How do I get my friends to like DIFFICULT MUSIC?

[@GreenManalishiUSA]

Years ago I had a roommate whom I tried to turn on to the no wave band DNA, specifically their EP, A Taste of DNA. Never before or since have I seen someone react so angrily to an album. He screamed and insisted that I take it off, and when I asked him to just give it a chance, he stormed out of the apartment. A week later, he went down to the record store and bought his own copy. Go figure.

[@ajames283]

Sounds like bipolar or cluster b personality disorder

[@samuel_andreyev]

I love that!

[@Juan-wo7zu]

My favourite no wave band! Arto Lindsay is a beast on skronky guitar.

[@xboxgamer474246]

If anyone says “I won’t need counterpoint” I’d snap back “not with that attitude!” You can put counterpoint anywhere.

[@zapazap]

Able to put a thing in any place does not entail needing that thing.

[@garretkaplan]

I can put deez nuts anywhere on your face

[@gerhardprasent3358]

​@@zapazap Without counterpoint you won't be able to write music above a certain ( quite low) level.

[@zapazap]

@@gerhardprasent3358 I am not well versed, but I don't think classical Raga relies much on counterpoint, at least not in the western sense.

[@goatuscrow4135]

I am a devoted “Trout Mask Replica” fan since I first heard it in the early 1990’s in my late 20’s. Your “Frownland” video made me an instant subscriber and follower. Keep up the good work!

[@samuel_andreyev]

Thanks!

[@mdhj67]

I tried "Trout Mask Replica" and found it to be unlistenable (is that a word?). It's OK, I put ketchup on everything.

[@FreakieFan]

I'm sure these Q&A videos are easier and less time-and-money intensive to make than the analysis videos (which is a point I totally understand), so I hope you will make more of these. The Q&A's are some of my favorite videos on your channel.

[@samuel_andreyev]

Thanks - I enjoy making them as they foster a true sense of engagement with the community - and the questions are always so excellent. I should add that the next video will be an analysis though (at last!)

[@guest_informant]

It seems to me that music is, for most people, extremely difficult to talk about, to articulate. I was talking with a friend about this the other day and we wondered if it's because music pre-dates language. Music is able to communicate in a way that language can't, so no wonder it is hard (or for some of us, impossible) to talk about. Growing up with a very strong interest in a) music and b) understanding I obviously wanted to understand music :-) but everywhere I looked I could only find discussions of, say, lyrics and personalities, and not the actual music. For me your analysis of music is crystal clear, passionate, and articulate. It's also democratic (if that's the word I am looking for). This is an extremely rare combination in any area, but especially for music, and music is so profoundly important for so many people. It's taken a while, but it seems like through the bush telegraph the word is getting out. The Mighty Algorithm brought me here many years ago. I am very grateful it did - I still don't get Frownland, but I'll keep trying. Thank You 🙂

[@ajames283]

Lack of music vocabulary. Usually not learned in public school.

[@DeflatingAtheism]

I read “social prominence” as something that’s been afforded to very, very few composers of concert music in the 20th Century- namely, the “crossover appeal” of a Samuel Barber or a Henryk Górecki.

[@FreakieFan]

You're spot on with the answer to the second question. People who claim that "oh, I don't need to know how to write counterpoint because I compose only in style X" have no idea what they're missing out on. I'm a classically trained composer, but I mostly work in the field of film/tv/games music (though I still write concert music occasionally) and I often participate in events where composers and media creators come together to meet, pitch and demonstrate their work to each other for possible future collaborations. And I can always instantly tell when a fellow composer has studied their technique or not, or if they are coming from a music production or instrumentalist background (often pop/jazz, which is very common these days). If these differences in quality are noticeable to the filmmakers and creators, I don't know, but for me, yes, even in the world of film composition, this matters hugely!

[@zapazap]

I suspect those who say the same thing about serial row music also do not know what they are missing.

[@theonewithoutidentity]

@@zapazap I believe that in order to appreciate any art, you need to bridge the gap between you and the piece of work. That can be via understanding and appreciating it on a technical level, or on more emotional like via repeated exposure or relating it to something else in your life. I have definitely began appreciating a more diverse set of genres after having learned music theory, even though a lot of the things I appreciate today used to be a technical curiosity, like contemporary classical or jazz fusion.

