How Weak Are The Death Knights in Hearthstone?

[@Rarran]

You look fantastic! Have a good friday!

[@deefman123]

back atcha Dude

[@kobban63]

I mean guldan did not see play untill kak

[@Ledros]

Could you do similar video but for zuljin hagata Reno and Dr boom?

[@magicspoon2571]

hey Rarran! could you share the anduin decklist please? i wanna try a priest deck lol :)

[@jaydenproctor8405]

Wouldn’t hero power mage pop off..? I think frostlich would make it more brutal by applying life steal and elemental swarm to overpower someone. This makes any elemental battlecries life steal, and I think it’s a second win condition which would freeze meta Aggro decks using weapons of you get late enough to afford her.

[@Iguanoman]

Bloodreaver Gul'dan was actually insane when Cubelock was the meta. Your board could never be empty; just insane amounts of value.

[@edschramm6757]

*internal screaming intensifies* between that and I already had a problem with the raw strength of the hero power they got (I thought it should have been 2 damage, or 3 mana) I thought bloodreaver was busted. And still have a chip on my shoulder about it.

[@MediciMedic]

Cubelock was an absolute powerhouse

[@LordSathar]

Last time the game was fun.

[@michaburtowy852]

My favourite card in hearthstone by far. I Hope Cubelock will come back in wild some day maby with un nerfing possesed lackey

[@Lasgriz]

and combining it with Rin and Man'ari was even making it better! I had a very premium Cubelock deck that made me climb Legend in those good ol' days that I've dusted after 2 years :,,)

[@justinsmeer9539]

Fun fact: Rexar’s aoe has a secret interaction, "the arrows" acquire whatever properties the bow (weapon) he is currently using, like lifesteal or poisonous.

[@cluelessmango768]

I'd imagine that could be because the weapon is giving the hero lifesteal/poisonous and the hero dealing damage to enemies in turn will inflict lifesteal or poisonous. Weapons don't really 'have' lifesteal, rather, they grant it to the hero. If this were the case, I'd imagine any card working in a similar fashion (tamsin, cariel) would work the same way, but those classes often don't have access to such weapons (and cariel replaces the weapon, so it could never work).

[@JJroks543]

Does this interact with Honorable Kill? Maybe you could abuse this to get a giant weapon. Probably wouldn’t be that insane, but if it works that’s a pretty nice combo.

[@alexandrepereira1097]

@@cluelessmango768 There is a card that let u steal other weapon so this could be tested with Tasmin

[@megbreathe4865]

Lokolah might make elemental shaman jaina a thing to bad I have no good elementals

[@EebstertheGreat]

@@cluelessmango768 I think that has to be the case, because weapons don't normally deal damage, the hero does. I mean, Perdition's Blade does deal damage, but most weapons don't.

[@matthewmedina3461]

I think a more accurate title for this is "How Weak Are The Death Knights in today's meta". I think it's fair to compare not their design by today's standards but instead how efficient they were in the meta they were released in versus how efficient the current hero cards are in our meta today. Power creeping has always been a thing in games and that affects the card design alot as the years go on, making alot of old cards incomparable to newer ones. I think a more objective way to view whether each Death Knight was "weak" is by seeing how good they were in the meta they were in because they were surrounded by roughly the same power level of cards. For example, alot of the "weaker" Death Knights in the video didn't really account for the cards surrounding each class during the time that I believe were big factors in the design of the death knights: Warrior had more cards with benefits if damaged, with Rotface, Death Revenant in addition to classic cards like Battle Rage and Frothing Berserker. Additionally, the weapon was great removal because it provided 3 charges of on average 8 damage spread out, or just 12 damage face. Since warrior ran dead man's hand as their answer to fatigue, a slightly more expensive whirlwind each turn enabled cards like the raptor summoner into special armor strong and shiny, blood warriors, Queen Mosh (if I remember correctly they nerfed her to 9 mana because of the hero power Mosh combo), the list goes on if we include other cards from expansions at that time because warrior constantly had these cards that benefited from being damaged. Rogue was especially fun and strong in my opinion because of A. It's ability to grant you immunity for a turn and B. it's ability to copy cards you're normally restricted to only having 1 or 2 copies of. If I remember correctly, thief rogue was popular after the obnoxious quest rotated out so constantly having a way to either easily trigger combos by using the combo card before activating it with the shadow, or by generating extra value with battlecry value gens was very good. Just listing things I think are worth noting. I agree that because of power creeping, the majority of the death knights are obsolete in today's meta but I don't think we could really call any of them "weak" in design. I still loved the video and like how you put your thoughts across Rarran!

[@kobban63]

Gona say this but its king mosh

[@matthewmedina3461]

@@kobban63 my bad! I completely forgot XD For some reason I always thought it was a girl (probably confused with Hunter quest reward wasn't that a girl dino)

[@deejayf69]

Doesn't change the fact they suck now. I'd want to be able to play them again without dying.... Also, I disagree that cards from different time periods are "incomparable". There's been plenty of data back in the day to give you an overview of how good cards were in their heyday. But looking at them today and pointing out the insane power creep which left once-powerful cards virtually unplayable is a topic that's usually only talked about broadly. There aren't many videos talking about iconic cards feeling the ravages of time.

[@boobiedefloop6097]

Terrible opinion waste of typing.

