[@quirkilyperfect1778]

Oxford and Cambridge has an interview process as their final stage of admissions. They say that the main point is to ask really hard questions in the students choice if field to see whether they have done enough super curricular work in their subject, and to test which candidates have a mindset that allows them to work through and attempt to answer the question they've been given. This kinda helps to enrol more people based on their "merit" then solely looking at what they can do on paper. It's not foolproof though as Oxbridge still have a problem with enrolling too many super rich white kids. But it's started to balance out the problem

[@dathunderman4]

That’s why you apply broadly. If you apply to a bunch of schools, and you’re qualified, you should get into a few. Harvard and Stanford aren’t the end all be all, there are so many great schools you can apply to.

[@88macchan_]

As someone who is applying to college this coming school year, this makes me extremely concerned/nervous. The public education system pushes college as "the key to a better future" and treats it as "the great equalizer," yet the reality of admissions is clearly corrupt... We are all doing the best we can. How are we supposed to get accepted to our dream schools if the students who are given acceptances are already demonstrated bias?

[@123422007]

You shouldn’t worry. You don’t have to go to some Ivy League school. Just go to a state school, and major in something with potential to make money and you’ll do great.

[@ericawalker5712]

Same I start applying next year and I’m nervous because like I want to get into a good college and I’m busting my butt everyday trying my best I’m three points away from being an honor student.

[@jokerwick]

Honestly don't worry about the "bias" stuff in this video. Vice failed to mention WHY they have to account for these factors. Generally admissions officers at the *most selective* US universities are looking at a pool of applicants with identical to near identical transcripts and test scores. Because of the limited number of spots offered by the university, the final acceptance decisions are made based on the holistic elements of one's application (i.e. extra curriculars). Your "merit" (grades and test scores) will always be taken into account, but it only gets students into the pool of *considered* applicants. Keep in mind that this really only happens at the *most selective* US universities, which is a pretty small minority of schools.

[@danwilson12]

I think you should focus more on the financial viability of a school how much debt you're willing to take and if you're able to make it back. The Ivy leagues are awesome, but they come at an extreme cost. Just get into a decent public university and really work your ass off and learn the material and apply it to internships. Maybe focus on a school that helps in actually getting a job that leads to a career rather than a pretty piece of paper in fancy script

[@evorty9179]

hey, a year passed. How is it going?

[@jrosa7319]

How did these biased, prejudiced individuals get hired to decide on admissions to any college?

[@sugarkrisp5199]

every person on the earth is a biased prejudiced person

[@tchit8792]

They start out of undergrad (lots get English degrees from ivies, enter this profession, and stick with it). No one is really gonna "break into" this profession, they are just there from the beginning.

[@asherujudo7383]

What happened was there was a crap load of societal bias against the groups the people in this video are advocating for now, which led to horrible poverty and desperation in those groups. But the more democratic society became, the more apparent it became that certain corrections needed to made to achieve egalitarianism and balance. It's not unlike taxation, monetary and welfare policies by governments. They are adjusted to achieve certain ends. When a lot of white people were struggling with poverty and unemployment in the early to mid 20th century, the government implemented various policies to help them acquire homes and employment. In this scenario, college admissions officers can't change laws or decide monetary policy to improve the lives of minority groups that are struggling; all they can do is educate the most desperate people and equip them with the tools and connections they need to succeed and hope that it helps. In truth such a problem requires more than one angle to be dealt with but that's a whole ither issue.

[@ultimateMGproduction]

liberal arts majors.....

[@alonsohernandez9779]

@@sugarkrisp5199 yep like the judge in court you always try to fight you real believes in the name of justice

[@Wh-3]

I was one of those kids, I worked my ass off in HS, maintained an A average but didn't get into a four year college, mind you, this wasn't even an ivy league school. This was devastating for my parents as they I would have been the first kid to go to College in the US. I had to quickly re-calculate my life and started going to a community college. Long story short, I am now starting Anesthesia school and I couldn't be more proud of myself because I did my whole undergrad working full time and I hope it will pay off once I am done with Anesthesia school. I will add that, it annoys me how KZbinrs and Instagram 'influencers' can make millions, yet people who save our lives on a daily basis such as Nurses, Firefighters, EMTs, Residents, and Police Officers are scraping in most states around the U.S. We really ceed to re-prioritize what's important in the world.

[@brittenyevans1101]

You will go very Far in life, screw what a piece of paper thinks about you.

[@timelessmusicfamilymusic9175]

Stay strong. I grew up poor. But, to me that was a blessing, cause everything I have & own, I earn myself. Nothing was ever given to me, it's my own doing. It's a sense of pride that kids who were given everything will never experience. If they do achieve there goals in life(which is great), it's because of there parents, HELP.

[@alsdjfknbo]

Good job man. I grew up poor. Had good grades but actually community college was my first option. I was told that it didn't matter where you got your degree at. And now I'm an RN. Went to school Monday through Friday and worked on the weekends.

[@coralday2009]

True!

[@vitaliyburlaka691]

w2011 what do you mean by “re-prioritize what’s important in the world”? You mean like taking money from youtubers and giving it to whoever you think is more worthy?

[@darrellsadler2848]

This is NOT new information being "exposed" here, but it is helpful that it is being discussed.

[@MiguelMartinez-iy6vx]

Darrell Sadler Yea, you can discuss it until your face turns black and blue. But what the hell is gonna be DONE ABOUT IT?????

[@AllTrickss]

Miguel Martinez facts. Awareness isn’t going to solve anything. Action must me taken.

[@leobuckey]

"I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character" (MLK). Looks like we've still got some ground to cover America.

[@rayanrahmani9838]

and sadly the naacp supports affirmative action, which does quite the opposite

[@justsumteennn6778]

@@rayanrahmani9838 affirmative action is a case of equity, something the US is still working towards. It doesn't take away from one's merit, because you'd still have to be distinguished when applying to colleges.