[@zapazap]

@@theonewithoutidentity I've long appreciated classical. In my teens I discovered Frank Zappa. A friend introduced be to jazz in my thirties. Right now I am exploring classical Indian Raga.

[@RainGodRecordsInc]

A mate admitted later that when I first played him Montana by Zappa, he thought I was mentally ill. He went on to become the biggest Zappa fan I know and even had Montana as his ring tone at one point. I had Trout Mask in my collection for years believing it to be self indulgent crap, it wasn't until I read a book about Beefheart that said to leave it on in the background and ignore it that it 'emerged', I still think it's one of the best albums ever.

[@okayfine6342]

love the response on getting friends into hard music! as i've gotten to be a stronger player on my instrument (sax), I know it's out of genuine best interest that I want a friend to be as deeply excited as i am with the infinite number of little details i know and hear that make me happy it's kind to share and be excited, but it's nobody's obligation to put in a ton of effort trying to find the same meaning that you do :)

[@qualiatranscript]

I was about to post my own timestamps, but I was pleasantly surprised to see you have made your own this time around. I will still post the timestamps for the mentions of figures and works, because it's something I tend to do for all youtube "podcasts-like" videos I watch and enjoy, out of personal entertainment and in case anyone is equally interested or motivated by seeing names of artists they appreciate being mentioned in a video. Anyway, I enjoyed this Q&A! Thank you for sharing it with us, Samuel.

[@qualiatranscript]

● People: [ 9:37 ] Ludwig Van Beethoven [ 9:39 ] Johannes Brahms [ 9:41 ] Richard Wagner [ 9:43 ] Gustav Mahler [ 9:45 ] Claude Debussy [ 20:38 ] Harrison Birtwhistle [ 20:40 ] Brian Ferneyhough

[@qualiatranscript]

● Works: [ 22:32 ] "Swollows", by Samuel Andreyev [ 23:07 ] "The Tubular West", by Samuel Andreyev

[@samuel_andreyev]

That’s super helpful! Thanks!!

[@FreakieFan]

Congrats on the new studio! Looks fantastic. Perhaps consider doing a studio tour? I'd also love to see the space where you compose/work?

[@samuel_andreyev]

Sure, good idea! Maybe I’ll do that.

[@JimmyHeight]

I'd love to hear more podcasts with important composers and scholars!

[@fstover5208]

Happy Birthday to Samuel. Live long and prosper. I come here because I have some things in common with Samuel, a serious composer. I appreciate his depth of understanding but find myself disagreeing with him half the time. That said, it's good for personal growth to hear differing opinions. The question, How Do I Get My Friends to like Difficult Music? I was concerned about this in my youth. Being 70, I could care less if the people around me understand what I'm doing. I'm used to being surrounded by dummies so I have no expectations.

[@freedomfilms974]

That new studio space looks legit. Love the framing of the shots too. I recently got my girlfriend into Henry Cow which is a major success because she’s not big into avant-garde music.

[@Palefury018]

Henry Cow… that is an impressive feat. Just Leg End or the others as well? I think that Leg End is their most accessible

[@freedomfilms974]

@@Palefury018 Oddly enough, she found Unrest more appealing. Fine by me. One of my favorite albums ever.

[@brötzmannsax]

Henry Now has reunited Fred Frith, Tim Hodgkinson, Chris Cutler and John Greaves, check out their live shows.

[@jonzaremba]

Thanks for answering these questions. Although we likely have very different artistic ideals, I watch your videos to learn effective ways to articulate a point and how to communicate an idea succinctly. I truly appreciate what you do and hope you can find the time to produce more analysis videos in the future. Until then, I will enjoy all your other content.

[@mattia.a_p]

I think you mentioned the sopranino saxophone piece in the interview we did :) looking forward to hear it! Belated happy birthday Samuel

[@rafaelfernandeslopesdeoliv1700]

Hey man, happy birthday and thank you very much for answering my very specific questions. Yes i am familiar with The Tubular West and i love it very much, in fact Winter in Århus is one of my favourite things i've heard from you, i was asking specifically about the pre-France albums. Guess i'll go do some googling now for the other available stuff. And i am looking forward to the sopranino piece, hopefully the video on your channel is that version and not the clarinet one. Again, thanks a lot for answering me.

