EVERY* Steam Loco Wheel Arrangement (and why) in 20 minutes! | Railroad 101

Welcome back to Railroad 101 - the educational series where we look at all things that make up the railroad. This time we're looking at steam locomotive wheel arrangements - what they are, why they are, and probably 99% of the varieties that were in the USA back in the day.
Huge thanks to ‪@DynamoProductions-trains‬ for letting me use their footage, and to ‪@guppybob‬ and ‪@WingsStrings‬ for helping with the script, and to ‪@WingsStrings‬ especially for the great graphics!
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[@Antimatter1207]

Hai Hyce, it's that comment you were looking for! They did cut all the Duplexes up. Even the B&O's 4-4-4-4 didn't escape the torch. Also YOU FORGOT THE S2 6-8-6 DAMMIT Jk love ya Mark Great vid as always

[@highball5550]

Hopefully in the next decade we will have a T1 back, which will be exciting. Where she will run is another question entirely.

[@Hyce777]

If you do some math on the S1, we have a 6-8*-6

[@erikunderbar4265]

the WHAT@@Hyce777

[@1982jeepcj8]

But were are building a new one! Hyce I sent you the images I have of the New T1 5550 under construction, she is 44% complete now

[@MattSmith-uw2pg]

the 6-8-6 was different to the 6-4-4-6 on the pensy.@@Hyce777

[@TryboBike]

The reason why steam engines ( and jackshaft electrics ) got leading trucks is mostly because power in those is delivered in pulses. Because of Newton's third, each pulse will be counteracted by reactive force which causes the locomotive to sway left and right. This is the reason why steam engines do so. The faster the locomotive goes, the more likely it is to derail because of this motion. Leading wheels, as name suggests, lead the locomotive onto curves. Trailing wheels mostly support fireboxes, but in tank engines - for which the feature is that they can run the same both ways, the 'trailing' wheels become leading wheels when going forward. Modern locomotives pretty much lost their leading/trailing wheels because electric motors are, in comparison, generating power smoothly.

[@Hyce777]

Great add, my friend! Totally correct.

[@genevarailfan3909]

If the pulses of power being applied to the wheels are what causes swaying/instability, does that mean that geared locomotives are somewhat immune to that? Particularly Heislers, since the power is not only mechanically farther from the wheels, but is also centered in the locomotive and applied to the wheels on both sides at the same time?

[@michaeld5888]

Engines without leading trucks were also known as track spreaders without it being there to more gradually introduce the weight of the engine into the curve. Having a trailing wheel at the back meant the pull bar weight pulled down on to a non driving wheel and in the UK the Great Western in the UK used the 4-6-0 to the end whilst the more common Pacifics elsewhere were notorious slippers. The GWR had fine Welsh anthracite so a long narrow grate was fine. They tried out the Mallet articulation in South Africa and it fouled trackside infrastructure so the Garrett was chosen.

[@goosenotmaverick1156]

Isn't wheel profile something that can be taken into consideration to? Pivoting wheels can be fit more snugly and apply weight more directly downward, hence reducing the spreading affect when compared to the fixed wheels that have a more tapered/conical profile?

[@t1m3f0x]

Trailing wheels on tank engines can also be needed to support the bunker. The BR Standard Class 2 had both tender and tank engine versions, the tender version were 2-6-0s but the tank engines required trailing wheels to support the bunker, so they had to be built as 2-6-2s. I think the reason modern locomotives lost their leading/trailing wheels has more to do with moving the all the wheels on to trucks. The Whyte notation is never used for diesel and electric locomotives if they don't have the driving wheels mounted rigidly to the body.

[@wisconsin_cheese417]

ERROR 4-0-4 SHAY not found (Sorry dumb joke)

[@FunAngelo2005]

The shay technicly count as 0-4-4-0

[@stephenfares5790]

​@@FunAngelo2005wait 1 3-piston engine powers all the wheels. So it's an 0-X-0. Unless it's an articulated geared locomotive and God have mercy on your soul

[@Scarlet_Gh0st.]

[@IAmAnonymyz]

Unless it's a 3 truck Shay then it would be a 0-4-4-4-0

[@metalkidleo]

It was good I liked it

[@KidarWolf]

I think it's easy to tell I like narrow gauge mountain railways because of my adoration of the 0-4-0 dance - I just think it's such a beautifully dynamic and quirky action to watch, it just screams "I'm working HARD" to me.

[@ostlandr]

Read a quote from an engineer of 0-X-0 locos that "If she was hunting back and forth, that was fine- but if she started hunting up and down, you were in trouble."

[@AshishSaxena01]

That 0-3-0 from India was built in Patiala ( a monarch state in colonial India ). This is called Ewing system where a double flanged wheel bears most of the weight of the train and a supporting road wheel maintains the balance. It can take some stupidly sharp turns and it's relatively cheap to build. Two of these systems were built, 1 was destroyed by flash flooding and the other one ( from Patiala ) still lives in the National Railway Museum in New Delhi and operates occasionally. Great video as always, Hyce ❤

[@pietersnackaert]

I like how belpaire's B1A was mentioned in the thumbnail but also said it doesn't fit so he won't talk about it. I'm proud of the factory's we had in belgium just because of that.

[@datguymiller]

It's an 0-4-2-2-0

[@pietersnackaert]

@@datguymiller no, this would mean the unpowered axle is powered, it doesn't fit in that type of wheel arrangement system.

[@oriontaylor]

I wonder if parentheses could be worked into the Whyte system to denote unpowered wheels in the midst of powered ones.

[@Hyce777]

​@@oriontaylorI've seen people do that, calling it an 0-6(2)-0 but that doesn't tell you *where* the unpowered wheel goes. And you can't split the 6 up because it's about coupled drivers.

[@LaPapaMollido]

​@@Hyce777 0-SI(2)X-0

[@antonysmitherson4949]

the "big chungus" but in russian had me lol

[@ovrwhlmd]

KOMRADE, HERE IN SOVETSKIY SOYUZ WE NOT SAY "big chungus", HERE IN SOVETSKIY SOYUZ WE SAY "БОЛЬШОЙ ПИЗДЕЦ (bol'shoy pizdets)"

[@TheMrPeteChannel]

Execute Order 66 likes.

[@RipRoaringGarage]

So I wasnt the only one that saw that! harasho balshoy chungus!

[@KZ1993]

No PRR Duplexes survived the end of steam. The T1 Trust is hoping to fix that and I'm pretty sure the Holding Company that technically still owns the Pennsylvania Rail Road charter wants to know their location.

[@zaklex3165]

Pretty sure the insurance company that holds that no longer cares(imagine being a railroad, merging, then going bankrupt and ending up as an insurance company).

[@KZ1993]

@@zaklex3165 first time reading a joke on the Internet?

[@jamesjacocks6221]

Need some help getting along with folks?@@KZ1993

[@t1m3f0x]

@@zaklex3165 Wouldn't the Pennsylvania Rail Road charter have ended up with Conrail?

