How to Embrace Slow Productivity, Achieve Mastery, and Defend Your Time - Cal Newport & Tim Ferriss

Cal Newport is a professor of computer science at Georgetown University, where he is also a founding member of the Center for Digital Ethics. His books have sold millions of copies and been translated into over forty languages. He is also a contributor to The New Yorker and hosts the popular Deep Questions podcast. His new book is Slow Productivity: The Lost Art of Accomplishment Without Burnout: www.amazon.com/Slow-Productiv...
Everything discussed in this interview: tim.blog/2024/02/21/cal-newpo...
Subscribe to Cal's KZbin channel:
@CalNewportMedia
Cal Newport's official website:
calnewport.com/
Please enjoy!
This episode is brought to you by:
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Eight Sleep’s Pod Cover sleeping solution for dynamic cooling and heating: eightsleep.com/Tim (save $200 on the Pod Cover by Eight Sleep this winter)
Momentous high-quality supplements: livemomentous.com/tim (code TIM for 20% off)
[00:00] Preview
[01:13] Unforced Errors: The Internet Story.
[04:47] Techno-selectionism.
[13:54] Why KZbin and podcasts aren't ideal bedfellows.
[19:24] Amish technology and Steve Martin.
[25:02] What prompted Cal to write Slow Productivity?
[28:48] Becoming a better writer through blogging.
[37:47] The benefits of obsessing over quality.
[42:12] How did Cal decide to identify himself as a writer?
[49:54] People who exemplify slow productivity.
[57:13] Trade-offs on the path to twenty-first-century slow productivity.
[1:02:00] Push systems vs. pull systems.
[1:03:23] Quota systems.
[1:05:06] Why slow productivity isn't a zero-sum game.
[1:08:40] Language that clarifies.
[1:12:42] Sender filters.
[1:16:11] What people might miss about Slow Productivity's message.
[1:21:34] How Cal defines productivity.
[1:26:01] Derek Sivers and money as a neutral indicator of value.
[1:29:07] Contemporary slow productivity champions.
[1:33:44] Asynchronous vs. real-time conversations.
[1:37:13] Making group scheduling less hellish.
[1:41:49] Cal's problem with Frederick Winslow Taylor.
[1:43:30] How The New Yorker maintains its old-timey charm where other publications fail.
[1:51:26] Cal's dream publications.
[1:53:31] Mental models for cultivating a slow productivity mindset.
[1:59:51] The consequences of playing the algorithm game.
[2:07:30] The renewed viability of newsletters.
[2:12:04] Parting thoughts.
Tim Ferriss is one of Fast Company’s “Most Innovative Business People” and an early-stage tech investor/advisor in Uber, Facebook, Twitter, Shopify, Duolingo, Alibaba, and 50+ other companies. He is also the author of five #1 New York Times and Wall Street Journal bestsellers: The 4-Hour Workweek, The 4-Hour Body, The 4-Hour Chef, Tools of Titans and Tribe of Mentors. The Observer and other media have named him “the Oprah of audio” due to the influence of his podcast, The Tim Ferriss Show, which has exceeded 900 million downloads and been selected for “Best of Apple Podcasts” three years running.
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[@timferriss]

This episode is brought to you by: AG1 all-in-one nutritional supplement: drinkag1.com/tim (1-year supply of Vitamin D (and 5 free AG1 travel packs) with your first subscription purchase.) Eight Sleep’s Pod Cover sleeping solution for dynamic cooling and heating: eightsleep.com/Tim (save $200 on the Pod Cover by Eight Sleep this winter) Momentous high-quality supplements: livemomentous.com/tim (code TIM for 20% off)

[@timferriss]

Cal's new book: www.amazon.com/Slow-Productivity-Accomplishment-Without-Burnout/dp/0593544854/?tag=offsitoftimfe-20

[@JeremyOcchipinti]

@@timferrisswhat kind of headset are you using? Thx

[@sapienspace8814]

When I saw "brought to you by AG1" my 1st thought "brought to you by AGI".

