In Depth One Month Review of the WINWING Orion Hotas F/A-18c

[@aetlaa]

To be clear, that paddle switch on the stick exists under the stick in the real F/A-18C. It is used as an Undesignation switch, as well as a G-Limiter override to allow higher G limits in an emergency.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Thanks for clarifying! Although I doubt it's exactly like the real thing.

[@aetlaa]

@@silverback-gjr2805 It is indeed not like the real thing. In the real aircraft, the HOTAS is installed on a console between the legs, this paddle switch (Much longer in the real aircraft) is attached to a protrusion on that console, and the movable “stick” is separated from it. In aircraft other than the F/A-18, this paddle switch (or equivalent) is used for other functions or disincluded entirely, the MiG-21 is a great example of a different use of a similar paddle switch, where it is used to engage the brakes and steering pneumatics. Some aircraft even have a full axis paddle, used most often for braking, but sometimes for other means. In DCS, that paddle switch can allow you to pull harder in dogfights or CFIT scenarios, so that you forego personal comfort in favor of survival of body and aircraft. The usage of a button in the throttle is most likely because most switches of the like (not just in flight sticks) have a button underneath them, as it’s a very durable and reliable translation of movement, as well as giving a tactile click.

[@ascherlafayette8572]

@@aetlaa The Paddle switch moves with the stick in the real aircraft as it isn't attached to the base, and undesignation is done with the nws button

[@aetlaa]

@@ascherlafayette8572 Correct! I see I made a slip-up originally on the undesignate.

[@hilok]

thanks a lot for this differentiated review, also pointing out negatives -we need more of these!

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Thankyou! I feel like alot of DCS related review videos have sponsorship behind them and therefore make it difficult to make any sort of decision. Im doing this purely to show the product and how it performs as its only fair when asking someone to pay alot of money for these types of products. Much appreciated feedback thanks again👍🏼

[@shubham6288]

My thoughts exactly!

[@BlueSky_fur]

What i noticed is most people go from Starter gear like a cheap thrustmaster, straight to virpil or winwing, and then of course won't look for negatives all that much. :p

[@billmcnally6392]

Outstanding review. Thank you. I had no intention of watching a 30+ minute review, but your concise breakdown had me transfixed the whole time. I feel a lot better about my purchase now.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Glad you enjoyed it mate! Thanks for the great feedback 👍🏼

[@cellokid5104]

If you think about it watching reviews post-purchase is really weird, but personally I do it all the time as well

[@BjornTheDim]

Thank you for this review. I've been considering getting a dedicated throttle for a while, and I've found that far too many reviewers just uncritically say "It's great, it's wonderful, I have no complaints." Pointing out that there are multiple buttons with poor placement or poor construction gives me a much better idea of what to expect... and I suspect that I might end up purchasing this product anyway. I'd like something a bit more realistic and higher-quality than the TWCS (I've read that many people modify it because of a very common flaw in the throttle axis), yet I'm a bit hesitant to put a rather large amount of money on the Virpil. And who the heck knows when/if the VKB throttle will ever be released.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Benefits outway the faults in my opinion. Virpil soultions require a much larger investment. Glad you enjoyed the review!

[@ceruleanskies1414]

I would suggest considering the Thrustmaster Warthog throttle with the DeltaSim mod to replace the ministick. It's a good price and they are durable. Many people have been using their Warthog throttles over 10 yrs without problems.

[@bradADMaxe]

I would add that if I had it to do all over I wouldn’t have given my brother the Winwing Orion but kept it instead. I bought the VIRPIL constellation alpha and the throttle CM3. I am not impressed and believe I like the Orion better. Just saying….

[@bretttrommler756]