[@zaklex3165]

@@t1m3f0x The charter which was issued by the state of Pennsylvania is probably no longer valid, but this is what happened to the Pennsylvania after the merger with NYC and bankruptcy: "After 1976, the Penn Central Corporation held diversified non-rail assets including the Buckeye Pipeline and a stake in Madison Square Garden. The company began to acquire a portfolio of insurance companies in 1988. In 1994, the company reorganized as American Premier Underwriters, a subsidiary of American Financial Group, which continues to operate as a property and casualty insurance company as-of January 2024.[5]"

[@Foxy_Lightning]

I just love our german nomenclature for wheel arrangement. For example: My favorite steam engine ever, the german class 24, is a 2-6-0, or a Mogul. Written in german nomenclature, it is a "1'C h2". This means: It has one leading axle (1) in it's own bogey ('), then three powered axles (C). And it has two cylinders (2) and is superheated (h). I just love how much information gets packed into this classification nomenclature.

[@wildstarfish3786]

Oh so the powered axels are letters instead of numbers then right?

[@Foxy_Lightning]

@@wildstarfish3786 Exactly. Number means unpowered, letter means powered. This way it would also be possible to name that strange loco in the thumbnail. That would be something along the lines of "B1A" probably.

[@Daneelro]

This system originated with the VDEV, the Association of German Railways, which included all state railways of what was then Germany and Austria-Hungary (including the Hungarian State Railways) and some allied countries. However, between the world wars it was adopted all across Europe, and in 1963 even at a global level by UIC (International Union of Railways), and hence was (is) in much wider use than in Germany or indeed in wider use than the US system globally.

[@Foxy_Lightning]

@@Daneelro Oh wow, I didn't know that! A book I have, which features many locomotives from around the world, uses this nomenclature. And.. it's in german of course, because I am from there and I got it when I was 10 or so. So I knew it was the one used in germany, but I didn't know it was this wide spread.

[@Daneelro]

@@Foxy_Lightning Going a bit off-topic, but if you have a well thought-through set of standards and adopt it for a relatively large market, countries not doing the same will feel the need and market pressure to adopt yours. This happened when the EU went ahead with the GSM 3rd-generation cell phone standard back in the 1990s, and it is happening now again with the also EU-introduced ERTMS/ETCS train control system. It is already used on all continents except Antartica, and now even the US feels the pressure. Right now Brightline in the US wants to introduce it on its LA-Las Vegas line, because that is the most economical and technically mature solution, and US manufacturer Wabtec is fighting a losing battle against it, in the hopes of introducing its harebrained GPS-based untested new system.

[@WhiteStar1222]

Yooo the ultimate Hyce video of all time. If this doesn’t become Hyce’s most viewed video, I will make very loud cockatoo noises

[@cameronriccio6050]

Exactly my thoughts

[@creepermaster6193]

Agreed

[@FuelFire]

This.

[@seymoarsalvage]

15k views at only 8hrs in. I say it gonna do well lol

[@silmarian]

Is doing well but nowhere near most viewed yet. I hope you’re practicing! 😊

[@darknut9696]

Bob the Locomotive designer: Ahh yes 2-8-8-2 A pinnacle design. Eric the Locomotive designer *AGGRESIVE SNORTING OF WHITE TALC* YESssssSSS!!!! 2-8-8-8-2 *SNORTS MORE TALC* EXCELLENT! Hyce: why are you like this? Eric: *Snorting in the afterlife* Wuh?

[@LunaGen-eh1ws]

More like: ALL THE FUGGING POWER AND DRIVERS WE NEED!!!!!!!!!

[@steeljawX]

And yet it was after the triplex that they learned they needed to stop. I don't know if it's just internet garbage of if they were really proposed, but I've seen designs/blueprints of a quadplex and a quinplex as far as how to arrange the drivers and they didn't look good. The fact the triplex failed means that Hyce got to keep his sanity that much more intact. I mean some of these designs I've seen have drive wheels on the tender (as in they realized the triplex was the most they could get on a chassis and that the only room left on what was technically the locomotive was the tender.)

[@nicholasstanton9575]

More like the 2-8-8-8-8-2

[@phoenixarian8513]

Triplex has got absolutely awesome pulling power but its boiler is so small compared to it that it hardly runs 10 mph before losing pressure. Only good for shunting and it's too big to get into spur lines, thus sucks. For a mainline locomotive you have to get a big firebox and for a shunter you need to be small enough to be flexible. Thus big boy is better for mainline and 0-4-0 0-6-0s are better for shunting.

[@LunaGen-eh1ws]

@@steeljawX more like they learned to stop after the PRR and B&O duplex's stunts

[@oriontaylor]

Some fun facts from out east: the NYC Lines had several 0-8-8-0s they used as dedicated hump engines, which replaced some earlier 0-10-0s, while their Lake Shore & Michigan Southern subsidiary had a brief but torrid affair with 2-6-2s in the 1890s and 1900s for Prairies with extremely large drivers for their top passenger and mail trains. They tried out some high driver 4-6-0s but really didn’t like them and did not want to leave the Prairies.

[@adalbertbuchaniec1199]

PKP(The Polish State Railways) had the OKz32, a 2-10-2 tank engine that ran trains to and from Zakopane in the Tatra Mountains. One survives in Chabowka at the Skansen Railway Museum

[@AnimalsVehiclesAndMore]

"Darkness" from History in the Dark said that the Belgian Type 3 locomotive "clearly throws the Whyte notation completely out the window."

[@ArxCyberwolfPC]

The *BELGIAN QUADRUPLEX LOCOMOTIVE*

[@steakthedoggaming5333]

I'll just note that there were a whole two classes of 2-10-10-2s. The ATSF ones were bad, but the Virginian Railway had a real good class of em for pulling Coal Drags.

[@christopherspringer2764]

Love the video, and very glad that you gave the 4-10-2 the attention that it deserves. The 4-10-2 Southern Pacific's are probably my favorite because they are actually 3-cylinder engines, which give them a unique exhaust note, and an absolute butt ton of power. They were used to pull heavy freights up the Cuesta Grade north out of San Luis Obispo and Tehachapi Pass in central/southern California. Another cool thing about the S. P. 4-10-2's is that they were also very good industrial and suburban locomotives, since their wheelbase wasn't very long for a 10-driver engine, and because they were so stable. They used to be seen very commonly running through smaller towns like Santa Cruz, Pacific Grove, and Ft. Ord, CA. The S. P.'s were so nimble, in fact, that they serviced the Monterey Canning Co. directly in downtown and were able to switch their own trains at the cannery, and then hit the main line, which actually saved the business. The Cannery boomed in 1917 when America joined the Allied Powers of WW1. They shipped millions of tins or sardines out of Monterey every day, however business began to slump in the late '20's when the demand for sardines was on the decline, and when the depression hit, Southern Pacific scrapped many of their 0-6-0 and 0-8-0 switchers, leaving the cannery without engines to service it. It looked like it was over for the Monterey Canning Co. until a small fleet of 4-10-2's began servicing the building shortly after. Because of the cheap and expedient transit of sardines that the 4-10-2's offered, the Cannery was saved and ended up being the lead producer of sardines in the world just a few years later in the mid '30's, all the way up until it closed in the 1980's and was transformed into the Monterey Bay Aquarium. Because of the S. P. 4-10-2's, the old cannery building and subsequently the M. B. A. still stands today.

