I ate only McDonald's burgers for two months

[@jamesmcgarragle8702]

Mountain Equipment certainly get their moneys worth with Dave. He managed to get the full spring/summer and autumn/winter collection for the last 5 years into this film.

[@decklundy]

I wonder when the last time is that Dave actually bought an item of clothing. I think I've never seen him in anything other than mountain equipment

[@audiojck1]

And maybe it had an affect on me liking their products. You can give Dave a raise 😉 I love my echo softshell for example.

[@vaargaazful]

😂

[@taliapage6259]

Curious if there was a McDonalds sponsorship here too, seems so expensive to buy so many burgers for a month otherwise!

[@jacobscott7467]

@Talia Page here in the USA single burger patty would probably cost about a dollar. 16 dollars a day on food seems pretty reasonable.

[@LatticeTraining]

Amazing work as always Dave! The quality of production and the effort you have put into researching content for videos like this is truly awesome and greatly appreciated!

[@TechnocraticBushman]

And also I can confirm that such a diet when getting on and off it for me at least works wonders for climbing.

[@SirPhytone]

​@@TechnocraticBushman I can also confirm the same results are possible without meat, it is just a case of incorporating keto rules. Much more ethical that way too :)

[@christianvollenhoven]

@@SirPhytone is it more ethical though? The carbon cost of flying and shipping in all of the foods required to make that possible is huge.

[@SirPhytone]

​@@christianvollenhoven Yes, I literally cannot see a case where it would not be more ethical. 1. 95% of animal products are factory farmed, so the meat industry is extremely unethical. And even if you farm your own animals, killing them for meat cannot be done in an ethical/humane way, unfortunately it is impossible. 2. Said animals also need to be fed plants, often that is imported soy. In fact the two biggest reasons for rainforest deforestation is soy for animal feed and cattle farming! 3. Look up the land use per kCalories of food, takes 100x the land to have beef over potatoes for example, or ~60x for nuts. It's all very well to say it's not so bad to farm meat on a local farm and use the manure to fertilise crops etc, but the reality is with the current world population, it is only the very privileged who can do that. Not only are costs much much higher when meat is farmed in this way,, but there simply isn't enough space on the planet.

[@abelabel3664]

@@christianvollenhoven It has been shown time and again how, even considering transportation, plant-based foods tend to have a smaller footprint than animal foods. Then again, one can eat mostly local plants and reduce their impact even further.

[@Matt-yu5ed]

4 minutes in and I have to say, the production quality is like a tv documentary. 10/10

[@trevortimm2443]

Man just burgers for 2 months, kuddos for sticking with that 😅 lack of variety sounds tough

[@lastcall42]

Ok, but check this out. 100% on the real, I lost 110 lbs (265 to 155) eating McDonald's 3 to 4 times a day. Here's how. The mobile APP has d3als; buy 1 get 1 for .29 cents breakfast sandwiches, also buy 1 get 1 .29 cents dbl cheeseburgers. I consume only 3 beverages on the regular. Water, black coffee, or Michelob Ultra. I'd eat 1 brkfst sandwich right away, the other 3 hrs later. Get the dbl chsbrgrs at lunch and eat 1 then, one for dinner. Keep in mind, it's mostly water I drink during the day. So basically, I was chasing calories, and ceilinged out at 1700. Itresulted in another 110 lb loss.

[@seagullj.l.6102]

Dave, an absolutely brilliant documentary - really well researched, presented even better!

[@charlie5917]

bro completed climbing and now hes just messing about 😭

[@eric752]

Every boulder is so easy for him😅

[@BennyHfm]

I actually love those kind of cross overs with climbing.

[@travisripper3689]

I like McDonald’s

[@masterpropper2485]

What are you even talking about? Maybe have a look at the last 24 videos on his channel, which are all purely about climbing...

[@charlie5917]

@@masterpropper2485 bro took it serious ;(

[@LoveAndClimbing]

6:00 Spot on, Dave. Anxiety and depression are definitely related to nutrition for me and they effect my climbing negatively even if I'm hitting my numeric weight and training goals. Your vlog on depression has been pretty instrumental in helping me change that for myself since you posted it and I can't thank you enough for that.

[@slof69]

I went from ssri's ruining my life to mentally sound from diet and stopping meds

[@xandermarjoram8622]

This is one of the first videos of yours I've watched and I have to say it was fascinating. I've been vegetarian for about 7 years and while I'm not sure I can see that changing any time soon, this has given me a lot to think about in terms of other effects that we don't tend to think about.

[@justroberto5052]

are you serious? and what good points did you feel were made?

[@mbaxter22]

If you’re vegetarian this tells me you already possess strong food discipline. I think vegans and vegetarians make good carnivores because they’ve already learned to master their food intake. Going from SAD to carnivore is probably even more difficult. Try it. Go carnivore for a month. You will thrive beyond all expectations.

[@xandermarjoram8622]

@@justroberto5052 Just came back to watch this video again (I was notified by another reply!) The main points were about how just because you're eating plants doesn't mean animals haven't died to grow them (is killing twenty mice and tens of thousands of insects better than killing a single cow or pig, if done humanely?), and you can't guarantee that the land is being managed sustainably. I'm still vegetarian for what it's worth.

