Hydraulic Clutch Reverse Bleeding

In this video I show how I fill and bleed a new clutch hose on my 2017 KTM 250 EXC using the reverse bleed method.

[@StarRain91]

Just tackling my 2002 exc racing clutch, finding this guide very helpful thankyou!

[@TheCaptainbarnacles]

Gutted they discontinued the intellilever, thanks for all the great content.

[@codenamenoob4973]

Great tutorial videos very informative, I'm gonna be doing the same with my KTM and was looking at getting myself a similar syringe is yours a US pro syringe? Looks the part

[@Scottjaykell]

Thank you. I followed your video and all went well.

[@uksteve-passiveincomevikin3981]

Thanks for this. easy to follow. Have had issues with my ktm superduke r clutch lever ever since I got it. Dealer said its normal. I dont believe them. I have an inch of travel before pressure. Going to try doing this this weekend.

[@lostinpa-dadenduro7555]

Great. 👍 I need to replace my fluid for this weekend.

[@VR4pt0r]

Awesome vid, thanks a lot !!

[@1wheeldrive751]

Reverse bleeding is best for clearing air from the clutch line. For fluid changes you can just gravity bleed and it’s neater and easier. It goes slowly so you can avoid sucking any air into the lines. Just did mine this morning.

[@jakeh5012]

I do not use the auto fill tank just the pneumatic bleeder. Gotta keep a close eye on the level of fuild, as it works really fast!!

[@mikitorres1517]

Where can I get that brake bleeding sereng u got there

[@EricNeilson_]

What diameter is the hose? 1/4" ?

[@maxpeltomaa3215]

Im little late here but should you put mineral oil in there?

[@John-bk2ox]

Great video thanks so much! After bleeding several times though I still have the problem that the clutch lever needs to be pulled all the way down to the grip to disengage the clutch. Would really like to get it so that I can have fingers under the lever and still have no engagement, as demonstrated in your video. Do you have any suggestions on what to do next? Bike is a 2014 ktm 300 xcw.

[@TokyoOffroad]

I think you still have some air trapped in the system. Also try bleeding the other way by forcing fluid out of the bleeder (squeeze the clutch lever with a short piece of hose on the bleeder). Be sure the close the bleeder before releasing the clutch lever. Sometimes, depending on where air is trapped, different bleed methods work better than others and a combination of reverse and regular bleeding may be necessary.

[@John-bk2ox]

You called it, that’s awesome, went back and did it again as you suggested, now it works great!! Really appreciate your help with this, I was seriously starting to wonder if there was a bigger problem with it! Extremely helpful suggestions, thank you very much!!👍

[@TokyoOffroad]

Great! Pleased it's working now...

[@throttlebuff]

Plates or basket looking like a steak knife

[@Nightingale1887]

Great tutorial. I work at the hospital, so I've taken an big Catheter syringe home with me. I'm struggling with air in the lines. Hopefully this works.

[@waverider744]

J

[@window2time]

Can you tell us where to get that exact syringe? I have other syringes for back bleeding but I want that one! Thanks

[@TokyoOffroad]

I’m not sure which country you’re located in. If you’re in the US someone else posted a link in the comments to the same one available at Walmart

[@StefConEnterprises]

It says dot something on the lid but the manual (for my sx -15) says "ISO VG (15)" and suggest some Motorex "Hydraulic Fluid 75". Is it really okay to use brake fluid?

[@TokyoOffroad]

ISO VG 15 is a mineral oil and that's what you should use. You must not use DOT 4, or 5.1 brake fluid as your system is not designed for it. If you use brake fluid the seals may become damaged and which would result in clutch failure.

[@Ryan-gw4ve]

Great stuff, mines engaging from the handle bar so i take it theres still a little bit of air left! Gunna bleed it up from bottom n see if any better! 🙏🏼

[@TokyoOffroad]

Yes, probably some air somewhere. Try the reverse bleed and see if it fixes it. If it’s still not right there might be some air trapped in the slave. You can put some hose on the bleed nipple, pull the clutch lever in, open them close the slave bleed nipple. That should get rid of all the air. If you still have problems it could be a damaged master seal, or damaged slave o-ring, either of which can be repaired (I made separate videos covering the repairs).

