I Am A Little Confused About This…

[@RabeaMassaad]

Thanks for watching guys. Just want to point out that the desired effect of this video was to say you shouldn’t need to be turning up a DI signal. If anything use the input signal from the plugin you’re using rather than the interface. Most modern interfaces will have compensation when using a line/inst input to achieve the right levels. If you’re curious about your specific interface to achieve this check the manual. As I said, focusrite and UAD have built in compensation as do many modern interfaces. But most importantly. - try to leave the DI where it is, so you don’t run into inaccuracies when using guitar plugins. Cheers

[@kyleyoungmusic]

Thank you!!! I’m going to stop clipping my interface now 😂

[@Hugo-pj4bm]

"try to leave the DI where it is" - does that mean turning gain to 0 on my interface?

[@johnnewton1830]

@@Hugo-pj4bm Yes.

[@garyshepherd9226]

Good explanation Rab - thanks that is helpful and explains why some patches from other people or commercial ones don't sound good. I will turn down the input a bit. Thanks!

[@user-tc9fk2dh7x]

Most interfaces are designed to be optimised at -18db. Even with my focusrite 0’ed I peak around -6db on the heaviest parts. Once you capture a good DI then you can always increase your gain in the DAW.

[@tacdoc8736]

John Nathan Cordy covered this in depth. The main issue is there is was no shared standard between different companies & they weren’t even being consistent in how they captured or made their plugins. Further complicating this is the fact that companies like Neural DSP have given conflicting instructions (written & video) for the best practices for optimizing their plugins for the best sounds. Neural has went so far as to change some directions recently, without communicating why, or even admitting that they were telling people the wrong things to do before. It’s corporate gas lighting.

[@jj454]

Companies should do a better job of speaking about this. I never knew and always heard you should go as high as possible without clipping

[@zambination11]

9:09 We also were very confused because some companies in their manual mentions to crank the DI until the reds and then back it off a little. No Amp sim company gave us (the mortals mediocre amateurs 😆) the proper way for gain staging, only a KZbinr like a month before

[@alessandroproverbio3411]

Well there is one new company that has done it, look for APFX and their smart input meter. Very simple, strum a bit and if it's blue you're too low, if it's red too hot and if it's green you are hitting the sweet spot.

[@TheBluesyPea]

This exactly, its says to push the level up in the manual

[@josuastangl7140]

@@TheBluesyPeawhich plugins/companies say that?

[@TheBluesyPea]

@@josuastangl7140 Neural DSP

[@NeZversSounds]

@@alessandroproverbio3411 I've seen only for plugin input not the interface input gain.

[@eds4754]

Hey man! Thanks for doing a video on this topic. Most of the discussion on this recently stems from a video I made. One thing you have to bear in mind is converters all use a different definition of what input signal equates to what digital level. So while this advice is PERFECT for UAD interfaces, if you did this same thing on a Behringer or Prism interface, your dBFS levels would be totally different (Behringer would be much hotter, Prism much quieter). The fact that converters all have their own definitions of analog signal>digital is what the goal of calibration is trying to achieve. An interface that has higher headroom than UAD would need a louder input signal to match, and vice versa. So I totally agree that there is no need to boost the signal at input, but just leaving the interface at 0 won’t guarantee your input level is optimal (unless it has 12.2dBu of headroom at 0 gain). For other plugins like Softube/STL/Mercuriall/Audiority, they all expect totally different levels to NDSP, so again the advice in this video doesn’t apply.

[@RabeaMassaad]

Hey man, nice one! I didn’t know that you’d made a video. But I was aware the discussion came up again. You’ve obviously gone into great depth which is awesome. From my experience with multiple interfaces, whether it’s focusrite, UAD, tascam, antelope or personus, I’ve never had any issues. I haven’t tried a Berhinger interface being honest. But I can’t say I’ve noticed anything different trying other Vst’s. Although I’m sure your research is accurate and wasn’t attempting to dispute it, I was trying to advise people that ultimately you shouldn’t need to gain up an input signal before hitting a plugin.

[@eds4754]

@@RabeaMassaad Definitely agree that starting from 0 is the best way, that way you can use the interfaces included specs to adjust to whatever you are using. There’s quite a lot of interfaces that will have a quieter signal than UAD at 0. Apogee is 2dB quieter at minimum, SSL is 3dB quieter, MOTU is 4dB quieter, Prism is 5dB quieter, Axe FX, Antelope and some RME will be quieter still. There’s plenty of others that go in the opposite direction too, so it’s just all over the place unfortunately. A Kemper as a DI would be 7dB hotter than UAD at 0. In my experience +/-2dB or so doesn’t make a huge difference but when it’s 3 or more it can start to feel quite different. Whether having an accurate sounding model is important or not is another question, a lot of people aren’t too fussed if it isn’t 100% the same as plugging directly into the amp. Worth bearing in mind while it may be the perfect level for NDSP, Softube will need a 13dB higher signal for the same input. STL needs 7dB higher than NDSP. If you are using something with a lot of headroom, it could need a 20dB boost or more to sound correct. I definitely do want the most accurate response possible, especially if I want to compare things like for like and fairly.

[@RabeaMassaad]

@@eds4754 yep, they’re all slightly different, agreed. I think I’m trying to focus more on not gaining up the signal so much. The main issue I’ve seen and have heard is dialling it up to a point that is inaccurate. I can understand a few db but ultimately advice that’s been given in multiple videos I feel is steering people wrongly. In my experience I’ve never turned up a DI signal on an interface when using a guitar plugin. I would rather use the input in the plugin itself if I needed more from it. I think that’s where I’d consider the issue to be mostly. Either way, your findings are well in depth and I think it’s great if you’ve made a video on this. Outside of the specifics I just think it’s also important to change the perspective when using VST’s starting with DI signals.

[@eds4754]

@@RabeaMassaad Yeah, I think the advice of keeping it at 0 is very solid and exactly what I suggest too :) and there is little to no benefit to turning the DI signal up at the interface. It’s still worth being prepared to (potentially) have to increase the plugin input level a lot - Amplitube/Softube/Audiority all need a pretty hefty boost in the plugin to sound correct, I think a lot of people are massively undergaining them without realising and then just assume the model isn’t good. Sometimes a small tweak might be necessary to match that “UAD at 0” if you want the absolute highest level of accuracy. Love your stuff man, all the best!

[@benzitocane]

Thank you both for addressing this topic. I have a PreSonus interface, and when people brought this up a few weeks ago, I was still so confused because with my input gain on my interface at 0, I received basically no signal. Ed helped by noticing that my fellow PreSonus users had inputs that had a negative dB with the dial turned all the way to “0,” so now I keep mine at about 11 o’clock and am getting a much more accurate response from my Neural plug-ins.

[@kevinwhite6172]

Not all interfaces have the same level when set at 0. Set your interface so that hard strums peak at -12. If I set my Scarlett to 0 it is hitting -3. When setting the M2 at 0 it’s not even hitting -20. So setting to 0 makes no since.

