How South Korea Is Running Out of Children

[@poodlescone9700]

Peter Zeihan summed it up best: When we were living on the farms, children were free labor. In an urban environment, children are an expensive hobby.

[@menumlor9432]

Which video was that in? I do remember him saying something like that.

[@Brabbs]

Source?

[@SeptikAvenger]

​@@Brabbs The End of the World is Just the Beginning by Peter Zeihan

[@SeptikAvenger]

​@@menumlor9432 Most of them.

[@NoobToobJamarMemes]

Nice to meet another fan of his.

[@Djungelurban]

You're forgetting one important factor, which considering the exclusive focus on women as a theme of this video is not surprising, but I'd argue is hugely significant... Most Korean children do not have a normal childhood. Particularly in terms of education. In Korea, it's seen as hugely important to have as accomplished an education as possible. As a result, most parents start hiring tutors and signing their kids up to classes before they even start school and even kindergarten's are specifically focused on education. When they later start school, kids have long school days from grade 1 with a specific focus on memorization and learning facts at scale. And over the course of a young person's school life, those school days get further and further extended and eventually most children get signed up to after school classes and studies. As they reach high school it's common that students spend 15+ hours every day on studying and those that don't are looked down on as lazy or delinquent. After that it's expected that you attend university and about 74% of all Koreans do so, usually right after high school... On top of that, once they enter the work force, expectations on how much you're expected to work leave precious little time for personal activities. All this means that at graduation from university, you have a whole nation of 20 somethings that none of them had a chance to be a kid, play around and experience things other than studying. And they're finally given their first opportunity, maybe ever, to actually make their own choices and experience all the things they likely feel they missed out on. You think they're gonna wanna spend that first taste on actual freedom on starting a family? Probably not, not in a global world where they know that other choices are available. Most people choose to try to enjoy their life as much as possible, but considering Korean often work over 60 hours per week, most people work through their bucket lists very very slowly... And by the time most people are satisfied, many are already in their 40s and there's precious little time for children. So really, Korea's birth rate problem is so multi-faceted that it's almost impossible to fix. You can't fix it with a new law or a check in the mail... It's cultural and societal, essentially the soul of Korea is preventing people from wanna have children.

[@missyouhoo]

Which also explains Japan in a way & what China could be in 50 years. Maybe India in 150 years

[@jason4275]

Yea, its succeed or nothing else in that country, after a Korean grows up in such a society and become more self-aware, why would they even want to have a kid in such a dog eat dog country.

[@HardestTorkum]

Very good explanation, like it!

[@f3n1xplat3ad0]

You forgot the male mandatory military service. If your family is poor, then you serve in the ROK Army.

[@bebebaba3442]

That’s so insane

[@sally7310]

I'm South Korean and I'm in my late 20s. In Korea, we say "We will be the first generation to be poorer than our parents' generations." There are tons of complicated reasons but this is why our fertility decreases so sharply and here's what we think : Now we have to raise our child in even more competitive society with less money. More expensive hobby(children) + Less Money(Being poorer than parents) = Give up hobby(No Children) (For me, I'll get married and have at least two kids only because I got lucky to have parents who can help me financially and I get paid little more than average 20s.)

[@zetaplus7911]

Here in the US, the thought of, "We will be the first generation to be poorer than our parents' generations" is increasingly more prevalent. This will likely become a major issue for us in a decade or two. Immigration is helping, but as immigrants naturalize, the situation will apply to them too.

[@paperplane-db8qf]

Children aren’t a hobby 🤦‍♂️

[@Arcessitor]

@@zetaplus7911 Immigration doesn't help, what are you even talking about. Immigration is depressing wages. It is creating a hostile environment to live in. Immigration isn't the solution, it is an emblem of the problem.

[@Arcessitor]

@@paperplane-db8qf Thank you, it pained me to read it.

[@LemGray]

@@Arcessitor Immigrants don't depress wages. Wages haven't gone up since the 70's, since the Reagan "miracle" and the gutting of unions. I guess I don't have a problem with immigrants because they usually create their own jobs, work jobs that no American wants, or they work harder for longer hours than I'm willing to work. They also maintain community and family relations for a generation or two, which is more than I can say about most Americans. Their children also tend to be more successful than the entitled people who whine about immigration. What makes it worse, is that the whiners are the descendants of immigrants themselves.

[@dragosstanciu9866]

Too much stress, no wonder the birthrate is falling. The men and women are living only for their jobs.

[@amadeuz8161]

and women dont want kids today because of X reasons. My ex didn't want misformed stomage muscles so abortion, another ex did 2 abortions because we were still studying, another ex was already too old so she mis carried or lied. Like they wont settle so when they dont settle they still wait for a different future and in the end they are too old and anyone will do as a father but its too late so they get at most 1. There is always exceptions and this does not include every woman, its a trend among women.

[@CesarLuisAfonsoDias]

@@amadeuz8161 I think that is the major problem everywhere. Development means people living in big cities, big cities means more people, more people means more options, more options means less decisions, less decisions means waiting until too late. People migrate from everywhere to big cities because off better jobs, better qualifications, better social status and also more stress. But we lost it in family cohesion, and nowadays we are like "octopus" every new generation we have to learn everything and everything more complex from the scratch, so we dont have continuity. This all been contributing to the shortage of babies. But hey good luck, trying to convince any women or even men that their social status, their work for some company means "sh**", and noone besides them would care about that.

[@USSAnimeNCC-]

Patriarchy too man did you see the video this idea of enforce gender roles should go the way of the dinosaurs those who kick it are go to have children as their going to be more flexible than one who stick to traditional gender roles South Korea is very patriarch society but what women in their right mind want that system also what men want that it benefits no one but a few usually men who want more power and control it doesn’t mean you shouldn’t be a house wife just it not for everyone wow women are better off as boss girl than a house wife and when women feels their better off their are going to want to settle down and have kids

[@amadeuz8161]

@@CesarLuisAfonsoDias Yep, to many options and when the grass always looks greener on the other side of the fence. I stopped trying to convince a woman to settle after my 5th. Like Shortest was 2.5 years and longest 5.5 years so I thought enough is enough. I have other things to do in my life than waste my time on doing the same thing over and over thinking the result will be any different. :D At least I'm free and can walk in around naked, eat whatever I want to cook, sleep in the whole bed, watch whatever I want... A family would have been better but I dont want someone elses children or a 40+ year old woman increasing the chance for problems. I never say never but I wont put any energy into it because a man can become a father still at 60 without problems.

[@amadeuz8161]

@@USSAnimeNCC- The thing is that women dont work in the same way as men. A woman should have children as pretty young while a man can have em when they are old. There are medical issues that occur when a woman gets older so women's clock ends earlier than a mans even if they live longer than men. Like I dont want kids with someone older than 35 because the chance of getting more than 1 kid is then reduced and I'm hoping for 3-4 at a minimun of 2 so that the first kid wont be alone get spoiled never learning what happens when you dont compromise with another kid. Yes a 40 year old can pop out 2 kids but the chance of getting a kid with special needs goes up with age and at least when I was young that crucial line went at 40.

[@johnjackson9751]

How can they expect people care for kids when they can hardly even care for themselves?

[@speakupyt4900]

There are many developed countries with much smaller populations than Korea -with about 1/5 of Korea's population~🟢🟢 Singapore, Sweden, the Netherlands, Switzerland, etc ~Are they extinct? Moreover, many analysts believe that the ''inevitable Korean reunification'' will increase population to 70 to 80 Million in the future, so stop talking nonsense about low birth rate.

[@RachelEden]

Amen . We got love ourselves and be happy with ourselves first before anything else or nothing good coming out of it .

[@--Traveler--]

it's got nothing to do with ourselves, it's got to do with quality of life. before, having children was about survival, and keeping the farm labour constant.

[@johnjackson9751]

@@--Traveler-- It’s hard to say it has nothing to do with ourselves. Not sure what country you even live in, but the costs of living in the states (in a place that isn’t in the middle of nowhere) is high for a young person. Prices for apartments where I live are $1200/mo for a STUDIO. Wages are not going up to match the high prices. A decent car that doesn’t have 200k miles on it will run you $15-20k at least. Houses are 250k at least if you don’t want to live in the ghetto w/ drugs and crime. These things are unaffordable on some crappy retail or low-skill job. Your options are college (which you may have to go into debt for if you weren’t born with a silver spoon in your mouth), or trade school. Either way, it’s years if your life taken away from you. You could also try starting a business, but your chance for failure is high unless you’re some entrepreneurial genius . Idk about you, but I imagine nobody wants to start a family with someone who is struggling to support themself.

[@johnjackson9751]

@@AB-df5mt Buddy you just answered your own question. It’s not an excuse, it’s a reality. Open your eyes man. Sure you can shit out a bunch of kids when you can hardly take care of yourself, however their lives will be just as crap as yours. Young people see that and don’t want that to happen to themselves or any kids they would have had.

[@rossanasparvoli5487]

As a woman I find it ridiculous that the solution implied in this video for the birth rate problem in South Korea would lie on their society be more open with being a single mother! Clearly women already feel overloaded with the entire responsibility of raising a child putting on their shoulders INSIDE A MARRIAGE, being a single mother is way more demanding and difficult! If women do not want to get married because they are feeling overload, they obviously will not want to have children just on their own, having even more pressure over them! The solution is clearly a cultural shift where MEN must take part of the responsibility of taking care of the children with their partners! Not put 100% of the responsibility of raising children entirely on women only, that's the very reason why they don't want marry in the first place!

[@glstka5710]

Also, in America most of the men in prison are from fatherless homes. Children need a father.

[@amylovemyart]

Women in SK: we hate this deeply rotted misogynistic sociatal norm. We refuse to get married and have kids. SK men and government: let's implement even more misogynistic policies and objectify women even more than before tp boost marriage and birth rate. Also, SK's government higher ups are a bunch of rich bigoted old men. They will never and can never comes up with any good policies that will actually benefit women.

[@kenim]

I was shocked that they are so woke to the point to see children almost exclusively born in wedlock as something negative! Its hilarious.

[@oldchild527]

It's a cultural problem, for starters if young population wasn't that much pressured onto a job that's doesn't pay extra hours and takes all your life time, where are the young ones gonna find a partner, there's no time for dating or meeting more people, there aren't much chances to have a better income, housing prices are leveling up faster

[@minhnguyen-rp2es]

Isn't this what woman are asking for? All men are the evil in womans eyes I'm right? On top of that. Do you know how much does it cost to marry a Korean woman? + how much you have to earn? This country is Finnish

[@QuteraFX]

If you want people to have children, people need TIME, more work-life balance, and for men to be active in raising children.

