How to pick a good Messer for sparring

[@TimothyFinucane]

Yes, I want all of the messers. These damn household bills keep getting in the way though. 🤣

[@VirtualFechtschule]

I know right? Unfair I say!

[@capinkyky]

I've used Regenyei, SIGI, Ensifer's Talhofer, and the VB "peasant knife"... let me tell you, the "peasant knife" is the best of them all at only 200 Euros. The light version is 800g and it is so lively and smooth that there is no competition--not to mention its sizeable handle making grappling with the weapon a dream. Ensifer comes close, but it's price point is just absurd for a training weapon and the exceedingly thin and wide handle makes it feel like holding a plank of wood.. Regenyei and SIGI feel heavy, clunky and unbalanced--the handles are also uncomfortable and overly square with a lot of rough edges (regenyei is much worse, just similar issues). In this case--less is more. VB peasant knife? count me in.

[@heirihunziker]

Nice to see a fellow appreciator of the VB light messer, that one tends to get overlooked or dismissed as a "kinda OK for beginners" blade but in terms of value for price, I find it a great product. Bought several of them already. One issue is that the long wooden handle gets easily chipped especially when fencing against two-handed weapons and it wouldn't look so nice if I was to wrap the grip. This is a general issue I have with wooden handles, applies to all brands and any messer with a long handle.

[@heirihunziker]

Thanks a lot, this video is much appreciated. Totally understand what you mean by how much more time consuming the task is when you expand the scope, the amount of work seems to increase exponentially. I'm starting to accept the fact that there is no "one messer to rule them all" and instead of spending time obsessing about stats (old habit from playing CRPGs...) I should just spend that time making extra money and then buy them all. But money isn't the main reason why I'm looking for the ultimate allrounder messer, it's the fact that I can only carry so and so much equipment to any given training session, so no matter how many swords I already have at home, it's very inconvenient having to carry one steel trainer for technical practice by the book, one for contact drills and one for full speed free sparring - especially when the session involves more than one weapon category.

[@VirtualFechtschule]

Yeah, this is a constant struggle. :P I generally bring two to each session at least: my custom blunt Messer and a sparring Messer, but that's for places where we have a bag of nylons to hand to people who don't have their own. Otherwise it's at least three Messer in my bag (and more if Mila comes along of course).

[@alexhunt7810]

0:28 I got that joke and I loved it.

[@peternordhaus5590]

that's a splendid mustache.

[@VirtualFechtschule]

Hehehe, thanks! :)

[@zerozerosud]

A great review ❤️ I was looking forward to it, thank you!

[@VirtualFechtschule]

You're welcome!

[@secutorprimus]

After having experience with the LE Gottfried, I definitely wish that I had thought ahead more and chosen the LE Karl. Definitely seems more suitable for long term training, sparring, and drilling. Edit: However, that SIGI messer seems quite, quite nice for my tastes.

[@VirtualFechtschule]

The Gottfried is still great, but it does benefit from a more dedicated hard sparring Messer next to it. Pro tip: black fencer synthetics are actually pretty great for hard sparring as well, as long as you don't overcommit on thrusts. They're a good affordable alternative if you don't want to or can't buy two steel Messer.

[@KingHomeschool]

ALL THE MESSERS !

[@VirtualFechtschule]

This is, in fact, the correct answer

[@ashleyhanks9608]

You fence beautifully.

[@harithhasrat2671]

Cool

[@tanterouge]

Hi! Will you be reviewing the Poker Armory Schnorrer Messer as well :) ?

[@VirtualFechtschule]

I will for the Biiiig review. A clubmate of mine has one, so I'll have the ability to look at it and form an opinion. :)

[@tanterouge]

@@VirtualFechtschule Wonderful! Looking forward to the video :)

[@ashleyhanks9608]

I have an sgt blades messer. It looks like the sigi, but according to your assessments, it seems closer to the Kreiger messer you showed.

