How Manta Style Actually Works in 7.36

[@beneaththeveil]

Gamers! Small correction @13:00 regarding the passive Pierce of MKB and Bloodthorn: Illusions do not gain the additional 70/50 magic damage on hit, but all the other Pierce mechanics work for Illusions. During the Soul Rend active: Illusions do deal additional magic damage though - game isn’t confusing at all… If there’s anything you think we missed below (especially Innates and Facets since they’re likely having their interactions shadow patched) please let us know and we’ll make addendums with credit Buffs: Alchemist’s Chemical Rage, Armlet of Mordiggian’s Unholy Strength (only from Strength), Dragon Knight’s Elder Dragon Form (without Wyrm Wrath buffs based on Facet), Lone Druid’s True Form, Lycan’s Shapeshift or Wolf Bite, Consumed Moon Shard (only the Night Vision Bonus), Terrorblade’s Metamorphosis, Troll Warlord’s Berserker’s Rage, Undying’s Flesh Golem Attack Modifiers: Abaddon’s Curse of Avernus, Bloodthorn’s Pierce, Chaos Knight’s Chaos Strike, Crystalys, Daedalus & Khanda Critical Strike, Diffusal Blade & Disperser’s Mana Break, Drow Ranger’s Marksmanship Split Shot, Juggernaut’s Blade Dance, Legion Commander’s Moment of Courage, Luna’s Moon Glaives, Lycan’s Shapeshift & Wolf Bite, Mask of Madness Lifesteal, Medusa’s Split Shot, MKB Pierce, Morbid Mask Lifesteal, Muerta’s Gunslinger, Orb of Venom Poison Attack, Phantom Assassin’s Coup de Grace, Phantom Lancer’s Juxtapose, Satanic Lifesteal, Sniper’s Take Aim, Spectre’s Desolate, Templar Assassin’s Psi Blades, Troll Warlord’s Fervor, Venomancer’s Poison Sting, Vladmir’s Offering’s Aura, Wraith King’s Mortal Strike Passive Abilities: Abyssal Blade, Crimson Guard & Vanguard Damage Block, Aether Lens Increased Cast Range, Axe’s Counter Helix, Enchantress’ Untouchable, Huskar’s Berserker's Blood, Medusa’s Split Shot, Night Stalker’s Hunter in the Night, Octarine Core Cooldown Reduction, Ogre Magi’s Multicast, Phantom Lancer’s Phantom Rush, Shadow Fiend’s Necromastery, Storm Spirit’s Overload, Treant Protector’s Nature’s Guise, Visage’s Gravekeeper’s Cloak Partially Functional Passives: Bloodseeker’s Thirst (Movespeed limit works but not the movespeed bonus, hero detection and vision), Bristleback’s Bristleback (only damage reduction), Tidehunter’s Kraken Shell (only damage reduction), Timbersaw’s Reactive Armor (only HP Regen), Auras: Assault Cuirass Assault Aura, Buckler Aura, Centaur Warrunner’s Retaliate (Illusions bestow Aura but don’t benefit themselves), Crystal Maiden’s Arcane Aura, Guardian Greaves Guardian Aura, Headdress Regeneration Aura, Luna’s Lunar Blessing, Lycan’s Feral Impulse, Mekansm Aura, Necrophos’ Heartstopper Aura, Pipe of Insight Insight Aura, Radiance Burn (lowered damage), Ring of Basilius and Veil of Discord Basilius Aura, Shadow Fiend’s Presence of the Dark Lord, Shiva’s Guard Freezing Aura, Underlord’s Atrophy Aura (Underlord gains damage if an enemy dies in range of his illusion no matter his hero’s range from them), Vengeful Spirit’s Vengeance Aura (Scepter Illusion bestows the Aura but does not gain the bonus damage itself), Vladimir’s Offering Vladmir’s Aura Innate Abilities: Anti-Mage’s Mana Break Bane’s Ichor of Nyctasha Batrider’s Smoldering Resin Beastmaster’s Inner Beast Bloodseeker’s Sanguivore (restores less when unit dies) Bristleback’s Warpath Broodmother’s Spider’s Milk Chaos Knight’s Reins of Chaos (50% chance to spawn 3rd Illusion with Manta) Crystal Maiden’s Blueheart Floe Dark Seer’s Mental Fortitude Dawnbreaker’s Break of Dawn (if making illusions of her while on enemy team you gain the effect