[@brapamaldi7666]

reverse bleeding is the only way i fill/refill any of my clutches/brakes. if you have ever changed the front brake hose on a DRZ400 you will know why I learnt to do it that way :P

[@londonTown1989]

Any idea when I'm trying to bleed the fluids just coming out under the niple and not travelling up the cable line

[@londonTown1989]

Sorted it bleed it from top of cable

[@FUCKYOUTUBE123]

Thanks for the video hope ur doing good

[@shogun678]

Brembo needs to make the master cylinder for the clutch the same depth as the front brake master cylinder. So easy to bleed the brakes. The clutch you get three pumps and it's already sucking in air. This is with the old school method of course. I love your videos btw. 👌

[@motocyclesandmayham]

Is it okay to bungee or zip tie the clutch lever overnight to make sure there are no bubbles in the line? Thx

[@TokyoOffroad]

Yes. I've tried it for the front brake and it does work. I haven't tried it on the clutch, but certainly won't do any harm...

[@WillyD1]

My clutch feels fine engages fine but my wheels hard to spin almost won’t when bikes not running and I put it in gear that’s my 300 xc I did same on my 450 xcf and when I put it in gear not running it pushes easy not sure 🤔 what to do with the 300 now re bleed I guess

[@TokyoOffroad]

If the clutch operates and engages fine it doesn’t solid like you have a bleeding issue. You may just be experiencing excessive clutch drag. Drag will be higher when the transmission oil is cold. Also do not over fill your transmission oil and use the oil grade specified in the manual for your bike. I made this video which shows how I measured the correct transmission oil volume for my bike kzbin.info/www/bejne/d5nbgp2bZc95d68

[@davenawahine6934]

I have back bleed several ktm clutch systems. However, on my 2015 even with high pressure on the syringe I was not able to back bleed the system. It feels like either the slave piston or the master plunger is covering one of the ports. I even removed the clutch pressure plate. what I ended up doing is I removed the slave and pumped the piston...which isn't ideal. I back bleed both brake systems with the same syringe without any issues. So, I just watched another video by tk2stroke and he had the same issue. As I suspected the slave piston was covering the bleed port. He removed the slave which allowed the piston to move forward and he could then back bleed....that sucks if I have to do that every time. Any Ideas?

[@throttlebuff]

I bet im having the same problem with my kids 105. I am so frustrated with this bullshit

[@ryunruly1227]

I'm having the same problem. It requires at tonne of pressure and the hose usually blows off spraying brake fluid everywhere. Very frustrating

[@throttlebuff]

I removed slave and use it as the pump. Just squeeze piston in and bubbles come out. Pump lever until piston is out. Squeeze in again. Pump, squeeze, repeat. It works really well. I poured some down line and filled slave before screwing on. Took less time than any method ive done yet. I bet if tires removed you could do the same with brakes at the caliper. I think i will try on my soft ass front brake

[@danny838]

I've got a gas gas txtpro and having an absolute nightmare. It's just engaging the cluch at the bars, so I've got serious drag. I've redone this 3 times, and I'm sure it's the right way that I'm doing wrong or not enough.

[@TokyoOffroad]

Sometimes you can get some air trapped in the clutch slave and a regular bleed (from master to slave) may work well following reverse bleeding. With some hose on the slave bleeder, try pulling the clutch lever in and hold it to the bars, then open the slave bleeder and note if any air bubbles come out with the fluid. Repeat this 3, or 4 times, topping off the master fluid as necessary.

[@danny838]

@Tokyo Offroad thanks I'll give it a go. I've now got it to the point where it slightly drags when it's in 1st but your body weight stops it dragging. So a slight drag. If it's in 1st and your feet are on the ground then you can feel it slightly. Thanks again I'll give that a shot.