[@Hyce777]

I love those 4-10-2's. Thanks for the commentary :)

[@NEAFarmKid4010]

Also interesting to note the UP had some 4-10-2s before their 4-12-2s. They called them Overlands

[@73Datsun180B]

Did any of the american 10 and 12 couplers have flangeless drivers?

[@ArtyI]

5:10 love the transliteration of ‘chungus’ there. That made me laugh much louder than I should have at 1 am

[@russianbear0027]

Same

[@superbluhedgehog1]

Just wanted to say that I read somewhere that the NYC called the Mountains Mohawks because of the lines not being in the mountains, despite crossing the Appalachian chain (most prominently along the Mohawk River Valley between the Adirondacks and the Catskills)

[@Hyce777]

Makes sense!

[@BrooksMoses]

Yup, and also they advertised their line as the Water Level Route, so not having mountains was rather important to them. But they also gave most of their other locomotive classes unique names too.

[@cjstrader8171]

17:42. My FAVORITE wheel arrangement. Basically the ULTIMATE mixed traffic locomotive in my opinion. Not as big and strong as something like Big Boy or the Yellowstone's, or the GN R-2's and not as fast as something like a 4-8-4 or anything comparable. But it didn't need to be. The Challenger was THE locomotive that you turned to that when the load was inefficient for the bigger articulates, but was also too big for the Northerns, Texas's and anything else that would require double heading on the plateaus. Edit: My favorite Challenger is the Northern Pacific Z-6 Class.

[@caelumvaldovinos5318]

The 4-8-8-2: for when you don't wanna literally smoke your crews in tunnels

[@Hyce777]

Yes but it's actually a 2-8-8-4 just spun on end.... Lol!

[@ThunderClawShocktrix]

and oil fired to solve bringing the fuel lol@@Hyce777

[@cr10001]

Talking about the SP's cab-forwards? Something the Whyte notation doesn't cover is the location of the cylinders (or, if you prefer, the firebox). Very much a 2-8-8-4 running backwards :)

[@azyrin4661]

If I recall correctly, the 2-10-4 is one of the few wheel arrangements with a name specific to Canada. The Canadian Pacific called their T1s Selkirks, for a mountain range they operated over. Interestingly enough (at least to me) they were used in both freight and passenger service on the Laggan and Mountain subdivisions between Calgary and Revelstoke, and the later Selkirks - the T1bs and T1cs - were semi streamlined. I've been able to see all three preserved Selkirks and they're some of my favourite locomotives. I model the Canadian Pacific Laggan Sub in N Scale and would love to have a model of one, however I've only found brass Selkirks in HO scale that are far too expensive for a broke student like myself.

[@dennisfox8673]

It may have been 20 minutes long, but it positively flew past. Excellent work!

[@sambrown6426]

The Virginian also had 2-6-6-6es, they just called them Blue Ridges instead of Alleghenies.

[@Pyrotrainthing]

I won't say people are wrong for calling a 4-8-0 a Mastodon instead of a Twelve Wheeler, I'll just say there's a reason we call a 2-8-2 a Mikado/Mike and not a Calumet. Also calling praries friend shaped is so true! My favorite Prarie at the moment is Argent Lumber Co. Number 5! She's not the most powerful but it looks like she could haul 2 cars at the CRRM and make the Onion Stack look good.

[@frantasramota1359]

18:39 I once drew up a 4-12-12-4 steam engine with two tenders and name it Moma Bear. I dont drink alcohol.

[@Hyce777]

Y u do dis

[@crazynachos4230]

​@@Hyce777Because why not? It's not the job of science to ask if we should do things thats what philosophy is for

[@thomasboese3793]

Is it safe to assume one tender each for oil & water? What type of tenders did you draw? Slope, Vanderbilt, or Standred?

[@jacobwhitecotton]

ok that's it, im gonna draw up an 8-8-8-8-8-8

[@thomasboese3793]

@@jacobwhitecotton Perhaps you should think big as the Russians did, and change all of those little "8" into "14"s. And have each set of drivers powered by 4-cylinders and not just the wimpy 3 like the UPs 4-12-2.

[@jdman1930]

"Oui Oui, Hon Hon" 😂 had me laughing, can't believe you didn't make a joke there.

[@TheInsanebrain247]

I've been mulling over a design for a locomotive with a 4-2-0 wheelbase (yes, for the "420, blaze it" meme), but based on what you've said here, I'm finding myself going back to the drawing board.

[@ostlandr]

IIRC that would be a Pioneer.

[@phoenixarian8513]

This is a Jervis type. This is a small locomotive. Don't expect it to pull much but still good for the sharp curves on the earliest days of railroad.

[@devinfaux6987]

I swear a KSP-like game that let you play around with steam locomotive design would be a hit. All kinds of crazy configurations you can try, and almost as many explosions as rockets!

[@benj.kerman609]

That would be so cool!

[@specs.weedle]

Kerbal Railroad Program when?

[@BaikieRyan]

I feel you should have mentioned two things 1. There’s only two surviving operating Decopods in the US, Great Western (Strasburg) 90 and Frisco 1630 2. Baldwin’s 4-10-2 that was so overkill that no railroad wanted to keep it

[@Hyce777]

I actually didn't realize that there were only the two decapods left. That's cool. 60000 was... Odd. This was not odd train video. Lol

[@BaikieRyan]

@@Hyce777 yes 60000 was very odd

[@steveboguslawski114]

@@BaikieRyan The 60000 combined a 350 PSI water tube boiler with 3 cylinders, and a compound at that. The 3-cylinders at the front needed 4 wheels underneath because it was too much to put above a single axle. It was also too much innovation and it was a pain to service the thing, so nobody bought it.

[@christopherspringer2764]

Yes, the 4-10-2's were big and somewhat overkill. But they were also very effective suburban locomotives and actually helped many small towns grow and thrive because they brough main line freight volume that engines like the 2-8-2's couldn't deliver to lines that bigger engines like the cab-forwards, Northerns, or Texas locomotives couldn't run on. High plains and hilly towns like Prescott, AZ and San Luis Obispo, CA benefitted greatly from the 4-10-2's.

[@ArticTheFox715]

You forgot the SP and UP with their Overlanders for the UP and Southern Pacifics for the SP, Both were 4-10-2 classes, even a SP 4-10-2 is left!

[@SteamKing2160]

For the 2-4-0, they were sometimes nicknamed the Porter after the main builder H.K. Porter Inc. The 4-10-2 was also known as the Overland on the Union Pacific. Also the 2-10-4 was nicknamed Colorado on the Burlington and Selkirk on the Canadian Pacific and the 2-6-6-6 was known as the Blue Ridge on the Virginian.