[@alexanderkennedy4851]

Congratulations and happy birthday!

[@rubenmolino1480]

The situation is simple: ..If someone has nothing to say,...the healthiest thing is to abandon ship,...and applaud the originality of others,...and that ethics does have value.

[@StefaanHimpe]

Happy (late) Birthday to you :D

[@robinjones6999]

I love all your video content - Ive been following you for about 2 years

[@samuel_andreyev]

Thanks, Robin

[@nicoladisvevia]

Apropos nothing in particular, I've come to enjoy your videos!

[@johannesbowman2194]

I am so glad you talked about composition portfolios. I tried, unsuccessfully, to apply to several composition programs at the graduate level. I got past the interview stage but it did not end up working out for me. Your advice has been extremely beneficial. Had I known some of your advice earlier I might have had a better shot at making it to composition school. But now, it's not too late, I will take your advice starting now. Thank you for your remarkable insights!

[@samuel_andreyev]

Keep going!! And good luck

[@jamesgorman7846]

Rayyyyyyyyyyy H.B.D !!!!!!! Love you.one of the smartest peeps on You Tube.

[@bf0189]

I'm mostly in the jazz world (albeit as a listener) and the same problem exists of the museumification. It's important to learn and enjoy the roots but there must be space for new styles to emerge from. I love Ellington as much as I love contemporary stuff. There needs to be a holistic approach of old and new.

[@okayfine6342]

with that i find a HUGE issue with figures like wynton marsalis that pretty much pretend like any vaguely recent jazz just didn't happen and is a waste of time... there's so so many beautiful and creative and unique new sounds that have come later and we have a hugely popular figure in jazz actively going against it. not to mention the many other problems with him... :)

[@theonewithoutidentity]

I feel like there actually needs to be (and thankfully is) a greater importance placed on filtering the past, otherwise it will encompass an ever-greater volume of our collective attention, as time goes on and there is more art from the past. If you paid and equal amount of attention to every decade since "art" has existed, you'd probably experience, like, 1 contemporary piece of art per year.

[@apchsiri1156]

"What we call museums -mausoleums, rather, in which a dead art heaps up its remains- are those the places where the Muses intended to dwell? We do not keep in show-cases the coins current in the world. A living art does not produce curiosities to be collected but spiritual necessaries to be diffused." (George Santayana)

[@spacerockwizard]

Great advice here. I've figured out some of these questions on my own and have arrived at similar conclusions.

[@FelipeTellez]

Loved this video and how you are sharing your thoughts

[@jacksonelmore6227]

If I was gonna be blunt or egotistical I’d say I don’t consider someone a real composer without a willingness for counterpoint and voice leading And artistic personality 🖼️ HBD 🎊 🎉 hope to see your continued artistic and public expansion 😎🙏

[@samuel_andreyev]

Thanks!

[@TeemuOnteroComposer]

One might have a genuine artistic vision to just do polyphonic musical/sound voices that don't have anything to do with each other. But I suppose even in that case one might want to know something about how it was done previously, perhaps just to avoid "harmonious"/"fitting" voices by accident. 😉

[@jacksonelmore6227]

@@TeemuOnteroComposer I mean, THAT is ultimately valid Maybe that’s just my taste I respect a lot of composers who don’t use such strict counterpoint or voice leading, I like free jazz and Indian music, caveman rock songs, but these are more Dionysian than composed Jazz is like the middle ground They can skin the cat their own way, but for many composers it’s as if I see them holding themselves back by just pissing into midi (I’ve been guilty of it) I just know that when I integrated voice leading and counterpoint I start listening to my own music and I’m thinking to myself damn I’m Mozart Like, you can go from being good or even great, to making divine music ❤️‍🔥🙏

[@TeemuOnteroComposer]

@@jacksonelmore6227 I am more in the position that I think it's actually pretty cool to have voices that don't blend well together. Nature and the Universe are not about blending things smoothly together, it's all pretty chaotic. Anyway, we all have our own tastes in things and it's great too!

[@jacksonelmore6227]

@@TeemuOnteroComposer hey I feel that! I’ll check out your channel 🙏

[@johnpcomposer]

Sam, Brilliant video. These are such great questions with thoughtful answers.