[@TheBikeOnTheMoon]

The gov want children but refuse to do anything to encourage work-life balance. They keep doubling down on extra working hours to keep the economy running in short term while begging citizens to have children, which is impossible, they can't have both ways.

[@yevhenkozlov286]

if it was the solution, Sweden would have fertility rate higher than current 1.6

[@quangminhpham7919]

@@yevhenkozlov286 give women nothing ,let them live miserable like in the past ,the more man give women the more women disrespect man that is mistake rich country did, see poor and developing country women breed hard, the more women has better life they dont want baby anymore , see poor country

[@sakuralein1]

@@yevhenkozlov286Sweden is expensive as fu..k 🤣

[@skierx]

world will collapse by the time they are balancing work life and get the so called time

[@matthewshields]

Most nations are more concerned about providing retirement benefits to older citizens than they are about maintaining birth rates which is what allows them to maintain the benefits for older citizens.

[@sleepete12]

well, kids have no voting rights and if country like Japan has huge elderly population then to win the next election you need those votes....

[@robertb1802]

Old people vote, babies don't.

[@matthewshields]

@@robertb1802 yeah, which is the problem. It's easier for politicians to make a short-term fix to retirement benefits and to get re-elected over making systemic changes that would increase the birth rate.

[@davidford3115]

Indeed. Sacrificing the future for the present. There is a reason why previous generations to the Boomers were content to go without so that the next generation could live comfortably and thrive. Those in power and those retiring should be focused on child-rearing instead of their own comfort.

[@Obscurai]

@@davidford3115 Most Boomers are now grandparents or dead. It's the generation after the Boomers that weren't willing to suffer. Which generation are you?

[@glory2cybertron]

There's always talk that young women postpone or forego kids for career/travel/partying but it's never acknowledged that a lot of men do not want to support a child because then there's less money for more fun things.

[@ngpb17]

it is hard to have kids when all your time and money goes into maintaining a comfortable life, no savings. having kids is a huge sacrifice nowadays. it means no saving for retirement as that money will go to child care and expenses in a system designed to make money no a living.

[@thijsjong]

Something changed in the 70tees in Europe and in the 90tees in South Korea.

[@jaeinnmoon3279]

@@thijsjong - solutions to this problem is easy one. Mandate all employers to give preferential hiring/employment practices to those with children, and impose punitive taxes to employers with people over 35 with no kids/children. Give tax credits to people with kids, more tax credits to people with more kids. Problem solved. If you know you will be unemployed after 35 years of age because you have no kids, you will get busy making babies pronto…

[@hidesbehindpseudonym1920]

My friend owes me almost $7,000, owes the government even more, doesn't make a lot of money, and has no savings. Yet she got pregnant on "accident" and decided it was a good idea to keep it. Poor people will have kids no matter what common sense dictates.

[@Latinoamerica837]

@@hidesbehindpseudonym1920 people around the world. you can have 10 children, for god sake be a heroe, why dont exist birth heroes that will have a great impulse to the fertility of their country, BE A HERO. START A REVOLUTION

[@ngpb17]

fertility rates are very low too, for both females and males. studies show that male sperm count has decreased by about 50% average. I have kids, but I got lucky I got a job that paid me very well and let me invest and save money, but that is not the average.

[@emsie1655]

I've watched many of these as I've lived in Korea for 15 years and this is a very good explanation. Money is part of the problem, not the main issue, but if you interview people on the street they will give that as a simple answer. Family systems are still very conservative and younger women especially do not want to get trapped in the older generations idea of family. Having children is a career ender or at least a huge career setback for most women here, the women I know who took 1 year off after giving birth were treated very poorly by their companies when they returned and for men it's mostly unthinkable. If they choose to become a housewife then they are completely reliant on their husband for the rest of their lives and the husband also has the burden of having to be the sole money earner for the rest of his life too. If they get divorced or their husband loses his job then it's basically game over. Other factors I've noticed: - Lack of high quality flexible or part-time jobs as people have to choose full time very long hours in the office or high school wage part time jobs. There are almost no opportunities for housewives coming back to work. - Older/younger generation extreme culture gap. Multi-generational support for raising children is much less common and also more difficult due to the generation gap. It also just causes a lot of stress/conflict for many people here. - Poor mental health care, high stress lives and very high depression/suicide rates. - Culture change no longer seeing marriage and children as an outright necessity. - Education system is literal hell and young people don't want their kids to experience that. - Korea transitioning from a very patriarchal society causing a lot of tension between men and women. - Extremely competitive society where appearance/job/money are highly valued. - Housing affordability, especially in Seoul. Basically you have to really, really want to have kids to overcome all the challenges of having children in Korea.

[@Wong-Jack-Man]

90% of these challenges existed with previous generations and had multiple children and survived on rice and ramen and eggs. The issue is today’s generation is weighing the trade off between comfort living and sacrificing to support children.

[@Sol-ps8ox]

Newer generation has become self centered. Otherwise women can return to work after sometime while grandparents could take care of the children. But anyhow, there are too many humans on earth....no problem if one country runs out of its population. We even have North Korea, so the culture won't die down.

[@jackblack1097]

Or you can just say: not enough money in the system. You can call also our age: silent depression

[@fransmith3255]

@@Wong-Jack-Man Okay, well you obviously don't know the real situation in South Korea... Have you actually spoken to South Korean women on the subject? Did you watch the video at all?

[@YouReadMyName]

People are not looking at the obvious. It is simple, population always tends towards the carrying capacity of the land that population inhabits. If people have higher living standards, then the carrying capacity of the land will fall, which is why technically "rich" countries have low birth rates, while people that have lower living standards, will have a higher carrying capacity for the land they inhabit, which is why technically "poor" countries have huge birth rates.

[@CuAnge1]

Working full time and being a full time parent and homemaker sounds like hell. You cannot even divorce and leave after that even if you face domestic abuse because you face discrimination and lack of public support. You basically have to slave away and sign your life to someone else.

[@britneybij3997]

South Korea: The woman needs her man's permission to have the child! Also South Korea: Children is a woman's business! The math: **not mathing**

[@siddharthgoyal4008]

Women's rights are not a solution for fertility rate. Nordic countries have most egalitarian societies with strong women's rights and they are all also below replacement rate.

[@arpandey698]

​@siddharthgoyal4008 Still much better than the conservative south Korea.

[@siddharthgoyal4008]

@@arpandey698 we're splitting hairs on which country will collapse when. Both have perpetually declining native populations.

[@treelinehugger]

As @siddharthgoyal4008 wrote, feminism is NOT relevant. Your feminist ideology is NEVER the panacea feminists think it is.

[@jojospice3353]

Nobody understands that people will not have kids in an absolut selfles way. In the former days, having kids was always a way to ensure the legacy or the retirement agreements . But in modern todays, the parents are expected to have nothing in return of raising the kids.

[@andreeas.2362]

And what about pension systems? Or who will man services when you are old? Hospitals etc?

[@shelbysycamore637]

@@andreeas.2362 The person who migrated to my country to improve their living standards can migrate if I don't have a kid.

[@speakupyt4900]

There are many developed countries with much smaller populations than Korea -with about 1/5 of Korea's population~🟢🟢 Singapore, Sweden, the Netherlands, Switzerland, etc ~Are they extinct? Moreover, many analysts believe that the ''inevitable Korean reunification'' will increase population to 70 to 80 Million in the future, so stop talking nonsense about low birth rate.

[@jojospice3353]

@@andreeas.2362 . Does your pension system honor when you have raised some kids?

[@waterflowzz]

@@jojospice3353 i believe the person was trying to say it takes the younger generations to maintain the pension system for the older generations. If you have an over populated older generation and under populated younger generation the older generation has no money to fall back on because it is the taxation of the younger generation that maintains the pension system. This is exactly what’s happening in korea. The older generation doesn’t have a pension to fall back on because there aren’t many younger people to work. It’s also worse because there are many young people that are jobless do to the fact that the economies around the world are so bad.

[@Dddd-ko2xn]

No woman wants to cook&clean the house&have unwanted sexes&nurse and educate children&work at low paid jobs at the same time. Too much workload for women here. And also safety issue is a key reason too. In a survey, 40% of women who dated men have experienced dating abuse. Furthermore, digital sex crimes are notorious in here. But tbh, not many Korean men are sexually desirable.If there were more handsome men, I think many South Korean women would have married despite of whatever workload.

[@bettylee234]

TRUE 😂 50M people in Korea abd only 10 maps celebrities are handsome lol smh 95% of mape population is NOT attractive Korean men 🤮

[@LeannsAdventures]

I remember reading an income graph when I was already a few years into my career. With my income being single I was considered lower middle class. But if I had a dependent/child I'd be under the poverty line. That definitely did not encourage me to have kids.

[@antnam4406]

Why be a single parent?

[@EsteOeste-vw7ps]

@@antnam4406 why would you want to put up with someone else?, If you can raise the kid by yourself???.

[@oldcat1790]

@@EsteOeste-vw7ps but you can't really do it alone if it puts you under the poverty line

[@vagrant-techart8278]

Bs you have been nuked with leftism woman is killing the world and no one holds you accountable I am not afraid to unlike these simps.

[@antnam4406]

@@EsteOeste-vw7ps clearly not doing a good job with the moaning.

[@theintrovertadventurer9640]

I think a major point that is being ignored is that many of us simply don’t want to have kids. It’s not about money, relationship, benefits, policy etc, I don’t want kids and you couldn’t pay me to change my mind. Most of my friends think similarly.

[@yahudi7253]

Why? Anti natalism, environment, finances or freedom?

[@theintrovertadventurer9640]

@@yahudi7253 Lifestyle. I travel a lot and have many other hobbies that are time consuming. Same for my girlfriend. I also don’t feel that having kids would make me happier.

[@yahudi7253]

@@theintrovertadventurer9640 yeah so basically freedom, children are in fact burden. I like other's kids though.

[@PettyIsMyMiddleName]

@@yahudi7253 Why do people feel the need to ask someone who decides to be childfree “why”? I do not see the opposite being done with people who want children.