[@thenayancat8802]

I don't think these are actually good points. Firstly, even grass-fed animals are typically fed crops (hay and silage, if not food crops outright as many are) - so many of the same issues with crop harvesting, tilling, etc, apply to animals. Secondly, if you're going with anything other than pastured ruminants (cows + sheep), there's a huge amount of crops being grown to feed the animals. ie the overwhelming majority of pigs+chickens in the UK are factory farmed and fed soya etc. I can absolutely 100% guarantee you that none of these lives can be termed "humane" treatment. Thirdly, the evidence on animal deaths in crop production is extremely mixed. Intuitively it may make sense that you're killing all the mice, but is it not rather more realistic that the mice might notice the massive farm machinery coming towards them, and temporarily move out of the way? Indeed this is what some evidence shows (I can dig up a paper if you like). Fourthly, Dave generally likes to attribute as many negatives as possible to plant farming and as little as possible to animals. How many insects do cows kill? Finally, it's worth considering how scalable the type of agriculture Dave's favouring here is (pastured ruminants, mainly cows). How many people do you think the UK can feed with pastured cows alone? Bear in mind we are already massively net importers of food, and typically pastured cows are among the most inefficient users of agricultural land, be it arable or not. @@xandermarjoram8622

[@adas1023]

​@@thenayancat8802exactly this, he definitely stawmanned the benefits to the environment for vegetables, I think just assuming everything is being done in a monoculture with nitrogen leeching crops

[@jamesmccormick1747]

I tend to binge on documentaries and this was far better than anything I've watched recently on Netflix and the like. Incredible production for just yourself, and avoiding being sensationalist or dogmatic. Where there is speculation you come back quickly and identify that. Calm, methodical, curious but cautious, and clearly structured. I think there's a real public health point to it as well. Being surrounded by fast food when you have limited time, e.g. office work or travel, makes it very hard for people who are susceptible to bad eating habits to actively manage their diet and break free from it. Just knowing that something like this is an option could help people with that, and then wean them off the allure of fast food altogether. Anyway, I'm waffling... really enjoyed it :)

[@oszb]

Morgan spurlocks diet of 20% mcdonalds and 80% scotch was quite different.

[@WolfHeathen]

Yeah, that guy was in bad shape before he even started. The whole documentary was just one big fat lie.

[@conorsheehan9929]

Exactly! scoth whiskey is deadly . But, Irish whiskey is a different story altogether .

[@RobbieB2606]

😂😅

[@mnight207]

​@@Grandmaster-Kush A burger patty does not have carbs man.

[@turokforever007]

I love the way MSM spun his story many years after the fact. He had been a drinker for many years, so it had no real effect on what he was doing Now if he had only just started to drink then that is totally different.

[@badbunnyTUBE]

The clear reference indication on the video on the same time of your statements is a very clear and good way to give the audience info. Thank you for that. Shame it isn't used very often. Usually if someone has data to show they only mention it making it harder for a viewer to find the exact validating info if needed.

[@nichtmarkus647]

Well that's a title and channel combination I did not expect to see LOL

[@ArtZ00]

Came to say the same!

[@terraflow__bryanburdo4547]

If you follow Dave, and his diet journey, this was not a huge surprise.

[@vapofusion]

I would love to see you partner with some experts on a range of topics in this type of format, you are really good at explaining all these difficult and complex topics simply. Great stuff mate!

[@wilfwilliams]

Get a job on the television ! You are very good at it !

[@vapofusion]

@@wilfwilliams definitely!

[@jackuk4431]

I agree, the way he explains things is very engaging.

[@theoamvr]

Thank you Dave! The world (or KZbin at least) needs more long-form videos like this.

[@benkearton6351]

More importantly. Did you survive on McDonalds tea for 2 months?

[@benkearton6351]

Very interesting video though. Certainly given me a lot to think about. Thanks Dave

[@antoinebourcieu1]

Absolutely amazing video. Ended up watching it all in one sitting without realizing it lasted over an hour.

[@ematise]

Yeah you're right, save here. Pleasant voice, and even more interesting ideas.

[@iangpark]

Brilliant as usual Dave. It is so nice to have nutritional information from someone who genuinely has a selfless interest at heart and is not in it for any personal or financial gain. Absolutely fascinating stuff.

[@denislejeune9218]

Superb video once again Dave. As a great climber, you make even greater content not talking about climbing (or very little). I love myth-busters, and your logical approach is such a relief from so much that is produced... The edit and structure are also great, a lot of work well done indeed. So thanks. Again. It would be great to see you on a wide audience channel, such as TV. But yeah, that could ruin your climbing a wee bit. Still, I can see you one day as the 'Attenborough of public health' 😇.

[@dmoney7536]

KZbin has a far wider audience these days than tv. TV seems more official to those of us who grew up before the internet but it is a dying form of media

[@channelsicks]

Dave - This is such a great vid. level headed personal experiment backed with external references and concise logic that does go against what is popular for active folks nowadays. i will likely rewatch a couple times - great work

[@OwNLaM]

You're challenging what I think I know, that's top quality content. Thank you Dave.

[@OwNLaM]

I have a question for you if you don't mind, what blood type are?

[@GeraldineDevlin-y8u]

Seems a genuine guy … thanks for helping spread some knowledge & interest in this horrendous situation for us humans, just trying to live a happy /healthy life … albeit short ! ! ! ❤

[@wentoneisendon6502]

I rarely watch long form videos but this vid was absolutely top notch

[@bensinger6655]

It's funny how much the title of this video undersells the depth and quality of analysis here. Really, really interesting stuff.

[@wee_hold6300]

The whole material is mindblowing to some point, I did not expect such results of blood tests ,congrats;D but from my point of view there’s much more important thing here. Frank discussion, supported by facts, and somehow trying to make the watcher/ listener THINK about reality. Thank you for this kind of narrative Dave, 100min of great material:), best!

[@thephore]

Even though this goes against my mostly vegetarian "ways", this is proper, well researched and articulate content. Amazing stuff!