[@kholdanstaalstorm6881]

The intersection of peak Hyce and peak basic railroad history education, laced with humor and Hyce's brilliant delivery. So the question has been answered, what's the best explanation for railroad interest? This, without a doubt! My wish is that this video gets updates with cards/links to detail explanations for the different wheel arrangements that needs more information, whether it's historical, technical or a mix.

[@ardsleytank7769]

Hey hey hey, you can't just skip the wheel arrangement made famous by the first mass-produced locomotive - the 4-2-0 or "Jervis", popularized by Norris of PA. But I jest, fantastic video sir. Most informative, and to the point!

[@AllisonChainz3718]

Some fun facts about my home railroad, the Boston and Maine organized by wheel arrangement. 0-6-0s: 2 of the 4 B&M engines currently on display are old 0-6-0 switchers, restored after being bought back from a quarry in Westford Massachusetts. 2-6-0s: The B&M kept these in rural branch line service until the end of the steam era. In fact some parts of rural New Hampshire are called mogul country due to the use of these little engines for there local freights and commuter service. 1 has been preserved for display. 2-8-0s: The work horses of Boston & Maine freight. Despite their usefulness, many got scraped during the depression, a decision that lead the B&M to have a power shortage during the 2nd world war. 4-4-0s: The B&M kept these until the end of the steam era and modernized them as they saw fit. A common trend for the old B&M, they would start with an old bare bones locomotive and over time add on things like steel cabs, electric lights, piston valves, and even super heaters. 1 American has been preserved for display. 4-6-0s: They never really found their place on the B&M's rails. They were an awkward middle ground between light moguls, fast trailers (atlantics), and powerful consolidations. they didn't survive till the end of steam, all being scraped in by the late 30s. 2-8-2s: Huh, that's an odd wheel arrangement. The B&M never bought any of those, they leased some from the Erie railroad in the 40s, but when the lease expired they were returned and never seen again on B&M rails. 2-10-2s: The mudsuckers. The B&Ms first line of super powered steamers. The story goes that when under load they could generate so much suction in the boiler it would suck the mud out of the mud ring in the boiler and shoot it out the stack. Ok that may be a case of little engines, big lies (or big engines in this case) a more likely story is since they were the first stoker fired engines on the B&M, the name comes from the coal which would have to be small, dusty and lumpy, almost like mud in order to work with the stoker, though you have to admit the first story is funnier. 4-4-2s: Called trailers on the B&M as they were the first locomotives with trailing wheels to ply their rails. They were used to haul passenger trains, though there is some photographic evidence that when the Boston and Maine got desperate for power they were pressed into freight service as well. 4-6-2s: When these came around they displaced the older trailers in mainline passenger service, and became such a common sight in passenger service they were called the Budd cars of the steam era. Some of these engines had the distinction of being named by local school children, some examples are 3710 Peter Cooper, 3713 The Constitution, and my personal favorite 3718 Ye Salem Witch. Currently 3713 The Constitution is being restored to running condition in the Steamtown USA shops, though when that project will be completed, if ever, is unknown. Also another pacific, 3666, has the distinction of avoiding the B&M scraper by diving head first into a river. A wheel set that has since been dredged up has been preserved as a memorial to the incident and the rest of engine remains at the bottom of the river to this day. 4-8-2s: These were the last new steam locomotives bought by the Boston and Maine, and also had the distinction of being named by local school children. Again some examples 4100 Endurance, 4110 Calvin Coolidge, and 4115 Casey Jones. 2-8-4s: Ah the damn Limas, named after the company we got them all from. While by no means exclusive to the B&M limas, they are know for their massive externally mounted coffin feed water heaters, a look that some people hate, but I personally love, and it is a style that the B&M personally exported out west to the Santa Fe and Southern Pacific with the sale of many of their limas to those railroads. A common misconception about trailing trucks is that they are articulated independently from the rest of the locomotive, this, more often then not, is not the case. While at first glance this may seem like a good way to help negotiate curves, it causes more problems than it solves. Namely it causes the trailing truck to get pulled off the rails frequently, as well as putting a lot of extra stress on the firebox. Feel free to ask the Boston and Maine how we know. 2-6-6-2s: The B&M got these for helper service through the Hoosac tunnel. They were oil burners as it was thought that they would generate less fumes. They only lased a year however as the tunnel was electrified and last I checked no fumes is less the however much fumes an oil burner puts out. The 2-6-6-2s were sold to the Maine Central up north. If you found this at all interesting please check out the Boston and Maine Historical Society for more information, you can find them right here on KZbin. And if you found this overly long and boring well... blame Hyce thanks to watching his channel I got curious about my own area and found the B&M, learned about them, and felt the need to info dump all over you with the knowledge I gained about an old class 1 that tends to go under the radar. (Which considering its location is probably more of a blessing than a curse. Northeastern railroads that are noteworthy tend to get that way by failing epically.)

[@svenofthejungle]

I freaking love your channel! Between you and Hyce, I get my choo-choo fix on the regular.

[@pclassproductions228]

Just a bloke from Australia here to say we had 4-8-4 + 4-8-4 garrets down here.

[@mattburke1869]

One day, I'll fly over to see 6029... One day...

[@glipglop1545]

hey hyce i dought you remember me but i was that kid at Disneyland on the train with the steam train phone case it was amazing to meet you and i hope we meet again one day!

[@Hyce777]

Hey man! I watched you subscribe. Was fun to talk to you and your mom! Check out the School of Mines in Colorado. ;)

[@leightonmoreland]

@@Hyce777leading another person down the path of mines and the museum

[@mikes47jeep]

the T1 trust is in the process of building a brand new T1, the PRR madness will roll again!!

[@Mereel9212]

I prefer the UIC system ,cause you can make out if an axel is powered or not 4-8-4 --> 2'D2' . And it can be easiely used on the oddset designs.

[@jameschase11]

Fs in chat for all the geared locos that got cut from the vid. Completely understand why you had to, especially since Shay also couldn't put down the whiskey 😂

[@windusbindo]

wait... aren't shays just 0-4-4-0s?

[@IAmAnonymyz]

Or 0-4-4-4-0's. Remember there were 2 truck and 3 truck Shays, then you have the post-patent expiration Shays called the Willamette which were superheated Shay - Types

[@jameschase11]

@@IAmAnonymyz Shay also made the 0-4-4-4-4-0's. A 4 truck engine that could pull the world

[@IAmAnonymyz]

@@jameschase11 ah! The Western Maryland! hadnt seen THAT one until I looked it up. Bet that thing had ALL the Torque lol

[@IsaacDaBoatSloth]

the utter madlads of a railway in london made a decapod tank loco to get a grant to them instead of an electric train co

[@DC4260Productions]

I know the one; that's the Great Eastern Railway A55 class.

[@00Zy99]

Can I just say that I LOVE the description of the Patiala State Monorail? "Which, inexplicably, is perfectly fine and still runs" Love it. Just LOVE IT.

