How to Properly Understand the Trinity

[@mamajan99]

Jesus said ‘The father and I are one,’ (John 10:30) Some teach that Jesus was saying that he was one of three personalities of God in a Trinity. But Jesus added "And in that day, you’ll come to know that I am in my Father, just as you’ll be in me and I’ll be in you." So if Jesus meant that he is the same person as (or is another personality of) his Father, then what he said at John 14:20 would mean that all of Jesus’ followers will become the same person as him and his Father; thus we would all become Jesus and God!

[@jdwagman]

"Imperial Legacy" is one of the best handles for Christianity coming out of 4th century Rome. I refer to it as Imperial Christianity - by the emperors for the emperors. It is exactly how the Trinity was forced into the church by imperial law. See: Edict of Thessalonica (380 AD).

[@Imperial_Legacy]

@@jdwagman Thank you! I thought of using the name “Imperial Christianity” as well because its really cool, but ended up settling on Imperial Legacy because I believe the most enduring legacy of the (Late) Roman Empire is Christianity.

[@dynamic9016]

Thanks much for this video.

[@MichaelTheophilus906]

Deut 6.4-6, Mark 12.28-32, John 17.3, John 20.17, Rom 15.6, Rom 11.31, I Cor 8.6, II Cor 11.31, I Tim 2.5, Rev 1.5-6, Rev 3.12.

[@Imperial_Legacy]

@@MichaelTheophilus906 Amen 🙏🏻

[@tombuddy100]

I have looked up all those references. They all imply that God is the Father alone. For example, Revelation 1: 5-6: 5 and from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth. To him who loves us and has freed us from our sins by his blood, 6 and has made us to be a kingdom and priests to serve his God and Father-to him be glory and power for ever and ever! Amen.

[@turpinwillie]

John 17:2 John 17:5 Jesus giving eternal life and had glory before the world was. Sounds like God the Son to me. Jesus is God.

[@tombuddy100]

@@turpinwillie Why are there "God the Father" phrases in the Bible yet no "God the Son" then?

[@turpinwillie]

@@tombuddy100 You’re correct, there are no verses stating God the Son. Revelation 1:6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father. Who is God’s Father? This verse is referring to Jesus as God. 1 Timothy 3:16 God was manifest in the flesh. Referring to Jesus as God. Acts 20:28 …feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood. Once again referring to Jesus as God. I can do this all day.

[@lcenteno262]