[@yahudi7253]

@@PettyIsMyMiddleName I am anti natalist myself was curious why he was. Simple, you don't need to play victim card here. And I constantly ask people who bear child why are you having it man

[@joy2bme]

You just scratched the surface of why Korean women are rejecting marriage. The unbalanced work load is certainly a factor, but it is greatly increased if you marry a first son. The wife of a first son is expected to take care of her in-laws and carry that burden in addition to all the housework and child rearing. Then there is the domestic abuse issue. There was a study in 2017 that found that about 80% of the Korean men surveyed had abused their girlfriends. Abuse doesn't get any better after marriage. Now that women can work, we don't need men to feed us anymore. We don't have to put up with the excessive workloads, abuse, and all-to-common cheating. We can have better lives by remaining unmarried.

[@sametyilmaz1543]

I doubt about the validity of that survey. That percentage seems to high for a any civilised community.

[@mickpeterson3722]

that 80% statistic must be BS

[@freewheeler1728]

a guy born n raised in korea here - WHAT year in history u r talking about?? 70s & 80s? u made me LMAO with your comment, the burden of marrying to 1st son? majority of men abusing partner? sounds like some old folklore I heard in 80s when I was a kid - your comments r delusional at best, wake up n smell the coffee of 21st century

[@Arcessitor]

@@sametyilmaz1543 It's probably the same as the 1 in 5 women were r***ed in America stat, where even looking at someone funny is considered r***.

[@Demopans5990]

@@mickpeterson3722 Less so if you are talking about Russians. Domestic abuse only counts there if the partner ends up dead

[@Nickelback8469]

It’s not that easy. A population decline due to low birth rates means that there will be a much heavier burden on the working force due to expenses of retirees

[@jeromebarry1741]

That's not an absolute. When the elderly have political power, they can make the burden on the young, but the time will come in any country when the elderly are insufficient to maintain that power. I calculate that in the U.S., the elderly political power will break in 2040. I should revisit that, because Covid-19 may have moved it to 2036.

[@aurilcia]

They'll just legalize euthanasia for the elderly to deal w/ the "problem".

[@speakupyt4900]

There are many developed countries with much smaller populations than Korea -with about 1/5 of Korea's population~🟢🟢 Singapore, Sweden, the Netherlands, Switzerland, etc ~Are they extinct? Moreover, many analysts believe that the ''inevitable Korean reunification'' will increase population to 70 to 80 Million in the future, so stop talking nonsense about low birth rate.

[@Arcessitor]

@@jeromebarry1741 That won't happen though. Because birthrates are declining, the elderly will always outnumber the young.

[@Demopans5990]

@@derek4412 Only difference is that statistically, the Millennial generation is more likely to be left leaning as they age compared to previous generations, and likely holds true of Gen Z and Alpha

[@razvanagafitei502]

Politicians do not realise that the cause for this problem is the Economy itself and they dare not change it

[@trackman2300]

I would agree with you, the problem is that the workers are working way too much and wages are to low wages do not keep up with the keeping the man of prices than the economy will decline . If the economy is too expensive to afford children in the society which they are being born, then the people in that society will not have children, and the government does not subsidize children's care, and make and subsidize free, education pays for by the taxpayers, And plus you need to raise waged and tell her is the price of living. Do you also need to allow companies to encourage their workers to interact with each other. School systems also needed to change we need to allow a school system to need allowed children to be children and allow them to grow up in a environments, we're looking grow inside of the fear of the Test. Societies in Japan and South Korea in their educational system needs to become less strict instead of throwing these children to go to cram school just let him relax instead of mandatory clubs after school, allow them to be themselves instead of punishing them of lack work ethic you should embrace their creativity

[@trackman2300]

I have forgotten about culture

[@jeromebarry1741]

"The Economy" is pretty nebulous. I've raised 3 children to adulthood in America during the economy of the past 40 years.

[@vaccinatedanti-vaxxer]

You realize when the economy was worse generations ago, Koreans had too many children right? Until the 1980s Korean gov had campaigned to lower birth rates when the economy was less developed, people worked more hours… so your statement is false

[@shithalshetty9762]

K-pop would be doomed

[@faevalentine9187]

Honestly this phenomenon is going on everywhere where women have a choice. Who wants to work a full time job just to come home to take care of some kids and a husband? Not to mention, you better not let yourself go and you BETTER tend to your husband because he might lose interest in you after childbirth. So you have to Work 40+ hours , tend to the kids, cook, clean, workout and eat right, and stay attractive so your husband doesn’t “stray” . And statically he will. So what’s the point? Also let’s not talk about the absolutely absurd Korean beauty standards. If the ideal body weight is around 80-90 pounds , having a baby and gaining weight is beauty suicide.

[@hainleysimpson1507]

You don't mention reasons why a man would want to be married. Why would i get married when most marriages end in divorce, the women leave with the kids half your stuff and she will get alimony, and child support only see the kids on weekends or 2 days a week. People look at you weird whenever you are with your kids in public, you are called regardless of what you do, women think you are an asshole creepy or a sex offender by merely existing. It's not sunshine and rainbows for men either.

[@TrinhNguyen-sh4fj]

@@hainleysimpson1507 That is why some of my brothers are not getting married. They said many women are gold diggers, they have to be the breadwinners, if they divorce, they will lose half their money if they divorce,etc… so many reasons why they do not want to marry.

[@Arcessitor]

"A choice" and yet you have to work 40+ hours. Let's face it, you don't have a choice. Economically it's not viable for you to stay at home. That's why you don't do it. Nobody wants to work in a cubicle 40 hours a week, men included. Face it, you went from being a respected homemaker to a wageslave to a company that will never love you as much as a husband will.

[@20thcentury_toy]

@@Arcessitor and they love it, until they don't

[@MoniiChanTheUnicorn]

@@Arcessitor "respected homemaker"? Really, since when were housewives respected?

[@MoniiChanTheUnicorn]

In many developed countries, people don't REALLY start living until they're in their mid-twenties. This is very different to just my parent's generation for example, who at that age were already home-owners, married with 2 kids. Cost of housing is too expensive so adults are infantilised for too long - no independence. High childhood pressures and trauma mean many people don't enjoy their childhood and they never grow up experiencing freedom (cram schools, intense competition and social pressure, family pressure, high suicide rates etc). So when they finally get freedom they don't want to burden their life again, we feel like we've finally earnt it to relax, except we can only barely relax because the economy is so bad and we still can't afford many things. I think solutions would be to not put such strict pressure on education that isn't even helpful (cramming for exams that you never remember the information for?). A system more like what the Finnish have is healthier and also world-class/still top performing. Those who are not destined to be doctors, lawyers etc should have apprenticeships offered as a respectable alternative from aged 16 onwards. If you have started earning your money and degree at 16, then you are already ahead of all your peers before you've even turned 20. You can start experiencing more early on and feel like you've 'lived your life' AND get a good establishment of the security of a house and a good partner (and high seniority at work). A lot of people would be very open to at least one child in these circumstances

[@HaHaHaHolowence]

Good comment.

[@mohdazminishak6387]

Not possible for Asian parent and culture. Asian parents all think highly about their kids to be lawyers and doctors

[@ismailnyeyusof3520]

Desperate times demand desperate measures. I’m a little surprised there was no mention of government provided nurseries for working young women who would otherwise have to give up their careers to free up more time to care for their children.

[@hoyoungan4244]

In fact, there are government provided, and subsidized nurseries all over the country. As a Korean citizen, I am a bit disappointed that this was not included in the video.

[@JessieBanana]

The problem is you can’t have material solutions without social change. Nurseries aren’t going to help if the second you have a baby your employer stops considering you for promotion or advancement. The societal expectation for women to sacrifice everything for their families and be in relationships where they don’t have supportive partners is always going to override any efforts.

[@JohnSmith-wx9wj]

It's probably a bad idea regardless.

[@speakupyt4900]

There are many developed countries with much smaller populations than Korea -with about 1/5 of Korea's population~🟢🟢 Singapore, Sweden, the Netherlands, Switzerland, etc ~Are they extinct? Moreover, many analysts believe that the ''inevitable Korean reunification'' will increase population to 70 to 80 Million in the future, so stop talking nonsense about low birth rate.

[@larryc1616]

Wish we had that in the US along with Universal Healthcare and No guns please! 🙄

[@lucymay446]

I think schools are a massive problem too, what's the point of having a kid if they can't even have a childhood because they're studying 24/7 and even being horrifically bullied where the bullies suffer no consequences.

[@ColourBlindHero]

You're right, how can we expect people to have kids if they don't think they're child will be happy?

[@KatAnne17]

Why are the kids being bullied? Who is bullying them?

[@beaulieuc8910]

well said. I remember being bullied by a girl in kent uk and she was about 8 and i remember thinking I definitely don';t want to bring a kid intot he world, either as a bully or a victim. kids are crap

[@attysthoughts3253]

shocking fact: South Korean divorce rate is higher than the EU average

[@rizasid]

The expectation that society has from you after you become a mother is too much, the woman is expected to completely devote herself towards raising a kid and managing the household, this in itself is a full time job, but NO she has to have another full time job to meet the rising cost of living. And motherhood is a very thankless job but if something goes wrong the mother is to be blamed and the added level of competitiveness in Korean society is a subject in itself. The women aren't choosing a career over family, this is them choosing their survival in the current society.

[@decoraqueena6413]

Not only is it a thankless job, but the fact its not profitable means it has no value in a capitalist society. How many times have you heard men talk about how SAHMs "stay at home and do nothing all day"?

[@rizasid]

@@decoraqueena6413 Exactly SAHMs are seen as lazing around the house all day, when in reality it is so much easier to get up in the morning, get ready and go to office work all day and come back home.

[@toomuchinformation]

​@@decoraqueena6413But still want to be the "head of the family", whose existence and upkeep they clearly don't value.

[@Ilja903]

Who cares about society? My best assumeption is that greedy boomers have too much assets, real estate and luxury. Younger generation is generally in debt. Instread of helping younger families, they are farting in their mansions and driving corvettes. Until they are gone and pass wealth further nothing will change

[@zackgravity7284]

I think this duty has become more difficult due to the decline of community as well

[@dawnandy7777]

If Korea addressed domestic violence and gave women a real financial incentive to have kids, including enabling mothers to return to work or school, they would have kids. Otherwise, the emotional and physical price is so high they will continue to choose not to.

