How Pokemon Post Games Fell Off

[@JPRPokeTrainer98]

Thank you to Holzkern for sponsoring this video! Click my link www.holzkern.com/jpr and use my code JPR at checkout to save 15% on your holiday gifts site-wide for a limited time only! #ad

[@TheShadow1347]

I prefer the old way of doing things over dlc

[@noviranger88]

That logo's going on the car.

[@kyledavid9415]

STOP BEING GREEDY IN EVERY SINGLE VIDEO NOW

[@dragonmaster613]

There is a small bonus that Indigo Disk had over Crown Tundra is that it did what Delta Episode did: a continuation of the story rather than just an extra area.

[@wikiuser92]

In Sword and Shield, Game Freak was still finding their footing with open world and DLC, and both have been implemented on a much bigger scale in Scarlet and Violet.

[@JPRPokeTrainer98]

That part I did enjoy, the Kieran & Terapagos storylines tying into the base game and Part 1 were done pretty well

[@dragonmaster613]

@wikiuser92 same size to me

[@wikiuser92]

@@dragonmaster613 I was going to say "better", actually, but wasn't sure if others would agree.

[@dragonmaster613]

@@wikiuser92 I thought you meant landscape wise. Oops

[@billmcguire3887]

2:53 "4 little letters; gotta catch 'em all" Me: ... wait a minute 🤔

[@JPRPokeTrainer98]

English is hard sometimes 😅

[@chingi420]

It's Phil from Hercules. 😅😂

[@m-jq6cw]

me who was about to type the same thing but realized someone else probably caught it

[@JoshTrager-j9g]

Oh, you know what he meant.

[@TheKoopa4561]

The Black and White 2 postgame is still the best to this day. There’s just so much to do 🔥

[@shewolfcub3]

That, HGSS, and Platinum are ones I really love! Gens 2-6 are all great games

[@SigilOfBaphomet]

I love how everyone saw gen 3-5 exclusively as being the golden age, and then came modern pokemon which made everyone appreciate gen 6 more (especially oras after bdsp)

[@TheKoopa4561]

@@shewolfcub3 Definitely agree! HGSS is a close second and Platinum and Emerald would probably be tied for 3rd on my list

[@cuck1ngfunt]

I’m playing BW2 right now. 150 hours in, and I’m not even close to finished with the postgame.

[@noahberan6498]

​@@shewolfcub3Gen 7 deserves love too, it's awesome

[@duyanhpham9227]

Something that irked me about third versions like Yellow, Crystal, Emerald and Platinum is how its missing version exclusives from BOTH its prior versions so playing Yellow you wont be able to complete the poke dex with only one friend trading you stuff from Red.

[@NV_Penta]

The fact Zangoose wasn't in Emerald was infuriating

[@goldenboy1805]

They probably don’t include the version exclusive on the third version because they don’t want to devalue the first two release. Also part of their business/marketing plan, to make us buy all their products. None of their business if we don’t have friends to trade with, so half of us probably own two set of the console and the game, so more revenue for them.

[@dayvonlouis5187]

@@duyanhpham9227 that’s the infuriating thing about the main series games that despite the third definitive version being the best of their respective series they still remove Pokemon to incentivize trading just for dex completion it’s one of the things I’m glad that the legends Arceus does not do

[@RiqMoran]

this probably one of the scummiest things Gamefreak has done.

[@steelguitar8587]

Crystal Mareep 😔

[@skippy336]

Remember ds games were from 30-35$ with a lot of effort and post game content in them. 3ds games got more expensive with less effort, and switch games doubled the price to 60-70$ and less than half the content with so much more glitches and less than half the pokemon, plus now having to pay for online features, and storing pokemon. The downfall of pokemon is real

[@Lithosagymfan173]

That's mostly gaming inflation in prices.

[@deweypatch]

There's also the fact $30 bought a lot more in the 2000s than it does now

[@Tyson-r1w]

Not really Scarlet and Violet and arguably sword and shield or both very good games with a lot more glitches $1 billion company should have The DLC format does have inherently more content like a lot more than any other game

[@SigilOfBaphomet]

Oras has plenty of postgame content although I don’t really count catching the legendaries as postgame since they become available immediately after groudon/kyrogre

[@mightza3781]

In a cynical way, only Pokemon GO really captured the original RBY magic with low barrier to entry (cheap Gameboy / your existing phone) and innovative use of underutilized tech (Link Cable / GPS). The Switch Pokemon games are the anti-thesis of what the Pokemon games were being $60 for a home console.

[@wanderlustwarrior]

JPR mentioned rematches. Does anyone else miss the Vs. Seeker?

[@chingi420]

Always. 😢

[@dayvonlouis5187]

@@wanderlustwarrior yet another thing gone that’s very much loved in the games

[@noodlesandeggs1512]

@@wanderlustwarrior My one real gripe with it is how you can’t use it in caves for some reason. It would be really nice if I could use it to rematch the Victory Road trainers.

[@Mehenstein]

Remember getting trainers phone numbers and they would call you to battle again? Crystal Pokemon was the best.

[@MidwestArtMan]

That was my favorite post-game because I'd grab all of my Pokémon that I didn't take to the Elite Four and train them up like a NG+ mode.

[@Nameless_mixes]

I definitely have my grievances with paid for DLC: 1. It means there’s less content in the base game. So, now we’re paying more to receive less. 2. Since the DLC is staggered in release, you’re likely going to still play the game for a while. So now your main team is going to be even more over leveled than it would be otherwise. Or maybe some people just didn’t want to pick up the game again after finishing it. So, they didn’t get to experience the DLC and the full extent of the post-game content. 3. Time limits. Just like the DS’s internet compatibility and the 3DS’ eShop, there will come a time when the Switch’s internet service is taken down. Then what? In the event that someone gets the game later on, should they just be forever barred from experiencing the DLC content? When the content is programmed in-game and onto the cartridge, you just buy the game and everything’s there. If it’s not already programmed, there will be missing content that some are permanently prevented from accessing. And heck, this doesn’t just apply to DLC. Look at the patches for BDSP and Scarlet/Violet. These games weren’t shipped out as completed products. If someone buys them when the Switch’s internet service isn’t available, how will they properly play them? Overall, I’m not completely against paid for DLC. If there were to actually be post-game content in these games, I wouldn’t mind them tacking on more stuff 6+ months after release to keep fans occupied while they work on new installments to the franchise. But it feels like they’re taking advantage of fans by giving them far less content than there would be in previous titles while still charging double the price.

[@DSLego3]

Honestly, I can see this change and it definitely isn't the glory days. Sinnoh and Unova definitely had good post game content. Just a shame you have to pay more and get less content from the game as a whole nowadays. Shame it may never go back to the way it was before.

[@gengargamer5657]

Not in the case of SV

[@Oneiroclast]

I think the big symbolic moment for the postgame decay was six simple words in ORAS. "The Battle Frontier Project has started!". Complete with NPCs excited about how much cooler the Battle Frontier is going to be than the Maison that's there now, but with the game being a frozen moment in time, you as the player know it's not coming, those NPCs are almost taunting you, saying "yeah, we know Emerald was better, but this sold like hotcakes anyway".