[@blowc1612]

I know this is a year late but he was pretty much correct about the value of the hero cards at the time of play, except for Paladin. Paladin to win with the horseman was really good during its meta. But Mage, Druid, Warlock dominated the meta while Hunter was a aggro deck that allowed you to not completely die if you lost steam and try to find a win condition if your opponent stabilized the situation. No one player Rogue and Shaman was more of a meme especially the option for heroes wasn't that good unless you get Rag.

[@ReformedPsycho]

I really loved Knights Of The Frozen Throne just because of the DK Heroes.. Midrange Hunter with DK was the best deck I have ever played. The fact that you could craft your own minion was just incredible. There were some spicy combos when you mixed some specific beasts. Control Warlock was my favourite deck as well back in the days. It was really good, but it required some skill for sure. God.. I miss these good old days.. :D

[@timson9506]

Let me tell you one thing: when I play wild, I love to play Genn Reno Warlock. And I still use DK card.

[@jonathansong855]

Malygos druid, control priest, death rattle hunter... was so much fun

[@patrickhohmeyer7416]

Funnily Rexxar was not even that good when he came out. Only after they updated the minion pool two (or so?) expansions later and he got access to a lot of lifesteal beasts did he suddenly become good. REALLY good.

[@justinjakeashton]

7/9/11 Lifesteal Rush never forget.

[@Ceracio]

I see what you're getting at, but Cubelock (if that's what you're referring to) was certainly not "the good old days". I remember playing 10 games against the exact same Warlock deck on ladder, in a row. Boring and annoying as all hell to play against.

[@ZedZerdz_]

8:25 you for real?? Deathstalker Rexxar was, from what I remember of his time in standard, THE reason Hunter was so consistently viable. Sure, Zuljin’s battlecry is immediately more impactful, but Deathstalker Rexxar was able to solo against control decks basically. Hunters actually ran both Hero cards in the same deck back in Rastakhan because of this I think basing the viability of these cards in current-day Standard purely off of 1 game in Wild is… a bit of a flawed way to evaluate the true strength of these cards, I guess? But then again, I guess there’s really no other options we can work with

[@Rarran]

Hey dude! It was more a joke, also didn’t only play one game, I just picked the best game for the video, but I agree with everything you said

[@ZedZerdz_]

@@Rarran Guess the joke went completely over my head then…. Uhhh, whoops. I’m at least glad that you don’t base your opinion on a singular match (variance & all that). Do you ever livestream these games/have a VOD or archive channel to watch these all back?

[@oom-3262]

Deathstalker is trash now, tavish is miles better. Wild games are much faster. The only old dks that sometimes see meta play are warlock's, and priest's. You may see the odd pala one too from time to time due to otk shenanigans as a tier 5-ish. Rest are so outclassed its ridiculous.

[@blowc1612]

Hunter at that time was 50/50 its games was winnable but not always. Mage, Druid, Priest and Warlock was the meta at the time.

[@blowc1612]

Paladin was also playable but it was in the same tier as hunter but Mage Warlock and priest were tier 1 at that time.

[@vulcanmemes9770]

It's worth noting, there was a developer interview where they stated Shaman's DK was originally going to revolve around a freeze mechanic. This is further supported by their legendary seemingly feeling out of place with how the kit is supposed to work, essentially becoming the laughing stock of the class legendaries even to this day. I can't recall exactly what the original design entailed but we can hypothesie even by Thrall's VA that it involved freeze effects. I believe they mention his battlecry would have revolved around freezing the board and his hero power would have most likely given him the ability to freeze any minion, which would makes sense and synergise really well with Morabi. But obviously your opponent being unable to do anything to you and your entire mechanic revolving around that for a single class proved really boring so they went with an unexpected evolve mechanic which kinda ended up working? Like Evolve Shaman is fun but it always odd to me how it felt a big inconsistent with the whole DK theme that everyone class shared.

[@szymonj9377]

Yeah and i agree that evolve shaman is fun. im still using it with that hero card and weapon and i like high rolling some cool minions And with my sometimes insane luck it somhow was quite consistent 😃

[@vulcanmemes9770]

Also I forgot to mention this but they also an axe that allowed you to destroy any frozen minion which adds further credence to my theory that it got changed late in the design phase.

[@szymonj9377]

@@vulcanmemes9770 yeah because blizzard was trying to create freeze shaman but they didnt made enough freeze synergy cards in kotft but in alterac valley they gave enough support that freeze shaman became real thing

[@vulcanmemes9770]

@@szymonj9377 I have no experience in game design myself but I would imagine they just didn't have a good concept of freeze that didn't feel like crap for both players. Even now cards like Snowfall Guardian draw the ire of the community because as a whole I just don't think freeze is that interesting of a mechanic, like you denied the other player from playing the game unless they use alot of spells, it feels way too polarizing.

[@szymonj9377]

@@vulcanmemes9770 yeah you're probably right but i was just saying anyway

[@TheAwkwardGuy]

I got Deathstalker Rexxar from a pack, made a face hunter (got it from a Kripp video) and included him, and fucking won against an entire priest deck basically using only his hero power lmao. Genuinely the most cheese-filled experience I've ever had in Hearthstone. Will never forget it.

[@67tedward]

Bloodreaver guldan was so broken when it had access to doomguard. In cubelock you could often summon like 3-4 doomguards for insane burst (not to mention a value board) when you played it.

[@topi2643]

Man the only Hunter deck what i loved is that Spell hunter was with deathknight card

[@phinn8193]

That was my favourite deck in all of Hearthstone

[@tamaszsombortolvaj7517]

And the weapon Rohk'delar (?) from the next expansion, Kobolds and Catacombs? Yeah, I played it that deck too, although I didnt have the Rexxar hero card. :,( Now Im trying to open old expansion decks to fill up the void.