[@rayanrahmani9838]

justsumteennn It’s not really equity though. There are so many poor Asians who are incredibly unfairly fucked by the system as well as so many rich blacks who are incredibly unfairly benefited by it. A real system of equity would be based on the person’s family’s financial information.

[@gobot581]

@@rayanrahmani9838 lol who are these blacks? Sounds like rich everyone unfairly benifits and you’re targeting black

[@rayanrahmani9838]

@@gobot581 I’m specifically talking about affirmative action. If you want to level the playing field, make it income-based. Not race-based. By making it race-based, blacks unfairly benefit

[@JL-jh6zn]

what pisses me off is when us students complain about this and people are like: too bad, you chose this path, that’s just the way things are. Like no??? We can and should change how the system runs and there’s no issue with us being angered by how fucked it is, bc we actually care.

[@acmaster5431]

u can't change the system deal with it I got into Upenn so Idgaf tbh lol

[@6idangle]

"we arent talking about donating a building to get your kid in" Oh I get it so thats fine?

[@SpongeDude8]

Tyler Potts i feel like thats fine.. Money is going directly to making the school a better place, while this bribery money is probably going to some admissions officer blowing it on an expensive car

[@EloiseInParis]

@@SpongeDude8 Those donations also line faculty pockets. They're just called bonuses instead of bribes.

[@atsojka]

quoting another commentor, stratostear "Bribes and academic fraud are fine. Writing them off on your taxes isn't. That's the lesson here."

[@vukasinzivkovic6450]

I mean the USA are probably the only country where lobbying is legal so this isn't surprising. A bribe is ok but has to be legal bribe, what a joke...

[@patthonsirilim5739]

@@vukasinzivkovic6450 you cant get away from bribe you can only systematise bribe are basically corruption that is not within the rules favouritism is human thing same as how you will favour your children over others when it comes to there well being a group will favour there interest over doing the rite thing we see this in work all the time ass kisser sometime get promoted or the ceo son just walk in without a single day of work in his life into a high executive position while you who have work 20 years now have to listen to that green boy

[@ryanchattertonYT]

Buying a building isn't bribing?

[@aaronmontgomery2055]

different type of bribing but more morally acceptable.

[@ShidaiTaino]

Ryan Chatterton sorry I don’t care who’s kid is coming in I would like a new building thanks

[@ryanchattertonYT]

@@aaronmontgomery2055 Exactly my point. Still bribing. Still using one's money and power to have a greater influence over what others in that situation assume to be meritocratic.

[@ryanchattertonYT]

@@ShidaiTaino Haha fair enough. Not saying we should stop the building-for-admission practice. Only that I'm curious whether or not there are clear rules for what is considered an acceptable bribe or not. Would love Vice to dig in more here and see if admissions offices or schools provide guidelines regarding these things or if it's all under the table as we assume.

[@nkwari]

I know, right?

[@MrGA555]

I wanna be a high school counselor because I never knew what to do after high school. My counselors never helped me. They went had a privilege life style that made them not being able to connect with me. I'm not only a first generation college student but also a first generation American. My parents didn't even knew what a FAFSA is let alone how to fill it out. That's just the small part in which my other classmates have an advantage over me.

[@jessicavictoriacarrillo7254]

That's a good idea. I can see you helping kids and there is quite a lot of demand for good guidance counselors in some places

[@CaptainBones222]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/g4Oyfo2Fqd-IopI

[@Grace-fu6mf]

Schäfer G. Yes please do that, my counselors never did shit for me

[@jayrod9002]

I feel like, if are from the hood, ghetto, and the like, and manage to maintain good grades (without being shot, on drugs, and the like), your application should be closely considered. Most don't live through that hell to even make it to college, or finish high school. Many die.

[@mpacino1224]

I think at least 2 of those Admissions Officers mentioned that they would choose that applicant over the others.

[@jjxngwoo58]

You’re right, I’m from the hood and I was accepted to my UC’s. Personally, I believe I was accepted because of my personal statements.

[@gemmagemma344]

+Jay Rod You're right about kids from the hood deserving special consideration if they graduate with good grades & apply to college. The only problem is that some of those kids haven't really been prepared for college because their high schools aren't great: some schools will give high grades to the kids who show up consistently and are well-behaved "good kids," and sometimes when those kids get to college they can't keep up with the work. Some colleges recognize this and offer free tutoring and free "college readiness" sessions the summer before college begins, but other colleges admit kids, let them take out loans and then watch them fail, while the admissions officers congratulate themselves of admitting such a "diverse" class.

[@padraigmurphy3540]

@@gemmagemma344 Nobody deserves special consideration.

[@puddincup9879]

Stfu

[@cybertyger2012]

What we learned from this video: underprivileged get admission and overprivileged get admission. All other hard-working middle class are SOL...

[@sonicsupreme7224]

In fact, this is exactly correct. "Non-profit take from the overprivileged in order to give to the better underprivileged with an ability to achieve with limited resources." Unfortunately, this is only good on paper. The real world is that 99% (people in the middle) don't stand out, and tend to be ignored, while the college gets a mix of really bad rich students and determined but relatively less capable students.

[@lucidnonsense942]

Given the few "token" underprivileged seats, you have to be a minority AND exceptional to get a chance. Remember, you have to have amazing grades and achievements despite lack of resources. It's 99.99% rich kids and few token extremely capable minorities.

[@cybertyger2012]

Lucid Nonsense - that is quite an authoritative sounding statistic, I’d be interested to know where you conducted your primary research and if you could share your quantitative methodology - or if perhaps it was mere conjecture?

[@cybertyger2012]

17607tacoma - I agree! Although my point was summarizing what the video stated, not my personal opinion. It is indeed a messed up system though...