[@user-ih4vf8xt3e]

adjust when you get new information. Vegetarianism is evolutionarily and metabolically illogical. Theres plenty of research

[@TobiasJeppsson]

@@user-ih4vf8xt3e Not really. New studies of what our ancestors did eat thousand of years ago show that they ate primarly vegetables. It´s of course more energy efficient to collect vegetables than hunting animals, at least big animals.

[@user-ih4vf8xt3e]

@@TobiasJeppsson no, that's an isolated study, I think i know which one youre referring to. If you read the paper the authors stated it was an usual finding. There are some fossil records showing higher plant consumption but they are rare and likely due to lack of animal foods available. Starvation foods. There's a recent study from 2021 out of Tel-Aviv University about humans being apex predators for 2 million years see if you can find it. Whenever I post the study title my comment gets deleted

[@user-ih4vf8xt3e]

@@TobiasJeppsson no. I think I know what study you're referring to and even the authors said it was an unusual finding. They likely weren't able to hunt enough animals.

[@user-ih4vf8xt3e]

@@TobiasJeppsson find the 2021 study out of Tel-Aviv uni showing humans have been apex predators for two million years

[@goldenzues3106]

Do you film and edit everything yourself? It's such good work it feels like there's a team behind your videos.

[@climbermacleod]

Thanks, yes all filmed and edited by myself.

[@goldenzues3106]

@@climbermacleod Incredible effort!

[@MythAvatar]

Excellent video! I've definitely read the clear message; I'll go order 16 McDonalds burger patties and eat them every day forever. Thanks for clearing that up!

[@DuncanAtkinson]

Maybe throw in some gherkins, food for the git bacteria 🦠 😛

[@turbobros_online1561]

@@DuncanAtkinson idk what a gherkin is but you gotta feed those microbes if you are chasing optimal health IMO. A good variety of small amounts of fermented veg along with your meat seems to be very positive.

[@brandondivine]

This video is incredibly interesting, thank you for showing all of the scientific studies and whatnot to support your speaking points. Really made it easy to follow and makes me want to look into it more. Cheers!

[@snickycrow]

This was such a high quality video and came at a time when I've practically reintroduced red meat into my diet only incidentally and noticed a jump in some of my own climbing performance, but didn't think they had anything to do with each other. I'll have to monitor it and make an effort to try to recognise any differences in performance surrounding my diet as I continue to consume some more red meat than I have been previously. Thanks very much for the huge amount of effort that you put into this and your other videos.

[@lewishall5101]

I havent watched this video fully yet but as someone that has eaten only meat mainly beef for a year and a half I cant stress how much healthier i feel doing it. 5 stone weight loss to

[@LeoShoSilva]

It's the weight loss that's giving you the benefit.Try increasing that amount with meat only and see how you feel

[@lewishall5101]

@@LeoShoSilva I only eat meat anyway

[@LeoShoSilva]

@@lewishall5101 eat more meat to get to original weight...if it's meat only that's giving you the benefit,then it shouldn't be an issue

[@TheOmniscientAtheist]

@@LeoShoSilva you won't be able to get enough calories to do that on meat only. I think regardless of what type of diet, the calories are the key but it's easier to do it on meat only (as opposed to vegan or something) because it contains all of the amino acids and fats. That's why anyone can get good results only eating meat but to be a successful vegan you literally need a masters degree in nutrition or you will end up depleted in certain amino acids and/or just eating sugary junk.

[@LeoShoSilva]

@@TheOmniscientAtheist Everything has amino acids being vegan means you need to eat a lot of varied plants to get them all , luckily that stuff is usually low in calories.Not a lot of knowledge is required just a varied diet.Although mono eating is all the rage these days.Sorry I didn't realise this was about weight loss.

[@smeghead420]

Thanks Dave, you are absolutely killing it. We are not worthy, great video.

[@nutzerbezeichnung]

I appreciate the general sentiment of confronting dogma(especially in a science as fraught as nutritional science) and an interest in open discussion free from personal attacks and all too common online nastiness. People should read the papers behind the headlines and realise how often these studies are ambivalent in their findings or poorly constructed. And your experiments have left me curious about the how's and why's of your results. That being said, I think some of how you framed this discussion is pretty questionable. For one, the references to Super Size Me should be more critical. The movie has been all but debunked. Spurlock admitted to being an alcoholic during the filming, which might have contributed to his bad health outcomes. He was also forcing himself to over-eat, unlike you. And studies trying to replicate his results have pretty much come up with nothing. Also, when it comes to confronting dogma: there is a real question whether there even is such a thing as an obesity epidemic. Obesity research in general is riddled with stigma and bad science. Which goes together with you suggesting that the outrageous health care spending in the US is because of high rates of obesity. It absolutely isn't, it's a function of how dystopian their health care system is. It's definetly more complex than 'People in the US have higher BMIs'. Lastly, I think your suggestion that a normal meat free diet might lead to more animal cruelty than a meat diet seems far fetched. You might have access to animals raised more humanely than the average but those cows still need to be killed. And this isn't scalable. Pointing the finger at vegetarians for the animals killed in farming is in bad faith. Most meat eaters still want food from those same fields and most of the meat they eat is fed on farmed plants as well.

