I Know Who The First Victim Of FNAF Is (I probably don’t) - FNAF Theory

[@DeskFanMan87]

Hey Everyone! Apologies if the first 6 mins occasionally have some bad/crackly audio, there were a lot of technical issues. Hopefully everyone enjoys, especially the middle segment. I may post it as its own video.

[@literallyalois2966]

Matpat: *leaves Game Theorists* The FNAF Timeline: "Welp, time to get solved."

[@joshuavis2736]

I really love your use of “what’s seen in shadows is often misunderstood in the mind of a child”. I feel like those 3 clues were kinda left alone as times gone on which is fair enough since who knows how accurate they still are but the idea that children are mistaking people putting the suits on as children being stuffed is creative. William could’ve also gotten the idea to stuff the kids based on the rumour

[@DeskFanMan87]

I also think the toy chica beak hint was pointing to the toy animatronics being based on actual toys, hence the name. (Also that Toy Chica did the bite of 87 but I’ll let people believe it’s mangle for now lol)

[@0celot9]

@DeskFanMan87 Toy Chica definitely did the bite of 87 (If it exists). Glad you agree

[@damkylan3]

I believe CC is first, and my reasons have to do with FNAF4's consistent theme of showing us the origins of the entire timeline. You got the four plushies referencing the MCI, you got the bullies in masks mirroring Happiest Day, you got a plethora of Happiest Day references in general, you got Fredbear plush being unique among the plushies like Golden Freddy will one day be, you got a reference to the Shadows, a reference to springlock victims, etc. And ofc... the Puppet is the only one who never shows up. Because CC is the Puppet stand-in. He has the stripes and tear streaks, he dies in the same pose as Shadow Puppet, he gives life to the plushies as his "friends", Fredbear pledging to put him back together mirrors Happiest Day when the Puppet helps Golden Freddy move on (since HD as a whole is a reflection/reversal of CC's tragic birthday), and he dies because of an act of bullying... like Charlie does. Perhaps even at the same exact location. So if FNAF4's theming is consistent, this is the "origin" or the foreshadowing of the Puppet, as with everything else in the game. Some believe it's a literal origin, in that CC's tremendous pain in life left a curse-like effect on the franchise and made everything in the timeline happen. But that's still a little out there for me. Of course, it is entirely possible that even if ALL this is accurate, it changed over time and is no longer relevant. But at the moment, I still believe this holds true. Of course, it could also be as simple as Puppet not being in 4 because it doesn't exist yet, and is created by Henry after CC dies for general security and safety of the kids. But that's not wordy enough. lol And also, there's nothing to suggest that, even if it does logically follow.

[@Kek393]

Honestly lately i started liking the idea that CC was left in a coma after the Bite and William knew his son wasn't gonna make it so he went off and "punished" Henry preemptively by taking away from him what was very soon going to be taken away from him.

[@moonknightanimations1251]

The case with Freddy being the Save Him Bear is intresting to me. Because the recent lore surrounding Fall Fest, and stories like "The Mimic" and "Dittophobia," might introduce the concept that the Freddy gang are much older than we thought. Being mascot suits from Fall Fest. Perhaps even making Phone Guy's "20 years" line be actually correct again after 10 years lol. So this could have implications when it comes to Charlotte's death date. But then again, this is a relatively new concept. It may or may not have been in Scott's mind since 2017.

[@vahle2751]

this is the first time i've watched a fnaf theory video that explains almost the exact same timeline i worked out in my mind, ever since fnaf 4. Except for the interpretation of "what's seen in shadows is often misunderstood in the mind of a child", but yours makes so much sense!!

[@DeskFanMan87]

@@vahle2751 what’s your idea for that line? Just curious about others interpretations

[@thedarkdevil1661]

13:30 I believe Elizabeth dies January 7th 1985. "1,5,7,8" ambience, from SL, HAS to be an important date for Elizabeth/Baby (Same ambience type as Phone Guy call in Fnaf 4, but with Baby). I believe it's Elizabeth's death date, and the only time that happens after 1983 is Jan 85, July 85, or dates in 87, and since July 1st 1985 is too soon after the MCI I believe it's Jan 7th 1985. As for Charlie's possession, the books have it as... (I believe these points are what happens in the games, hence why i made the points more... broad): 1. Charlie dies 2. Somehow Charlie returns (Henry creates Charlie bots/Charlie possesses the puppet) 3. William wants to replicate what happens to Charlie, so he creates Circus Baby (he steals 4th charlie/creates Baby from scratch) 4. Elizabeth dies from Baby. (Book Henry is said to have taken Baby back by the time of the MCI, meaning Elizabeth is already dead) 5. MCI happens June 85 6. Book Henry kills himself July 85 + Game Henry stays alive, might be the lack of illusion discs. Or something more.

[@a_world_worth_living_in]

Ok I love this whole editing so much and the take of: CC was, yes, bitten before the death of Charlie, but died after. It makes sanse, the wound to the frontal Lobe wouldn't be deadly but put CC in a Coma, William then kills Charli, her being a first would mean Tha he still didn't have a "Modus operandi" and once he saw The Puppet acting different and thinking about the possibility of eternal life by possession. Putting CC into Fredbear himself, killing him. Especially if the suit had been left in an humid space for years after they closed the diner. Now I'm waiting for Scott and team to just put random stuff in the next books and games so we lose even this tight string of time line

[@comicbrooks1364]

I love this NARRATIVE SCENARIO section alot. (Also just the whole video) I feel the storytelling is something people forget about, instead focusing on timelines and dates and set events rather than the narrative and characters themselves. So, seeing a theory focusing on THAT aspect, as well as the details, was great to watch. Excellent work mate. 👍

[@0celot9]

I think midnight motorist tells us if cc or charlie die first. Due to “later that night” in the files, it seems to be the night charlie died. It just depends if you believe cc is the runaway or lump of dirt in the woods. Personally I think michael is the runaway and cc is dead, and responsible for the footprints, but it could go either way.