[@aaronbrown3820]

@owen coleman this is already the gist of college currently

[@stratostear]

Bribes and academic fraud are fine. Writing them off on your taxes isn't. That's the lesson here.

[@TheRazorTongue]

Somebody was paying attention. Uncle Sam wants in! He's straight up Frank White about the situation.

[@stratostear]

@Jeffrey Canzani It's so frustrating how the story is being reported.

[@pizzabandit1518]

stratostear Why would you ever risk writing off a bribe on your taxes? Just... why?

[@kab2599]

Pizza Bandit Pretty crazy entitled behaviour, right?! They couldn’t just leave it at the business-as-usual bribes 🤪

[@Tonixxy]

They did what? They had a pretty creative accountant it seems.

[@NoboPenguin]

I attended an elite private high school on full financial aid, and I knew the system was broken when many of my classmate were accepted to prestigious private colleges either through parents' donations (some donated an additional $10 million on top of their regular donations) or their last names alone carry a long history of legacy with that school.

[@eigenme9755]

I feel weird when these admission officers are so comfortable about not un-biasing their own biases. If I was once of them, I would say, "I try my best to avoid mine".

[@MidnightCravings]

*So what else is new about college admission corruption?*

[@dvchel]

Cultural Marxism on campus.

[@bahjom658]

Midnight Cravings nothing much 😂

[@Hamlet137475]

Sounds like none of these admissions officers should ever be admitting students again. Amount of bias is insane!

[@be.A.b]

Those little biases are all a normal part of admission. When you have a stack of identically perfect GPAs and SAT scores, the admissions officers have to gauge what sets the student apart. Yes a minority multi-instrumentalist student who came from a low income household is probably gonna sound more interesting then an affluent white student who volunteered at their church on weekends. In the same way a minority student who did after school tutoring may not be as appealing as a white student who won nationals on their math science team and also produced a killer essay. It’s a balancing act, and overtime the admissions officers developed little biases that help them quickly weed out thousands of near identical applications.Thats why it’s also important to have a diverse team of admissions officers at each school.

[@dren5810]

@@be.A.b come through with the nuance!

[@haagjohnson2773]

I’d rather have someone grade applications who can admit their own biases rather than one that can’t. No matter what, biases *will* exist, the only thing that matters is if they can recognize and correct them

[@oratval]

@@be.A.b I simply dislike these biases because they are inconvenient to me 😤

[@o.oo.o5637]

that was a lot of bias xD and all just for reading an application. they're really proud of themselves like they know the person

[@Phlegethon]

The real people who should be in jail are these admission people.

[@JohnJohnson-do3db]

“I have a lot of biases” “so many spots reserved”…… farthest thing from fair …… corruption at its finest

[@ctmtb27]

Wow. Seems like none of them should be in admissions. Amount of bias is off the charts.

[@caylanwojciechowski8233]

comical

[@samson136]

And remember not to be Asian

[@story3877]

Its nearly impossible to remove bias from humans, it is how we experience the world. The only way we can remove this is to automate the process. This is absolutely a job that should be replaced by a computer program. However even that could be corrupted. It would need to be given certain parameters and key words to look for when sorting the applicants. This would rely even more on sat/act scores (something many non ivy league colleges are now dumping as they are desperate for students and have come around to the idea that people can test poorly and be great students), there would need to be assurances that the student body is diverse and it would need to look closely at financial need and extra curricular activities as well. But even after all that, a computer still couldn't do things like weed out the students who are there for music, art, or theater - all of which require students to audition. So yeah, the whole process is subjective and insane and no matter how much we try, I just don't see how we'll ever make it 100% fair, because life isn't fair. Best you can do is be your best advocate, make yourself look awesome on paper and in person.... and have a mom who was on a shitty 90s sitcom who can use that rerun residuals money to build your college a new pool. Lol *sigh*

[@aminasn991]

CT MTB everyone has implicit bias. It’s best to recognize it and address it then shove it under the rug.

[@user-ne2bb5nh7t]

So this is why it is important to have diverse admissions teams. Also note that none of these people ever said "I only accept xyz students", they only said that they are able to relate more to students with whom they share a common background, and so they are able to support them better as the admissions person can pull from that similar experience in their defense. Having a diverse team with a multitude of different backgrounds ensures that all the bases are covered, and that a hardworking student will have a chance to shine through.

[@TraceMyers26]

(paraphrased) 'We're not talking about making donations so college officials are more likely to accept...', 'we're talking about bribes'. What? It's the same thing.

[@TraceMyers26]

@maverickM249 I don't understand your point.

[@kiybro]

It isn't the same thing. As the FBI guy said, they're dealing with literal fraud. These people are lying, cheating, and bribing people to falsify information presented to universities. None of that occurs when rich people donate millions of dollars for a building. That is the university knowingly making a sacrifice to the benefit of everyone that is involved. They knowingly give an admission spot to someone who might otherwise not be qualified to get funds, that will benefit the student body as a whole, that they might not have otherwise have gotten. You can argue that such practices should detrimentally effect the integrity or perception of the university, but it's an entirely different question and in my opinion not even in the same moral ball park. It's certainly not in the same legal ball park. The bribes in this scenario are only benefiting the individuals that pocket it in exchange for deception and falsification.

[@TraceMyers26]

@@kiybro Without looking it up, I can tell you a good definition for 'bribe' is 'unfairly gaining something desirable in exchange for pay'. You said 'to the benefit of all involved', which is a clear contradiction when a student population is limited, and especially when there are so many benefactors to a university that probability of admittance sharply declines if you haven't donated. Although any rejection after a donation can't be a bribe, acceptance weighed even partly on a donation is clearly a bribe. Or, if you're going to gate off the word without defining it, admit it's unfair and you've made my point.