[@nataliecoronado4206]

It's more Masuda personally taunting Emerald fans, he was the one that made the decision to cut the Battle Frontier (a choice that had a ripple effect on all mainline games to follow). The reason? He thought kids were too busy playing mobile games to care about post-game anymore. _I'm dead serious._

[@bellslimes]

@@nataliecoronado4206 ​​⁠what a dumbass bro that’s such a stupid copout reason to not do that 😢

[@SockieTheSockPuppet]

​@@nataliecoronado4206My opinion on Masuda has really nosedived.

[@MrTherandomguy42]

@@nataliecoronado4206And while he isn’t wrong on that end, he is being ignorant over the fact that a lot of people who bought ORAS are fans who played the original Hoenn games. I suppose it’s better than GF (or TPC, don’t remember who made the announcement) stating that BD/SP would be “very faithful remakes,” which translates to: here’s a lazy excuse as to why these games have less content than ORAS (or perhaps even FR/LG).

[@moseskuria1234]

Gen six felt unfinished

[@Ninja_Geek]

As someone who enjoys competitive battling but doesn't have the time to commit to it, I honestly miss the battle facilities in SV. I was so surprised that Blueberry Academy didn't have any kind of battle facilities.

[@dayvonlouis5187]

@@Ninja_Geek I guess game freak didn’t think people would notice they were missing……or that you can’t rematch the elite 4 until you bought the dlc imagine that

[@AedraRising]

Same. I was adamant that a battle facility would be introduced in Blueberry Academy due to how the place was advertised, a second school dedicated most to Pokémon battling. I was even thinking that Game Freak would have expanded the classes of the base game to teach more high level tactics that are crucial in competitive and battle facilities. I know they never actually promised that but it was still super disappointing that the Indigo Disk never added that. Seriously, beyond the graphics and performance, my main issue with Scarlet and Violet on a design level is the lack of a battle facility of any kind. Like, it's the one game where they make held items easy to get by just buying them in shops but there's nowhere to use them besides the six Blueberry Academy trainer rematches after you complete the story.

[@dayvonlouis5187]

@@AedraRising oh you know they “ran out of time” or didn’t think people would be interested because we have online battling and VGC……please tell me you’ve heard that excuse before

[@theamazingspooderman2697]

​@@dayvonlouis5187 I dont think they ran out of time, they knew they could make anything and people will still buy it

[@dayvonlouis5187]

@@theamazingspooderman2697 evidently as people still *bought* DLC for a clearly unfinished and poorly optimized product people can enjoy the games if the want to but hot damn if that is not an example of a lack of standards

[@thomasator1139]

I’d rather pay 40 extra bucks for an enhanced version that fixes the story and makes the game better alongside postgame content than pay 60 for dlc that should be in the game to start. I hate that games (not just pokemon) get released with dlc already planned. Also pokemon is a game that I want a definitive version to come back and play several years down the line. I still play black and platinum more than modern games

[@-Down-D-Stairs-]

YES ME TOO

[@theamazingspooderman2697]

based

[@_DewGaming]

2:56 Gotta, Catch, 'em, and All are some of my favorite letters in the alphabet

[@extremmefan7305]

The disappearance of the "side carreer modes" is my BIGGEST gripe with modern Pokemon. The entire narrative of Black and White is proving to N that Pokemon aren't merely used as tools for battle. Sure you could argue they can get that across with lame-ass "do your own fun" modes like picnics, camping, and Pokemon Amie (the least lame of the bunch), but the fact of the matter is that these activities still mainly provide battle boons (like Super Training in XY)-- and are basically *not* giving the Pokemon entire carreer paths themselves outside of more battles. Contests used to be a MAJOR deal in the anime for generations 3 and 4, and in fact even bled into generation 6's anime despite those games literally not having them anymore. Pokestar is to this day very widely alluded to in Pokemon Masters to a point of having 2 entire story events harkening back to it directly and 2 more plus a main story arc chapter using the same concept of acting being an actual inuniverse profession (mainly thanks to Diantha from XY). Even Pokemon Musicals were a major deal in the earlier parts of the Unova manga thanks to White directing a talent agency and straightup inventing the concept during the events of the manga. And while it can't say the same as any of thoses, the Pokeathlon is extremely beloved, as with most things from HGSS. No amount of DLC is ever going to replace those. As it stands, it feels like they instead have been reinforcing the need for Pokemon to be battle tools. Even the "friendship" mechanic literally introduced in XY has been mostly a hindrance to players seeking either higher difficulty or even just canonical inuniverse character runs, to a point where the optimal play for healing your team has become feeding them sour medicinal herbs instead of potions. If you told me The Pokemon Company was being run by Team Rocket right now, I *would* believe you.

[@germandragon8664]

It was revealed in the Teraleaks that Rhyhorn racing and even the modified version of contests were actually planned to be in XY. But obviously got scrapped for no clear reason aside from the obvious time constraints and them having to do every single 3d model for the Pokemon at the time. OLM (The anime studio that makes the Pokemon anime to this day) clearly got told about aspects of the game which was still developed at the time and were told to feature them in some capacity, which was relegating the two aforementioned features to the mother of the XY protagonist and Serena in the anime.

[@extremmefan7305]

@@germandragon8664 Yea, I suspected it was because the move to 3D was just too heavy for these modes to still happen, because it felt like they were a pretty big deal during the entire DS era and just suddenly reduced to mere mentions going forward. (well, I think ORAS still has Contests at least, which I damn HOPE it does because Hoenn's version of Contests were the most bare but in turn also the most doable of these side modes)

[@thomasfinch6292]

“All you ever do is complain about modern Pokémon” I mean… there’s a LOT to complain about!!

[@toumabyakuya]

If you live stuck in the past and cannot remove your rose-tinted glasses.

[@Shyguy2434]

​@@toumabyakuyaI'll be fighting every previous gym leader in bw2 you have fun with your 30$ expansion so you don't run out of double battles :D

[@Lithosagymfan173]

@@toumabyakuya Based.

[@Lithosagymfan173]

From what I've seen, Black 2 and White 2 seem to be the only games in the entire franchise to not have anything that's too wrong with them, except for obvious dumb choices like unlocking Easy Mode after BEATING THE MAIN GAME and other caveats(Msauda, fire your monkey!).

[@shouldveusedsafesearch8099]

​@@toumabyakuya Or maybe people give their criticisms of modern Pokémon because they know it can be so much better than what it is. These Switch Pokémon games should not be having significantly less content in them than what the DS games had in them.

[@GreyShadowUchiha]

talking about how with the DLC model, they aren't able to fix anything is so crazy because I feel like we're at the point where GameFreak should have this down to a science (like Intelligent Systems for Fire Emblem ) and there should be no need to fix anything from the games' first go around but that's just not the case

[@returnofskurk1633]

Old way was better. Post-game content was actually interesting and get this through your heads people, the DLC is EXPENSIVE. Blood and Wine from Witcher 3 added more content that either DLC did for SWSH and SV, that's a fact.