[@robertbeattie8503]

Hi my sons ktm 65 was going fine parked it up about a month r so started it and wen going into first gear it just stalls and jumps forwards if I give it bita rave it will go but with a slight crunch .any idears

[@TokyoOffroad]

If the bike moves forwards even with the clutch lever pulled back to the handlebar then there is either a leak and air getting in to the clutch hydraulic system, or the clutch master, or slave needs rebuilding. If the master seal is gone the fluid level in the mater will not change, but the clutch will not disengage correctly. If the slave seal is gone the fluid level in the master will decrease (fluid will leak into the engine) and the clutch will not disengage correctly.

[@stone4858]

I tried this method about 3 times and each time I have the same problem, 1st problem the syringe is extremely hard to press, 2nd problem I have more fluid leaking from the bleed screw then it's going up thru the hose . What am I doing wrong ?

[@TokyoOffroad]

A large, good quality syringe helps and is easier to press than a small syringe. Make sure the hose is a good fit on the bleed nipple. It using silicone hose you can secure it to the nipple using a zip tie. And make sure the bleed nipple is open enough when forcing in fresh fluid from the syringe.

[@motorcycleridingadventures2023]

Please note, Brenbo uses brake fluid and magura uses mineral oil , ktm uses both, so check your reservoir cover.

[@TokyoOffroad]

Yes agree, that's a good point. Never assume what is correct and always refer to what is recommended on the master cap, or in the manual...

[@1wheeldrive751]

My 2021 701 has a Magura clutch master that uses DOT4 brake fluid. It’s not just the brand, you need to look at the master cylinder reservoir lid.

[@jwskms]

Can you share where we could purchase the syringe for this process?

[@TokyoOffroad]

I purchased mine from a local tool shop in Japan. The link which dlrarmy posted looks as though it's the same one...

[@michail1963]

any bigger syringe will do :) so try pharmacy

[@isabellez5671]

what type of syringe do you use and/or where can we buy it?

[@TokyoOffroad]

I purchased mine in a local tool shop in Japan. But if you search for "Fluid Extractor, Manual, 7-1/2 in" on Amazon you can find the same thing

[@newenglandscrambler2262]

@@TokyoOffroad I've had issues ordering stuff like this and then having the hose be too small gauge to fit on the bleeder. Any issues with this one?

[@paulgeorgelas383]

Hello! I tried this on my bike with the bleed screw open and the reservoir empty. When I depressed the syringe nothing happened. I then took the clutch line off the clutch lever and was able to get the syringe to depress. Any idea what’s going on at the clutch lever? Thanks!

[@TokyoOffroad]

The master piston is probably still engaged. Make sure that the lever is adjusted out enough, or fluid will not be able to pass into the master reservoir as it’ll be blocked by the piston

[@SwormCycles]

So at times I have experienced getting air into the system when I loosen the bleeder as air gets past the threads. How do you recommend stopping this?

[@TokyoOffroad]

I personally haven't experienced an issue. I think when reverse bleeding the fluid is under pressure and may leak out a little bit past the bleeder threaded area, but in doing so will prevent air entering. I have heard of some people using grease on the bleeder threads to help prevent leaking during bleeding, but haven't tried it personally.

[@SwormCycles]

Thanks my friend! Love the vid's and your quick responses.@@TokyoOffroad

[@loskiff]

Can you use dot 4 oil for the clutch? Because the owners manual recommend motored hydraulic fluid 75

[@TokyoOffroad]

Motorex Hydraulic Fluid 75 is a mineral oil fluid. I'm guessing you have a bike fitted with a Magura clutch master. No you should not use DOT 4 fluid. On the clutch master cover it probably states to only use mineral oil...

[@loskiff]

​@@TokyoOffroad No, I have a Brembo clutch lever, infact on the master cover it calls for dot4/5.1. I do not understand why on the manual it recommends the mineral oil and on the bike it says another thing...

[@TokyoOffroad]

@@loskiff - What bike do you have? Did it come stock with a Brembo master. Is the slave also Brembo? If both are Brembo then you should use DOT 4, or 5.1 fluid...

[@loskiff]

@@TokyoOffroad Is the slave the part located on the left side of the engine? In which enter the cable with the fluid from the pump on the handlebar? Thanks

[@TokyoOffroad]

@@loskiff Yes, the clutch slave is on the left side of the engine and is joined to the master on the handlebar via the hydraulic hose.