[@karkha2894]

@@kiybro Yeah, but 2 wrongs will not make a right. By selecting the unqualified student based on donations a slot is taken away from more qualified student, which means the school lose out on a better and stable return on investment in the long-run.

[@DMRoper1]

Yeah. Ha, ha! I picked up on that one too. These college people don't know the difference. Ironic isn't it?

[@ashleylesiak4114]

I went to a public high school in a very nice area. When students from rich families got bad grades, they would transfer to private schools and end up all of a sudden going from C's to A's. It was an open secret that there were small private schools that were basically just grade mills. Even a teacher once addressed it in class, stating that it was a waste of money because the universities know to look out for schools like this. The only thing I find shocking about this admissions scandal is that other people are shocked.

[@FediaBean]

10% of Harvard admission is devoted to legacy admission anyway. Pff.

[@jocelyncooper1738]

It’s statistically prove to be around 33%

[@samblock4937]

Lol legacy shouldnt exist in the first place

[@FediaBean]

Ishaan Hussian Yet it does. 😔

[@chili_boi2537]

@@samblock4937 why? If everybody in your family tree went to Harvard, chances are you are smart also.

[@amandal.1422]

@@chili_boi2537 just bc u go to harvard doesnt mean ur smart. Its called money and having enough will make ppl bend over backwards for u. Ur obviously not smart if u cant see this

[@ladymonacoofthebluepacific2571]

I am very proud of my honest, hard-working kids. They studied for months b4 taking their SAT exams. They worked hard in their public high school AP classes and got good scores on those exams, too. They EARNED their college admissions!😊💓💓💓 #proudestmomever

[@thelionsleepstonight275]

Awesome! Congratulations to all of you!😃

[@mannyf708]

And most likely they wont do jail time.

[@ariefraiser140]

Jail time for breaking what law?

[@DaveDDD]

@@ariefraiser140 fraud

[@kutie216]

Arie Fraiser Fraud, coercion, etc. There are many laws preventing bribery like this and ESPECIALLY for schools that are public state universities.

[@ariefraiser140]

@@DaveDDD Who are the they being referred to that should be criminally prosecuted? The admin officers being interviewed by vice?

[@ayan9202]

Arie Fraiser no the actual admin officers, teachers, and coaches who lied to let students in along with the 33 parents who bribed them

[@TheTimeisGrey]

I went to university in Belgium. No admission restriction and $600 tuition for 1 year. Everyone gets a chance to get in but then here's what happens, from the 300 students in my first year in Architecture, only 10% of us made it to graduation. The exams, the work you have to provide is what will eliminate the masses. But at least it is based on merit, not on money and connection.

[@stinhuffine4422]

In almost all countries it's like that

[@user-mr4cs3do5j]

I don't know who to contact to provide this information but I know the very prestigious FIT (fashion institute of technology) also accepts bribes, I was told by a girl in my school that she got into FIT thanks to a hefty bribe that got her in without even taking the SAT test, I thought she was lying but she told me about this in late April when admissions were still open and yet she already knew she got in and she also told me how her father already bought a penthouse for her in NYC. I was still doubtful until I see in September she sent me her admission letter. In my school (I live outside the USA) only 5 people took the SAT test and we all prepared together and there is only 1 place you can take the test and she was not there so I know for a fact she didn't take the SAT's. I was very disappointed when I realized she was telling the truth about the bribe because I immediately thought of the actually deserving student she took the spot from and to make matters worse she never went to class and she left after the first semester because she missed her parents too much.

[@gemmagemma344]

+ Miyuki Nishioka Sweetie, FIT doesn't require the SAT for students to be admitted. It's the Fashion Institute of Technology: it's for people who want to be artists and designers, so when you apply, FIT cares more about your portfolio of work than about your grades or test scores. I know this because it says so on the official FIT website (www.fitnyc.edu/admissions/FAQ.php#sat-act). Also, my sister graduated from FIT, and I've taken some art classes there. It's a state school, not a private university. Bribes won't help you get in: they only care whether you're a good artist, and if your work isn't good enough while you're studying there, FIT will ask you to leave (FIT students have to re-apply after 2 years of study if they want to be admitted to the 4-year degree program).

[@DjGhost718]

50 people is the tip of the iceberg

[@DjGhost718]

@1001001010 110101 I can't tell it you're trying to be funny, racist or some weird combination of the two.

[@TheRazorTongue]

@DjGhost718, it's racism. Just look at their other comments.

[@oceanmgtow3750]

1001001010 110101 Great comment.

[@theylied1776]

So, the pilot episode of Suits was a Documentary?

[@OjaysReel]

You win!

[@DMRoper1]

Damn. One of my favorite shows.

[@dartagnan2971]

the people making these decisions have a chip on their shoulder which is concerning to say the least.

[@bluedancelilly]

Apart from the way rich families bribe schools with their donations and legacies (a reality we've all known about for centuries), I was surprised to hear how biased these admissions counselors were even when it comes to regular applicants. If you apply to a school that has an admissions counselor who focuses on "the newspaper kids" and you hadn't participated in the school newspaper, I guess you're screwed and can't get into that particular school. Really? What about a kid who has decent grades and test scores and writes a good essay, but hasn't joined a political campaign or doesn't play violin? You're passed over for that? Sheesh. Just wow. How can an applicant know what school has what biased admissions counselors to know if you have an ounce of a chance? Its a crapshoot! That's the big takeaway I get from this. Not the rich kid bribe issue. This video should be titled "The Unfair Biases of Colleges Admissions Departments".