[@Castersvarog]

I agree in a lot of ways, the base games since gen 6 are already striped really damn bare with content, and the dlc is the only way to actually have more to do. Meanwhile at least with the third version you could just as easily skip over the original version and buy just the third version.

[@Lithosagymfan173]

What DLC? Kanto had Mewtwo and that's it. Johto had a barren Kanto. Hoenn and Sinnoh's postgame are in thier DLCs. Only Black 2 and White 2 had good postgames.

[@adge5106]

At least with third versions we got finished games. The DLC model gives us unfinished games with DLC slapped on, makes the games still feel incomplete.

[@Registeel13Ty]

The problem also with the new dlc is lack of level scaling. I had a full team of level 100s by the time I got to the Indigo Disk so it wasn't really challenging. Honestly I remember Gamefreak outright saying more or less that kids now are too distracted by mobile devices to play a long post game. Pokémon seems to have become even more of a product meant for quick mass appeal than a passion project.

[@havingfunwithelijah214]

Level Scaling would be to hard for kids is probably the excuse they would come up with if asked. Anyway Pokemon doesn't need level scaling IMO, fan games and stuff? Sure, but the mainline games don't, Pokemon is meant to be a fun time, if you want you can go in with level 100's and sweep everyone or you can go in with level 80's and get destroyed, also you are forced to use new mons for Dragon elite fours challenge in the dlc. Finally more competitive moves and items, and such would make the dlcs harder without level scaling, idk why people want that so much? If you want challenge Pokemon is not for you, it's a kids franchise thus it has to be beatable by them. If people want challenge in Pokemon that is what fan challenges are for, Pokemon is never going to be harder For anyone smarter than a ten year old.

[@deringjosuegarcia1531]

​@@havingfunwithelijah214 I disagree, considering that Pokémon Scarlet and Violet are open world and allow you to challenge gym leaders in any order, it would be reasonable to think that, you know, the gyms get harder as you go on? For example, let's say I start the game and go to the "second" gym with all level 18 Pokémon, through trial and error I beat it and now I head towards the "first" gym and... they only have level 10 Pokémon. What's the point of giving me the freedom to face the world in any order I want if the challenges I'm going to face are already predefined instead of, I don't know, SCALE WITH MY LEVEL?

[@havingfunwithelijah214]

@deringjosuegarcia1531 because it was advertised as that, no level scaling, plus game freak aren't the best coders so who knows how botched it would be, SV is built in a way where you can fight the hardest first if you wish. Like if you level scale by badge where depending on how many badges you have they keep the same team but just swap levels around, than that could work but that would mean that other storylines would be impacted as well, if your lvl 60 but the bosses are lvl 10 because you have zero badges it wouldn't be fun. Everything has its pros and cons. See ya.

[@DPDBR23]

3:43 Actually, it's still a GB cartridge although the GBC was the most common way to play G/S games back then!

[@justinn8541akaDrPokemon]

I still miss postgame like the Battle Frontier or the Battle Subway.

[@dayvonlouis5187]

Damn right

[@toumabyakuya]

Why? They are boring. To be able to fully complete them you have to grind a lot. How is that a good thing?

[@dayvonlouis5187]

@@toumabyakuya if you’re genuinely asking I’ll give 5 reasons 1. Actually difficult battles that you can’t brute force your way through with overleveled and or legendary Pokémon. 2. Much like the first reason you’re actually given a reason to learn what strategy actually is in a Pokémon battle for both singles and doubles without having to play test against other player and have prior knowledge that could help you perform better when you learn from it. 3. The facilities you go to outside of the battle tower have creative rule sets that aren’t available in other areas of the game. 4 you actually have a reason to breed specific Pokémon outside of dex completion and shiny hunting to create certain combinations to cover a Pokémon weak points or to have alternative means to deal with certain strategies and 5. It’s fun postgame content you have something to do after completing the league instead of just trading and online battles Granted these reasons aren’t for everyone obviously but its a reason enough for why it’s one of the more requested things to return to the series like the Pokémon world tournament and mega evolution

[@toumabyakuya]

@@dayvonlouis5187 So, in short, gameplay. Yeah, I do not agree that any of the 5 are good reasons at all. I have never cared for "more gameplay", for me, a post-game is good if it gives some more story and closes any loose ends the game might have and none of what you said fits in here. All that you mentioned would be fun for a video series, but not to experience it yourself, unless you love repetitive stuff a lot.

[@fromis_96]

@@toumabyakuyaain’t that also the premise of a whole pokemon game? To grind your team to have it on par with your opponents?

[@ZachaRicO]

HeartGold and SoulSilver probably win the postgame debate in terms of sheer quantity. They brought back the Gold and Silver postgame and then added a postgame _to that postgame._ Legends Arceus, meanwhile, blurred the line a bit. The postgame typically comes after the credits, but in that game, there's still some story left to do afterwards. At the very latest, the postgame starts after catching Arceus. Either way, it's pretty robust. I really hope Generation 10, at the very least, gives a decent postgame to play through before DLC gets factored in.

[@JamieVideoGamer]

disagree. The post game in Pokemon Black 2 and White 2 is better. Especially as they are games that don't have two regions in one game which didn't work with HGSS and the originals. Having two regions wasn't as good as people think it is especially when there are multiple issues and problems that comes with it.

[@Lithosagymfan173]

@@JamieVideoGamer I think people love the idea of having two regions than actually having 2 of them. Every time I hear about Kanto in Johto, I always hear about the *potential* it has and not what it *actually* has.

[@Mendejito]

HGSS post game is great in theory but not execution

[@ZachaRicO]

@@JamieVideoGamer I was referring to _quantity,_ not _quality._ B2W2 may have the better postgame, but in terms of just how much there is to do, HGSS wins hands down.

[@JamieVideoGamer]

@@ZachaRicO i don't agree. HGSS doesn't win at all. There is nothing redeeming about HGSS. It wasn't a good game and it wasn't a good remake. It and Platinum is why I don't like gen 4 much

[@danielolivierpepin]

Skip ads 2:48

[@sonicsega1699]

i will never support paying for the rest of a incomplete game

[@The_Otto_Von_Bismarck]

How will the Pokemon company ever recover

[@JesusTorres-f3p]

Black/White 2 and heartgold/soulsliver had the best post game and nothing else had came close

[@gengargamer5657]

Why must you lie?

[@oyeh8908]

@@gengargamer5657 How is that a lie?

[@gengargamer5657]

@@oyeh8908 ORAS, USUM, PLA, and SV all have great postgames that easily rival them

[@ChrisDavidLo]

I love third versions. I like revisiting and starting fresh without feeling like I am doing a "redo" of the story. It's fun to compare the differences; it's like a game in itself to find what has changed. Especially with Pokémon's development issues lately, a third issue might give them a bit more time to work on other projects again. Yes, there are changes and new locations, but they do not need to go through the extra steps of trying to make something that has to be "sellable" to the extent DLC might call for. I agree though. I do not see third versions happening again any time soon. But who knows. EX cards made a comeback. Pokémon has thrown surprises in recent years.