[@rentedwerewolf6159]

Yea, my Behringer UMC404HD has a very hot hi-z input. At zero gain I'm already in the red, lol. Switched to an Evo 8 and the signal at zero gain had more headroom. Sadly it failed so my quest for the right interface continues. Gonna try the SSL 12 next.

[@Walkerbjj]

yeah man. This video actually confuses me even more. I have always ran my input level high just before clipping and then adjust the amp within the plugin to sound good from there and had no issues. Not sure where he's suggesting I set my level because (as you said) O would provide different results from interface to interface

[@Tontonbeats]

Rabea can you please tell the guys at Neural to implement the option to lock input and output levels between presets? Preset makers obviously use their own setup, with maybe hotter or less hot pickups. So I can understand why some presets sound weak or not as intended when using different setups. I think locking those options would be welcomed by many

[@joaoguilhermenextlevel302]

What do you mean? When I save a preset, my output levels stay like I left it...

[@dee_biscuit]

Can't you already do this by adjusting the levels then saving the preset as your own?

[@PippPriss]

The thing is such a lock only makes sense if you would use the same interface. If they use an interface with way higher headroom and dialed it in, you'd need to lower your interface input or even the plugins input anyway. Having additional information what setup the respective person used would be more useful, but hard to implement /keep a track record of.

[@JustinGoff-n7p]

This should be something built-in by default - agreed. Nothing more irritating like having to constantly readjust your levels when auditioning presets!

[@joaoguilhermenextlevel302]

@@JustinGoff-n7p i never have to do that, don't know how y'all run your volumes, but for me here, it always plays nicely, even if there's -2db or +2db or something on the output ...

[@ileutur6863]

Wouldn't another easy fix be just to lower the input gain of the plugin? My DI tracks record way too low if I use no gain on the input, to the point where noise floor becomes an issue.

[@scottyecora]

That a very good question! My understanding is that it would be better to use the gain on the interface to maximize the range of the signal on which the A/D converter is working, in order to have a good "signal to noise" ratio, and then lower the gain on the plugin to recreate the real life situation a lower level signal driving the amp, but in the digital domain.

[@thewaldfe9763]

@@scottyecoraI absolutely agree. The AD converter should get a signal as healthy as possible (without clipping). This will differ both between interfaces and instruments. The signal within the DAW then has good signal to noise ratio and can still be tamed down using the input gain (of the PlugIn, not the gain knob of the amp simulation). Should be much less "lossy" as it then already is processed in 32bit float.

[@scottyecora]

@@thewaldfe9763I shall however correct myself : the aim is not signal-to-noise ratio, as I wrote it, but using the full range of the converter, and thus using as much bits as possible to encode the original signal.

[@misanthropicalparadise]

There are loads and loads of videos and guides who clearly instruct people to turn their interface input up until almost clipping and then roll back slightly to get a "good signal". So if you never had to look up videos or already knew what you were doing then yeah I guess you would think it was strange. But for all of us home recording noobs who needed some guidance, this is something that has been repeatedly and wrongly shown to us. I'm glad this information is finally coming to light, but it shouldn't be surprising so many had it wrong.

[@mhoff7722]

Exactly.

[@jc5512]

I still think that doing that and bringing the input level down in the plugin should give you the best signal to noise ratio while dropping the signal to the correct level for the plugin.

[@dodoclub]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/m6Och5ulr7N7hM0 in this video 10 years ago Misha mansoor explained clearly when digital axe fx days began , that the way to set up the input level in your focusrite or similar was to chug until red light hits and rool back a bit untill green light . This video replicated all over the net since then, That thing is wrong af this days, with amp sims neural dsp , i spent 30 days thinking neural dsp was shit, until some guy said on some youtube video tha in focusrite 2i2 you have to roll back totally off the input gain until even NO green light is exposed , like not any light at all, (that is crazy) but is the way to sound "normal" and not clip.

[@JtothemuthafuckinP]

I think misha had his amp before the interface so its a different game, but id have to watch it again to be sure.

[@Ghostman1846]

I never heard that an interface input level should be 0'd out, all the way down, when using a guitar until only a few weeks ago when another YT'er put out a video on this. Coming from an Audio mixing concept, the level control is always adjusted per channel based on the device you have plugged into it. I assumed the guitar was the same way into the interface. Using the device's App or front panel, adjusting the input gain until it starts to clip and then backing it off a touch. However, all my plugins were too hot at that point and I couldn't figure out why, and thought, "Wow! I have really hot pickups!" :D Thank you for spreading this around.

[@mormegil85]

I had the same idea up until recently as well! I always thought that the level of a hi-z input needed to be adjusted, just as you adjust the level when using a microphone into a xlr... this explains why I always had a lot of difficulties in getting a clean sound from guitar plugins

[@RonniSantmyer]

It’s the same as an amp.. a real amp takes a Hi impedance input and it’s seeing the signal like a DI would..so same theory if you put a boost pedal in front and over drive the amp you will get extra gain..but it works out on real amp because it can handle that and clipping on a lot of amps sounds good to us.. but that same sort of clipping into a plug-in doesn’t work as well and really it’s more because of the A/D converter clipping on interface more then it is the plug-in can’t handle it. Sort of what makes the Apollo Unison nice so it knows to match the impedance of the plug-in amp design.

[@JamieK_89]

Yeah it's strange, seems like common sense that you would set the gain on your interface for a guitar the same way you would a mic, make sure there's plenty of signal but not clipping. Been doing it this way since I first plugged my guitar into an interface 15 years ago. Never read anywhere that you should set the gain to 0 on the interface until a couple of weeks ago, how is this not common knowledge!? Glad it's finally getting out there though, if a little late haha

[@johnyang799]

You have less than 6db headroom normally. Or even less with some interfaces. You don't "have to" down it all the way down and keep it that way. Or rather the 0db is different for different interfaces. Correct/better way to do it is turn it all the way down at interface then increase level in daw. This way you are not risking clipping and you have the control over the input level going into the plugin.

[@DirtyDavesDirt]

Yeah, I was doing the same thing, many thanks to these KZbinrs, I’m now getting decent tones from my plugins.

[@Surgebinder16]

I’ve noticed a few people are asking about Misha’s old video on guitar recording and just wanted to point out in that video Misha is not recording a DI. If you zoom in on his interface he is set to Line level rather than Instrument. Since he’s running out of an Axe-Fx, that’s similar to what Rabea does here when running his amp through a load box. In short, set the input to Instrument and gain to 0 when recording a DI. When using a load box or modeler output, set to Line level and adjust input gain accordingly for high volume but no clipping.

[@Dirnkus_Ginish]

I could be missing something but it doesn't look like Rabea is plugging into a DI it looks like he's plugging in the the Hi-Z input of the interface. Could you clarify what you mean by "recording a DI"? DI boxes generally REDUCE the level to Mic level.