[@leadgenjay]

Cal Newport's insights on productivity without burnout are spot on. A key tactic not often discussed is the 'attention management'-structuring your workday around when you're naturally most focused can dramatically increase output without extra hours. It's about working smarter, not harder.

[@hopelessatusernames]

Cal's at the forefront of humanistic productivity / career advice. Can't wait for the next book.

[@DrBrianKeating]

Two of the OGs together sharing deep insights into self-improvement. Gotta love it! Just wanted to add that Google is doing away with their podcast app and their replacement is KZbin Music which is the same at KZbin podcast playlist. So KZbin is still the future of podcasts- for google at least.

[@Ryan.G.Spalding]

Yeah, I actually think the KZbin algorithm is great. I rarely, if ever, am suggested something I’m not interested in. Everyone has a different algorithm. I am never notified of Mr Beast video, unless he is on a different podcast I listen to. I think it’s just the demographic that is on KZbin. It skews much younger.

[@DrBrianKeating]

🙏

[@groovysecondhalf]

I guess I am just the kind of person that watches a podcast. I listen to podcasts way less frequently because I can’t walk due to an injury. And maybe because I jump on KZbin to research different plants because I am new to gardening and videos from channels I subscribe to are on my home page. Don’t get me wrong ~ when it is a podcast versus a video I need to watch ~ I multitask. Tim ~ I’ve been following you since the 4 hour work week and really appreciate you introducing me to new writers, bloggers, KZbinrs, etc. I also love that you break-up your interviews into smaller segments for KZbin Shorts.

[@RugilePenno-qr1nh]

Thank you both very much. It is nice to hear about intentional, slow productivity. I enjoyed this episode a lot.

[@jackskellingtron]

When Cal talks, I listen. He is one of my favorite thinkers even going back to his "How to Get Straight A's" book, which gave me tons of great ideas in my technical career. I was really disappointed to see the book isn't out until March! I have been thinking about this with regards to entrepreneurship. Most of the advice out there right now is essentially to take any half baked idea, just start, build a weak MVP, and then metric hack the everloving piss out of it. But I'm pretty sure that product focused companies will last longer. OR more importantly, it's a lot more fun and fulfilling to build out a product you love and are proud of. Granted, A/B testing and solid experimentation hygiene are standard best practices now. But hygiene is not the main theme of a fun life, and hygiene isn't the main theme of a fun company.

[@MattTheMallard]

Exactly what I needed, thank you!

[@JoseGarcia-vr8mx]

Awesome podcast, thankn you for putting it together Tim!

[@Mislimdaklepostojim]

🎉🎉🎉 Great episode. Thank you very much

[@nda4591]

Thanks for the beautiful conversation! Very inspiring and entertaining podcast! Everytime I think that’s the best episode and it only gets better or as great! Well crafted questions fun and deep and great guests it never gets boring or without gist! Loved the philosophy behind Cal’s answers and the simple and inspiring way of channeling the complex topic of life performance. Thanks for “Coming up with those deep words”!

[@itinerantghost]

Excellent interview! Looking forward to the book

[@philosophy1996]

Hey Tim, if I like the people I actually really enjoy sitting down and just watching the video version of a podcast, maybe over dinner or with some tea. There's something really peaceful and non-commital about it compared to shorter youtube videos or heavily produced media like movies. It's a different experience compared to listening to an episode while my mind is elsewhere. Loved the episode, the two titans of productivity!

[@rudolfsceseiko7972]

Excellent, thank you!

[@AlexanderStoic]

Looking forward to this one!