[@Gustavriber]

I love how you phrased "they've never 'sat though' a Wagner opera"

[@taylorflowers4598]

First time I've heard "lacunae" like that... 🎉🎉

[@videomillsy]

I was a huge fan of Trout Mask Replica. It made sense at the time if you were there as I was, and it still does. 😊

[@drrendezvous1014]

Good to hear, man! Right on!

[@msjoanofthearc]

I love and have DVV albums on vinyl, along with his artwork, and promotional venue posters, CB rocks! Also enjoy Jane, Sun Ra, SRC, Master's Apprentices, and of course the Dictators!

[@notator]

26'23" to 28'03": Yes indeed! :-) That advice is probably true for _any_ career choice at the moment, but its _especially_ true for composition students!

[@PabloGambaccini]

I completelly agree with the balance issue. I apply it to myself. I study 20% of repertoire from the great pieces of the past in order to challenge and inspire me and 80% of repertoire from my own compositions. 💪 (it's just a pareto propportion, for those who know 😂, but I think institutions should do the same with proframs, 80% from living composers... so they can also make a living a 20%, from dead ones)

[@falstmusic]

I have a suggestion for monetizing analysis videos: Make a digital product for every analysis, lets say a pdf of commentary + audio files, and see if it sells well. You can use the video to promote it. Wishing you all the best, Samuel !

[@zarg05]

You can't really. And does it matter? Music is a personal journey. I love difficult music. I also like simple music. I just enjoy exploring new sounds be it in any genre. Schoenberg, Ligeti, Cecil Taylor, Allan Holdsworth, Derek Bailey . I tend to listen to the musical outsiders, the challengers. Its amazing they survive in anty cultural climate where being normal and obedience in sanctioned gate keeping.Just enjoy it.

[@briancornish2076]

I don't have any friends so I can listen to whatever I please. Couperin, Alkan, Sorabji, Stockhausen (of course).The most complex and intense Messiaen - Livre d'Orgue. I don't have to explain anything to people who aren't ever going to be convinced anyway. And yes, I understand: it's the reason I have no friends.

[@trydowave]

I love video game music. Especially c64 sid chip tunes. Some of my favourite melodies have came out if that little sound chip from 1982. Getting others to appreciate it though is very difficult. ;)

[@skylarlimex]

Great video as always Samuel and happy birthday!

[@samuel_andreyev]

Nice to hear from you, Skylar. Send me an update some time.

[@skylarlimex]

@@samuel_andreyev I will!

[@RD-zj6vc]

Bribes. Kidding, it's really hypnosis.

[@guille____]

great video Samuel. I recently subscribed, you're content is very interesting!

[@Arnoldiepin]

it's fascinating that you should come across increasing number of students who aren't familiar either standard rep, when it's in a practical sense at it's most accessible ever, here with score videos on KZbin. having access in the abstract to the whole universe doesn't grant you the motivation or guidance to make the necessary inquiries I suppose

[@stevealleman9206]

The photo of Rimbaud on the shelf behind you is a nice touch.

[@samuel_andreyev]

It’s an oil painting made by a friend and given to me over 20 years ago. Thanks for noticing!

[@f.botello]

happy birthday! 🎉

[@remingtongagnard4442]

My question seems dumb in retrospect but thank you so much for answering! It's like trying to make someone like black licorice, totally out there acquired taste! Best I can do is let them know it exists and not be too obnoxious about it 🎉

[@samuel_andreyev]

Not dumb at all. Thanks for the question 🙏

[@jwc3o2]

sometimes all people need is a little guidance: a truly interested-but-baffled listener faced with something that sounds like sheer cacaphony can have that resolved into mellifluous polyphony just by drawing attention to one aspect of consistency (or - the same thing, really - deliberate inconsistency) that everything anchors to or wraps around like some kind of sonic DNA. people whose "use" of music is equatable to a kind of aural wallpaper are generally not people willing to deliberately LISTEN to much of anything.

[@DavidCarltonAdams]

Congrats on the new digs!

[@DavidCarltonAdams]

Thanks also for all your work - and happy belated!

[@StephenGrew]

Then all the music that has elapsed, would progress as it did, but would start from now...day 1

[@p-__]

My farts are better than Samuel's farts.

[@ordinarryalien]

​@@p-__You know what? You're probably right.

[@ordinarryalien]

Nice profile picture, Stephen.