[@crazydef3556]

That's also my favourite deck too) and it is still my favourite... All others decks don't given me that emotions. I missed that good time(

[@kourii]

Man Zul'jin Hunter (I didn't run Rexxar though) was one of my favorite decks

[@omikamiz568]

I love Deathstalker Rexxar, sadly Blizz seem like doesn't want Hunter to have good late game deck and only push for early game face hunter.....which I really hate it.

[@BushSage]

Its part of the whole class identity thing. I do agree that hunter should get some lategame support, but it also comes with the absolute least defensive hero power.

[@satibel]

do you mean death. stalker. rexxar. ?

[@stoyantodorov2133]

Well, big beast hunter is definitely playable right now. Reached legend with it last season so it can't be that bad. Check out Kiblers list if you are interested. That being said, hunter has by far the strongest and least defensive hero power, so a strategy that wins before mid-late game will almost always be the best for the class.

[@bretert]

DS rexxar was amazing for lategame imo

[@BushSage]

@@bretert true, it was, but hunter doesnt have even half as many tools as other lategame decks

[@weedboe3763]

Here as a wild player to note the cards in the current wild meta: The 2 cards that have seen play since forever and have their own win conditions: - Bloodreaver guldan has seen the last amount of play and in the current meta is too expensive to play in the Tier 1 reno-warlock. - Shadowreaper anduin has been replaced with the priest quest for reno priest and therefore bringing an end to the Tier 1 raza-priest deck. The rest of the death-nights see no play, you might play deathstalker rexxar in reno-hunter, ... but reno-hunter is not viable in the wild format. And you addressed the rest in the video already: the cards are too expensive and the current hero cards are just better.

[@Gabriel64468]

I think Valeera got underrated a bit. Copying cards becomes stronger when the cards you have are stronger, totally possible there are some incredible combos with it atm

[@EnderGoku9001]

9 mana tho..

[@RaventhortheWarrior]

Frost lich jaina with wildfires and teckless apprentices would absolutely see play if any relevant elementals actually existed. Varden is broken, so is jaina....at least for standard, I'd think Waaaaaaaay too slow in wild.

[@Lothien32]

Still my favorite hs card ever...

[@mrcx6142]

It's such a shame that Thrall is so weak considering how fun Evolve Shaman is. Also, Knights of the Frozen Throne might just be THE best expansion we ever had just due to the DK Heroes and how much content they gave us.

[@brianpaolercio3388]

One thing that came to mind for me - and it depends on the how the mechanic works - but if Guff permanently sets your max mana to 20, I could see people being Guff for a couple of turns then swapping to Malfurion for the hero power flexibility. There comes a point where Guff's button just loses a ton of value and having the armor / attack may help you close out games.

[@timcal2136]

I agree, ive considered adding Malfurion to my Nzoth Taunt Druid in wild

[@zachariastsampasidis8880]

The ability to have a free card draw is very good though. You would usually go guff into mal only after you have stabilized

[@delirium1326]

I agree on all except frost lich jaina. That dk was so good and would be even better with the hero power enhancements mage has now

[@Rarran]

She might be good enough, only one I was iffy on but varden is probs better than her, 9 mana is a spicy amount of mana

[@szymonj9377]

@@Rarran i know what you mean but if you have good enough amount of control and some good elemental that you can synergize with (like this elemental with corrupt that deals 12 damage) then this card can be quite good Yes varden is better because he's cheaper and in right decks also insane but Jaina is still good imo and im still using her golden version i got from packs

[@satibel]

I know it was fringe but the deal 8 damage to all minions deathrattle ele was pretty great if they couldn't kill you, you'd just nuke the board and heal everything.

[@szymonj9377]

@@satibel well yeah but you know that there is also elemental that deals 3 to all minions as Battlecry which with Jaina buff its simply shamans 8 mana lifesteal spell but 6 mana with 3/3 body

[@szymonj9377]

@@satibel i know you meant it as good board clear but problem with it is that its expensive and you have to kill it to do something

[@godogodo8893]

What do you mean!? The death knights are strong. Jaina, Anduin, Gul'Dan and Malfurion DKs are good. Sure, they got power crept, but that is another story all together.

[@longbow857]

No, that is exactly the story he is telling. Read the description.

[@kabrozkabroz]

@@longbow857 they didn't get power crept WHILE LIVE IN STANDARD. They got power crept after they were moved to wild lmfao. Big difference. These cards were all huge and all saw plat in KOTFT annnnd in K&C, til they were rotated out.

[@breadguytv]

Wouldn't call them weak just the game suffering from insane power creep

[@Abhi-SN]

I haven't played Hearthstone in 7 years and never had any intention of playing it again as a thing called LIFE got in the way lol, but I recently discovered your channel and have been binging your vids like crazy. Just the other day I told myself "Damn these videos are fucking amazing but I don't think I'll play again" cut to me binging a couple of more videos from your channel "Fuck it I'm getting back in". All that was just to say your videos are amazing and I hope you continue to make great content!