[@danadomino]

Thank you for addressing the issue of classism! Something which I think isnt talked about. Sure I'm a young woman and first generation but I genuinely felt the biggest thing holding me back was classism and being from a rural community. Like what the one woman said, my guidance counselor didn't know anything about college admissions. Most people in my graduating class, or just that school in general, wouldn't go on to college. No talk of SAT or ACT prep, didn't even know that was a thing until I made it into college. I also don't have the networking connections that I found many people who were applying to medical school had. My family is very blue collar, so any connections I had to make on my own. Classism is very real and puts people at a real disadvantage too.

[@FarChu215]

The people in the video just said that they have implicit favoritism towards women from working class backgrounds. Did you mean that you think classism is real in the application process against rich people so they have to bribe their way in?

[@sillidill5227]

:(

[@NathanGatten]

In many ways, classism and elitism are the guiding force of all prejudices.

[@evettaproductions]

I am also a first generation college graduate that's now pursuing medical school and I couldn't agree more with what you said. I'm definitely feeling the effects of classism first hand currently.

[@suburbiaKID]

FarChu lol no. They said that they looked favorably upon women and poor/rural students BECAUSE they are aware of classism. They are aware that someone who manages to do well despite numerous disadvantages can very well outperform a student who had had all the advantages in the world and preforms nominally better. And they’re correct. As this young lady said, once she went to college she was made aware of all of these things that she didn’t even know existed. Yet even then, colleges can offer aid but they can’t change your social class standing. For example, most students go home for the summer and those living in rural areas don’t have the same opportunities to do internships etc. On the other hand, they often can’t take internships far from home because they’d need the money to forgo working a summer job (interns get paid shit) and still somehow have money to pay for flights, food, housing, etc.

[@clyffanselm1983]

McDonald should fix their ice cream machines, that shit never work on most of its premises especially the one next to my high school !!

[@kkona3868]

Clyff Anselm we need vice to do a story on why McDonald’s ice cream machine is always “broken”

[@PHlophe]

Cliff, you need to hit the gym

[@Deaz3ygaming]

It's not actually broken they are just cleaning the machine most of the time unless u at one of them bad mcdonalds

[@clyffanselm1983]

Lechiffresix six too bad for me, my dad didn't want to pay for my gym membership :(

[@stee8345]

I KNOW. everytime I go to McDonald's they say the ice cream or shake machine is "broken", literally everytime. Drives me nuts!

[@a.w.4134]

thank god university is free in my country

[@sharanya2045]

Which country omg?

[@aryamanmishra154]

Germany?

[@ethnicleanserberg7975]

@@aryamanmishra154 he could be from Germany, Iceland, Denmark, Sweden, Norway or Finland

[@chili_boi2537]

It's not free, you are still paying for it through taxes even when you are not going to college. That's why you should only pay for college when you actually go to college lol.

[@anis-690]

@@ethnicleanserberg7975 Every European country has free Universities, so he could be from France, Spain, Italy, Portugal, Ireland, etc ...

[@valdezfam8694]

It is scary and disgusting that I bust my ass and sacrifice everything so that my girls can receive a great education only to see that a couple of individuals with tremendous bias will decide if she will attend that particular university. We need much more objectivity when it comes to admissions into universities, especially top schools.

[@davidyeric8176]

this is so frustrating to watch, seeing how BS the whole system is -- i just got denied from my top-choice university :/

[@whatiff4616]

was it because of GPA?

[@cecedoll88]

You probably didn’t have a sob story. Seriously I felt like I was watching how people on American Idol are judged. I can’t believe these are the people deciding who gets to move forward in life. They sound disturbingly bias.

[@MrCauseEffect]

Would you be able to afford it?

[@jonathanvillegas7570]

@@cecedoll88 When you have thousands of similar applications, the one with the sob story that still manages to have the identical qualifications as the one without, is always going to have an edge. They have proven that they worked hard in spite of their circumstances. Do not ignore the fact that there are already reserved spots in a limited class size for those with legacy status, connections and large donators.

[@cecedoll88]

Jonathan Villegas That is the problem. Going from one extreme to another. I grew up In poverty and my parents worked so I could graduate from a decent high school. I would be considered a first generation college graduate. I went to college. I had to pay for it through stripping and student loans. For a chemistry degree. I wonder though if my parents would have stayed In poverty and not worked hard to put me in a decent high school would I have got into certain schools? That is the issue I have. The middle class is being ignored. My family wasn’t born into opportunity. They worked for it. So my application would just look average because of the high school I attended. That is horrible. Just because I graduated from a decent high school didn’t mean my family didn’t struggle to get me there. That is the problem. There is too much bias here. It’s extremely disturbing.

[@masonl8128]

Soft spot for poverty, so if accepted we can put you in massive debt for a little knowledge.

[@Shawntawnproductions]

Obviously whoever submitted that application clearly knows how much money it’s going to cost...you’re blaming the person who accepted them into college for putting them in debt, When they applicant is the one who wants to attend? You make no sense.

[@noname-zp1yh]

it depends on the degree. it is an unfortunate fact that currently the future of a large number of people success depends on luck but that's not the fault of the one choosing who gets admitted. The cost of college is also not their fault but even considering the fact that student debt would affect a poor person far more than a rich person that poor person would still statistically be better off just for having the title of going to college even if their specific degree is completely useless in the field they work in. Not even giving poor people a chance would be far worse.

[@lizettemendoza7233]

owen coleman they have a even greater understanding considering they know what’s it like to not have money for basic things like food, water, electricity and such and development money saving skills and learned to shop at department stares like Ross and Marshalls or even thrift shops and try to get the most out of their money

[@DMRoper1]

Most intelligent comment so far.

[@DMRoper1]

@@lizettemendoza7233 You think that's understanding money and finance???

[@IT-ut6zu]

Saying that they have ANY “soft spots” or biases is wrong tbh. Just base it on merit. How does playing sports, instruments or being from a certain race or gender make you a better student??