[@speakupyt4900]

There are many developed countries with much smaller populations than Korea -with about 1/5 of Korea's population~🟢🟢 Singapore, Sweden, the Netherlands, Switzerland, etc ~Are they extinct? Moreover, many analysts believe that the ''inevitable Korean reunification'' will increase population to 70 to 80 Million in the future, so stop talking nonsense about low birth rate.

[@ewabrzakaa6395]

Some child protection from abuse and maybe making foster families functional would also be great in order to lose bit less of those few children they get as well.

[@dawnandy7777]

@@ewabrzakaa6395 Yes, I was just pointing out issues at the tip of the iceberg. There is something deeply wrong with the fabric of Russian society. We all know about corruption and alcoholism. However, how many people are aware that the leading cause of female death in Russia is Russian men or domestic violence. This is a worldwide problem that the West is a little better at handling. Domestic violence is just as big an issue for kids.

[@zicob2536]

Yeah because Muslim countries don't have domestic violence they have high birthrates. Korea needs Islam.

[@AmeLia-ch5si]

domestic violence exists everywhere

[@tora201jp]

It's not only South Korea. The fertility rate is dropping worldwide and is only accelerating. Basically, our modern social system is designed to covertly discourage us from having children. And its frightening how we have just accepted it.

[@divx1001]

The obvious solution is to change our current political and economic systems because they were based 100 years ago on a growing population. We need to start thinking about increasing our productivity thus we won't need as many people in the future to support the system. It's actually not a bad thing that the birth rates are dropping as our planet can not support infinite population growth. Our current model is unsustainable and governments trying to change people's behaviors in a system that was designed for infinite population growth (completely unrealistic) are missing the point.

[@TrinhNguyen-sh4fj]

So true and it is a worldwide issue not just South Korea’s problem only. Many I know are struggling to survive so having kids is considered a luxury now.

[@Puzzoozoo]

You can also blame increasingly toxic feminism.

[@jonathanguzman3044]

​@Puzzoozoo no its not. your problems with modern women are not universal

[@MrNote-lz7lh]

@@jonathanguzman3044 No. They're pretty widespread.

[@langouste6544]

I live in South Korea, and it seems we have to spend our whole lives supporting elders. No hope in this country.

[@kimandre336]

Hope never existed in South Korea since its existance. Remember. South Korea was one of the poorest countries in the world and it will become the poorest country in the world again. History will always repeat. South Koreans will always suffer, unless if they live outside of their homeland.

[@langouste6544]

Pensions, educational spending, housing prices, etc. These are prices that we have to pay for elders and it is pretty burdensome.

[@paljogo]

살기줫같네요

[@kenim]

Of course you have to support the Elders, because of the inheritance model. Koreans generally inherit everything their parents own well before they die. Their children’s success IS their retirement plan so they dont have an investment portfolio like the west.

[@CastorRabbit]

@@langouste6544 When the overall quality of life is declines the human population should decline accordingly.

[@grimmlinn]

So many people worried about fewer people on this planet but having gone from 4 billion to 8 billion in just a few decades, fewer people isn’t necessarily bad.

[@4SChris]

Yes but big companies are scared not to have enough customers !

[@grimmlinn]

@@4SChris It’s never enough

[@HeroDai2448]

But in the case the case of south korea. South korea is very important since it’s a economic power house. It’s important for the whole world

[@grimmlinn]

@@HeroDai2448 So are any modern economy, but the less you need, the less you need to make. Over consumption is a modern issue.

[@HeroDai2448]

@@grimmlinn consumption creates wealth and progress. That’s why poverty is at all time low and going down exponentially

[@Big_Tex]

Half the Korean population lives in the Seoul metropolitan area - and it’s well known that urbanization is a key factor in falling birth rates. I suspect that if you could incentivize people to move back out to the countryside in any country the birth rate would improve. Not sure how you do that though.

[@AlbanAwan]

I dunno, rural areas have small families too

[@CesarLuisAfonsoDias]

There a big pollical agenda against that. People living on the countryside and not depending on big govenment?! How dare you! Its cultural thing that big cities provide better social status and almost noone wants to move back to the countryside. I personally have the possibility to be 50/50 in a big city and in the countryside and I cant tell you by experience life is so more easier simpler and enjoyable on the countryside. And nowdays, one can be in less than 1h/2h in a big city if needed. But the social status and the cultural political agenda blinds people.

[@CesarLuisAfonsoDias]

@@AlbanAwan I will not argue that there a problem in rural areas too, but comparing with cities, they have way more children. I think its a matter of logic, in rural areas people tend to rely more on their families, on neighbors to help them. In big cities that was lost, who will help you if the parents get sick or they need to go somewhere? Where is the aunt, the cousin, the grandmother?

[@ImLure]

Forcing people who spent their entire youth and adult hood studying to be doctors, lawyers, etc into the rural area to raises birth rates after making their previous environment hyper competitive will not be good in the short to mid term. Most of the people do not have the means of self sustaining labour. AKA farming, plumbing, electric labour, welding, etc. this is basically sentencing a “small generation” to birth slavery to prop up the country. Granted, many Koreans would probably enjoy a lax lifestyle, but after a while, that is the timeframe that will determine the course of the decision long term

[@marcos-ll2yr]

is not gonna increase even doing that. The key is bring foreigner women to marry korean men.

[@jennifer-oc6io]

Korea should ease their education stress

[@ericsohn5084]

I agree but Korea has nothing but human resource. Education fever is directly associated to the country's success.

[@sagepirotess6312]

Nope. Education not the problem. Koreans start up and are eunterperns more than anyone else. 4 out of 10 globally even in usa.

[@hazmia151]

the problem is the older generations still cheer them up to rank first. their mind is still close-minded.

[@sophia-annsmith9277]

They also should stop looking down on blue collar jobs and not attending college. Having a life skill is very important and the culture appears not to address this issue. You will always need someone to fix your shoe, pick up the garbage, make your clothes which does not need to be designer brand, mke your furniture etc.

[@nabimiso]

Most children in South Korea are the only child in the family so a woman knows when she marries a man she is culturally expected to take on the care of his parents including most of the care for any children you may have. Often times this includes the mother in law moving in with you and controlling every aspect of your life. I a m married to a Korean man but he is the 3rd son. There is NO WAY I'd ever consider marrying an oldest Korean son.

[@SSNESS]

Why don’t they have any eyelashes

[@robertsaget9697]

Low birth rates aren't a problem. Its only a problem when a government makes poor financial decisions by tying pensions to population growth. Have some basic fiscal responsibility and don't do that and there is no problem.

[@davidford3115]

I tend to agree. Most social safety nets in the West are glorified Ponzi schemes. Japan has come to terms with their stagnant population and have accepted austerity, unlike the spoiled adult-children in the EU and the US.

[@LuisRomeroLopez]

Criminally under liked comment.

[@doujinflip]

They might want to revisit how they pay out those pensions, making it a share of taxpayer size and input... meaning it's bound to shrink if they don't have kids and don't pressure their kids' employers to pay more.

[@DOCTORKHANblog]

This is a dumb way to look at this. This not just pensions.

[@yahudi7253]

Agree on it somehow. Human are way too much. This borrowing from future thing was scam and it will not work now

[@Minifutzi_o.O]

Well but it seems the politicians are afraid to tackle the socio-cultural environment. Taking away the social pressure could probably do much more.

[@TheHaniverse]

While I agree with all the points made in the video, I feel like not enough focus was put on the financial side being a colossal deterrent even for couples who want kids, and I mean this in more than just a 'kids are expensive' way. Korea is going thru a massive housing crisis that is holding a lot of people in their 30s from even considering marriage bc they can not even fathom being able to buy a space big enough for a 3-person family. You mentioned how 25% of households are now single-person, but let's also highlight that those households are shoebox-sized studio apartments that cost a fraction of what a 3-bedroom apartment does in Seoul these days. The inability of couples to buy homes where they can raise a family is also stopping many people from settling down and/or having kids. Add in the terrible legislation for foreign immigrants (who are not eligible for most mortgage loans and have extremely limited job opportunities, meaning all the financial burden falls on the Korean partner) - even though multicultural couples are amongst the most 'fertile' in Korea (ie they have the most children), the inability for them to build stable lives in Korea has them and a lot of Korean couples exiting Korea altogether.

[@eugenedelacruz6754]

The main issue is money both partner needs to work to afford the cost of living today.

[@Guitar6ty]

Same in Canada and the UK.

[@classictutor]

Actually reverse is true. Chinese immigrants in Korea are not subject to loan limits for housing, limits on pre-schools, and other limits that Koreans are subjected to. Further they get banking subsidies (6% interest while Koreans get 1% on deposits), birth subsidies, housing subsidies, etc. It was put into place by the leftist President Kim Dae Jung 20 years ago and kept increasing to a point that Chinese immigrants get 19 benefits that Korean citizens are not able to get in their own country. The reason this keeps going is media is a silent culprit and most people do not know about this to the point now there are close to 2 million Chinese in South Korea. Koreans are subsidizing Chinese population growth inside Korea.

[@suriowl]

Thank you.

[@vijeolook]

And in the Netherlands too. With both parents working you also need (expensive) childcare during the day which eats up a large part of the extra income...@@Guitar6ty

[@temistogen]

Work culture,no contacts,no opportunities,less help from the state...What do you expect?

[@vaccinatedanti-vaxxer]

That was true for south korea even when they were facing over population. Its more to do with women now don't need marriage to survive.

[@raven3moon]

Also the expectation of being completely subservient to your mother-in-law, who expects you to take care of your husband the same way she has. And if your mother has passed, or they are divorced, you're also expected to take care of your father in the same way. Cooking, laundry, dishes, planning social events...

[@PinKeeDJ]

I once saw a documentary about a woman who was making money on selling paid subscriptions to people watching her eat meals :) They said the Koreans are so lonely that they would do that to fake not having a meal alone. Very developed culture, indeed.

[@susiex6669]

Mukbang has been a thing since forever.

[@PinKeeDJ]

@@susiex6669 Call it whatever, it doesn't change the fact that the idea is plain stupid :)

[@susiex6669]

@@PinKeeDJ To YOU. Im sure theres plenty in your culture that people would deem stupid.