I've had mine for about four days now. Here's what I don't like: - I don't like the feel of the second stage of the joystick trigger on my F-16EX grip. Instead of feeling/hearing the click of a switch like the first stage, it's more of a cam/spring feel, if that makes any sense. Is the FA-18 stick the same way? - The hat switches on the FA-18 throttle handles feel much stiffer than the ones on the F-16 stick. Possibly just a personal preference but I like the slightly lighter feel of the ones on the stick. - Some of the switches on the throttle base are not very ergonomic, especially when flying in VR. I find it somewhat awkward to have to physically reach around the throttle handles to get to the landing gear and flap switches. It also feels to me like the arrangement of the switches and knobs on the throttle base is somewhat haphazard, like... there's three rotary knobs and we need a fourth so will stick it over here amongst these switches. - This one is definitely personal preference. I wish the switch labeling was a bit more generic instead of it being mostly aimed specifically at F-16/FA-18 cockpit duplication. Like everyone else, I fly the DCS Hornet and Viper quite frequently. But I also fly the P-51, the L-39 and many other DCS planes and helicopters as well as Star Citizen, Elite Dangerous, X-4 foundations, MSFS and two versions of P3D. Like I said, mostly personal preference. Now, here's what I do like: - Everything else. The amount of buttons and switches, the nice metallic feel of the grip and handles, the feel of the joystick. So far I am extremely happy with my purchase. I came over to the Orion 2 system from a Logitech X-56 HOTAS. Now, for what I paid for the X-56, I was kind of okay with it... for the most part. But there were two huge issues that were eventually deal breakers. First, the slop in the joystick was unacceptable. But, me being a fairly creative and handy kinda guy, I could have manufactured and installed a piece that would have eliminated the slop and I would have done that if not for the second issue, the ghost inputs. I researched and asked and Googled and tried every supposed solution I could find but nothing prevented the ghost inputs. So I busted my piggy bank and sprung for the Orion 2 system, which happened to be on sale. I cannot get over how that joystick feels when flying! I recently retired from a career as an aviation maintenance tech specializing in avionics both military and civilian for most of the last four decades. I worked almost exclusively on L-39s for the last 16 years and got to fly in them many, many times including a fair amount of stick time. Even though the Orion 2 stick is not FFB like my old G940 (which I still use on occasion), it still felt amazing and so realistic. I will be installing the rumble motor module soon so that might even get it closer. Anyway, I digress. Despite my nitpicking issues with this system, I would give it probably a 9.5 out of 10.

[@Captain_Coleslaw]

I got myself the Orion 2 with the F18 throttle, and the F-16EX stick. This combo seems to fix ALL the gripes you have with the OG setup. Minus the numbering of the buttons

[@algroyp3r]

Just picked up the Orion 2, and pleased to report most of the issues have been fixed, at least partially.

[@lambdacalculus8316]

After using Orion throttle and warthog throttle simultaneously for over two months, I feel more comfortable with the Orion throttle because it makes the carrier landing much more effortless.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

It's great for carrier landings. Especially when you lower the resistance

[@gameexplosion836]

mine comes in a few days i’m super excited to use this thing.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

I bet! It's a great upgrade man you won't be disappointed

[@christophermcsherry2655]

I put in my pre-order for this set up not to ling ago. Now to try & be patient. Thanks for this review.

[@michaelwmcdonald]

Great review, I so appreciate actual users who bought the equipment for review. There are so many tainted reviews on YT, the kind that have the nerve to say they got it free from the manufacturer but were not compensated for the review. Yes they were, these products cost hundreds if not thousands of dollars - you bet they were compensated. And they will only give great reviews because they want the next set of equipment "FREE" too. Try telling the tax collector you were not paid.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Thanks for the feedback mate spot on 👌

[@rwhunt99]

Nice review, I agree with you and I'm in the market for a new throttle, while it's been two years, Winwing must have been listening and has made many improvements on their equipment. I do have an F-16ex stick and it's amazing and I love it, which is why I am seriously considering getting the Winwing throttle over the Virpil one.

[@isaacwest]

0:50 bro gets hit with an earthquake but keeps the review going. that's dedication.

[@stevenmackey582]

I’m shocked by these flaws for this price point. Thank you for this review.

[@gromm93]

So, I showed up here to see the in depth review for the hardware, but at the end there was this bit about doing your startup with no mouse. Well hell, colour me impressed. It hadn't occurred to me to bind joystick buttons to mouse clicks like that. I'd always been using my Oculus controller to manipulate switches in game. Switching back and forth is a pain! Mind you, I'm also not that deep into DCS yet either, but you know, a few trial runs!

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Pleased I could help!

[@diverspudph]

That no keyboard start up was awesome! Picked up a couple ideas there. I wish there was some narrative around it (how and why), but all good, still helpful!

[@silverback-gjr2805]

How: Its just a simple hornet start there are loads of tutorials online and some really detailed knee boards and why: my seat is set quite far back from my pc so that i can extend my legs for the rudder pedels, this means I'm about arms length from my keyboard and it's a bit of a pain to use it primarily.