[@chrispark7010]

all I heard was identity politics and nothing to do with SAT or GPA. If you're Asian, don't waste your money on elite universities, I've been burned many times. I got almost 400 points more on the SAT than some girl at my high school and my GPA was way better than her's, but since she was a different minority, she got into an elite school I was rejected from.

[@meandkg]

0:31 So if they had donated a building that would make it okay?

[@TheSunderingSea]

@Gioachino Rossini Their donations pay for endowments for scholorships for poorer kids like me or others. If admitting a few silver spoons who are still smart and talented in their own right means helping dozens or hundreds of other, poorer students then no, it is not "Problematic".

[@chili_boi2537]

You might have a higher chance to get into a university if your parents donate to the school. Its totally ok considering the money they are donating will go towards scholarships funding poor kids to go to college.

[@meghanoconnor1066]

meandkg im sorry. Bc some of your opinion is correct but it is way too confined. Just because a person is rich later in their life does not mean that they are a bad person. Therefore, what is wrong with them donating to a school they like or support? Or a school they went to and grew to love? And despite intentions, these people are doing something totally legal. And those donations help the schools succeed and give scholarships to other underprivileged kids. Plus, look it up, it’s not like the kids whose parents donate money do not always get in. My dad was a Boston College alumni so my brother was put in the alumni pool. And my dad had gave money to the school in small amounts each year for about 15 years, because he loved his time there. My brother wasn’t qualified though and he did not get in anyways.

[@jollyholly2851]

the rhetoric isnt even suggesting that

[@kingblue71]

Affirmative Action For the Rich. Folks! That's all it is.

[@Unknownxyz100]

TheShowMan which comes way before the actual affirmative action...thus the term then used by you to frame it the other way. That’s all “the” it is ;)

[@Gee-xb7rt]

nope, you obviously don't understand what affirmative action is and how it works. this is the white mafia in action.

[@Oppressedwhiteguy]

@@Gee-xb7rt Affirmative Action is less qualified blacks getting into schools while more qualified whites and Asians are rejected in an attempt to fulfill the leftist's vision of equality of outcome.

[@Deloowix]

@gisforgary you are the one that doesn’t understand affirmative action. It is racial and sexual bias, and has nothing to do with merit or background. Rich black women shouldn’t have a leg up over poor white orphans.

[@mrs.stewart6833]

Where is the Asian outcry

[@flursea2419]

Thank you for shedding more light on the situation.

[@razonjoanify]

I already see a major flaw when they mentioned personal bias... the admission panel members made the selection process about them and not about future students even though I’m sure there are ethical guidelines they have a contractual obligation be fair across the broad spectrum of applicants.

[@npi9p4mk37]

It’s “open season” in 2019... Errbody gettin’ exposed! #Let me get my 🍿

[@pdc4930]

4:56 I do not think colleges shoul dbe run like businesses. look at the for-profit colleges going under and their degrees being useless for example.

[@Cosmo1093]

Every college is a business by virtue of not having unlimited funding. Non-profits aren't able to operate at a loss any more than for-profit organizations.

[@DarthBagel]

State colleges get federal and state money and has alot of accreditations. Public universities will never go bankrupt or loose those accreditations that make their degrees valuable.

[@Cosmo1093]

​@@DarthBagel That's true for public teaching universities. However, the "top" universities in the US are all research universities, and most of them are private. The Ivy League, for example, is comprised entirely of private research universities. MIT, Stanford, and CalTech are also private. And even if public research universities don't "need" donations to survive, the top universities don't become the top universities by doing the bare minimum to survive. Donations and research funding are what ultimately distinguish the best universities from the rest of the pack. More money means they can do more research, build new buildings/facilities necessary to conduct said research, and fund scholarships. UC Berkeley is a prime example of this -- they're a state school that raises like half a billion dollars per year in donations, much of which goes straight towards funding more research.

[@JM-mr6lv]

Sure does seem broken when all of these admissions officers prioritize race, sex, and creed over academic merit. Absolutely shameful.

[@___.51]

Basically my takeaway from the interviews with those college admissions people is that their selection process is arbitrary insofar as you already have good grades, because they all had their "type" that they liked to advocate for. So you'd better hope that one of the admissions people looking over your application looks and thinks a lot like you, because then they're more likely to "root for you."

[@isunlloaoll]

America = pay to win x10 China = pay to win x100 Denmark = pay to give everyone a good life.

[@bobby398]

Denmark hasn't been relevant to the world since the 1600's and Tulip Mania. Last time I checked the States and China produce or create just about everything you purchase. So who really cares what a nation of 5.7 million thinks or does.

[@Irv350]

@@bobby398 That's netherlands not denmark

[@bobby398]

@@Irv350 ok fine, even less relevant then.

[@Irv350]

@@evil_spicoli2967 make europe gay again

[@lonewolfzor]

Isn't Denmark sending refugees they don't want to an island they tested chemical warfare on?

[@RayTieRom]

Personal bias seems to be part of the problem. Student selection should be more objective than this.

[@gladlock]

yes but at the end it didn't matter because they had to make room for the donation and connection kids

[@birdies8397]

Not excusing things like legacy status and donations to schools because, IMO, shit like that should not be allowed. But, when it comes to the pool of applicants to Ivy League schools overall, pretty much everyone has perfectly identical GPAs and test scores, so admissions officer really have no choice but to look at other attributes (quality of extracurriculars, socioeconomic background, overcoming adversity, etc). If a minority applicant from the projects applies to an Ivy League with a 3.9 GPA/33 ACT score with evidence of leadership by starting an educational campaign in their local elementary schools and had to really fight their way to get there vs. the rich white kid with a 4.0 GPA and a 35 ACT score who volunteered at church weekly, the admissions committee is gonna take the black kid over the white kid because the black kid had to work three times as hard to do (essentially) just as well in school and made a bigger impact on their community. It’s more than just about grades and test scores when you’re dealing with admissions to top schools. There are limited seats and the admissions officers have to choose a couple thousand students out of tens of thousands with basically identical grades and test scores.

