Ian Gordon on Salmon Fishing

[@mikewill620]

Hi Ian, I and I’m sure many others who share your passion really enjoyed this short clip. Thank you. I myself was an avid Ugie angler and witnessed the demise of the finnock in the late 80s and on though the 90s….(note: at that time we still had decent numbers of returning mature sea trout). I wondered back then if the fish were not returning as finnock due to having to spend more time at sea searching for food….a result of a lack of foodstuffs along the Buchan coast and being forced to travel further afield. I shared my thoughts back then with the ‘mis-managers’ of the river, but it simply went over their and the ‘experienced’ anglers heads. It was as you’ve stated in this clip….’an indicator’. Now that we know there is a lack of feeding off our coasts….and that our salmonids are travelling further in order to feed. It’s not surprising the impact on exiting smolts and returning mature fish as they run the gauntlet of even greater predation. The angling community appear to be a polarised and splintered group……if we could only unite as one collective body we may then exercise the political muscle we require…..all is not lost…but we first need to accept and understand that sitting, waiting on the situation to improve without collective collaboration and intervention isn’t going to happen. Happy New Year.

[@bruinocanfish2370]

Ian it really comes across your passion and love for salmon and there preservation.

[@IanGordonsalmonfishing]

Many thanks for your reply. It's a real passion of mine .

[@gunzowillis545]

Your absolutely right Ian. Controlled management of the predator population inland and reducing the catches at sea are a must. Unfortunately I think artificial spawning is the only safeguard we can rely on to ensure we have fry getting to smolts and running the gauntlet at sea and returning.

[@IanGordonsalmonfishing]

I think the same. It's been sometime since the river had an excess of either juveniles or adults. What Bob Kindness has proven on the Carron is this will work on smaller rivers. it now needs to be trialed properly on a bigger river. I'm afraid managers were sleeping in the 1990s and failed to recognise the decline.

[@MrKveite1]

The problem with artificial spawning is the fish get smaller and dont have the same survivability tho so that must be taken into consideration and there must be planted more row or released a bit more smolt than what will likely be recommended to make up for that fact. That's how it goes with the artificial fish here in Norway and i have a har d time seing the artificially spawned salmon there will be much different.

[@lawrencecourt7991]

What interests me is that atlantics EVERYWHERE are declining rapidly. This tells you that the localized problems (fish farms, goosanders, seals, fertilizer runoff, increased sewerage, unmanaged fishing at sea, warmer summers etc.) are not the central problem as the decline is universal across all geographies. Which points the finger to the one central place where all salmon go and where their localized problems are discounted -- namely, the sea. If we fix the local problems, it will help -- but until we stop what's killing them on the banks, we most likely won't see a real improvement.

[@IanGordonsalmonfishing]

I totally agree that most of the salmons problems are at sea, and for all different reasons the balance between predation and pray is not favouring salmon at this time. Man is the main perpetrator.

[@BigFly028]

Great explanation of the salmon reproduction cycle 👌👌

[@SalmoScotland]

Fabulous Ian, great informative clip

[@IanGordonsalmonfishing]

Thanks pal.

[@kevinadamson5768]

I fish the river Tees in NE England and it's not a prolific salmon river just the odd one, but I've noticed over the last few years the cormorants and goose anders have ran hammock. Add to that here has been a massive increase in the American crayfish which feed on the eggs so the whole ecosystem has changed. The crayfish explosion has increased the otter population too which feed on them and the fish, it's a no win situation unless something is done about it. The native brown trout have taken to eating these crayfish too but there are that many that it doesn't put a dent in the population. There is now a catch and release on all salmon on the river until stocks improve but in my opinion it's the predators that need culling first and the trapping of the crayfish

[@crestonlaager3216]

Mr. Gordon, I live in NY, USA, and frequent the Lake Champlain area, and lately there's been much discussion regarding Landlocked (Atlantic) Salmon "Restoration." We - and I don't know if this is the right way to go either - have gone "all in" with a landlocked salmon stocking program, while at the same time, attempting to bring back natural reproduction in the streams they once frequented. It's a joint effort here between Vermont, New York, and the US Fish & Wildlife agency - a trifecta, organized to finally answer the call. I have been in touch with biologists from the two states and they're very excited, but admit there's a long way to go to have successful reproduction and there has been, they're certain of that. Of course, our landlocked fish don't have the additional period of vulnerability and lack of protection from predation in the ocean, however, it's still a tough thing bringing back fish even with aggressive stocking and anti-poaching measures that were for all intents and purposes, extinct. Anyway, thank you for your continuing efforts, your wisdom, and for keeping the faith.