[@diverspudph]

@@silverback-gjr2805 Thanks for the tip!

[@mrcpu9999]

I really enjoyed this. I've been staring at the winwing kit for a wihle, but I appreciate your honest review. Now you need to get back to making videos. :)

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Thanks mate! I appreciate the nice feedback. I haven't uploaded in a while, I know. Takes up alot of time. Hoping to get back into it soon.👌🏼 What content would you like to see?

[@mrcpu9999]

@@silverback-gjr2805 I think more of your VR setup, setup and config of the winwing? Some of that stuff looks pretty daunting, let alone the complexity of the stick/throttle itself. Maybe more on why some of the choices you made for settings/configs and how they help you in DCS or whatever sim you're using. There's 8-10 vids right there... :)

[@zbyskie]

20:00 That's not how DirectInput operates, and what you said is impossible. It's an Discord issue, they should look for the correct PID (Product ID) associeated with that button press, just like any other app/game does.

[@strong_gaming]

Thanks for the review mine shipped yesterday cant wait

[@winslowleach1835]

Thank you. Great! Can’t wait for mine. It’s like I’m getting an F18.

[@nelsonh.9651]

I think for the newer version of the throttle, the AA and AG buttons got reworked, that issue seems to be solved

[@angryace4017]

I just got mine yesterday and I am already annoyed at the suction cups on the stick side. You could mount the hotas straight to the table with screws but would be a pain if you need to move it a lot or add some Velcro strips to help hold it place. I might go the mount route myself, the Monstertech mounts look interesting but are pretty expensive for what they are. I also noticed the wire and AG button issue but was able to train the wire to go the other direction so its not an issue for me currently. Over all, I'm happy with the purchase.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Sorry to hear that mate, ultimately If you have a desk with a smooth surface it's gonna stick better. So really you want glass but not everyone has that. Considering it's an on desk mount I think it performs pretty well. After using for a while mate you'll learn to put some down pressure on the stick 👍🏼

[@Noxbellator]

Just got mine yesterday. Yeah those suction cups are garbage. Gonna try the velcro. If that doesn't work guess I'll pony up for some mounts.

[@angryace4017]

@@Noxbellator I ended up buying mounts. Work much better and make for a comfortable flighting experience

[@zeroomicron4821]

desk mounts are a must. worth the money, having the stick and throttle on my desk really hurt my shoulder after a while. The mounts soled all of that and I will never go back to not using them.

[@thecolter]

Monstertech table mounts make an amazing difference in the ergonomics when using them to mount the stick in the center position. I was not a fan of the stick on the table for the short time I used it in that setup. The F/A-18 stick wasn't designed to mount high and to the side. Joytokey works well for solving the button press conflict with Discord by using it to map the button to a key press.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Considering its not designed for side mounting I think it performs pretty well. Looking into different mounting options but I reviewed the out of the box design.

[@krostouin]

The F-16 stick is coming, and it is compatible with the Orion base :)

[@silverback-gjr2805]

@@krostouin sure is buddy. Check out some of the footage 👌

[@AdrianFourie]

Nice video. I have the same issue with Discord and the buttons but I think the problem is with Discord. Windows can only register 32 buttons per game controller (Direct X issues). Discord for some reason sees for example all the different controllers button 11 as the same button. And that is causing the mute issue as per my understanding. Problem: Discord. But still a great video. Tx for that.

[@AdrianFourie]

How did you use JoytoKey to solve the problem with Discord Justin?

[@CampbellyTube]

Great honest review. Good job! I just ordered one, so hopefully you’re still enjoying it :)

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Thanks mate! Glad you enjoyed. You won't be disappointed 👍🏼

[@Nevermind_Im_Lost]

I understand the stick can be desk mounted, but I'm pretty confident they intend it to be used with their mounts or whatever other mounts. Don't forget it's an F-18 replica and the F-18 stick is between your legs, so the hand rest is something I don't really see as an issue Great video though, pretty in depth and the negatives definitely seem minor enough to justify the price point

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Oh I agree completely, I mentioned it to cover all areas and uses. Check out my newest video and you can see how I've mounted it between my legs. Glas you enjoyed the video 👌

[@TaffenFelspar]

Great points... I hope the engineers at WINWING takes note.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

I hope so! Overall though, great hotas.