[@DeskFanMan87]

It could depend on that, but what if I don’t even believe Mustard Man is William 👀

[@0celot9]

Thats an interesting idea, I would like to see what you think the minigame is about.

[@latlequin1]

@@DeskFanMan87 Well I mean it's confirmed now lmao

[@BudgetAthena]

I wanna take a sec to acknowledge the animation segment: it is awesome, very well done. It must have taken a lot of time and effort! Kudos to you and/or the editor.

[@DeskFanMan87]

@@BudgetAthenaReally appreciate it, it was all me on my phone! Took close to 3 weeks, plus needing to remake all the backgrounds from the games.

[@BudgetAthena]

@@DeskFanMan87 And done on your phone? That's impressive, great work once again!

[@archieharrodine3925]

I like a lot about this theory especially the rebrand after the bite i think it makes a lot of sense!! I wanted to add one thing it made me think of: More evidence to why Charlie dies at Fredbear’s So from Ruin we know that the Pizzaplex is built on top of FnaF 6 location, and that the FnaF 6 location is built on top of Sister location. i agree it is very likely that FnaF 6 location is the same as where Charlie dies, due to the back alley similarity, and the poetic justice part from Henry. Therefore where Charlie dies is built on top of Sister location. In sister location we see that the crying child’s house is being powered/monitored. Which suggests that it is likely close by. We know that the pizzeria in FnaF 4 is close to the crying child’s house, therefore would be close to sister location, therefore likely the pizzeria that is built above sister location. Which overall makes it very likely in my opinion that Charlie dies at the FnaF 4 location.

[@KaiWood-yq7kd]

I thought it was the bite victim that got bit first and then put into a coma but whilst bite victim was alive but in coma William killed Charlie and then the bite victim died a few weeks after charlie died

[@Takejiro24]

I'd like to think Midnight Motorist adds an extra layer of motivation to William killing Charlotte. Not only was he heavily drunk (if JR's was a bar) but he and his family were living in a seemingly smaller house in the middle of the woods (compared to the one they were in while in a neighborhood in FNAF 4) which suggested to me they were facing financial difficulties, fueling his jealousy of Henry further. And who's to say William wasn't phased out of Fredbear's after the death of his son? Your idea of Henry rebranding their restaurant inspired that idea for me. Ultimately, I agree with this video. Both Crying Child and Charlotte died at Fredbear's ("Symmetry, my friend") with the former being the first.

[@DeskFanMan87]

You’re probably right about the whole extra motivation thing, but honestly I just dislike William having the crutch of alcohol for the kill. Just IMO it should ALL be him. It almost detracts from it for me if he just had the excuse of being drunk.

[@Takejiro24]

@@DeskFanMan87 Oh, I hope it didn't come across that I was suggesting him being drunk somehow excused him murdering Charlie. It 100% *does not* in the same way drunk driving isn't excused (especially if they hurt someone while driving). Just an extra explanation that's compounded by the death of his son and the necessity of his family moving (and resulting money problems). It gave him that extra push/loosening/lowering of inhibitions that alcohol tends to do (so I hear). Maybe they also had to move for Michael's sake? I can't imagine him staying in his old neighborhood going well after what he and his friends did. There were *several* different avenues William could have taken to assuage his troubles; killing his best friend's child is *not* one of them. The fact that William went on to murder 5-11 more kids (if you believe the DCI is another incident from the MCI) and deliberately harvested their remnant in the Funtimes (along with having had plans to do so for more kids with Circus Baby's Pizza World before it shut down on its opening day) *all while sober* tells me he was always twisted to some degree. He just hid it better.

[@DeskFanMan87]

@@Takejiro24 oh don’t worry, I understand you’re not using that to excuse anything, I just feel that him being drunk is an unnecessary detail for the game to try to add. I just feel it takes away some agency from the first kill. It’s more of a personal story gripe than anything.

[@terreliv]

I love your art style. I love how all the theorists animate things differently.

[@DeskFanMan87]

Thank you! Pretty much all of it key framed and done on a phone, goal was pretty much “FNAF minigames but smoother”

[@foxybro7997]

Well I believe now that the bite victim is the first victim but I still believe that Charlie is the final speaker of FNAF 4 and that Charlie die when bite victim was still in the hospital

[@_H1p0_]

Another peak video just dropped holy shit. I agree with almost everything in it, especially Afton's motives for killing Charlie. The one thing I disagree on is BV surviving the bite long enough to outlast Charlie, in my interpretation of ShatterVictim, Charlie has to die after BV does, because the Puppet seemingly has a piece of BV and his memories in 3, specifically Mangles Quest. I also think Afton knew BV was broken, just through some feeling he had, like how he knew Henry's soul broke a piece off onto the Ella doll. William just knew somehow, possibly something paranormal happened with BV pre 4, which would give Afton a motive to spy on him (with WillPlush ofc)

[@DeskFanMan87]

Thanks! and totally fair perspective on BV living so long. I agree there is a good chance that William just somehow knew about supernatural stuff even without Charlie’s death, I just really like to try to fit as much together as I can. It’s a partial flaw in my theorizing, but it leads to some fun conclusions. It’s a weird loop for me. If Charlie dies before BV, I don’t think that SAVEHIM can be Fredbear’s, but if it’s after the bite you need to justify why Fredbear would stay in operation at that location. I guess it depends on how you view Midnight Motorist and who runaway is and all that. One day I’ll talk about it.