when daytime hits if your illusions are up) Death Prophet’s Witchcraft Disruptor’s Electromagnetic Repulsion Dragon Knight’s Dragon Blood Drow Ranger’s Precision Aura Earthshaker’s Aftershock Elder Titan’s Natural Order Ember Spirit’s Flame Guard Enigma’s Gravity Well Faceless Void’s Illusions are Innately Immune to Chronosphere (regardless of Allegiance) Hoodwink’s Mistwoods Wayfarer Juggernaut’s Duelist Keeper Of The Light’s Mana Magnifier Legion Commander’s Moment of Courage Magnus’ Solid Core Mars’ Dauntless (Illusions count as part of the ability) Medusa’s Mana Shield (Illusions absorb less damage) Mirana’s Selemene’s Faithful increases healing of Healing Lotuses if you make Illusions of an enemy Mirana Morphling’s Accumulation Muerta’s Supernatural Naga Siren’s Eelskin Necrophos’ Sadist Night Stalker’s Heart of Darkness Omniknight’s Degen Aura Oracle’s Prognosticate (if making Illusions of enemy Oracle you can gain the Innate for the duration of your illusion) Phantom Assassin’s Immaterial Phantom Lancer’s Phantom Rush Primal Beast’s Colossal Pudge’s Flesh Heap Razor’s Unstable Current Shadow Demon’s Menace Slardar’s Seaborn Sentinel (only gives movespeed and HP Regen, not damage and armor) Sniper’s Keen Scope Spectre’s Spectral Storm Spirit’s Galvanised Sven’s Vanquisher Templar Assassin’s Psi Blades Terrorblade’s Dark Unity (Only applies to TB controlled Units) Treant Protector’s Nature’s Guise (Shard upgrade gives Invisibility to Illusions of Treant) Tusk’s Bitter Chill Underlord’s Atrophy Aura (explained in Aura section) Venomancer’s Poison Sting Viper’s Corrosive Skin (only DPS and Slow Bonuses) Visage’s Gravekeeper’s Cloak Void Spirit’s Intrinsic Edge (HP/Mana Regen, Base Magic Resist and Base Armor) Windranger’s Easy Breezy Wraith King’s Vampiric Spirit Facets: Axe’s One Man Army (Illusions gain bonus Strength per their Armor so long as no other allies, Illusions or Axe himself is around) Bane’s Dream Stalker also increases attack speed of his illusions on Nightmared units Beastmaster’s Wild Hunt (Allied Illusions count as additional units to give bonus Attack Speed) Centaur Warrunner’s Horsepower Chaos Knight’s Phantasmagoria (Makes Illusions Strong Illusions) Dark Seer’s Quick Wit & Heart of Battle Drow Ranger’s Vantage Point Elder Titan’s Deconstruction Enchantress’ Spellbound (Attack Range on Enchanted Units benefits her Illusions too) Enigma’s Event Horizon Juggernaut’s Bladeform Kunkka’s Grog Blossom (Damage Delay Buff applies to Illusions) Lion’s Fist of Death (Illusions get melee damage but not cleave) Lycan’s Pack Leader (Illusions killing heroes extend Shapeshift Naga Siren’s Rip Tide (Deluge only on Allied Illusions) Meepo’s Pack Rat (Illusions gain Attributes from any item in Neutral Item Slot as per normal Illusion rules) Morphling’s Ebb & Flow Nature’s Prophet’s Soothing Saplings (Heal Illusions when nearby Sprout) Necrophos’ Profane Potency Omniknight’s Omnipresent Spectre’s Forsaken Techies’ Squee’s Scope Templar Assassin’s Voidblades Tidehunter’s Kraken Swell (increases damage block of Kraken Shell which illusions get) & Krill Eater (everything except Anchor Smash radius benefits Illusions) Tiny’s Insurmountable Treant Protector’s Primeval Power (Increases Base Damage) & Sapling (Leech Seed heals Illusions) Troll Warlord’s Bad Influence (grants Attack Speed bonus to Illusions) Vengeful Spirit’s Soul Strike (Illusions also count as melee for proccing on hit effects that illusions can such as Orb of Venom) Venomancer’s Plague Carrier (can be attached to Illusions) Windranger’s Tailwind (Illusions gain additional movement speed)