[@IanGordonsalmonfishing]

Hi Creston, Im going to re post an earlier reply as i think it relevant. Im a great fan of hatcheries, especially those run properly and with angling in mind. What people like Throstor Elidison (Ranga River), Bob Kindness (Carron) Peter Gray (Tyne) have done is, during a time of very low output and return, they have micromanaged their respective fisheries, providing them with extra fish to offset natural loss. The causes of those losses we have debated till the cows have came home and returned to the field again. However those guys took the bull by the horns, not thinking of changing the “world” by “solving the overall problem”, bit by doing what they “knew” would help their fishery. Its not about the big picture, its about your particular picture. The one you describe is really interesting and different. We are all programmed to try and “Fix” the overall problem but in the case of a migratory animal, particularly one hidden under the waves, instead of trying to find all of the answers, those guys who have been successful look at the problem from an angling perspective. Have a look here www.speyonline.com/post/salmon-recovery-creates-1000s-more-jobs

[@crestonlaager3216]

@@IanGordonsalmonfishing

[@crestonlaager3216]

@@IanGordonsalmonfishing Mr. Gordon, Thank you for the reply, I was so excited to receive the personal reply, I even showed it to my wife, lol. I watched the link you sent me, interesting. I guess Similar to the situation in the Carron, our Lake Camplain fish are also a mix these days of wild/stocked fish. Except our fishery had been completely decimated to the extent that the fish had been made practically extinct due to dams, pollution, no game laws, foresty, over-harvest, etc. Our program was started from fish brought in from the state of Maine a few years ago and only recently have we had wild reproduction. Another serious obstacle for our salmon is that only 150 miles away, across New York state, there’s the Pacific Salmon fishery in Lake Ontario. I fished with my father there, and my son too, that’s three generations of fisherman raised to have a parochial understanding of what a salmon is. Where I live, a salmon is a salmon is salmon, at least that’s the understanding, the mentality. In Lake Champlain they’ve introduced these fish that the fishing public hasn’t been “culture” into, seeing even the Landlocked variety as a fish for the wealthy and kings and such. There’s another interesting thing that works in our salmon’s favor, however. The Lake Champlain fishery is basically landlocked, and sees no commercial pressure, and like was mentioned in the forward to the film on Speypages, the economic benefit from the salmon should make the politicians drool. They say that the LakeChamplain fishery saw a doubling of fishing tournaments during the pandemic, basically saving the area. I see good things on the horizon, for your fishery and mine. Good day sir, keep the faith.

[@jjames2162]

@@crestonlaager3216 As a Vermonter who have been double handing for more than a decade, the Champlain Valley effort as well as the Connecticut River restoration are abject failures due to the lakes farm run off and the CT river dams. If you look at Maine, they are having very good success with sea going landlock salmon restoration efforts because they removed the dams and prohibited angling until the population becomes sustainable

[@johnbrown3951]

What are your thoughts on re stocking a river with a river specific hatchery. The Ugie certainly had a hatchery well before my time. In my humble opinion and experience I think the rivers that had in the past certainly benefited. In my short time on the Kintyre peninsula I spoke to many anglers and they told me stories about prolific runs of fish but they had dwindled away. The one river that still had a run!! of fish was the Barr Water at Glenbarr which had had it's own hatchery. That was twenty years ago and things I am sure will have changed. Your theory of a bait ball is spot on if there are not numerous numbers of fish in the smolt run the fish from smaller rivers are under more threat from predation unless they can meet up with other rivers. When I was involved with Stornoway Angling Association they had set up a hatchery on the Creed. That river in my opinion had good runs of fish but the locals knew things were changing and fish farms (don't get me started) were also not helping!!!!. Seals have to be considered as well and the numbers of them that sit at the mouth of the Dee,Ythan,Ugie etc. I am no expert in this field, just my opinion from experiences over the years of travelling through work choosing my destinations based on fishing opportunities.

[@tomjones7593]

Agreed- yet Natural Resources Wales (NRW-The NRA here) have not only stopped stocking but my .local fishing club, which had established its own hatchery with tremendous volunteer work, is now forbidden to stock migratory fish. Why ? I have two thoughts; 1. NRW don't want to do it any more because it requires expertise and costs money-much easier to make all rivers catch and release here, 'monitor' the situation and spend the savings on salaries and jetties for 'leisure users' and 2. By forbidding all stocking NRW can always use the old argument there is 'no evidence' that stocking helps (Which of course there cannot be, as it is forbidden !). I fish the North Tyne now whenever I can- stocked, of course......