[@induchopra3014]

This is all our future. Every country

[@divestfromdust]

You really have no idea about Korea.... Clearly. Mukbang is just another Internet fad, like asmr, watching others play a video game or those annoying fake pranks🙄. Those people eating are usually entertaining to listen to while eating and make the food look really delicious that you wanna go buy that. Also the awe of seeing someone usually small finish a colossal amount of food also draws in viewers. I feel like western countries have higher rates of loneliness that eastern countries since the west still follows individualism (putting yourself first) vs the east where collectivism(putting the group first) is still strong.

[@scamexpose123]

Its true about south korean buying bride houses. Many grils from north east of India are married to southkoreans. We too have shortage of girls in the country. Approx 30 million men in India are unmarried just because there are no girls, can you imagine this in a country like India? Yeah you are hearing it right. The problem is true. Please stop such trafficking businesses..

[@marilenaganea6578]

Yeah... It's a pleasure to work 3 jobs to make the government and "society" happy while your body is failing earlier because the rich need a new generation of workers. How about NO!

[@djangokill65]

🎯🎯🎯

[@Godfrey544]

Most Rich people were pushing overpopulation and that the middle class should stop having kids. I only know of one billionaire asking people to have kids. And it’s the same one trying to make robots to replace human workers

[@terranceknows]

Based.

[@DOCTORKHANblog]

You going to make babies and you're going to like it.

[@saksheebhaiswar5037]

As an Indian urban woman I am always juggling the societal expectation that comes from being a married woman and what it is expected from the role v/s managing a full time career and having my own interests and desires. This becomes overwhelming even when I don't have kids. I see a similar future for Indian urban population in the coming generation. Where women will choose their careers rather than managing the stress of having it all.

[@plantiron]

Choose careers instead of having kids? Do women the world over even know that the only reason men did not take them as competition that should be annihilated is BECAUSE THEY OFFER SEX AND REPRODUCTION. If women start failing at these things, then why would men want to protect, provide or see any value in women?

[@tad0930]

Cultures that traditionally enjoyed free lifetime devotion of women will need to wake up to that fact. Sadly, when privileges are taken for granted, equality seems like a punishment. Stay safe and independent. It will get very ugly before it gets better

[@yami6499]

Most indian couples have 2 kids nowadays except some communities like mslms. Even urban middle-class families with housewives have 1 or 2 children mostly. The falling birth rate in Korea has reasons totally different from what is shown in this video. But since the cause is 'politically incorrect' to talk , it will never be discussed let alone worked upon. Long-story short, korea's birth rate is going to continue decreasing since the falling birthrate is mainly caused by falling marriages as well which in turn is caused by korean men not marrying(a decade back it were korean women going on 'marriage-strike' but now things have reversed there). As for Indian urban population, multiple communities encouraging their young ones is gonna keep the birthrate at 2.1 for foreseeable future.

[@Sol-ps8ox]

Indian birth rate will remain fine. Its because Indian culture is unique. 2 children is the normal in India. Hardly anyone goes on marriage strike....be it men or women. Marriage and kids is the norm...no matter how much costly. Some couples only have one kids...but still they do reproduce. And in rural region...its also mostly around 2-3. Only muslim community, that too very poor muslim community have more than 4 children....due to lack of education and religious fundamentalism.

[@omarmansuri7099]

In the cities you're probably right but India still has a huge rural population where the old mentality of kids= free labour prevail so until these folks are educated, it won't fall that much

[@MsCruzan]

Looking in from the outside, I think it would help if there were other major industrialized cities other than Seoul. Everything is so expensive, so cramped, and there isn’t enough space to even physically have a family. Everyone shouldn’t feel like they have to live in Seoul just to get an education, get a job, etc. The govt should look into encouraging more industries and universities to be developed outside of Seoul.

[@zackgravity7284]

More industrialisation isnt the answer, its the root cause. That and the anti competitive monopolised economy. Moving back to small family based agriculture would be a cure

[@cooperhawk988]

Spreading out the problem doesn’t fix the issue. It’s much more cultural and economic than just not enough space.

[@dogetoshinakamoto7057]

They’ve sort of tried but not a lot of “economic pies” to go around to disperse. We’re after all talking about Korea, which is highly concentrated in few industries and companies. It’s not the US, Japan, Germany or any large economies.

[@weomxd]

The Industrial Revolution and its consequences, have been a disaster for the human race, South Korea is like the prime example.

[@zackgravity7284]

@@weomxd east asia and europe too

[@KeepMeConscious1]

At 7:10 - 7:27 the video says that it is a good thing that the acceptance of single motherhood is on the rise, but then at 8:53 - 9:12 it says that women do not want to be burdened with the sole responsibility of raising the children... What do you think single motherhood is? I think that South Korea correctly identifies that children should be born within marriage, but maybe it needs to have more grace and understanding towards people who fail to meet the ideal. Also, it should focus on the other factors like cost of living and promoting the involvement of the father in raising children.

[@edwardblair4096]

What the latter comment is about is the expectation that raising a child is wholly the responsibility of the woman, even when she is in a committed marriage. At least women who decide to have a child outside of marriage have voluntarily chosen to take on the responsibility. If there was a change in the cultural expectations, and a corresponding change in job security, that allowed the burdens of child care to be spread more evenly between the partners, then there might be less reluctance among women.

[@jacobjamersony]

Exactly

[@NoOne24]

There is no contradiction between the two statements.

[@Arcessitor]

@@NoOne24 Yes, there is. It is bizarre to accept sole responsibility for a child while single but not while married, where at least you are offered financial support.

[@xanderreyno]

Give people their lives back and they will want to have children. People are living in society where children are too much cost, time, effort etc because we are so convinced work comes first. You need your job to participate in society but there will be no society without children. The five day, forty hour week, is outdated, and based on having a full time parent at home with the children and taking care if the home, we have women in the workforce now, yet wages are stagnant and dropping in real terms? People need their time back, and they need to be able to afford to live comfortably. The phrase "working poor" and "cost of living" shouldn't be commom phrases or topics in "rich", "developed" countries.

[@Firealchemist24]

Why yes, if you double the available workforce in the market, as a company you can easily afford to pay less, because it is only the workforce that doubled, the amount of jobs stayed the same. Basic supply and demand. And "giving people their lives back" would only be a small part of the solution. You can give people more time by limiting working hours, but if the jobs on offer are unstable, if the economy is in a constant downturn, if buying a small home will take you the greatest part of your working life, if the wages stay the same but the cost of living and things continue to go up and if you live in constant fear of getting fired form your job people will prioritize living for the moment and avoiding big expenses, which having children is a part of, because you have absolutely no certainty in your life.

[@paperplane-db8qf]

Forty hour week is a dream 😂.

[@lalakuma9]

I get that falling birth rate could become an economic disaster in the current system we have. But maybe having fewer humans is actually good for the future of our planet. If a lot of people don't want to have kids, it's already showing that the society we have is not sustainable in some ways.

[@jimo1150]

I keep seeing these videos popping up, but nobody brings up the idea that having kids, even with having the resources for it, doesn't seem to be that interesting or rewarding

[@cawheeler27]

Because most people don't feel that way. That's weird and abnormal. Humans, like all living organisms, are biologically programmed to reproduce. If you don't feel that way, something is wrong with you. It's unnatural.

[@kwwamalwa]

Failure to reproduce is suicidal. One person can do it, no problem. But if everybody stops having kids on a societal level, that's a guaranteed catastrophe. The result would be a society where everyone is 80 years old. Who pays for your pension when you're too old to work? Who grows your food, collects your trash, changes your diaper, or buries you when you die? Without a huge technological leap some time in the next 50 years, the level of human suffering in some of these low-birth-rate countries could be immense. The elderly may use their voting power to institute increasingly higher taxes to fund their own pensions but the young are the ones who do all the actual work in any society. They could just refuse to pay these higher taxes. That will be the death of democracy. What are you gonna do? Send 80-year-olds to battle 25-year-olds? And even if the young lose by some miracle, they could just leave the country entirely. The elderly won't have that option. Even if we have robots taking care of the elderly and doing all the jobs humans currently do, what next? If we're lucky, we'll have death and extinction to look forward to. Soul crushing but that's the consequence of our choices. The more likely outcome, however, is one where the religious fanatics (who are the only people having kids these days) grow enough in numbers to dominate society and institute a theocracy. It's already happening in Israel. The ultra-orthodox Jews (7 kids per woman) are outbreeding the moderate and secular Jews (2 kids per woman). This has grown their political influence to the point where the rightward tilt in Israeli politics is pretty much permanent and is only going to grow.

[@kathycoleman4648]

@@kwwamalwa Yes. It's Longshanks theory from "Braveheart" essentially. People do not realize that if the problem gets bad enough, someone WILL step in to change it and people will not like the results. Also, Tim Pool constantly talks about how the future is conservatives because liberals are aborting their children at one end of the candle and sterilizing them at the other. The true and great challenge, though, is how do we convince people that they want marriage and children again? We've spent decades bastardizing both and we're going to reap the rewards for that.

[@paperplane-db8qf]

Majority of the world disagrees with you. Even most people who don’t have kids go on to have pets. That’s even more work in a way. You have to pick up the poo their entire lives.

[@ltb1345]

@@paperplane-db8qf Kids are more work and are more expensive than pets.

[@JessieBanana]

Men will do everything except be better partners and parents. It’s ridiculous.

[@Assassins6688]

Always the victim

[@Eklavya1008]

As an Indian🇮🇳 this vedio is not for us 😂😂😂

[@ObobWobob]

India's population will be instrumental in their development

[@newworldbro]

As india industrializes, she too will experience population declines. There’s nothing I’ve seen that suggests that india is seriously investing in ways to make it easier for a young couple. This is a sign of India’s future if it doesn’t start on addressing capitalism’s failures now

[@baha3alshamari152]

​@@newworldbro India population will continue to increase even with below replacement rate due to Bengalis immigrants India receives more immigrants than emigrants leaving thus they can survive low birth rates unlike south Korea

[@aaat4873]

No, India has other issues!

[@Eklavya1008]

@@baha3alshamari152 fun fact is that we have 50 million immigrants,equal to population of korea 😂🤣🤣

[@jimflagg4009]

There seems to be a world wide drop in births in the developed countries. It looks like social cultures will need to change for the new world.