I used to be a Trinitarian in one of the world’s largest religious denominations for 53 years and taught and raised my own family the same for 18 years. I continued in this teaching right up until the day God had mercy on me and sent me the Holy Spirit who led me into all the truth (John 16:13). What does the Spirit have to say about this? If you have eyes to see and ears to hear, listen: “At that same time Jesus was filled with the joy of the Holy Spirit, and he said, “O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, thank you for HIDING THESE THINGS FROM THOSE WHO THINK THEMSELVES WISE AND CLEVER, and for REVEALING THEM TO THE CHILDLIKE. Yes, Father, it pleased you to do it this way.” (Luke 10:21) “Truly I tell you,” He said, “unless you change and become like little children, you will NEVER ENTER the kingdom of heaven.” (Matt. 18:3) Now, remember that show, “Are you smarter than a 5th grader”? Are you willing to be humble and be like a child? Take the test yourself and find out. The topic is based on the doctrine of the Trinity. This doctrine declares the Godhead is triune being comprised of Father, Son and Holy Spirit who are “co-equal” with each other and “are all God”. Without being a bible scholar or having to twist scripture, this is really quite simple. Ready to test yourself? Elementary 5th grade reading and basic 2nd grade math show us the truth of this matter; hence being like a child just like our Lord said: Open your Bible (most won’t), go to the gospel of John and read John 1:1-3 as it is written: In the beginning the Word already existed. The Word was with God, and the Word was God. He existed in the beginning with God. God created everything through him, and nothing was created except through him.” (John 1:1-3) Now do the basic math. How many God beings do you count? 2 or 3? Having established that both the Father and the Son are God from what you just read, now read the following verses: John 5:17, 5:19, 5:20, 5:21, 5:22, 5:23, 5:26, 5:30, 5:36, 8:28, 12:50, 10:30, 14:6, 14:23, 14:28, 15:10, 17:3, 17:5, Rom. 1:1, Rom. 1:27, 1 Cor. 1:3, 1 Cor. 1:9, 1 Cor. 8:6-7, 1 Cor. 15:27-28, 2 Cor. 1:2-3, Eph. 1:2, 5:20, Philip. 1:2, Col. 1:3, 1 Thess. 1:3, 2 Thess. 1:2, Phil. 1:3, Heb. 1:8-13, 1 Peter 1:3, 2 Peter 1:2, 1 John 1:3, 1: John 5:20, 2 John 1:3, 2 John 1:9, Rev. 3:12, 7:10, 21:22-23. Now do the basic math. How many God beings do you count? 2 or 3? Now, ask honestly ask yourself, where in this world does 1 + 1 =3? The Spirit can keep going on with many more verses just like this. If you have the humility to be honest with yourself and what you just read, you will see the plain truth and the trinity doctrine is debunked. If the Holy Spirit was in fact God, why was he left out of all those verses? What happened to being co-equal? Little children truly believe in Santa Claus in all sincerity up until the day they discover the ugly truth of the matter, right? This isn’t any different. Why anyone would continue to believe in a lie after the truth has been revealed with the preponderance of overwhelming evidence? Ripping the band aid off hurts, doesn’t it? But, “the truth will set you free” (John 8:32). So now that you have read and seen the truth for yourself, do you still believe in the false trinity doctrine or did you fail the 5th grade test? If you failed it and still believe in the doctrines of men and not God, go to your Bible and read John 8:47. That is the harsh reality friend. Another biblical fact: Nowhere in the Bible does it say that the Holy Spirit is God. Nowhere! Christ also said, “the Father is greater than I” (John 14:28). Clearly, Christ by his very statement of fact said they are NOT co-equal! This totally scotches the doctrine of the trinity that claims the Father, Son and Spirit are co-equal. Who on earth would dare call Christ a liar? It’s sheer foolishness! How can anyone believe in the false doctrine of the trinity after reading the gospel of John? The gospel of John and other books of the Bible clearly testify that the doctrine of the triune god is a lie (John 1:1-3). The word “trinity” isn’t even written anywhere in the Bible, why would anyone believe it? The world foolishly says about the Spirit of God that he is “God the Spirit”. Christ tells us that “God IS spirit” (John 4:24). Do you see how foolish this is already? Why does God need a Spirit if he already IS spirit? It is the Spirit of God. The word “OF” being paramount as the Spirit belongs to God and Christ; the word “OF” denotes possession/ownership. They own it and they sent it (John 16:15) Don’t know who the Holy Spirit is? Simple, read John 1:51 and Hebrews 1:7, 1:14, and Psalm 104:4. There is our Helper in plain sight yet most are so blinded by the years of false teaching and lies they can’t see the truth. Spirit of God, the Spirit of the Lord, the Spirit = Holy Spirit. Read Hebrews 1:7 and Psalm 104:4. Now go to the Book of Acts and read Acts 2:1-4 (The Coming of the Holy Spirit). This isn’t hard to figure out. Still can’t see? Paul cautioned us about false humility and the worship of angles (Col. 2:18). The Holy Spirit warned John twice in the Book of Revelation that he should not be worshiped (Rev. 19:10, 22:8-9). Let’s really simplify this: If a fallen angel is a demon/evil spirit that belongs to Satan (Rev. 12:7), then an angel of God can only be what? A Holy Spirit because he belongs to God who is holy (Lev. 11:44, 1 Peter 1:16). Think about it, if the Holy Spirit was a single 3rd person of the Godhead, how is it even possible we can we all have him? See how foolish this is already? Do I get the Holy Spirit today and borrow him to you tomorrow? Can you see how foolish this world’s wisdom is. The answer is found again in Matthew 18:10 for it is written: “Beware that you don't look down on any of these little ones. For I tell you that in heaven THEIR ANGELS are always in the presence of my heavenly Father.” (Matt. 18:10). The words “their angels” (Holy Spirit) shows ownership. The Holy Spirit for each one of us was not sent until Christ came into his glory (John 7:39). Let the Bible explain itself, it's quite simple and straightforward. The teaching is very simple without having to twist scripture and believe in something that just isn't there like the word “trinity”. Biblical truth is solely based on the word of God (John 17:17) It’s time to unlearn one of the greatest lies of so called “modern Christianity”. Believe in what Christ said and taught. Believe in what is actually and clearly written in the word of God and not in the invented mythology or eisegesis of men. Get this, if you are worshiping the pagan invented god known as the “trinity”, you will never, ever receive the Holy Spirit (Acts 5:32) as you are breaking the 1st Commandment, a spiritual law of God’s coming kingdom (Rom. 7:14, Rev. 11:19) by creating your own god made up in the mythology and eisegesis of men. “that their hearts may be encouraged, being KNIT together in love, and attaining to all riches of the full assurance of understanding, to the knowledge of the mystery of God, BOTH of the FATHER AND OF CHRIST, IN WHOM are hidden ALL the treasures of WISDOM and KNOWLEDGE.” (Col. 2:2-3 NKJV). Whom has ALL the treasures of wisdom and knowledge as you just read? The Father and Christ. Again, how many God beings do you count? 2 or 3? Lay down your pride and what you think you know about God and the Bible and unlearn the lies. Repent and let God through the Holy Spirit teach you. Unless you become like a child, you will never enter the Kingdom of God. Forget what you think you know as the Lord has sent me to reveal the simplicity of his teaching in spirit and truth. Finally, let’s read Proverbs 30:4 together: “Who has ascended into heaven, or descended? Who has gathered the wind in His fists? Who has bound the waters in a garment? Who has established all the ends of the earth? What is HIS NAME, and what is HIS SON’S NAME, If you know? One more time, how many God beings do you count? 2 or 3? Still don’t believe it? Let’s continue reading the rest of it: “Every word of God is pure; He is a shield to those who put their trust in Him. DO NOT ADD TO HIS WORD, Lest He rebuke you, and you be found a liar.” (Prov. 30:5-6) FACT: The word “trinity” isn’t found anywhere in the Bible as it is “added” to His word. So now ask yourself, who is the liar? If today you hear his voice, harden not your heart! Repent for the Kingdom of God is near!