[@_H1p0_]

@@DeskFanMan87 I think like you said it could just be chalked up to a freak accident and a case of bullying gone too far. I think that TakeCakeBear's black accessories were an attempt to distance Fredbear from the bite, "It was purple hat fredbear who did it, black hat fredbear would never" in the limbo period before Freddy's was set to open. The black accessories were probably based on the old "70s Freddy" we see in SB and Ruin. It also explains why Golden Freddy's hat and bow tie are black and not purple So for me it goes: Black Accessory Fredbear -> Purple Accessory Fredbear -> Bite of 87 tarnishes Fredbear's reputation -> Back to Black Accessory Fredbear, who's basically just Golden Freddy My Midnight Motorist views don't actually effect any of this because they're not the most orthodox. I currently believe there's tons of evidence that Gabriel was the runaway during the MCI lmao

[@DeskFanMan87]

@@_H1p0_ I like the hat timeline a lot. Also, haven’t we talked on twitter? I swear I knew I recognized you. If not imma look stupid but yeah, I’m definitely with you on midnight motorist being around the MCI. Who its exactly about, pshhh I dunno, either Gabriel, Andrew, or someone else. Honestly legitimately hoping the new racer game ties more into it. It won’t but a guy can dream.

[@_H1p0_]

@@DeskFanMan87 Yeah we did!

[@_H1p0_]

wait bo83 not 87 lmao

[@maikoI16]

this is so well edited

[@devereauxrobxyahoo]

My theory has always been MCI, Charlie, Elizabeth, Crying Child. Why did the security bot need to even exist prior to any murders happening? That has always bothered me in timeline where Charlie dies first. My theory has always been MCI happens, the MCI souls wander the restaurant until Charlie’s murder. Charlie helps each spirit find their body(inside the animatronics) and that’s what causes them to be able to possess them. William build Baby to kill more kids and Elizabeth is killed which is when he discovers remnant and the animatronics being possessed. Crying child is killed, and that is when William vows to use remnant to bring him back. William builds fun time animatronics to capture more kids and continue his remnant experiments. He gathers the MCI animatronics melts them down and injects them into the Funtime animatronics. Finally William gets Springtrapped after the MCI chase him into Spring Bonnie.

[@AAmelia--___--Hankss]

Some interesting points but at 3:09 it shows that Charlie died in '83 and if I remember correctly the MCI was in '85

[@devereauxrobxyahoo]

@@AAmelia--___--Hankss The books kinda flip flopped. There is clear implication that Charlie died at Fredbears.

[@AAmelia--___--Hankss]

@@devereauxrobxyahoo I won't deny that I am a firm believer that Charlie died outside fredbears I think it would make the most sense. And yea the books aren't really the most accurate with game lore but it is the only death date we have for her. There is also the pizzeria sim ending with the missing children graves including one on a hill under a tree that im pretty sure matches the description from the books for Charlie's grave.

[@ethbeatthem4836]

There is always a monkey wrench no matter who’s first and where dates from the book have it version of the events. And then movie also have a different version that even more different and you get it. Main Points that can’t all fit cleanly together are: Help wanted 2 tombstone order, Books alternate 1985 date, Elizabeth empty room, “Wound first inflicted” line, “Remember what you saw” and “hair” in suit from FNAF 4, Midnight Motorist “later That night,” and final “I was the first” line in UCN. Combine all of these and you get a cluster of information that can’t all fit together cleanly with jumping to making up Territory. This is why we can’t solve the timeline without jumping a shark in a pool of sharks.

[@ekeditz20]

Wow, I love the 8 bit parts it's very entertaining! And your commentary is very professional ☺️

[@jesuscamou602]

i feel like midnight motorist is ment to chronologically place charlies death before the crying child

[@DeskFanMan87]

At this point with FLAF evidence, probably

[@greeninjacraft]

I think the MCI happened before Elizabeth's death because otherwise why would he stuff the MCI kids in the Freddy's suits instead of the Funtime suits he had lying right there which were made specifically for holding children. Furthermore, if at that point he realized that Elizabeth was in Baby and so then the spirit transfer worked then that would also make it weird for him to stuff the kids in the Freddy's suits instead of the Funtimes. That said I think he got a taste for blood after killing charlie and either he knew charlie was in the puppet or he didn't but either way he went on to kill the MCI kids. At that point he realizes that the kids possessed the suits so he creates the Funtimes which he doesn't use because before the opening of Circus Baby's Elizabeth dies. William then gathers the old suits with the MCI kids possessing them and melts all of them in remnant and puts them in the Funtimes (or something idk this part is blurry to me). Anyways that's just my 2 cents

[@DeskFanMan87]

I try to address this in my sister location timeline video, but I think it’s fair that a lot of people still believe MCI was before Elizabeth. I did until like months ago.

[@raffymcdaffy]

For an upstarting channel, your content is on par to the top dogs of youtubers. Can't wait to see this channel grow!

[@br2891]

Amazing video honestly, great theory and great editing. You deserve many more subs, I will definitely be subscribing and watchig your other videos! The only thing I disagree with is this interpretation of Afton being ''evil'' without a good reason, as in Steel Wool's interview with Dawko they said ''you want a villain that commits terrible acts, but they're a victim of other wrongdoings, they're not a force of evil who comes out of nowhere to torment people''. I get where you're coming from tho as in the books Afton is just straight up narcissistic and sociopathic.

[@DeskFanMan87]

I tend to believe they were referencing the Mimic with that description, but yours is a fair takeaway. I’m glad ya liked the editing, that whole middle part took forever, thanks for the support😁

[@mrhalfsaid1389]

Ive always been more of the idea that this is the order, in terms of narrative and logical deduction of how this kind of series of events would happen this is the one that makes the most sense. Mostly because you can't really have mci before charlie and definitely not before cc

[@DJBurns-jq8mn]

Charlie then BV at least 5 days afterwards when he dies at his party.

[@mottdropsie]

I do have to agree on your placement of Elizabeth, that feels like the time that would make the most sense.

