How Cyclists Should Strength Train: Research Review - Ask a Cycling Coach Podcast 492

[@trbeyond]

Keep it simple folks. Make sure to use good form and lift heavy. Do something for each of the following: Squat, hinge, push, pull, press, core. 2 or 3x per week. You’ll be 99% the way there.

[@carbonman1967]

@@Mansell5Senna8 my exact thought. I tried this winter/spring to incorporate weights, but my legs kept feeling so sore that I couldn't perform my interval sessions. The weeks simply don't have enough days: 2 strength session a week, at least 2 days recovery 1 high interval session a week, 2-3 days recovery 1 long session of base/sweetspot a week, 1-2 days recovery 😂

[@davidthein1158]

Exactly this!

[@Hamsterlovers408]

@@carbonman1967feel the same

[@alanpaschoal7299]

See, I am an active TrainerRoad customer, and it works very well for me. Regarding KZbin content, if you could please add an illustrated summary at the end of the video, it would be perfect. I find most of the videos very useful, but I can't get to the end due to their length and time constraints.

[@aspenwagon04]

Natural bodybuilder here. Frequency (consistency) combined with smart intensity (difficulty) is the key. If you always find a way to improve, and on the days you can't do that, just show up for yourself, you will see results. People get wayyy too caught up in the minutia. Train hard and keep going and you will absolutely get stronger and better at the things you practice. Also must eat well but you need to train properly for that to even matter.

[@corymolloy-advertisingprof4689]

I got incredible gains from three workouts a week Tues legs, Thursday Back and Saturday Arms and going up one of the Utah canyons to push my lung capacity. When I first started lifting weights I trained like Arnold, yet when I did the one set training recommended by Arthur Jones, Mike Mentzer and John Little I got a lot stronger faster than ever. It's definitely the way to go, glad to see you teaching this. ❤

[@sandwich25-k5w]

Are you doing this throughout the entire year? I'm a 52F and trying to figure out the best combo. Thanks.

[@BrennanMoore]

A blog post with some images would be super helpful here! (Really interesting but a bit hard to incorporate without images)

[@timtaylor9590]

to solve the barbell squat problem, use a trap bar, and lift the heels with shoes and or something under the heels. having to go to the gym is an excuse to not work out all. then good ones with no weights is reverse nordics, pistol squats, and one leg lunge. those help with mobility, flexibility, coordination, balance, stabilizers and provide plenty of resistance for growth. definitely gotta incorporate that yoga too.

[@patmorton4714]

The Trap/Hex Bar is excellent. Another option for minimal equipment at home is the Bulgarian split squat. To emphasize the quads bring your planted foot back closer to the support and let your knee move forward over your toes.

[@TylerMcHenry]

Getting a set of wedges has been a huge improvement in my ability to get to full depth on a barbell squat and really work the quads. Before that I just felt too unstable getting deeper because I'd start to come up on my toes due to limited flexibility.

[@739jep]

Full body workouts 3 times a week for me! I mix the focus between volume and intensity. Not all on the same workout but I love squats , deadlifts , bench , overhead press , pull ups , barbell rows , Hungarian split squats and hanging leg raises 💪

[@mrsmtw5210]

Traditional squats have improved my strength and stability far more than when I was doing leg press. I only squat with a spotter.

[@aleasebott431]

So happy your finally talking about strength training and cycling. Combination together is awesome.

[@jayseb]

49 here - I cycle one day - skip one day - strength train - Skip one day wash rince and repeat. Works wonders and I feel great - but manage your sleep like it's the gold standard of your life - and please don't worry getting too big it's the hardest thing for most - cheers.

[@carollevy4698]

Great advice throughout this video. Thanks very much Nate and Jonathan!!!

[@ronbrotherton1006]

Well done. Great insight and info. I'm just over 60 so have been doing the 3 sets, 10 reps since Jimmy Carter (RIP) was President. I'll be working to make that adjustment to 1 set to failure and keep form. But I learned a few things here today - thanks.

[@markusseppala6547]

Squat, hinge, push/pull vertical/horizontal. Stay consistent don't go too hard. Learn the movements well. I think talking about your foot placement or which part of your quad you target is over complicating it for no reason.