[@DetVen]

Ummm, no.

[@lcenteno262]

@@DetVen “When we tell you these things, we do not use words that come from human wisdom. Instead, we speak words given to us by the Spirit, using the Spirit’s words to explain spiritual truths. But people who aren’t spiritual can’t receive these truths from God’s Spirit. It all sounds foolish to them and they can’t understand it, for only those who are spiritual can understand what the Spirit means. Those who are spiritual can evaluate all things, but they themselves cannot be evaluated by others. For,“Who can know the LORD’s thoughts? Who knows enough to teach him?” But we understand these things, for we have the mind of Christ.” (1 Cor. 2:13-16)

[@Robert-r4s4c]

There is more to the Trinity than what you described.

[@larsrons7937]

Good choise for a topic. Very well explained in just five minutes.

[@Imperial_Legacy]

@@larsrons7937 Thank you, Lars! I'm now focusing more on theological and church history videos, as I'm really interested in these topics. I hope you enjoy this type of content!

[@larsrons7937]

@@Imperial_Legacy That's fine. For me my interest in religion is a bit smaller but definitely still there, and it's fine for a change. Religion is very much still part of history. I do encourage you to go on. 😊 I do believe you picked an interesting topic here, and the formats and length of your videos are fine for me.

[@Imperial_Legacy]

@@larsrons7937 Thank you, Lars. I'm glad you find this content interesting, even though you prefer more historical videos. I plan to create content in both areas because my passion for history always draws me to it. I’ll also be creating videos in a 5-10 minute format, as I believe that’s what most people prefer.

[@larsrons7937]

@@Imperial_Legacy As my avatar picture might hint I spend a lot of time getting updated on the sutiation around Ukraine. So these years 5-10 minutes format for other videos suit me very well. I do long for the days when I had time for hours long videos of my own personal interest, but I think the help I can provide in the information space is more important than my private interest. From years ago I subscribe to a number of channels with videos of 30 mins to over an hour in lenght. I loved them, but don't have time for them. I'm very glad I found your small channel. Your videos give a short break from the more serious things I concentrate on. 😊

[@Imperial_Legacy]

@@larsrons7937 I keep an eye on the Ukrainian conflict as well, it’s very sad what’s happening there. I don’t believe Russia will win this war, and I hope Ukraine can join NATO as soon as possible once the war is over, if they emerge victorious. I feel the same way about longer videos-my watch later playlist is full of them, just waiting for the right moment. Most of the time, I end up watching shorter videos instead. Thank you so much for your support, Lars. It’s always a pleasure reading your comments and chatting with you.

[@KorithStoneheart]

You sound like Richard Dreyfuss, bro.

[@Imperial_Legacy]

Thank you

[@tombuddy100]

Can Trinitarians answer these three questions? 1. Is there a single verse in the Bible that clarifies that God is more than just one person, or three persons? 2. Why are almost all references to God in the Bible in either first person singular, second person singular, or third person singular? 3. Why was Jesus saying that his Father is the only true God, and that the Father is greater than all?

[@Imperial_Legacy]

While Trinitarian theology affirm that there is no single verse explicitly stating "God is three persons," they argue that the doctrine of the Trinity is derived from a collective understanding of multiple scriptures. Verses like Matthew 28:19, which mentions baptizing "in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit," reflect a triune understanding of God. Additionally, passages like John 1:1, which refers to Jesus (the Word) as both with God and as God, suggest a multi-personal nature of God. Trinitarians rely on the consistent portrayal of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit throughout the New Testament to argue for a plurality of persons within the one Godhead. Trinitarians would argue that this is because God is one being, and the use of singular pronouns reflects the unity and singular nature of God. In Trinitarian theology, God is understood as a single "what" (one essence) but three "who’s" (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit). Therefore, singular references do not contradict the Trinity because they reflect God's unified essence, while the interactions between the Father, Son, and Spirit show the distinction of persons. The use of singular pronouns is seen as emphasizing God’s oneness, which is a key aspect of Trinitarian doctrine. Trinitarians interpret John 10:30, where Jesus says, "I and the Father are one," as a clear statement of Jesus’ divine unity with the Father, showing that they share the same divine essence. When Jesus says, "the Father is greater than I" (John 14:28), they understand this to refer to His role during His earthly life, where He took on human nature and submitted to the Father (Philippians 2:5-8), without denying His divinity.