[@Narrowgaugefilms]

Forneys are easy: either "0-4-4T" or sometimes "2-4-4T" in what's often called a "modified Forney". Where it gets interesting is the very first of the Maine Narrow Gauge Forneys were originally built with the pilot and headlight on the "trailing truck" end and meant to be operated with the smokebox in the "back". Not only were these engines technically 4-4-0Ts, they were actually early cab forwards. Even though they did operate very well this way, not very long after they entered service, they were flipped to 0-4-4T. Apparently even by the 1880s, there was a pretty strong expectation of what a locomotive was supposed to look like at the front of a train. The 0-4-4Ts had a reputation for hunting back and forth between the rails when running "forward" and it got worse with speed. They didn't twist back and forth on the track the way an 0-4-0T would have because the 4 wheel trailing truck did a lot to stabilize them, but they had a habit of going from one side's flanges to the other riding the railheads. None of the Maine Two Foot engines ever became very far from general purpose, but some were more oriented to passenger service and got larger drivers and leading trucks. The later 0-4-4Ts were more closely dedicated to freight and mixed train service. All this hit a limit: the largest Maine narrow gauge engines were 2-6-0s and later 2-6-2s with tenders. There was talk of 2-8-2s, but at that point a lot of easing of curves would have been needed. There was a further development of the largest 2-6-2 design which went to South Africa as a 4-6-2 and is alive and well in Wales today. Personally I thought they missed the mark by never building a passenger 4-4-0 with tender and large driving wheels, but by the time such an engine would have been needed, "4-4-0" was considered an obsolete wheel arrangement. Even though, It would have allowed their longest run without taking on water along the way.

[@cr10001]

Er, no. If the South African locos you refer to as being 'alive and well in Wales today' are the Welsh Highland's three NGG16 class, those are Narrow Gauge Garratt 2-6-2+2-6-2's, built by Cockerill (Belgium), Beyer Peacock (originator of the Garratt type), or Hunslet. Nothing to do with Forney. The Welsh Highland also has K1, the very first Garratt ever, an 0-4-0+0-4-0 that was built for Tasmania and was bought back by Beyer Peacock for their museum when the railway closed. If there is a 4-6-2 narrow gauge loco of South African/American origin in Wales I'd like to see a reference.

[@Narrowgaugefilms]

Er, yes.... The railway is Brecon Mountain Railway, the locomotive is number 2, a Baldwin built 4-6-2 built in 1930 in Philadelphia. She was exported to South Africa for the Eastern Province Cement Company. After she was damaged in a wreck in the 1970s, she was bought as scrap and then imported to Wales for restoration. Based on the Sandy River and Rangeley Lakes-style caboose they built to travel with her, the resemblance to the Maine tender engines has not gone unnoticed! kzbin.info/www/bejne/ZqWVZJuphLiXgs0si=GCbIeVrbmBcnMHj0 If you look in the "BMR Locomotives" section of their website, it seems they have plans to build two brand new reproductions of SR&RL locomotives #10 and #23 and have already re-gauged a former 30" gauge Baldwin 2-6-0 and converted her into a 2-6-2.

[@PadraicORegan-to1cp]

0-4-2 was a common wheel arrangement here in NZ. The 0-4-0s had a habit of 'wagging their tails' so an addition truck was put underneath the can of the locomotive

[@cacanovotny]

In Czechia and Slovakia (formerly Czechoslovakia) we have a lovely system for creating the class of the loco based on the wheel arangement (although it cares only about live axles), max speed, axle loading called Kryšpín's system and it also contains a system for classing the tenders based on amount of water and coal it can haul (even though that's not translated to the English Wiki page). I think it's quite interesting system that tells you a lot about the Loco purely based on the class it is.

[@JPofCT]

I feel like there's one wheel arrangement you didn't mention that deserves to be brought up: the 4-2-0. While no examples are particularly impressive looking and they were outdated by the 1860s, they were a key step in American locomotive designs. Prior designs were typically 2-2-0s or 0-4-0s based on British designs, but it was found that they had trouble navigating rough American track as opposed to the straighter and leveler track of Europe. The solution was to fit a 4-wheel truck in the place of the lead axle of a 2-2-0. Many American railroads would have at least one of them as their first engine.

[@phoenixarian8513]

Yes. The jervis type had an answer for the sharp curves.

[@sthomas6369]

4-8-4s are Poconos because the Delaware, Lackawanna & Western said so!

[@amtrakproductions-mx9ib]

You forgot this: the Santa Fe railroad actually adored the 2-6-2 prairies, they really really loved 2-6-2s, in fact they have 15 surviving 2-6-2s today

[@Midwest_Urbanist]

The REAL "The GN would like to know your location" locomotive is the 2-6-8-0

[@donovankillian1532]

Always makes me happy to see the triplex get a mention/shoutout. It’s the “what if we took the idea even further just to see what it does” kind of energy that I thrive on.

[@NicholasAdkisson1025]

The Pennsylvania called and asked why you needed anything other than a 2-8-0.

[@ostlandr]

Dear Pennsy: Did you maybe forget about that twelve miles of 1.8% ruling grade Westbound from Altoona to Gallitzin? Which trip brings you to the 1.45% grade of Horseshoe Curve? NS is still using helpers there- currently SD70ACUs (SD90MAC rebuilds.)

[@sbmallik2]

Excellent presentation while aligning the facts. While growing up in Eastern India I witnessed 4-6-2 steam locomotives for passenger and 2-8-2 (larger cylinders) for goods hauling on 5’6” Broad Gauge. 👍

[@mikebirkett010]

The Riddles 2-10-0 Standards in the UK used non flanged wheels in the centre pair and reduced flanges on either side to allow them to cope with tight curves. The 9F was probably the best (and last) steam loco ever built in the UK. 1960, Evening Star.

[@davidty2006]

theres also a 2-10-0 version of the austerity 8F.

[@phoenixarian8513]

Chinese class QJ (it's 2-10-2) also have blind (non flanged) wheel as the middle driving wheels.

[@JohnSmith-of2gu]

Learning how leading wheels function as an extra truck that moves the locomotive's pivot forwards and greatly improves stability was very cool!

[@Blondihacks]

Fantastic info! I learned a lot. Canadians had yet still different names for many of these 😄 Your Texas was our Selkirk and so on 😄

[@Hyce777]

Thanks Quinn! Yeah; I tried to include a few of the Canadian names I had heard before, but I honestly hadn't heard those! :D always fun to learn something new. I guess more than just machining from you this time!

[@G60syncro]

Also, our Hudsons were Royal!!

[@nozyspy4967]

Brilliant video! I never knew that American locos got so bonkers.

[@sambrown6426]

I'm not sure how true this is, but I've been told that with Whyte notation, the suffix "t" specifically denotes the locomotive having side tanks, with other types of tanks having their own suffixes, such as saddle tanks being st, well tanks being wt, crane tanks being ct, rear/back tanks being rt, etc.

[@KidarWolf]

I've likewise seen st used for saddle tanks, this does track true with what I've read as well.

[@theimaginationstation1899]

Whyte didn't address tank locomotives. The T, ST, WT are later affectations.

[@sambrown6426]

@@theimaginationstation1899 That makes sense

[@oriontaylor]

PT is also commonly used to denote pannier tanks.