[@Brain.Damage.]

You legend¡

[@quinell-firestruthers8151]

You mentioned to check pinned for the Critical strike breakdown, yet it seems to not be there..... (Items)

[@beneaththeveil]

@@quinell-firestruthers8151 We initially planned to do a section on Critical Strike items and effects but as it turned out the only ones that don't work for illusions are the ones tied to active hero skills (Tusk and Bounty Hunter). All other critical strike passives (such as PA ult, PL 25 talent etc.) all spread to illusions so it was actually much simpler and we figured it wasn't worth overcomplicating. If you check the attack modifiers you can see Crystalys, Daedalus & Khanda are all grouped together :)

[@raulmontero8736]

Great work team. I learned a lot with this video, after 15 years of dota. What a learning curve...😂 Btw so nice u clear the Javelins material items. I knew they dont get the dmg proc. Was broken if they buged this patch

[@beneaththeveil]

@@raulmontero8736 beautiful thing about Dota. You never stop learning

[@nbchannelnb]

Never knew about 0.25s trick, explains how pros sometimes immediately find the real enemy

[@beneaththeveil]

It's one of those things that once you start seeing it, you can't un-see it

[@gaetanhennebert2403]

Same! Its been a while and i havent saw rhis too!

[@Ggfc-w9s]

Iv also noticed the manta active will form in a triangle with the illusions being further from eachother than the real hero. They form a triangle with the 2 illusions being further from eachother than the hero. Once you see it, it becomes very clear.

[@imfinishedgrinding638]

You forgot to consider Mjollnir, the usual go to counter item against Illusion heroes. Great video though and I didn't even know about Manta Style activation giving a brief window to spot the real hero.

[@beneaththeveil]

Good point! Also didn't mention Battle Fury too. Typically don't see players having issues going those items though. Wanted to highlight Crimson Guard in particular and then also overwhelming magic damage so both teams in illusion hero games have something to consider they'd usually overlook. Yeah, the Manta Style trick is pretty nasty.

[@sovannreaksachea7258]

Tbh with you i always love the way you explain things about Dota. Please keep it coming low ranker like me really need to understand which item to build on our own not base on the dota guide.

[@beneaththeveil]

Can do!

[@zzadrianzz]

Yoo great video once again Really interesting topic with lots of small details that I think a lot of people (me included) forget about or miss

[@beneaththeveil]

Thank you! The devil is in the details for sure. We forgot to mention classic illusion counter items like Mjollnir just due to time restrictions. God damn DOTA being so complicated

[@chowwwie3322]

Nice content!keep it up brother! Looking forward for more!

[@beneaththeveil]

Appreciate it!

[@guilestevenobligar5728]

to quote Ana "I mean, I don't even know wtf is going on"

[@pedda4834]

Just stumbled upon your channel. Instantly Subbed. Great Videos.

[@beneaththeveil]

Glad to hear! Welcome aboard!

[@lagunabad]

its good manta with drow ranger? in what situation i buy this manta. if i play drow, not many times im using manta

[@beneaththeveil]

Drow likes Manta for two main reasons: the first being the dispel. It's not uncommon for heroes to try and jump Drow then try silencing her and locking her down so they can kill her. The dispel lets her get her spells up so she is able to use Gust to silence the enemy, push them away from her and then retreat and sometimes turn the fight using her range advantage. Secondly: the stats are just good for her. Drow's Marksmanship scales with Agility, plus the percentage movement speed bonus helps her move around the map faster so she can get from camp to camp quicker and farm faster overall. For heroes like Drow, Luna and Medusa who don't move quickly but farm fast: a Yasha along with Boots and a casual Wind Lace help them move around the map much faster and hasten their item timings through increased GPM

[@hellnickyable]

2:11 so that's why manta doesn't really works against auto-attacks......

[@beneaththeveil]

:)

[@fullmil3]

illusions can proc mkb magic dmg? that sounds insanely broken but ive never noticed it before

[@imfinishedgrinding638]

I don't think they do also he followed up a comment here to mention that mistake. However though Illusions will benefit from MKB's true strike. It's still not a great item to buy for Illusion carries coz their Illusions really do not benefit much except for truestrike. CK and TB might consider it in certain matchups especially against PA but it's just awful to buy it on Naga and PL. Bloodthorne is a better alternative for them though it is more expensive.

[@beneaththeveil]

As the other commenter has already mentioned yes we were mistaken there and corrected ourselves in our pinned comment. Illusions still gain the passive chance to pierce evasion through the passive Pierce effects of both MKB and Bloodthorn but do not deal the extra magical damage on strike. However during the Soul Rend active from Bloodthorn: all units hitting the silenced hero will have additional magic damage added to their strikes. This counts for illusions as well as creeps and other creep units :)

[@TheVaporwaveExp]

Good vid my man. +1 sub

[@beneaththeveil]

Welcome aboard! Thank you!

