I'm Suing Honey

[@LegalEagle]

Learn more about the lawsuit here: honeylawsuit.com Read the operative Complaint here: www.courtlistener.com/docket/69503243/9/wendover-productions-llc-v-paypal-inc/

[@smixqse]

this is so badass

[@juicebox5]

oke

[@williambarrington5735]

Great Legal Eagle is sueing the company, Honey. Now every customer who installed honey should sue every creator for pushing this. Creators want to make themselves the sole victims in this process. They are not. They were the catalyst for it and their viewers were convinced to use a scam. DUE DILIGENCE. Many of those beloved creators abused the trust of their viewers.

[@pedro09876]

Git em!

[@rawpotatofella9654]

looks like the honey lawsuit page crashed?

[@megapeebs2631]

"You're going to pay, pal." - legal eagle probably

[@wertuiop1157]

Peak cinema

[@ToxqJam]

This

[@dereksamuel5659]

underrated comment

[@PhiOfficialAdministration]

real

[@Chaostick]

It's a stolen comment.

[@Mamuta8307]

The alternate universe of the bee movie where the humans sue the bees instead

[@virusapple662]

Lol

[@ondrejrichtr6835]

ahahahaha

[@FSoJG28597]

Our reality and that of the bee movie are polar opposites confirmed.

[@underSTATEDexcellence]

That’s fucting hilarious, I gotta give it to you 👏

[@SushiElemental]

Unbeelievable 🐝

[@jarvis]

he's putting together a team

[@mahranislam3554]

real

[@oshea72]

An eagle team

[@nerbins1632]

Bro’s about to be the Nick Fury of class-action lawsuits

[@fedoraspeaks8962]

I hope you’ll be there Jarvis

[@tenshimocha]

Hi Jarvis :))

[@permabearxbt]

when a company steals from creators youtube goes mental if honey decided to steal from the consumers I bet this story wouldn't be as big edit: for the people arguing that consumers got hurt as well, I don't buy it. either it was minimal but either way thats not the focus creators are focusing on and why they are making a big deal out of it. as you can see legaleagle didn't go over it at all which is saying enough. secondly nobody is looking for compensation for the consumer because they got a 5% discount instead of a 6% discount

[@jordanbeasley3804]

These are the same people that would happily shill BetterHelp and NordVPN to their audiences but the second they're taken from it's "the biggest scam in youtube history". What a joke.

[@Neko-kun-0w0ラーメン]

Fr

[@TheGroberUnfug]

theres the campaign taking off

[@Natshuri]

Was talking about that with my gf 2 mins ago

[@vincentbardai1096]

I mean yeah they’re doing more bc it affects them. Do you expect creators to sue on the behalf of viewers when the viewers get scammed?

[@milieg3309]

Can we appreciate how amazing Megalag's work is that the entire industry took notice?

[@PrograError]

Well... It's a bigger channel with more eyes after the DHL investigation... Plus more attractive visuals...

[@seizan88]

His video is great. Very detailed and easy to understand. Giving everyone a very good understanding what the actual situation is. Despite being told something different from honey.

[@TheJubess]

And there's gonna be a part 2!

[@shadowimpostor1990]

Can we just appreciate how x always does y to make our day?

[@krissyseptember5241]

His video is interesting to watch too. I just somehow watched the whole thing instead of listening passively

[@onEmEmbErstudios]

Thank you Markiplier for the prediction Thank you MegaLag for the investigation Thank you LegalEagle for taking it further stand

[@atlasdragon3290]

Thank you LegalEagle for the Litigation FIFY

[@StormLeader0]

This is exactly how to use the power of influence

[@zekicordell1498]

fr

[@hhere2stay]

mark didnt do shit MegaLag should get all the praise

[@PerfectoonsYT]

Dont forget affiliatemarketmc. Before megalag made the video, they proved it was a scam but it didn't get popular. The video was posted 4 YEARS AGO.

[@MediecreGoddess]

thankfully mr beast's ad was so obnoxious that I refused to download honey on principle.

[@katelovell625]

I try to avoid purchasing anything i see on ads.

[@JuriSins]

True. Plus it's useless as well.

[@andrejmanfreda]

i tried it once and noticed i could find more affordable prices for the same stuff myself, i thought than it was a scam

[@Fuudo_123]

@@andrejmanfreda I tried it once too years ago, literally found me zero coupons on several sites, so I never bothered with it ever again and took it out

[@lcgaming1yt]

true

[@neekless]

creators who have never used or heard of honey, therefore never agreed to their TOS, still got their affiliate commission stolen by honey. straight up theft.

[@t3ch_n0]

In my opinion, it most definitely is cookie stuffing. By definition, its hard to imagine it NOT being cookie stuffing.

[@christopherlperezcruz1507]

There is no claim here. Honey is sniping customers. But that's not illegal. The sleazy salesman is part of the environment. This suit won't go anywhere.

[@Jack-hs4vc]

@@christopherlperezcruz1507that’s just blatantly wrong. there have been multiple cases where companies were accused and convicted of cookie stuffing and it’s never been even close to this bad

[@lowhood22]

@@christopherlperezcruz1507 If it gets proven to be cookie stuffing, there is already legal precedent set that it is considered wire fraud. It is 100% illegal.

[@DaSmolPotato]

@@christopherlperezcruz1507 this is in fact illegal, its blatant cookie stuffing, which there have been legal cases of in the past. cookie stuffing is usually charged as wire fraud. and is infact a illegal affiliate marketing technique.

[@catch878able]

I'm not sure if it's exactly the same thing, and you'll probably dig this up on your own, but Honey's actions in this case might count as cookie stuffing, which is considered a form of wire fraud. Ebay, Inc. v. Digital Point Solutions, Inc. could be useful legal precedent.

[@webbowser8834]

Signal boosting the crap out of this, useful case law in digital cases are very difficult to come by because the internet simply has not been around for very long.

[@aqua-bery]

I'm sure he'll find this but if not, gotta make this top comment!

[@NoriegaArdento]

Yes, it’s the same thing :) When the user clicks on a coupon in the extension and their cookie is changed, this is not considered cookie stuffing, nor does it violate legislation or the terms and conditions of affiliate programs. However, when the user interacts with other elements in the extension’s menu, such as the button to close a pop-up, without interacting with the coupons, replacing the cookie violates at least the terms and conditions of affiliate programs.

[@LastNickNameOnEarth]

Came here to point out: Brian Dunning might have a thing or two to say/notsay on this topic.

[@visualoo1918]

Damn, good on you! I actually was wondering if this would be a case of first impression of sorts. (Considering law always lag behind technology)

[@alpacamale2909]

Honey wake up, new lawsuit just dropped

[@yomommashaus]

I never went to sleep in the first place with this honey drama lol, been staying up all night for the show to begin!

[@Proferk]

"honey" wake up

[@SanctimoniaFeatherdove]

underrated

[@franklinploeg1156]

I think they know. This lawsuit got on the news

[@sophomorphia]

Honey wake up *pulls out subpoena*

[@afjer]

Even if a creator vetted Honey and REJECTED their sponsorship, their affiliate money STILL gets stolen if their audience installed it from someone else.

[@Notagrill1]

That just clicked with me, this is so massive I'm not sure we've seen anything like it. Millions of users of honey purchasing with hundreds of thousands of affiliate links with ANY SPONSOR honey can access. The amount of money honey has stolen from creators could very well be in the BILLIONS.

[@serehero4722]

Like Legal Eagle said "We believe things like running a promo code, affiliate link, tracking tag is enoufb to be caught in their web." This applies to pretty much every creator that has gotten any sponsorship deal or done affiliate marking. ALL creators who have done any of these things should join the class action lawsuit.

[@islandwatch]

Yup. They are poaching ANY affiliate link where the buyer clicks "Honey".

[@alimanski7941]

Also lost revenue from other sponsors who stopped dealing with creators as they saw no clickthrough

[@Qermaq]

It's not even about sponsorship. Honey profits by disrupting the agreed-upon course of business transaction. It's intentionally stealing revenue from authorized link providers under the pretense of saving their users a little money. It's simply theft.

