IBM 5150 PC with dual MDA & CGA monitor setup

[@buckykattnj]

This brings back memories. Back around 1990, I set up my roommate's PC clone to do dual monitors. Hercules and VGA, IIRC... we had a few applications we used that took advantage of this, such as Borland's Turbo debugger... but most of the stuff we used was our own code... TSRs that would keep stats on one monitor while apps ran on the other. It used to really impress the other geeks when I'd bring up my bouncing ball program that would go across monitors.

[@galier2]

Autocad under DOS up to version 13 (the last version with MS-DOS support) was also dual screen capable. We used old Hercules text cards up to the Pentium age. A modern VGA graphics card with very high resolutions on a 20" CRT and a cheap hercules/monochrome screen for the text part. This avoided the screen switching that often had to be done on MS-DOS

[@vwestlife]

Looks like the vertical height on your 5151 monitor needs to be adjusted, as it isn't filling the screen. There is a control for adjusting it, VR402 (V-Size) on the circuit board.

[@RetroSpector78]

I know :) But after all of the other issues I had with it it was the least of my worries. But definitely on my todo-list and thanks for pointing out the location.

[@CyberhugTechnologies]

Great video and narration - A trip in the past, thumbs up.

[@RogueScholarMDC]

This is something I can't imagine ever trying to set up on my 5150, but I can imagine how it would have blown my kid mind in the 80s if I ever saw a computer using more than one screen.

[@kFY514]

9:15 My first computer was, oddly, a 386 with Hercules graphics outputting to an amber CRT. It ran DOS 6.22 and Windows 3.1. I used it around '95-'96, which was pretty painful - nearly anything remotely contemporary would require a VGA display. Still, I learned the basics of both using computers generally, and some programming (in QBasic and Turbo Pascal) on it, so I remember it fondly. I've read about this dual-monitor arrangement on early PCs before, but I've never seen it in action, so it was great seeing it here!

[@papa_dook9846]

You do an excellent job explaining things and with positioning your camera shots - please more content!

[@RetroSpector78]

Thx a lot, really appreciate the feedback. More cool content coming but it takes a lot of prep to create some of these videos ... and really busy period now. New video about to drop this weekend. Stay tuned and spread the word. Thx !

[@douro20]

Our first PC which we acquired in 1992 was a 5271, a special version of the XT which had the Extended Keyboard, a Professional Graphics Adapter with 3270 character set and the 5272 high-resolution colour display. The Professional Graphics Adapter in the 3270 PC configuration emulated a 3279 colour terminal, had full CGA support and provided a few extended text modes including a 120-column mode which a handful of programs supported. The standard DOS text mode on this adapter is similar to EGA, having a 640x480 resolution and a full 16-colour on-screen ANSI pallette.

[@billv4987]

The dual-monitor support on the early 80s PC is blowing my mind. I never knew.

[@davemcdonald2574]

Brilliant video, dual Screens back in the Early 1980s

[@DavidWonn]

0:07 Rather than drawing directly onto the keyboard keys, I used to cut up the sticky portion of post-it notes and apply those to keys whenever I wanted to do any keyboard remapping or to indicate macros that I assigned (often for mainframe / midframe terminals or via WinKey software on the PC side of things.)

[@Romanon26]

In fact, first 5150's was supplied with CGA cards not with MDA. It was assumed that customer connected normal TV to computer using RCA or antenna connector. CGA monitors was released later, in 1983.

[@RetroSpector78]

Thanks for clearing that up ! Didn’t realise I explicitly stated that MDA was default and CGA optional. My bad.

[@skierpage]

I thought IBM made the MDA and CGA cards available from the start along with the 5151 monochrome monitor. I forgot the CGA card had a composite RCA output, but few TVs had that; you had to get a third-party RF modulator to plug it into the TV's antenna input.

[@Brfff]

Thank you Sir! I just got my hands on a brand new IBM CGA card for my PC/XT and added it to the MDA - I've only got got Model 5151 monochrome display at the moment so have to use a CGA-to-VGA converter and a "boring" modern LCD. But I had read that there was a small selection of software that utilised both so, of course, wanted to try it out ... when I did a search, your video came up first ... so thanks for the demo & info! /Brett

[@Luis45ccs]

Thanks for the video, I like that I explain everything, the applications to many things to be able to work well at that time. Many people do not know that this could be done. Very interesting

[@skierpage]

Very cool. The IBM CGA card had connector pins for a light pen. I saw someone using one to create 4-color pixel art on a CGA monitor; I can't remember what PC ssoftware they used. This was a year or more before VisiOn and the Apple Lisa introduced the mouse.It seemed rocket scientist stuff to us doing 80x25 work in green on the 5151 monochrome screen.

[@lucius1976]

Maybe a nice demo with one of the Multiuser Multitask DOS of the 80ies from Digital Research would be nice.

[@JenniferinIllinois]

Ahh, 1980s computing. Who knew what would become of those new fangled devices over the years. :)

[@vulturius7664]

I think one of the reasons why it was not much used is because it costs mucho dinero ;-)

[@KoralLeidy]

this video does have a parallel port making it very popular for business

[@FishFind3000]

I saw one of these monochrome green monitors in use at an Arbys last year... the whole restaurant was stuck in the 90s... they still had carpet on the floor. I'm pretty sure all the tech and equipment in there was never upgraded since the place was built.