[@timtaylor9590]

nah it took 2 minutes, im gonna do more leg extensions now, lol

[@edhill8568]

Not a popular approach but this past year I've concentrated on riding out of the saddle for 15-20 miles without sitting. I'm stronger now because of this. Started out as a challenge and never expected the results I've had. I do this 1-2 times per week supplementing my gym strength training. My quads are noticeably bigger, and I can climb hills much easier. Heart rate is lower at the top of the hill. Additionally since my hands, wrists and forearms are bearing weight my hand grip is now 20% stronger. When you're older this is important. My co-riders have commented on my improvement. I'm 72 and people think I'm a bit crazy doing this which of course is true. My gym strength follows this videos recommendations pretty closely and I've been doing this for a long time.

[@corymolloy-advertisingprof4689]

That's awesome! Thank you for sharing this. I'm going to do intervals like you say and I bet it's going to make a difference. ❤

[@JamSa85]

Contador did this when training and he had a pretty successful career.

[@GearedforChange]

Strength, stability, and function are so important. I’m a trainer but also a bike fitter. The loss of mobility in the ankle really inhibits lots of cyclists. There are lots of ways to ride a bike, but the predication to ride toe down (pkantarflexed) really takes a lot of muscles off the table. A pretty deep set behavior that definitely limits people and doesn’t have to guarded as much. I’ll push back a little bit with a different perspective. We have a one plane sport yes, but stability is still super important. If I get more stable contextually across all planes, I require less energy for a one plane sport metabolically. My whole systemic system is more efficient and the strain for optimization of one muscle requires less calorically and costs less in fatigue.

[@donaldmorrill1636]

I used to walk a slack line for 20 mins a day when I was into rock climbing. It really works stability in the knees. Fast forward 30 years and all I do is cycling and stepping on a slack line has my legs shaking like a sewing machine.

[@starlitshadows]

A couple things. The more you train and the more you train to failure the more you can spot where the line is with almost absolute certainty. I can tell when the next rep is a yes, maybe or definite no. If it's a maybe on a risky exercise I stop. Beginner lifters notoriously don't know where that line is and will stop way too early. Or have failure suddenly hit unexpectedly. They also often have poor stability. Takes practice and time. There is one caveat with machines as well. Yes, you don't have the risk of dropping the weight on yourself. However machines are a fixed movement. Sometimes that movement may be unnatural for an individual. For instance I struggle doing hack squats. Ive tried every position, always feels strain on my knee caps. And I have a chest press machine at my house. Always feel rotator cuff strain no matter the position. Listen to your body and use good form and take safety precautions.

[@corymolloy-advertisingprof4689]

Great point. It's always been like that for me as well. When I first started lifting I did not always know when I would be done, after lifting consistently I always know what I can lift. ❤

[@robtt27]

You can go to failure on bench press by yourself and it won't kill you. Set it on your chest and roll it to your waist, sit up and set the bar on the ground. Yes it sucks but it works. And make sure you don't use collars to hold the weight on. If the weights slide while you're bench pressing, work on your stability to hold the bar level while lifting.

[@deafbass3477]

Funny...nobody talks about the humble kettlebell workout for strength and endurance.

[@aspenwagon04]

The thing here is that the *single set* or more frequency NEEDS to be challenging....like extremely difficult. You can't just go in and do easy stuff for an hour and not challenge yourself. Far too many people are afraid of those things you mentioned (being sore etc) but you can still move around, you get way more used to it as you do it and it becomes enjoyable even with the pain and soreness. This stuff absolutely has to challenge you to your inner core, especially psychologically so you grow and can handle more on and off the bike.

[@ΘάνατοςΧορτοφάγος]

And in case it doesnt get mentioned, knees past toes is perfevtly fine and even preferred

[@thecyclinggreek274]

Good overview!

[@veganbeastmode]

If you’re a general Cyclist looking for strength gains, you can 100% do it at Planet Fitness. If you’re an elite athlete looking to build more strength, I’d find a fancier gym. I enjoy my Planet Fitness membership.

[@chrisridesbicycles]

@@veganbeastmode I was shocked how cheap that is in the US. You can barely find offers below 40-50 € here.

[@foldinghomealone]

Thank you for this video. Especially that you guys understand the difference between correlation and causation unlike Dr. Attia who recommends grip strength training for a prolonged life.