[@kris575d]

Hey @nutzerbezeichnung, The points about landuse being equally or more efficient when using animal protein was also were he lost me. The references that he cites to back up that statement does not support his argument and I think he would have come away stronger if he would have left that standpoint out of his video. The world is not capable of supporting billions of carnivores, but it could support billions of omnivores who eat slight amounts of animal protein. The reason his entire statement about landuse is invalid, is very simple. Animals are also feed cultivated plant foods, and if they are not they require a whole lot more land. In fact a free grazing herd of cattle requires a minimum of 1 acre per cow. This can of course only be on suitable arable land. Right now the world has around 1.5 billion cows (According to the US department of agriculture), while the world has 3.4 billions acres of arable land(World population review), so just to meet the current demand we would have to allocate half of the worlds arable land to cowgrazing. I like some of the other thoughts in the video, but this point just didnt sit right with me. I am btw not a vegetarian, but do hold a masters degree in biology.

[@filippersson4826]

Great documentary, well researched and a sound reasoning, 10/10!

[@Devoted96]

Dave, thanks for this type of content and all the work you do.

[@jaspermorris1313]

I for one would be interested indeed in a video on the supplements you take - after a seemingly bombastic title, this was very thought provoking, thanks very much Dave!

[@satanaz]

yeahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh finally this video is out! I was waiting for this one!!

[@nanbuso]

Awesome video Dave!! Congratulations for the effort, and the capability of condensing all of your work in 1h 20` I think the video goes deep in some aspects that are crucial in the way humanity is evolving It's not just only about eating beef pattys..... Congrats again!!!!! Cheers

[@ngobmx]

This was really interesting, thanks Dave. I love the longer format and the detailed information passed on. The fiber point was one I really was listening out for, was a good take and something I've felt for a while. Thanks again, I really appreciate all the time taken to read, think and produce this epic vid

[@dkeener13]

I was incredibly impressed with this video. It combines three things I really value -- curiosity, iconoclasm, and rationality -- in a way you don't usually see, all brought together in an entertaining package. And it's really got me thinking. Cheers, mate, I'm a fan of the content.

[@TimH123]

I don’t even have an issue with taking the life of an animal for food. The issue for me is the animal’s ability to suffer. Choosing to make a creature which can suffer, suffer, is not ethical, whatever reason you do it for, with almost no exceptions.

[@CJski]

Would you be ok with farming and killing an animal in a way such that it wouldn’t suffer?

[@zukodude487987]

Humans are animals, does that mean humans are OK to take thier lives as long as they dont suffer?

[@Cronama]

I've been on a carnivore diet for over two years and was wondering about doing something like this but was always suspicious of fast food.

[@ProdicleSon.]

I’m on the carnivore diet and whenever I’ve not had time to make my own meals at home I go to Maccies and get 9 burger patties. Always sorts me out. Obviously won’t be as good as eating a grass fed steak but it gets the job done.

[@ikennaanugwo5212]

I was going to Wendy's for their patties, so Everytime I ate them something was off. Went to McDonald's got their patties and I feel normal. I only go if I'm lazy. My gym is right next to a McDonald's so that's great too

[@stephenquinton9163]

Fantastic Video again Dave, incredibly thought-provoking - I've generally gone along with the view that a wide variety of food types, a colourful plate and not too much of anything is a fairly reliable rule of thumb for a healthy diet. It's really interesting to see that the opposite can also have positive impacts on health and fitness. Well done on the production quality and explaining these points in a clear and balanced way. Thanks very much.

[@Jaydan]

i love this approach to dieting and also training. Information is great, but the best way to see how YOUR body reacts, is to test it out. Bring an open mind and honestly access how you feel and perform. great video

[@MangoJunkie]

I really enjoy this video and the depth of research you go to to explore these complex topics. I just felt as though the section about replacing meat products was not as thorough. It was explained how the research is potentially flawed on meat consumption and that we destroy ecosystems for harvesting but it was stated as if to say that plant consumption is just as bad even though the evidence (as imperfect as it may be) still suggests otherwise and your argument just picked some flaws in the research. I'm not sure an argument can be made for meat consumption as being more ethical just yet. I just worry that the framing of this argument causes non-ethical meat eaters to have their bias confirmed which will probably do more damage than having those people eat plant based at least while ethical and sustainable solutions are being conceived and implemented.

[@jonnyscheibenhauer4059]

I had the same thoughts. I fully agree that a carnivorous or keto diet can be healthy but the environmental and ethical implications of meat consumption were downplayed by unfitting comparisons. Saying that plant farming kills animals and comparing that to animal consumption is already kinda shady, but comparing the effects of the "best way of beef production" to worst case industrial agriculture is just a disingenuous argument in my book

[@DDracee]

ethically the ideal would be a balanced diet, balance of meat and harvesting, on the sole premise of maintaining the carbon cycle, too much of either disrupts the carbon cycle and leads to infertile lands, which then leads to mass death of the local ecosystems and forces industries to move on to new land to destroy (which is actually a growing problem in USA) as for health, i don't think it really matters as long as you work from clean/raw ingredients, there's blue zones out there of pretty much all diets imaginable, just avoid sugars, processed foods and seed oils, this experiment pretty much panned out well just because turns out mcdonalds paties are actually 100% beef after all (they always claimed so but honestly never really believed it lol)

[@herrar6595]

Phenomenal Job! I have to say, half way in, that in my time on youtube, I have seen few such nuanced discussions on anything really. I don´t agree with all the points, but that´s what makes it special. You have created a magnet for healthy, nuanced disagreement.