[@ChristianMechem]

Happy (Belated) Birthday Samuel!

[@samuel_andreyev]

Thank you, Christian

[@truBador2]

Both technically and psychologically speaking, all there is any more is difficult music. I.e., Noise.

[@jasonmillion5970]

Henry Cows a great band Fred Frith. Do you have any of Magma's albums ? I do

[@oldboarbrain]

Would you be able to help me learn composition of organum for gregorian chant? It's relatively simple, but also niche.

[@Freddy-Da-Freeloadah]

Q: "How do I get my friends to like DIFFICULT MUSIC?" A: you don't. Just find friends that like crazy stuff... IMHO

[@TJHANEY]

I think you should always share your interests with your friends. people change their minds and grow all the time! But-- without expectation to keep you from being let down. Finding people who love the weird stuff to fill that desire is definitely necessary, I agree, but share important things to you with those OOTL friends when it's relevant. I always leave it at that. And I love receiving that from friends and finding the importance in that suggestion that I never would have bothered with otherwise.

[@rubenmolino1480]

It would be nice, if you could do a report and if it would be to your liking, Alan Belkin!

[@zkreso]

I'd love to hear your thoughts on improvisational avant-garde music

[@samuel_andreyev]

Such as?

[@zkreso]

​@@samuel_andreyev Anything within free jazz and/or free improv really. Is it something you enjoy, and if so, are there any particular recordings? Personally I'm fond of recordings by AMM and their individual members' other projects, when it comes to free improv at least.

[@michaelketley1252]

Thanks

[@lippi2171]

It's difficult. My music project (me) debuted with an experimental concept EP that I promoted on my personal Facebook page 😬 I kinda cringe about that eversince. Most people want pop music, regardless of style it has to be accessible.

[@SuonoReale]

14:25 This can also be incredibly stimulating/inspirational from a compositional perspective, in and of itself, apart from trying to get into a comp program. 28:58 I lent 2 albums to my Japanese neighbour back in 2003. One was a video game album 'Masashi Hamauzu Rhapsody on a Theme of Saga Frontier 2' ,and the other was a CD of Takemitsu's "From Me Flow What You Call Time" and some other works by him. When he gave them back to me he commented on how good the Takemitsu album was, but he didn't say anything about the other album.

[@ManiacalForeigner]

Hamauzu is a phenomenal composer. A very distinct voice in the world in video game music. Criminally underrated.

[@greggcoppolo8430]

Captain Beefheart is a Legend!

[@Mai-Gninwod]

A response to your final question: I halfway disagree. It is true that you cannot make your friend love what you love. But my friend made me love heavy metal by exposing me to heavier and heavier songs throughout our friendship. Relationships shape who you are.

[@MrDaigoRiki]

You look exactly 43 years old but your mind is open minded and never ages.

[@jojoestoy]

I think you have not quite answered the question with regards to your (contemporary Western art music composers) attitudes towards contemporary film music (say that of John Williams)? Do you respect, despise or ignore them?

[@royaebrahim2449]

❤❤🎉❤❤

[@micpoc4597]

From my experience, it’s much easier to get new friends.

[@samuel_andreyev]

Yeah that works too ;)

[@Eclipto14]

Someone spill their beans and tell us where to find these "other" (not "Swallos") "weird pop music" albums.

[@samuel_andreyev]

They are out there, but very hard to find

[@scottbubb2946]

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him listen to Frownland.

[@theonewithoutidentity]

24:10 If you were Jacob Collier, you'd just release these 'laboratory' albums anyways.

[@Superphilipp]

Oh come on, these clickbait titles are getting ridiculous. This is a birthday FAQ video, just call it that.

[@Sophia-le3px]

he actually does answer the question it’s just not the whole video. the level of clickbait could be orders of magnitude worse stop complaining.

[@Superphilipp]

@@Sophia-le3px It could also be better.

[@Sophia-le3px]

@@Superphilipp i’d rather this content get views than to have more honest titles. this channel is how i discovered the new music world it’s changed the course of my life and it could do the same for others

[@glenngould7299]

I did listen to stuff like Einstein On The Beach and the Trout Mask Replica. I do not think it is really music. It is more like musical art. You like it or you do not like..there is no wrong there..just do not try to force such stuff upon peope..