How to beat Sonic Spin Dash | Deal With It

In this second episode of Deal With It, we will address probably THE strongest midrange tool in Smash Ultimate, Sonic Spin Dash. If you have ever fought sonic, you definitely know that this move requires a strategy to beat. Subscribe for more videos like this, and let me know your thoughts!
For the Extended Deal With It featuring a more in-depth look at dealing with Bayonetta (more coming soon) check out my Patreon here: / andrewt658
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[@kthulu6747]

Moves like Steve blocks is something alot of people would love to see

[@bruno_diaz-39]

Agreed! Maybe a whole "How to Deal with __" series? 👀

[@justindarling9601]

actually very useful, (i will still get hit by every spindash)

[@haplow2394]

something to note, if the sonic initiates a spin dash or charge when they don’t have double jump, they do not get their double jump back until they touch the ground AND are not in ball form. a common tactic i’ve seen sonix use is spin dash in the corner, cancel with a double jump, then begin charging a second spin dash in the air, which makes where he’ll be very hard to pin down as the second spin dash stops all of his horizontal momentum, allowing him to whiff punish people trying to hit his first spin dash out of the corner. however, when he does this, he’s without a double jump for a long time, but most players probably don’t realize this since when he touches the ground in spin dash they likely believe he gets his double jump back. he generally doesn’t get his double jump back until he crosses the entire stage and lands on the ps2 plat on the other side of the stage.

[@cocoapuff5853]

I think i need to see this. So whenever he doubke jumps into the spin dash he doesnt get his double jump back even when he touches the ground?

[@majinblussb]

@@cocoapuff5853 Until he returns from his ball form, no. Be careful tho, when you land with a no DJ spin dash, the player can hold jump to do a small bounce with a hitbox, so use disjointed attacks.

[@DarkThomy]

Very interesting. Just forgot to mention if you dash attack into a released spin dash, it will always (?) Clank. Which is rather nice since you either beat it before, or clank it if you're a bit late

[@gianz2066]

But I thought it had I frames?

[@DiazoContent]

@gianz2066 I Frames at the start don't matter on fully charged side special, it's way more prone to cranks. It's the uncharged version that will likely beat the dash attack

[@Goljee]

@@gianz2066 i frames don't affect clanking

[@ColorWheelHero]

Here's a fun fact: Spin Dash, Spin Charge, and Homing Attack can be grabbed armored through. As Ganon, I can Flame Choke the Spin moves (with some timing), and I'll try to use Up-B on Homing attack (again with timing). Maybe not always reliable, but an option where I can tank damage and win the interaction is still great! Great video, btw!

[@oknerd7431]

U say that wen sonic can mix up his spindash and ganons side b and up b are rly slow compared to his spin moves. Atp its more of a rly hard read that wont be consistent to get

[@ColorWheelHero]

@@oknerd7431 yea, true. But it's still pretty funny that I can tank his ball moves at all (I know I'm not the only character, any grab will tank the ball, but timing is hard).

[@LukeDurhbehny]

sonic players shaking in their boots

[@heraldofv3379]

I am😔

[@geekmac9349]

They don‘t cause the risk reward is still insanely in their favor no matter what you do

[@Paradox_Of_Crota]

Not really, I can just do other options.

[@audreyrobert90]

@@Paradox_Of_Crota-🤓

[@janswhatsupdoc]

@@Paradox_Of_Crotano surprises you’re carried

[@wildmonkeycar]

THIS is how you do it! Instead of complaining about it on Twitter, you do your research and learn to beat it! Thank you for making this, and helping out those of us who aren't as good at researching this game

[@MD-se8ft]

Finally someone not complaining and actually trying to help people improve.

[@CipherKnighto]

As a Roy main I like how double edge dance can just beat it out also

[@DizRuption]

As a Sonic main can confirm this is effective but here’s a few notes. Hope it helps. 1. Sonic has Excellent landing options from springing off screen into dair for momentum, and he will usually air dodge or back air depending on position. Charge an attack to prompt an airdodge and try and get to him in advantage. 2. On shield landing up air can pressure into grab if unexpected, if you see landing up air be ready to take frame advantage 3. Challenge Sonic off stage in spin dash OR spin charge, it isn’t a hard tool to stop with a disjoint and forces the Sonic to burn jump or forces them to spin shot off stage leaving them hitbox less and vulnerable

[@vtrinh1574]