[@hallm3lbp]

the full video by MegaLag is really worth a watch, it’s crazy and runs so much deeper. I woulda thought a false advertising lawsuit for their “best discount” claims would be enough on its own. Mad.

[@lunayoshi]

And the fact that you could actually find a coupon, "submit" it, and have them go "oh, thanks!" only for them to never use it is a huge sign that it's more of a scam. Crazy.

[@nomadpurple6154]

But that only affects consumers and no-one cares if consumers get screwed. The only reason this has blown up is that creators with money got screwed. And some of them found out, dropped Honey and kept quiet cos they didn't care about other creators getting screwed.

[@146348]

What’s wild is the claim “we will find you the best deal” when in fact they’re colluding behind the scenes with businesses to make sure consumers don’t. It’s crazy.

[@XGD5layer]

I heard that they stopped claiming that to get a fraudulent advertisement investigation dropped

[@dely9999]

Well they found the best deal... just... the best for them

[@TheJohn8765]

Isn't unregulated capitalism fun? I just love being food for the Corporations!

[@GazpaNova]

It seems thet were not even colluding with businesses. They were blackmailing them. "Work with us or we will scour the earth for coupons, and make sure your customers pay pennies on every purchase on your store"

[@xemiiklera]

To be fair, they probably do find it, they just don't give it to you

[@jonathanhibberd9983]

I had Honey for years. Not once - not even one time - did it find a coupon for me.

[@tadzikp276]

Such a scam

[@Ichneumonxx]

Same. I downloaded it once out of curiosity and it did nothing for me. Uninstalled.

[@__nog642]

Why did you have it then lmao

[@affectojfgidi1246]

​@@__nog642because there was no strong incentive to delete it either? Since it seemed to be harmless, why not just let it sit on your PC. If you delete it, you won't get anything guaranteed, if you don't - maybe some coupon will eventually emerge. I don't always delete apps that I don't actively use.

[@averageanikienjoyer4156]

@@__nog642 Well you can just assume that maybe it doesn't work on this website etc, and maybe it will work sometime in the future, what's the harm? I am picky about browser extensions so personally never downloaded Honey because I thought they would be selling my data somewhere (if the business model is not apparent and it is a heavily marketed product there is a catch somewhere), but I understand why a lot of people got it.

[@Tamisday]

It made me so mad because as a consumer I look at as a stranger stealing tips from the waiter who was serving me. I very intentionally directed my tip/affiliate code to the person who provided a service. Someone who did nothing, who doesn’t even work there just snatched it off the table and the waiter would never know.

[@0mn1P4wn4g3]

Ad a consumer, you shouldn't support tipping in situations where it isn't required to make up the income. It's an unhealthy form of supplemental income.

[@RoughShodRiot]

@@0mn1P4wn4g3 it was a metaphor......

[@carmenmccauley585]

Excellent analogy.

[@strammerdetlef]

lol ur problem. u put oil into the huge greed fire as well by using that affiliate cr.p

[@1tylerq127]

​@0mn1P4wn4g3 in the US it's not supplemental for servers in restaurants, they get paid below (often less than half) minimum wage hourly with the expectation that they'll make up for the deficit in tips.

[@militantpacifist4087]

It’s funny how Markeplier called it out literally years ago.

[@Snorlaxiian]

He was/is right. Money does not generally come out of thin air ... unless you are the federal reserve.😆

[@buzztube1738]

Always based markie

[@Agownsrs2]

so did Linus back in 2022 on his blog, but Gen Z only likes shiny videos cause their attention span to read a blog is beyond them.

[@marcdavies75]

So LTT discovered Honey was a scam, and didn't bother making a video about it, and you're blaming all of Gen Z for not following LTT's written blog closely enough to catch their single blog post about it? What in the F is wrong with your brain 😂

[@StarkillerAyyan]

​​@@Agownsrs2 what was the point of including the Gen Z hate part? Does it really make you feel better? Want a cookie?

[@defaultsplace1348]

Makes me think of all the content creators who had entire sponsors pull out because they were under the impression the content creator was not making them money due to Honey.

[@Hexagonaldonut]

Yeah, there's a lot of potential opportunity cost associated with this one. Not only direct theft of revenue, but damaging future opportunities for revenue through that theft.

[@fidelabc123]

I would assume this is everyone's conclusion after learning about this

[@Juxtaposedjoker]

replying for visibility

[@NoriMori1992]

I was wondering about that! Surely someone somewhere along the chain noticed they weren't getting as much money as they should be, even if it wasn't the creators themselves.

[@TheXeioken]

1 up

[@Corl296]

the thing when you even click just "ok" to hide a honey notification, not even providing anything of reasonable help at all, hijacking the sale, is criminal

[@Breakbeat.]

You can label buttons whatever you want them to say. Doesn't have to be accurate.

[@merylsmith5305]

@@Breakbeat. No, you cant. Its called fraud, and its illegal.

[@philmkraken150]

@@merylsmith5305 lmao fr

[@jan861]

@@Breakbeat. You need to be investigated.

[@Mathignihilcehk]

The worst part, IMO, is that Honey agreed to conspire with retailers and distributors to NOT provide the best coupon code and then lied to the consumers using the code in their marketing (by claiming it was the best code) by providing a worse code. Imagine a shady salesman sitting at the checkout aisle offering to find you the best codes if you give him the credit for the sale, and there's a board containing all the best deals right outside the store and he doesn't give you any of them. Instead, he takes the credit for the sale and gives you a worse code that he agreed to provide with the retailer.

[@Colonal]

This makes so much sense. As a small creator, my affiliate links don't get a ton of use. So when someone tells me in the discord they used my code/link, I can usually immediately find a sale to correlate to that user in whatever dashboard my sponsors have. But there has been so many times when no sale shows up, and Honey probably stole it.

[@TheOneGoodRoad]

Same here...

[@Somnium-yi7gw]

reach out! evidence like this is great for this case

[@XRedmonkey8X]

It’s especially grimy that since it’s a browser extension, even the people that were never affiliated with Honey became victims. All they needed to do was end up on as many computers as possible and they had a way to steal from even the smallest creators.

[@muireannmc1056]

I hope you reach out for this law suit!

[@magoshyyem7436]

go for them

[@zissu2]

You're really doing something good for society here! MegaLag laid the foundation with his research, you as lawyers use the capabilitys of your profession to use that research to take honey into responsibility :-)

[@SomeHobo7]

The thing is it’s stealing from creators who never even endorsed honey either. If someone downloaded it while watching Mr. beast, then bought a 3D printer with CNC Kitchens referral but it got sniped by honey because they already had it, then CNC was hurt even though they never endorsed honey. Literally everyone who has referral codes, whether they endorsed honey or not, were victimized by honey if it was on the users computer.

[@RandomGU7U]

Reading the documents linked, this does include, and I quote "All persons (corporate or individual) in the United States who participated in an Affiliate Program with a United States online merchant and had affiliate attribution redirected to Paypal as a result of the Honey browser extension" The lawsuit aims to identify people who got harmed by looking at records and partnership data, at least as far as I understand. I only ever did international business law as a subject, and am not well versed legally by any means, but from what I can understand, the goal is to identify as many affected people as a "class" even if not everyone is individually named and get reparations.

[@naejelangelogonzales6623]

Ono

[@strammerdetlef]

the whole refcode system s.ks anyways as its just raising prices for everyone, so well deserved lol

[@6thwilbury2331]

Yeah, I was thinking about that while watching another video... think how many other referrals/attributions it stole, even (as Devin says in this video) the seller had never even heard of Honey. Also, I'm glad he mentioned CapitalOne Shopping, which does similar to Honey. In that it looks for other sellers to see if there is a better price elsewhere. I tested it to the best of my ability, which is admittedly less than MegaLag's. It doesn't seem to change the referral so long as you stay on the site, but it probably does if you switch.