[@ropersonline]

@RetroSpector78: Hey, I'm noticing your (French) Guide to Operations that you have next to your 5150 says Personal Computer *XT* on it, despite the fact this isn't a 5160. My UK-bought 5150 also came with a Guide to Operations that also says Personal Computer XT, and I always thought that was a mistake or mix-up and that I should ultimately try and get the "correct" GtO for it, i.e. one that doesn't say XT. But now I'm wondering if I was wrong all along, i.e. if all the 5150s in Europe only ever came with the same GtO that the 5160 would also have come with? Is it true the 5150 was only sold in Europe from 1983 onwards, the same year the 5160 was already available too? If so, then maybe (that's why) there was just one GtO for both the PC and XT? Do you happen to know any of this? If not, do you happen to know who might know and who I could ask? Thank you!

[@vtechk]

I used to use a similar config for coding in the 90's. VGA (IDE) + Hercules monochrome (debug output)

[@gklinger]

Thanks for posting this!

[@tarstarkusz]

CGA looks fine. The pixels you see are because of the dot pitch of the monitor, which is poor. 8x8 is fine for most applications.

[@grunt31]

I remember that the mda card video performance was higher than cga video card in text mode.

[@ropersonline]

Are you referring to speed or pixels per inch?

[@grunt31]

@@ropersonline per display speed

[@ropersonline]

@@grunt31 That's interesting; I don't remember that. I understand that CGA in graphics mode is slower, but are you sure that CGA in pure text mode on original hardware is also slower than original MDA hardware?

[@grunt31]

@@ropersonline yes i'm sure, in text mode, MDA card is faster than CGA card. and faster than some ISA VGA Card (i.e oak ISA vga 256K ), i rember of that, in landmark utility test

[@pascalmariany]

Awesome video again! How about reviewing a 25MHz 286 cpu. I have one called Harris. But my motherboard only supports up to 16MHz.

[@RetroSpector78]

Have an IBM AT 5170 stock + an amd 16mhz upgrade on it that I wanna do a video on.

[@pascalmariany]

@@RetroSpector78 Awesome! If you find a mainboard that supports the Harris 25MHz cpu, let me know! :-)

[@ropersonline]

0:40: "Up to 4 colours at the same time from a 16 colour palette." Or up to 16 colours at the same time in text or 160x100 mode. Or indeed up to 1024 colours at the same time in composite mode, with hacks. Just google 8088MPH. (...) 2:25: "resolution 320x200" Or 640x200 in mono. ;-) PS: That's the most ghetto AZERTY keyboard I've ever seen. :D

[@alexandermirdzveli3200]

To be fair to the truth, Or up to 16 colors in 320(160)x200 composite mode

[@henrikgustav2294]

Can we do cga + vga?

[@intel386DX]

Very cool ,can you combinate other standards EGA VGA?

[@RetroSpector78]

These wil have overlapping memory addresses and that will be tricky. MDA and CGA have completely separate memory addresses so that’s why it works. here is a good reference on what is possible : www.seasip.info/VintagePC/dualhead.html

[@intel386DX]

@@RetroSpector78 thanks :) very interesting article :)

[@MrSoxAndShoes]

I've been experimenting with dual-monitor setups lately. Basically, MDA and Hercules share the same address space at 0xB0000 while CGA, EGA, and VGA reside at 0xB8000. This means systems can be configured to run with an MDA or Hercules carc in one ISA slot and CGA, EGA, or VGA in a second slot, switching between the two using "MODE MONO" and "MODE CO80" (as shown in the video). I've done this with an IBM 5160, generic 80286, 80386DX, 80386SX ISA boards, and a Pentium ISA/PCI motherboard. The system I'm currently working with is a 80486DX-50MHz with a Hercules ISA and Paradise VGA VLB - and it runs great!

[@ultrametric9317]

Your MDA monitor needs some tweaking to make the picture fill the screen. You can do that by adjusting a couple of potentiometers inside the case. Don't kill yourself with the 15k voltage on the tube.

[@RetroSpector78]

The fear of 15k volts is why it still needs tweaking :)

[@grunt31]

Bonjour, vous êtes français ? Je vois que vous avez des logiciels en français. Et le clavier azerty. Merci 😉

[@RetroSpector78]

Bonjour ... moi je suis flamand, mais je parle un peu de français :) Ici en Belgique il y a beaucoup de monde qui utilise le clavier azerty. Moi personellement, je suis développeur logiciels et préfère qwerty.

[@grunt31]

@@RetroSpector78 ca fait plaisir de voir vos vidéos. J'ai 42 ans et j'ai connu certains ordinateurs qui sont dans vos vidéos. J'ai très bien connu les ibm pc 😉. J'adorais surtout les ibm pc 5160 et 5170 (pc at)

[@RetroSpector78]

@@grunt31 J'ai 2 vidéos sur le 5170 qui vont arriver bientôt (j'ai 2 IBM 5170. 1 est en parfait état et l'autre est en très mauvais état :)

[@RetroSpector78]

@@grunt31 J'espère que vous allez vous abonner, aimer, partager et continuer à commenter les vidéos ... peut aussi être en anglais pour les autres téléspectateurs aussi :)

[@grunt31]

@@RetroSpector78 je me suis abonné. Je peux parler de vous sur le groupe "Retro PC" sur facebook (français) Sinon, je parle un peu anglais aussi, pour commenter vos vidéos 😉

[@toddstewart9070]

And I thought I was cool sporting 2 monitors with win98.

[@eddiehimself]

Multiple GPUs? It'll never catch on lol.