[@Trontotario]

Midnight motorist would help explain the order. If Mike is the couch person which is heavily implied by the books and visual similarities then the runaway is the crying child which would place Charlie’s death as the first. William was working on the funtimes at the time when bite victim was alive because we see his office monitoring the crying child in his bedroom. (yes, CC is who we play as in FNaF 4) I’m not however saying Elizabeth died before him but actually that the sister location bunker was being worked on. Charlie being first would tie to how William even discovered remnant (tear tracks on the puppet) and prove that Elizabeth died before the MCI. I believe Bite Victim died second because in FNaF 4 there is a girl who is visually similar to Elizabeth playing in the backyard which belongs to the Afton house, why would a random kid be playing there if it wasn’t his sister? On top of that she is among the few who doesn’t care about the party because she’ll be there anyways unlike the pigtail girl and she is playing with toys (the “empty” room isn’t really empty)

[@AswangKape]

I love your animation style!! This reminds me of the RyeToast video where they discuss the order of deaths as well, so I was intrigued. I have to admit I like this one more ^-^ My only thing is- if Elizabeth Afton died before the MCI, then why would the Scooper exist? (I’ll be honest I haven’t seen your Sister Location video yet and I intend to check it out later today, so if you explain yourself there I apologize)

[@DeskFanMan87]

Thank you so much, I had a lot of fun doing that segment of the video (took forever tho) The scooper is strange, it’s a remnant injector but also clearly functional as just an endoskeleton removing device. I don’t think I fully try to make a good case for it existing, honestly as long as William knows SOMETHING about possession I think it’s possible for him to make it. And for the cover story it’s just an over complicated way to remove endos. Hopefully you like the Sister Location video when you check it out, it’s my personal favorite so far.

[@CloverPegs]

while i'm not the BIGGEST fan of CBPW being Pre-MCI (and even then i'm still flip-flopping on the idea), that concept isn't necessarily integral to this theory. this video has managed to free me of my doubts regarding Charlie's death location, and is one of the few theory videos i've seen on KZbin that properly characterizes William Afton. also probably the only attempt to explain Pigtail Girl and "don't you remember what you saw?" i've seen in years.

[@SirStendar]

good theory! i do think mci came before elizabeth but i have to see your theory first

[@numetalOverlord]

Yeah, the MCI seems less sophisticated than the plan with the Funtime animatronics.

[@DeskFanMan87]

I really do recommend that video, even if you disagree it’s personally my favorite I’ve done so far.

[@michaellynes3540]

Evan Afton dies first (Evan’s death is the fuse of the powdered keg to William Afton’s murder spree) Elizabeth Afton dies second (Elizabeth’s death snaps William Afton’s mental sanity) Charlotte Emily dies third (Charlotte’s death sparks the beginning of William Afton’s murder spree)

[@darkhumour741]

That narration of how events unfolded + diving into the characters thoughts and motivations was just *chefs kiss* Hope you do more stuff like that in future Only part I disagree with timeline wise is crying child’s death - Curse of Dreadbear strongly implies it occurred during Fallfest 83 The update is overwhelmingly FNAF 4 themed, not just with the added levels but also the environment - FNAF 4 house in background of the hub world - Random mysterious car behind us…potentially Williams? - Bully masks in Trick or Treat (oh yeah, we get casual confirmation they’re halloween masks, likely sold at Fallfest) Not to mention the only new animatronics being Dreadbear and Grimm Foxy, aka perfect crying child and Michael symbolism - A version of Fredbear (crying child’s killer) based on Frankenstein’s monster (creature brought to life by a *mad scientist* who, in order to control the forces of life and death, steals body parts from the deceased and *puts them back together* as one) - Halloween themed Foxy you’re constantly on the lookout for + need to hide from in the Corn Maze level With all this in mind, rather than summer it’s more likely crying child was killed just weeks before Charlie and Henry didn’t bother to rebrand, only installing the Security Puppet. Hey, if they were willing to keep using Fredvear at their *main restaurant* after the diner closed, it’s entirely possible they didn’t see the bite as grounds enough to replace him. Freddy’s sprite in Take Cake is probably just a continuity error because at the time of making FNAF 2 Scott hadn’t decided Fredbear was Golden Freddy. Also, considering the FNAF 4 minigames are *sequential* (going day by day through the week of the bite) crying child’s coma probably only lasted that long - a day, not months.

[@DeskFanMan87]

@@darkhumour741 I really appreciate people liking that section, even if they don’t 100 percent agree on the exact dates I put things. If anything, I do want the takeaway from the video to be the characterizations I presented, I feel really strongly about that, so glad you liked it😁 Also, that last point about using Fredbear at the main restaurant is a really great point that I kinda just glossed over. Someone else commented similar evidence about the Dreadbear DLC and I kinda came to this conclusion, 1) if you want cakebear to be Freddy, just use what I presented. 2) if you don’t care either way, push the bite to early October and Charlie end of October. One thing I will push back on is that CC had to die the next day due to the minigames being sequential. It’s presented that way because it’s counting down to the party, imo the final cutscene could be anytime after. I totally get people not liking him living that long after though so I get not wanting it to be summer. Thanks for commenting, I really like talking about stuff like this.

[@milana.x325]

I think BV's (Crying Childs) death and Charlie's death have 0 impact on each other. They kinda parallel each other (both got bullied), but whether Charlie died first or not, BV would've died anyways, and whether BV died first or not, Charlie would've died anyways. SImply 'cause while they deaths may look like they would be related, they absolutely aren't at all, it's completely different situations. I think unless we get something with Fall Fest that shows us more details about 1983, it doesn't really matter what you objectively believe in. Personally I think BVFirst is correct, but that's moreso in relation with me believing SparkVictim as well. CharlieFirst and BVFirst just kinda depends on what theories you want to believe in.

[@DeskFanMan87]

What you said at the beginning of the second paragraph is something I’ve been thinking for years. All these small details really don’t matter. We know the events happen, exactly how aren’t as important. It’s just fun to speculate. I really need to make a discussion video about that. I really appreciate your input

[@emerson-biggons7078]

Honestly I dont even car if I end up agreeing with your theories. I just love hearing them, keep em coming and I'll keep watching them.