[@rue6914]

In cybersecurity we call that shit malware

[@TheGoldenBolt]

I'll add another anecdote to the pile: I've straight-up had sponsors suggest that they weren't seeing clickthroughs or conversions, when deciding not to renew for additional spots. In more than one of those cases, I've had viewers, friends, or family that had absolutely purchased from the brands in question (i.e. they sent pictures or wore an item in person), making the brands more than enough money on top of viewership alone to make me a "good deal" and an easy renewal. Guess how many of them confirmed they use Honey, when I asked recently.

[@alexvarlotta9586]

ratchet & clank would be proud!

[@alexvarlotta9586]

that came out wrong. they would be proud of legal eagle xD

[@user-zc6ug3qh3z]

The thing that confuses me is that companies should be able to see that people use your personalised link to come in and then go to honey. Also wouldn't companies notice that after an ad campaign, people coming through honey wildly increases, which wouldn't make sense...

[@unoriginalname4321]

Paypal's CE0 made $42 million in 2023. The rich aren't happy with having _most_ of the money, they want _all_ of the money.

[@user-zc6ug3qh3z]

Companies were or obvlious in how to handle data, or they knew what was happening, but chose to accept it because they could keep the price of ad campaigns low...

[@jorgelotr3752]

Add the fact of false advertisement: they tell the consumer that using Honey gives them the best possible price, while they tell businesses that they will *avoid* giving customers the best possible price (every affiliate shopping site can choose what coupons can be "found").

[@ethanhambert8732]

They are attacking both sides meanwhile promising to save both of them.

[@philritter9042]

With this they are pretty much also threatening the sites saying if you don’t work with us we will give consumers all the best coupons for your site

[@tomer4566]

The word best is usually considered marketing puffery, not a genuine claim that something is the best.

[@xrmike68]

@@tomer4566 It is puffery but also false advertising if they are actively ignoring or hiding publicly known coupons that provide better value. i.e if a coupon code website has a 25% off code, and honey is found to actively agree with a website not to give a consumer the 25% off code, they are no longer using puffery but knowingly false advertising (which is at least covered in the UK).

[@ethanhambert8732]

​@philritter9042 exactly. Theyre threatening to do something that will benefit the consumers, but they also saying they are benefiting the consumers. Odd

[@adamschneider5755]

This was scummy at the $100M+ level before you realize that creators who DIDNT even vouch for honey still get their stuff poached.

[@whistist]

oh this is definitely in the billions of $$$ range , they made like 20 billion last year alone (number maybe wrong , or maybe from a different year), and id imagine atleast 95% of that was stolen from various sources

[@reefshadow1]

Would really like you to read this- honey affects small businesses as well. I stopped giving out reward coupons to my Etsy customers because Honey kept giving that coupon to other first time buyers that it wasn’t intended for. It was intended to be a thank you to return customers. I have had to disable all coupons in my store which impacts my sales, but I refuse to allow my coupon codes to be stolen.

[@solitarelee6200]

Yeah, and if what's alleged is true, they were doing it on purpose to straight up extort businesses like yours, like some kinda friggin coupon mafia running a protection racket

[@SnowieShiba]

Etsy has it's own way of sending out coupons which I appreciate, it's sad that your sales are getting sniped by honey.

[@blastlightstar]

this seems to be an intentional part of their business plan, to convince businesses to buy in so that honey doesn't give people coupons they don't want out there. i've seen it compared to a protection racket.

[@EricLS]

OK I KNEW this would be happening. The DAY I saw honey ads I was like “do you think a business would just sit there and give allow same special coupon code to be used by hundreds of random people? They would just turn off coupons entirely if Honey did what it said” And here you are. The affiliate scrubbing just makes it insane.

[@cheesywithers]

But doesn't honey only use website approved coupons? İsn't that part of the scam?

[@21preend42]

The worst part of this, is even when you have honey, simply clicking "okay" after they check and failed to find a coupon, they still getting money. This is ridiculous.

[@ZakEmerald]

Or when there's already a paypal checkout but honey wants you to click their little pop up checkout so you give money to them

[@wildmyke]

Feels like creators should have done their due-diligence before promoting this. The lawyer should have been involved BEFORE taking honey’s money. I find it hard to care if Mr beast makes a few less bucks.

[@beinerthchitivamachado9892]

Bro, I heard this but still don't understand HOW. How would they still get money or a comission from a sale if there wasn't a coupon in the first place? That makes no sense to me. Where would the money be coming from? Would they be taking it from the retailer directly?

[@evangrimm7824]

​@wildmyke Even creators who did not promote Honey had their attributions stolen. If Mr. Beast's audience downloaded Honey and then clicked on an affiliate link for Legal Eagle, the proceeds from the Legal Eagle attribution were stolen by Honey, even if Legal Eagle did not promote Honey to their audience.

[@frgnr88]

@@beinerthchitivamachado9892 In the same way someone with an affiliate links gets money. Say you have an affiliate link that you send people to XYZ site, and the agreement from the site is that you get 5% of any sale through your link. When people visit that site through your link, it is noted in the system that you were the person that brought them to XYZ site which led to a sale for the site. If someone makes a $100 purchase through your link you will get $5. Say you had 5,000 people make that same size purchase through your link. You would earn $25,000. What he is saying honey does, is that they remove the original affiliate link and replace it with their own so that they get the credit for bringing the sale to the site. So in the example, all the work you would have done to promote XYZ site and send people to their site you would now receive $0 and instead honey would receive the $25,000 that would have been yours. Simply because they ran a check to see if XYZ site had a coupon the people could use.

[@TalynWuff]

Oh snap. LegalEagle is on the case. Also intentional "We/I Believe" and "Allegedly" peppered throughout. Godspeed, sir.

[@jasonhatt4295]

The sign of a good lawyer

[@Kristjan_N]

@@jasonhatt4295 Not too sure how much he knows about bird law though.

[@jasonhatt4295]

@@Kristjan_N We’ll need an Avian Attorney for that

[@Kristjan_N]

@@jasonhatt4295 he'll consult Charlie Kelly I'm sure, he knows what's up.

[@kakabot3954]

@@Kristjan_Nwait wdym by bird law

[@adamel-sawaf4045]

Honey in a sticky situation, how ironic…

[@piotrswat169]

Legal boy here is suing in the name of the creators.Cause you know f the normal folk let the beast hook em up on sugar and gambling.

[@HrTykonu]

Honey, as you described to us, can now be categorized as malware.

[@kylewhiteman]

More like fraudware if you believe all the claims

[@NatiiixLP]

Yes. It's a man-in-the-middle attack that maliciously spoofs your cookies. While they'll surely claim that it's mentioned somewhere in their 5000-page terms of service, this is clearly a subversion of user expectations, and not the intended and/or expected behaviour.

[@KohanaWohali]

Shouting out not just Mega Lag's video but his patreon is absolutely a 10/10 move. Thats really cool.

[@TamWam_]

fr, at least honey can’t steal patreon donations

[@fullalbums5675]

dude at least credit him properly

[@LumpyBrain]

@@TamWam_I have no idea who/what Honey is, but from the sound of it, they’re probably thinking hmmm, now how can I weasel my way into their Patreon.

[@greenbeanjellybean]

@@LumpyBrainthis class action lawsuit wont let them do that😂

[@Toastmaster_5000]

@@TamWam_ Don't give them ideas lol

[@Cyber.Thunder]

Thankfully I un-installed Honey very early on, kept noticing they didn't find many coupons in general. So there was no point in keeping the extension.

[@aidenpangborn2382]

same

[@asmosisyup2557]

Yup, was still somewhat shocked to learn it was intentionally hiding coupon codes that it DID know about. They even have (or had) on one of their podcast things explaining to investors/suppliers how it lets them flag codes they dont want Honey to show to consumers.

[@jacobzeno5095]

same like 5 days in lol

[@PLMMJ]

We need more class action lawsuits against greedy companies.