[@IanGordonsalmonfishing]

Hi John, many thanks for the reply. Im a great fan of hatcheries, especially those run properly and with angling in mind. What people like Throstor Elidison (Ranga River), Bob Kindness (Carron) Peter Gray (Tyne) have done is, during a time of very low output and return, they have micromanaged their respective fisheries, providing them with extra fish to offset natural loss. The causes of those losses we have debated till the cows have came home and went away again, however those guys took the bull by the horns, not thinking of changing the “world” by “solving the overall problem”, bit by doing what they “knew” would help their fishery. Have a look here www.speyonline.com/post/salmon-recovery-creates-1000s-more-jobs

[@IanGordonsalmonfishing]

Sorry John, i answered to you but posted it to Tom below by mistake. Please have a look there. www.speyonline.com/post/salmon-recovery-creates-1000s-more-jobs

[@johnbrown3951]

@@IanGordonsalmonfishing Will do. Have a great festive period. Look forward to any content in 2023

[@Vasinator1]

New waders Ian?! Which simms variant are those? Keep up the good work 🎉

[@IanGordonsalmonfishing]

Those are the boot foot ones. I find them really comfortable, great to wade in very easy for a fat boy like me to get in and out of.

[@simbabradley]

Question, why is it that Norway Iceland Russia, their populations are doing well what is the difference? Can someone tell me

[@IanGordonsalmonfishing]

Having fished in all of those countries I can say that the decline is affecting those in a similar way to that of Scotland. I know this to be accurate.

[@davidcollins5102]

Norway has all their salmon farms in Scotland

[@robertcross6834]

It's like the problem the American northwest, seal populations out of control

[@steveharrison4176]

Yet another well meant but useless video. What is it with Scotland ,its beyond my ken why fishery boards think that, 1) culling birds an seals is anything other than a very shortsighted argument mainly meant to look like they are doing something .2) should fishery boards really think that birds an seals culled will not be instantly replaced by others as there is nothing for them to eat at sea ,then ask them how they think they will get permission for such actions ? they will not and they know it. We have almost total c&r ,restrictions on methods and the hours fished ,none have done anything to improve returns. Then we get to herring and sandeels and there we get to the bottom of the matter ,we are the end user of both herring and sandeel ,be that eating them or using them as feed an fertilizer ,so basically the whole of the Scottish farming industry and our eating habits would have to change ( you see that happening ) ? and with the backdrop of a growing population .Then we have fish farms that pollute but create employment where no one else does and of course give money to the very charity that is meant to be protecting wild salmon ( work that one out ) and wonder why more is not done to prosecute fish farms. Incidentally no wild salmon charity has ever managed to do anything about over fishing of sandeels but the RSPB has been sucessful in getting quotes down and that should tell us just how much clout they have and why the culling of birds is a fishery board red herring that will never get anywhere . At the end of the day the decline of alantic salmon is down to us and our explotation of natural resources .

[@IanGordonsalmonfishing]

Mans impact on natural resources has a great deal to do with both the decline and upsetting a natural cycle of high and low numbers of salmon. As long as we are here this will continue. I think most people interested will know this. Finding an overall “solution” is 100% impossible for the simple fact that the “only” overall, solution is a political one and history tells us that politicians (no matter what party) have zero interest in such matters. As for salmon conservation groups, I’m afraid they are simply talking shops, none of which have done anything to reverse the decline simply because, without political support, they cannot. The only thing we can do is use research such as this in Germany www.speyonline.com/post/salmon-we-already-know-90-is-this-not-enough and the fact that the scottish government already sanction the “culling” of another iconic species, Deer. Salmon will be here when we are not, however, the business of salmon fishing needs to adapt to far fewer fish.

[@hyperionsound]

in the PNW we have huge predation by birds and seals - wish we could do the same for our salmonids

[@peterjohnston4472]

I'm 42 and feel my chance of actually catching a salmon are running out

[@rangerwhite5165]

One thing's for sure, Salmon are in trouble. I think there are big problems out at sea.

[@IanGordonsalmonfishing]

They most certainly are and there most certainly are too. My Granda fished in the Moray Firth all his days, well, apart from a west coast Herring trip when they followed the silver darlings every year. Before he died he told me, due to technology, greed and a lack of sound management, something that should have been sustainable for generations to come is being ruined and once gone, will never come back. He was speaking about the the first 3 miles of the sea because this was where he made his living. 80% of the answers to our problems with salmon lie in there. However, those supposedly looking for the answers have the same greedy trait as those who caused the problem in the first place. Everyone seems to put themselves before the actual problem.

[@rangerwhite5165]

@@IanGordonsalmonfishing I think the big problems are at sea. The post lockdown runs in 2020 were phenomenal in Ireland, with no trawlers out. Miles of nets must be scooping up migrating smolts and migrating fish. Our agencies set up to protect salmon stocks are fiddling while Rome burns.

[@SalmoScotland]

Fabulous Ian, great informative clip