[@Surgebinder16]

When you use the Instrument input on an audio interface, you are recording a DI track. It’s an alternative method to using a DI box. Basically, a DI box converts a high impedance output (from a guitar for example), to a low impedance output. This output is meant to be plugged into a Line level audio interface input such as a mic preamp. The Hi-Z input on an audio interface eliminates the need for a DI box because the input impedance of a Hi-Z input is much higher than the output impedance of a guitar pickup. Either way, the resulting recording is still a DI. If you listen to a recording from a Hi-Z input with the plug-in turned off, all you hear is the sound of an un-amplified electric guitar, and that’s all a DI is.

[@Dirnkus_Ginish]

@@Surgebinder16 Yes I'm aware of what a DI is and does. Incedentally it reduces the signal to "Mic level" not "Line level". I think it was just the phrasing that was an issue. Recording a DI (Direct Injection) as opposed to recording a the guitar directly to the interface via the Hi-Z input. My bad.

[@Surgebinder16]

No worries. When I referred to DI I just meant that it was being recorded directly rather than using a DI box. You’re correct that a DI box is reducing the input to Mic level. I was just trying to say this signal needs plugged into a mic preamp on an interface, which then brings the signal up to Line level after it’s been amplified by the preamp. I might have misspoke a bit on that previously, but that was my intention.

[@nishadnadkarni7874]

For an instrument input as well the gain doesn't necessarily have to be zero, you could increase or decrease it a bit based on what you like, but yeah 0 works for the most part, your plugin may have a dial to increase the level of the signal going into the main part of the plugin itself to make use of any input saturation modelling that the plugin may have

[@17cupsofcoffee]

I definitely have always heard people saying "turn up your interface so you're almost clipping when you play as hard as you can", and just took that as gospel (especially given I have a Tele, which isn't super high-output to begin with). It sounded pretty good, so I never really questioned it. But after A/Bing the two channels on my Focusrite (both in instrument mode, one with my usual settings and one at zero gain), I'm kicking myself! It doesn't sound *totally* different (as I wasn't cranking the volume that high previously), but it sounds a lot more like my Tele does through a real amp. And way less background noise on the signal is an added bonus... Lesson learned :) I do wonder if this *used* to be true at one point, before the current generation of modelling plugins, though - I swear I remember an old Amplitube manual telling me to turn up my interface, but I can't find that in the latest version. Could be that people are repeating outdated info without checking if it's still relevant.

[@RabeaMassaad]

Yeah I find that confusing. Because a DI is an ultra high dynamic range signal. So you can almost clip without gaining anything up. As I say, I was confused to hear about this recently so wanted to shed some light and hopefully help out

[@jacy123]

Ideally you want to have about -4DB when you’re playing as hard as you can. It’s still quite possible for modelers to sound anemic due to weak DI and it also affects the gate threshold significantly if input level is too low. As rabea said most interfaces have plenty of level and don’t need much if any additional gain on a HI z input. Some interfaces are too loud from the get-go and don’t have a pad which is a bummer.

[@BDSGuitar]

Misha Mansoor definitely uploaded a video years ago saying to turn up to just before clipping for recording guitars. Summarily thats what I did, and id seen countless other videos with the same information. Watching Rabea's video, it makes total sense, and explains why I always feel like im fighting with the noise floor in some plugins.

[@angus68655]

I’m a hack at best, but I can attest to having been taught the same thing when I purchased my Focusrite Scarlett. I’m almost certain it was contained within their training videos on how to setup and use their interface. Happy to be corrected on this if my recollection is incorrect.

[@luizdemarco99]

It's a gospel from the early years of digital recording... It made sense at the time, but kinda lost it's purpose in this era of higher bit depth and sample rate.

[@mikerope5785]

when I was 14 I recorded onto acid pro using the microphone jack DIMED for that smooth sound card distortion.

[@johndo9648]

Those were the days. Acid 🙂

[@hagenwoods]

To be honest, I find it a bit disappointing what you're trying to tell us here. There are plenty of videos where Neural DSP told us to turn up the input gain as high as we can without clipping. That also makes sense, because you want to have a DI signal that you can still process (e.g. timing corrections). You need to see a waveform for this. In addition, such a low-level DI signal brings with it a lot of background noise. Now that the cat is out of the bag, every Neural DSP KZbinr and Signiture artist is suddenly telling me that I was just too stupid to use the plugins properly. I myself once asked in a Neural live stream about a year ago how my input signal should be leveled, because I always had the feeling that the amps were too hot at the end. I was also told in this stream that I should set the input level as high as possible without clipping. I think it's just weak not to just admit that Neural didn't inform the customers properly. Nevertheless, thank you for taking up the topic.

[@RabeaMassaad]

Hey man, sorry you feel like that. I wasn’t speaking specifically about neural but since I have my own plugin and wanted to demonstrate with the real amp, it seemed the logical choice. Myself, and I don’t think anyone else’s is suggesting one is stupid for not doing things this way. I had no idea neural had advised otherwise. I don’t pay attention to that kinda stuff. I just do my own thing and when I saw there was some confusion round it I wanted to add my 2 cents. I don’t think I came across saying people are dumb for not doing things a certain way. But if you feel that was the case then I apologise. That was not the intended purpose of my message or this video

[@hagenwoods]

@@RabeaMassaad Yes, I'm sorry. I should have unloaded my frustration directly to Neural, because I lost a lot of time and money mixing due to this misinformation. I'm also annoyed with myself. With a little thought I could have figured it out on my own. I think it's great that you brought this up. Love you and your content. Keep up the good work.

[@tonedragon8616]

Some guy name Ed did some great research on l this and John cordy did some videos as well really helped make sense of it all

[@christopher-miles]

yeah, i think that's what might have started all this.

[@RabeaMassaad]

Yeah, I think to me I was just baffled that it was even an issue in the first place. I’ve never gained up a DI when using a plugin for guitar. So I figured I’d give a quick explanation. It seems a lot of people, even those guys gain up their DI’s and it’s just not the right way to do it (unless you want more gain hitting the plugin). So hopefully this helps

[@hubbalol]

I think this has to do with the pickups people use running into their interface. Whenever I use my Strat with very low output pickups, the signal is so low going into the interface that both Ableton and Logic stuggles to find the transients when using warp/flex. It still sounds and feels really good because the plugins does what an amplifier should, but seeing such low signals really makes turning up the signal the first logical (although as demonstrated - wrong) step@@RabeaMassaad

[@johnschober4008]

I think this has recently been updated but from Neural's website it tells you: Step 2 - Make sure the Hi-Z input gain is at its minimum value. That should be enough to get a good signal level.