[@fruxo4218]

I find the most scummiest part about this, which equates it to literal fraud, being the fact that even if honey doesn't find you a coupon at all, they will STILL take the credit for the sale, even when worthless.

[@CuanZ]

Or when they say there are no coupons when there are

[@Dzhama_Omarov]

To me the scummiest part is that a KZbinr won’t get his referral bonus even if he didn’t promote honey (if you have installed it before)

[@FilipCordas]

It's not fraud, the ambulance chaser should stick to stealing insurance money from victims. Only people that can ask for damages are people who installed honey not influencers trying to scam viewers. I don't feel bad for youtubers that promoted yet another scam and for once they lost money.

[@erolaydin8314]

@@FilipCordasyea i think more of an emphasis should be put on scaming its users and lying about finding you the best deals plus the scummy referal snag. That part should be class action as well

[@decentish8546]

@@FilipCordas it is fraud. It doesn’t matter how you feel about the KZbinrs who promoted it. Honey is taking credit and financial compensation for sales they didn’t create. That’s fraud plain and simple.

[@gritnix]

The straightforward, no-usual-comedy delivery of this shows just how serious this is. All business this time.

[@shannon915]

Well, yeah, it's his money being affected this time, so it's not funny to him.

[@reedlewis2968]

It's a lawsuit he is directly involved in so it's possible this video gets used in court. Joking about the situation might make it seem like he doesn't really care that much which could help PayPal's case

[@oporayamzzz]

Definitely. the only "comedy" bit was showing Ludwig's clip of needing Legal Eagle video and maybe the batman-like transition

[@jayjester4843]

A lot of it is because he’s involved in sewing them. He’s using a lot of allegedly, and we believe, because he knows what he’s doing. Eagle knows this video will come up in deposition and discovery. He has to state facts that can’t be used against him, or said with any seeming malice.

[@xBloodXGusherx]

I honestly wish 90% of KZbin was like this. Nearly every video is over the top snark and comedy.

[@NerdSyncProductions]

4:14 this is so important to keep in mind. Think of how many companies never came back to sponsor a creator because honey took the credit for that creator’s sale. Think of the future sponsor money Honey effectively stole from creators.

[@danushkastanley1746]

Exactly!

[@medea27]

I've heard multiple creators complain about disputes with a sponsoring company over the past few years where they weren't being given correct attribution for click-throughs... one I recall had multiple affiliate codes issued by the marketing company in an effort to resolve the issue. When I saw Megalag's video I immediately thought of those creators & I'd bet good money that Honey was causing those problems... if so, there were definitely sponsor/creator relationships that fractured due to their actions.

[@mallk238]

@theviking25 found the honey plant

[@JohnGeorgeBauerBuis]

@@theviking25 I was today years old when I learned about this situation.

[@carazy123_]

Right. Imagine the company thought their sponsor didn’t get any engagement on your channel because it was all stolen. Scum behavior imo.

[@ntray3729]

I think honey should be held accountable for what they did. Although I find it hypocritical to call it the "biggest scam" when there where thousands of scams that scammed viewers off their money. The reason many influencers call it that, in my books, is that it hurts their wallet for once.

[@MediecreGoddess]

i agree with your points but i think "hypocritical" is the wrong word here. (maybe "tone deaf"? theres a definite dissonance here with the influencers priorities)

[@nemaele]

I disagree that that is the reason. Honey was VERY widespread as a sponsor. To the point that most mainstream KZbinrs were likely sponsored or offered the sponsorship. I remember so many KZbinrs having a Honey sponsorship back in the day.

[@Editnamehere]

Big baby content creators crying now. And all the sheep following. This isn’t a scam at all.

[@ohio255]

​@@Editnamehere did you even watch the video?

[@sirspeedy9006]

I think this is so much bigger than just youtube, it affects literally every kind of affiliate link. I can see this lawsuit bankrupting honey and potentially doing serious damage to PayPal, and it'll be 100% deserved

[@PasionaGATES]

Im gon be honest, paypal has way tooo many people in it’s pockets that i Doubt there’ll be enough damage to them

[@mangenkyo]

I'll be surprised if Honey continues operating after this.

[@wildwilco]

Just too bad the original creator of honey wont get in legal trouble... he has already set up multiple other scam apps/sites since selling honey for billions to paypal.

[@andyb2977]

The guys who sold Honey to Paypal for $4 billion are laughing all the way to the bank.

[@MattExzy]

I'd still like to know how straight up obvious fraud got pass the big wigs at PayPal.

[@mikekreeki]

I'm a developer and watching MegaLag's expose, I was like "No way they are doing that. Oh, that's baaaad". PayPal must be in panic mode now. I'm making popcorn.

[@joeltucci1916]

Peter Thiel owns the next Vice President so…..

[@joshn1678]

Just think Peter Thiel just got his vice president elected, and he owns PayPal, who paid $4 billion for Honey.

[@artikus-k2j]

paypal is multibilion dollar company this is just a youtuber with a team sadly nothing will happen, its not the truth that wins, its the lawyers and paypal can afford the best ones

[@globalincident694]

I'm still not certain whether creators have an avenue to sue Honey. I can see how consumers have a way to sue Honey (for unrelated reasons, due to their false advertising). I can also see that the online store has a way to sue Honey. And I can see that creators might have a way to sue the online stores (who definitely would have known what was going on and could have done something about it through technological means, and it is suspicious that they didn't.) But that doesn't make it totally clear that the creators can sue Honey itself.

[@blueyandicy]

​@@globalincident694What? Why in the world would it be the stores fault?! You do realize this makes the affiliate data much worse for the store, right? And of course they can sue honey...it's called cookie stuffing, and eBay sued a different company a few years back for it.

[@superslash7254]

It's not just the referral link fraud. Honey would only show seller-approved (often much weaker) coupons from anyone who "participated" in their program, but if you DIDN'T pay Honey protection money they would go out of their way to show much larger coupons and hurt your business more. It's literally extortion.

[@PRC533]

Yeah, a kind of digital marketplace protection racket. We truly are rocketing towards a cyberpunk dystopia but without all the cool implants.

[@maxinoume]

I'm surprised the lawsuit isn't about that. I feel like it is way worse.

[@Jack-sy6di]

That's true, but it's also kind of the default for an extension with honey's functionality. If I were to make my own open source honey with volunteer-contributed coupon codes, online stores would get screwed over just as hard.

[@christopher6600]

That last point is a little asinine. Companies are the ones creating and approving their own coupon codes in the first place. Yeah, they'd prefer consumers pay full price, but they're not putting out coupons that they aren't prepared to honor in the first place.

[@Sinsanatis]

seems thats what megalags part 2 is going to be about

[@sagekay]

I unfortunately had Honey on my computer for years but tbh… it really never did anything. I would often click out of it the last couple years because it never did what it offered me to do- which is save me money.

[@geneticallymodified7775]

Gotta love the legal-friendly language 😂 "allegedly" "I believe that..." "it appears that..." "probably" "Presumably"

[@deathnstuff]

Ya 😭 when I started the video, I was like “why is this so vague…” before remembering this is a real lawsuit being filed by an actual professional lmaoo. Genuinely v cool to see

[@yomommashaus]

Allegedly is such a hilarious word when people drop it at the end of a sentence. It's almost like that comedian who said that you can change the entire context of most sentences by adding the word "ladies" to the end of it lol.

[@johan.ohgren]

@@yomommashaus That is very intentional.

[@Maladjester]

"Allegedly" always makes me think of Letterkenny.

[@bowietwombly5951]

Yeah wild, it's like he's a lawyer or something 😂

[@CellmateX]

Dunno about this one, Devin. The last time legal issues regarding honey were brought up, a guy named Barry B. Benson, caused a big economic and ecological issue with it.