[@sambrown6426]

@@oriontaylor And C is often used for camelbacks.

[@vladthe_cat]

4:00 more drive wheels means more points of contact, as you said, to spread the weight out, but this also has the benefit of more friction with the track, which is definitely a part of the "useful way" that you stated

[@awildjared1396]

5:03, the 4-12-2s were good locomotives and they did what they were designed to do, they could run over sherman hill just fine, they were the easiest locomotives to fire of any UP motive power, and they lasted generally close to 30 years in service, their main drawback wasn't their wheelbase, it was the inside cylinder. Also prior to the 9000s UP owned a handful of 4-12-2s, piggybacking on SP's order from ALCO and calling theirs "Overlands" after the Overland route, and thus were the testbed for the 4-12-2s. UP basically just rang up ALCO and said "Hey, these are great... but add another driver, this funky british valve gear, and a boiler the size of a grain elevator." And also, like GN, UP also owned a lot of bull meese, starting life after the 1st world war as compounds, they were converted to simple articulateds and continued operating until the 40s and 50s, longer than the 9000s by just a few years.

[@Hyce777]

The 9000 really deserves its own deep dive video. They're bloody cool.

[@BrooksMoses]

Yeah, the UP decided to convert their three-cylinder 4-10-2s to two-cylinder, so presumably on those they figured the extra cylinder wasn't worth the bother. (SP kept theirs as three-cylinder.)

[@awildjared1396]

@@BrooksMoses Once UP got the 9000s there wasn't really a point to having locomotives like the 4-10-2s since the 4-12-2s could haul heavier fast freight, and the 2-10-2s were already doing helper service, so it kinda just made sense for UP to simplify and downgrade their 4-10-2s to just blend in with the 2-10-2s.

[@ostlandr]

Funny how the Brits seemed perfectly capable of dealing with the maintenance requirements of three cylinder locomotives. Likewise locomotives that proved perfectly satisfactory in other countries, specifically the Diesel-Hydraulics, failed in the US. "Unsatisfactory in mountain service." Doesn't Germany have the Alps?

[@BrooksMoses]

@@ostlandr To be fair, the real issue with the Diesel-Hydraulics was "difficult to get serviced properly in shops staffed with people who are used to EMDs and GEs and basically nothing else." And, meanwhile, the Brits were already experienced with maintaining lots of locomotives with inside cylinders and all the clambering into the machinery with an oil can that's involved in doing that.

[@G60syncro]

Another cool nugget of CPR steam history is they had the only articulated locomotives in Canada. 6 locomotives built in 3 different classes of a 0-6-6-0 wheel arrangement were tried in the rockies to handle the steep grades. the locomotives were built by Angus with their cylinders towards the middle of the loco, so the forward set would be running in reverse relative to the back one. Eventually, better road power and track realignment made these engines obsolete. They ended up being rebuilt as straight 2-10-0 switchers for transfer service. For those not in the know, a transfer run in a big city like Montreal in the 30-40's they had smaller yards like Hochelaga near the port where basically whole trains would be filled with goods coming from ships or and other yard near the industrial district. That whole train would be pulled back to the main yard at Saint-Luc to be broken up and dispatched to various trains going different places. Conversely, you could get various grain car lots from various trains assembled into one consist heading for the port. None of these moves required speed, so a loco with lots of traction fit the bill!! This is the reason you might see 0-10-4 or other weird wheel arrangements like that... They might just be the by-product of an old road locomotive being demoted to switching duties and the rebuild job ditched the lead truck.

[@TheMrPeteChannel]

The 0-6-6-0 in semi-officaly called the Angus.

[@crazyguy32100]

The bit with the AA20 was true class. In Soviet Russia derailments find you!.

[@Alcochaser]

There was one order of locomotives with no leading truck, but a trailing truck. The Union Railroad 0-10-2 A result of turntable restrictions. Had a tender booster too (which tender or trailing truck boosters didn't fit the Wyhte notation ether)

[@MainlineThruTheRockies]

Quickly wanna dispel a common myth about what the D&RGW called their 4-8-4’s. A lot of sources say they called them “Westerns”. While that’s an amazing name and I love it, it was simply a foamer name made up for them that the railroad didn’t use themselves. The class designation for the 4-8-4’s on the Grande was the M class, M-64 and M-68, which was the same letter as their 4-8-2's, M-67, M-78, and M-75, so its likely they called their 4-8-4's "Mountains", which….is a choice

[@patricksheary2219]

So enjoyed this latest 101 episode Mark! Excellent descriptions of these wheel arrangements. I’ve been trying to figure out why some of these existed and, as always, you answered my questions. Thanks Professor for another fab class of learning and fun. As always looking forward to the next episode and cheers to you!

[@slanderedstone]

Denver salt lake 2-6-6-0 gobbleeeesss! This video was a fun one :)

[@JDSmalley-ct2uh]

Thank you Hyce. That was the best Presentation of Wheel Arrangements I've every viewed.

[@guy_called_Odin]

@Hyce: you of all damn people should know that separating railroaders from their alcohol is a really damn dangerous and downright suicidal task. Some people be like: "Don't tread on me." Railroaders be like: "don't touch my booze."

[@Enjoy_my_1st_Amendment]

My father worked UP and sometime in the 90s, either the Big Boy or the Challenger was coming through Poplar Bluff Mo. under its own steam. Dont know where it was going or where it had come from. I was about 10 years old and dad had been working for UP for over a decade by the 90s and worked out of Poplar Bluff. So he took me up to the see the Steam Engine and it was special. With dad working for UP we got to go up in the cab while it was stopped on the line and had a great tour of the engine inside and out. Never ever forget that experience, the latter to the cab from a ten yearold's perspective was a mighty exciting climb.

[@nicholasresar]

Look, the Water Level Route can't have a Mountain type. And since Whyte was a New York Central employee, I think they can rename something if they want.

[@Hyce777]

That's very fair, lol!

[@theinternaut1991]

I've seen Chesapeake & Ohio's Allegheny at the ford museum, it was what got me to be so interested in railroads & locomotives. So at least that one is still around.

[@sawspitfire422]

11:41 Here in the UK the GWR made many 2-6-2T engines both big and small because they could run just as quick in reverse. Useful on branch lines that wouldn't have a turntable at the end, of which the GWR had many with some pretty fearsome grades. I took a ride behind a large prairie at the GCR railway but frankly the ride was awful, the coach was shuddering forwards and backwards quite forcefully. Not sure if it was because of uneven power distribution along the stroke of the steam engine or a result of hunting oscillation which the prairies were quite famous for. Or something else entirely

[@cr10001]

I read somewhere that GWR two-cylinder locos were prone to longitudinal surging on light trains. Something to do with long cylinder stroke. I do know that at Brockenhurst (on the Southern region) once, just once a GWR Hall 4-6-0 turned up on a train and I noticed the same thing, strong fore-and-aft surging. Never noticed it with a BR or a ex-Southern engine. 2-6-2's were also subject to lateral oscillation (so I've read) because, being symmetrical in their weight distribution, they were 'balanced' in the middle, so more prone to waggling about that point, but this would be a different issue from the surging.

