idolising ppl in politics & counterculture | patches & parley

[@evilandmaliciouswarwick]

hehe the subtitles said gnome chomsky

[@graveyardpansy]

lmao im halfway though writing the actual CC but gnome chomsky is,,, v good

[@34weaselsinatrenchcoat11]

someone draw this please lmao

[@christinam7994]

@@graveyardpansy I am

[@martinthedrainedsedlak]

@@christinam7994 did you draw it?

[@damien899]

i could listen to you talk for hours, dude. you're the only person who makes lengthy videos that i can sit through, enjoy, and learn from. have you ever thought about making a podcast?

[@chaotic_enby2625]

That’s a thing that really annoys me about the way we teach in schools: you are not allowed to critique the stuff that’s taught. And I can see that for most things we learn in school, those are facts. That’s not what I’m talking about. I’m talking about stuff like social science or art where there are often ideas taught as fact that are not fact, that are just ideas. One example would be maslows hierarchy of needs. I disagree with that thing, there are so many things that don’t make sense. Like why tf is sex listed as a basic need. Especially as an ace person I just don’t get it. But no, we were of course not allowed to critique it. The teacher showed it and presented it as fact and everyone nodded and wrote it down without even thinking for a second about it. The perfect obedient student that gets perfect grades. People who actually take a second to think about the stuff they get taught however get shit grades. Teachers love to talk about how they’re teaching us critical thinking skills, and no they’re not. They’re doing the opposite.

[@testosteronic]

Yes! Sex listed as a basic need always bothered me! Like p sure most ppl who have sex need to feel safe and secure first for a start

[@charlotteice5704]

I wouldn't say sex is a basic need either, like people can go without it, but I'd say it's in a whole other category of needs that I'd maybe call primal needs. Generally lusty and sometimes addictive stuff. Drugs would also be in the same category as both drugs and sex are things that some people will do anything to get sometimes.

[@warrenmaverickp4750]

i feel the same way about parasocial relationships as well. just like you shouldn't idolize someone too much, you also shouldn't get too attached to people you don't know personally or view them as a friend. slightly different, but can still have bad effects. i enjoy having a "friendly" voice in the background as much as anyone else, but there is a line there somewhere.

[@dumpstercub2902]

I feel this so hard. I’m a basic transgender communist bitch, and I enjoy things like Breadtube, Against Me, satirical cartoons and communism. I think it’s great that there are spaces where people can get together and enjoy these things and discuss these things (especially communism), and I love having these spaces so we can also criticize them. Stan culture kinda weaves the content we consume into our identities, and that’s concerning because criticizing media causes us to examine whether we are good people for liking it (which is cool sometimes but also A. It turns the conversation from “am I doing something good” to “am I a good person” and B. It can drive people away from criticizing things that rightfully need to be criticized). This can create people who believe they’re superior for not liking said content and martyrs who refuse to reflect on how said content can be problematic as well as, like you said, feel like the criticism is a personal attack. This is a huge issue within politics because of how much weight it holds, what it is (how to organize people), the nuance of it, and what goes into forming a political opinion. Sometimes people treat it like a fandom, instead of seeing people who write theory and make political content as participants in a discussion we see them as celebrities and us parts of the (insert political ideology here) fandom.

[@MIurbex]

touch grass

[@dumpstercub2902]

@@MIurbex why? im already smoking it with your mother

[@jackriver8385]

Sometimes I worry about anarchists I come across that seem to idolise certain anarchist/leftist philosophers. I feel like we should not just blindly follow whatever some person said, even if most of it is very good. It's important to keep thinking for ourselves!

[@achilleus9918]