[@PenellopeSweetz]

Okay this gave me a good chuckle. Well done. 🤣👏

[@llMarvelous]

It would bee an unbeelievable shame, if honey ends up to bee a scam I just bought 4kg 🍯

[@arthurdent4791]

inb4 economy crashes from honey scam

[@GreenGalaxio5]

I like this one 😂

[@yaseen157]

Hahah nice

[@audioithacaofficial]

KZbin: 2000's Broadcast Yourself KZbin: 2010's: Pranks leading to death and harassment KZbin: 2020's: Corporate level lawsuits between KZbinr and Sponsors

[@drkclshr]

@@alwaysdisputin9930dont make this political bruv

[@Spazy912]

@@alwaysdisputin9930hey don’t get political

[@samyollo8833]

@@alwaysdisputin9930bro had to make it into politics

[@khemdino9392]

​@@alwaysdisputin9930in reality, it would be: KZbin 2030's: The whole platform is bought by Elon Musk

[@charleston1789]

@@alwaysdisputin9930 I fear you may be right

[@NybergCarl]

That PayPal bought Honey means that the plaintiffs have a bottomless pit of money to go after. This isn't some fringe corporation that can go into bankruptcy.

[@WhiteOak61]

I love the "we believe" because this is an actual lawsuit so legal eagle is bringing out the legal speak

[@boojinapeggy]

saw this as it played

[@thefloatingeyeball2526]

The entire script reads as if it was written as a legal brief. Also his timbre and just presence seemed as if he was already at trial.

[@vladimirglutentag1469]

Last time I was this early the judge asked me “why the hell are you in my house?”

[@hermitsunite953]

lmao

[@Chimpy1]

Early?! Its 6 pm here! 😅

[@Feedback72]

I like your brain funny man 🤣🤣

[@jackhammer915]

I saw your pfp and I’m like “wait how how tf did I comment already”

[@IZ4DAYZ_]

Perhaps

[@gran_blackwell]

When I heard Lud say he needed a legal eagle video in his video I felt like world were colliding

[@jasonbuckley4118]

See i wasn't a fan of Ludwigs reaction (1 of many reactions i watched to the honey Video) to finding it out beacuse he seemed to gloss over how it effected EVERYONE with affiliate links, not just Streamers and content creators. Seeing this worthy enough to go as a Class Action let me feel like i was right in thinking this was more of a big deal than the reactions were making it seem. (i have a feeling there might be a few Clauses in contracts, not NDA of course as they are voided if they are covering something illegal but perhaps stipulations of an NDA in more loose terms to not restrict speech but enough to not beseech the name.)

[@gyomeihimejima3982]

@@jasonbuckley4118 yea but ludwig does this with everything lmao hes 'mr neutral' (if you can call him that w how he's always on the side of awful people)

[@TamWam_]

@@gyomeihimejima3982bro the point of being neutral is not siding, so he’s js going against his own “title”

[@MoonfishyTheMoonfish]

You're absolute Legend for actually trying to sue honey a scam company that takes people money.

[@Telkhine122]

BTW the same company that made honey also made pie, an adblocker that's been all over the internet recently

[@3dfactor]

You mean the adblocker that allegedly stole ad blocking patches from uBlock Origin? uBlock is licensed under GPL and fair game as long as your product is GPL too, which PIE isn't.

[@seabass8313]

they replace the ads with their own ads and pocket that ad money

[@mildu545]

And in the ads they use the fact that it's the same company as if it's a positive thing

[@V3x0r]

Adblock is all you need to never see an ad again on youtube.

[@coyoteisrandom]

Imagine making an adblocker just to make more ads about it

[@namehere139]

Crazy how when it's the creator getting messed with, everything goes haywire about it. But when it's the consumer affected, for example, BetterHelp, all the company has to do is wait a few months, and creators will take sponsor deals like it's nothing all over again. Kinda dissapointing really.

[@1esk192]

Julie Nolke getting sponsored recently was such a HUGE disappointment 😪

[@jackielinde7568]

I completely agree with this. For decades, content creators have been taking money from anyone with either dodgy claims about their products or outright scams and malware. And Legal Eagle only got into this because content creators were being affected.

[@amemelia]

KZbinrs that ditched but are now going back to better help seem to be going with "but they've changed and don't do those practices anymore" as the reason/ excuse

[@One.Zero.One101]

It basically mirrors real life. If you don't have a platform, it doesn't matter if you're kicking and screaming, companies will just ignore you. But as soon as your complaint gets any traction or media attention, suddenly the companies are right on the case!

[@snazzydrew]

It's a bit different than that but I can understand how your place in life may cause you to have resent for anyone one else getting justice. Just be careful with that resentful mindset.

[@fadlanal-amsi9839]

"We are suing honey" thank you so much LegalEagle , thank you

[@ethanhambert8732]

It will go down in history as one of the biggest lawsuits of all time.

[@harryshuman9637]

You do realize class action lawyers take most of the money from a win, correct?

[@Voidi-Void]

​@@harryshuman9637congratulations you know what legal fees are

[@Tortoise14]

@@harryshuman9637 At least it's money out of Honey's pocket though

[@AnormaIPerson3121]

and?​@@harryshuman9637

[@linsqopiring6816]

I think for a lot of your fans this will be the most satisfying video you've ever made. They messed with the wrong guy!

[@lich109]

Absolutely needs to be done. The fact they thought they could get away with this is shocking.

[@XXman23]

Unfortunately there is no case against Honey. No one wouild form a class action lawsuit, except celebrity lawyers on youtube who want more views.

[@retched]

@@XXman23 There is a case but not by the consumers.

[@the_real_rascal]

I mean, they got away with it for years so I guess they were right

[@MEHOLE]

This did get away with it. They got bought by PayPal!

[@iskeptical5698]

The amount of crap American businesses, especially healthcare, get away with is shocking. We're #1 all right. At absolutely getting fked over while the world laughs lol.

[@beanieb0b]

The fact that my favorite legal KZbinr is covering this is crazy, I missed back when the entire platform coming together for these kinda things

[@snowparody]

Tbh when was the last time this sort of thing happened? It makes sense in this case because Honey is stealing from these people directly

[@Applestoroger]

The pie adblocker (that is advertised all over youtube) is also created by honey, so I'd avoid that.

[@Zoey--]

KZbin advertises an ad-blocker after so anally trying to block them? That'd make me suspicious alone. Never listen to youtube :D

[@pithub6903]

@@Zoey-- ... man please don't be foolish. "youtube" doesn't advertise anything, Pie is advertising itself using youtube. Which yeah, would alone make me suspicious

[@RealMysticalMan]

Not surprising because KZbin barely regulates advertisements.

[@arkimaito1544]

Yea, just use Ublock origin

[@MuhammedGemci]

I avoid anything and everything that's advertised aggressively . I just know something is up, else they wouldn't have the buckets of money to fund all that aggressive advertising.

[@NybergCarl]

Devin makes a good point about creators having responsibility to vet advertisers. It's almost like there's a business opportunity for someone to vet advertisers.

[@SR-lr4ho]

Hi Devin, I am a software engineer who works in this industry for a major consumer brand. This kind of stuff is incredibly damaging to the industry as a whole, and is unfortunately more common than one might think. I'd be happy to offer my technical expertise free of charge. In addition to the other comment here mentioning case-law regarding cookie stuffing; it might be worthwhile looking at any legal filings, if available, in the twin lawsuits filed by Criteo and SteelHouse against one another (even though they were latter dropped/settled).

[@theedmee]

@LegalEagle (just in case)

[@anny8720]

Bumping!

[@cooly1234]

bumping

[@WindyRen]

I suggest using the contact info he gave in video, it’s not guaranteed he’ll see this in a list of comments

[@rubikvoncube3583]

Hopefully he sees this, although I would expect Devin has a method for learning about this type of stuff. Everything helps though! So replying to boost this

[@Yangy_Young]

This might go underappreciated but can I just say tagging MegaLag's Patreon as your source is hella based. Gotta love seeing content creators supporting and promoting others with more than just mentioning their KZbin videos.

[@circlePulse]

Yeah, I had the same reaction!

[@heddevh]

Definitely agree! I've already watched 5 KZbinrs react to his video by now, and though they mention his video as the source sadly most didn't even link it...