[@tombuddy100]

@@Imperial_Legacy I am aware that there are very few verses here and there in the Bible that can be interpreted as supporting Trinity doctrine, if you presuppose Trinity doctrine and interpret those verses to fit such a narrative. However, overwhelmingly more verses do not seem to support Trinity doctrine, as they support Unitarian view, where God is one person, the Father, using the following points: - The Son exclusively talks (prays) to the Father, not even one time to the Holy Spirit - The Son mostly talks about the Father, mentioning the Holy Spirit only in context of the Father giving the Holy Spirit to those who pray to the Father - The Son says that the Father is greater than him and greater than all - There is no doubt that the Son thinks that the Father is God, in fact, the only true God, as he said in John - The person the Son urges us to worship is the Father - The person the Son urges us to pray to is the Father - Stephen (in Acts) saw a vision where the Son was standing at the right hand of God, while Stephen was filled with the Holy Spirit. Note that it does not say the Son stood at the right hand of the Father. - There are many "God the Father" phrases yet no "God the Son" or "God the Holy Spirit" in the Bible Finally, the Trinity doctrine is defined as one God yet there co-equal persons, each of whom is 100% God. Such doctrine is by no means obvious by reading the Bible, considering that there is clear hierarchy of worship, authority, and function between the three. The doctrine seem to be incomprehensible and illogical, rather than obvious.

[@tombuddy100]

@@Imperial_Legacy By the way, if God wanted us to understand Him through the Trinity doctrine, wouldn't He have inspired writers of the Bible to make the doctrine unquestionably and undeniably clear. There wouldn't be just two verses: 1 John 5:7 and Matthew 28:19. Instead, there would numerous verses in abundance like those, emphasized and repeated in different forms.

[@alanablanchard9615]

@@tombuddy100 there are 2 verses in the Bible where many try to avoid because it does not fit into their teachings, there is Isaiah 9:6 and John 14:9-14

[@tombuddy100]

@@alanablanchard9615 You may interpret those verses to clearly support Trinity doctrine. I do not. Isaiah 9:6 does not say that the Son is God. It says that the Son will be called... similar to "Immanuel" in Matthew 1:23, which means "God with us", or name Isaiah itself, which means "Salvation of the Lord". John 14:9-14 does not say that the Son is God either. The Son is like God, because the Son perfectly imitates his Father, and does His will.

[@peacemaker3156]

Did anyone else here have Jesus Christ come down on cloud from heaven in real time and tell them the entire book of john and say those who killed Him long ago had changed it to lies and now everyone in this last age is praying to a lie and must return to His tree Of Life way of life???? Anyone? Perhaps the video maker here on this channel?? I been searching online for same or simular gift from Creator to humanity since 2008, no one comes fwd, not even famous preachers :( Anyone???

[@Imperial_Legacy]

@@peacemaker3156 I'm sorry, I didn't quite understand your question. Could you clarify what you're referring to? If you're concerned that newer translations may not accurately reflect the original text, you might consider checking older translations. I often use the Vulgate to compare original verses with modern Bible translations, but you can also refer to even older texts.

[@peacemaker3156]

@@Imperial_Legacy No, Im coherent, He given me that sight and hearing, not my self...I'll ask this way instead.. did He come from above and tell YOU or anyone you know in person Himself, the book of john and prophecy about now times? And tell you more about it that Creator's way was stolen and rewritten by the bad ppls who murdered Him into lies?

[@peacemaker3156]

I share it here, His msg, not my own thinking or 'dream' or 'NDE' but it REALLY happened, most my life, no one believes His msg when I share it, they believe a book by bad ppls instead or a ear tickler - kzbin.info/www/bejne/rpfJf3dooMiml9Usi=EIml7KCcVWbD3zaJ

[@Imperial_Legacy]

@@peacemaker3156 Okay, the question you’re asking touches on a few significant theological points, so I’ll do my best to provide an answer based on Christian teachings. In Christianity, God primarily reveals Himself through the Bible and the Holy Spirit. The Book of John is considered divinely inspired, and while it focuses on Jesus’ life, the Book of Revelation specifically covers prophecies about the end times and future events. While some believe the true teachings of God might have been altered, mainstream Christianity holds that the Bible’s core message has been faithfully preserved. I hope I was able to answer your question. God bless. 🙏🏻✝️

[@johnirish989]

Well, Satan surely exists and he can and does inspire translations of His word. But of course all is out of God, including Satan, and all that happens is in accord with the counsel of His will. Satanically mistranslated bibles can be said to be a test of faith, an opportunity for the human to demonstrate his/her love of the truth. Relatively speaking, of course.​@@peacemaker3156

[@larsrons7937]

The Father, the Son and the Holy spirit. There's a lot of spirit in this bottle of mine. 😋

[@Imperial_Legacy]

@@larsrons7937 😂😂😂😂

[@larsrons7937]

@@Imperial_Legacy 🍹🍸🥂🍾 Espirito Santo.