[@danielhegar]

Amazing work Dave! Massive thanks for putting all this effort and touching on so many different angles for this experiment. I wonder for your max strength how much of a factor pure recovery was since you stopped training for specific finger strength. Big hug from Mexico man =)

[@rohanarchibald5853]

51year old climbing 30 + years been carnivor for a year now feel like 21 again . For me there is no downside to carnivor only positives. My body has taking a beating over the years and there's no more inflammation or pain after training heaps more motivation because I feel good ever day . It feels good to be 51 and one of the strongest climbers in the gym against all these super strong 20 year olds . This is my way of life now I will never go back to a western diet full of sugar

[@kevinjohn9244]

im a medical student about to give a presentation tommorow about the dogmas in obesity in global health and am finding this so interesting i absolutely love the amout of research and the referenced papers and the use of pubmed as it is exacly what i am doing for my research , keep up the good work

[@hanneshuch8965]

The mentioned traits »curiosity and scepticism« are something that the world desperately needs. Thanks for showing us how it's done! Keep up the great work and don't let the wisenheimers beat you down. All the best, Hannes Huch

[@benja_mint]

Good and interesting video. I haven't finished watching yet, but I notice a fallacy in the farming section. It's mentioned that crop-farming results in many animal deaths, and no food source is death free. True, But keep in mind that in many (most?) Western countries the animals we eat aren't grassfed but rather eat corn and soy etc.. So by eating an animal that ate plant crops you didn't avoid all the problems of crop farming. You just did multi-tasking and contributed to both.

[@catiemonteiro7283]

Brilliant and refreshing! I've been keto/carnivore for years to manage anxiety, so I've really been looking forward to watching this video! :) Thank you for articulating this (frustratingly contentious) subject so thoughtfully.

[@tristanvandermerwe3816]

Charlie is soon to be on the menu

[@jessietreverton3191]

This is some of the most well researched, intelligent, open minded and important content on KZbin, it should be on mainstream TV and seen by everybody especially doctors. Thank you so much Dave.

[@michaeldavidsonjr]

I appreciate your detailed discussion, inclusion of scientific lit, and willingness to tread into such perilous terrain. In discussing the destruction that can come from unhealthy plant agriculture, I think you neglect to account for the fact that animals farmed for food have to eat too--and they eat plants. If our plant farming needs reform, it affects both plant and animal eaters. Moreover, because cows have to eat so many plants to produce enough food for a single human meal, any negative effects from plant faming are actually compounded.

[@1981stonemonkey]

Reads title... "No you didn´t. That´s clickbait."" "Well, but it´s down-to-earth Dave MacLeod. Let´s just have a look..."

[@maizalima2493]

I’ve experimented with many diets too and meat and eggs are what heals my body and makes me feel the best. Thanks for doing this.

[@breezyillo2101]

I didn't even realize this was Dave's channel until I read the comments lmao. Finna roll up to the crag with a no-carb happy meal

[@RhysHoltom]

Just start by saying i never bother commenting on youtube videos.... But this has to be one of the most well structured videos ever ever seen, full of clean information the delivery is excellent. This is so easy to digest, all i have to say is kudos Dave you absolutely smashed this video Thank you very much. Also great to find out you are a proficient climber, you have a new subscriber! Thanks again!

[@jimmahgee]

Proficient is an understatement!

[@The20khz]

Proficient 😂

[@boohoo5419]

before even watching this.. the bread and sauce is the problem.. OBVIOUSLY!

[@FulguroGeek]

the cheese too.. eating salty beef is ok .. its meat!

[@yonaz3334]

Spurloks health issues was mostly due to alcoholism.

[@AlexeiDrummond]

Love the way you think Dave. You are clearly an academic at heart; sharp-minded and insightful. It is a pity that you haven't got a large research grant and network of collaborators to help you test some of your hypotheses properly. I enjoyed your highlights from the literature and was shocked but not surprised by the statistic that 60% of calories eaten by Americans came from flour, vegetable oil and sugar. Personally I'd love to give the keto diet a proper go, but the first time I tried it for a couple of weeks the adaptation proved difficult for me. I need to find a period of time when I am not too busy and can do it justice.

[@rikvdmark]

Amazing video, very well documented and explained. Very educational, food for thought :)

[@stuffstuffington39]

When it comes to carbon lost from soil when plowed etc mentioned at about 22:20. For factory farms wouldn't it be true that the soil would still be used to make the processed food to feed the cow? Genuine question, not a statement :)

[@michaellauer1661]

so well done and informative, thanks!

[@Richard0292]

You're intelligent and thoughtful. I was looking for something long form on KZbin to watch to get away from 10 minute snipets and this hit the bill perfectly. I'll be checking out the rest of your chanel. 🙂

[@BoulderConnoisseur]

20:24 As an environmental scientist I've heard pro-meat bias time and time again. The reference he links is to a paper trying to claim that livestock (even beef) production is sustainable, though the paper skims over its section on GHG emissions from livestock itself. It comes as no surprise to me that the main author of the paper is the President of the "Belgian Association for Meat Science and Technology", in addition to receiving funding for the paper from the "North Dakota Beef Association". Nutrition is by far the most obfuscated field of science to find credible data since the funding is usually coming from organisations that are acting in their best interest, this is something the general public, and even a lot of nutritional science students i've met don't understand. The consensus within the environmental science community has been for decades that cattle herd numbers need to reduce significantly if we want to have any chance of making our rapid intensification of agriculture sustainable. Regardless of all this, love ya Dave you're a beast.

[@Geoffreyg41]

Thank you so much for your input.

[@ascendtoaesthetics]

natural animal agriculture is best for environment.

[@PinkFZeppelin]

Who funds the studies that say the opposite?

[@ms-jl6dl]

What does it mean "sustainable"?

[@ScottMillar]

how much do you pay for just the patties ?