[@max7164]

I definitely watch/listen to a lot of my podcast material through KZbin, but it tends to be the more intentional shows that I choose to subscribe to and that I am already subscribed to on my podcast app. Whereas reels/shorts is where I tend to discover a lot of these shows I would never otherwise watch. Personally, it rarely leads to me subscribing. But it does mean they come onto my radar and I do end up consuming a lot of their material in snippets, as once the algorithm realises I like it, that's all I get! (i.e Joe Rogan, 2 bears 1 cave, a lot of comedy podcasts in general)

[@AfterCoffeeWithJess]

yessssssssss!!!!! my two fav people

[@redstarbuxcup]

watching this on youtube! it works for my use case: 1) the UI for searching and organizing (to watch, watched, listen again) is way better than the green app. 2) i work alone at home as an illustrator and i have the pod on all day with wifi. i rarely look at the video, because my active window is on references / work.

[@cashvsbeauty]

Great podcast, perfect timing, as I am an inventor of a new tech algorithm, building the capital to invest in my first stage of the app build. "It takes as long as it takes," is the quote.

[@impactmakerstribe]

We can let go of the pressure to rush through everything.

[@daralelaina]

I do not have the time to watch podcasts on my TV, I like to listen to them on YT premium while I am doing something else. Apple Podcast is difficult, YT has a better system

[@impactmakerstribe]

That's a great idea 😂😂😂

[@ravivarmanthiagarajan8879]

Excellent episode

[@PedroSilvaSantos]

Excellent episode!

[@black_knight_1975]

Excellent👍

[@mattcarrelo]

Listening to this having just listened to the All-In Podcast's latest episode where they debate MVP / Quick to market strategies like most SaS companies vs Deep Tech Business strategies like Elon's companies, Open AI and chip manufacturing... Interesting how Tim's observation about how if you feel like you have to rush you almost definitely don't have a long term competitive advantage (a moat) applies to business too. Zoom out to a 10 to 20 year time-horizon. Decide to work on 1 or 2 main things in your life, and go all in. Become the best in those things. In a world that is chasing its own tail, this is the way 🤝🤝

[@sumonahamed7134]

Awesone..❤

[@vSwampFox]

Will take me the rest of the week. Gunna try

[@lucasjsnyder]

15:35 I’m actually watching this podcast on a smart tv lol.

[@hopelessatusernames]

The thing about writing is practice sharpens your thinking. Can long conversations do the same thing? Perhaps, but you'd be much more dependent on the interlocutor being a good listener, responder, generous etc

[@catchjyoti]

some kind soul - please give timestamps.

[@ladle24]

Okay, so I literally just figured out with this podcast that you can click on a link in the short to get the whole thing. I was starting to get mad at KZbin for putting shorts in my notifications, because then I thought I had to remember the title long enough to find the YT search bar. (Usually three swipes or taps of things that I didn't want to do, accidentally exiting and reopening the app, so by the time I get there, I can't remember the title, and half the time, it doesn't show up in the history.) And if you accidentally hit a button and screw it up, if YT didn't record it in your history, sometimes it is hard to find again, because for some reason, the back swipe doesn't take you back to where you were. YT on phone is maddening. Also, I don't want to have to play podcasts as videos because videos eat phone batteries faster.

[@Ritam_ok]

07:27 we aren't free of the algorithm 09:37 why is growth important

[@GabrielRyanCo]

The irony of truth. I was 5-10 minutes into this episode before I realized Tim & Cal weren’t sitting across the table from one another because I was listening to the audio of this episode on KZbin, one AirPod in, with my phone face down on my bedside table.

[@jbmop]

Please provide timestamps!

[@ascensionbias7528]

10 minutes in...Cal is finally able to talk.

[@barbaradora]

1:33:16 another great contemporary example of writers who embrace slow productivity: Donna Tartt!

[@jmanakajosh9354]

I stopped everything to watch this. Watched it at 1x, sadly, I don't think I get it. I'll have to watch it again.

[@saulgoodwin8328]

the chris nolan thing blew my mind

[@CryptoC4T]

IDK, all my podcast watching is YT.

[@victoralfaro2339]

really interesting and smart guest.. I really enjoyed it, however, Tim ... what was up with the many out-of-sync giggles throughout the show.. It was odd.... the guest did not know what to say.....