[@gaetanhennebert2403]

I didnt know why most of the time, i select the right hero instead of illu! Thats bc he spawn a little faster! 6000h and i didnt saw that! 😲

[@reiokimura6519]

Used to be able to break illusion using lion's mana burn with fast cooldown, sadly it doesn't work anymore

[@beneaththeveil]

This still works on basic illusions ☺️

[@reiokimura6519]

@@beneaththeveil I think I used it on TerrorBlade's illusion, that didn't work

[@beneaththeveil]

@@reiokimura6519 It should work on Terrorblade's illusions. Sounds like you drained the real hero

[@DavidGlendaleArdenaso]

to be fair they were both already named like that back in DotA 1 but yeah I would be nice if Manta Style's active got a new name

[@beneaththeveil]

As people who never played DotA: Allstars, thank you for this piece of lore ❤️

[@markshelor3991]

Stop. The name is fine

[@ns.yannis9718]

omg, i was wondering why i recognized everytime the real heros to the illu sometime i was attacking the illu for not hearing poeples say im cheating because i attack always the good one

[@beneaththeveil]

You just inherently saw it already ;)

[@rollerskdude]

Just me, or does this sound amazing with Dark Seer?

[@beneaththeveil]

There's a build circulating around the Chinese scene that puts Dark Seer in position one and plays around building Agility. Manta Style is part of it. The Western style is playing offlane and playing around building strength instead

[@rn8567]

I didn’t know illusions can benefit from MKB evasion pierce And also deal its magic damage

[@beneaththeveil]

We got that slightly wrong! They do pierce evasion based on the percentage chance but they only deal their damage, not the additional magic damage. It's the same case for Bloodthorn's passive but the active soul rend does allow illusions to deal the bonus magic damage

[@rn8567]

@@beneaththeveil ooh, thanks for clarifying that I though it was weird that it deal the extra damage, but didn’t really feel like checking it rn

[@beneaththeveil]

@@rn8567 no worries! Happy to help

[@1lucas1910]

thank you gaben? Should be: thank you IceFrog

[@beneaththeveil]

We all know Gaben has final sign off. He plays after all :)

[@1lucas1910]

@@beneaththeveil I know what you mean but no

[@1lucas1910]

@@beneaththeveil Great video by the way

[@beneaththeveil]

@@1lucas1910 thank you!

[@RatedManatee]

Me not knowing about this in Ancient.... 💀

[@beneaththeveil]

It's ok. Always lots to learn in this game

[@madokim]

can you do armlet

[@beneaththeveil]

It's on the list to cover! Should be in the next couple of months :) Make sure to subscribe if you aren't already so you don't miss it

[@madokim]

@@beneaththeveil oh yes i have babe i could never miss any of your posts

[@defelater1334]

Well, CKs ilusions are all strong ulusions with his faces, so its fuckin broken =) :D

[@beneaththeveil]

Very true. There's lots of broken combos around CK. We're going to talk through them all in our next video :')

[@guidemonkey6407]

Illusions can pop and deal the full pierce dmg of mkb???? Excusez moi????

[@beneaththeveil]

Slight misunderstanding on our part there: we clarified it in the pinned comment. Illusions get the same percentage chance to pierce evasion and deal their base damage through the Pierce passive on both MKB and Bloodthorn, but don't deal the extra magic damage on hit. However, with Soul Rend active: Illusions get True Strike (100% hit on units with Evasion) and also deal the additional magic damage on hit. It's why Bloodthorn is way better if the enemy can't dispel it

[@guidemonkey6407]

@@beneaththeveil thank you, so for mkb they only counter evasion but for bloodthorne its pierce and dmg. I should start considering building bloodthorne on illusion heroes seems really good luxury item. The video was incredibly informative and high quality keep up the good work!

[@beneaththeveil]

@@guidemonkey6407 exactly. Glad it helped!

[@g4md0r32]

Very nice

[@beneaththeveil]

Thanks

[@joshuabrunetti2001]

It's pronounced Armlet of Mordiggian not Armlet of Mordiggian, literally uninstructive

[@beneaththeveil]

Can't tell if this is a joke or not

[@MrPaulCraft]

+

[@Jasiuuu]

subscribed

[@beneaththeveil]

Thank you!