Based on this video, in which I tend to agree with you, I’m curious about your thoughts on where one does (should?) draw the line when someone you look up to does something bad. You don’t need to share your personal line, obviously, I’m just thinking about it at the moment because I’ve got more into black metal than I used to be and have found that a shocking number of black metal musicians are Nazis. Like, Varg Vikernes, who was in one of the most influential black metal bands (Mayhem) started a neo Nazi organisation while in prison for murder. Almost all the popular bands - Darkthrone, Immortal, Gorgoroth, etc - have members who are far right or have done splits with known Nazi bands or have other dodgy ties. Since I was new to the scene when I found this out anyway it was easy to just stop listening to them (I hadn’t bought any albums yet for example) and stick to the explicitly left wing stuff (there’s a whole sub genre called RABM, which stands for red and anarchist black metal), but plenty of black metal fans who are roughly left wing or apolitical just don’t care, or say “I disagree with them but the music is good.” I’m not arguing for or against a position - it’s just interesting to me. I was a fan of the Smiths and still listen to them but since hearing about how weirdly right wing Morrissey has got I wouldn’t want to like wear a T-shirt or advertise that I listen to them because I don’t want to seem like I support him as a person. But then there are the shades in between - I still want Contrapoints despite her having some weird nonbinary-phobic stuff and having included Buck Angel in a video because I genuinely don’t believe she meant harm by it, but then again I’ve disagreed with her on plenty of things before that and I watch her because I’m interested in what she has to say, not because I necessarily expect to agree with it. But for some people, that was where they drew the line.

[@graveyardpansy]

definitely a related topic & smth i find hard to really pin down as well. I don’t listen to the smiths & me and most of my goth pals are in the fuck-morrissey-camp. i imagine the metal thing is pretty difficult, outside of goth most of my music taste is explicitly politically left and that’s something i sometimes take for granted. one of the easiest ‘lines’ that i draw, although it’s morbid, is whether the person is dead. like, it’s so easy for me to read Marx and not care too much abt the homophobia bc he can’t profit off that work anymore, and it’s such a small portion of his work as a whole that for me, the good outweighs the bad. I think another ‘line’ for me is that, actually - does the good work they’ve done do enough to actively counter more questionable aspects? and do those questionable things actively harm people, was it for shock value, is it smth someone has shown growth from? totally feel you that it’s complex and a rly difficult thing to sort your thoughts about, but super important !

[@aqueercommunist]

personally i assume that everyone is horrible unless they are actively proving that theyre not

[@charlotteice5704]

fellow leftist lover of black metal here, but I deal with it differently. I dislike rabm because to me, black metal and politics just don't mix. You're supposed to hate everyone (including yourself), not just certain groups of people (obviously you shouldn't really but in terms of lyrics n stuff). However, when I see something has nazi lyrics, I'm just too disgusted to enjoy it at all. But whether the art itself reflects the despicable positions of its creator or not is where I draw the line between it being ok to enjoy it and it not being ok to enjoy (and also whether it's nsbm or not). Burzum music for example (solo project of Varg Vikernes for those unaware) does not contain any nazi ideas in the lyrics and honestly I just find the music to be really, really enjoyable, so I listen to it. Although I would like to wear a Burzum shirt because the logo on shirts just looks damn good and I like the music, I'm not going to (even if it was a bootleg and I wouldn't be supporting Varg by buying it) because I would then promote Burzum to people without them knowing about the nazi stuff, so they would potentially watch Varg's political videos uncritically and be pulled into nazi ideology.

[@markcangila1613]

"Jifs"? Sinful. Hard g

[@gothetikpunk8508]

Im so glad i found your youtube channel

[@mossypunk4039]

Just random and not related but i think the only thing i dont like abut you and that makes me sceptical of you is that you leave your door open(edit: there you go ash here is your critic) Also your shirt and makeup is 😚👌 ( shef kiss)

[@graveyardpansy]

fhdjdb does it make it better that it’s my closet door ? and thank u 💜

[@mossypunk4039]

I mean a bit yeah but it still dont sit right with me like were you born in a barn, shut the door behind you 😂

[@graveyardpansy]

liam Moss lmao that’s very valid im so sorry,, truth is that door wasn’t properly put in the frame and it can’t close all the way unless you put like all your body weight into it

[@Sunny-gy3jv]

Haven't you people ever heard of closing the goddamn door

[@34weaselsinatrenchcoat11]

@@Sunny-gy3jv nO

[@praalgraf]

oof yea this has been something that's been on my mind lately. i definitely have people i look up to, both irl and ppl like angela davis, but it is an effort to not make that lean toward putting ppl on a pedestal /supporting someone uncritically. my general 'system' is to seperate the good things theyve contributed to movements (such as davis and prison abolition) and them as people. prison abilition doesn't end or start with her edit: also definitely celebs are. not it. like marx is ykno an important figure but no way that harry styles or something would influence my opinion on politics

[@_galaxydrifter_]

Enjoying a cup of cannabis tea while I watch this. Its been raining and been fending off a migraine. I feel this particularly after a popular trans content creator was exposed as an abuser. Im not naming any names because I dont want to turn any unnecessary or possible toxic attention to the survivor or abuser. I looked to them for educational content for my folks, and now Im much more cautious of who I look to for educational content.