[@DeskFanMan87]

@@emerson-biggons7078 that means a lot, I try to make sure the presentation is always nice for these vids so I really appreciate the support 😁

[@vamprascare621]

I believe Susie was first, after Mrs. Afton's death sparking evil. And wishing others to feel his pain. Then Jeremy, Gabriel, Fritz, Cassidy, and then Charlie, then Circus Baby, remade to hunt innocent kids, accidentally causing Elizabeth's death, hints to the her bedroom being empty in FNAF 4, and Crying Child followed Shadow Freddy to Freddy's and sees Charlie's lifeless body, and the puppet on top of her, sparking his fear of Animatronics.

[@gorzl7888]

Yo man I really enjoyed the video! I like the way that you explain a lot of things very in depth. I really can’t wait to see where your channel goes!

[@DeskFanMan87]

Thank you, from one Spidey fan to another 😁🕸️

[@technofurs]

the editing is so gooooood

[@coleangelillo8147]

this is an awesome theory! i agree with most of it :) keep up the good work you are killing it!!!

[@ulookbeutiful3736]

I kinda liked the idea of William motives are for continuing his murder spree is recreating what Charlie had gone through. Well you can say it’s supported in game too. I always assumed Security Puppet track name “Alchemist Fantasy” referred to Henry imagining how his daughter was killed but come to think of it its more about William wanting to be immortal just like her. Its a similar situation in the novels as well. Basically his whole shtick is he want to trick death by becoming a undead robot himself similar to RoboCharlie. To pursue it he becomes an “alchemist” that experiments with soul properties (remnant). Even though we don’t know how much novel personality correlates the game but still I think it serves as a better motive than “I kill kids cause I kill kids” and matches with his deranged scientist personality more. Random idea: I think this is why his biggest fear is Nigthmarrione. Nightmarrione symbolizes looming threat of death ever coming closer taking the face of the immortal entity he tries to imitate. (Even though this discusses Puppet as a passive symbol character the reason very much could be puppet actively trying to undo his actions in an arch nemesisy way or because it is the freakiest looking one among furry robots).

[@DeskFanMan87]

This. Even if Charlie or Crying Child die first, I still maintain that Charlie and her possession is what spurred him to explore the supernatural/possession/immortality. I also love your callout about Nightmarionne.

[@Animelord119]

(New sub for your) I actually approve with this theory I think it seems right seeing more evidence I assume when chica in ucn saying “I was the first I have seen everything” maybe she can be the first animatronic or the first of the missing children’s incident but all wells they are all theory’s nice video.❤

[@LionPKrono]

Hey, LOVE your vid I just have a desagreement with the placement of the bite. Curse of Dredbear heavely implies that something related to crying child happened in October or in the fall, and uh, here's something you didn't took a look properly. Who is Fredbear Plush? Yeah William, SL prooves it, blah blah blah, but outside William, who is Plushbear? Like- we see him be a flower, a reference to IT (be in a sewer) and literally teleport. He's not an imaginary friend, we literally see him in SL, so, what if he's possessed? Not by charlie, but by an agony entity. What if Plushbear is Shadow Freddy? like- not necesarily being created by CC, but by Charlie. Also, Freddy's is really implied to have opened AFTER Fredbear's closed, and that's confirmed by the Charlie Trilogy. My timeline goes something like this: 1983 * William, out of jealusy, kills Charlie - Halloween * the agony of Charlie creates Shadow Freddy, and mixed with the wickedness of William he starts being a mirror to him * SF ends up in Plushbear a doll of CC * William notices that Charlie possesses Puppet - a few days after her death * William creates the Nightmare chambers in his house * CC is in the nightmare chambers (that's what he saw) * FNaF 4 Minigames - early Winter - BO83 * CC dies in the hospital (I don't know where you got that he was sent to his home) * Michael is placed in the nightmare chambers 1985 * William creates CBPW * Elizabeth dies * CBPW is cancelled * MCI - June 26th * Freddy's Closes * CBEAR is created and opened! * Michael is set free of the chambers 'cuz they were moved into the bunker of CBEAR * William creates a springlock suit to kill the kids of the chambers * William creates the Scooper to use their remnant and inject it into the funtimes (shattering Elizabeth too) :b

[@DeskFanMan87]

I have…thoughts about the plush I’ll put out there one day, same for shadow Freddy, but I will address the whole summer vs fall setting. I agree there’s a lot of weird connections to 1983 and Halloween, but currently I see a lot of that more as something attributed to fall fest. Maybe it ties more into 4, dreadbear himself and the house being there are kinda hard to ignore as evidence points, but I guess we’ll just have to wait and see with whatever they come out with next. Then there’s the whole “4 was gonna release on Halloween originally” and the dlc it got really tying it more that way. But for me it’s this, I don’t think Charlie can die at Fredbear’s and it still be open before crying child’s death. The repeated theme of “children die--> close down” is hard for me to ignore. CC can be the exception because it was actually an accident. Here’s an off the top of my head compromise on that, just push the bite to early October/late September. Overall I like your timeline though, and we totally line up when it comes to sister location. Last thing is CC being brought home was creative license, it can still take place in an hospital it doesn’t really affect much. I kinda went with it because of “The Real Jake” not cus of the parallel thing or whatever, I’m not even gonna touch that, it’s just that there’s precedent for that kind of thing to happen in the series.

[@PandaSlothProductions]

This video is so well made!! Keep up the grind, this channel bouta blow up!

[@Adventist1997]

So in conclusion, maybe? I love the concert storyline for these games 😂

[@1Unknown_Clips]

I feel like Elizabeth’s death should be before CryingChild’s death because of Nightmare Fredbear’s stomach theory is supposed to relate to him seeing his sister being “eaten” by baby’s stomach

[@DeskFanMan87]

I don’t think that he saw her die, she’s specifically made to only work if the target is alone. I do think his fear of being eaten is true though, it could be how he interprets people putting the suits on, or being “stuffed”

[@SonZackSSJ9k]

That theory has been debunked many times now.