[@Rarran]

That’s awesome dude! Thanks for making my day

[@mapmakerlich]

My thoughts about DKs: Warrior: really situative. Board clears? Warrior has plenty. And sacrificing armor stacking didn't worth it. Paladin: OTK was fun. But otherwise... two 1/1 instead of 2/2 sounded better. Even in late game. And lifesteal? Pal had plenty of heal. Mage: Elem mage was good deck. Very good. Priest: we all know about miracle-style damage under Raza. 0-cost hero power, refreshing when you play a card? Totally OP. Druid: overall great DK. Good for control and midrange. Shaman: RNG fiesta continued. Warlock: 1 patch and it went crazy! Hunter: Great card for midrange decks. Totally was worth it. Rogue: Kingsbane arch, guys. Kingsbane arch.

[@illicitbike2782]

If ya don't mind me. I have my thoughts as well that does goes against yours tho. Warrior: was the better control cards we had until it was rotated out and when paired with recruit warrior (which at the time was a tier 1 deck) did insanely good. Paladin: made for a memey OTK if you were able to constantly refresh your hero power. Mage: was the strongest DK in the game considering we had a huge elemental support with Journey to Un'goro Priest: was the best when Raza made it 0 but when it was changed to 1 sadly fell from it's greatness. Shaman: I agree here with it being RNG frenzy but the evolve mechanic was that in general. Hunter: best midrange for hunter that basically handled reigns over control type decks. Warlock: Was insanely good for the meta during Frozen Throne release just fell off after rumble. The patch screwed it over Rouge: Kingsbane and thief was the best thing for it.

[@jaredkuzik3876]

I solely play wild and forgot that standard was a format at all, so this video confused me for a bit to say the least lol

[@67tedward]

Having played a lot of HS back then here's my personal rankings of the death knights at the time: 1. Shadow reaper anduin - allowed for absolutely degenerate level burn in reno priest, got raza nerfed at the time. 2. Malfurion the pestilent - Almost every druid deck (which were op) played this guy, the 1/5s allowed for really good stall and then just gave you a hero power upgrade. Not game breaking but it didn't need any synergy and so it ended up being played everywhere. 3. Bloodreaver guldan - Resummons doomguards and voidlords that you cheated out, excellent finisher, gives a pretty good hero power. 4. Deathstalker rexxar - Pretty good value engine + a board clear in hunter which previously lacked this for the most part. Could let you win value matchups you previously wouldn't have. 5. Frostlich Jaina - Was often played in control mage back then but that deck was not t1 for the majority of its lifetime. Gave really good survivability but overall a really slow card. 6. Valeera the Hollow - Ice block for 9 mana is still kinda playable. Besides stall, was mainly used to duplicate burn cards (or draw to fish for burn) to end the game. 7. Scourgelord Garrosh - The weapon is really good in control warrior but the hero power is not... in fact, sometimes it was worse than armor up depending on the matchup. 8. Uther of the Ebon Blade - Only really good for meme otk decks. Otherwise too slow. The weapon is good but not enough tempo to justify spending 9 mana. 9. Thrall, deathseer - RNG evolves tend to be underwhelming, especially as more and more lowrolls got added to the game. The hero power isn't that good either. Decks using evolve synergy cards like the 5/5 taunt guy that got cheaper tended to come out to slow to be good aggro but run out of steam to fast to be a good midrange deck.

[@macmakmc1894]

They were stronggggg I never want any part of Frost Lich Jaina again

[@edschramm6757]

So one thing to note for Frost Lich Jaina: Wildfire exists. I use her in a wild deck that is very hero power centric, and can force through a 4 damage hero power a few times a game. Sometimes more. And with Jan'alai summoning Ragnaros for 7 Mana, arguably the strongest elemental in the game, it's difficult to die once I've flipped, barring instakill effects like Purified Shard. I had Chef Nomi in an older itteration of the deck, since he summons 6 6/6 elementals when the game is near it's end. Typically I'd do this right after a Dragon caller Alana baited out the holdout sweeper effect in their hand

[@A5ylumPri5oner]

The thing with the mage death knight, is if you increase its damage, you can overkill and still get the elemental, so if your able to play a slower deck, where you pump up the deathknights hero power, you can use it to control the board getting you water elementals and they can keep you healthy enough to keep chugging along the value train.

[@bird3713]

I believe that Blizz acknowledged that the Shaman and Warrior death knights were underwhelming by then introducing Hagatha and Dr. Boom hero cards into the meta. And then they gave Zul’jin to Hunter, just so that Hunter could run two hero cards in their deck, and that was actually really fun.

[@mike_v02]

I really want to play death knight again in standard. Uther was my favorite.

[@MCBlade2562]

I feel like a couple of these didn't age too well lol Uther of the Ebon Blade with Jailer basically guarantees your exodia, Frost Lich Jaina is much better with elementals like Lokholar, Geddon and Neptulon. The rest are pretty accurate though and its interesting to see how much has changed

[@rajkanishu]

what a nice trip down memory lane, those were (almost) the days when playing a 5 mana 2/2 and destroying it yourself the following turn to summon a voidlord on turn 6 was considered extremely broken, now i can get stoneborn general down on turn 2 and still risk losing the game! i definitely like the new cool mechanics we got but the nostalgic feeling 2017 hearthstone gives me will always warm my heart

[@Creepy___]

frostlich jaina mage control was one of my favorite decks of all time and bringing her back with wildfires would be based

[@longbow857]

Yep also my favorite deck I've ever played. It just felt like a fair deck where you actually had some thinking to do to opimise your honourable killing.

[@kobban63]

@@longbow857 i mean horobel kill and kill are kinda not same brain is roting

[@rG1vZ]

@@kobban63 technically if it's only 1 damage it's the same. If it's more then there will be a difference

[@emilemil1]

Good memories. Reno Mage with Jaina was the most fun I've ever had in Hearthstone.