[@Monkey_slapping_keys]

Did some resistance work earlier this year, stopped for a bit due to tendon issues in my arms and then a shoulder injury from other activities. The body is wierd though, I'm a big lad and have over developed calfs, I can calf lift over 200 kilos for multiple sets but couldnt free squat 100 safely. Hack squat though, 200 for reps again. So don't expect it to make sense at first whilst you work out what you can do as a baseline. And importantly build into it. It takes a couple of weeks for your body to adapt to the DOMs and the first few sessions will ruin your week.

[@clos2132]

Just completed my century ride that I've been training for this year and want to get back to strength training (paused about 2 months ago to 100% focus on century). But I still want to maintain my cycling fitness for next year, so have been debating on what the best way to do this will be. Great timing on this video!

[@malp4650]

In season: If you're doing more than five reps, it's too light. You won't feel as fatigued, which allows further sport specific training

[@Jan-df7dl]

What do you want to train with lifting? Just full body strenght? Or maybe differ between training specific musclefibers when training your legs? Why only lift heavy unlike u are a sprinter. Which fibers do you want to make stronger? What kind of rider are you. I often miss that in strenght training for cyclists.

[@orbifold4387]

In addition to adding more protein, you also need to be in a calorie surplus to maximize the benefits.

[@miksalcuni]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but using the machine isolates the work on specific muscles, I understand the advantages of the ability to loan more with more security, the other way around using machines, cut off all the core and stability muscles groups. If this is true, in my opinion we should include them with additional exercises, right? Another point is about training just the muscles used on the bike, I think biking is not balancing engaging our body and gym should work as a competition, what is your opinion on this? Thank you

[@paulw677]

I recently started a strength program at the gym and found this episode really interesting. How important are single leg exercises vs both legs? With the ultimate goal being improving my time (and enjoyment) in a 10hr mountainous road event. (Take as a given that I'm following strictly a TR training plan and am consistently riding 8-12 hrs per week). Thanks for the episode👍

[@TrainerRoad]

You can do both legs at the same time to save TIME 😀>

[@hotsky83]

So true about stretching BEFORE working out. I stopped for a while and nothing but issues and injuries. Not worth it at all, I also stretch after as well.

[@Dakota.Covers]

Dynamic warm up before. Stretch afterwards.

[@starlitshadows]

​@@Dakota.Coversyep. Static stretching before can actually cause the muscle to weaken slightly and potentiallu increase risk of injury. Dynamic before, static after

[@hotsky83]

@@starlitshadows I bought into that for a while and it worked out not so well for me. Took me many months to hear the shoulder injury and yes I was warming up.

[@ΘάνατοςΧορτοφάγος]

Ego lifting half repping is the complete opposite of lengthed partials

[@jaredmickel7750]

Bench press is not great. Do DB presses. Easier on the shoulders, easier to do without a spotter. Better overall recruitment, and you can extend to range to a deeper stretch than with a bar. Lots of squat talk but nothing on dead lifts?

[@hotsky83]

Dumbbell press gets difficult to set up when you go heavy as it takes up a bit of your strength to get ready to play lift and 1st rep is always the hardest (as well as the last)

[@Der_Richiee]

There's nothing such as easier or harder on the shoulder when it's the same movement pattern. It comes down to load management. 120lbs DB presses are "harder" on the shoulders than 80lbs Barbell Benches. And you want your shoulders to adapt anyways.

[@jaredmickel7750]

@@hotsky83 I've worked my way up to the 75#'ers and I can see what you mean. You're working hard before you do your first rep. But that's also a very real-life kind of thing. I can see where once you're approach 200# total just getting them off the rack, onto the bench, back up, and re-racked is going to be its own challange.

[@irfuel]

@@Der_Richieewrong.

[@scorchedearthdj]

i have big calves and am a heel neutral rider. my case is probably genetic as my legs are also substantial from many different activities over the years.

[@ganeshdevkar4624]

Couldn't find the first part of this video, can someone tag it for me please?

[@strider7008]

Two words: lengthened partials. You and your joints will be thankful

[@johnlewis17]

Is there any plans to add workouts to the TrainerRoad app?