[@MarcWilliams-v9w]

This is the traditional description of the Trinity, but it goes no farther. The Holy Spirit is directed by God, hence can not be independent of Him. In John's Gospel, Jesus repeatedly says "I am nothing without the Father," hence no independence, either. John's Prologue is the summation of his own understanding of God in relation to Jesus, but always remember, this Prologue was written by John after decades of deliberation, and not by Jesus Himself. I understand the usefulness of the Trinity, but it does not truly work as a concept, and was formulated by Tertullian in ca. 200 CE. The only reference to such in the Gospels is Matthew 28:54 (I think).

[@think1416]

Is that why Jesus said: “no one knows the day or time, but the only father does “ Is the father greater than God????

[@asaruff]

Having a heritical icon of the Father right away is not a good way to start the video.

[@Imperial_Legacy]

I wouldn't say that's heretical, but I make it clear in the video that I don't agree with making representations of God the Father. However, I wouldn't go so far as to call them heretical.

[@jimjuri6490]

The Trinity was a concept borrowed from the pagan nations. cf Acts 20:30. Israel was surrounded by nations which worshiped its triad of gods. The following was stressed and also acted as a warning to Israel. (Deuteronomy 6:4) “Listen, O Israel: Jehovah OUR GOD IS ONE Jehovah.

[@marcusvanrensberg6060]

Jesus christ is the glorious NAME of almighty God who became flesh and dwelled with man as the invisible and visible God, not a separate God but the one and only true living God and savior. Almighty is in all things, not just a trinity.

[@tongakhan230]

If anyone can understand or explain the Trinity, he will be the first in history Being a twisted doctrine Paul prophesied at Acts 20:30, it defies logic. Essences used in cakes to explain God??? Desperate times call for desperate means. 'No man has SEEN God AT ANY TIME ' is clear as crystal. Jesus was seen by tons of people. Ref 1John 4:12,20.

[@mike62mcmanus]

So that's why they just repeat Jesus words and don't do what he said, Peter got it when he commanded baptism in the Name of Jesus Christ...

[@AustinHayes-w7i]

Rotating it so that jesus is at the very bottom.

[@tekone11]