[@blind8478]

I loved playing the Death Knight Paladin OTK-Deck. Basically you played a heavy control paladin with brewmasters and stuff to get the horsemen back to your hand. onve you got 3 different ones in your hand and your hero power summoned the 4th you would OTK your opponent by playing the remaining 3 for 2 mana each and get the "destroy enemy hero"-effect. hillarious and insanely funny.

[@javiermejias6184]

Shadowreaper Anduin is still to this day my favorite card in the game, i have so many good memories playing heartstone back in the day

[@michaeld8705]

Ah such mixed memories of Frost Lich jaina and Shadow Anduin....Loved it when I played it, hated it when my opponent did 😅

[@DaedricDanish]

This man is a master at miscommunication with what the title is and what he actually does in his videos

[@GreatJinZ]

Thrall deathseer might be a meme or worse than Brukan, but god he is the first card I like so much that I have to craft him in golden. He’s basically my first crafted golden card ever. And I still play him to this day in my wild evolve shaman. I just like the evolve mechanic that much to ever craft it golden.

[@deejayf69]

Hey, really enjoyed the video, however, you can't really test the Death Knights in Wild to accurately compare them for Standard. This is especially true for synergistic Hero cards such as Anduin and Gul'Dan, as they would be either incredibly powerful or REALLY bad depending on their support. Playing Raza to gain a 0 Mana Hero Power is such a Colossal difference. It genuinely is the difference between having a reliable OTK finisher or just a meh chip damage tool. Without good demons, Gul'Dan suffers a similar fate. It's also not a good environment since, if you were to be matched against Meta Wild decks, all Death Knights would feel awful to play. The only way to properly test it is to make a custom game against a friend who plays Standard decks. Due to the massive difference in power level, I don't think Standard and Wild are comparable. I'm sure you put a lot of effort into the video. Sorry if this was too negative.

[@SinfulGFX]

The mage Death knight hero is my favorite. It's a bit slow but If you can survive to use it while a decent elemental is on the field then you are set to win. I myself win 3/4 of my games with it. The downside of it is that it isn't good versus fast-paced decks.

[@Nova4891]

Blood Reaver Gul'Dan was great in Fatigue Warlock back in the day. You would summon 2 Voidwalkers for taunt and you would summon 2 Despicable Dreadlords that would deal 2 damage to your opponent's minions. It was such a great deck and I loved playing the mirror match because it came down to who would lifetap less. I think it would see play in standard, don't forget Mo'arg Forgefiend.

[@RaiXYT]

It just heavily dependent on matchups, Frost lich can be comparable with Varden as long you can throw in a lot of wildfire, Shadow Anduin is just Quest Hunter currently. Out of all these death knights I can say that Thrall needs RNG to win the game and Garrosh just get power crept by better cards nowadays.

[@sencher85]

Nice video. Try to build serious decks with old heroes(include Hagatha, Boom, Zul'Jin) and new cards. Also try to build deck with old quests. Could be some un-expected discoveries.

[@tboyswizzal1129]

well I guess we will now see how strong these death knights really are lol

[@BryantDScott]

I don't see anyone mentioning Uther. I remember playing the combo deck with the tiger to deal 25dmg holy fires by digging through the deck with immunities heals and draw. The hero card was simply a secondary win condition against ice block or big armor warrior/druid. One of the more fun decks I've played in hearthstone.

[@ronyheat91]

Once I lost my DK priest Anduin, I stopped playing hearthstone. I couldn't cope with the lost

[@Ganksy_]

I found your content a couple days ago, quit playing hearthstone around 4 or 5 years ago. been binging for two days. And just today, without even realizing... I fuckin redownloaded hearthstone and bought some packs, I'm playing ramp druid now How dare you get me back into hearthstone without me even noticing you sick bastard

[@Rarran]

I’m sorry 😂

[@SeleenShadowpaw]

You made the mistake of not including Desert Hare and Doppelgangster in your Thrall deck. Bogspine knuckles are amazing as well. Evolve shaman is a lot of fun, if not _super_ consistent, but i most certainly wouldn't call it bad :D

[@henchman1366]

Deathknight Priest, Raza unchained, and any infinite spells, my beloved

[@Skeleton43]

IT'S ALREADY BEEN FIVE YEARS SINCE KNIGHTS? JESUS

[@Waddlington]

rexxars death knight was just super fun to play and continues to get more options every expansion in wild, its just such a fun value card that fits into any deck

[@АртёмБесфамильнов]

Raza Anduin is an INSANE combo. You can try a challange: put core cards from this deck (two above and some removal) and all the other cards must come from basic set. Such a deck is still OP.

[@normund8348]

A wild player watching this with intrigue even tho i dont play standard XD

[@MOBBDE97]

Love the posters in the background!!

[@TheStyler2710]

How about a video about "THE BEST HS DECK OF ALL TIME" which features unnerfed aggro demon hunter. I really liked your video where you compared classic cards with their power creeps. I saw some comments saying "Why would you compare them?" "It's clear which card is better" but I understand the idea and really liked that video (part 2 when? 0w0). That's why I'd love to see gameplay of demon hunter when he was first introduced, preferably against a class that's not demon hunter and how he obliterates them. I hope you still have gameplay from that era because I just searched it on KZbin and I couldn't find any early demon hunter gameplay, that's why I thought it would make a good "timeless video"

[@izaiahsundquist6877]

Currently, the Heroes that see play in Wild are Thrall Deathseer, Guff, and Shadow Reaper Anduin. Thrall is played in low tier evolve decks, Guff is broken, and Anduin is apart of the win condition for Reno Priest. Guldan is decent but currently it's a little too slow to see play in Wild. It's still a good win condition if you manage to get that far into the late game

[@NateRox]

I’ve never seen anyone play thrall in wild lol

[@izaiahsundquist6877]

@@NateRox I've seen Corb use it as an option a couple times in evolve shaman.