Sonic, zss, and bayo. Ur literally perfect

[@Flip-a-dip-dip]

Me as a Krool main: great now I can win 2% of the time instead of just 1%

[@SussyBaka_irl]

A great video, this coming from a Sonic player. I wanna add something though. Everything you've mentioned for counterplay is simply mix ups towards pursuing advantage state, cause Sonic's spin mix ups are simoly determined by their players own utility of his specials. With that in mind, forcing clanks on spins is very useful, due to Spin Charge ALWAYS being negatively disjointed & as for Spin Dash, the fully charged variant becomes a disjoint that i-frames don't completely cover & seeing as invulnerable moves process attacks transcending them (only invincible moves like Palu Dash Attack phase completely through attacks), the opponent is almost always going to have priority, for as long as they collide an active hitbox with Sonic. Players historically like Light, Maister & Sparg0 have used this mix up tactic against Sonix, especially when he's charging in the corner, because the mix up forces Sonic to sometimes not remain stationary, charging Spin Specials. Hope this mix up can help some & again great video dude.

[@sunnycideup4725]

OH THIS IS GONNA BE A GREAT SERIES

[@StrawhatFan42]

Just picked up Sonic , now I know what to look out for 👁️👄👁️

[@heyitsmort7744]

I’d love to learn how to deal with min-min’s grounded punches.

[@Werwa_]

Hell yeah, love to see it! Thank you for putting all this information into one place thats easy for people to come back and refer to. Based on the sheer amount of information I feel like I'll have to be coming back to rewatch this a few times if I want to remember it all, lol

[@bobdude273]

great series, subbed. Want to see more of this

[@LPMasterRob]

Great video! Please make more of these

[@jannomeeuwessen4886]

Is it weird that I actually like fighting Sonic? It's like trying to solve a puzzle or riddle, and it feels so regarding to win.

[@strikerali2160]

I try to tell my friends all the time that if Sonic spin dashes you have to punish their options after the move more than the move itself. Everything you pointed out was great especially the segment about positioning yourself at ledge. As a DK main I often do this and if they homing attack, it often trades with my up smash or loses if they decide to charge it. (Other characters can up smash homing attack too btw) or if they jump away I can shark with an up air on their way back or hit them with a bair. If they go low, like you said. Time to capitalize on them being in disadvantage.

[@hectorneros7171]

Finally someone gets it If sonic decides to camp you out with spindash but has no lead the best thing to do is go to ledge and stall I'm a sora main and this strategy is imo sora's only method to contest sonic At the ledge you can fire off spells,react to spindash and counter,you can even call it out and beat it with side b,then wait until you can get sonic at a ledge and ledge trap him

[@Goljee]

Wait a second, pac-man corner camping sonic would be so broken

[@FallingandRelaxing]

Yes that's why Sonix lost to DeeDee a couple months back lol

[@untitled_unmastered]

Hey man, I’m loving this serie of “deal with it” I’m definitely subscribing for it. I’d love to see a video about Ken’s shoryuken (like avoiding set ups, di for reverse shoryuken, etc) and how to deal with byleth’s nair

[@cocoapuff5853]

This helps a ton!! Thxs

[@briannaremias8491]

finally i can stop dying to these interactions thank you!!

[@pbz7572]

Insanely good series that I hope you keep doing. Since you’ve started a move series on the top 5 (Bayo & Sonic), I would love to see how you’d try to deal with *snake* (grenade, down/up tilt, DA), *GnW* (Nair, down/up smash, fair), & *Steve* (uptilt, AC bair, anvil, minecart)

[@johnasamoah8668]

Thank you for the video, the frustration with this charecter comes from how much you have to understand about those 2 moves to be able to fight it back. The thing with sonic is that if you want to actually play the game against him, you have to stop playing the game and hard core study the properties of that move. I remember how annoyed I was trying to understand the difference between spin dash and spin charge on the Wikipedia as well as figuring out how and what he is able to do out of spin dash / spin charge.

[@scubadoo3]

This is such a good resource and helped a scrub like me think about the game differently. Criminally under viewed.

[@lazylenni1017]

I never quite understood how Sonic's moves really work. Thanks for the help!

[@ikan2192]

huge fan of ur content! keep going :)

[@Mykahaia]

When I play Ganon is like this but with every gimmicky character...I get punished for empty hopping...