[@AmroNaddy]

Fascinating video, I’m mostly vegan / plant-based and have been bouldering for about a year (which is how I know of Dave’s work), but try to maintain a broad perspective. At first, I was really resistant to some of the ideas in the video, but re-watching it with more of an open mind has been super interesting. Dave is articulate as always, love seeing this food content

[@kennette2121]

subscribed because your video on shoulder separation helped me so much when i had the same injury. I love your intentional and well researched approach to all things! As another comment noted, content like this where the internet shines its brightest! keep up the great work!

[@NorroTaku]

should have done bloodwork before and after maybe one in between too this here delivers very little usable data except the subjective experience

[@FreefromTyranny]

great video Dave! I love to see the data you have tracked over time. As a guy, in his mid 40's who also climbs, you have been a great source of knowledge over the years for my own personal fitness, health, climbing, and training journey. I appreciate what you do, and the modesty, honesty, and humility you project into the world.

[@Mee0tchy]

Words can't describe how much I appreciate the effort and attention to detail Dave has applied towards this topic. It is presented beautifully and articulated in a way that is both unbiased and convincing simultaneously. I have personally found ketogenic diets to be helpful in profound ways, and find comfort through Dave's legwork in researching and presenting science-based evidence surrounding this topic. Bravo, inspiring, 10/10 video Dave!

[@slof69]

regenerative beef is better for the environment than all this plant based stuff just ignore the media and do your own research like this guy

[@betaxxl]

Love the longer format / kind of a documentary. I hope we will see more videos on the subject in the future.

[@NewMinority]

I eat clean and when I’m in a pinch I grab beef only from fast food! Beef is a superfood

[@davidw789]

This isn't what I was expecting when I clicked on the video but I'm glad I've spent this time listening to a well organized rock climber talk about different topics related to nutrition and ethics and more

[@ercle88]

Thank you for making this very informative video! I've not switched to a meat based diet (or even increased my meat intake at all after watching) but I am coming back to comment now as it caused my to re-evaluate my relationship with sugar, flour, and vegetable oil. After a long period of struggling to understand what a healthy diet means for me personally (and more recently struggling to loose unhealthy excess weight) this video prompted simple changes that have resulted in dramatic effects.

[@Aapje344]

One of the most interesting videos, amazing to post this to the climbing subset of people interested in nutrition. really eye-opening and grounded, thanks so much Dave.

[@Hidinginyourcupboard]

RIP Morgan Spurlock. Apparently he was anyway not healthy when he started that documentary as portrayed. Makes sense that humans are best adapted to consuming whole foods 👍🏼 Really good point about what is an ‘extreme’ diet. Interesting!

[@danimal818]

mans was an alcoholic....

[@CyberChud2077]

1. Sugar 2. Portion size 3. Inflammatory additives and preservatives, seed oils 4. Carb load 5. Low quality materials (vegetables are better quality in Britain and Europe) Even the plain burgers have a litany of strange additives. The eggs are probably your best option since allegedly they really are just eggs.

[@muscularibuprofen69]

Awesome video, very informative and certainly gave me food for thought on what I eat and what I feed my family. Very true about what you say regarding 'extreme' diets - the internet people are quick to judge and vilify anyone that strays from the resultant societal norms that we find ourselves faced with, yet do not question how and why we got to this point. Much respect for following through with this. Keep doing what you are doing, for one, you have my support.

[@skartimusprime4779]

Glad you mention the mental aspect, as someone with BPD, the immediate result of hitting ketosis is a night and day difference in baseline happiness. I keep a pretty low carb diet generally, which I think helps a lot, but ketosis is actually incredible. It makes you realise how far off the mark you are unknowingly - you might not even realise how low your baseline is until your brain starts running on ketones. I recommend it to people I know who have issues but I don't think any of them have tried it.

[@Exi01]

Can't walk past a McDonald's now without seeing a mental image of Dave scarfing down a stack of patties and crushing some V14 roof

[@dqdr]

Hi Dave, thanks for this. It’s been absolutely invaluable for shifting my mindset even in the short time it’s been up. I’ve returned to climbing 25 years after I got my climbers badge in Scouts. But the frustration I’m suffering currently is that my weight and eating habits are wildly different to the young Dan and it’s stifling my progress. Although I feel that I have some balance in my diet - it’s majority vegetarian, majority freshly home cooked by me - but I have, despite this, an extraordinary and seemingly unbreakable attachment to junk food (the psychiatric trigger of which, is almost certainly complex and better left undisturbed - nothing weird, just had a slightly unusual upbringing) I have McDonalds/KFC/etc probably twice/thrice a week and I’ve been wondering why despite climbing with similar regularity I’m not dropping weight and am having outrageous dips in energy, concentration and mood throughout the days. And this has been happening in essence, for decades. So much of what you discussed resonated with me and my own battles that it feels like a weight off the shoulders, if that makes sense. I did some research after you posted and I watched, and I realised, as well as the fast food hypnosis, how insane my carbohydrate intake is, because I’m making compensation in my diet for the lack of meat (my partner is the vegetarian) with things like pasta/rice/bread. So I’ve drawn up what feels like a promising and achievable keto plan and am going to try it for as long as you did the burgers for and see where I’m at. Thanks again for the video Dave, I don’t think you could have timed it any better.

[@bonomonkey]

I hope you make it and am glad you got back into climbing!

[@kenadams5504]

Just burgers each day (even fastfood ones) are a Carnivore diet...the species appropriate diet our ancestors ate for millions of years ,and the healthiest diey we can possibly eat .Unprocessed meat cooked without oils would be healthier ,and, including fish once a week would be even healthier still.

[@Crimpitsucka]

Good video. Well paced for such a long piece. Thanks for experimenting, lots to ruminate on.