[@kourii]

Gul'dan still sees play in some Evenlock/Handlock decks. Certainly a viable option, but it's not in every deck (basically depends on if you're running demons worth resurrecting). Some people use Tavish in Questline Hunter. Kurtrus also sees play in most non-Odd DH lists

[@tranquilissekai8613]

Honestly even with the way faster metagame I think Jaina could see play provided there are enough elementals around for her to use. Like "All your elementals have lifesteal" seems really minor on paper but with stuff like Baron Gedon basically being a full heal on legs, the moment DK Jaina got dropped she turned whatever game you were in into a control warrior tier game of attrition where the main winning strategy for the majority of decks was to completely ignore going face and just control the board until the mage player ran out of resources and just decked out. Like everyone complains about Highlander Priest from the Frozen Throne era but at least that deck had the good graces to kill you in a reasonable timeframe. Jaina just turned every game she was in into a horrendous slog.

[@ComissarYarrick]

Deathstalker Rexxar is one of the most fun cards to play in HS, ever. Some zombeasts that you can craft with his hero power are just absolutly batshit insane.

[@poncho9587]

Weirdly enough, Tasmin and Gul'dan go together like peanut butter and chocolate. Tasmin is a good lead in to Gul'dan because it gives a good board clear, draws you extra cards , and the demons that are shuffled into the deck don't pollute the Demon pool if you don't use the Hero Power.

[@Emperorhirohito19272]

Well they do if they get summoned..

[@cluelessmango768]

What you talking about, Tamsin's 3/3 imps definitely pollute the demon pool. I feel like bloodreaver gul'dan and JARAXXUS are a way better match, since bloodreaver guldan is a great middle-man to heal up or create a massive threat which could allow for a turn to play Jaraxxus. You face JARAXXUS, Eredar lord of the BURNING LEGION

[@poncho9587]

@@cluelessmango768 Tasmin's used as another useful board clear for Cubelock. I use both Dark Pact and Sacrificial Pact, and Bloodreaver Gul'dan serves as a huge finisher for a final burst to kill opponents or just to overwhelm them with Taunts. The key is to Soul Tap before Tasmin goes down, by that time you have enough cards in hand that you don't need to use Tasmin's Hero Power. At the very most, i have had only one Imp. Besides, that 3/3 Imp is a lot more dangerous if you Cubed Mal'ganis.

[@AuraXars]

Maaan cubelock and raza priest were one hell of a thing, also malf made jade druid a thing together with spreading plague

[@emmetstanevich2121]

My favorite was easily Rexxar, but that's probably because I was a largely a f2p player when I played, so I always valued these types of cards that allowed me to "cheat" out cards that I might not have in my collection. Sure, prince malchezaar probably hurts more than he helps due to stuffing your deck with legendaries you probably won't be able to use optimally, but without him I wouldn't be able to play with those legendaries at all. That's probably also the main reason I spent so much time playing that one challenge in blackrock mountain with the 30 unstable portals. Ultimately, of course, whizbang is probably the best single card for new/f2p/budget players due to giving you an actual full, synergistic deck that you otherwise wouldn't be able to play at all if you didn't unpack the right cards.

[@Slikk1980]

I would love to see the Death Knights back in standard

[@Raoul9753]

Honestly, the time where Deathstalker Rexxar was around was the only time I really played the game. He was so much fun to play and it felt great to build the perfect beast to help you out. I stopped playing after the Deathknights were rotated out.

[@Taddpole1998]

I wish that theyd release these as hero portraits. Id get them...

[@oterator2861]

9:07 why do you remind Kripp so much suddenly lol especially with that head tilt at 9:15

[@Nirkaz]

I remember playing alot of deathknights cards back then. Funky paladin exodia deck and mill rogue with Valeera were my absolute favourites.

[@TP_Rockstar]

It probably wasn't at release, but I remember playing the rogue hero a lot, as the reflection was just insane with one of the weapons that kept all its buffs (that deck was busted). Also, the warrior hero I remember getting really far with in ladder, in mill warrior, where the whirlwind effect was crutial late game. A lot of your videos have been popping into my feed lately (I don't know why), but what it really has thaught me is that whatever hearstone has become now, Im glad I left it long ago, because the structure it has now just seems...bad. or worse.

[@elegy8187]

Would love to see you discuss Hagatha, Dr Boom, Zul’jin, Reno and the Galakronds

[@shinzanryu1916]

Deathstalker Rexxar is even more absurd when you combine with the questline.

[@blowc1612]

When these cards came out and you were at comic con san Diego they had a full Death Knight theme section with the frozen throne for pics, it was cool i think you got something if you attended, it was such a huge comic con with it being the comic con before Thor Ragnarok and Infinity War other companies brought their A game too. Nintendo, Blizzard, Netflix, Rick and Morty it was one of the best comic con and you didnt even have to attend Marvel and DC Pannels. There were celebrities everywhere, it was a memorable one wnd Blizzard went all out. The following comic cons wasn't that good since Marvel pulled back... And game of thrones hype died down. 2017 was a great year when Stranger Things was also was blowing up. Rick and Morty Season 3 coming out, they actually had the sauce too.