[@acebubbles5023]

mine was great for about a year then the female end on the throttle ended up getting shoved into the quadrant. took it apart to fix and discovered the pretty abysmal build quality. The stick still works great tho

[@SmoocheeWallace]

Great review, just went ahead and picked one up myself! Upgrading from a t16000m setup, I cant wait!

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Thanks mate! Glad it helped you decide

[@NatendoSwitch]

Awesome review. Subscribed. Hope to see you in the VR skies, someday.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Thank you 🙏 Sounds good!

[@philhealey2520]

Perfect timing I will be buying one of these at the end of the month. It sounds like it's going to be a huge upgrade from my ch fighterstick Pro and thrustmaster twcs. Awesome review thanks

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Appreciate the feedback pal 👍🏼 glad you enjoyed

[@dalebachman2892]

I got the Orion to replace my TM 16000n TWCS. No regrets except maybe I should have gotten the Super Taurus and Libra instead... It has worked that well!

[@Try_n_2Tri]

@@dalebachman2892 I'm in that process now... why would you want the upgrade model?

[@Keks1976]

I‘ve bought the F18 Thrustmaster stick and I‘ve never used it , becsuse agaiinst the F16 stick, it‘s so uncomfortable - at least for me. The F16 stick is perfect, maybe you need a big hand for the F18 stick. So please consider this also here.

[@thepacketnarc7634]

Most of the negatives can be solved by placing the stick in the proper position for flight sims. Between your legs, like on the actual aircraft. These are designed to ‘sim’ulate reality not for ergonomics or comfort

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Winnwing has sent me a new comms switch which is now working absolutely fine! Excellent customer service...

[@davidwhite2544]

all the negative and the positive. just bought it tonight. can't wait to use them.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Ayee, glad I could help in your choice mate.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Starting from 1st of June: New price of ORION will be 549.99 USD.

[@EbonySeraphim]

I think the F/A-18 stick is unfortunate on Winwing's stick base panel (or lack thereof). Honestly, Thrustmaster's approach is overall better here. It may be awkward placing it on your desk because your keyboard and mousepad will have to overlap it a bit, but the benefit is that you *should place* The TM Warthog stick base panel on a normal desk chair, then sit on top of it (straddle the joystick, legs are fully on top pinning down the flat base on the sides). You operate the joystick as if it is sticking out the front of your chair and that is damn good placement. That has been how I've used it all this time and I don't know how this isn't how every KZbinr without a sim pit chair is doing it. When I get my Winwing F-16EX stick, I plan putting it on one of my Warthog base panels. Also, the paddle switch on the F/A-18 should be used in flight. It unlocks the G-limiter in flight so if you want the F/A-18 to make a really tight turn beyond 7.5Gs, you have to do it while holding that switch. Perhaps if you avoid dogfights then it is fairly unused. Also, currently the Thrustmaster F/A-18 grip is only $10 more on Amazon than Winwings F/A-18 grip. And Thrustmaster's actually has an extra switch+button on the face which is a good mapping for VR zoom, or radar elevation control (which is missing from the TM Warthog base).

[@hellz-vip8055]

Good review sir, will take everything you have said in to account when i come to upgrade from my Saitek X52 Pro

[@ceruleanskies1414]

What do you think of the gimbal? How would you compare it to something like the Warthog, VKP or Virpil, if you've ever tried them?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

I haven't tried the others but it works great still 👍🏼

[@ceruleanskies1414]

@@silverback-gjr2805 Thanks for the insight.

[@michaelwmcdonald]

Which do you think should be first, a good HOTAS or VR? I need a GPU for VR so the cost going that way would be even more. I have a Delanclip tracker on the way already, but use T.Flight Hotas One now and that cable between them and having them on the desk is super annoying.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Ahh it's a tricky one. I was in the same situation. I got vr first because it enables you to actually get the best situational awareness and therefore improve your in game skills. (plus the winwing wasn't out yet and I didn't want to shed out for the other makes) A better hotas just makes your life easier and your flying more efficient. Personally I'd get vr first because you can buy a new hotas but won't be able to use it to its full potential if you think you'll benefit from vr use. On the other hand many players out there only use 2d screens and they'll disagree with that statement as they get along just fine. Vr you can also use for other games so I'd say for yourself it's a better investment but you need alot of gpu power. I run a 1660s on a pretty decent system and it still struggles sometimes. My next upgrade will deffo be to a 3080ti or similar.