[@gillianbooth8225]

Really interesting video and results - well discussed thanks

[@lukebacon6560]

Dave, you overlooked something critical in the conversation about sustainability and ethics. Your claim that soil plowing, fertilization, pesticide use, etc in raising plant foods create emissions and degrades soil quality is undeniably true. But what you seem to have forgotten to consider is that animals raised for meat for human consumption also eat farmed grains and soy. Actually the majority of farmed crops go to feed livestock, not people. According to a Yale study, it takes 25 calories of feed to produce 1 calorie of beef. You could feed the same amount of people on less farm land by feeding the population majority plant foods. I know that isn’t directly applicable to your situation because you eat from local farms, but 99% or more of all animals consumed are raised in CAFOs, eating farm raised corn and soy. This can be extrapolated out to your ethics argument as well. If you’re worried about the field mice, worms, bugs, etc that end up as bi-kill, a plant based diet will cause less because it uses less land. Please address this and let me know what you think.

[@climbermacleod]

I didn't overlook it and specifically called for McDonalds to stop feeding the human edible parts of grains to cows. The points you bring up were what I was meaning when I said it's the solution to these problems is the more contentious part. You go over the same problems I was trying to point out in the video - a focus on calories. We have an excess of calories in the food supply and a poverty of nutrients. A cow can take 0.6g of human edible protein and convert this to 1g of protein with a superior ratio of AAs. So the issue of how to direct resources through food production is a wee bit more complicated than a calorie for calorie equation.

[@lukebacon6560]

@@climbermacleod thank you for a thoughtful answer. I'd really appreciate seeing you sit down with another qualified person who's opinion differs from yours on this topic. even when digging into research first hand (which I have done) can be dubious for non-clinicians because methodology of studies can have a huge influence on results. eg: testing fasted blood lipids vs post prandial. I've been a big fan of yours for a long time, almost as long as I've been vegan! I can appreciate the message of getting people off processed food and refined sugar despite our differing diets!

[@Geoffreyg41]

@@lukebacon6560 Thank you for putting this point across so clearly. I tried with less success. I'd appreciate an exchange with a specialist, because I too have a feeling Dave's approach overlooks the impact of beef production which is specifically pointed out by the ipcc as a big source of GHG. And I don't reckon there's enough arable land on earth to feed 8 billion people burger patties.

[@michellejohnson6207]

It's an AMAZING way to eat and thrive...I'm INCREDIBLY THANKFUL for changing to The Proper Human way of eating 🎉🥳

[@adas1023]

I think you've taken into account only some of the worst agricultural practices for vegetables and only the best for animal products for your examples on food production. Vegetables and animals in terms of land use to be converted into nutrients are always going to be broadly similar. Monocultures are a problem that can be found to cause a huge amount of environmental impact, but the cause there is purely economics, ie it's cheaper to do than a more considered but labour intensive approach to farming (also true for the most destructive animal agricultural practices in that monocultures of animal feed can be even more destructive). Animals get their nutrition from eating a shitload of greens, and the nutrients remain in them which we can then eat, but this is a really inefficient way of getting those nutrients. I don't think processed food is the best for us as human beings but to get nutritious, environmentally considered food for the globe I don't think meat can be a major part of all our diets. animal products (like eggs) and nitrogen positive crops can be a part of this overall view of getting our nutrition and soil to be maintained appropriately for the global population

[@SzechuanChickenDog]

Just wow...the most eloquent description of all the points we need to think about in the end .. absolutely top notch documentary...I subscribed. I wish some of the carnivore diet propagators in the us could deliver messages this clearly and not get caught up in the dogma and infighting between specific diets. You, sir, are extremely intelligent and balanced. Im so happy people like you are alive in a world that constantly makes me doubt my sanity and my outlook on life. Thank you

[@joegrainger-hull3769]

Great that you dug into other possible mechanisms by which contrasting forms of agriculture (arable/ pastoral) can have the opposite effect on carbon emissions than commonly cited - IE carbon loss through plowing with arable. The argument that in this instance pastoral farming is more sustainable than arable seems to then rest on your caveat of 'if done in the right way': if carried out on an intensive scale, as is the case with the majority of beef production, similar carbon loss may well be seen through the effects of overgrazing. You seem to state that crop production may be degrading the soil with the implied meaning that pastoral agriculture is not. Though it is true that after countless years of repeated harvests soils are left nutrient deficient, this is not an argument to replace all arable with pastoral - the converse argument could be made that overgrazing would do the same thing. An implied conclusion of yours seems to be that animal agriculture may in fact be more sustainable than plant production, though I would posit that both can be equally damaging in their modern, intensive forms. There is no sliding scale between plant and animal production when it comes to sustainability: both, if managed correctly, are integral parts of healthy food and farming systems.

[@climbermacleod]

Agree with pretty much all of that.

[@euanhamilton-rigg]

Fascinating, thanks Dave

[@calumacky]