[@graveyardpansy]

hope you’re feeling alright, and enjoy your tea!! 💖

[@_galaxydrifter_]

Ashton Daniel Thank you! Its going well, Im in the postdrome phase, so the height of the pain has passed. Have a racial justice workshop in 15mins. I hope you are having a good day.

[@adamdawson6700]

I agree with the vast majority of this vid but I will say the way leftists critique Black female theorists seems kinda like misogynoir. The points made are often fair but then they get way overblown and used to dismiss their WHOLE career rather than just the bad take in a way I have never seen with white male theorists

[@jermarule34]

Woah I just found your channel like an hour ago. And now I'm early for an upload. Sweet

[@graveyardpansy]

welcome to the club >:)

[@kellyofearth2092]

Hey, I was wondering if you are studying in this direction. As someone on the autism spectrum, studying "vague" courses like history or politics has always been challenging. Because there is so much information I guess it's difficult to decide what's relevant, how to organize it in my mind etc. If you'd like to talk about that some time, that would be cool. :) With the autistic people I've met, it seems like they're oftentimes really interested in and good at these disciplines, so I'd be interested to hear more about how you go about your studies.

[@AurelUrban]

the 5 o'clock shadow makeup looks AWESOME, also I find myself agreeing with basically everything I've heard you say so far and I'm loving it.

[@claywaffles7073]

i like sewing homemade patches with you during patches n parley

[@finch4309]

on tumblr im part of both bandom spaces and other fandoms and its crazy how different groups act. like in bandom “ls dunes using ai for their music video was shitty” is a generally accepted critique. yeah i still love frank. yeah he did something i dont agree with. we can all move on. compared to some other fandoms (especially with youtubers/social media people), people take any critique of their idols as a call to never have anything to do with that person again, as well as a personal attack on them for still watching that content

[@soy4138]

Thank you for saying this! On a completely unrelated note I'd love for you to read on caste and the trans community in India. If you're interested I'd love to give you some book reccs.

[@spaceheroes2]

Thanks so much for this video! I think this topic is super important and not idolizing people (or even pieces of media) is definitely something I need to work on.

[@cypher7582]

i actually subconsciously idolized jesse paige because she helped me find my identity when i was younger but your video on them made me realized that and i stopped so thanks lol. :)

[@cassj.nes1]

It's also really good practice in your personal life not to put people on pedestals--I've been in relationships where it was hard to accept someone I loved and respected had done something to hurt me, so I must have been the problem. Which is obviously a very dangerous mindset and really hard to break from. It also goes hand in hand with the idea that we should question all authority I think. Basically exactly what you said--no one anywhere is perfect

[@stephantyrone8678]

I feel like its a bit weird to say this but i do kinda look up to you as in how vocal about who you are and what your opinions are inspire me a lot, especially since i feel like we are similar. Tho, as you said, i still keep in mind that anyone can be wrong and anyone can f*ck up. I feel like its extremely unrealistic and even dehumanizing to think someone can do no wrong. I guess im a bit different in how i approach it tho. As in, i have quite the standards when it comes to people i look up to so when they fuck up, i expect them to fix their problems and all. Simply because i look up to to people who are aware of issues and such and if they wouldnt own up and fix their stuff i'd be like "ok uhm boycott time until they fix this?" Kinda thing. So i guess i approach it in a very positive way as in i'll expect them to be great but if they don't then i don't bother anymore.

[@13gudadod]

This came in such good time like no cap my favorite singer Taylor momsen from the band the pretty reckless stole an idea from a dedicated fan:(and they're being accused of copying a song

[@RR-fo2ld]

I definitely agree with everything you said in this video. The one issue personally being that I find it INCREDIBLY difficult to not put Dave Vanian on a godly pedestal above everyone else... I think if he were to do something that I was morally opposed to I'd be crushed and stop feeling this way but still... Which is stupid of me because I think one of the good things about punk is that there isn't a large barrier between fans and bands.