[@them3497]

Every time I hear Allegheny I recall the Allegheny railroad dispatcher that wanted a freight haul to tie down on an uphill grade because they were almost at their permitted hours of operation and what a cluster that entire conversation was.

[@aritapper4279]

The other thing to remember about the Yellowstones, especially the DMIR ones, was that they never really went that fast in the first place so the theoretical instability is less of an issue compared to the way the UP was running the Big Boys, namely across long distances at speed.

[@rivitedrailfan]

I was pretty excited about this video, and it was just as great as I’d hoped! Great video, Mark! Also, fun facts about wheel arrangements on the Illinois Central for anyone interested: The IC had Santa Fe’s that they called “Centrals” as well as having the only Hudson ever built for specifically freight. Lastly, the ICRR never upgraded to the northern types, but had some of the largest mountain types built on fast long distance freight.

[@DraketheRailfan]

Hey, Mark! The Southern Pacific would like to know your location because they want to ask you why you didn't include the cab-forwards. I'm sure they just want to talk it out peacefully...

[@Hyce777]

:P tell those guys that they're basically backwards 2-8-8-4's and that their lead and trailing trucks didn't fit the overall lesson I was teaching.... Lol!

[@DinsdalePiranha67]

I was about to say this, but then it occurred to me that most of the cab-forward AC's were basically a Yellowstone running in reverse.

[@cr10001]

@@Hyce777 The Whyte notation doesn't distinguish cylinder locations (or firebox) but maybe they should be called 2-8-8-4B's (for 'backwards' :)

[@LunaGenYT7905]

The Whyte system is 124 years old, I did some quick math for that. Quick stupid fact, the P&R (Philadelphia & Reading) had 0-12-0's with tenders for pusher service that I believe were turned into 2-10-0's (don't quote me). Another fun thing about the 6-8-6 (the ONLY one that BLW(Baldwin Locomotive Works) made) was supposed to be a 4-8-4 but was turned into a 6-8-6 because of the heavy metals used to make the flipping thing

[@Johndoe-jd]

So will we get a short follow up video about wheel arrangement on diesels since they don’t use Whyte Notation?

[@michaelmoses8745]

Seconded

[@philtheairplanemechanic]

Gonna be honest, that's not going to be nearly as interesting. The UIC or whichever uses the letters A/B/C/D for number of letters per one bogey. So a two axle four wheel switcher would be A. A two bogey six axle like the modern diesel road switchers is C-C. A monster like the DD40 would be D-D. There's just less variation and it basically is just, how many axles does it have and how many bogies if any.

[@Hyce777]

Probably a good idea to do, but yeah, usually pretty simple.

[@JonBerry555]

Some diesel mechanical locomotives wheel arrangements can be expressed via Whyte Notation as 0-4-0DM and 0-6-0DM. As they have only driving wheels, and some (such as the British Rail Class 08) had connecting rods like steam engine. Does not mean Whyte Notation was used for them, but it can be fun to translate to different notations.

[@TheHandgunhero]

Here in Queensland our locomotives were classified in an entirely different system as such: X is a capital letter to define number of drivers or tank engine (A = 4, B = 6, C = 8, D = Tank Locomotive) and two numbers which denote the cylinder diameter in inches. If you made a second class with a driving wheel arrangement and cylinder size then you doubled up the letters to denote that it's a newer class. Our most successful locomotive was the C17, a 4-8-0 which had a cylinder diameter of 17 inches. We ended up making 227 of them as they were so successful for freight and mixed trains (mixed trains were common here until the early 1990's.) 25 remain in service. Another really successful short lived locomotive was the BB181/4, a 4-6-2 which was the second locomotive series that had 6 driving wheels and a cylinder size of 18 and a quarter inches, becoming the least steam locomotives built in Australia being used from the early 50's until the late 60's for passenger use.

[@garysprandel1817]

Chicago Great Western: hello we'd like to haul the entire contents of our Olwein Iowa yard to Chicago in one train. We'd like use 10 or 12 F units but those aren't available yet what have you got? Locomotive salesman slaps side of Texas class. Loved the descriptions under the wheel arrangements but the triplex almost made me blow a mouthful of peach edition Red Bull through my nose.

[@flickcentergaming680]

Do you mean Oelwein? Iowa's German influence made spelling the names of some of our towns HELL.

[@astromancer5370]

One time a friend challenged me to name every train. That evening I sent him a PowerPoint of every wheel arrangement, their basic properties, and pictures. This video is practically a better version of that presentation and I love that.

[@bloopbloop9687]

I kind of wish you went into more detail on some of the arrangements, particularly the 4-12-2, and basically all the articulated and duplex drives

[@Hyce777]

They're super neat, of course, but this was an overview, not a dive. :)

[@bloopbloop9687]

@@Hyce777 is there more of a deep dive planned at some point down the road? Maybe a 101 sort of video?

[@nicholasstanton9575]

One UK locomotive that had 2-10-0 wheel configuration was No. 92220 _Evening Star_

[@dylanhackbarth6390]

whats the story of the 2-6-6-6 class action?

[@Hyce777]

That was a Wings & Strings detail add that I'm not sure of.

[@jimjensen230]

Great, first thing in the morning, and I get rabbit holed. Turns out to be quite a story. Lima under reported the weight of one of the classes and crew wages were based on weight on the drivers. If I read it correctly it was basically wage theft. C&O paid the back wages, then sued Lima for 3 million in 1944 to recoup the losses.

[@paulw.woodring7304]

@@jimjensen230 And that was the beginning of the end of Lima.

[@BrooksMoses]

Arguably the beginning of the end of Lima happened three years earlier, when the War Production Board said that nobody but EMD got to build diesels until the war was over. But, yeah.

[@paulw.woodring7304]

@@BrooksMoses Lima also stubbornly stood by steam after the handwriting was on the wall. If you look at their advertising to potential railroad customers in the era they talk about steam just being another "unit of power" or something like that.

[@GrantDolanMusic]

I feel like this does a better job explaining the leading and trailing trucks than any other video out there.

[@Hyce777]

Thank you my friend! Glad it helps.

[@uncipaws7643]

It seems like in north America small articulated locomotives for curvy branchlines never really caught on. Saxony had class I TV in standard gauge and IV K in 750 mm gauge, both Meyer-type compound locomotives (B'B' or whyte 0-4-4-0) with the cylinders pointing to the middle. They were slow, had a limited size of firebox and kind of complex steam pipes to the cylinders, but were also very long living, some IV K (class built since 1892) are still in use at museum lines. The motivation behind triplex-coupled locomotives, instead of just putting two or more locomotives in front of a train, was probably that they could be operated by one crew ... multiple traction with steam is a bit tricky but you can certainly say more about this.