[@VirtualFechtschule]

Could very well be. I used some SGT blades messers back in the day and they were very light.

[@VirtualFechtschule]

I did really like them for safe sparring. How's your experience with that type of Messer now?

[@ashleyhanks9608]

@@VirtualFechtschule I really like this messer. It's long and narrow, with a good amount of flex. Lightweight and easy to maneuver. The balance is closer to the cross, which I prefer. The handle is also longer, which I like a lot. I started with a pentii style plastic messer that has a really long handle, and this sgt is not as long, but balanced similarly to what I learned before I upgraded to a steel messer. Our school was given two of these sgt messers about 6 years ago. One of them was given to a student who graduated high school and took it to college with him. The other broke approximately 6" from the tip after 6 years of constant use. Teaching, sparring, and competing. About 3 years ago, my husband and myself ordered two, along with a third for another student who pitched in on shipping/customs from Canada to USA. My messer and Phil's messer have been totally fine and have held up well. My husband on the other hand, has broken two in the exact same spot. Where the blade meets at the cross. The entire blade just popped off from the handle. It seems to be a heating issue when they attach the cross to the blade. The maker has replaced the first, since it was within one year of manufacture. The second, was also within a few months of replacement. He has said he will replace it again. But he's been busy with life. I get it, and honestly if he doesn't send another, that's okay. He's already kept his word once. It's a lot of money for a small business to lose. Would I buy another? No. I really like the look LE Karl and günther. I haven't held them, but they look like what I want. The VB messer from Purpleheart armory is actually a close runner up. They have been out of stock, but some of our students have them and they are really good swords. They hold up really well. Another student has a lefty regenyei that was an "orphan" at hema supplies. (Someone ordered and didn't pick up) I like it and don't at the same time. The blade is nice. The handle is terrible. It's a short and square shaped, then it tapers in towards the cross. I absolutely hate it. It makes the balance and feel in hand just seem icky. I have no other way to describe it. 🤣 I'm a regenyei fan. I love their feders and sideswords. We have a standard, ringed (super heavy), and a shorty (my favorite). As well as, two each matching right and left sideswords with matching daggers. We love the. But all of the Messers I have handled have been weird. That's a lot of stuff! I could talk about Messers for days! My husband and I have taken over Tuesday nights at our school to go through single hand sword. First we went through royal armories i.33. Now we are going through lecküchner's art of Swordsmanship.

[@unexpectedbonk4049]

This video was perfectly times, I was just looking to getting a messer for sparring and was wondering if the Karl (being cheaper than the others) was as good for sparring

[@VirtualFechtschule]

It is, but really try to get one with a better nagel or sidering. The flex isn't a terrible issue unless you really want to launch with an ansetzen into the opponent expecting them to step back (and then they don't), but the nagel is something that really needs to be addressed.

[@VirtualFechtschule]

That said though, go for it. I generally get the best handling with it out of these three, even with full gear and heavy gloves on.

[@bojownik89]

I'm thinking about getting a Karl too and asked myself if the end of the wooden grip may chip away. That's why I'd like to add the CC1 pommel to it. In terms of weight and balance would you recommend the solid or the hollow one?

[@Heresjonnyagain]

Has anyone tried the Malleus Martialis messers?

[@blakeevert7955]

Thoughts on Ensifers messer?

[@VirtualFechtschule]

I like them. They may be a bit on the expensive side, but a friend who has one has had it for almost a decade and it seems near indestructible. Not my jam when it comes to handling though, but that's just personal preference.

[@elgostine]

why are all the sparring messers so narrow and stabby and long when i thought the messer was shorter, wider and more choppy whats happening there?

[@VirtualFechtschule]

Well, the length is sort of on point (hehehe), and thinner originals did exist, but Messers should most often be a bit choppier. That said, those messers are not a lot of fun to be hit by, so there's almost no messers like that that I feel comfortable sparring at max intensity with.