[@vermilion328]

i only found your account last month and ive watched all your videos and i love them im so glad i found your account ^^ thank you hdehusdfjnwk

[@Alex-pn2hn]

When Mikey cheated on his wife, fans definitely did not stan that. People held him accountable for sure

[@13gudadod]

People say the same about che Guevara Edit: I said that about supporting problemic people who had valid views/believes

[@badreanna]

A note about the Biden thing- I hate this dude, I hate the democrats, I lost faith in our electoral system long ago and I understand why people are going to sit this one out but a reason I cannot sit out any election is because I believe in harm reduction. I think a lot of people have woken up to the reality of this country and I hope they wont be lulled back to sleep if Biden is elected. I personally don't think ppl will. I also strongly believe that democrats are cowards who fold. I'd rather fight Democrats than open fascists. Please people, vote. If you cannot bring yourself to vote Biden please for the love of god vote on your local bills! Poor turn out really hurts lots of good bills that do reduce harm to your direct community.

[@graveyardpansy]

totally understand where you’re coming from, but here’s a few different and v important perspectives on it!! twitter.com/kmlytong/status/1283107877666750464?s=21

[@badreanna]

@@graveyardpansy I agree that the system is screwed and not good but seriously we cannot have 4 more years of trump. He's going out of his way to make literally everything worse. I agree with the thread you've posted. The whole system is entirely corrupt and doesn't serve the people and shouldn't be in place at all but that is not going to change under trump. Harm reduction is very nuanced. I'm not saying voting is absolutely harm reduction but it is to a degree and the only way we're going to change anything is through people hitting the streets and saying enough is enough. While voting is a tactic at our disposal I personally will continue to use it. Democrats are weak and they fold. I'd rather fight the system against them. Either way regardless of if people vote or not the same system is in place. I support a diversity of tactics. No ome tactic will succeed on its own. It isn't turning your back on indigenous peoples to use whatever tools are at your disposal. We can do multiple things.

[@pyttpytts2690]

@@badreanna You should prob see this video, because it might actual help your point of view kzbin.info/www/bejne/aKaVlIx3aZ1_mNk

[@emosterjpeg5000]

what you said about marx reminds me of a phrase i heard in jewish seminary along the lines of peeling an orange and throwing away the peel before you eat it also took me 16 minutes to notice you got a necklace of teeth! yeeeeeeee

[@letsnot27]

yay i’m here early, can’t wait to watch!!!

[@griffinnguyen945]

HELL YEAH DPD

[@narc3angel]

I thought you meant the personality disorder and I got so confused lol

[@alexonline2340]

im cancelling you for pronouncing gif like "jif"

[@kirbyjuice2033]

*Unrelated to this video* idk if you need it but here's a video suggestion (commenting here bc this is one of your latest more political videos): *gun control and leftism!* I've heard alot of people say that you cant be leftist and support any kind of gun control and I wanna see your thoughts on this!

[@dabelli3818]

I've yet to watch the video.but it was in my recommend for quite some time. By the title (and the "cover" whatever it's called, of the video) I understand that it's against idolizing ppl and shit in general. I 100% agree. You know who also agreed to this? Mr Stalin himself ahah Now that I got all of you angry, well I feel satisfied and I'm going to sleep or whatever I guess. WORKERS OF THE WORLD UNITE

[@34weaselsinatrenchcoat11]

>:0 u pronounce gif wrong smh my head

[@La_Princes_music]

I admire your courage but how did you do it. Did you always have short hair. I mean I have curly hair and it's harder, aspecialy for my mom. 😑😕

[@hunkenbunken7578]

hey about critiquing you: can i dm you on discord about some issues i have w something on your discord server? or should i dm a mod for that?

[@markcangila1613]

"Coffee"? Also sinful

[@dumpstercub2902]

Teeth necklace

[@theadolescentfoxteen6063]

Agreed

[@hellmind1304]

I think what I mostly "dislike" about your content is that you are unlikely to draw real-life political international events (conflicts, wars, truces, decisions made by various countries in that or another situation etc.), which makes it pretty hard for me to see where exactly you stand on many controversial issues; although I do understand that your channel is leaning towards more social issues, most of which are connected to the politics of US. Maybe it's just my international relations major showing, but I would like to see more of political IR stuff on your channel (of course, only if you would like it yourself) through the lense of your opinion. Because in this video your briefly mentioned the Palestinian case and I would like to hear your opinions on that and anything else you choose to see your thoughts and ideas. Thanks!

[@finnkahrs]

do you like AOC and would you vote for her

[@MrSandwichk]

there's something in your nose