[@1Unknown_Clips]

@@SonZackSSJ9k when was her death?

[@SonZackSSJ9k]

@@1Unknown_Clips sometime after the MCI.

[@themanwithaplan5425]

This vid so SOOOOO GOOD!!! Hope to see more of your work!

[@ناصرعادل-د6ل]

i really like the presentation of this even tho i dont agree with 20% this i really like how you used the 8-bit to show and tell at the same time

[@Commanderkoblad]

That's exactly how i think it is great video, charlie dies first but bite of 83 happens first

[@Gamer_Dylan_6]

amazing video!!! I love the animations

[@ItsVerum]

you forgot to explain how withered chica's voiceline in ucn says "i was the first, i have seen everything"

[@DeskFanMan87]

First of the MCI killings

[@ItsVerum]

@@DeskFanMan87 chica says" I have seen EVERYTHING" and that would generally regard all possessions. So Theoritcally Chica possessed first then Charlie died first, but IDK how that can make sense... Give me your ideas on it!

[@DeskFanMan87]

@@ItsVerum it’s a matter of potentially conflicting lines, Henry says Williams actions are “a wound first inflicted on me” while Chica has her UCN line. I personally take the line from Henry as more credible. Since UCN is in Williams head, perhaps “I have seen EVERYTHING” is from William’s perspective, the beginning of his intentional experimenting with spirits. Or if you believe William was drunk when killing Charlie and it wasn’t super planned, this can still apply as Chica being William’s first INTENTIONAL murder.

[@ItsVerum]

@@DeskFanMan87 You alway gotta be more aware of perspectives I guess! Also loved your video, keep it up! Each person will have their own timeline with small differances and you bringing awareness about William being the one saying that line is a possibility and a theory and one that I will definitely take into consideration!!!

[@yecksd]

i appreciate the honesty bro

[@azimuddin1890]

I think Charlotte (Web) died first, like in her novel trilogy, where Aubergine Man (William Afton) had a weird obsession and jealousy towards Dr.Horrid Henry Danger Stickman, and he already had a kid, so no other motivation. This also happened in the movie, well not with Charlotte (Web). My point is that it’s consistent with those two. So I think she dies first, then either Elizabeth or EvanBearCC (F.N.A.F.4 C.C) dies after. I think, personally, that she dies at Freddy’s, which might be the restaurant Henry owned. I also think The Puppet was only at Freddy’s since it’s never said he was ever at Fredbear’s. I don’t know about the back alley thing, I feel like it’s not enough evidence to convince me. It’s a back alley after all. Now, I think EvanBearCC is the F.N.A.F.4 player, in the fake / nightmare bedroom and PlushTrap hallway, as the Encyclopedia confirmed it and shows an art of Evan with Nightmare behind him, something that might have been commissioned by Scott, maybe? I think it lines up. Now as for Aubergine Man Jr? Hot take but I don’t think it’s him, and I think they’re nightmares. I get evidence like parallels and Phoney from F.N.A.F.1, but I still don't think it’s enough. Now as for motivations and explanations, I don’t do those as they’re not explored much, especially with Aubergine Man, I just try and put things together. I do think Elizabeth dies before Evan since she doesn’t show up. Maybe a little wild, but the orange pigtail girl might potentially be Circus Baby with an Illusion Disc, and escape the bunker like she says she and the others did before scooping Jr. Even though she said if they looked like Jr, they would hide, not sure, but I’ll say she did die before Evan. To make it clear what I think of the parts of the early lore is: Henry & Aubergine Man opened Fredbear’s Family Diner Success, and Freddy’s open due to it. Henry works in that restaurant, while Aubergine Man works at Fredbear’s as seen in F.N.A.F.4. Security Puppet is made at Freddy’s probably to look after her since he might be single in the games’ continuity. Jealousy thing, and Aubergine Man puts a present box on The Puppet’s box to prevent it getting out, and kills Charlotte (even though he drives to her, and kills her which is weird in this context). Security Puppet gets out, and finds Charlotte outside, and she possesses it. Aubergine Man makes Circus Baby’s Pizza World. Elizabeth dies, and possesses Circus Baby Circus Baby Pizza World closes Aubergine Man makes a bunker connecting to his house, Fredbear’s, and a fake bedroom and hallway with a SpringTrap plush. Circus Baby and other FunTimes kept trying to escape the bunker, but were found and put back. He makes a fake bedroom, and experiences with EvanBearCC by pinning him against the nightmarish versions of the Freddy animatronics. Evan’s birthday Chomp of 83 Possesses Fredbear Restaurant shuts down (?) This is what I (currently) think.

[@williamcolt1073]

it all makes more logical sense to me in a professional way. tbh i wish scott would have just came out and said it a long time ago, but i don't even think he remembers now. the hole thing gives me vibes of oh i want to make a lot of money, so every time a plot hole gets pointed out re write the story so that we can work that in. which has a certain charm to it, but eventually its like just end it man.

[@DeskFanMan87]

Eh, I’m kinda grateful, I’m sure we’ll have an answer one day but I have a lot of fun overthinking this stuff at the moment 😅

[@b4tman_and_Rob1n]

this guy deserves more subs!

[@notyetundead3143]

I feel like you have the right vibe for William and Henry as characters.