[@TheAbigailDee]

Yeah this rules!

[@starricerulean1721]

@@suuslime3908 yes he does

[@qar_ty7732]

@@suuslime3908 look at the literal second line in the description by expanding it

[@BubsGirl291]

My job is right down the street from Honey headquarters. It is HUGE, and is a whole building in the LA Arts District. I always wondered why it was so extravagant, despite their alleged business model that they advertised in the past. I cannot *wait* to see the building potentially close down as I drive to work in the upcoming years.

[@enbydeadly]

i was gonna ask why they put their office in the arts diatrict, but its fitting since they're experts in the art of misdirection

[@BubsGirl291]

@ HAHA yes 😂

[@TheWinpie]

well I mean fly-over state psych majors need some sort of job to get by, why not honey? Also, this isn't against you, but somewhat question the viewers on the honey case. Do you really think honey advertised a system that was illegal? Or perhaps, are the people using honey bad consumers?

[@Bandrik]

Hahaha that's perfect! You'll have front row seats to see what will hopefully become metaphorically boarded-up windows :)

[@HigherQualityUploads]

Why do they need such a big space for a company that just maintains a browser extension? 🤔

[@ikwhite]

It’s not a scam if the creator agreed to the brand/advertisers terms that state last click attribution is who gets the credit. IF honey is wiping cookies BEFORE an active click of a coupon, then yes, that’s wrong. If they are not and they fire it when there is an active click from the user, and they are the last click, then it’s perfectly legal. The change that needs to happen is advertisers/brands change the terms and tracking technologies account for the changes brands deem to pay on.

[@TheLetterbomber]

Love the callout of other similarly questionable services at the end. I had assumed Honey was a massive data-scraping business, but I never expected the scam would be so much more sneaky and complicated. I'm excited to see where this goes.

[@Joshua_Hale]

Yeah, my mind went to data scraping as their source of revenue as well. I figured that would already be a viable business model. And even after I watched the MegaLag video, I didn't realise that this sort of switcheroo swindle was so common in the industry. It's insane.

[@damiang888]

I feel alone in that I always tought that the creators already knew that honey removed their affiliate links and codes and had already baked that up in a flat fee that honey was paying since, for me, this was the only thing that made sense. Ohh how naive I was.

[@One.Zero.One101]

They got too greedy. They could have gotten away with selling personal information which is legal in America (but not in Europe). They could have made big money but they wanted more. I don't know why they thought they could get away with this.

[@Joshua_Hale]

@@One.Zero.One101 Well, for a while there they were getting away with this. Hell, the people who made the extension did get away with it; they aren't part of this lawsuit and flogged Honey off to PayPal for four billion dollars after already having made who knows how much money with it.

[@kreeperskid]

I was looking into this whole Honey situation and thought "Wow it sounds a lot like what my Capital One Shopping extension does", then you literally name dropped it at 7:05. Getting rid of that immediately

[@Kristjan_N]

Interestingly, Linus tech tips (which was sponsored by honey) said they switched to Karma instead - even though Karma does basically the same thing.

[@alowva]

It does the same thing NOW. Linus claims that Karma claimed they didn't affiliate hijack at the time they did the sponsor, but we have no way to verify that unfortunately.

[@headkraber]

@@Kristjan_N It only makes sense for LTT to switch to Karma if Karma agreed not to hijack LTT affiliate links. Which could be easily tested out, preferably on an addon version prior to Megalag investigation video. From the LTT response to Megalag, it seems that they were not particularly phased by the investigation and LTT KNEW what Honey was doing.

[@alexl9]

​@@headkraberLTT also mentioned Karma assured them they were not touching the affiliate links like Honey does at the time of the sponsorship. But since they haven't worked with them since, Linus also said that may not be the case anymore, so there's a chance Karma might do the same now.

[@xii7548]

I thought and did the same thing

[@zlamanit]

5:11 apparently it's worse - not only they changed cookies when they had no codes, but they also gave consumers lower value codes if they had a deal with the store while claiming that they offer the best codes available. So a consumer could find a better code online but instead used a low value or no code at all after Honey made the "check".

[@vap0rw1se]

I always always ALWAYS had a hunch that it was too good to be true. It "helped" people far too much.

[@NintendoCapriSun]

I haven't been this thunderstruck by the words "See you in court" since the middle of case 5 in Ace Attorney Spirit of Justice.

[@lashoxcin9348]

Omg Nintendocaprisun!

[@Mr.Board_]

O hoi didn’t expect to see you here

[@makototv1035]

Ace attorney mentioned 🗣

[@Subreon]

HOLD IT! *slam* in order to be truly Thunderstruck, you must run an AC unit on DC power.

[@bobstevenson3130]

Rare NCS sighting 👀📸

[@NotChicoAndPico]

interesting to see legaleagle becoming the go-to lawyer for youtube creators.

[@sylvrwolflol]

Yeah I was gonna say lol We're watching the Legal Eagle become Harvey Birdman in real time, and I'm kinda about it.

[@Seraphim144]

@@NotChicoAndPico it is truly a site to see, my respect for him has greatly increased.

[@JalnorTheGreat]

I was offered Megalag's video right away when it published, but didn't watch until a day or so later and I remember thinking "I hope LegalEagle drags their asses through court." Glad to see you intend to!

[@rossherndon4548]

I tried honey several years ago when it first became the hot sponsorship on KZbin. I eventually stopped because it literally never worked for me. The fact that they only got as big as they did because they paid KZbinrs to promote them, only to screw them over in the end is so insidious

[@Boffy]

Filled out my info, praying for y'all to win so that I can get my justice in the form of a juicy check

[@iconicflorence5883]

You’re the goat

[@ShedPCNextGenUpgrade]

Just keep in mind these class actions will get you a $17 cheque in the mail like 4-5 years down the line. Obviously there is a greater trust when it comes to Devin, (LegalEagle) but that's usually how these things play out. I would hope he was the website worked out in a way so that everyone who contributes gets compensated fairly.

[@zerobudgetvideos-n5h]

You being here is a surprise

[@wakuwakusonicpartolcar]

the goat

[@AR-dq2jq]

Did'nt expect to see you here, have you returned to yt

[@Benmenesesjr]

Such masterful use of "We believe" and "Allegedly". Sidestepping the lawsuits

[@TPHRyan]

I, heh, might not watch enough LegalEagle, does anybody understand the benefit of saying these things even though the things being said have been proven? (in some of the cases that he said it)

[@hilliamwowl8750]

@@TPHRyan It has to be proved in court, no matter how cut and dry the evidence may seem, before you can speak in absolutes about a legal case

[@cicalinarrot]

That's "KZbinr accusing someone before court rulings 101"

[@buttervlies]

He's a veteran, son

[@TycoPazifist]

@@TPHRyan also as a actual working professional in the field it is probably an autmatic habit by now - just part of the way they are trained to speak in general

[@QuinnTheGM]

As a law student and KZbinr, I greatly appreciate both the action taken in this video and the number of "allegedly"s used in its presentation. Godspeed!

[@asimhussain8716]

You should do a video on the "legal system" of Westeros.

[@staytuned2L337]

​@@asimhussain8716 could be wrong but I think he did do a thing on how useless the master of laws was, and certain dumb westerosi laws

[@theleviathan3902]

Love your videos!!

[@MugenHeadNinja]

Didn't expect to see you here, but I should've figured honestly considering the whole law student thing. Keep up the good work man looking forward to more videos, you're one of the few ASOIAF KZbinr's that I still watch.

[@rabbit251]

Did you notice also that he didn't mention any of the defendants by name (Mr. Beast from what I have heard should comes to mind). Don't want them to have an action for defamation. Other creators when discussing the issue should take note. Truth is an absolute defense in defamation, but you have to weigh the costs and Paypal has some pretty deep pockets. Interesting to see what Paypal's next move will be and how this will play out.

[@YTPeregrine]

I was today years old when I learned what Honey was...