[@Dirnkus_Ginish]

@@RabeaMassaad I think the issue is that generally people are used to adjusting the input gain knob on the interface to get a decent (non clipping) input. We do this when using a mic for instance. For instance, with single coils you probably could have added some gain to the input without actually clipping but I believe the advice is to leave the channel gain knob all the way down. I think it probably comes from the days of tape when you tried to get the hottest signal to tape without totally clipping the channel.

[@roryt1985]

Misha probably caused a lot of the confusion. He has a video from 10 years ago currently 1.7 million views where he advises turning up the input level on the interface. Recently guys like Keyan reiterated this to the newer generation.

[@07dhiraj]

In your case its justified to reduce the gain to zero to come closer to real amp ... but in case of amplitube 5 models sound weak even with humbucker guitars ...does it mean while modelling they were using boost pedal and we are not ... pls tell the possibility... thx 😊 🙏

[@DanHovington]

I just dropped my input levels at zero with the instrument option and it sounds much clearer.... wow thanks you.... almost every video says the exact opposite.....thanks you so much

[@curtisbrause9255]

I noticed that as well using this plugin. I got a ton of noise (like as loud if not louder than the actual guitar signal) until I turned the input of the interface to 0. Every video tells you to turn that up until you’re clipping and then back it off a little. It sounds like that isn’t necessary with Neural DSP stuff.

[@ScrambleBandOfficial]

If anyone has recorded any tracks the ''old'' way and wants to keep the takes or not re-record them, you can drop the input signal in the plugin itself to -14 or so and this will compensate as though you were running in neutrally.

[@eliteextremophile8895]

Exactly and at least on Reaper, it might be even clearer to use pre-fader to get to proper input gain. Since this topic got trending, people went all over the place. Some people even measure their interface's gain using 3rd party devices. Literally every preamp and adc is almost identically clean and silent no matter which interface you're getting, so only thing you need to worry about is clipping. The rest you can change in pre-fader or plugin gain, since the characteristics of the sound doesn't change noticeably.

[@thewaldfe9763]

This is probably the more sensible way of doing it anyway: record a good signal and turn the plugin input down if needed.

[@filterscape]

This method that Rabea is on doesn’t work for everyone. My interface at 0 level sounds weak and thin on high gain and on clean lacks sustain. At the same time I found it too hot at the common method of going just before clipping. So I aimed for between -12 to -9 dB level. Which sounds good for me across my plugins. That’s the key, aim for what sounds right or good to you. Trust your ears

[@JimijaymesProductions]

I think the problem people had is they'd set levels to close to clipping no matter if they had a vintage strat (turn it up so it hits -3ish) or something with bare knuckle warpig (turns down to -3dbfs ish) and wondering why their strat and vox emulation setup sounds fuzzy, but a strat should be nowhere near clipping at the reference point of high gain humbuckers the real world voltage is massively different. It sounds confusing but basically find the reference for the amp plugin and then don't change it for guitars to act as normal (obviously creative use is fine). Some people claim the gain control is the same but it isn't, some amps have gain stages before the control and often their is treble bleed and factors that affect impedance that means the frequency response changes as the gain control increases. Important side note alot of amplitube amps have really high reference levels so you need to boost signal in the plugin, if you have the input set for something like Neural DSP with a lower reference.

[@Alex_Martz]

The issue is that there is NO STANDARD on calibrating input levels for plugins and every manufacturer has different settings!

[@davidmultimedia2024]

I totally agree with the fact the you should not raise the input gain of your interface and should leave it to 0 when using a Hi-Z input. Although, the recent argument had more to do with knowing what is the actual input level that each particular amp sim plugin is expecting in order to reproduce the model accurately (the way they have been initially measured), since apparently different developpers uses different levels... and then adjust the input gain of the plugin (by either increasing or decreasing it). To do that, your first need to know the specs of your particular audio interface, and look for the ''Maximum Level IN at minimum gain''. In the case of my Motu M2, it's +16 dBu. Then, you need to know what level your plugin is expecting, and apparently they asked Neural DSP and 12.2 dBu was their answer (they got different answers from different developpers). So based on that theory, I should ''increase'' the input gain of the plugin by 3.8 to reach to expected level (3.8 + 12.2 = 16). That said, I've seen some people comparing the gain of the true amp VS the amp sim... and apparently we should leave both the interface and plugin input gain at 0 in order to match the actual gain of the modeled amp. So yeah.. still a lot of confusion... and I don't understand why developpers like Neural DSP haven't made that clear with a video demo yet... this is quite ridiculous IMO. The truth is still that most developpers recommend users to ajust their interface input gain using the SNR method, when it makes no sense since every guitar/pickups have different ouput levels.. so that would give very inconsistent results. Bea, please have Neural DSP make a video about that to end the debate once and for all!

[@philkirschner]

Unfortunately Steven from the official Neural DSP KZbin channel apparently gave the wrong information in a video years ago. He said we should play as hard as possible while turning the gain knob in the audio interface higher, when it started clipping we then should dial it a little back again.

[@brendenrodgers7821]

well in all essence that is technically not wrong either, if you have a low output vintage pickup and youre trying to get a gnarly tone from a plugin like Fortin Nameless, Steven's method is a good way to compensate for your guitars shortcomings. But in the situation where you want your guitars authentic tone you probably shouldnt mess with the input gain of a guitar DI signal. I think Rabea in this vid is more so trying to educate people who probably made negative remarks about his plugin or other neural plug ins sounding bad when at the end the day (this is usually 95% of the time with any bad reviews) it was simply user error and misunderstanding of proper gain staging.

[@philkirschner]

@@brendenrodgers7821 Hey Brenden, for me the information is still wrong. What you are doing is boosting your signal, which is ok, but only if you want/need to do it. It would be the same as saying you always have to put a booster pedal before your amp and set your signal just bellow clipping. You can do it, but you don't need to do it.

[@DebowyMocny]

@@philkirschner100% agree. Turning the input gain is like changing the guitar into something it is not. Whilst there might be reasons why one might want to do that (for instance using a back up lower output guitar to play a regular set designed with a different guitar in mind), I feel this apparently poor advice comes from the old days or vocal processing. I’m really glad this subject has blown up on the internet because I myself questioned this on a number of channels (forums, discords, KZbin etc) and was always, and I absolutely mean always, told to turn the input gain up to clipping, then back off a little.

[@MetalMathiasTP]

100% agree. The pickups of the guitar should ultimately decide the input level into the plugins. Like on real amps.. If people increase input gain, its almost like chaging the guitar pickups with something hotter.

[@LeeB-l6y]

This is like saying when you use a DI into a preamp... don't turn up the preamp to make sure your level is good... If you plug in and you have good level, fine, but understand gain staging and what good level is.. Feel like there's a lot of misinformation here. Every instrument will have a different output level based on the electronics.