[@CW-up7xv]

Yeah I want one. What is the right size hose to fit on the slave bleeding ports? Would like to get a few feet of it.

[@TokyoOffroad]

The clutch slave bleed nipple OD is 7mm so the hose needs to be smaller than that.

[@brapamaldi7666]

i use 6mm hose witch fits like a glove

[@grutzmac]

I have tried this in the past many times using a syringe not quite as large as the one you use unsuccessfully. I have not been able to push fluid through the slave cylinder, it instead just leaks out around the bleeder where it's been loosened. Do you really have to use a giant syringe or am I missing something that is blocking the fluid from a reverse bleed?

[@TokyoOffroad]

No, I've done it previously using a smaller syringe. One tip if the hose is popping off the bleeder is to use a zip tie to hold it in place.

[@throttlebuff]

Could be blocked port by cylinder

[@justicebdone7]

I rebuilt my slave cylinder & when I tried to reverse bleed to fill up the clutch reservoir the fluid would push up into the reservoir, can you tell me what might be the problem? Thank you

[@TokyoOffroad]

Would, or wouldn't? Fluid should be able to push up into the clutch master when reverse bleeding. If it doesn't make sure that the lever position is fully out (away from the bars, not pushing on the master piston) and that the slave bleeder is open.

[@TokyoOffroad]

Also, it you rebuilt the slave, you'll achieve a much quicker system bleed if you fill the slave with fluid and hand bleed it before reinstalling. I show this in this video from 10:30 : kzbin.info/www/bejne/oZe5l6mYpMmWb6M

[@zitgo]

When I use this method the brake fluid leaks straight through the slave cylinder.

[@ExcuserGT]

same, help.

[@jasonr6328]

I need help my ktm i bought the slave cylinder online I don’t a seal tho what can do or what do I do

[@herbertbirkley5074]

I got confused why put brake fluid inside the bleeding were the clutch fluid comes from

[@TokyoOffroad]

The Brembo hydraulic clutches on most late model KTM dirt bikes use DOT 4, or 5.1 brake fluid. Note that Magura clutches (fitted to many Husqvarna bikes) use mineral oil. The correct fluid is marked on the clutch master cap and in the owners manual so it's easy to confirm...

[@herbertbirkley5074]

@@TokyoOffroad aw ok well thanks man and Awsome video 🤘🔥

[@mclovinmycamaro29]

What happens if I do this, and and still Keep getting air bubbles?

[@TokyoOffroad]

If air bubble keep coming up, air might be leaking into the hose from the bleeder screw thread. One thing you can do to help prevent this is remove the bleeder and put a little grease on the threads. The grease should stop air leaking into the hose even when the bleeder in loose during the bleeding process.

[@TokyoOffroad]

And sometime you may find a little air trapped in the slave. After reverse bleeding, try pulling in the clutch lever to the handlebar and hold it there, then with some hose on the bleeder loosen the bleeder and retighten the bleeder. Repeat this a couple of times if necessary.

[@patpaluch9842]

I am having trouble bleeding the clutch this way. The fluid is coming out from where the bleeding nipple meets the banjo bolt but fluid is not going to the reservoir. I have just done the brakes the same way and it worked perfectly fine. Any idea why this might be happening? On another KTM I had the same issue with rear brake but no issues reverse bleeding front break or clutch.

[@TokyoOffroad]

The most likely causes are either the bleeder nipple on the slave is not open, or the clutch master piston is partially engaged (make sure the clutch lever is adjusted out and not pushing on the piston).

[@patpaluch9842]

I suspected the lever engaging so I completely took it off and it didn’t make any difference. If the nipple wasn’t open would the fluid still leak out of it? I pushed about half a string of fluid through and it just all basically spilled on the floor. I unscrewed the nipple half a turn. I tried unscrewing even more but it just resulted in fluid leaking on the floor even faster. I tried bleeding the normal way by pressing on the clutch lever and everything worked as expected. Nipple opens and closes properly and fluid gets discarded into a hose attached to a nipple.