[@Sbeyonce-ur9zk]

Except Islamic countries

[@yuriel6691]

​@@Sbeyonce-ur9zk that's the reason the world was always ruled by religion because religious people have kids and they inherit the world

[@babyboijeremy]

@@yuriel6691 Thats very interesting, i've watched a few documentaries and they all seem to point in the same direction. Once people become overly progressive and liberal they often focus only on themselves and forgo having children. Or they never find a partner because both sides hate each other. Basically these people will die out, the population will decline, we won't be able to pay pentions, more people will die. But then there will be a great reversal, mostly of very religous people.

[@koushikdas1992]

​@@yuriel6691Where are you from?

[@zackgravity7284]

The common denominator is industrialisation. Children went from profitable to unaffordable post agricultural economy

[@jacquie212]

If you want me to have children, then reward us. And not a few bucks here or there, but making parents (active, ones that take paternity leave while the partner works) a required/special employee. With preference given to parents. It is a widely acknowledged fact that are children not only expensive, but also negatively impact your career. I have lost a job because i only worked 50 hour weeks. Each child will cost 100s of k, with (when available) prohibitively expensive childcare, and (in the US) no guranteed leave. The birth rate is a direct result of modern society, and the unwritten norms and naturally occurring incentives (or disincentives). Modern life basically punishes the individuals for having children, yet bemoans how society needs children (at the macro level).

[@doujinflip]

Right, capitalism becomes self-defeating when it deems care for dependents as purely "personal" and a "net loss" to the firm.

[@starfox300]

Even if you wanted babies you wouldn't even have a man to have babies with

[@paperplane-db8qf]

Reward you for what? And how is being a parent a qualification for a job? Why should preferences be given on factors that aren’t job related. Because parents can’t work as much or need more time off, other employees who work harder should be screwed over. Leave is guaranteed for any decent job. Especially paternity leave. Schooling is free, most parents don’t even pay for university. US and the west on the whole is one of the cheapest places to raise a kid.

[@jacquie212]

@@paperplane-db8qf lol, right. Then we don't have kids and the current system collapses. Having kids is expensive and disruptive, with those that don't have kids usually having better career and personal finance outcomes. Who would want to go through that? I think you miss the point of my post. Cheapest place to raise a kid you say? Here is a quick breakdown of raising a kid on the west coast of the US. Daycare - from 6 months (assuming you can afford to take this off as there is no maternity leave here) through to kindergarten. $120k. After school care for at least elementary school. $23k. College for 4 years. $100k So best case, $250k. This does not include any other ancillary costs, or impact to career. A babysitter is now $20+ an hour here.

[@paperplane-db8qf]

@@jacquie212 in most other countries, the grandparents or nanny’s just help look after the kid. Daycare from 6 months for 120k, that’s completely on you for wasting money. You could literally hire a nurse to just babysit your child for multiple years with that money. The cost isn’t even remotely realistic. Average daycare cost is less than $300 a week, which is less than $15,000 a year < 75,000 for 5 years. Where in “best case” are you getting the extra $45k? Same thing for “after school care”. Like what the hell is that. And hardly any parents pay for College. So it’s definitely not the best case. Married couples with children have joined incomes and with lots of tax deductions. According to IRS data that’s almost $4900 a year till 13years with EITC.

[@NightshadeGoddess]

This is very focused on women, but the men in SK also do not want children anymore. It takes two to create life.

[@baha3alshamari152]

Actually it only takes women since 1 man can impregnate dozens of women in year while a woman can only get pregnant once a year even if she sleeps with hundreds of men

[@R.-.]

6:23 "Children in the rest of the developed world don't appear to be turning out so badly" ... that's false. Children of single parent families are statistically more likely to underachieve and be drawn into criminality. 9:28 "And then of course there is the issue of ... extremely expensive housing" = the real reason for low birth rates.

[@paulomilan515]

You don't read sarcasm well

[@QH96]

The prisons are also full of single parent individuals

[@Obscurai]

Yep, and abortion prohibitions will only increase single parent families.

[@rafabonacci4268]

“Children of single parent families are statistically more likely to underachieve and be drawn to criminality” ….that’s false the vast majority of Scandinavian and Western European countries in general have very low marriage rates. If what you say were true most Scandinavian countries would be failure but are some of the most successful countries and not going into extinction.

[@paulomilan515]

@@Obscurai yup and they are going to get abortions any way. People don't remember abortions became legal because women were dying in an unsanitary basement. People are going continue to get them they just don't be safe.

[@binaryseraph855]

They only have themselves to blame. You don't have to look too far than the type of unrealistic, overbearing, and ridiculous standards that their own media (kdrama, kpop, etc...) is pushing down the throats of their kids. Everything is all about excess, superficiality, and living beyond your means all for the sake of appearances. Everything in modern day Korean culture pushes the youth to be their best on the outside and how they are perceived by others. When that is the paramount agenda then who cares about making babies when its more important to put all your resources to look good and be accepted by society no matter the cost.

[@LTDLetsPlays]

there is a far better reason than whatever you are saying here Overworking constant work no life outside of work work work work and do you think people will give up their freedom they recently gained to just give away to kids?

[@divx1001]

​@@LTDLetsPlays you're both right. Such problems can never have a unique solution, they are multi faceted and require multi faceted solutions. Most governments in the world are not ready for that though.

[@Arcessitor]

@@LTDLetsPlays Children do not take your freedom, they offer you a legacy. Imagine being this narcissistic that you'd rather go to a bar than create new life.

[@crysed7897]

Superficial expectations of lavish possession as a way to have a "secure" lifestyle yet the never ending greed of having such keeps them raising their expectations that raising a children to the same level. So true.

[@SummaGirl1347]

This was pathetically one-sided. Something tells me the men of South Korea have something to do with the decline in marriage and birth rates but, let’s just put it all on women. Marriage and parenthood do not have high enough ROIs for either sex.

[@casualpasser-by5954]

For me personally the demographic crisis arising in the developed countries is a very interesting topic. It seems like at the moment no one country has learned how to deal with this challenge. Which can potentially result in the collapse of many countries. The statement that money are not enough to fix the problem is very true. I think, very important things are the infrastructure for childcare, child medicine as well as availability of education, etc. Also, more generally, the low level of competitiveness in society and better work-life balance are essential for enhancing fertility rate. And, as I think, ideology is important too, though in less extent than the other aspects mentioned. P. S. Thank for not mentioning immigration this time. It really isn't a solution at all.

[@dfcx1]

Availability of education is certainly an issue, the more of it you have the less kids you get.

[@Latinoamerica837]

Sadly Its Ideology the only possible solution, so that the leading role of most countries does not end. The practitioners of the Conservative right and religious Christians are in charge of taking over and making up for the lack of children of the liberals. But little time is counting, can all conservatives come to the point that this is the main path to take? because if the conservatives are aware of the solution, they are the ones who are going to do whatever it takes to change destiny, they are the only ones who take the risk. Ideology encompasses more than you think

[@Latinoamerica837]

I have seen a significant number of right-wing conservative families and religious Christians right now on KZbin who have 8 or 10 children.

[@Latinoamerica837]

Ideo logy the only possible solution, so that the leading role of most countries does not end. The practitioners of the Conserva tive right and religious Christians are in charge of taking over and making up for the lack of children of the liberals. But little time is counting, can all conservatives come to the point that this is the main path to take? because if the conservatives are aware of the solution, they are the ones who are going to do whatever it takes to change destiny, they are the only ones who take the risk. I have seen a significant number of conserva tive families and religious Christians right now on KZbin who have 8 or 10 children

[@davidford3115]

@@Latinoamerica837 Yeah, Partick J. Buchanan made a similar observation in his book "Suicide of a Superpower" which got him fired from MSNBC. He notices that orthodox and traditionalist families in Israel have 8-10 kids while the liberals rarely have 2 kids. That invariably means that in such a nation, the trend will be towards to politics that creates the most offspring. In Israel's case, that means the future belongs to Netanyahu's coalition.

[@cure-t5m]

Indeed marriage is a bad deal for women of South Korea. They have an education, can earn money and support themselves so no longer dependent on marriage to survive into old age. The expectation that women do all the child rearing and housework even in cases where they also work (statistics show that even in cases where women are the sole breadwinners, they still do more housework than their husband in the majority of cases), dealing with sexist attitudes and traditions within family(in laws), having your career end and give up financial independence, so many reasons women will not marry and have children in South Korea. Of course conservative attitudes is not the only reason for the falling birth rates but it is a pretty major reason. The government is adamant to ignore the sexism issue and throw more money into schemes like sponsoring mail order brides that will not do much in increasing population but do have the effect of announcing to women that they are very much living in a sexist society and their fears and worries about marriage very likely to come true.

[@jessicapark6424]

Korea is a country that doesn't take a lot of immigrants. Korean culture is one of most closed cultures to new immigrants. Getting korean citizenship or resident card is extremely difficult. Koreans have this strong one-race country mindset. So, whoever is not biologically Korean will have a hard time getting accepted as Korean even after they get citizenship. This include those who born in only one korean parent (and the other parent is non korean) For not married women, it is illegal to get pregnant by sperm donation, which I think is absolutely stupid law. At this point, the government has to take all options. Spending billions and billions of dollars in last 2 decades proved that the money doesn't solve the problem. Same sex marrige? What is that? Nothing else than "normal" families won't be socially accepted in Korea. The sad part is Korea was one of the contries that babies get adopted by foreign countries and still is.. hundred of thousands of babies get adopted in Europe or North American families in 60s, 70s, 80s, 90s, and still is. Most of these babies are born in ouside of "normarl married families" so they were abandoned. And people in korean doesn't really consider adopting a babies because again its not a "normal family form"

[@kokliangchew3609]

In the late 1970s, there was a very strong argument for countries to limit their birthrate, and China and Singapore placed caps on the number of children you could have. Of course there was also a strong emphasis on contraception. Against all of that was the Vatican City who argued that research showed that as countries became more wealthy, their birthrate would reduce accordingly. At that time, very few people, including myself bought the Vatican City arguments. However, the last 4 decades or so have proved the Vatican City to be correct. Countries such as China and Singapore have reversed their stance and trying to get their people to have more children.

[@freewheeler1728]

other way around - countries got wealthier BECAUSE the birthrate was dropped, don't u get it?? bozo

[@ukrs7359]

@@freewheeler1728 how exactly did countries got wealthier cuz of birthrate drop? Countries started getting rich when the kids from baby boom grew upto adults but now the next generation will be far less..