[@TerrickTerran]

A third version is simply a different form of paywall. They also tend to sell fewer copies than the first two.

[@Moonstriker2514]

my biggest issue is kinda what you said " Ten years down the line they become beloved " when the switch eshop inevitably closes in like 10 years there will be no way to get the dlc

[@bdt2002gaming]

There are physical releases of both SwSh and SV with their DLCs added on, and while $95 U.S. sounds ridiculous, it’s not as bad as it sounds when you consider that the combined price of a base game and a third version at launch was around $80-$85. That’s with inflation not accounted for, too- if, say. a DS game cost the same amount as a Switch game did in the late 2000s, that’s looking more like $130 for the same campaign twice. Yikes.

[@RiqMoran]

thats a big issue right now, Nintendo/GF are so untrustworthy. You just cant trust them to build a platform they wont abandon. You just cant trust them the way you can Apple. really sucks.

[@taylorjames14]

The best post games aren't story related it's the post post game activities that actually give you a reason to keep playing (battle frontier, contests, pokeathlon and world tournament)

[@JustGre3d]

Actually I love story related post game it makes me want to pay attention lol. Battling is always so easy

[@taylorjames14]

@JustGre3d yeah but you finish it in a few hours and then have no reason to ever pick the game up again

[@JustGre3d]

@@taylorjames14 They should just do both tbh

[@havingfunwithelijah214]

3:53 the pokemon SV dlc have us a total of THREE WHOLE regions to explore, the base game of paldea, Kitakami and blueberry academy which is in Unova.

[@gengargamer5657]

Exactly

[@Fauna_CR]

Calling Kitakami and Blueberry Academy "regions" is being extremely generous. It's not at all like they're the same size as Paldea, not that that would improve them if they were though, as at their current size they're quite barren and lacking. Just because they're called "regions" and are advertised as such doesn't mean they're packing an equivalent amount of content.

[@gengargamer5657]

@ The same could literally be said about Kanto in GSC, pal, yet people consider that a region despite how much of the original got cut out or reduced in it

[@DragonsGuy]

Them removing battle facilities didn't bother me as much as waiting to do so until they finally made perfecting your pokemon not require outside websites and tons of time.

[@Graymanlegend]

Yeah I never really understood the appeal. Even as a kid I thought “Wait I just spent 90 hours raising a team to compete the game you want me to spend 100s of hours grinding dozens of Pokémon for the battle frontier? BEFORE WIFI TRADING WAS A THING?!” Raids and online battles have pretty much replaced it

[@alphamarigi]

When they got rid PWT and Battle Frontier I got more into collecting trying to get a Hidden Ability living dex. When they got rid of national dex I quit modern pokemon.

[@DryBones271]

to be fair gen 1 had no post game, catch Mewtwo, that's it!

[@NicMagz]

Gen 1 learned to walk so the rest of the series could run. While I don't recommend anyone return to Gen 1 for any other reason that a hit of nostalgia, I'd argue its massive list of shortcomings are justified, as it was an experiment with VERY little funding when it was being produced.

[@christianthompson2768]

For me, a good post-game has great replayability. Sure, I love all the additional little stories like the Delta Episode and all that, but at the end of the day, those are just additional story missions that will be completed after another few hours of play. New features that keep me replaying are what I consider great post-game. Different Shiny-hunting methods is one pillar of that, with X and Y in particular having a wide variety of ways to shiny hunt (Friend Safari, Hordes, Pokeradar, Chain Fishing, etc.). However, the endless battles of Battle Facilities is the other big pillar of that in my opinion. Battle Tower is cool, but the Battle Frontiers in particular were INTERESTING and let you battle endlessly but with unique battle mechanics.

[@NicMagz]

I'll take 3rd versions of Pokemon Games all day if they maintain the quality of Crystal, Emerald, and Platinum. But I also don't see them so much of a cash grab, but more of an opportunity to fix the mistakes of the original releases, and I'd argue that Crystal, Emerald, and Platinum to this job very well. So long as they don't market them as entirely new games, I don't find it unethical. Also, I remember being very upset when I couldn't return to Kanto and Johto when I beat Sapphire for the first time as a kid. But then again, I think GameFreak realized that it wasn't sustainable keep letting you revisit previous regions, so I understand the decision.

[@Lithosagymfan173]

They are cash grabs, because they give you a game, and then tell you to buy it again for full price with a few things added on. Plus, Emerald sold considerably less than most games in the franchise.

[@nathanlamont9920]

Wouldn't mind a polished 3rd version of SV with all pokemon plus ZA and all pokemon included until gen 10 via switch 2 though. Just make terapagos, and boxed legends shiny huntable. The missing pokemon will replace some pokemon across the maps such as Swablu will be replaced Pidgey. As far as the Shednija problem, it can only tera into bug or ghost.

[@calvinmatthews1527]

As someone who hasn't bought a Pokémon game since the 3DS Era, I'm kinda glad I stopped there. To see what the series has become after is hard to believe after Gen V. Guess such is the fate of every popular game series that adapts to modern times. P.S. try the Monster Hunter Stories series, they're like everything modern Pokémon should be.

[@WiiFan-1300]

0:23 "And then nothing note never happens to that region ever again" So true LOL

[@Kawi31]

i think that johto including all of kanto, while cool is overhyped, there isn't as much stuff to do in kanto, its mostly just more trainer battles and gym battles but not much else.

[@castform7]

Enhanced versions and DLC both kind of feel wrong to me and like a symptom of Pokemon not having enough time even in the earlier days. Like, does anyone else find it kind of weird that in the span of 2 years we got 2 games that only have slight differences and then what's basically a remaster of that game at the same price. That's dumb. Meanwhile the DLC helps the problem but doesn't offer a solution to base game issues like 3rd versions did. I feel like the post games are just another showcase of Pokemon's biggest flaw, the amount of time they have. That's how we get third versions, that's how we get DLC. Game Freak ran out of time and the games can't get delayed so just wait a year for the real full experience.

[@mobilenation1104]

NO MORE DEX CUT IN ALL THE FUTURE POKEMON GAMES!

[@The_Otto_Von_Bismarck]

Womp womp

[@TekoMythmaster]

I think my biggest problem with DLC vs Third Game is a matter of cost. I didn't buy any of the Switch Pokemon games at launch, actually I only just this past month bought any of them, so if they released a third version I could have just picked that up for used prices (say, around $30-40) and moved on. With DLC I've spent that used price (well less than that really because of my job) buying the base game, and now if I want the full thing I *have* to pay another $30 per game. Yes they did release "DLC on Cart" versions of each entry but, 1. they weren't any less expensive at launch than just buying base game and DLC separately ($90) 2. they aren't really much cheaper now used (~$70) so there's not really any money to be saved there either 3. Even if they were cheap enough to justify buying them instead they also sold way less than the original base games, so they're incredibly hard to find used (even on Ebay)! So basically the DLC model means there is no "I'll save some money and just wait for the third version instead of buying the 'same' game twice" you *have* to pay effectively the same price as buying both versions of the old games no matter what you do.