[@DeskFanMan87]

That is something I wanted everyone to take away from this video, even if people disagree with my conclusions I’m like 99.99999% confident in these characterizations and I’m glad it’s coming across well.😁

[@BBD213lol]

I actually really like this timeline

[@Grayson-tk5hn]

i thought it was confirmed that crying child was first

[@DeskFanMan87]

Oh I wish

[@zeldristhecactus1304]

First time seeing evidence of Charlie dying in Autumn . 3:00

[@sworishina]

I like your interpretation, but I disagree on Afton "putting CC back together". That line has a different color, and I believe that indicates that the one speaking is in fact Cassidy. I think the minigames where we play as CC are Cassidy watching through his memories, to figure out what happened, after he pulls CC's spirit into Golden Freddy with him. Or Cassidy maybe died /before/ CC, and speaks to him as William is pulling the plug on his life support after he's been comatose for a while. (This is why Mike is saying sorry. They've gone to the hospital and made the choice to take him off support after he doesn't wake up for a long time. This is Mike's goodbye to his brother, and William's. Then we hear the noise of the heart monitor going out.) I think Cassidy was likely William's first test subject, especially since the implication is that Cassidy was springlocked, likely in that spare Fredbear suit we see in the backroom in the CC minigames. Whether that's Cassidy's hair sticking out or just wires, that's likely the suit Cassidy eventually died in. This has been floating around in my head for a while and I don't know how well I'm putting it into words but if anyone has any questions, I'll elaborate.

[@DeskFanMan87]

@@sworishina I agree with you that the minigames in 4 are Cassidy watching memories of CC. That will be in my video whenever I cover the fredbear plush identity. I don’t think that the final speaker is William either, I think generally being put back together is a thing many people have said, Michael Brooks in the fourth closet, Michael Afton in sister location, and the fredbear plush. So yeah I was referencing the final line but I didn’t mean to imply William actually said it, totally get why it’s being taken that way though. I still think the line is along William’s intent, but he doesn’t say those lines. The way I’ve started to view the plush is this: think about how 4 starts. It’s in a black void with the fredbear plush and then the final scene (besides the box) is plush in black void with CC. We’re starting the game from CC’s perspective, then ending the game we get the side profile. I think we see the beginning of their interactions in FNAF World, the opening is when they first meet, FNAF 4 is then going through the memories, then plush leaves to put CC back together properly, by helping him pass on. The clock events happen in World, Happiest Day happens, and CC moves on. Anyway I don’t wanna spoil more of my theory, but I appreciate the comment, nice to see other people thinking the same thing about 4 being revisited memories, it’s reassuring I’m maybe on the right track lol.

[@LuisLicona-n2m]

I believe Rory from dittophobia is the one should not have killed from UCN!

[@DeskFanMan87]

Haven’t heard that one before, any particular reason or just a cool idea?

[@azimuddin1890]

In my opinion, I don’t think The Puppet was at FredBear’s since he’s always at a Freddy’s location, as shown in F.N.A.F.2 and F.N.A.F.6 (Security Puppet). So the Give Cake would happen at Freddy’s not, FredBear’s.

[@golan.b2035]

dont even think the order truly matters at this point with these two but i still strongly belive charlie is first than bv and i still belive that physcic friend freadbear is possesed by puppet while also being use by william to spy on his kid l( i mean if golden freddy is possed by two souls why wont the plush be usued by the main forced of good and the main force of evil in the seires) or at the very least this is howi think it was meant to be in the orginal story (fnaf 1 - 3 and then fnaf 1 -4 since both were considered the final games when they were announced, good times ) and since the old games werent updated since then if that was changed i thinks its practically impossible to tell at this point

[@Xman-go]

The puppet had a twin and we just didn't know this I wish we read the books why didn't Henry mention this

[@DeskFanMan87]

I don’t think Sammy is in the games, but it would be cool if he did ever show up. I think he’s solely a Silver Eyes trilogy character though.

[@Renboys55]

It’s Evan dying making William kill so it’s Evan da crying boi

[@DeskFanMan87]

I shall now forever refer to CC as “da crying boi” because it’s really funny

[@Sing87eh]

Your my fav old fnaf theorist

[@DeskFanMan87]

Thanks, I hope to keep it up😁

[@ediblefredible]

yes!! yes yes yeeees, im so glad this vid popped up on my feed, i spent the Entire video just going "EX👏AACT👏LYYYY" bahaha, dude- you got you a sub 👌 gotta check out your other vids now. the animations for the presentation of the story are smoooove too!

[@DeskFanMan87]

I’m glad people are liking that part, definitely took the longest to make out of the whole thing. There’s snippets of similar stuff in my other vids but not nearly as refined, I was learning still.

[@nathanstruble2177]

Does cassette man confirm that Save Him and Green Wrist Band are the same event??

[@DeskFanMan87]

Yes, at the end during his speech both images flash back to back and are referred to under the same event. I guess he TECHNICALLY doesn’t say “hey that game and this one are the same” but it’s basically 99.99 percent confirmation

[@dogperson4793]

Wait idk if this is stupid to point out but doesn’t the Freddy gang have to exist before spring bonnie and freddy since they have the masks

[@DeskFanMan87]

That would be because Freddy’s is founded that year, so they would be the new characters. 1983 would be the brief period where both Fredbear’s and Freddy’s overlapped.

[@Lunablues23]

Willly wonderland shirt

[@Lunablues23]

Also did you make the herry sprite?

[@DeskFanMan87]

@@Lunablues23made the Henry, Charlie, and Freddy sprite.

[@tomiross91011]

Congrats for the 1k likes

[@DeskFanMan87]

@@tomiross91011 thank you!!

[@VersesEditz]

i love this theory! 😄

[@vincenticyfiregeetar7656]

okay this title is sick

[@DeskFanMan87]

I try to be honest lol

[@senatorarmstrong9673]

I love fanfics 💜🤎💛

[@DeskFanMan87]

Ya gotta do what ya gotta do sometimes 😅🤷‍♂️

[@Fredboyos]

This is such a based video! I love it. I'm not sure about MikeExperiment that you seem to imply, but I love the storytelling either way! I actually made up a theory that the reason Fredbear's didn't close was because of the Crying Child not being dead yet, and instead Charlie's death causes Fredbear's to close, the Crying Child dying the day after her death. Though the only problem I have with your timeline is the placement of CC's death. It feels like he died soon after the bite from the severe brain damage, which ultimately would place his death before Charlie's, not just the bite. The reason why I don't believe the theory anymore is because of that fact, so I would place both the bite and his death in Summer 1983, then Charlie's death October 31st 1983, Elizabeth in 1984 or 1985(before MCI) and MCI June 26th 1985.