[@bassgoul]

Confusion comes from: A. Not all interface DI are same level at zero B. Some plugins/plugin manufacturers tell you to turn up DI to near clipping levels (overloud THU, amplitube, STL tones all do, for example) C. Some plugin manufacturers give you no insight or guidance at all. Im sure there's more reasons but those are the stand outs to me. The 3 plugins i mentioned are more accurate with the DI turned up how they specify

[@cesarventura682]

A little advise Bea, this is a very helpful video and i believe a better title would help lots of people in the future. Lot of love, and thanks for clarifying this to me.

[@np094]

It is really funny how you are confused about something that Neural DSP and other companies have been recommending for years. Even Misha from Periphery has a video saying to increase input lvls on your interface.

[@BBGuitars]

I could have sworn the reason I dialled up my DI gain was based advice in a video of yours from wayyyy back.

[@dudemcgee256]

It was.

[@mirkomarkovic3438]

This is complete bullshit and just wrong. You need to turn your hi-z amplification up to get a good signal to noise ratio, but more important to get the best dynamic range possible. In other words-to get the most out of the design of the amplification. You can turn it down afterwards if you feel your amp sims sound better that way. But not turning the input gain up is just comically wrong.

[@sjones3891]

Here’s one problem though: I just dealt with this issue last night and this morning on a new song I was working on. I recorded at 0 with my DI straight into the plugin and the waveform was so small I couldn’t see any transients, which is important when editing parts. I had to max the clip gain, edit, and then reduce the clip gain back to 0. Perhaps I’m doing something wrong but I wasn’t having this issue before when I would just turn it up to a point where it wasn’t clipping on the input section.

[@ileutur6863]

Same issue here. Even with the track height maxed, my DI signal os always so low when tracking that it barely shows up on the meter. And I'm playing an active bass!!

[@macios124]

I know it's been asked 8 days ago but, what I am doing is recording as I would normally (adjust gain just below clipping) and then before amp sim I am putting a volume plugin where I set volume to ~-25db

[@drabbster]

My RME Fireface 802 also has a Hi-Z input but doesn't reach usable levels without gain on the input. I've tried it after seeing some of the videos about that matter. My old Scarlets and my Clarett also needed a boost to be usable with guitar at all, even with Hi-Z.

[@Chugs4Serotonin]

Even Misha Mansoor has had videos saying to crank it to clipping then back off. I know that was common knowledge at one point until now all of a sudden. Now everyone wants to act like they knew you were supposed to turn input gain down low all along. Lmfao

[@PondoSinatra680]

I’m sorry you were confused by my ignorance. I hope you can forgive me.

[@alessandroproverbio3411]

I have to strongly disagree on that. On your specific setup (guitar + interface), with input gain at 0 you are already using nearly all the dynamic range, but this is not true for every setup. In many scenarios with 0 pre-gain you will end up recording a signal too weak, with a poor SNR and less accuracy since you are not using all the bits available in the dynamic range (usually 24, not so many interfaces nowadays have 32). It is way better to record with a good amount of pre-gain, without clipping of course. Then if the sound on a specific plugin is too hot, just turn its input gain down. Also there is not a universal "reference" level that all the plugin companies agree on, so again is better to record with the correct gain (use all the dynamic range but not clip) and then adjust the input gain of each plugin you are using (IK, Neural, THD etc...). I personally use "PRIMO" from APFX and it has a smart input meter that tells me if my level is too low or too hot through its color, so I just have to strum a bit and set its input level accordingly.

[@austinbridge]

I think guitarists just overthink things constantly...

[@rickard9294]

It seems to me that Rabea is missing the reason why they do what they do. Not all interfaces have the same gain on the instrument input channel and "instrument level" does not mean they are at the same dBFS on every audio interface. Use a looper pedal with a small loop running continuesly, connect it to different audio interfaces and their DI/Hi-Z/instrument inputs and see the difference. I personally don't care about having exact the same levels as when the amplifiers were modeled but it seems the "purists" do.

[@RabeaMassaad]

Hey man, the main thing I’m trying to communicate here is not to gain up your DI signal. Rather use the input in the plugin if needed. By gaining up the DI you run into more issues with noise and inconsistencies. I know they’re not all the same. I’ve used multiple different interfaces with plugins but never really turn up the DI at input.

[@JoeBaermann]

That is because you never ran into issues with the signal being to low. I have a program with note tracking, for it to work propertly I do have to auto gain the HiZ channel, which lands around the gain at 8-9/100 with a Super3, I then back down the gain one notch to make absolutely sure that it won’t clip. The program does not come with the ability to adjust up to the correct amount of input gain to have accurate note tracking. Anyway, it works fine with guitar plugins too, they don’t clip on their input level, which is what really matters, not if the input gain is flat zero.

[@BlugubriousMusic]

Just two cents. What was obvious to you about levels going in was not clear to most who read the normal practices or watch others speak on recording DI. Before these latest thoughts in the past couple of months, most people did the old 'raise it to the point of clipping and back off a little' because audio guys were saying that. So, for me, even as a real amp guy for the most part, it was indeed a revelation to not boost input... learning digital stuff, we trusted digital guys... and for the most part, they said... do it like lines or mics.... even with an instrument imedence... still had impression as hot as possible was the goal. Glad I know better now.

[@so_guitar8471]

Yes, the same confusion for me. I've also been noticing these types of questions more and more on the NeuralDSP Reddit lately. I've been using VST plugins for almost 10 years and it looked like setting the input gain on the interface and gain staging was common knowledge. Probably more and more people are currently switching to plugins because of the less metal-focused neural plugins that have recently been released.

[@TomatePasFraiche]

And this is something that I didn’t know for the 7 years of use of my interface (!!). Honestly they should have made it so the switch to instrument would deactivate any control from the front of the interface, this would have made more sense even if you might need a little more level on some instrument, at this point someone that knows could have juste use the regular line input side of things…

[@bigjoeisgood]

Ok,your explication is clear about DI input ! But what about plugin input level ? I can see on your it's to zero. But there is a lot of gap before clipping. Do you level up sometimes or never ? Thx ! Love

[@adamskaggs4494]

Seems basic, but I didn’t know this either. 😂

[@fearpocalypse8062]

Thanks for clearing this up man! I've heard people go back and forth on this and it's been confusing me.

[@chrisbraddock2825]

This sudden revelation about the input gain of your interface being too high or low is rubbish. The argument is that a real amp doesn't have a preamp in between guitar and amp but every amp sim has an input level. A real amp does not have this feature. The instrument input of any daw is clean up to the point of digital clipping, It's not saturated. Bring your level up on your interface before clipping and use the level controls of amp sim and dismiss this nonsense of turning your DI signal all the way down with a pathetic level and higher noise floor.

[@jjrockjaw]

You are incorrect. Unless your interface gain is turned all the way down, you are boosting the level in front of the amp. The effect is like having a clean boost in front of your amp at all times. Run this test. Dial in a crunch tone with the settings that you normally use, print it, and then do the same thing with the input turned all the way down.