[@hudsonhintze]

4:39 This interview shot is GORGEOUS the lighting and colors are amazing

[@god563616]

This was a very good and eye opening video HBO. Thank you. Always fight for the underdog

[@peterb4891]

Dang vice. How did you get this piece together so quickly? Bravo ! 👏

[@derekstevens257]

To summarize this video it seems like the people that get hurt the most are qualified middle class students as lower class and minority students receive a lot of benefit from judging their background, and wealthy individuals receive help from donations and legacy support.

[@julianquesada6933]

Derek Stevens If that we’re really the case then the majority of colleges would be full of low SES students and minority. You really only find that in regional colleges.

[@derekstevens257]

Julian Quesada I didn’t say that there weren’t plenty of white middle class students in those colleges, I just said it’s hardest for them to get in. Consider how much easier it is for a minority to get in over someone of Asian descent. Additionally consider how much harder it is to get into school when you’re not bribing your way in. Combine both these things you create white/Asian middle class Americans who need substantially more credentials to get into a school than others. Notice that there’s no lawsuits suing schools because they’re discriminating against minorities rather there are more affirmative action lawsuits from students who had less qualified people let in below them. (Not saying this is a bad thing just pointing it out)

[@clauce7953]

I think the number of applicants who are poor is significantly lower than middle class.

[@derekstevens257]

Clau Ce as an anecdote Harvard consists of 36% of people who’s household income is < 30K. That’s more than any other income group so I would say that either they must apply in greater proportion than everyone else, or at least be accepted at higher rates.

[@flighted2513]

funny how Asians are also minorities but instead of being benefitted they get penalized in the admissions process.

[@mohaamd_7505]

Sorry to be that guy, but where I come from, higher education is free and admissions are purely based on merit. But U.S schools are still ages ahead of us..

[@NaijaCINE]

Why are you apologizing, who are you apologizing too? And where are you from?

[@mohaamd_7505]

NaijaCINE _”Sorry”_ is figurative, as in I don’t mean to brag. I’m from the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia, wbu?

[@NaijaCINE]

@@mohaamd_7505 Ah I see. I'm from Nigeria, good to know Saudi Arabia takes care of it's people like that

[@jonathanvillegas7570]

Purely based on merit lol.. So the children of illegal slaves in your country could get in too?

[@mohaamd_7505]

NaijaCINE That’s great, my psychology professor is Nigerian and he’s by far the nicest person I’ve ever met. But to be completely honest, his accent is a bit funny.

[@gracemcarthur8690]

"already extraordinary kids that no one is fighting for" what tf do u mean no one's fighting for me if my parents don't give 6 figures to a school?? Wtf does that mean though??

[@blossoms978]

Never mind the bribes and six-figure donations. Because even without this scandal, college admissions is still rigged in favor of the rich. That's because college admissions is ridiculously complex, subjective, and nontransparent, which means that those with the resources can manipulate admissions without breaking a single law. Rich parents can hire college consulting firms to write their kids' applications, use their connections to get them tony internships on Capitol Hill or at some nonprofit, even send them on some save-the-world trip to Guatemala so their child can write about it on their applications. Point is, rich kids have opportunities and resources that give them a distinct advantage in a subjective admissions scheme. Meanwhile, the rural or urban kid with top test scores and a perfect GPA doesn't stand a chance.

[@BigNickPoodle]

I got into MIT because I was a recruited athlete. What they said about people fighting for you being important cannot be more true. I would not have gotten in if it wasn't for the track/cross country coach fighting for my admission. My good test scores alone would never have been enough.

[@adr77510]

Recruited athletics is the biggest boost an application can get - their application process is entirely different

[@alexisoviedo100]

Love this!!! Great job Vice!

[@sunshinegirl6854]

BRODY JENNER, Spencer Pratt, lo bosworth, that blonde individual from the Hills, and Robert kardashian . How did they get in? Do you think they scores high sat with extra curricular activities

[@JTD472]

This is a good example of when a news organization wants to be be fast instead of having something new to offer. What did this piece actually say?

[@wheresbellaj2386]

JTD472 That even the college admission officers are biased as hell. They are building the classes of some of the top universities in the world with what they think makes a good student, not on what the student has done but On what ethnicity they are, where they live and how much money their parents make. All things that they don’t have any sort of control over

[@thehappy15a]

God forbid your kid go to trade school.

[@TheRazorTongue]

You have to compare long term earning potential and the connections they will make. Ivy Leagues decide who sit in the seats of power.

[@thehappy15a]

Next time a pipe bursts at your house tell the plumber you will pay him in “experience”

[@solomonarbc]

That's a problem in many countries. We should make all high schools teach some trades (except for a few ones for the exceptionally gifted) and thus ensure our children are able to earn for a living even before graduating from the desired college. There's so many jobs in the renewables where you go out and see places instead of the few extra bucks you'll get by being overweight in an office. And even if you get an MSc afterwards, you can find work (of your trade) if there's a recession.

[@thehappy15a]

Honestly repair and tradesmen jobs are the ones that won’t be taken by automation. It’s hard to get a robot to do a complex task like fixing a plumbing or electrical system. When robots take the jobs, the man who fixes the robots will be king.

[@Cosmo1093]

I disagree. The man who designs and programs the robots will truly be king, and advanced degrees are essentially a requirement for doing that. For example, the race to develop driverless cars and the shortage of talent has resulted in *average* salaries of $300k/year. That number is only rising.

[@212dragon]

Blessed and worked to go from a community college to an Ivy league school. Even though I was lucky the system is indeed broken. Anyone else interested in a AI driven system that is supplementary to human admissions officers? Also, double blind admissions process?