[@michaelwmcdonald]

@@silverback-gjr2805 thank you, I'm also running a 1660s on a I9 10900k and 64Gb ram. So that 1660s is handling VR? That's encouraging, maybe VR first then. I do gotta get a better HOTAS, but maybe something lower in cost.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Yeah your system is better than mine. I run 1660s on i5 9600k with 32gb of ram. (I use rift s which is less power hungry than other headsets) Fast ssd also helps massively. I have my m.2 drive only for dcs. I get good and smooth graphics most of the time with 1.3 pd. Took months of settings tweeking though and leaning out windows settings. Fast wired Internet also helps alot with multilayer. I'd also not be tight with a hotas. Spend the little extra and gain the massive performance benefits. Mid range hotas like the saitek just don't compare with replica type systems.

[@RS-gn4bv]

thanks for this. Much appreciated. Would you be able to share your mapping profiles, if possible? I'm essentially going to have the exact same setup(with VR) as soon as this is delivered.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Sure thing, message me on discord I'll send it over 👍🏼

[@VideoGameParties]

I am also setting up my Orion for VR. Would you be able to share your profiles?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Of course, message me on discord and I'll send them over 👌

[@bradADMaxe]

Wondering if someone could provide some help. While using the WinWing Orion, the stick, while using the F-18 it pulls hard to the right with zero input. Even kicks off the Auto pilot. If anyone has any constructive ideas I would be very appreciative.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Make sure your trim is set properly, uneven wing loads can initiate banks ie after releasing ordinance etc. If its not an aircraft issue reset your input profiles and redo the axis assigns. Also check simapp Pro to see if it's regestering the the right movement on the x axis. If it is, its potentially a software/hardware issue. Try reinstalling/updating simapp Pro and your hardware. If it doesn't register the right bank on the x axis its definitely a dcs/in game related issue.

[@nighpaw4651]

Okay so virpil sticks are compatible with the warthog base, you can get something to make this compatible too, that means if I get this I could use it on my virpil base, correct?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Unless there is anything official from winwing I really couldn't guess. Triple check before you buy!

[@liquid_shadow8690]

Time for an upgrade to orion 2?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

I have thought about it! But I don't really need it and definitely don't have the funds for it hahah. Would much rather spend the money on a new GPU at this time.

[@rja12]

Bought mine last night when they came back in stock for $399. 16 hours later they were sold out again. This morning I already had a FedEx tracking number and the package is on the move.

[@doifeellucky]

Have you got it yet?

[@rja12]

@@doifeellucky Sorry, I didn't see this until now. Yes, it arrived about 10 days after ordering.

[@doifeellucky]

@@rja12 Are you happy with it?

[@FdxDad50]

Great vid - I just don’t get how to use sim app pro… The default speed brake button works opposite, I have no idea how to fix it…

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Thank you! You'll be able to invert the speed brake axis in dcs controls. Go to axis assign and choose the axis and then click on axis tune. In tune there will be an option to invert the axis.

[@antonkrutyakov7825]

Have you had any luck with mounting it? How does it feel without an extension and do you plan on getting an extension at any point?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Hi mate, no trouble at all. You just have to apply a little down pressure when performing hard maneuvers otherwise it's absolutely fine. Possibly, if I ever mount it between my legs, it's likely I'll buy the extension.

[@dblgonzo]

My cables are twisted so the loop is formed at full AB. Easy to fix just rotate the cables. My 4 way switch on the throttle has 4 solid clicks. Contact WinWing and they will send you a replacement. Man if you do not tighten the joystick handle so it does not twist you are going to have trouble soon. The wire will break or come loose internally.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Thanks for the feedback matey. I shall

[@captandrewebb4472]

hey i have my winwing orion and my throttle works but when i go in to sim app pro and try to update my firmware for the winwing orion joystick base it will not work what should i do?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Make sure you're running up to date windows and drivers. Uninstall the USB driver in device manager and restart your pc. Try the firmware update then... Also try different USB port and or swapping the cables over to see if it still is causing you issues. Reinstall simapp and if none of that works contact winwing, their customer service is ace.

[@jimmehjiimmeehh9748]

The way that the joystick and throttle both fire off the same inputs, even if DCS can account for it, is kind of silly. Is there really no way to fix this, such as changing the button assignments in the joystick configuration software?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

I think some people have commented solutions. It's annoying in some cases but only really when I use that specific button which is the sparrow select in the hornet, which I use very rarely anyway.