[@noahberan6498]

The half of Poni island was a good amount of areas though. I think Alola's postgame in general is underrated. SM was decent but USUM had a lot to do. Also, Alola has 3 of those side things to do, with 2 of them in USUM only. Mantine surfing, Battle royals, and Ultra warp riding. I love Alola

[@arestheprime9178]

Gamefreak in 2000: * insert a photo of buff cheems * I put two regions inside one cartridge and you're free to explore anything Gamefreak nowadays: * insert a photo of normal cheems * To get the post game, you have to pay a full price for two DLCs that introduces a few pokémon and nothing more

[@KnightofChaosDeck]

Johto: Is remember more for having Kanto next door than anything the game did. SV DLC: Has one of the best rivals in the series. Sure, Jan.

[@arestheprime9178]

@KnightofChaosDeck I don't need to pay an extra buck for visiting Kanto and my National Pokédex have all Kanto and Johto Pokémon that weren't cut

[@ansoni1295]

Meh personally I feel like DLCs are better and the content was really fun and worth it.

[@Shinntoku]

​@@arestheprime9178 you'd have to pay full price for a whole extra game if you wanted Crystal content though

[@Lithosagymfan173]

Kanto is extremely overhyped, other than the battle with Red, nothing is interesting about... oh yeah, catching JOHTO Pokémon in it(Masuda, fire that monkey, he keeps making dumb decisions)!

[@ansonprydejr.1432]

I think that a good Gen X has a post-game that gets enhanced by the DLC. Maybe adding a Battle Facility and the DLC, in addition to providing new facilities and the like, adds new options for that facility. Maybe in DLC, you add the ability to fight competitively viable teams instead of just random double battles. The base game postgame doesn't need to be that great, because the DLC will add to and expand it.

[@rjd1922]

The recent leaks reveal Kalos was once planned to have a huge post-game southern area which includes Battle Island, a new Mirage Island that appeared more frequently than Hoenn's, a port town, and Ancient Ruins where the remnants of Team Flare hid.

[@dayvonlouis5187]

Despite how people might take it as a bad idea I would’ve wanted an improved definitive version of SV because that initial buggy mess of a release that even now still has its performance problems and even the paid DLC is not it man to this day Violet was the _only_ Pokémon game I’ve ever returned to a store I was that displeased by it I love Oras it’s still my favorite remake so far but there wasn’t a justifiable reason why we couldn’t have both the Battle maison and the Frontier it’s a shame they cut it

[@Lithosagymfan173]

Well the justifiable reason is that... no one wants them really, Emerald and Platinum both had Battle Frontier, and didn't sell enough to warrant to recreate the whole model but in 3D now.

[@dayvonlouis5187]

@@Lithosagymfan173 though coincidentally they happen to be in third definitive versions of games that existed prior Ruby and Sapphire, Diamond and pearl respectively that sold better as pairs and intros to the generations and not to mention the gap in time between their releases so one could only imagine why they didn’t sell as well this also extends to HGSS as well which sold worst than Diamond and pearl collectively but is undoubtedly the better of the gen 4 games alongside platinum and i will have to disagree with no one wanting them to return the battle frontier is just one of many along with a huge slew of other features that were cut for time and resources related reasons that people want to return

[@byrnesy6149]

5:04 holy crap I thought I was the only one. I eventually gave up and grinded a finneon to evolve it since I couldn't find lumineon

[@HoennMaster]

The DS era, especially Gen 4, was just peak Pokémon for me. Wish we could have that level of games again where it seemed like Game Freak actually cared.

[@Lithosagymfan173]

Game Freak STILL care, just too little time to work on the games, and the games are far bigger than they used to be(Why do you think Pokémon fan games are 2D and not 3D?), that or the monkey Masuda hired has gone rogue again. Plus, it seems like Legends Z-A is promising.

[@phil2160]

Slow gameplay is peak!

[@BlackJacked]

​@@phil2160 bro thinks DP were the only ds games

[@oyeh8908]

@@Lithosagymfan173 Game Freak sets the release dates themselves, and they're responsible for how their own studio is run. They really don't care.

[@Lithosagymfan173]

@@oyeh8908 Isn't it Nintendo and The Company Themselves?

[@robertlupa8273]

Johto's postgame is a fantastic idea and feels wonderful when you don't know about it... but it's kinda meh in execution and there's not that much to do in Kanto.

[@jaretco6423]

Exactly. I was so disappointed by how empty the region is. It also doesn't help that the level curves & leveling up Pokemons faster is unhealthy.

[@HowManySmall]

It's two half regions combined into one game

[@dayvonlouis5187]

@robertlupa8273 there wasn’t a lot to do in Kanto to begin it’s the first region and the legendary birds and Mewtwo aren’t there so it’s more of a retreading for the sake of nostalgia FRLG and HGSS made Kanto a lot more engaging

[@Soafia]

I think an important thing to note is that with the change to open world it kinda blurs the line between post game area and not. Since you can go anywhere during the story, areas that you’re not required to go would in any other game be extras, but plenty of people went there during the story.

[@misterzygarde6431]

I legit think that Gym Rematches could be work for a post-game like you're essentially doing the Pokemon equivalent of Super Mario Bros' Second Quest. Just throw in the option to do it in any order and it'd be neat. Maybe help out any of the Gym Leaders like in HGSS as a substitute for the Gym Trainers as well.

[@legendofrayquazagaming5125]

The problem with Isle of Armor and Crown Tundra is that you didn’t even have to start the gym challenge to catch a bunch of heavily over-leveled legendaries.

[@danielstokes2127]

I never did the battle frontier or battle towers, I mainly did the gym and elite 4 rematches. My favorite post event is the Pecharunt event!

[@dragonmaster613]

I was so disappointed back then when I thought each new region was going to have the Post Game like Gold & Silver did. Like when Power Rangers had crossover episodes with the previous team

[@jaretco6423]

Black 2 & White 2 has the best postgame out of the series. Period. I know alot of people like Heartgold & Soulsilver's postgame. But honestly, I found it underwhelming. I like the idea of going back to the region from the previous games and facing any Gym Leaders in any order is cool. But in execution wise, it is not that great.

[@zackarywood5850]

EXACTLY, I've been trying to tell people this for years now lol

[@LunaticKD1991]

In Black 2 and White 2 you can face all of the Kanto gym leaders in the Pokemon World Tournament along with all of the past generations gym leaders on top of Unova's gym leaders.

[@jeff3221]

The thing with the 3rd game formula was that it was still more consumer friendly than the current DLC format. You could simply just buy Platinum and forgo D&P, and then you'd get all the extra and improved content for the cost of a single DS game. Now you NEED to fork out 90 dollars to get what the DS games sold you for just 40ish dollars.

[@houndofculann1793]

And now you will also be stuck with a non-fixed and unfinished base game. Of course, it shouldn't need it in the first place, but Pokemon has really never _not_ needed it after at least Gen2

[@shouldveusedsafesearch8099]

And even then the DS games generally still offered more than these Switch titles do even with their DLCs.