[@drummingjeremy11]

Thank you. As a noob who is trying to learn how to do home recording through KZbin videos, I apparently have been doing this wrong the entire time. So basically plug your guitar into your interface (HI Z or instrument mode engaged), leave your interface gain level at Zero and leave the Amp plugin virtual input level nob at zero (unless your going for a more "pushed" sound before hitting the amp plugin). Is this correct?

[@JakeGrahamGuitarist]

Just to confirm, if I use a plugin like this I should keep my interface gain all the way down as that’s the natural guitar signal? I can’t believe I’ve never realised this 😂 I always turn the gain up so it’s near clipping so it’s a good signal but this makes so much more sense. Thanks man!

[@harshtruth9148]

What I love about STL tones in the input has an auto setting....when you do it it ask you to play notes and adjust the input accordingly....brilliant

[@DanHovington]

Same with modern metal's clairevoyant amp.... I really would love that feature to be added to Neural stuff

[@harshtruth9148]

@@DanHovington yes definitely

[@iurigrang]

The problem with that is that different gain pickups would sound the same. If you want the most realistic sound, you'd still just have the gain at 0. If you don't care about a realistic sound, you should set it by taste anyways. So I really don't see a point in such a function

[@DanHovington]

@@iurigrang Very interesting point, but to have tried it I can say (for clairvoyant) it works great and my guitars still sound a bit different. Don't want to go into the whole pick-ups don't matter argument but for volume matching different gear it's also great. But I do find your argument very interesting and worth more digging into

[@harshtruth9148]

@@iurigrang ive noticed that...tried adjusting to 0 this morning and a bigg difference

[@whenifeellikeit]

So that's why I got better sound when I lowered my single pickup volume knob from 10 to 8. Too much input signal into the plugin because I had gain knob up on my interface. 😮

[@whenifeellikeit]

The best noise to sound ratio signal is at 0 dBu (0.77 Volts) before it hits your audio gear. If it's higher you get distortion. If it's lower you get more noise when you increase the output signal. That's all there is to it. If the pickups are too hot they will distort the clean sound.

[@mrbungle8493]

Everybody is talking about this, incredible how we didn't realize it before! 😮

[@BigSh00tsie]

I stopped using amplitube because i set it up exactly like the internet said and it was unusable. This is why.

[@jjrockjaw]

Rabea, as an employee of ndsp should be honest about the fact that they have instructed us to turn input gain up to just below clipping. They've changed this advice only recently.

[@dekofschipper8412]

Just tried recording a bass guitar track with these suggestions. Fender Professional II Jazz (passive PU's) into focusrite clarett 8 Pro, hi-Z input, input at 0, neck pick-up vol at 10, bridge PU added for taste (around 6). The levels I get (checked with iZotop insight) are Peak -31, RMS -45. Doesn't look/sound right to me. I realize the discussion centers around guitar, but the general suggestion to keep your Hi-Z input at 0 seems a bit weird. Shouldn't we increase this until we get an input signal around -18 dBFS ?

[@NeZversSounds]

Probably you cleared it for some, but for me your explanation felt convoluted and confusing. - Interface input gain should be in normal position and not touched unless you change guitars/ pickups. - Adjust plugin's Input as if it was a volume pedal in front to get right level (or boost / cut) That's it. Tangent on loadbox felt confusing. That's an output volume after an amp.

[@mattvdh]

Well it's not really baffling because there's a lot of amp sim suites that have a line input level function and it gets you to turn it up as you would a microphone. NDSP doesn't do this but many suites do.

[@popsarocker]

There's an analog to digital conversion happening right after the analog DI (assuming most interfaces now include such inputs). If there were ever a point to gaining up an analog DI preceding an amp sim it's to maximize the number of bits utilized in that conversion process. This will maximize dynamic range and minimize quantization distortion.. This also will no doubt subsequently maximize downstream processing vis a vis your amp sim. When the input signal is hitting the plugin's input gain control it's already in the digital domain. If you're looking to have the plugin match some actual amplifier in terms of its tonal characteristics with **the knobs in a certain position** then your best bet is to use that input control on the plugin to find that sweet spot. Note that this input gain control has 24dB of gain **in both directions**. Too hot? Turn it down. Not hot enough? Turn it up. The point to the whole "tickle the red, and then back it off" approach is so that there are sufficient bits representing both nailing the strings hard, and then also gently touching them - or - you know - using the guitar's volume knob to turn it down. It's not necessarily about finding a certain tone (although that is certainly also possible if you like that kind of thing).

[@alessandroproverbio3411]

Extremely underrated comment! 0 pre-gain leads to lower SNR and waste of bits of dynamic range, this is what happens when people without a technical background decide to "explain" something to a huge audience...

[@kempguitar6235]

@@alessandroproverbio3411 pre-gain of audio interface or inside the plugin?

[@alessandroproverbio3411]

@@kempguitar6235 interface!

[@scottyecora]

@@alessandroproverbio3411Exactly, and the level of confusion it brings is a bit worrying. I had a look to the videos from which all that bullshit started. It's quite clear that the poster misunderstands the notion of signal-to-noise ratio and has no clue about the inner workings of an A/D converter. But still, from that lack of understanding, he elaborates recommendations on how to set up the input gain of a plugin based on the maximum level of the interface in order to have "accurate modelling". It's very impressive... in a really bad way!

[@johndo9648]

Good points. I’m going with this approach. The level on zero method just doesn’t work for me.

[@mofous]

How did it take this long for people in the know to figure this out, that's the real question.

[@kempguitar6235]

because brands have always said the opposite, Why have they always said the opposite? this is the question, which generates confusion.

[@blsforlife]

Hello @Rabea Massaad . Are you still using the captor X? I’ve been using neural dsp for a while, and added a captor x to my setup using a 6505+ and a peavey classic. I was hoping you could touch on gain staging for the captor x into an interface and into a DAW. Between the guitar to the master on the DAW off the top of my head I can think of 6 different levels that can be adjusted. How do we know when we are hitting the sweet spot with all that variability?