[@ericandi]

I have the Thrustmaster Warthog throttle and flight stick with the A-10/F-16 stick. I’m trying to decide whether to try the Virbil throttle and flight stick or the WinWing throttle and flight stick and if I like them better than the Warthogs, I can sell what I currently have. I figure by the time I spent $80 to replace the slew and $89 to add a radar wheel on the Warthog throttle, I might as well upgrade to the Virbil or WinWing, if it is an upgrade. I feel like Virbil is the best overall.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Depends on which aircraft you use most. If you fly the hornet I'd recommend the winwing!

[@gerryabbott]

Thanks for the video, Don't remember you saying what hotas you had come from before winwing? (perhaps i missed it)

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Thrustmaster tflight

[@scottc791]

I notice you talk about the switch numbering issue with discord. Does SRS have the same issue? Or does it recognise the different devices as such?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Works fine with srs 👍🏼

[@01rockape]

@silverback.. which vr headset do you use???

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Oculus Rift S (probably considered old tech now)

[@boggy8557]

"Somatimes maybe good, somatimes maybe shit!!!" Hahaha, man that cracked me up! Good review thanks. How is the idle cutoff detent now?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Completely manageable now I'm used to it!

[@vaidexxhalladay7067]

If your using a glass desk that suction is not popping off..

[@sliceheartshot4341]

i plan on using VR also. do you find that you use zoom often in VR? aslo, what button do you have your zoom mapped to?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

I never use zoom in vr (you don't need it because you can lean forward) and don't have it mapped in dcs. However, oculus has a pre mapped a button on one of the controllers.

[@justinspirational]

Which button do you use for the equivalent of left and right mouse clicks and mouse wheel movements when looking around in vr? Thanks

[@silverback-gjr2805]

The little button at the bottom of the stick, left and right is mouse clicks, up and down is atflir zoom in and out. I don't have a scroll mapped 👍🏼

[@justinspirational]

@@silverback-gjr2805 thanks

[@Scaladan]

Hi ! I’m not sure to understand… Mouse X-Y is with the 8 directions small black switch ? Where is the « little button at the bottom of the stick » for the clicks and atflir ?

[@deadshot4245]

I’d use personally the two axis to the side for radar elevation on A4 and not sure on a3

[@deadshot4245]

I retract my statement didn’t see the elevation on throttle lol 😂

[@jervischongyeechian4337]

i it your fans i come from malaysia

[@MasterMojo85]

How does the throttle work with other games, especially space sims like Star Citizen or Elite Dangerous?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Can't help you there mate, I don't play those games.

[@chriszack4777]

Is there still a software issue where it recognizes the same numbered buttons on both throttle and stick when bound to another program like Discord and SRS?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Yes, I haven't sorted it yet tbh. One commenter offered a solution which I need to follow.

[@bomkata]

For this i would say get desk mounts i got some and it is 100x better and center mounting it is better over that.

[@Cash_McCoy]

Does the radar elevation axis have a center detent?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Yes

[@EliasSchanz06]

Hey, any chance you know if this is compatible with the super libra mount? I’m looking to put my stick on an extension and mount it for < $150usd incl. shipping. Thanks a lot

[@silverback-gjr2805]

I'm not sure mate, I'd contact winwing and ask them. 👍🏼

[@Maartssssss]

How do you manage to click in the cockpit just by looking and pressing the stick button? I can't seem to see any options for it

[@silverback-gjr2805]

You need to select your aircraft and then go into the UI options. There you'll see left click and right click 👍🏼

[@Maartssssss]

@@silverback-gjr2805 thanks mate, appreciate it! Great video. Can't wait for mine to come

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Much appreciated dude 👍🏼

[@Maartssssss]

@@silverback-gjr2805 Hi dude, just taking a look at the settings now, can't seem to activate the blue crosshair that you seem to have permanenlty on screen? Any ideas? Cheers

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Hi mate. Pretty sure it's in the VR settings page. I'll double check when I'm next on.

[@AdrianFourie]

Nice video. I have the same issue with Discord and the buttons but I think the problem is with Discord. Windows can only register 32 buttons per game controller (Direct X issues). Discord for some reason sees for example all the different controllers button 11 as the same button. And that is causing the mute issue as per my understanding. Problem: Discord. But still a great video. Tx for that.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Thanks for the feedback! Yeah I appreciate its not necessarily a problem related to the HOTAS.