[@RyanMay-uo9fz]

I play Puff, I just rest it every time

[@Dakpo]

Thanks for the content!

[@andrewt8166]

Thank YOU for the idea

[@Metabolica1]

All of this is good information, but for lower level players that want an easy place to start, spin dash is pretty bad at trading with very active moves. Using big moves to cut him off mid spin dash is also very effective. One reason people consider Corrin to be a great match up vs Sonic, is cause her nair does both at once. You can out of shield him with nair, and it covers most of his follow up options after spin dash connects. Or, you can throw it out right as he's about to let go, to let the active disjoint cut his spin dash off. This is one of the better tools for this, but sex-kick nairs can also be really good, and a lot of characters have those. Just in general, try and diagnose your characters most active move and try using it to trade out, or out of shield spin dash. Have your conversions ready off whatever you use too. The bigger a lead you can get against Sonic, the riskier and more punishable he'll usually end up playing, and it'll hopefully start a snowball effect against him. Great video!

[@pigboi666]

Watching this as a sonic player

[@JonnyJayKhan]

Big fan of this video existing

[@roobi2101]

banger vid. a vid on sora nair maybe ?

[@Austin-qd7ys]

Nice vid

[@M1dori_]

Something that is pretty character specific but still works is that when your playing as inkling against sonic, when the sonic spindashes and stays grounded you can counter the spindash with roller if you can tell that they aren't going to try and jump over it, what I've experienced is that sonic players don't expect roller on their spindash the first couple of times.

[@CoVa923]

I'm pretty sure fully charged spin dash either beats roller or just clashes with it, ik the hope for sure beats it because it jumps over the hit box of roller and hits inkling directly. Spin charge is the one that loses to roller in which case they just won't use it

[@M1dori_]

@@CoVa923 ive canceled out and buried sonic spin dash with roller several times

[@CoVa923]

@M1dori_ yeah if it's past the point of i frames or not fully charged sure but if it is fully charged or they let it go as the i frames start than nah, I've countered many rollers with spin dash lol. Like i said before tho spin charge does lose to it

[@massilyar341]

This guide is a great in depth explanation on how to beat spindash, but what you gonna do if we don’t use spindash 😎

[@danieloconnor1821]

Wiifit header is such a pain to deal with - on stage setups or as a ledge option I always feel so lost

[@jackattackhissnack]

I can help with that one. If she's offstage, just go above her and hit her AFTER she does the header. A trade will result in getting spiked. On stage, just shield ball and look out for a follow up. It does very little shield damage and then she can't use it again for a few seconds. On ledge, she gets to do it for free so just don't get baited.

[@Avatarbutters]

Just have good reaction time. Ez

[@caoinhnamkhanh2795]

small thing to add, if you can sdi well, react to BEING hit by grounded spindash in and down to get a tech situation while hes still doing the move

[@rosestrohm7986]

Steve Minecart or Krool Crown would be great

[@Catohat52]

Me a Sonic player watching this to learn how to be a better Sonic player

[@sethdavis3046]

Knowing how your opponent can deal with your tools helps you develop your own counterplay

[@Catohat52]

@@sethdavis3046 yeah

[@xaviahan]

Little Mac Here!! Forward Smash.

[@unidentified4122]

Really interesting video, I dunno if I'm crazy though but it feels like the audio and video are slightly out of sync

[@ThecoolDecent]

Teach people to go around sora Firaga because I want a better challenge.

[@CopyNPasteComments]

Sora side B. I’m convinced it cannot be dealt with online

[@lucash2245]

shield

[@plabcentral630]

If you can parry then your gold

[@jhamandrogrisk7724]

Lol

[@jfrogfoot]

please bayonetta, specifically that move that hits from the ground in neutral and prevents you from jumping. idk what it’s called i think it’s her side b??

[@Snagger__11]

Analyzing the unquie ways top players deal with spin dash like putting themselves in the corner is VERY insightful and could be a main focus going forwards! Pika t jolt next? 😏 Could also do minecart or jiro! (Jiro at ledge is a monster) 👿

[@aricting4252]

Monkey Flip and Banana?

[@BatzyTL]

Andrew! Can you talk about Samus chargeshot next?