[@bradhaley8432]

As for me, i never played the following post game content because their was no incentive to play it: 1. The battle tower. 2. The battle frontier. 3. The battle subway. 4. Pokestar studios.

[@christopherballero866]

Post-game content should be part of the game upon release. Would be nice if upon release all Pokemon were in the game too. With SW/SH and SV I believe they each had around 400 Pokemon usable upon release including new Pokemon by comparison Gen 3 had about 376 Pokemon including the older ones. The fact that: shiny hunting, Battle Tower/Facility, & completing the Pokedex have all been around since Gen 2/3 which now seems to be most of the post-game doesn't help either

[@tktyga77]

Congrats, JPR. Maybe a part that combines the best aspects of both the enhanced versions & the dlc stuff can be a way to offset the shortcomings of both?

[@sigiligus]

Old games had to have better postgame content because online interactivity was either nonexistent or not reliable. This is an industry wide problem, not just Pokémon.

[@Lionwoman]

I still like 3rd versions better than the DLC approach (at least platinum still had post-game). Also felt very disconnected from SV with their DLC.

[@TheGilGS]

Pokemon used to be great ! Now, they seem don't care anymore !!

[@Lithosagymfan173]

They care, they didn't create 3 entire plots that culminate together into an emotional final adventure to be called "They seem don't care anymore !!"

[@TheGilGS]

@@Lithosagymfan173 They preferred to launch a DLC instead of fixing the problems with Scarlet and Violet !

[@tomclark362]

Another low-key nice thing about Gen 5 was that mall complex you could customize to help you with IV training and item buying.

[@TheStupidRaptor]

The Legend Of Zelda is NOT a role playing game like Persona. It is an action adventure game.

[@GameFreakSucks]

And they’re both better than modern Pokemon these days lol

[@Mark-nh7ng]

Pokemon World Tournament = PWT, the best thing GameFreak ever did. Battleing old gym leaders and champions..........it is crazy to think about it and today get more content behind dlcs, I will not support this.

[@KonDragon008]

I certainly agree with your four pillars of post-game content, and that missing one of those pillars can still work...just not very well; and missing more than one will make it fall flat on its face entirely. I dislike the newer DLC format, since it effectively makes someone pay $90 - $95 for a single video game. If the price keeps going up like that, next we'll wind up with a $70 game and $40 DLC...which only works for ONE version (so if you get, or were gifted, the other version then you'd have to buy the DLC again for that specific version). This, of course, combined with the fact that PLA even proved that we don't need the two-game format and highlighted that it's only a greedy moneygrab at this point. What I'm also worried about, with the direction they're taking DLC, is the push for NSO. I gave up on grinding out BBQ points (gave up on inviting NPCs to BB Academy, and even gave up on having any starters in the Academy wilds) because I don't have NSO and doing it solo was somehow more painful than grinding for the very first FFXIV relic weapon (which I also gave up on mid way). Even the first part of the DLC for S/V had this problem in the Ogre Ousting game, where it was downright impossible to complete even the Intermediate level if you were playing by yourself; this meant that getting things like Reset Mochi rarely ever happened, and other prizes which only appeared (or appeared more frequently) in the higher difficulties. The legendary hunt, too, required group BBQ quests to be completed to unlock the "snack" needed...so of course, I was forced to stop after only one or two. The push for this online content wouldn't have been so bad in Gen 6, when we had (IMO) the best online play system; and it was totally FREE. I could go to my local library, connect to their WiFi, and trade/battle with people from around the world or participate in the official (online) tournaments. These days, I can't do that unless I also give them money for NSO. Since I don't play many Nintendo/Switch games (preferring PC gaming), and managing a budget, I don't feel it's worth the cost (to me; the cost of NSO might be a drop of water in the ocean to some, but when you're balancing gaming around a budget, and online features used to be free, it's a big deal).

[@frosttheweavile461]

I’d rather go back to the third enhanced versions than dlc.

[@annarenfold438]

Before we get any cool post-game stuff, the company has to stop with dual releases. Instead, they could do what they have done in previous games and have certain Pokémon be a one-time gift/catch that is a choice between one of two Pokémon. Still, removing "exclusive" Pokémon would be the best, at least that's my opinion. If they sort that out, they'd have way more time to work in a single game and give it a solid post-game, like revisiting previous regions.

[@Jlaps941]

6:29 definitely agree, since every game since X&Y has had some fun new interactive method for shiny hunting besides the Masuda Method: •XY had chain fishing and Poke Radar •ORAS has DexNav chaining on top of chain fishing •SM has SOS chains •USUM has SOS chains and Ultra Wormholes •LGPE has the catch combo method •SWSH has Dynamax Adventures •BDSP brought back the Poke Radar •PLA has mass and massive mass outbreaks •SV reworked outbreaks and has sparkling sandwiches

[@GameFreakSucks]

I mean swsh onwards shiny hunting is worthless due to dexit

[@qwefg3]

I preferred the old way due to two simple reasons. 1) it was cheaper. Yes you are buying the same game a second time, but if you want to go back and play the series again as you lost the card or bought a series you missed. You got an easy to play version that has most of the issues fixed. 2) content. It sounds odd, but some of the DLC have simply been lacking. You beat the game, wait months or a year for the DLC... And its DLC for a new player meaning your level 80s crush the level 10 or 20 pokemon. Which makes you question why you bought it if you already beat the game. Makes the person who bought the game later wondering why they had to pay an extra $30 just to get this mini region which doesn't connect with the main game. Then of course is the second part. 2.5) lacking content and fixes. It sounds odd, but some DLC simply added more problems rather than fixing them. We get less 'improvement' and more of the same half baked issues with the higher ups claiming they will finally fix those issues in the second DLC. Did the story get better? Nope. Did the updates fix things? Nope? Did you get get something akin to Soul Silver or White 2 for end game... Also nope.

[@not_juano]

SM's "postgame" being just catching a bunch of ultra beasts as opposed to USUM having a whole ass new story with necrozma involved feels like a slap on the face

[@tempertenchi]

thought scarlet and violet have my favorite "post game" (DLC) of any pokemon game besides HGSS, I do prefer the old way. with the post game built into the games and not an extra charge after the fact.

[@joshuakolton9955]

5:02 I had the exact same problem. For some reason I had missed Lumineon’s trainer battle and couldn’t find it for the longest time.

[@julesrules7297]

I appreciate you starting with the rise.

[@AngelPerez-tu1nk]

Yeah... Before post-game had so much to do, embarking on it felt rewarding. Now with the DLC format in place, post-game in Pokémon games is an afterthought, and that's being generous.

[@toumabyakuya]

Dude, back then post-games were more a chore than a reward. A boring Kanto with no story going on, the Battle Frontier requires a lot of grinding to complete and none of them had any story to speak of.

[@AngelPerez-tu1nk]

@@toumabyakuya Still WAY better than current shallow post-games

[@toumabyakuya]

@@AngelPerez-tu1nk Dude, what's more shallow than "Here's Kanto, go get all Badges and fight Red"? There's literally no story at all. Whenever I play said post-game, I am more in auto-pilot and not even having fun.