The real reason why the doctrine of the Trinity is not defensible is because it doesn't exist. How can you defend something GOD NEVER SAID NOR TAUGHT. There are a plethora of scriptures that GOD HIMSELF said that disputes the Trinity. So, who are we to believe, GOD and HIS WORD or man's misconception of the nature of GOD, that they deem the Trinity. There is NO TRINITY. Isaiah 44:24 Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD THAT MAKETH ALL THINGS; that stretcheth forth the heavens ALONE; that spreadeth abroad the EARTH BY MYSELF; Deuteronomy 32:12 So the LORD ALONE did lead him, and there was NO STRANGE GOD WITH HIM. Deuteronomy 32:39 See now that I, even I, am he, and THERE IS NO GOD WITH ME: I kill, and I make alive; I wound, and I heal: neither is there any that can deliver out of my hand. Deuteronomy 4:35 Unto thee it was shewed, that thou mightest know that the LORD HE IS GOD; THERE IS NONE ELSE BESIDE HIM. Isaiah 44:6 Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I AM THE FIRST, AND I AM THE LAST; AND BESIDE ME THERE IS NO GOD. Isaiah 44:8 Fear ye not, neither be afraid: have not I told thee from that time, and have declared it? ye are even my witnesses. IS THERE A GOD BESIDE ME? YEA, THERE IS NO GOD; I KNOW NOT ANY. Isaiah 45:5 I am the LORD, and THERE IS NONE ELSE, THERE IS NO GOD BESIDE ME: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me: Isaiah 45:21 Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and THERE IS NO GOD ELSE BESIDE ME; A JUST GOD AND A SAVIOUR; THERE IS NONE BESIDE ME. Hosea 13:4 Yet I am the LORD thy GOD from the land of Egypt, and THOU SHALT KNOW NO GOD BUT ME: FOR THERE IS NO SAVIOUR BESIDE ME. Romans 3:29-30 Is he the God of the Jews only? is he not also of the Gentiles? Yes, of the Gentiles also: SEEING IT IS ONE GOD, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith. So, where is this so-called coexistence, being that the LORD has said over and over that it's just HIM and nobody else. Titles are not persons or entities. They all ascribe to the ONE SELFSAME GOD, JESUS CHRIST. Isaiah 9:6 FOR UNTO US A CHILD IS BORN, UNTO US A SON IS GIVEN: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, THE MIGHTY GOD, THE EVERLASTING FATHER, The Prince of Peace. 1 Timothy 3:16 And without controversy GREAT IS THE MYSTERY OF GODLINESS: GOD WAS MANIFEST IN THE FLESH, justified in the SPIRIT, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, RECEIVED UP INTO GLORY. Colossians 2:2 That their hearts might be comforted, being knit together in love, and unto all riches of the full assurance of understanding, to the acknowledgement of THE MYSTERY OF GOD, AND OF THE FATHER, AND OF CHRIST; Revelation 10:7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, THE MYSTERY OF GOD should be FINISHED, AS HE HATH DECLARED TO HIS SERVANTS THE PROPHETS. The MYSTERY OF GOD is NOT the TRINITY. THE MYSTERY OF GOD is that JESUS IS THE TRUE GOD AND ETERNAL LIFE. That is what you should be defending because that is what's written. Not a concept concocted by the Devil himself. 1 John 5:20-21 And we know that THE SON OF GOD IS COME, and hath GIVEN US AN UNDERSTANDING, that we may KNOW HIM THAT IS TRUE, and WE ARE IN HIM THAT IS TRUE, EVEN IN HIS SON JESUS CHRIST. THIS IS THE TRUE GOD, AND ETERNAL LIFE. Little children, KEEP YOURSELVES FROM IDOLS. Amen. GOD IS NOT THE AUTHOR OF CONFUSION but Satan is. It's the same old trick he pulled on Eve in the Garden. GOD says of HIMSELF, BY COMMANDMENT, HE IS ONE. The Devil says, HE IS NOT SURELY ONE, HE'S THREE. Mark 12:29-31 And Jesus answered him, THE FIRST OF ALL THE COMMANDMENTS IS, HEAR, O ISRAEL; THE LORD OUR GOD IS ONE LORD: And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: THIS IS THE FIRST COMMANDMENT. And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. THERE IS NONE OTHER COMMANDMENT GREATER THAN THESE. Revelation 16:13-14 And I saw THREE UNCLEAN SPIRITS LIKE FROGS COME OUT OF THE MOUTH OF THE DRAGON, AND OUT OF THE MOUTH OF THE BEAST, AND OUT OF THE MOUTH OF THE FALSE PROPHET. For they are THE SPIRITS OF DEVILS, WORKING MIRACLES, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that GREAT DAY OF GOD ALMIGHTY. The TRINITY is AN IDOL, just like the molten calf Aaron made for the children of Israel, which caused them to SIN AGAINST GOD. We don't worship IDOLS nor defend them.

[@jperez7893]

it is rather unfortunate that the false piety of the jews in hiding the name of God, YHWH, has contributed to the obfuscation of the trinity. if you replace the word God, with the Holy Name, YHWH, in the diagram of the trinity, it becomes more instructive. the trinity is manifestly clearer in the hebrew. the athanasian is the complete definition of the trinity. and to belabor the point: The Father is YHWH, The Son is YHWH, The Holy Spirit is YHWH; There are not 3 YHWH but 1 YHWH; the Father is not the Son, the Father is not the Holy Spirit; the Son is not the Father, the Son is not the Holy Spirit; the Holy Spirit is not the Father, the Holy Spirit is not the Son. this is YHWH that abraham met and welcomed. abraham met the trinity and yet abraham referred only to YHWH. for in the hebrew, it would have been more proper to the father YHWH, the messenger YHWH, and the Spirit YHWH. the theophanies in the bible attest to the Blessed Trinity and the reality of the truine God. it is also for the same reason that the priests did not accept what pilate wrote on the titulus crucis: yeshua the nazarene and king of the jews, the acrostic or which is YHWH

[@Cotronixco]

Jesus is not God. Instead of leaning only on controversial passages, listen to the very words of Jesus: Jesus said, "I can by myself do nothing. As I hear, I judge. And my judgment is just, because I do not seek my own will, but the will of God, who sent me.” John 5:30 Jesus said, "he who sent me is reliable, and I tell the world what I have heard from him. I do nothing on my own, but speak just what God has taught me. God is with me; he has not left me alone, for I always do what pleases HIM.” John 8:26,28-29 Jesus said, “Anyone who loves me will obey my teaching. God will love him, and WE will come to him and make OUR home with them.” John 14:23 Jesus said to God, "glorify your son, that your son may glorify YOU. For you granted him authority over all people that he might give eternal life to all those you have given him. Now this is eternal life: that they may know you, the only true God; AND Jesus Christ whom you have sent.” John 17:1-3 And there is much, much more.