[@PeterRiello]

@@freewheeler1728 Nope, he was right. Dropping birthrate doesn't just cause the country to become wealthier, it's much more complicated than that.

[@xisigma]

Women don't want to be enslaved. Men don't want to be leeched off. One wont lead; the other wont follow. Everyone goes their own way.

[@0.0표범]

I honestly wouldn’t want to have anymore children. The cost of them are too much and would rather throw my uterus out just to avoid the thought. Because the fact that people thinks because I’m the woman I have to take on everything alone then treated poorly if you were to get divorced and be a single mom after a divorce.. 🙅🏽‍♀️ if you see how some people treat women who have children I can see why other women feel the same way.

[@edwardblair4096]

This video sounds very similar to the one you put out on the same topic in Japan. Some of the details are different, but the overall themes are the same. You didn't address whether South Korea is open to immigration of whole families vs. the bringing in of foreign brides to pair with local men. The problem with general immigration policies is that they risk breaking up unitary cultural norms. In the USA we take for granted that different people have different ideas on how they should live their lives. We are not always perfectly accepting of the differences, but we acknowledge they exist and officially proclaim them to be valid.

[@gijane2cantwaittoseeyou203]

It s time they grow up and learn to live with outsiders, otherwise they die anyway and foreiners will claim their empty lands.

[@speakupyt4900]

There are many developed countries with much smaller populations than Korea -with about 1/5 of Korea's population~🟢🟢 Singapore, Sweden, the Netherlands, Switzerland, etc ~Are they extinct? Moreover, many analysts believe that the ''inevitable Korean reunification'' will increase population to 70 to 80 Million in the future, so stop talking nonsense about low birth rate.

[@declanfeeney7004]

Japan is a much more unified and functional Nation/Society than South Korea.

[@crossmaster77]

@@gijane2cantwaittoseeyou203 lmao no, that fixes nothing. The Birth Rate is still low and foreigners still claim their lands anyway. At least without immigrants they can still enjoy their land with a bit longer

[@dhobbs1803]

I live here in Korea. I've heard friends ands professors talk about this problem a lot. You covered a lot of points I never hear brought. Next time, I'll have to steal some of the points you made so I can sound smart lol. There are two things that I would like to add to what was already covered in the video (specifically from the perspective of a guy: 1) People are getting married waaaaay later (if at all) in general. Very few of my friends or colleagues get/have gotten married in their 20s , and the biggest reason I hear for that is because of finances. A lot of financial burden is placed on the guy. You have to have a house, a car, a good job, etc. If the guy isn't confident in their financial situation, they tend to not get married. 2) I don't know if this affects the birthrate specifically, but as a foreigner here in Korea I can tell you that getting work visas from immigration is a PAIN. Immigration is very stingy with their visas and their are tons of restrictions on foreigners in general once you do get one. I see a lot of talented, able-bodied foreign nationals (guys who generally enjoy their lives here), just give up out of frustration and go back to their respective countries.

[@amadexi]

I don't think immigration is a good solution for birth rate. Even putting aside the difference in appearance and culture (except if you bring brides from neighboring countries like Vietnam which is popular for that). But most problem that our population face regarding children, will also affect immigrants. But it will be much worse for them because they are just immigrants, even if law change to help them (which I think is a bad idea), foreigners are often too different.

[@dhobbs1803]

@@amadexi It might not solve the birthrate problem, but it may definitely with the shortage of workers that will eventually come when Korea's aging population gets too old to work with no young people to replace them. Japan has made peace with this concept; I think soon it will be Korea's turn.

[@amadexi]

@@dhobbs1803 We do already import droves of workers from neighboring countries. Our job market is very unbalanced, we have hyper competition for white collar jobs but low skill labor jobs are completely deserted. It is due to the fact that there is a social stigma associated to labor jobs and that society incentivizes education. The problem is that we already import many immigrants to fill these jobs, mostly from vietnam and china. Which is great because they have similar culture and appeareance. But when it comes to more remote countries like Africa and Middle east, where technically there are immigrants willing to fill low skill labor jobs, ethno cultural differences are too high and it's not just for us, it's for them too, it's much easier for them to migrate to the west where not only the work-life balance is better, but also because it is easier to integrate (due to the already well established communities of their ethnic groups). So the west already captures most of the low skill immigrants on the planet. And the west is by far more attractive. And our governent is already tring to expand the support for immigrants for the sectors where we need them, like workers at the docks.

[@chrisdee7931]

@@amadexi right - it just causes decades of suffering. Rarely a good choice

[@charlie_56]

In Uzbekistan, which the video mentioned as "most expensive bride country for Korean bride services (haha)", we have a much lower income compared to South Korea but less to no problems like low birth rates, or like a poor behaviour towards women who took a year off to be a housewife. Instead, we have this national identity of "child-loving nation", or "bolajon xalq" in Uzbek

[@LuminousKugelblitz]

Hello, if these kind of bride selling to other nations is normalised in your country, I'm sorry to say that your country has some problem. Women are not commodities.

[@charlie_56]

@Luminous Kugelblitz yes women are not commodities, but it is not us "selling them"? and it is not normalised at all. Those women or girls were just surfing on a so-called Korean wave and better economic conditions were an extra incentive for most of them to go willingly to marry Koreans. Plus it is actually a tiny number which just disappears in the overall population, so I wouldn't rush to normalise that. And, some of them just return because of cultural differences and even worse life they got to get

[@LuminousKugelblitz]

@@charlie_56 oh my bad, I thought it was very generalised

[@pratikgore6536]

Uzbekistan TFR was 2.7 for 2023. Will soon approach replacement by 2035

[@kenbistro7358]

I lived and worked in South Korea for a few months, you rarely see kids/teenagers walking about, even in Seoul.

[@heekyungkim8147]

Don’t be so dramatic… not true… i see plenty of kids around my neighborhood.

[@kenbistro7358]

@@heekyungkim8147 i might be in North Korea then.

[@Kensuke22]

​@@heekyungkim8147 I'm in the Philippines and I can barely see anybody past 6pm...

[@FloridaTrini]

Hopefully more women globally follow suit.

[@heartikn]

I think Korean men has also made women feel very unsafe and unprotected that they would rather not interact with them at all

[@ottomusprime5028]

What a time we live in when we actually encourage childbirth out of wedlock nowadays

[@lolavonwrinkle1617]

Wedlock is just a made up thing, what does it matter

[@SirConto]

Should also be noted: South koreans work on average, 46.8 hours per week - the most of any developed country. And that being the average, it's not unusual for some companies to keep their workers there 60h+ per week. Must be quite hard to find time for dating with that, much less for raising children properly.

[@helloworld-ti5zs]

Why don't you fight against that? I can't understand. Like office slaves. Europeans fight. ❤ Especially French people.

[@MyName123.]

a non-Korean MALE speaking about a Korean FEMALE issue. Really bro?? 😒

[@almaderoble]

I don't think incentivicing aceptance to single mothers and divorce is part of the solution. Instead I think they should address the constant overworking and internet addictions (corn, social media).

[@hainleysimpson1507]

The best option would be for South Korea to ease up on work. Single motherhood is a horrible idea for everyone involved just look at the USA, Jamaica and any other country or region with a lot of single mothers. Crime rates and mental illness drastically increase.

[@EdithEsquivel]

In Brazil they lowered the birth rate by sponsoring soap operas where the protagonists had only one child. I don't see why they couldn't do something similar. Their kdramas usually end when the couples are together, never following them to the reproductive stage. I believe in the force of storytelling

[@seseth9971]

As a Korean woman who elected to remain single, I agree with what you have said 100%. I would rather choose freedom over family burden. There's almost no joy in reducing my social status by getting married and raising kids in this male-oriented society. Women's role is usually under-appreciated and as the video has shown, regarded as easily replaceable by foreign mail-order brides. I don't want Koreans to go extinct nor I hate all Korean men (my dad's one of them) but I just wish that gender equality rises before it gets too late and politicians start to embrace female side of the narratives. ( Politics and courts are still all male-dominated unfortunately. The future is bleak.) Plus, I'm amazed by your insight and resources..Good for you.

[@michaeljoseph3475]

Most modern women just want equality of outcomes. Ill take feminism seriously when women start choosing construction work, plumbing, participate in military... you know...REAL equality.

[@edwardsedwards796]

Gender equality? Are you saying you want to do military service?

[@seseth9971]

@@edwardsedwards796 18~21 month military service to free myself from life-long obligations ? to gain equal footings with a husband in household matters for the rest of my life and no subservient roles demanded when dealing with inlaws? Of course. Yes. Work-wise I don't have much trouble currently. (By the way, I'm in construction biz) I'm quite comfortable with this independent peace but sometimes I wonder what it would've been like if I had kids. I could've been ok mom. Anyways, male group mentality projecting deep rooted hatred towards females in South Korea, even shown trailing after my short honest comment, is one of the problems that concern me and is a major missed point in the video. I never said just any male or female should be paid equally. I'm one of the biggest advocates of meritocratic society. I can even accept male domination/leadership in work place if it means responsibilities and goal-orientedness. However it should not hinder any one of either gender from developing her/his full potential vocationally or reaching any level of leadership.

[@edwardsedwards796]

@@seseth9971 You think that military service frees men from lifelong obligations? You are wrong. You wrote: "male group mentality projecting deep rooted hatred towards females in south Korea", so you are the thing you are complaining about, because you are generalising putting almost all of the men together in this comment. You even write in your first comment that you do not hate all men. Are people to understand that you hate all men but there are exceptions? You are in construction business, so you are working everyday on the construction site doing manual work? That would be amazing.

[@damirmujkic3270]

​@Booty Eater 456 they not . ALLAH made men and women different not equal. Whoever think that is a I d I o t

[@kimkunhee]

The current lowest birth rate is not the bottom. Until now, it has been an economic problem, but in the future, it is highly likely that it will become even lower due to the wariness and dislike of each other among the younger generations

[@clonosfreid6658]

It's sad that there's societal wars between men and women now. Looking at older generations, yeah, they used to fight, but atleast they were a team. Kinda sucks now.

[@sunddundee352]

This is just an outsiders opinion/view of this situation. What I see here is the women of South Korea doing a very good job of exerting their power. They want change in their society and this is how they have chosen to try and get that change. Obviously the only problem with that is that the South Korean society and the government are choosing to ignore the elephant in the room. Instead they are trying all of these other ways to fix the problem because they don't want to change anything. Clearly the powers that be are even willing to let the South Korean society die out so that they don't have to make any changes.