[@gir1456]

I disagree with your evaluation of Frost Lich Jaina's hero power because you forgot to mention that hero power buffs exist. The 1 mana increase your hero powers damage by 1 is an effect that's bound to the player and not the hero itself. So if you swap from your base hero to another hero card it'll keep the damage buff. So dealing 3 damage and summoning a water elemental with lifesteal is better imo.

[@KarstenOkk]

You always would play both Malfurion and Guff in Standard, because the Guff 20 mana effect is a battlecry and not an effect while Guff is your hero.

[@XmortoxX1990]

I've always loved the original DK hero cards. After returning to the game I still own those cards, and got almost all of them (only missing Warrior and Druid Heroes). I even somehow managed to win som Wild matches using a janky evolve shaman with the Dk card. Can't wait to see what Hero card would give to the newaly added Death Knight. I feel something like a corrupted Ner'Zul, The Bolver with the Helmet or Zooval would be perfect IMO.

[@popeks8680]

Frost lich jaina's best decks were things like big spell mage and other mage control decks. Elemental mage was at best a fringe deck, while jaina was a great standalone card, being the wincon for every single control mage deck at the time

[@XoIoRouge]

Could be cool to revisit this as a bracket. 16 players. Each of them choose a hero card from Frozen Throne or Alterac Valley. They cannot choose one that's already been chosen. Up to 8 heroes from each set can be chosen (so once the first 8 Alterac heroes are chosen, no more from Alterac can be chosen). This keeps the math simple and it means players aren't forced to play a hero they don't like (i.e. Thrall Deathseer). Then just randomly pair off each player, format up to you, last hero standing is the winner.

[@daffodillz9182]

8:58 Rarrans deepest moment...

[@lordfinbar]

Scourgelord Garrosh was my free legendary from KotFT. I'm still disappointed about it to this day.

[@zihenghe7462]

The power level of some of the DKs can't be judged in a vacuum or in the current power level. Druid had ultimate infestation and spreading plagues back in days and getting a bunch of 1/5 taunts and later buff them actually was in the meta of druid. So the druid DK actually make a lot of sense.

[@MrJamieVe]

I remember the good old days of KOFT, Exodia Paladin was suuuuper niche, but god damn I loved playing it. Playing Burgly Bully to get coins and then using Auctionmaster Beardo to OTK the enemy was just great.

[@m84winzi]

Uther was actually quite broken and easy to exodia. With the auctionmaster to refresh hero power on a spell you only needed to collect a couple of coins which at the time was easu to kill someone regardless if you started the board empty on your turn.

[@alex2d]

Frostlich Jaina is still one of my all time favorite Hearthstone cards and I wish we could get back to a meta like that one

[@rdogg114]

I will never forgive blizzard for this crime of making death knight hero cards instead of a new class.

[@BackyardDuelist]

What seems cool with druid is you can run both hero cards. Play gruff 1st to for the battlecry then play Malfy when you're past 10 or 11 mana for late game

[@Gidinam]

I still run DK Gul'dan in wild, super strong with stuff like mal'ganis, doomguards, etc etc

[@wrent291]

I feel like with the recent focus on elemental and freeze mages the Mage DK could see play again

[@HopfenMalzify]

valeera is definitly still playable i think. the stealth kinda nullifies the mana cost since your opponent can only buid board or deal with yours. If you don't have board the only option is to build. I don't know if rouge has any good board clear since i haven't played pretty much since the deathknights came out but if they have a decent one valeera can double it up and the value from doubling up your topdeck phase also makes her pretty strong, maybe not as good as rexxar's beast generation.

[@Imperium83]

It would be cool if arena had an event where every class would have one card slot dedicated to a Death Knight for like a week or month.

[@bodbyss]

Lol didn't even try Valeera. I wish they'd reprint her shadow reflection mechanic on another hero because that was fun. There was a fun miracle build with her using unending arcane giants as the wincon that was pretty jank but also hilarious. Your win condition was to turn 1 or 2 arcane giants into a fistful of giants and grind down your opponent with giant after giant after giant of value that he cannot deal with. Or flooding five giants onto the battlefield at once after doing two consecutive vanish turns. Supported by 4/4 spiders randomly popping out of your deck, and keeping vilespines for clutch removals. This shit worked extremely well against slow grindy decks in wild before lots of OTK stuff appeared. Say you have a giant. You'd drop a giant, drop the shadow giant with valeera's unique card, then pick them back up with vanish. Now you have two arcane giant cards and your opponent has no minions. Next turn, do it again: Drop a giant, drop a shadow giant. Pick them back up again with another vanish. Now you have three giants. Did you natural draw your other giant from your deck? Cool you've got four giants in hand. Did you draw a shadowstep and have nothing good to do with it? Wrong, of course you have something good to do with it! Drop a giant, drop a shadow giant, pick one of those bad boys up again to use next turn (the guy you picked up could be two giants next turn, after all) Guess what card also exists? Lab Recruiter. Just go and shuffle three more giants into your deck. Topdeck giants are tight! So you've got four giants in hand and your turn started. You can play these giants for max tempo or for max value depending on what your opponent is doing and what removal he can use. If you play them out slow, your four giants can be eight by making use of the shadow card over four turns. If you wanna go fast, you can dump five giants on the board right now. If you topdeck a giant, go ahead and throw him down too for more pressure. You can do other silly things like use Gral to pull giants out of your deck. Heck, play Gral again! Two Grals! You can use the shadow card to make one vilespine into two removals if you have a combo activator. Here's the decklist AAEBAYO6AgKA0wLXjAMOtAHEAc0DmwWIB6QHhgnEFoK0AvW7AoHCAtzRAtvjAuD6AgA=

[@TooTsaka]

6:33 Tamsinwiches sounds like a pretty tasty card.