[@kirkshanghai]

I knew immediately there would be a juicy class action against them the moment I saw the video. I was not expecting my boy Devin to be spearheading the charge. We are behind you, brother and we appreciate you

[@Sunshyne670]

I predicted Devin would jump on this. He's uniquely prepared to litigate this case, being intimately familiar with how the KZbin business works.

[@southerncharmcreative]

Yep, I knew it wouldn’t take long for a class action suit to be filed 😅

[@nonstandard5492]

the video is called "I'm suing honey". the title says that there's a lawsuit and that he's spearheading it.

[@jougjimmadome]

​@@nonstandard5492 they're speaking of the first video to call out honey, not this video

[@MoonLiteNite]

Or you could have just read the EULA for honey like 10 years ago..... also explains what the program does. This ain't new. Its just dumb people watching some video, then pulling out the pitchforks cause they noticed they couldn't read their contract.

[@Some-q1]

2024-2025 is gonna be the internet’s justice arc

[@connycontainer9459]

Hahahahahahahaha haha hahahahahaha hahahahahahahaha hahahahahaha.

[@ArtGirl82]

So, he's not suing on behalf of bees? I mean, that's also kind of stealing from creators 🐝🍯

[@G1ng3rG4m1ng]

LETSGOOOOOOOO

[@strain42]

I'm glad you mentioned Pie because I absolutely don't trust them. Any adblocker that is allowed to advertise on KZbin and basically has some rando creator I've never heard of essentially going "You'd be stupid not to install this right now!" is a HUGE red flag for me. And just to see if this ages well, but I don't trust Rocket Money either. Their ads feel super sketchy.

[@whiteraven562]

yeah. Same with that company that offers to find all your subscriptions for you so you can keep track of them easier. How is it doing that? How much of my account info can it see? How much of my *bank* info can it see?

[@Belgarath1966]

So the people at Pie are the same ones that created Honey and sold it to PayPal for $4 billion dollars. Now you’ve heard of them! It’s the same damn group!

[@HearMeLearn]

@@Belgarath1966 yep it's literally like the same leaders and devs, doing the ad blocking thing, and pie also has a coupon function as well. they're literally trying to recreate the exact same thing they already sold to paypal so they can get in on the scam as well

[@zigzag321go]

I heard somewhere that the CEO of Pie is/was somehow related to Honey. I don't know how reliable this is though

[@Obsidian8R]

if ANY ad blocker gets advertised period, now that is a red flag

[@spoileralerttheater642]

The consumers have to go through arbitration that Honey pays for? I wonder what would happen if millions of consumers were to file for arbitration? After all, it is following their rules they set.

[@MadMorgie6318]

I remember when I first saw the ads thinking, "So, wait, where's the money coming from for them?" Best hopes, LegalEagle.

[@Literallymefr912]

markiplier alt account /j

[@jeremytine]

i ask that everytime I see a service for free, including all social media... no such thing as a free lunch. Honey seemed like a scam from me on day 1, just didn't know how for certain.

[@6thwilbury2331]

Same! I just assumed it was harvesting user data, similar to social media platforms and such. What they actually did is not something I thought of, nor could have imagined.

[@WackoMcGoose]

@@6thwilbury2331 Very much this. "If you're not paying for the product, you ARE the product" has been accepted internet canon for at least a decade... but "and even when you're _paying_ for the product, someone can change _who_ is getting paid for the product" is certainly a plot twist no one saw coming.

[@blowc1612]

It's discount from the store, Honey makes money for directing traffic to the store. This lawsuit is very weak as there is no law on who gets what in regards to directing traffic and nothing honey did is illegal. ITS CONTENT CREATOR GREED 90% OF CONTENT CREATORS BEING GREEDY TRASH HUMAN BEING AS USUAL

[@katherinelynch4193]

Devon’s in scary mode this video. No goofs, no gags, just righteous fury on behalf of his colleagues. Even the closing catchphrase is pure venom.

[@mightyakkylex]

It gave me chills

[@kuhljager2429]

Im so used to the jokes, this threw me for a bit listening to him be so serious

[@baleavitt]

The difference is when he usually posts a video it is for the purposes of informing and entertaining. This one was under the auspices of his day job so he was all business this time

[@hugegamer5988]

Somehow I think honey has taken a bit from him lol.

[@djsmeguk]

Yeah you can see why Devin might be a rather good trial lawyer right here. Impressive!

[@SalRoyale]

Attorney in NY here, and friend and long time viewer of the channel. I absolutely support your suit.

[@boarbot7829]

To be fair, I've never, ever, in my entire life used an affiliate link.

[@arya6085]

it also harms the consumer. honey intentionally handed out bad coupons to help out the businesses

[@Balingy]

I have also never and likely will never use an affiliate link.

[@johnwerner69]

This is literally the plot to the bee movie

[@BaronSengir1008]

Not really

[@benwasserman8223]

So, who’s gonna be KZbin’s Southern drawl lawyer?

[@macchiatoceo]

This made me laugh way too hard 💀

[@johnwerner69]

​​@@BaronSengir1008the title is not the actual video

[@Stormfishingfordiscs]

Lmao

[@inviktus1983]

KZbin recommended Megalag's video to me hours after it uploaded. I was *floored* watching that video and I KNEW it was going to blow up. And blow up it did. Other channels started covering Megalag's video and it just skyrocketed in no time. This is history unfolding folks.

[@HowDoUPlayGames]

Until this blew up, I was getting so many ads for that Pie ad-blocker. The ads even tried to sell it on being "by the makers of Honey". Funny how I don't see those ads anymore.

[@ferryvantichelen6521]

I'm seeing this Pie adblocker for the first time, but it sounds a lot like how the Brave browser works

[@jackhemsworth7515]

i typically see surfshark or nordvpn on the channels i'm on. and i did sign up for it at one point. it seems like a decent service, but then i went on certain websites, that have ip blocked the vpn servers.

[@maspheliciasonsaku2523]

Funny how they removed the "by the makers of Honey" from their official website as well ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

[@jackhemsworth7515]

@@maspheliciasonsaku2523 Curious right? like when that building complex in brooklyn removed their association with trump

[@maspheliciasonsaku2523]

@@jackhemsworth7515 Wouldn't know about this, I don't live in the US and only remotely follow US politics ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[@ramonmartinez2843]

My respect for Markiplier went through the roof He was the only KZbinr who knew something fishy was going on at honey and he refused to shill out their advertisements

[@nmoharo829]

Worst part is probably every creator who did not take the sponsorship but are also losing money and credit as a result

[@tehSunBro]

No worst part is the end users not getting the best codes, because businesses pay honey to withhold them. Literally the only part that matters.

[@Seraphim144]

@@nmoharo829losing credit is the worst part, because you can replace money. But credit takes lots of time to rebuild, if it’s even possible.

[@emilyboller7588]

This the first time I'm hearing about Honey's problems....makes me wonder where in the world I've been that I missed this information. I've had Honey running on my browser for years but just uninstalled it after seeing your video and reading the comments. Thanks for the video!

[@michaelfrymus]

The news has been out for only the last month or so. No one seemed to notice until just now. Now revealing how big of a scam Honey is!

[@volbla]

Well, megalag only posted the result of their investigation a couple of weeks ago. It's easy to miss if you're not involved in communities that care a lot about youtubing/internet culture. Even if you are you could miss the conversations by sheer bad luck.

[@stefanoangelini6408]

My wife gifted me a LegalEagle fan club coffee mug for Christmas. No such thing exists, she has unscrupulously appropriated the image of Devin and printed it on a mug such that my lips would touch him every day. What recourse is there against this.

[@charleston1789]

😂

[@daniellamalcolm7328]

😂

[@puppykitty6100]

Misappropriation of marital assets. Good luck ;)

[@Whoataku]

When he dies, you have to stay far away from the funeral. Far, far away.

[@orangeblack1285]

I'd say marry her, but I think it might be too late for that.