[@ivanborg]

add them to strava, and link your strava to trainerroad

[@johnlewis17]

@@ivanborg, I mean similar to the current setup, which tells you what you need to do for your cycling training but for weight training.

[@ivanborg]

@@johnlewis17 that'd be great!

[@matthewbasile9417]

How not to incorporate strength w/ cycling: SL5x5 plus two accessory lifts per workout…5 sets of everything. Absolutely obliterated my ability to handle cycling workouts. Should’ve started at two or three sets each 😂 Question for Nate, though: do you still think the TR strength benchmark are a good set of exercises and goals for cyclists? I was surprised to not hear anything about goal-setting.

[@HeibesHealth]

Why not, instead of barbells, front-loading squats with dumbbells? Front-loading is good for people just starting out that aren’t as steady in their squat form. Dumbbells are easy to drop if you fail your rep.

[@MysticMac000]

dumbbells for squats is dumb. The limiting factor quickly becomes how big of a dumbbell you can hold in your hands

[@bveb33]

I bet that would be fine for beginners, but legs are strong, and it's really hard to appropriately load a squat movement with just dumbbells. Also, you'll eventually end up limited by your arm strength. I'd think you'd be better off using a barbell with less weight as you gain confidence in the movement.

[@brentperez4700]

I love dumbbells, kettlebells too. Mix it up. Keeps your body guessing and your mind fresh, but always focus on good form.

[@brentperez4700]

I promise, unless you are a freak, you won’t add bulk by accident. It is very very very hard to do while doing endurance work.

[@bartix5839]

i can do 20 sets of leg press and on the next day do 1400 watts max power sprint :)

[@Once-a-fatman-nownormal]

Big calf’s I ride heel down

[@timtaylor9590]

dont need machines but maybe equipment, rings are amazing for upper body ppl have no clue until they try.

[@foundfoundfound1]

there are a number of useful, free apps for estimating 1rm, based on heaviest lifts for 3, 4, 5 reps etc.

[@andreassakkas7234]

TR's ability to talk for an hour and leave the listener more confused is amazing. Sorry guys

[@justinlavish3862]

I think that’s the nature of the science of the human body. Most complex machine we know of

[@chrisridesbicycles]

I tried a local gym recently and my biceps was out with DOMS for over a week. Any good advice on preventing that? (I will pay with calf muscle for Nate, I have plenty and it only rubs on the front mech)

[@gregbrown3764]

The best advice is to start very, very slowly. First couple weeks focus way more on correct movement than on any weight.

[@chrisridesbicycles]

@@gregbrown3764 Thanks! That nicely brings me to another question: „To failure“ usually means not exactly correct movement any more. Any tips to avoid injury other than using guided machines?

[@Der_Richiee]

Lower the total volume for a while and over time you won't get doms anymore. Then increase weight / reps / sets / time under tension

[@ColoCX]

42:18 1g of protein per pound not kg

[@patsmith4462]

Yes…. 42:15. It’s 1.6 to 1.8 g of protein per kilogram of bodyweight, per the studies…. when you do the conversion math that is about 1g of protein per 1 pound of body weight

[@ΘάνατοςΧορτοφάγος]

​@@patsmith4462to further clarify, it per lbs/ kg of lean body mass

[@ColoCX]

@@patsmith4462 wish they had a video editor for the mistakes

[@TrainerRoad]

You're right, sorry about that.

[@ivanmoreno5283]

NATE PLEASE Add the letter “S” to the word BICEP , this word doesn’t exist 😢 Etymologically means a two headed muscle . Same applies to TRICEPS, QUADRICEPS. Great content 💪🏻💪🏻 Killer mustache

[@timtaylor9590]

its impossible to really help ppl get started with strength training. the best advice is, just start doing it. its a life style and life long journey. you will get what you put in. whats good for one person may be terrible for another. knees over toe, bent back, half reps, jerking, fast reps, slow reps, theres no such thing as bad form, wrong form or right form. for cyclists this is a good starting point but as he stated their target audience is 30-50 who need more than a basic work out routine, most ppl need to change their entire mind set on what it means to be strong and efficient with their bodies. imo everyone should be doing movement exercises like ido portal stuff, yoga, and i highly recommend rings. the reason is because living comes first, overall health and balance comes before strong muscles, zone 1 and zone 2 on the bike is good because its a more natural state for our bodies and mind. the bike is already a super specialized movement so the body is crying out for more balance and freedom. weights may make you stronger but it will also add tension, as if group rides and kids werent enough, remember balance.