[@GeeMorno]

💚For those who have smashed their head against the wall, such as I have for over a year now. Your interface may not be HI-Z. in this case, plug your guitar into a buffer. All boss petals are buffered. Just keep them off. I use a metal zone as my buffer😆. my interface is a digi rack 002. without a high Z input, or a buffer, your Guitar will not have clarity. Doing this in combination with setting your interface at zero. (all the way down), as well as knowing how much below zero, you should be placing the plug-in input level at; you will begin to get closer sounds to all the Internet gods. I was really frustrated over this. I live in Finland and almost walked into Neural DSP, For answers. Instead I applied there. I could never understand why my John Petrucci plug-in was never clean compared to the Rabea plug-in., with single coils. On a sidenote, let’s talk about analog gear versus digital gear. 2 inch tape is made to be hit hard. the particles on the tape spread in a way that creates warmth. Listen to any Stevie Wonder album or groovy shit from the 70s, and you’ll hear it right away. This is why we set our levels hot with analog. With digital, it either sounds good or shit. No room for warmth. Most younger people are not aware of this and it pisses me off that I don’t get the respect that I deserve in my current profession as an audio visual technician. Hope this helps somebody. I had to figure it all out the hard way and I lost a lot of sleep over this. It made me want to throw my computer out the window and plug into my Marshall. Edit: I almost bought a new computer, a quad cortex, and possibly a new interface, and almost replaced all my cables, because of this. I can’t believe I almost blew over €5000 over a simple solution. Not everyone has the time schedule, to go down rabbit holes of trouble shooting. Some guys just wanna wind down after an 80hr work week, & simply play…

[@klap00]

Like, it would be common sense not to send an already clipping signal into an amp simulation. Sending at 0db max peak is the way. Rest is all from the plugin's settings, that's why the input knob is in there too. Loving your signature plugin with NDSP and the rest of their stuff, too! Haven't looked back since swapping to plugins.

[@arturoalvarez_music]

What is the “input level 0” of a Scarlett Focusrite? No gain at all? Reach the 0 in the master output level? Quite confusing.

[@Jarsepaani]

This whole amp sim world is completely new to me, but I guess I understand the point why the gain should be adjusted from the interface to zero. I just don't understand why the developers advise otherwise. But I also have a problem with it. When I adjust a gain to zero from my audio interface, my DI signal is so weak that my audio interface's mixer application and my daw are just barely able to recognize it. That's why the amp simulators don't work at all with these instructions. I've tried using amp simulators with Daw and in standalone. My guitar is a fairly new 7-string Schecter with Seymour Duncans active pickups (can't remember the model) and my audio interface is an audient id24 which works with IDmixer app. Amp sims, I've tried Neural DSP: Archetype Gojira X, Rabea, Nolly, Fortin Cali and now I'm trying Mixwave: Spiritbox - Mike Stringer. Where the issue might be?

[@BassBaseBerlin]

Nice video ... just thougth ... a no-brainer. But I'm to "techie" 😆 But pls. don't mix up "level" and "impedance". So mostly "instrument-inputs" are "instrument-level" and "high-impedance". For instruments you normally use "high impedance" - therefore you use DI-Boxes. Then you get low-impedance for mic inputs. So impedance --> solved. And you just need to level it as you said ... play heavy, peaks at interface input (digital) should be greater than -20dB and lower than -10dB (for some safety). And for impedance - most modern units have switchable input impedance. This will impact high frequencies. E.g. Helix can do this dependent on the first effect. Not sure, if this is suitable in every circustance - but it's cool. And having lower "high-impedance" - like 200k Ohms will result in lower highs - like with a longer guitar cable (basically ... not totally correct, but anyhow). And with higher impedance > 1 mega Ohm, you get more highs. And if you use active instruments - like some e-basses, most acoutic guitars and some metal-guitars (e.g. EMGs) - this difference in sound should vanish. Anyhow ... just some ideas

[@truthtorpedo99]

Strange. When the focusrite interface is at 0dB the DI signal in my DAW is -25dB when im playing guitar hard. Its just too weak. Turning interface gain up til i reaçh -18 to -15dB makes plugin tone more healthy. My DI signal never gets close to clipping, why is this?

[@NowakP]

I think the part that is confusing people is the fact that your gain on an instrument input needs to be set to 0 and then when you record, the waves on the DI tracks are very "small" compared to any other recorded tracks that you wouldn't use a guitar plugin on. Back "before" Neural DSP plugins, the "common knowledge" was to set your input gain until just before it starts clipping, which clearly is way too hot for modern guitar plugins.

[@jt9800]

I've been using DI & Guitar Rig with a Focusrite for prolly 5 years cause apartment life brought me to it, and at the end of the day, yea, it's all about getting the sound you want. Zero input gain on the interface with a cranked modeled amp sounds great. Increased input gain on the interface with an un-cranked modeled amp also sounds great, depending on what you're doing. I love to play clean rhythm with my Strat with the input gain on my interface increased, to a modeled amp that's not cranked. And then playing lead with my SG with interface input at zero, to a cranked modeled amp in Guitar Rig. Sounds killer, lots of fun. Sidenote: that digital interface console looks awesome, i want it

[@tusharistherails]

The lowest the hi-z input will go on the Apollo twin x (per the manual) is +10dB, and when I try to bring the hi-z volume “all the way down”, it won’t be below +10db.

[@joesalyers]

Rabea the word you were searching for this entire video is IMPEDANCE!

[@arturoalvarez_music]

Thanks, this clarifies a lot of things in regards of gain structure and my interface settings. Now I know those instructions on turning on the interface gain until we reach a clipping point, and then turning it down a little bit is OK when no plug-in is involved.

[@ivanzivanovic4013]

I mean my plugins then sound like shit if i do that...very thin and no balls...like various different kinds from NeuralDSP, to NAM, etc...

[@Nui7hari]

I'm curious as to wether or not this is also true for using the QC on itself. If plugins expect a Dynamic range of about 12.2dB, is the same true for the models on the QC itself? So should we raise input to around +3dB (as max input is 15dB on the QC at 1MOhm Impedance) ? Or do you let sit at 0dB, like you would an interface + plugin?

[@BecomingProductions]

Although fully agree with everything said in the video, I'm a bit confused over why this is being discussed. I would have thought it was plainly obvious if you hit a preamp with a hotter signal you'll get more gain. It's somewhat irrelevant if that preamp is an amp or a plugin, it'll behave the same.

[@keaneycakes]

What if I'm using a DI box that converts my Line-Level signal to a low-impedance microphone signal? Would the Mic-Level signal on my interface ( Quad Cortex) make the level correct?

[@n3rdg4m3r]

I think its just a misunderstanding of using interfaces. I dont know why, for some reaaon i thought the level control on the input was like a volume control not a gain control. Seeing plenty of misinformation when i first started learning about using an interface and DAWs that said to set the level control so it wasnt peaking. I always wondered why the clean sounds werent that clean. I was adjusting the input gain in the plugin and in the DAW but never the interface.

[@n3rdg4m3r]

For some reason, I thought turning the level down on the interface would kill the signal. Would make sense if it was a true volume control but now I realized it's a GAIN control.

[@dekofschipper8412]

Yes, exactly, this is the real source of the confusion. Hi-Z input is gain, not volume is what I get out of all this mess. Never realized this before. I feel pretty stupid now.

[@elmolewis9123]

I thought the guy who started this a month or so ago was saying that every manufacturer uses a different value for 0 input on their devices. He gave a list of many devices with the offsetting numbers, supplied by the manufacturers themselves. And this is what the user was supposed to use to get to a proper 0 input level that the plugin would see.

[@eds4754]

that’s correct. 0 on UAD and Focusrite (and some others) is correct for NDSP but it won’t be for other interfaces.