[@DeskFanMan87]

Yeah him living so long is the major stretch, but I needed a reason for William to somehow know about possession already by the time he dies, so I kinda tried my best to make it work. I think narratively it works nicely but there is admittedly no solid in game evidence for that.

[@notdarlingg]

i dislike that people see william as a father that doesnt love his children. he does care about them, and even respects micheal in fnaf 3 by leaving him instructions to put her back together. trying to fix the crying child while he’s dying, understanding that micheal made a mistake, and trying to keep elizabeth safe away from baby despite her consistant nagging. william cared about his kids.

[@DeskFanMan87]

I, respectfully, completely disagree. I also believe Willcare is genuinely harmful to the character of William and the FNAF story as a whole. Imagine a child with an abusive home life and they read or hear about William. But it’s okay, the things they’re doing are terrible but they still love you! The most I’d say William “cares” about his kids is like how a builder cares about his hammer. An object, a tool at their disposal.

[@notdarlingg]

@@DeskFanMan87 i was a child with an abusive home life growing up with fnaf fyi and i do support william having atleast some affection towards his kids; it might be toxic in a lot of places but i think he still cares about them enough to want to keep them safe and not only think of them as tools.

[@DeskFanMan87]

@@notdarlingg I am sorry you had to go through that.

[@josuawhite2209]

Take cake obviously in FNAF 2 restaurant and in party room, look at that small room. Also Puppet moved from different restaurant are fans made up theory and no proof or anything that show Puppet ever in Family diner.

[@echothesilent4693]

A common argument against what you say is that the playable version of Freddy in the mini game isn't toy Freddy. It's stated the withered gang never got repaired for a chance to perform at the fnaf2 location (reference phone guy call in fnaf2) so it can't be withered Freddy. It may not be at Fredbear's, but likely not in the f2 restaurant unless years before (pre original closing that allows for the fnaf 2 gameplay restaurant to be a grand reopening instead of an original opening).

[@DeskFanMan87]

Something I wish I put in the video as evidence for puppet coming from Fredbear’s is actually the paper pals in FNAF 2. A rabbit, a bear, and a humanoid with lanky limbs. I think that’s pretty strong. Take cake in general is very stylized, we don’t see the puppet box but FNAF 6 shows there was one, overall take cake is less reliable. Hope you liked the rest of the vid at least, I appreciate critiques tho 👍

[@josuawhite2209]

@@DeskFanMan87 Charlotte die in Family Diner also just a theory based on Charlie kidnapped in book. There's no hard proof saying security puppet mini game in FNAF6 as Family Diner. Take cake deny it with brown bear. The Lefty scene just show connection about Lefty and Charlotte. Car track and trash can doesnt mean the minigame happen there, it just show extra info like poster around Scraptrap.

[@josuawhite2209]

@@echothesilent4693 it's toy Freddy, he have advanced mobility and great finger to grab stuff. Not even normal freddy springsuit can serve cake, its pretty dangerous.

[@andrejmendes2645]

I think Charlie died first, because Midnight Motorist indicates that it takes place right after William murderd her, wich means that the couch person is Michael and the ranaway was the Crying Child.

[@DeskFanMan87]

If you believe Midnight Motorist is the Aftons, then yeah that’s fair. I don’t think they are because of Toy Chica The High School Years though.

[@mizzviolet]

Wait… kids died in fnaf???

[@DeskFanMan87]

Why did I laugh at this?😂

[@kaspertheshepherd3010]

Bruh ppl still theorizing?? I have the full lore 😭

[@DeskFanMan87]

TELL MEEE!!!

[@kaspertheshepherd3010]

@@DeskFanMan87 too much for a KZbin comment lmao

[@DeskFanMan87]

@@kaspertheshepherd3010 aw dang 😔lol

[@azimuddin1890]

@@kaspertheshepherd3010 NOOOO, WE MUST KNOOOOWWWWWW!!!!

[@daveiscool24]

👾

[@DeskFanMan87]

🎶 smashing windshields intensifies 🎶

[@FnaftheUltimateking2]

nah Elizabeth died first

[@DeskFanMan87]

Respect the bluntness lol

[@FnaftheUltimateking2]

@@DeskFanMan87 but i don't understand William motive it's complicated everything in the time line if the crying child died first then what about the empty room and what the crying child saw if Elizabeth died first then what about William motive of creating circus baby

[@0celot9]

@FnaftheUltimateking2 I think Elizabeth first is interesting, especially with the nightmare fredbear stomach mouth and remember what you saw, but I just can’t believe it because of motivations not working for william.

[@DeskFanMan87]

@@FnaftheUltimateking2 I don’t think the empty room is meaning that the occupant needs to be be dead, she could just be at daycare or anywhere else. I dunno if you’ve seen my Sister Location video but I think I make a good case for her dying after Charlie and CC, but before the MCI.

[@FnaftheUltimateking2]

@@0celot9 I finally believed that Elizabeth died first it's because i saw a video about it it's proved to me that circus baby never developed to kill people when Elizabeth death it was mistake by non other then Henry he made circus baby with William after all he made the scooper thing to kill by incident with angry he was angry and remember baby endoskeleton it's the MIMIC he mimic Henry bad doing and then killed Elizabeth

[@emperorvader283]

Audio and Video out of sink in first 10 seconds. Literally unwatchable.

[@DeskFanMan87]

😂Oh trust me I know, something got messed up in the final edit and with the music I couldn’t fix it without just remaking the whole intro. Thankfully the pain is quick😅