[@108u9]

2:01:40 if Tim’s KZbin thumbnails start changing, we’ll know why 😂😂😂

[@Eldenaya]

Holy shit this podcast is 80% Tim rambling

[@Eldenaya]

Skip to 25min for the podcast to start

[@ascensionbias7528]

Steve Martin was quoting Orson Scott Card.

[@jasmine16290]

1:03:40

[@aalbero]

It was so funny when he talked about video being necessary for the machine, but humans not consuming the video, while I was not consuming the video

[@hopelessatusernames]

Video on Spotify > video on KZbin

[@secondhandentity]

Listened to this at 2x speed

[@realspacemusicvideos]

You are fast to embrace slow productivity!

[@Indraneel27]

25:00

[@StarTreeNFT]

All about the peeling of the watermelon!!😂😂😂

[@thinkpadthinkers]

Cal is ALL over the place with these takes. "I don't think KZbin is the future of video for podcasts. KZbin and podcasts don't play well together at all". Data? He claims smart TVs? YT TV? Chromecast? Hahahaha come on, Cal! Get your head in the game.

[@mo-akif]

being chronically offline will make you dumb af in some aspects

[@thinkpadthinkers]

YT Podcasts hahaha come on! It's the future AND the present.

[@thinkpadthinkers]

Integratin between YT Music and Podcasting... come on hahaha

[@quasa0]

3:30 super wrong. Literally podcast clips

[@SantoRedentor]

The future of podcasting will be in Smart TVs. I think this is so wrong. Lost people listen to podcast, don't watch them. Who cares if you record yourself in 4k? I don't want to see your face for 2 hours on 4k. Video only. Makes sense if there is some value added in the image. In a podcast, also this one, only the voice is of any value. I only turned the screen on to write this, now I'll turn it back off and continue with the listening while I work out.

[@joseph-the-seventh]

Tim was flexing his “taste” muscles in this episode. Calm down, Tim.

[@user-xx6hs2qv3s]

Most pod casters do the same content. They copy each other when they need a new, out of the box idea. Am I wrong ?

[@enlighten92]

Just a friendly feedback Tim. Your questions are too verbose and drawn out. I can understand that you need to set the context of the question but please work on brevity.

[@wernerhabel]

Newports ignorance to the impact of audio podcasts coming to KZbin Music is almost funny.

[@siriusblack3369]

Harry Potter & The Potent productivity poisons.

[@alya-8205]

You talk so much more than the guests

[@talalkhalid2920]

30 minutes in and they talk about irrelevant topics that are very personal to them. Future of podcasting and how to write are NOT reasons i opened this. Tim i would suggest you steer conversations to be relevant to the topic at hand.

[@seanobrien9849]

Maybe long form interview is not the format you should consume. Try their audio books

[@Linzeyloo2]

There is also the handy 'Chapter' feature with descriptions so you can easily and quickly fast forward to the section you are interested in. I found it all interesting and appreciate the free quality content.

[@Dad_Brad]

I read this comment before I actually started the video. Thanks for saving me the time, I’ll pass on this guy’s channel. Another pointless KZbin recommendation

[@talalkhalid2920]

No I do consume long form interviews and with most creators this isn't really an issue. ​@@seanobrien9849

[@alexandrerighi]

Stopped at minute 34. Can't go on. Very bad episode

[@kacpergaka3892]

What you do with sound in your latest interviews is just wrong. I mean using some software to silence breaks - I don’t know what it’s called. I just can’t get used to it, it seems so unnatural and useless. I don’t understand why the quality of your show is so low from the technical standpoint, compares to guys who consider you a master of podcasting... this particular thing seems like a weird experiment, am I the only one who hears that??

[@andrewchong5823]

bad take . no way ppl move towards single tasking this guy jus doesnt like youtube himself and jus projecting his hopes and dreams

[@alykinns9051]

I find Tim so incredibly wordy. Try to watch/listen but never finish. Bye bye.

[@AnnaKravtsova-jp9vj]

Looking forward to this one!