[@awjvdheide]

@@silverback-gjr2805 this has to do with the button registration in windows. All devices are eqaul for windows. So all have numbers as button assignments. So my thustmaster mfd’s and warthog throttle have a button 21 that is assigned to discord because discord reads button 21 on any device. Discord needs to assign device numbers to the push to talk button. SRS works this way.

[@xuhaoping4360]

Agree many software don't use direct input, one work around is using joystick gerlmin to map the button to a key marco.

[@shaggzzbdo4214]

is there a better recommended setup at this price point?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Not for a replica

[@shaggzzbdo4214]

@@silverback-gjr2805 how does this compare to the x56 rhino setup? Im looking at my first setup

[@silverback-gjr2805]

X56 considered medium setup whereas orion higher end... Remember it's a replica so it's going to be more accurate to the hornet than a standard hotas system. I believe the x56 is not a full metal construction and that the ergonomics are not as good as replicas. For starting up I'd have a look at VKB as well I've heard alot of good things...

[@MrTailspinstu]

I have 1 problem with the new Orion Hotas while the stick seems to work fine the throttle only takes the assignment of the thrust or is it the "r" slider the rest of the buttons and sliders it refuses to accept, including the china hat on the stick and the TDC on the throttle Im very non- tech and all the buttons and sliders seem to work fine in the software and il2 menues such as plane controls and engine controls,pilot head control etc. ,why do the NOT work in the cockpit,am I the problem or is the H

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Message me on discord and I'll give you a hand. Have you installed simapp Pro?

[@MrTailspinstu]

SILVERBACK-GJR ,yes ive installed simapppro and all buttons and sliders seem to be recognized and registered in app but in the cockpit they are not....how do I go about contacting you in discord it aiways asks for a 4 digit ID code ?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

discord.gg/dD95upaxCH try this one

[@oppotato5440]

What aircraft doesnt have axis tdc slew?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

The older ones. So for example KA-50

[@Melkor54]

email winwing and they will send you a new switch for the throttle. you can tuck the wire over for the throttles so they dont interfere

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Winwing have sent me a new switch now. Thank you!

[@ceruleanskies1414]

Any signs of problems with those moving wires on the throttle?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Not as of yet 👍🏼

[@ceruleanskies1414]

@@silverback-gjr2805 Do you know if Winwing sells replacements for those wires. I am pretty sure if something goes wrong with the throttle over time, it's going to be those wires.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

It's likely, they've already sent me a replacement switch which I used to replace the original faulty one when it was delivered.

[@ceruleanskies1414]

@@silverback-gjr2805 I guess that was the switch you used for coms that didn't click?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

That's correct yep

[@Mista_Spicy]

Should I het this or the Thrustmaster Warthog?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

I'd look at the Orion 2.0. Apparently vast improvements over the original version

[@Mista_Spicy]

@@silverback-gjr2805 ok thanks

[@bdog7262]

What do u use for the coolie hat?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

If its for the a10, I use the a/a and a/g buttons

[@bdog7262]

@@silverback-gjr2805 I’m guessing that is not even close to ideal…. How hard is it for one of these big Hotas company’s to make a truly perfect Hotas? Seriously, take all the feed back from everything that is out their and mop the floor with something spectacular! Guess I need to wake up.

[@bdog7262]

@@silverback-gjr2805 thank you for your response brother.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Honestly pal, it's absolutely fine. Only use it to change the white hot black hot function if I remember correctly... So many bindings for a10

[@bdog7262]

@@silverback-gjr2805 do you still use it today, or do you have a different setup? Yeah I’m just not sure how you use those switches u speak of for coolie hat left,right, up, down, long, short… appreciate your feedback

[@raymondyee2008]

So how would it compare with Thrustmaster?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

If you fly the Hornet, the Orion is better. However I also use it for the Hog and its great for that as well. If you favour the Hog I'd say thrustmaster as it's more suited but then you're limited on everything else. Orion is good for most aircraft.

[@Power5]

I think both of them excel at their intended aircraft, but lack a bit when used with others. Warthog is better with warthog, Orion is better with F-18. All other planes are a compromise due to the sets being specifically tailored to their respective aircraft.