[@vgomesbr]

This topic sparked a question in my mind: Does the same thing happen, or would the same "rule" apply, when recording vocals through a pre-amp plugin? I mean, are the pre-amp recreations reacting as they should? What levels should we actually feed them? Or am I being nonsensical by having these questions in mind?

[@eggweed_productions]

I have a (real, not virtual!) Deluxe Reverb which will just start driving at about 5 or 6? The DR in Amplitude was driving at 1! Basically my Focusrite was acting like a boost pedal. I always thought I had to dial in the gain knob so it didn't go yellow or red and stayed green. Blimey - thanks Rabea!

[@elvancor]

I have an internal PCI card rather than a USB interface, and its dedicated instrument input is wayyyy too hot. Even at the lowest gain setting, a passive guitar will clip the input, and I can get the archetype plugin to feedback just on internal background noise, without even a cable plugged into the instrument intput. It's the weirdest thing. I guess that's what I get for using an obscure PCI interface, but I never had this problem with Guitar Rig. In my somewhat flawed setup, Archetype Rabea is definitely unusably noisy, while Guitar Rig somehow isn't.

[@Saf1ouane]

Using my Audient Id44 input level at 0 with a strat I get super low di input around-40/-35 and if I play really really hard, it gets to about -25 max that too low, and the plugins sound too quiet and not good. This is not working for me, any idea about that ?

[@CarlGonzalesGuitar]

But I think, this method varies depending on your interface. His interface has that 0 mark and some interfaces doesn't have that.

[@Kris_T_]

when I record I have a (sm57)Mic in front of a cab on one input (into a 2i4), and an emulated out from my head to the other input... kinda, because I put it through a mixer first, with Mic on one channel balanced left, and the emulated out balanced right, so the focusrite actually gets the output of the mixer. So how should I have my inst/line and pad switches? (I'm an old fart and very new to DAW's and Interfaces). I presume as a general rule I want whatever setting allows me to use the least gain?

[@chvcky1]

all this talk about the input settings !...I understand better now but is the optimum 48Hz and 128 samples if no crackling please Bea ? and is it ok to play with the output for some more dB :)

[@simonjonasmusic8410]

I feel very very stupid. Been a guitar player first and foremost for the past 30 years, still did make the mistake you mentioned. I think it has a lot to do with instrumentalists kinda "learning" to use a DAW as their second sort of instrument. In the process there's put much emphasis on getting the input gain on the interface right for all kinds of mic'd up sources (as in: "always make sure the interface shows a green light when dialing in your input gain"). Most guys i know, certainly myself, did transfer that method over to recording electric guitar via plugins...make sure you have a healthy input gain your DAW can "work with", then proceed to any in the box adjustments...i guess that's the source of the problem. When i saw the several videos that came up about a month or so ago, i felt extremely stupid, because as a guitarplayer of course i KNOW full well what happens, when i put a boost or even pickups with more output in front of the same amplifier....Thanks anyway man, not gonna make that mistake again i guess 😅

[@nine-tees-house-music]

Not a scooby! I'm just not interested in all the tech behind it. I love all the options Neural plugins give you, so I bought a Volt 1, some speakers and just plugged in. It had a gain knob and a clipping meter. I made sure when I played it wasn't clipping on the front of the Volt 1 and just cracked on. I think there are a lot of hobby guitarists like me who couldn't give a monkey's toss about all the tech, just want some good sounds.

[@Dave24hrs]

It boggles my mind how people are still confused about this. I was very surprised when Rhett Shull made that video basically putting it as some sort of ground breaking knowledge. Like what? Really?

[@vonbleak101]

My lord - If people are trying to make music without knowing how to gain stage needs to stop and learn... This is really basic 101 type stuff lol...

[@Jt7166]

Neural DSPs own website says something completely different. As do many of the videos on their official YT page. So I can understand why there is confusion

[@wijons522]

Why is there an input knobs in your plugin then? The problem is that there is no shared standard, what works in your plugin might not work with other, impeadance is NOT input level. Also not al interfaces have 1 Meg resistance built in for the instrument inputs. Brands differ sadly

[@errorkit]

mh ok so what do I set up on my Babyface? +4dbU or -10dbV? 😅

[@joeybones222]

How many other people are making the shocked pikachu face that they’ve been doing it wrong for so long? 😮 Man I am so grateful for this video though, I had to rush over to my guitars and try it out and I’m blown away by how much better everything sounds. I feel like a jackass that I’ve been meticulously dialing in presets the wrong way for years now lol.

[@lacyrytex]

So practically speaking, using a interface like UA Volt, should the Gain just be at 0 (all way down)?

[@ChrisM541]

Rabea - you NEED to demonstrate this using a clean patch, NOT a distorted patch, for obvious reasons. Yes, we can all see the meter, but adding more distortion onto distortion isn't the same, or as 'visible', as doing this with a clean patch and ALSO listening to it saturating the plugin patch.

[@godsinbox]

the age old question. ask yourself, where is the noise? if you take a picture, for instance, is the noise introduced in the amplification of light or inherent in the capture? If the latter, then it doesnt matter when you turn it up. I once did sound in pubs in the 90s and there was one guy who had all the faders level and straight on the console, and use the gain trim to 'mix' the band. we thought he was nuts. But hey, if it isnt clipped then run your signal wherever you like.

[@burchwoodstudio2548]

When I lower my input gain on my Scarlett, I stop seeing my audio signal. I can get my guitar clipping with input level and gain on your plugin before seeing any peaks. Any ideas?

[@RichardDuenaz]

soif someone dad say 4 -10 different dist,overdrives with tubes in them isnt that similar to a pre amp section on an amp ???? i just thought of another experiment im going torun 5 of my dist intothe fxloop in of my head by passing the amps preamp ill be back

[@Ravelle17]

To all the wonks arguing in the comments: there is no correct method. Generally you will get a good result if your input isn’t clipping. Some people may want that sound; good for them. Argue less and play more, for fuck’s sake.

[@taylorvolleberg]

I also thought this was common sense but it's nice to have a refresher course for people. the input on the interface is there to get a good level going into your daw. The rule of thumb that I've always stuck with is to play your guitar the hardest you can till you see it peak, once you've seen where you peak on your hardest hit note, chord and palm mute you pull the input gain to just under peaking. that way when you're playing you get a solid amount of head room to work with in playing dynamics for starters. having head room is key when tracking ANYTHING. Gain staging lol...

[@zeevshaff]

Because of you and one other youtuber, guitar recording will never be the same

[@Michaelgroberts]

I really love the Dad energy here of "i'm not upset, just disappointed and baffled"

[@babahias]

Just crank every volume/gain/input level/... in your signal chain up to the maximum in order to get the best result. 🙏

[@KeenanCrow]

Depends on the guitar, depends on the DIY. I’d prefer a target peak level so I can set it regardless of what I’m using.