[@BrooksMoses]

There was one delightful little 2-4-4-2 used for west-coast logging, which managed to survive into preservation at the Niles Canyon Railway, but yeah, they really didn't catch on. Probably because our branchlines weren't that curvy; a small 2-8-0 was fine for almost all of them. For what it's worth, I don't think either of the triplexes would have ever been on the front of a train; they were both intended as helpers in pusher service.

[@Stooltoad5017]

There is one example of a narrow gauge railroad of using an articulated locomotive to get around a curve. The Uintah railroad custom ordered a pair of 2-6-6-2 tank locomotives to get around a specific curve that was causing them trouble. Sadly neither were preserved.

[@Dan_Gyros]

I didn't realize there were so many different wheel arrangements produced!

[@Transit_Biker]

Ah yes, the 2-8-8-8-2, for when you want a locomotive that runs at 65% power 100% of the time.

[@ostlandr]

"Hey, let''s take the firebox from a standard 2-8-0 and try to make it run three locomotives at once. If we put in three times the coal and water, we'll get three times the steam out, right?"

[@TheMrPeteChannel]

The Triplex was a failure. Natrualy Belgium said maybe a Quadraplex will work.

[@jerjerferson]

Thank you! I've been looking for this video for a couple of years now. I know a considerable amount about diesel, but found steam a bit overwhelming. This was a nice, concise resource.

[@neiloflongbeck5705]

The Whyte notation is very limited system for describing steam locomotives. The UIC system can deal with oddball arrangements but is more complex. The Garretts are really easy to do in the Whyte notation, eg 4-6-2+2-6-4 (as I the photo you used), but what about Cramptons with a rigid frame with 2 or 3 carrying axles followed by single powered axle or the LNER's W1 with a 4-6-2-2 wheel arrangement with the last -2-2 being separate carrying axles?

[@Ilenapieta]

I have ridden the Nickel Plate Road 765 since 2019. I was in first grade and in 2023, I rode the tri state train and the day before I rode the “dads and doughnuts train”. I was 7 years old when mom, dad, my sister, and me rode the train. I had just escaped the hell hole that was kindergarten.

[@Ppppmaisad]

Shay's locomotive is an 0-4-4-4-0 or 0-4-4-0

[@jeremeymcdude]

you forgot the class D 4 trucks, 0-4-4-4-4-0

[@SnapDash]

Cool video! It's great to learn what went into these arrangements and why- I'm looking forward to the sequel: Cursed Wheel Arrangements

[@steveboguslawski114]

The 2-6-2 Prairie was aptly named, since it almost perfectly described the territory where they were most used. The Burlington bought over 400 of them, and the other roads to get more than 100 were the Milwaukee Road, the Northern Pacific, the Great Northern, and the Chicago Great Western. The Wabash bought 90. The Prairie had a very brief run as a popular design, with most of them built in the first 6 or 8 years of the 1900s. Lots of smaller roads with lighter weight rail got them too, since they were about as big a locomotive as their track could support, and they ran OK on lower quality coal. However, they were unstable at higher speeds. This had something to do with the center of gravity or center of yaw being right above the center driver, at least that is what I think I read. The Pacific and Mikado designs both rode better. Most Prairies were "retired" in the 1930s, either rebuilt into switchers, light Pacifics, or just scrapped. The small percentage that survived through WW2 were used on branch lines, in mixed service where high speed was not a priority.

[@oriontaylor]

Their hunting/nosing wobble at high speed didn’t stop the LS&MS from building several with 79-inch drivers that handled the west end of the 20th Century Limited in its first few years and set all sorts of time records on the line. Apparently they frightened a lot of the crews; there was some thought in the Lake Shore at the time that the trailing trucks had too much lateral movement that was the real cause, but they never had the chance to figure it out before Atlantics and Pacific’s came along to handle heavier trains.

[@cr10001]

Yes I think I read that (about the CG being above the centre driver so their 'symmetrical' balancing led to yaw), about British 2-6-2's as well.

[@davecass485]

Found this interesting and educational for someone without a deep knowledge of railroading.

[@oriontaylor]

If we were going to rename the Mikados during WWII, couldn’t we have at least named them after a GOOD general? 😄

[@ostlandr]

Beat me to it! I knew a guy who served under both Patton and McArthur. He said of Patton "We really called him 'Old Blood-and-guts'- our blood, his guts. We hated him with a holy passion- but we'd have followed him into hell." All he would say about 'Dugout Doug" was "At least Patton didn't need bodyguards to protect him from his own troops." We went on to talk about how Patton also didn't need bodyguards because of that pair of custom ivory-handled M1911s. NOT pearl handled, because as Patton said "Only a New Orleans pimp would carry a pearl handled pistol." In an alternate universe, Patton survived that "accident", came home, went back to filling stadiums when he spoke (a' la' Trump) and threw his hat in the ring as a fourth candidate in the election of 1948.

[@RealTechZen]

Might have mentioned that the ALCO 4-6-4 Hudson's of the Milwaukee Road's "Hiawatha" were the fastest in-service steam locomotives ever built. They did daily runs, for years, keeping to a schedule that required an averaged speed of 100 mph between Chicago, IL and Saint Paul, MN.

[@therombaro]

8:25 - How does a 4 leading-wheel arrangement “inform” the frame about torque? I’m trying to wrap my head around it. Does this mean it transmits flex forces to the frame and can make the frame flex (ie “articulation via bending / flexing)?

[@danp2779]

Remember that there is a bit of tolerance in the gauge (both in the rails themselves and the spacing of the flanges ... and that's before we consider wear, curves, etc.). A pony truck will help keep the front of the frame centered (and in turn, the drivers) on tangent tracks; and will likewise help pull the frame into curves.

[@ivovanzon164]

Because the frame of the front truck is linked to the first set of driving wheels (with sideways movement) and has a virtual pivot point behind the first axle

[@cr10001]

@@ivovanzon164 I think you just described a Krauss-Helmholtz bogie which is found on locos with a 2-x-x (e.g. 2-6-4) wheel arrangement. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krauss-Helmholtz_bogie A 4-wheel bogie at the front (e.g. on a 4-6-0) is usually a separate 4-wheel truck with no connection to the driving wheels. It transmits side load to the loco frame by various arrangements of springs or links hence helping to 'guide' the loco into curves.

[@kingkeshi1140]

@12:47 " 'I wanted an Atlantic,' he would fume, 'and that ___ ___ ___ sent me that!' " - Sir Toppam Hatt of the NWR.

[@OldIronVideo]

13:33 close! They are pronounced "Berk-Shy-Er" and "Ka-Nah-Wah"

[@buccaneerrailfanning1776]

I've always pronounced it as Berk-Shur and Can-awh

[@clockwork3494]

I respectfully request you take the time to discuss all "cursed" wheel arrangements you could find in the future when you get around to it, after seeing that weird example from Belgium I now wanna learn more about the wacky and weird classifications I've never seen or heard of before lol

[@itsjustaviper]

first ten seconds and my first thought is: BIG CHOO CHOO HANCOCK GO *_BWAHHHH_*

[@IanSonOfZues]

I probably said this before but Belgium Quadraplex was so powerful it would sometimes break couplers on the freight cars.