[@ΘάνατοςΧορτοφάγος]

Dont call it half reps, but lengthened partials please

[@natashatallent6566]

"cyclists never do any overhead motion". Unless you win 😁!

[@TrainerRoad]

🙌

[@enki42ea]

Need to have bodyweight exercises(i.e. when we have no equipment) in the training plan. When will this come?

[@SebastianBrandes2300]

I second this.

[@enki42ea]

I realize there are many who do more advanced exercise so would be hard to satisfy them but many of us don't know what we are doing at all and do no weight training so easy to get us improved. Maybe work with a third party that can integrate into TR if you don't want to do the workouts yourself? (Fitbod?)

[@oldanslo]

For most, bodyweight exercises aren't strength training. Strength is the maximum force that you can apply, so if the exercises don't require near maximal force, they won't improve strength. You can do all the body weight squats that you want, but you won't improve the maximum force that your legs can generate.

[@dyvel]

Bro-shaming is such a "i think I'm Cool"-word

[@cynthialee6147]

Nate- I know people who think fast, talk fast, to keep up with their thoughts. But, could you slow down? Hard to hear and process all your advice. Hmmm… steady efforts are more beneficial than occasional explosive workouts. Where have we learned that before? 😉

[@juicyfruit100x]

0.5x speed on KZbin could be helpful for you then! Makes the podcast longer though.

[@ramblingofvesves]

NO PAIN, NO GAIN this is the worst advice I've ever followed. The pain IS our friend! We have to understand what kind of pain we feel. At 40 I had to stop any sport activity, (stop for almost 10 very long years) the wall was hitted! For 15 years I pushed my body to the limit. And pain, injuries, recovering - and again. I was stupid - very stupid. Family, children, all day work, training, 6h sleep and repeat. We have to be wise! We have to understand our body, our capabilities and the most important thing is to determine our goals in the light of our current life conditions. We have to learn to recognize the pain. Now I'm 54 (not 45), 3 times per w in gym, 3 times on bike, 1d rest. In the Summer - 1 to 2 gym sessions and 5 on bike. I feel better than when I was young.

[@marcosamigos]

VBT is almighty

[@suisinghoraceho2403]

Okay, Nate, sorry, but the moustache doesn’t quite work for ya. 🤣🤣🤣

[@jeremys2159]

Thanks for your input.

[@ΘάνατοςΧορτοφάγος]

Maybe let Nate decide and keep moustache shaming out of here?

[@suisinghoraceho2403]

@@ΘάνατοςΧορτοφάγος Come on guys, it’s just a joke. Why so serious? Actually on second thought, he’s quite cute in that moustache 🥸 particularly because it doesn’t really fit.

[@ryane2117]

I love trainer road and it has improved my cycling by leaps and bounds but what Nate is talking about here is the approach for hypertrophy, not strength. Here is a podcast with someone who knows what they are talking about. It’s a clip , but the whole podcast is fascinating. kzbin.info/www/bejne/e5m0pZ6kesuLgqssi=2fw38sDxxSQ-Yyze

[@thatguy9051]

Multimillion dollar company too tight to hire an occasional expert for good information rather than, "I heard a study that said this"...........can we step it up please?

[@chriskalman4555]

Small calves, major toe pointer and horrible hamstring flexibility.

[@JulAlxAU]

Be very cautious with weights. You can easily destroy your knees if you do it recklessly.

[@kbd13-n9c]

You can destroy joints and back in general

[@Der_Richiee]

Outdated view. You can destroy your knees if you cycle recklessly. It comes down to load management.

[@JulAlxAU]

@@Der_Richiee I’m speaking of experience. Too heavy and you will hurt yourself, will be off the bike for a while. Not worth it. I would stick to lighter weights and higher repetitions.

[@Der_Richiee]

@@JulAlxAU again, load management und bio-psycho-social faftors. I'm speaking of current evidence in physio therapy and rehab.

[@timtaylor9590]

dont use straps learn the hook grip