[@AngelPerez-tu1nk]

@@toumabyakuya Sword and Shield's post game is abysmally mediocre, and the only thing acceptable about Scarlet and Violet's is the tournament. Modern post-game SUCK. Deal with it. the Kanto-Red post-game is a masterpiece of excitement in comparison

[@toumabyakuya]

@@AngelPerez-tu1nk *"Sword and Shield's post game is abysmally mediocre, and the only thing acceptable about Scarlet and Violet's is the tournament."* However, they at least have an interesting story going on with its own characters and everything, that's already a plus. *"the Kanto-Red post-game is a masterpiece of excitement in comparison"* How?! There's literally no story going on! All you do is go to a Gym, get a Badge and move onto the next Gym and literally nothing else! There's no story to speak of! How is that good?

[@wowjennawow]

haven’t bought SWSH or SV’s DLC, which is saying something when the games lack almost any post-game things to do

[@krissjames7276]

Enhanced versions were better than DLC, you don't actually NEED to buy a game on day 1, or even the year it comes out, if you know a superior version is releasing in 1-2 years, you can wait. Having to pay an extra 30 bucks on top of buying a bad, unfinished game that is sold for 60 bucks to get a somewhat complete experience is just awful.

[@Lithosagymfan173]

Well, people didn't buy third versions, they'd buy the original games and then leave it at that.

[@noodlesandeggs1512]

I think DLC for Pokemon games are a good thing. It’s just that most videogame companies use DLC as scummy ways to release games lacking in content to try and sell consumers that content that was missing from the base game. I would say USUM had the last good postgame. There were multiple side events with npc’s, Ultra Wormhole Legendary hunts, Battle Tree, RR episode, and a good regional dex to finish. It’s not perfect but still was good.

[@bdt2002gaming]

The problem with Ultra Sun/Moon is that similar to ORAS, nothing outside of the dedicated postgame Episode is actually true postgame content that wasn’t also in base Sun & Moon. The Battle Tree is almost completely unchanged, and even the way you find Legendaries technically isn’t true postgame content.

[@ryanvandenberg3119]

I really miss the days of good Post-Game in Pokemon. In my opinion, Scarlet and Violet have the worst post-game since Gen 1. After finishing the DLC stories(which I would not even consider Post-Game as it is a separate concept) , I have had little reason to go back to Scarlet and Violet. At least most games leading up to Gen 9 had a Battle Tower that I could spend hours raising different Pokemon to challenge it, Scarlet and Violet didn't even give us that!

[@LITTLE1994]

As a Gen 1 veteran, I miss old Pokemon. Since the modern games, things really went downhill.

[@imperialraider1158]

The new games can also be patched post launch to make “enhanced version changes” or add difficulty settings. To be honest, instead of selling the post game as dlc, sell the community things they actually want (Nat Dex and expired moves don’t count) add a warp zone to emerald BF or Platinum/HGSS BF if making a whole new one is too much work. Also adding in a side island like Aether Paradise to get access to Z-Moves or a Kalos fight club to gain access to a mega ring (keystone) and battle for the mega stones (using battle points in a BF or TT like setting) these are things that could be argued are worth the extra money since they would add extra development time and extra time in patches to balance all these DLCs out for competitive games. I think as an aging Pokémon player starting in gen 4, these are changes that would benefit the series and make GF tons of cash if done correctly. Also following Pokémon could be added (correctly HGSS/LGPE) and people would probably pay for a patch or pass for that. At least given other gaming standards like FNBR and COD. Oh and one more side note. Even if in Gen 10 (or 9 through extensive patches) they added in all battle gimmicks (Megas/Z/D/T) online battle formats can limit one “gimmick” per team unless played on no restrictions “Applies to AG tier only most likely) the anime did this in journeys excluding Tera as it wasn’t released yet Also to my knowledge online simulators already can balance multiple gimmicks against each other such as megas vs DMax even though in game that is impossible.

[@remyoconnor3141]

Zelda doesn’t really have post game content.

[@little_finger]

Im fine with both. I'll pay for more content but I also want something to do after the credits roll while im waiting for the dlc to drop.

[@AwakenedL]

Going to Kanto in gen 2 was cool as a kid but let's be real its just a bunch of empty space. It hardly even feels like post game when Johto has the smallest region in the series.

[@CosmicCorviknight]

On my first playthrough of Sapphire I 100% believed that I'd be able to visit Johto and/or Kanto after beating the Elite 4, particularly because so many Gen 1 and 2 Pokémon weren't obtainable in Hoenn. I was very disappointed that the post-game was pretty much just go pick up a Beldum from Steven's coffee table

[@ktvx.94]

I'm mad that SwSh changed the rules of the Battle Tower and SV outright nuked it. There's literally nothing replayable, no competitive content. Just pay for the DLC _and_ for online play. BT is super simple and we didn't even get that.

[@RealCatInWindow]

Pokémon games in general haven’t been great for a good while.

[@gengargamer5657]

Outside of BDSP and SWSH, yes they have

[@SockieTheSockPuppet]

​@@gengargamer5657 S/V had a nice story and improved graphics (with some qol), but that's about it. LGPE was just a cash grab. ORAS was nearly perfect, but that was _years_ ago. S/M was literally another D/P situation with the Platinum equivalent fixing _so_ many problems. Modern Pokémon has been a legitimate problem.

[@cankurt1696]

Pokemon S/V are in my opinion some of the worst video games of the decade. It's a shame that they were so successful.

[@gengargamer5657]

@ They were fantastic outside of the presentation, stop it

[@gengargamer5657]

@@SockieTheSockPuppet You forgot a few. USUM were great outside of the story, PLA was fantastic, and SV were really good outside of the presentation

[@Cool_Kid95]

I don’t mind DLCs but if they were free I’d be much happier

[@xxdaley]

Funny enough, I stopped buying Pokémon games when DLC came out, and just literally finish the main campaign. Waiting for a new DLC every six months is like an endless edg*ng. I prefer buying a new one altogether.

[@ResidentTarantino]

This video really hit on what I try to tell people about navigating the paywall hellscape that is modern Pokémon. There is only one solution to the DLC problem, but it'll never happen, because that would involve making the additional content FREE, something Pokémon Company will never do because they want to suck every penny out of little Timmy's allowance. One can argue that box legends have always been paywall Pokémon, but we've hit the point of new legendaries within a generation becoming paywall Pokémon (i.e. Urshifu, Calyrex, Ogerpon, etc.) as well as the ability to evolve Pokémon being paywalled (i.e. regional forms and new evolutions introduced in Legends Arceus and potentially Z-A). So many of these problems are deliberately manufactured to make you pay more money when they're easily fixable. But let's face it, this series is cooked because a whole new generation of kids playing this slop will think this is peak Pokémon gaming and people like myself are just old-heads yelling at cloud.