Great video and fairly balanced which is nice to see. I think the environmental and ethics sections are a bit of a post hoc rationalisation that follows from the health benefits that Dave thinks are achievable through red meat though. For the environment, there is an overwhelming amount of research showing how bad ruminant farming can be, especially in terms of emissions, and also other animal products - but there is a distinction between different animal products, even a distinction between beef from beef cows vs dairy cows. I don't think you can blame this push for reduction on some sort of agenda (bar the agenda of reducing our impact on the environment) as many organisations recommend switching to lower impact animal products rather than eliminating them altogether. There is also a push to switch to more plant based options due to the lesser impact that research has shown. Soil carbon sequestration has limits as only so much can be sequestered so using the definition of sustainable mentioned, would imply that this is also not a long term solution, when ruminants will continue outputting methane without any sequestration occurring. Considering a global solution, I can't see a good reason to go against the myriad of environmental organisations that recommend reduction. The ourworldindata graphs shown here also can be shown per protein, not just weight and kcal, and the protein rich plants foods do better in this case also. We can combine plant proteins to achieve an effective amino acid profile whilst reducing environmental impact. Absorbability, protein quality and protein requirements are mostly exaggerated, for non-professional athletes anyway. Office workers playing 5 a-side once a week do not need 200g of "high quality" protein for example, even though that can be achieved with many styles of eating. From the ethical side, that's obviously very personal, but I also think the rationale is following on from the health argument and leans a bit too much on the fact that we must kill something to live. We should consider the beings that are being killed e.g. is the life of a cow "worth" more than an insect? If Dave were to discover that consuming chicken resulted in better health and performance, would he refrain from doing so on ethical grounds because the cows he's currently eating result in fewer deaths? Would he consider the capacity for well being in the animals? Maybe I'm wrong and can be corrected if so but I believe this way of eating for Dave i.e. close to all meat isn't a continuous thing? (Edit: yeah, confirmed in the video) At least for many people on these diets that will be the case - for those people it is clearly not a big ethical concern as to what they eat as they can dip in and out. That's not really how ethics should work if you consider something important. Perhaps I'm missing the point and the argument is that there is basically no difference in what we eat due to the unseen impacts that are hard to qualify and quantify - but I think there are many cases where we can confidently say this specific thing is objectively worse than that specific thing and if that matters ethically to you, you should choose the less harmful one. I suppose that is what Dave is attempting to do with the meat he usually tries to source, I do commend that but I also know that is not sustainable, environmentally or financially, for society at large and that needs to be taken into consideration in this discussion. Lots of effort put into this video and it is fairly balanced which is great to see but I don't fully buy that section of the video. Edit: the very next section I coudn't agree more with - junk food places popping up everywhere with no alternatives is an absolute joke that shouldn't be happening!

[@matthew6732]

Brilliant, highly informative video Dave! I am really curious though, about what effect your diet growing up might have had on all of this. Not just your propensity to thrive on keto/carnivore diet, but also struggles with depression etc. I seem to remember from your long video on a keto diet for athletes, you talked about your diet at school, sugary donuts and Irn-Bru for lunch every day I think it was (?). If you had had a healthier diet growing up do you think you might now do better on a mixed diet? Be less prone to easily gain weight etc? Anyway, thanks again!

[@Code_377]

Excellent video - this needs to be shown on all the news channels and spread far and wide

[@Luke_MoonWalker]

Livestock raised properly, meaning grass fed through their whole life cycle, actually restore the environment. They exist in a closed loop where everything they consume gets deposited back in to the soil. The water and grass they consume gets excreted back in to the soil to replenish it and grow more healthy grass. The process of them moving around and foraging removes CO2 from the atmosphere by churning up the soil and then pushing it in to the ground by stamping it back down. The healthier grass that grows also removes CO2 and creates more oxygen. The problems come from commercial monocropping and then moving those products around to be used as feed for the animals that are kept in small dirt lots. Raising ruminant animals properly is ecologically motivated, while raising them via factory farming is economically motivated. Meat is not the problem... Money is.

[@MalavitaOfBB]

This is becoming the best nutrition channel on KZbin. Amazing that all we needed to understand nutrition is an amazing rock climber with common sense and a degree in nutrition ;).

[@alexanderbogander2671]

Thanks a lot for the great video Dave. Although I’ve been a fan of yours for 10 years plus, my wife is not a climber and we just sat and watched the whole episode. I think that’s a testament to the quality of the video, both the content and how it was put together. As I also have eczema, you’ve inspired me to try the steak and eggs diet for a week or so. 2 questions. If you fried the steaks (and eggs), what do you fry them in? Butter? Or lard? And secondly, how many cups of tea would you say you drink per day? You say ‘a lot’ in the video, but this differs in Scotland from village to village! Thanks!

[@climbermacleod]

Thanks, that's appreciated. Butter or lard is fine. I use lard myself because I don't like butter. I would not like to count how many cups of tea I drink.

[@ascendtoaesthetics]

use tallow to cook. don't drink tea.

[@allesindwillkommen]

Never believed in the myths that fast food chains are pure evil for your health. Not in this day and age in the countries with strict food regulations. As far as I know McDonald's burger patties here are basically pure beef that is locally produced. It doesn't even qualify as "processed" meat as some might think as it is just ground beef (in comparison to sausages or bacon, for example, that many eat for breakfast or at grill parties etc. That's real processed meat!!!). You should probably be more worried about french fries and sauces that contain extra fat, salt and sugar. But even those are not the worst things you can have in your diet. So chill and enjoy your fast food meal as part of your regular diet. Just make sure you also eat a variety of other fresh produce and lead an otherwise healthy lifestyle.

[@allesindwillkommen]

@@Denis-z6s I wrote about this in my comment though what exactly you should be more worried about.

[@TheBenchPressMan]

exactly, you can’t sell a “beef burger” that isn’t actually a beef burger

[@CKWINN11]

​@@TheBenchPressMan well they actually call them Hamburgers but Ham is pork and they dont contain any pork so explain that one? 😂

[@lewiswood6440]

Great content Dave. I think all of your content on nutrition is interesting and certainly makes you consider what’s healthy. Would love to hear more about the carnivore diet and your foot eczema

[@shokland]

Thank you for yet another thoughtful and well researched contribution to a complicated topic. And thank you for keeping it complicated and not resorting to easy binary conclusions.