[@franhdv1304]

I hope the DK heroes come back someday to standard, maybe with buffs! This is what i'd do: 1) Druid: Summon 3 Scarab/Spiders instead of 2. 2) Hunter: 3 damage instead of 2. 3) Mage: It should cost 8, and maybe give the Water Elementals gain Taunt (Both the Battlecry and the Hero Power ones) 4) Paladin: Oh boy this is a hard one... Make it cost 6 lol and maybe change the hero power for more board presence other than OTK, kinda similar to the Shaman Hero Power. Make the Horseman 3/4 and 4/3 and each of them has something like Rush, Taunt, etc. And maybe you could choose which one you get instead of a random one. 5) Priest; He's fine. Don't change him. Just nerf Raza. I hate Priest. Well, if we don't have Raza, maybe make his HP hit for 3 instead of 2 idk. Rogue: I don't like this one at all. First; Make ir cheaper, like 6-7 mana, and make the Hero Power copy a card costing 2 less (But not less than 1 PLEASE), and maybe you can play a card from your last turn as well (maybe thats a little toxic and annoying but that's what the card is about 7) Shaman: Make his battlecry evolve your Minions to ones that cost 3-4 more, and make the Hero Power cost 1 and refreshable, OR for each time you Summon a minion, you increase your next Hero Power evolve by 1 mana. 8) Warlock: I think he's fine, but standard needs more bigger demons. (BRINGBACKCUBELOCKBRINGBACLCUBELOCK) 9) Warrior: Make it 7 mana, gain 10 armor, make him Inmune while attacking with the Weapon, ignore Taunt (only with the Weapon, to get always the clean hit you want), and the Hero Power should refresh itself when a minion dies (reminiscent of Warpath and Defile) I know they're big changes but I feel like they need it :]

[@timcal2136]

A lot of those buffs are extremely over the top, like the Paladin and Warrior ones. Just because theyre bad atm doesnt mean they should be made mindblowingly op

[@franhdv1304]

@@timcal2136 I don't think so, I think most of them are fine. Maybe some tweaks with the Warrior one cause that's really good. Paladin is almost the same as the Hunter one, except not random. Came up with them while on the toilet lol

[@timcal2136]

@@franhdv1304 the issue it take with the paladin one specifically is the extreme cost reduction. If a hero with ALL of those effects was, say, 8 or 9 mana, that would be an auto-include in basically every paladin deck, but at 6??? It would be undoubtedly the best hero card in the game, and nothing would come close

[@hydra66]

Would you do a vid on smaller card pools (eg post rotation) vs larger card pools (end of rotation, wild) have meant for hearthsone over the years?

[@roguebanshee]

Deathstalker Rexxar was actually fairly bad upon release and for the first couple of weeks of Kobolds and Catacombs since the pool of beasts wasn't as high quality (though you did have access to Bloatbat + Gastropod for a defensive boardwipe). This was in part due to Build-A-Beast not originally utilizing any beasts added after KotFT, but the devs changed that after a few weeks of complaints post-KnC's launch. BAB then got much better when Vicious Scalehide was added to the game in Witchwood.

[@vipuldass2318]

Blood reaver guldsn in a control deck where tou summoned an entire board of those 9 mana void walkers was judt *chefs kiss*

[@willnash7907]

Actually, in wild, Jaina is pretty strong in control mage decks because of the lifesteal swings and interaction with hero power buffs.

[@byeguyssry]

4:20 Not technically. It didn't need to be an exact kill.

[@ethanevans3537]

Elemental Mage with Frost Lich Jaina was actually pretty solid

[@user-bn6ju5ip1i]

I always hated Frost lich Jania. Guldan was my go to for warlock Shaman I had to have that repayable epic evolve card and kragwa for really cool effects. Shaman was gimmicky but I could get insane value off the 0 cost Murloc and unstable evolution on turn 9. Valera I had a crazy jade deck that was fun. Wild is just too wild these days, blizzard should release legendaries like Baku or Whizbang that add effects but limit the amount of Legendaries you can add to your deck.

[@longbow857]

I loved Jaina because I played her xD

[@GaussianEntity]

Frost Lich Jaina is actually nasty once it comes down. You can get the immediate benefit if you can get a corrupted Firework Elemental cost 1 mana (Potion of Illusion). Also with the introduction of Lok'holar, you can come back to full health no problem. The biggest issue is obviously getting there but I do think this card can cost 1 or 2 less without breaking anything.

[@MatthewTheUntitled]

Shaman's DK had such a good adaptation from WoW The identity CRYsis archetype

[@HeadlessClient]

For the brief time I played Hearthstone (which was during Frozen Throne) I lucked out with an Anduin card. Any time he made it to the table I was able to win the game and I was trash at Hearthstone. Never got to try out the others

[@dmoore2525]

Cariel and frost linch jaina are my favorite cards of all time. Hope paladin gets one more good control card at the mini set so I can grind control paladin:)