[@clothieredward]

I don't hate the fact that Game Freak has put the majority of the postgame behind a paywall. I would prefer if the postgame was still completely free, but that's not the world we live in anymore. If anything, I think the main issue is that Game Freak just doesn't have the same ambition with postgames that they used to. I really miss the days where Game Freak would have battle facilities like the Battle Frontier and PWT. I really hope Game Freak brings back the PWT for Gen 10. I don't care if it's free or behind the DLC paywall. I just wanna see it happen man.

[@Lithosagymfan173]

Game Freak did bring the Pokémon World Tournament of sort, it's the Galar Star Tournament, you know that elimination tournament where you play with a partner. Plus, the Battle Frontier was boring, nice in theory, but no one cared about it.

[@shouldveusedsafesearch8099]

If they bring back something like the Battle Frontier or the PWT, it *NEEEEDS* to be free in the base game at launch.

[@shouldveusedsafesearch8099]

​@@Lithosagymfan173 The Galar Star Tournament is just the Pokémon World Tournament from Wish.

[@phil2160]

They did that as early as Crystal, with the Battle Tower, except you had to buy a whole ass game you had to start from scratch instead of just a DLC. If anything it reminds me of the Final Mix versions for KH1, 2 and Birth by Sleep vs the way KH3 did it with the Re:Mind DLC.

[@LunaticKD1991]

​@@Lithosagymfan173Not even close to being on the level of the Pokemon World Tournament from Black 2 and White 2.

[@tabbender1232]

Literally what's the problem with DP's campaign?

[@gengargamer5657]

It mainly comes down to the terrible Pokédex

[@tabbender1232]

@@gengargamer5657 The dex is ok. It's bigger than Kanto and BW because unlike those every single one is available before the league

[@HMMadsen]

The DP dex is actually quite terrible. First of all, 151 (150 if we don't count Manaphy) total Pokémon where only roughly half of that number consist of new Pokémon is not great for a Pokémon game released in 2006. BW is around 150's sure, but at least that Pokédex consists of only new Pokémon. Also, I decided to check your claim if DP had more Pokémon available before the league than RB and BW and it's still not great. DP only has five Pokémon more than RB (four of which are just version exclusives with only one being truly exclusive to only after the league, which is Mewtwo), and DP and BW actually have the same amount of Pokémon available at least from what I can tell (of the 156 total number of Pokémon in the BW regional dex, 150 should be available before the league akin to DP with its 150 dex excluding Manaphy, and if we filter out version exclusives both DP and BW would have 143 Pokémon available). So the DP dex only has five more Pokémon than RB and the same amount as BW. However, the reason why some claim DP to have the dookiest dex in all of Pokémon lies in the Pokémon distribution. Which leads me to the second reason the DP dex is terrible, the Pokémon distribution. Some types are heavily under represented like Fire and Ice with only two lines or Electric with three, and then there's Water with 16 lines (17 in Pearl because of Palkia). Team building therefore isn't as fun in DP because your options with certain types are so limited. Some of the specific Pokémon choices are also quite baffling, like why is the Wumple line there when it's a useless bug that just take up five spots in the dex, or why are Quagsire or Wiscash in the dex when we already have Gastrodon as a Water/Ground type? Couldn't those spots have been given to some the new Gen 4 evolutions? When the dex is limited to only 150 Pokémon, filler slots and uneven type distribution like in DP just doesn't cut it, expecially when dex excludes some of the new Pokémon for these filler slots and Water types

[@tabbender1232]

@@HMMadsen Pokemon games weren't balanced with your monotype nuzlocke self imposed challenges in mind Rare types exist in every old game (the new ones just bloat the routes with 1000 different encounters) Returning pokemon are not an issue at all Also unlike Victini Manaphy isn't a limited time event, you can still get it today if you have Rangers. And Unova has a lot of pokemon that evolve at levels you will never be at before the league, Sinnoh doesn't do that

[@HMMadsen]

@@tabbender1232 I've never tried out a monotype run before and my comment wasn't about that (although you totally could run a Water monotype run in DP with how bloated the type is in that game). It was simply about having options for building a team, and DP doesn't give you a lot of options unless it's Water. It's expecially baffling when Gen 4 already introduced a couple of new Pokémon for the under represented types, but a lot of them aren't available in the main campaign and instead we just have 17 water types. And yeah, rare types existed in the older generations like Ghost and Dragon, but not a basic type like Electric, or at the very least not to the extend that you only had three options (and for most people it would actually only be two options because of Pachirisu). You are right about the Pokémon that evolve too late in Unova (Volcorona, Hydreigon, Mandibuzz, Braviary, and Bisharp), and that's also a terrible part of BW. But at least it's only five Pokémon, and the type distribution for the BW dex is balanced enough that you can find other Pokémon to cover the types of those five Pokémon. Also as for the comment about the event Manaphy from Ranger, it has now become near impossible to get that Pokémon in DPPt. This is because you only get one Manaphy egg per Ranger cartridge, not per save file, which means that if someone already recieved the Manaphy egg from Ranger and sent it to DP, you can't recieve a new egg from that Ranger cartridge even if you restart with a new save file. And given that most people who bought Ranger already have sent their egg to DP, the numbers of Ranger cartridges with Manaphy are heavily dwindling. So Manaphy may as well just have been a limited time event to Victini because of this, and most people will never get Manaphy in DPPt because of this

[@dukecaliblap]

I honestly think that the real solution to the enhanced versions/dlc debate is that they should have done neither and stuck with making sequels after black and white 2. It's the best of both worlds. It lets the developers reuse a bunch of assets and characters but with a new story, expanded region, and more opportunities for post-game content

[@Lithosagymfan173]

Even that, Black 2 and White 2 are the fourth worst selling games, with the Top 3 all being Crystal, Emerald, and Platinum; they saw that selling that selling the same game but with more isn't that good.

[@fenixrises9854]

Honestly I’d like UNPAID DLC. With how big of a company Nintendo, game freak, monsters inc, etc are, they really don’t need to be charging for that anymore. But that’s just my take on the whole thinh

[@Zersetzor]

You can't just flatly say that the first games in a generation were unfinished and only the third version fixed them. This flatly is not true about gens 1, and 2, arguably 3, and gen 5. It was really gen4 where this started. For some reason it seems Pokemon fans agree that if Platinum is the gen4 game to play if you had to chose, but don't want to admit that Diamond and Pearl were a complete mess that was clearly not fit for release. The precedent this set, plus the fact that GameFreak clearly was (is?) not able to produce a 3d game, even if it's only graphics, is a big reason for the current state of the franchise.

[@ryanchad8384]

I personally only play the post game of a new game on my first playthrough. DLC is much better than a postgame for me

[@RiqMoran]

I think SV have the best postgame other than Emerald's battle frontier. Because in SV you can legitimately catch everything and their shiny forms. not to mention the dlc is substantial.

[@mattanatior3484]

Yes, we can do something about 70 dollar games. DONT BUY THEM. If people dont buy them at that price, they will be forced to lower the price to get sales. Nothing will change if you pretend like you're powerless.

[@Silverphantom4444]

11:35 I'll have you know I was quite the contest coordinator 😤

[@alex_humphrey_33]

GOATED video game background music in this one