[@enid9911]

Raising a child is boring. I rather have the money for myself.

[@03e-210a]

The simplest and most logical rationale, but little do we know that this will be the downfall of us.

[@enid9911]

@@03e-210a It's ok. Ai robots will replace us all in a few centuries.

[@how-to-live-right]

Everybody is saying that rich nations have money to have children, so it's not money that is a problem. But what they fail to understand is that not money is counted, but opportunity cost. If I'm poor and my country doesn't have pension, I have nothing to lose if i have children, they can support me when I'm old. But if I'm urban living women with education and career prospectives having children will put me far behind in this life according to my potential.

[@cttommy73]

There are many factors to the population decline and it's the same for pretty much every developed country. Increase cost of living, more people need to work and work longer, less time to socialize and form relationships, women wanting to focus on careers and by the time they are ready or want to have children, men either choose the younger women or just opt out of marriage and dating so they don't lose their lives and be trapped in something not that beneficial to them. It keeps going and add on increasing amount of problems, perfect recipe for decline.

[@luongvuong3312]

Vietnam is one of the "go-to" places for Korean men when it comes to the bride-buying practice. And believe it or not, a lot of these Vietnamese women are victims of domestic abuse :)

[@MistahFuzzBunny]

the real question people should ask what are the people going to do about the companies that reinforces the modern day culture in the name of short term gains

[@indrinita]

Why would you bring more children into the world willingly when you know life is just hell? As long as women’s main purpose to exist is to serve men, birth rates will fortunately continue to go down.

[@economieliberale5189]

South Korea is the perfect example of a country that has liberalized economically without liberalizing its mentality, the result is a huge contradiction between what they "expect from life", and what is achievable in an urbanized, interconnected and modern society. We can no longer promote patriarchal, rigid, religious or theocratic models and live in a modern state at the same time, we have to choose.(The cow or the car, the farm or the skyscrapers). The fact that single women and young pregnant students are considered plague victims is absolutely outrageous. Just like the refusal to legally recognize the existence of same-sex couples. how many south korean homosexual couples leave korea for canada and usa where they have access to legal recognition but also to fertility care (ivf, surrogacy). By refusing modernity, they will die. And that's so unfortunate, because Korea is a nation that has beautiful elements in its culture but can also teach us some work ethics and technological innovations.

[@06250chris]

If modernity equals praising single moms and people who think they're another sex than they are, I'll stay in the middle ages thanks!

[@IMZ44]

Its crazy that S.Korea, China, and Japan has some of the lowest birth rates in the world.

[@Latinoamerica837]

All Europe too, that its full of Old-green-people as result of this

[@francisquebachmann7375]

High Cost of Living, Most jobs are concentrated to a few cities which raises the cost of rent in those said cities. A faster and cheaper transportation that can get you from Far away province to City will reduce the rent prices which is only one of the high cost of living.

[@googleAlphabet-t9y]

I don't know why they only talk about women's perspectives. I have no desire to marry a woman who has the highest average childbirth and marriage age in OECD countries. In a country where all men undergo a physical examination at the age of 20 due to forced conscription, I do not want to have sex freely in a country where women have a higher diagnosis rate for various sexually transmitted diseases, including syphilis, than men. I also don't want to get into a marriage like the OECD's fairly low dual-income ratio and low homogeneous marriage.

[@UncleSev]

We live in a more picky and selfish world. But also, the stressful long working hours and often not that great salary doesn't help either. Lack of support for couples with kids also scares many women away from motherhood. Not only in SK. Arranged married (non forced) can fix some of the issues. But the other problems are still not solved.

[@jhodowany]

There is probably a limit to what governments can do to encourage healthy demographics, but to the extent that there are policy solutions, one radical idea would simply be to broadly survey the population, especially young women, on ways the government can help support a personal decision to start a family. And---here is the kicker---actually listen to them, regardless of pre survey, religious, cultural or normative biases.

[@Bootyeater999]

No countries started listening to women 50 years ago and here we are now 🤷‍♂️!

[@how-to-live-right]

they will say they have no money, but what they mean they don't want to be left behind in society. Children are irrational financial decisions even with all incentives.

[@Maybe-cg2tn]

I don't think there is a way for the government to get women to have children. It's just not in a woman's best interest most the time to have a child.

[@zackgravity7284]

Return to small family based agriculture would be a huge way to reverse the decline

[@debbie1724cham]

My guess would be to revamp the house rental system and house purchase scheme. I am living and working here in South Korea for almost two years now and several Korean friends and acquantance complain about the high cost of housing. In many countries, housinh cost is ALWAYS the #1 factor why people live life normally. I think if President Yoon could do a "miracle" during his term for his citizens, it might boost the marriages and the childbirth. In the past decades, housing seemed not improving or if it is, it does not totaly help the single people build a family. Korea is already a rich government, why can they change the housing scheme and made a reform to consider the benefits that it would give to his citizens. **please change the housing schemes so that Koreans would be able to afford it. In the Philippines, many Filipinos have their own house and lot or great condominium unit because of a cheap housing mortgage. Many can afford buying a new home even if we don't go abroad.

[@hazelnut3794]

In conclusion, more than 20 years after the start of the 21st century, already Korea's greatest era are passing by so far, on the other hand, there are too many burdens for young men to bear, and there are many tasks to go through in various fields and complain of a lot of stress. That will be one of the main reasons why the suicide rate among young people and the poverty elderly in Korea has been particularly high compared to other age groups over the years. It's not just a problem with even the country's birth rate, it's actually a mis-buttoned country from birth and has become a sick country in many aspects of society since the IMF financial crisis in the late 90s.

[@alechorn1109]

Immigration was never discussed. Does S Korea have encouraging policies?

[@ash8672]

Lmfao are you kidding? They are xenophobic af

[@Crest28]

Plummeting birthrate is a side effect of south Koreas obsession with perfection and believing hyper competition is just a reality they should accept.

[@crystalross7943]

If South Korea didn't expect women to chose between her hard earned career or being an indentured servant to her husband's family to raise kids. There would be more kids.

[@Itried20takennames]

South Korean Gov: We coddle and protect CP and SA criminals, while treating SA and CP victims horriblly (see the Nth room and “GodGod” cases). Why aren’t young people making more kids to feed into and be abused by the Korean CP system?

[@AmeLia-ch5si]

I would say that it comes down to these factors: 1. sheer population density and a lack of space... Korea’s urban environments are simply too crowded and housing is expensive, making raising a child seem unattractive and/or impossible. Also almost everyone lives in an apartment complex. 2. many adults in their twenties, thirties and beyond continue to live with their parents, and do not become financially independent… 3. Korean society is (in my opinion) heavily patriarchal and misogynistic… thus women are still considered and treated as inferior to men, saddled with housework/child rearing, and not given the rights they deserve (compared with other developed countries). 4. a hypercompetitive culture of achievement… the obsession with education, getting a good job, becoming financially stable, all before getting married and having children… all of this creates a stranglehold on many young people who feel they cannot ‘adult’ unless they first meet certain ‘prerequisites’ and ‘tick every box’. 5. Korean society needs to be more open-minded re: biracial/multiracial families.

[@kalvin1123]

The government should make it easier for ethnic Korean Diaspora to move there. Right now, there are ethnic Korean Ukrainians moving there because of the war.

[@Hilariusgamer]

they should make it also easier for anybody who has some education and basic knowledge of korean. Countries like Japan and Korea are too closed for the future but many people like their languages and culture

[@kalvin1123]

@@Hilariusgamer No, it's very difficult to do that. There are people that refuse to integrate. At least with ethnic Koreans, the following generation can and feel comfortable blending in with the culture. But there are some that absolutely won't. Recently, there have been people from the Middle East who've demanding refugee status and all the benefits. The government has been refusing and the ME people are getting furious. They want everybody else to adjust to their way of life. So, Koreans have been protesting saying they don't want to become like Europe.

[@davidford3115]

Right now, the ONLY way one can become a Korean citizen is if they are ethnically Korean. That kind of discourages any immigration. They should at least allow a foreigner who marries or is married a Korean national to have a path to citizenship. Fast track it if the marriage produces mixed children.

[@Sol-ps8ox]

​@@kalvin1123That problem is only with ME radicals...especially muslims Rest of the world is very much assimilating to other cultures.

[@koushikdas1992]

​@@Sol-ps8oxSo what will you do about muslim immigrants!?

[@reuvensg]

life is empty without kids.. but living is just too expensive for having them.

[@robertm.8653]

Maybe support the women more?

[@muajin]

Well there were a lot of babies that were thrown away as garbage or discarded by women that didn't want them. This went on for awhile. I find it pretty sad that many babies were abandoned yet now says running out of children.

[@aaat4873]

From selling their children to no children to sell! How ironic!

[@zawiszaczarny7876]

This constant rambling about extinction becouse of the falling populations in developed countries is so annoying and ridicilous, nobody talks about the technological and mechanical lightyear jump we made in last 50 years that made large population hard to maintain, but the real the problem is not the population but overpumped market based system that is not restricted and it does not share with the hard working population and it that drags everyone in as slaves to pump on more production and artificial consumptionism of goods to the point of ridicilous (buy a new version of the same phone every year or two) and that what needs to change. Countries do not exist to be a workhorse breeding ground for 5% of wealthy multi billonare conglomerates like Amazon... The main problem is the circle of error this system has created, we can either work our asses to old age with as little children as possible to buy unnececery things, or start demanding more from the 5% elite that has the 90% of world's wealth. We could all live better life with more children, but noooo Greed, materialism and aggresive consumptionism is killing us like a cancer....

[@davidford3115]

Yeah, the hysterical and hyperbolic statements about "extinction" is over the top to the point of farcical. The population will decrease to an equilibrium point. Either the system will implode FORCING people to have more children, or the pressures discouraging people having children will self-correct.

[@cawheeler27]

People in prior generations had to deal with far worse and they had lots of kids.

[@zawiszaczarny7876]

@@cawheeler27 They had way more time for kids than nowdays generations do and they werent a part of aggresive production and consumption market where the state tells you to work longer every few years. Rising children has become part of the market as well rising the costs astronomicly.

[@CordeliaWagner]

Motherhood is domestic slavery. More and more women want more for their life than providing unpaid services.