[@TokyoOffroad]

@@patpaluch9842 From your description it sounds like a master issue. Either the master piston is partially engaged for some reason, or debris might is blocking the fluid return passage.

[@patpaluch9842]

Thanks. I appreciate your help! I’ll recheck the master.

[@patpaluch9842]

For anyone stumbling across this thread having similar issue. I ended up solving this. Still not sure what the exact cause was but I ended up taking off the clutch lever again and then I took off the slave cylinder and pressed it which worked and the fluid backed into the master cylinder reservoir. After doing that I was able to proceed with reverse bleeding the system with fresh fluid.

[@johnball3634]

Thanks so much for this. Why don't workshop manuals prescribe this method? I've always suspected there was a better way, as it's bloody logical that air tends to rise in fluid, thus resisting being forced downwards. Is this another example of stupidity in the auto industry, or just a ploy to get people to use more brake fluid than necessary according to 'waste = profit' mentality? Thus we have all these theories on how best to bleed brakes preached by know-nothings and, pushed by the parts industry, an abundance of 'power bleeders' that still waste oodles of fluid (unless you're astute enough to collect and reuse it once the fresh stuff begins to flow) and which aren't even a universal fit. One question I would pose is this: Was it really necessary to keep filling once the master cylinder was full? That is to say, isn't it possible that all the air was expelled once the fluid level reached the maximum point? Thanks again, matey.

[@elobiretv]

My KTM manual says to do it this way. I dont think there's some kind of plot by KTM to sell you more brake fluid lol.

[@garbs1917]

I can't find that syringe he is using anywhere, did anyone find one?????????

[@jeffloucks2120]

Search for "Mityvac MVA6851" on Amazon. Just got one today.

[@fprintf]

@@jeffloucks2120 Thank you for sharing this. Looks like the best one out there, great reviews. Ordered mine today. Appreciate it.

[@Matt-nf7ss]

Why does tokyo mods delete critical comments exposing poor practices?

[@TokyoOffroad]

Not sure if you have the right channel. This is Tokyo Offroad (not Tokyo Mods). I don't delete comments unless they are totally unrelated to the video content, or clearly abusive. And I haven't deleted any comments posted by you.

[@vegasromaniac]

I'm gonna do this tonight on my YAMAHA YZ250FX :D , haha :D

[@TokyoOffroad]

One of my friends converted his YZ250FX cable clutch to hydraulic using a Magura kit. He much prefers the pull and consistency of the hydraulic clutch. He races enduro and hard enduro.

[@vegasromaniac]

@@TokyoOffroad I was just messing with you.. Yeah I have cable, and I like it, I put a cable lever reducer on itz it's 6 pounds pull. Btw dona video on the pull force on the Ktm.. I'll watch that. Actually I watch every repair video you make.. Regardless if I have it or not on my bike

[@TokyoOffroad]

I've never considered doing a clutch pull measurement. The stock Brembo clutch works so well I don't think about it while riding and don't get tired using the clutch. A couple of my friends did want to reduce the clutch effort due to injuries and both got Clake (one a One Light Clutch and the other a Clake Two) and they love those. I've read of others using Midwest Engineering clutch levers which change the pull mechanically, which some people like and others don't. I just looked at their website and their pull tests show a stock Brembo clutch pull is 7lbs 3oz and the Midwest Engineering lever is 3lbs 11oz www.midwestme.com/products.html#Clutch But the majority of people I know like the stock KTM clutch as is.

[@vegasromaniac]

@@TokyoOffroad a light clutch helps with the transition, I forts started ridding with 4 fingers on the lever, than 2, and now I slowly transition to one, I can hold on to the bike a lot better then the things get tough. Thanks for taking the time to answer.. Keep up the good work...

[@djocharablaikan8601]

your motorcycle sounds evil

[@blackbirdxx928]

Want to know the easy way? And ya, this sounds like bs..feel free to ignore it...lol Somewhere around the cap seal there is some kind of vent hole...make sure it's clear, get a rubber tip blow gun and give it a coupke6 quick shots of air...ya, it's a done deal....:)