[@camas77721]

i really appreciate the honesty and candor of the admissions council members that were interviewed.

[@pettywhite8124]

I think this also just kind of shows you that it's so important to actually show who you are in your apps because you never know who could be rooting for you. besides those students who come from ridiculous wealth, almost every applicant will have near perfect grades and test scores. What makes you stand out is what you do with the rest of your time and how good your personal essay is. I once read an essay (which helped this applicant get accepted into Princeton) about growing up as the only boy in a family of women that seemed so simple at first glance, but was so powerful and moving that you just knew this kid was gonna go places.

[@glaznflip1501]

The process ain’t broken, it’s our society defining success based on where you went to school is what’s enabling it.

[@WsjMGdqp8VR0GvP6YI26RJSp]

I spent my entire time in highschool Working my ass off and stressing myself out to the point where it was harmful for my mental health. I didn’t get into practically any school I wanted, made myself miserable in the process, and it was not worth it one bit. All it did is make me a bitter and sad person.

[@MunTre123]

Thought this had been common knowledge for years.

[@crolomyers2516]

“0:36” that is still bribery in another form if your child gets in to a university, because you donated to it.

[@thepinkkush]

Can we find out why they put so much focus into standardized testing scores instead of gpa, activities, and resume when it comes to scholarship awards

[@gemmagemma344]

They put focus on all of those things. It's a combination of factors. Testing is supposed to be a way to compare apples to apples when looking at students, because GPAs aren't a good way to compare students: some schools give everyone nearly straight "A"s, while at others, the students have to struggle to maintain a "B" average.

[@sudonimm2311]

“School isn’t for smart people.” -Rick Sanchez

[@MZBrandao]

look up rick sanchez, who he works for and his criminal record (including a dui). Im not going to take advice from that dipshit

[@bigrover7857]

College is a scam.

[@calinmarie5974]

You say that like it's a notable person.

[@michaelnguyen3259]

Wow none of you guys ever heard of Rick and Morty? Lol

[@GODSlove1358]

Calin Marie 😂😂😂😂😂

[@robb3670]

This has been going on for years and it will keep happening .

[@yusufcagowayne1990]

Affirmative ACTION has helped women more the minnorties.

[@ct5951]

White women yes.

[@PAllen74]

@1001001010 110101 You can't really underplay years of segregation, discrimination and denial of equal opportunities that easily.

[@rogshotz]

New thought. People DON'T care who it helps most. DON'T DISCRIMINATE ON RACE ON GENDER.

[@ct5951]

@1001001010 110101 And what about it?

[@jasontreyes8078]

Oh man, that's the only way I got accepted at UC Irvine ... my SAT scores were okay. Berkley and UCLA said, nope! lol UCI needed more minorities at the time, specifically Asians. Heh heh.

[@ifonefan1147]

My public school academic advisor told my mom to abort me 18yrs before she met me, so that she could “have a good life”. That was interesting.

[@realSimoneCherie]

Actually, this just confirms everything I've always presumed to be the case of what happens in closed-door settings like University admissions' offices.

[@alextran2526]

“I have a lot of biases”

[@totticavalier1596]

Great! Brought up the issues, forgot about them, changed nothing.

[@mrs.dunlap8003]

This is stupid. Universities should accept students based on scores. Period.

[@margaretmouka5552]

Mrs. Dunlap no, not everyone is good at taking tests. There are many types of intelligence like musical, linguistic, etc. things like sports, hobbies, talents, languages etc should be also considered

[@birdies8397]

Ivy Leagues only have a few thousands seats per class. Tens of thousands of students with perfect grades and test scores apply. You can’t accept all of them, so you have to go through the details (background, overcoming adversity, quality of extracurriculars, leadership potential, etc) to determine admission. You gotta consider the pool of applicants applying to these schools. No one with a 3.0 GPA and average SAT/ACT scores is going to apply to an Ivy unless they had a serious (and I mean SERIOUS) life circumstance that hindered their performance (and they had to show an upward trend to prove that they were able to get past it.

[@brandonjoseph1106]

@Michelle Appiah I don't even consider that an achievement.

[@sunshinegirl6854]

I get tired of getting letters from my college asking for a donation because I am a alumni. I still have loans today!

[@phishitaac]

trumps incompetence makes sense now

[@SS-cc2cv]

Obamas incompetence makes sense then too.

[@zzraven777]

@@SS-cc2cv You seem hurt

[@SS-cc2cv]

Alexis Johnson does responding to somebody else’s glib comment about colleges being the sole determinant of productivity and value qualify me as hurt. The orange man is a joke a lot of the time, but had he done a lot of the stuff Obama did, he would’ve been lit up for it while the media gave Obama a pass because he was “the cool guy”. I don’t understand how you attribute my feelings being hurt to a comment with literally the same demeanor as the original comment. I don’t feel hurt whenever someone disagrees with me and you should either.

[@ZxRiGxZ]

Did I just watch a video demonstrating that the average college administrator has 100% biased opinions when deciding applicants?? Sorry did I hear “soft spot?” You’re job is literally to not be biased. Jesus christ.

[@SinnedNogara]

Is being unbiased their job though?

[@ZxRiGxZ]

SinnedNogara that’s not a clever comment my man haha, what?

[@sanjanasriv]

Everyone in the comments seems to be shocked by the amount of biases these admissions officers have, but let's be real. They're people. People have biases. However, these people are aware of that and are being honest about it, and I would rather have my application be reviewed by a self-aware person than someone denying all biases. These men and women came out to honestly talk about the process, and we shouldn't be berating them for their honesty. Would you rather know the people reading your application or be oblivious because you don't like what they might say?

[@travelguy6424]

the comments of that black woman are so insane