[@eodee8459]

Somebody please show me one verse that says God is in three persons. Show me one verse that calls Jesus Christ, God the son. Show me one verse that says, God the Holy Ghost. If there is a Trinity, then who is the father to Jesus Christ? The first person, the second person, or the third person? Why would it take the Holy Ghost to conceive in Mary a human body so an already, pre existing eternal god the son could go in her to be born? If God is eternal, all knowing, all powerful, everywhere at once, why would he have to divide himself up into three persons to do his work. Why did God tell the Hebrews there is only one God. Why did he leave the Hebrews believing in monotheism when he is a Trinity? Why didn't God teach them, Hear oh Israel, the Lord thy God is in three persons? There is no teaching in the old testament about a Trinity. If God changes not, is the same, yesterday, today, and forever, then how did God go from a monotheistic God in the old testament to a Trinity in the new? Without changing?

[@nosuchthing8]

A metaphor. The chemical h20 comes in three forms: ice, water, vapor. Ice is not water or steam Water is not ice or steam. Steam is not water or ice. But ice, water, steam are all h20

[@eodee8459]

@@nosuchthing8 that doesn't answer any of my questions, nor does it show the Trinity, scripturally. Please show me one verse that calls Jesus Christ, god the son. If there is a Trinity, then why did Paul write, great is the mystery of godliness, God was manifested in the flesh? Why didn't he say, God was manifested in three persons?

[@nosuchthing8]

@@eodee8459 The justification for the Trinity in the Bible is based on passages that present God as existing in three distinct persons: the Father, the Son (Jesus Christ), and the Holy Spirit, while still maintaining the concept of one God; key verses include John 1:1 ("In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God"), John 10:30 ("I and the Father are one"), and the baptism of Jesus where the Holy Spirit is present as a dove, all indicating a unified yet distinct divine nature within the Godhead.

[@eodee8459]

@@nosuchthing8 none of those verses prove a Trinity exist. The baptism of Jesus Christ, where there is a voice from heaven and the appearance of the dove, which only John saw only shows the omnipresent of one God, not three persons. The only person would be Jesus Christ in the water. The only begotten Son of God. John 1:1 is far from showing a Trinity in that it says, In the beginning was the Word, (not son).In most places the word, 'word' defines as, something said, spoken. But not in this verse. Word here means essences. So, In the beginning was the essence of God and was with God, and was God. If it does show a Trinity, then it contradicts what Isaiah wrote that God created the world by himself. No one else was there creating. Jesus Christ said, I and the father are one doesn't show a Trinity in that the one true God was in him bodily. The angel came to Mary and said, That Holy thing born unto you shall be called, the Son of God. Calling this Christ a holy thing. The word thing here defines as Word. So the angel said, that holy word born, is the Son of God. The Son is human flesh. A human person. Mary was conceived by the Holy Ghost. God possessed that human body to live a holy life in it. God worked the miracles, and taught the Jews about the kingdom. Paul tells us that Christ is the expressed image of God's person. Here image defines as exact copy. Jesus Christ is the exact copy of the essence of the Father. No, none of those verses show a Trinity. And no one still has shown me where the scriptures say that Jesus Christ is ever called,god the son, or ever calls him an eternal son. Show me one verse that says Jesus Christ is in the godhead, and I'll show you one that says, the fullness of the godhead is in him bodily. That is fullness of the deity of God was in the body of Christ.

[@nosuchthing8]

@@eodee8459 the very first one demolished your claim. Read it again.

[@JamesRichardWiley]

Properly understanding means acceptance of a claim that has no validity in the real world. You have to make it up and you have to believe it - or else.

[@johnirish989]

The Father is eternal and was not begotten. Nothing eternal is begotten. The Son has a beginning the Father does not. The Son dies the Father cannot. The Son has a God the Father does not. The Son does the will of His Father ( Not Mine but Thine will be done) the Father does not do the will of the Son. The Son is perfectly happy being Numero Dos in His Father's universe. My favorite argument against the trinity is that of Ernest L Martin's: In all his salutations in all his epistles not once does Paul mention the holy spirit and the one time he does mention it at the end of 2nd Corinthians it's merely the COMMUNION of the holy spirit. Gee Paul how disrespectful. Luke 1:35 gives a definition of the Holy Spirit: the power of the MOST High. In impregnating Mary God does not suffer from impotence and does not need the assistance of another person. Jesus does not have two Fathers.

[@johnirish989]

Nothing begotten is eternal. The trinity is not HIS word. It is MAN's word: theology. Akin to Nimrod.