[@itsEyrie]

Vouch

[@JonnyJayKhan]

Do Snake next

[@Legogreens]

Htg i implemented this, went over 50% win odds BUT still not fun to play vs sonic. Experienced same thing against steve minecart, can beat it but no having fun. I think ill just wait for next game and hope its worth my time/ $

[@massilyar341]

Make a video on how to deal with ice climber grab

[@itstoby289]

this series is fire, you should do ROB's kit (cause its all BS)

[@alejandrobreceda8509]

this made me hate ultimate less :) thx king

[@albertthepeacock8020]

I just use projectiles to camp them out

[@user-lb9yx1vh9z]

HOW do you beat large lingering hit boxes? (Link or Mario nair) just shield and try to punish the frames of landing??

[@loxcess]

please do one for against steve

[@cocoapuff5853]

If u can , this one is a little bit more specific, Can you teach or show how to deal with constant paisy pressure. I dont know there weak points in it. Ie When paisys do fair/bair/nair on shield and float dropping to do it again.

[@MorrowMoon_thenightwing]

Charge shot, or Min mins arms, would be helpful videos

[@ignazioacerenza9881]

How to deal with Mr. Game and Watch up b + down air loop.

[@pbank_]

Gas vid zss king

[@Ricky_019]

I would like a video about Fox's up smash. For me is one of the most broken moves in the game.

[@oscarcalles4117]

Not specifically a move but a situation. I use right trigger to grab instead of shield. Why do I sometimes get natural A attack when using grab button in some situations?

[@andrewt8166]

The “grab” button is a macro for shield + A (or whatever your attack button is) so if there’s a spot where there’s a lockout for shield then it’ll do the attack. For example if you did a turn around during your dash while grabbing it could give you ftilt

[@postboy2242]

Because this input system is designed like crap

[@morganbruno3252]

Deal with it suggestion: Rob nair/dtilt

[@math1410]

PLEASE DO BYLETH NAIR!!!!

[@Tiquono]

How to beat Link nair

[@Justinbyleth]

What If You Play Byleth

[@Justinbyleth]

Lmao jk great video dude

[@TwinHacari]

Why doc doesnt lose this mu (even) nair + da.

[@sham_noway]

thank god i have charge shot and not care about that rodent

[@DrDavidRojas]

Bayoneta pls

[@itsEyrie]

His last video was about bayonetta!

[@lloydaran]

I watched the whole video and I still don't get how to precisely differentiate between Dash and Charge and what to do against the latter, since you almost always say "if they spinDASH your shield"

[@andrewt8166]

It’s more about the interaction of if either one hits your shield and knowing what he can do out of it. There are small differences like if it hits shield but knowing the general idea of where to position and how it’ll work after shielding it

[@lloydaran]

@@andrewt8166 I'm sorry but this confused me even more... The burst range thing is quite intuitive, but once he actually hits my shield, I'm still as lost as before

[@majinblussb]

Nice video, but you never really discussed in depth the different ways Sonic can cancel his spin dash before commiting to any interaction and thus escaping whatever options or strategies that you have. So here's some advice from me, a Sonic Main(btw check my channel out, pls). If you notice that a Sonic is going to cancel their spin dash with an airdodge down or is in the corner, projectile characters can take advantage of that by using their, well, projectiles. They can pressure Sonic for free due to range, so using projectiles to cover the ground and then aerials to cover his jumps would be beneficial. However, the best way to do that is to also be within burst range, so you need to react accordingy. As for other characters, during the window in which you would guess a Sonic would cancel spin dash, you could either(again you must be in burst range to do so): properly space a safe aerial or just outright attack(this is excellent with characters with high priority attacks like terry) grab Anything a Sonic does related to spin dash can be very laggy except when hitting shield; it's just hard because frame data doesn't matter as much for Sonic's spins as other characters, so making sure that you learn how to punish Sonic after he committed or not commited to a spin is really important. Last thing is learning how to punish spin dash is only half the game. You also need to learn how to deal with spinless approaches, though depending on the player, it might be easier or harder. Regardless of how much a Sonic spins, a Sonic that can play neutral without spin(like Sonix) may be very difficult to deal with, so watch out. That's all I have basically.

[@StardustOwO]

Sheild, jump, anti SPINDASH, parry… guys there’s so much ways you can avoid this shit move.

[@janswhatsupdoc]

Spin dash should’ve nerfed day one, it makes minecraft power rails look balanced There’s still no guarantee you’ll 100% be able to deal with this move it’s waaaaay to rewarding and has zero thought process

[@itsEyrie]

Hot vid by a hot man

[@Andy23497]

god sonic is so lame