[@Elbruhman6456]

Years ago I told people that honey, usually sponsored by Mr Beast, woudlnt work and I doubted it with every inch of my determination. Well, well, look where we're at.

[@MAKEARTNOWCHANNEL]

Thank you and MegaLag for this. I can recall a noticeable drop in my affiliate commissions back in 2021. I thought it was due to Amazon and others reducing affiliate commissions. The difference from end of 2019 to end of 2021 was a few hundred dollars a month, despite my videos growing and subscriber count growing. Now we know. I think the two creators who crafted Honey in the first place and sold to PayPal need to be publicly flogged for shameful theft.

[@Solzthestarforger]

*megalag

[@Hirotechnics]

Dont blame the original devs, this very much happened as a result of the PayPal buyout and corporations being morally/ethically bankrupt.

[@dominik36127]

@@Hirotechnics No, original devs are now promoting a new app called Pie that does the same shit. They knew very well what they were doing.

[@Siddeshlowk]

@@Hirotechnics nah, it's the creators fault. That's the entire honey business model

[@greydominguez9195]

@@Hirotechnics Even small corporations are ethically bankrupt. There is no ethical consumption under capitalism, nor is there ethical production.

[@dragonabsurda]

I used to have the Honey plugin for a while, but removed it ages ago because it never once found me any savings and just became an annoyance. If I had known what they were doing, I never would have considered using it in the first place!

[@pollexmeister5464]

I dont care who gets the commission. If it saved me money I would still use it.

[@yumleadpaintchips2213]

When a business does something like this people need to start realizing that they themselves, meaning their cookies, browser history, data, everything related to their digital footprint, are the product. Be more vigilant in what you download, install, browse, or use. Because all, each and every single one of these assholes, want your data. I mean even Apple had to settle a class action just today because of Siri recording private conversations without people knowing. And all they had to pay for that data they got? Under 100 million which might work out to something like 20 dollars per person. Protect yourself and start being more selective about the tech you use, both hardware and software. Because this "ease of use" shit is just code for collecting your data, making a portfolio on who you as a person are, and then selling it off. What we're seeing big tech doing now makes 1984 and The Patriot Act look like the creep with binoculars watching for tits out of his high rise downtown. Big tech is instead going around and installing cameras in everybody's homes while they're at work in order to crank off.

[@andsailedcalmlyon]

​@pollexmeister5464 It in fact would actively hide better coupons on sites that paid them, so even if you don't care about anyone but yourself it's bad.

[@instantrameng0d36]

"I will see you in court" is such a terrifying sentence. I got scared a little

[@codingpileofdirt]

That's a sign the warning is working.

[@justchiling22]

Thank you for taking action on this! I hope the lawsuit ends in our favour and end this scam that leeches on creators' hard-earned money.

[@vZuggy]

YES! these companies need to learn their lesson.

[@TechnicallyNothing]

YES!

[@2m7b5]

They won't.

[@_BangDroid_]

It's Paypal, it's not the first or last time they've effed people over and they'll continue doing so

[@chupamishuevos303]

This the first time I don't really care. I knew honey was a scam from the start and I bet creators did too but didn't care because of course money. so I am glad they got scammed. I hope that content creators do too.

[@rakinkazi9780]

YES!

[@MrFalliorsGaming]

Is it possible to do a class action for consumers as well? They INTENTIONALLY kept the real coupons away, they intentionally didn't do exactly what they promoted they did. Sure we didn't pay anything to use honey, but they are still directly responsible for customers paying more than they were supposed to when using their service.

[@alisaarama5585]

No, the customers are “supposed to” pay full price actually. Customers use honey to take advantage of codes they had no idea about, and pay less. Without such extensions you either pay full price or just look for codes yourself online. No one is entitled to a discount. Is that surprising?

[@maspheliciasonsaku2523]

No class action for the customers because it should already be covered by false advertisment if it's included in this lawsuit.

[@sonjaimmonen6610]

Depends on the Terms of Service. It is possible the ToS states you cannot sue them.

[@BackwardsPancake]

@@alisaarama5585 Yeah, but the critical sticking point here isn't about what the customer actually pays the company - It's about what honey said they'd do for the customer vs what they actually did. The fact that the product is given for "free" doesn't mean it's ok to lie or mislead about what it does.

[@cyan_oxy6734]

​@@alisaarama5585 Couldn't the lost savings be classified as damages? Saying that lost savings are intended while lost revenue is a crime is a bit funny imo. Especially since both creators and consumers basically put no effort into it making the salesman referral car reference card bit quite misleading.

[@solarianvoid-pi9428]

I appreciate that you’re calmly explaining and yet your anger is more than clear

[@Sumire9287]

These guys are a bunch of scumbags who saw easy money. I don’t blame them though, and I also believe they’re well legally covered since they’ve been doing this for almost a decade. It just came to light recently on a massive scale. I’m excited to see how this turns out, likely with a settlement. The lawsuit is massive against a huge company that know that they’re stealing in a semi legal way.

[@Aurorajunior7321]

@@Sumire9287 nothing about what they are doing is legal…

[@hushpuppi3]

The odds of LegalEagle being directly harmed by Honey are pretty high since it still steals your attributions even if you weren't the one promoting Honey. It's pretty messed up.

[@Sumire9287]

@@hushpuppi3 it’s completely messed up, yes. I don’t think he’s getting screwed over much since he mainly promotes his own legal team that won’t have any referral links, but he can for sure sue for damages himself.

[@Sumire9287]

@@Aurorajunior7321 I wouldn’t be so sure. It’s completely true no jury will like them, since they might have been screwed by honey themselves, so any possible argument for a crime will be positively regarded. But as I’ve said before, they’ve been at it for almost a decade and someone like PayPal bought them. PayPal is huge and I don’t think they want to get dragged into this mess given the obvious repercussions even back then. They’ll likely have done their due diligence before the 4 billion dollar purchase. Honey and PayPal are not idiots, they wouldn’t be blatantly stealing without having some legal coverage. Obviously a long battle won’t benefit either, both sides have a lot of money to spend on this and PayPal has a lot to lose, that is why I believe they’re going to get a settlement.

[@faba6753]

Sooooo ... no lawsuit on behalf of consumers who were scammed by honey? Only millionaire and other well off creators who lost affiliate money?

[@Balingy]

Exactly.

[@BobSchmidt]

The creator of Honey is doing the same thing with his new venture, PIE Ad Blocker. On youtube, it blocks adsense ads, inserts their own ads, and pays the end user a tiny bit. The creator and youtube gets nothing.

[@Quinimunn]

THERES A SEQUEL

[@j.munday7913]

Wait, so that's why I'm getting a billion PIE ads? Oh, hell no!

[@battuk2017]

does that make a Honey Pie?

[@OmgItsTheWigeon]

I dont care much that youtube doesn't get money from it, since it's already a shady company making billions trying to squeeze every penny from their consumers, but it really annoys me how it affects creators

[@TheCrazyCapMaster]

FASCINATING. That explains the ad bombardment for that thing. 🤔

[@snowshinobi]

Eagle Team really said "is anyone else gonna sue that?" and didn't wait for an answer (: Thanks folks. Holding the line is exhausting work. I see you.

[@ingenuity23-yg4ev]

is that a wilbur reference i see😭

[@cat1554]

Also, Wendover (Jet Lag) appears to have hired him.

[@Seraphim144]

@@cat1554 nice! The more teamwork the better.

[@Steambull1]

The first time a KZbinr did an ad read for Honey, I thought "that's too good to be true."

[@TheZiaJarin]

I thought that too.

[@patrickcarrera5956]

Nothing is free, ever. They most earn money somehow.

[@AXELEMASTER]

I, as well, thought that too but after years of seeing different creators stand behind honey I began to change my mind only to find that suspicion was warranted

[@bartderuyck]

Exactly! I never installed it because I wondered: what is their business model? How are they making money? Now, we know: they allegedly hijacked affiliate links.

[@marcuscostello5635]

What a dumb thought. It isn't too good to be true. Consumers should still very much continue using honey