[@RalphHumphries-th1ym]

You might want to do your homework about the Trinity is a lie and they don't know who the only true God blind leaders of the blind

[@cbooth151]

The trinity is a false belief that even the Catholic Church admits is unscriptural. Consider the following *CATHOLIC* references... 1. Is the trinity teaching found in the OT? Not according to... a. the New Catholic Encyclopedia, which says: “The doctrine of the Trinity is not taught in the Old Testament” (1967, Vol. XIV, p. 306). b. Catholic theologian Edmund Fortman, who said: “The Old Testament tells us nothing explicitly or by necessary implication of a Triune God who is Father, Son and Holy Spirit…. There is no evidence that any sacred writer even suspected the existence of a [Trinity] within the Godhead." 2. Is the trinity teaching found in the NT? Recall that the trinity consists of THREE PERSONS, namely, the Father, Son, and holy spirit. So, is the holy spirit one of the three persons of the trinity? Not according to... a. Catholic theologian Edmund Fortman, who said: "The Holy Spirit is usually presented in the Synoptic gospels (Matt., Mark, Luke) and in Acts as a divine force or power.” b. the New Catholic Encyclopedia, which says: "The majority of New Testament texts reveal God’s spirit as someTHING, not someONE; this is especially seen in the parallelism between the spirit and the power of God." c. A Catholic Dictionary, which says: "“On the whole the New Testament, like the Old, speaks of the spirit as a divine energy or power.” Did you get al of this? Since the holy spirit is not a person, it can't be the third person of a three-person deity. In other words, there is no trinity!

[@Imperial_Legacy]

@@cbooth151 Since you provided some Catholic references, I’ll share one as well: The Nicene Creed We believe in one God, the Father almighty, maker of heaven and earth, of all things visible and invisible. And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only Son of God, begotten from the Father before all ages, God from God, Light from Light, true God from true God, begotten, not made; of the same essence as the Father. Through him all things were made. For us and for our salvation he came down from heaven; he became incarnate by the Holy Spirit and the virgin Mary, and was made human. He was crucified for us under Pontius Pilate; he suffered and was buried. The third day he rose again, according to the Scriptures. He ascended to heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father. He will come again with glory to judge the living and the dead. His kingdom will never end. And we believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the giver of life. He proceeds from the Father [and the Son], and with the Father and the Son is worshiped and glorified. He spoke through the prophets. We believe in one holy catholic** and apostolic church. We affirm one baptism for the forgiveness of sins. We look forward to the resurrection of the dead, and to life in the world to come. Amen.

[@cbooth151]

@@Imperial_Legacy Is your quoting of the Nicene Creed somehow supposed to cancel out the Catholic references that I quoted which deny God's consisting of three persons? BTW, the Catholic trinity doctrine is based on the Athanasian Creed, which contradicts the Nicene Creed. Consider... 1a. The NICENE CREED says: "We believe in one God, the Father, the Almighty." 1b. The ATHANASIAN CREED says: "[The Father, Son, and holy spirit] are not three Gods but one God." 2a . The NICENE CREED says: "We believe in one Lord, Jesus Christ." 2b. The ATHANASIAN CREED says: "The Father, Son, and holy spirit "are one Lord." 3a. The NICENE CREED says: "We believe in...the Father, the Almighty." 3b. The ATHANASIAN CREED says "the Father, Son, and holy spirit "are one Almighty." 4a. The NICENE CREED says: "We believe in...Jesus Christ, the only Son of God." 4b. The ATHANASIAN CREED says: "[Jesus] is God." 5a. The NICENE CREED says--"[Jesus] suffered death and was buried." 5b. The ATHANASIAN CREED says: "[Jesus] is eternal." [Someone who is eternal can't suffer death and be buried.]

[@EnochSnowden]

@@cbooth151 The Nicene Creed was originally formulated at the First Council of Nicaea in AD 325. And it Teaches That Trinity is the True Doctrine. Your catholic sources New Catholic Encyclopedia is written in 1967. So quoting the Nicene Creed followed by the Catholic Church back then shows your NEW Catholic Encyclopedia is a Lie.

[@cbooth151]

@@EnochSnowden "The Nicene Creed was originally formulated at the First Council of Nicaea in AD 325. And it Teaches That Trinity is the True Doctrine." Not so. The Catholic doctrine of the trinity is based on the Athanasian Creed, not the Nicene Creed. Also, the trinity was invented by two Catholic Councils. As A Catholic Dictionary says: "The third Person was asserted at a Council of Alexandria in 362…and finally by the Council of Constantinople of 381.” "Your catholic sources New Catholic Encyclopedia is written in 1967." So what? I quoted other Catholic sources that agreed with it that that agreed that the trinity teaching is unscriptural. "So quoting the Nicene Creed followed by the Catholic Church back then shows your NEW Catholic Encyclopedia is a lie." Really? How's that?

[@EnochSnowden]

@@cbooth151 The Athanasian Creed is much longer and more detailed than the Nicene Creed, focusing explicitly on the doctrine of the Trinity and Christology. It goes deeper into the nature of the Trinity and Christology, stating more emphatically the need to believe in the equality and unity of the three persons of the Trinity while maintaining their distinct persons. It also discusses Christ’s incarnation and two natures-divine and human-more explicitly than the Nicene Creed. but you are saying that trinity is a false doctrine.. how?