[@BrianStDenis-pj1tq]

Audio is super low. Hard to hear your thoughts.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Thanks for letting me know! try using headphones that might work.

[@gsus3918]

That music in the background...

[@spcrowe]

That exposed wire leading up to the throttle quadrant should last about 6 months then you are offline. Build quality looks questionable for the price

[@silverback-gjr2805]

No problems yet 5 months in 👍🏼

[@AB-bu8ti]

audio is really quiet

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Thanks for feedback will look into it next video 👍🏼

[@MitjaBonca]

Not buying this hotas for sure, thx for this awesome review, which seems to really show and explain all the deficiencies.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Glad you enjoyed the video mate! What's put you off?

[@MitjaBonca]

@@silverback-gjr2805 many things, for example: those 2 cables on throttle unit, and buttons underneeth. On joystick few buttons wihch are not in place or dont work as they should. Way too much faults for that money.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

I've sorted the wires now thanks to another viewer. I also rearly use those buttons. As for the single button I need to contact winwing about that. Those are more moans than proper fualts. It's not expensive compared to alternatives which can also have simular issues.

[@MitjaBonca]

@@silverback-gjr2805 I hope the Winwing listens to yours and other people's opinions and they fix all the issues in next build. Until then I know what to buy 😉

[@doifeellucky]

@@MitjaBonca So what did you buy?

[@Cash_McCoy]

"the stick stops in the corners..." Doesn't the real stick in the real airplane do that also?

[@HoloOG]

Finally a non biased review pointing out the negatives and positives. 👏👏

[@jskah6471]

With all due respect, I really think you are a bit overly dramatic about the throttle idle position detent. Sure it doesn’t have the lift handles but you can clearly feel when you’ve reached 0%. One of your button does seem to have a problem though as mine doesn’t do the same and i’ve been using it for couple of months already. For the joystick popping out, well if you have to pull so long and so hard on the stick, i have to wonder about your speed management of the plane. I’ve never encountered a moment when i would have to pull so far back, so long on the stick during dogfights. You should consider repositioning your stick at a lower level to replicate the position of a real fighter and all your gripes about the joystick will most likely go away. Remember that it is modeled after a real f18 stick and that’s why the buttons are in in such placement. Overall I would say that it it may not be a perfect product with some minor compromises, but overall for the price it’s extremely hard to beat. I am adding a combat panel to my setup and i really think it makes it a more complete package at a very competitive price. I felt i had to add my comment as i feel that your review is overly critical and if you were to place your stick at the right level, it would be a different feel and i hope it doesn’t discourage others to get this great package.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Appreciate your feedback mate. I tend to disagree though. The idle detent can be easy to sliped into (if you haven't been used to detents and its set on low resistance) it's just how I found it at the time, it's now a rare occurance but the video is "one month" of usage. I reviewed the stick as desk mounted as this is how it's advertised to be used. I agree with the fact that it may be far better with it mounted between your legs but some people may not have that option available to them. I tried to make the video from a generic point of view and therefore cover all aspects. I certainly recommend it over its competitors especially from a price standpoint. At the time of purchasing, I couldn't find any videos that answered some questions I had about the product. And therefore aimed to create the content that I wish I had when purchasing. Prolonging pulls on the stick doesn't = speed managment issues. If I didn't mention about the suction cups people wouldn't know that they can potentially do that. Reviews are meant to scrutinies the product, otherwise I'm just giving free advertising. I felt it was fair and gave it off in a better light anyway.

[@jskah6471]

@@silverback-gjr2805 Sure. No worries man. You should consider getting some 8040 aluminium profile and make yourself a simple but yet super effective stand. If you DIY it's fairly cheap but you can also go the monstertech one for a ready to use. Well worth getting it.

[@captandrewebb4472]

But what is the number

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Email : [e-mail] Service tel : [phone] Address : High-tech International Enterprise Zone No.19 Building,Changshengqiao Road 1111#, Pidu District, Chengdu,China 610000

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Feel free to contact me on discord and I can walk you through the steps!

[@captandrewebb4472]

What is your discord name

[@captandrewebb4472]

Or maybe a link to your discord

[@silverback-gjr2805]

@@captandrewebb4472 its in the video description

[@ericandi]

No serious flight simmer uses desktop suction cups anymore. Spend $80 or so and get yourself some desk clamp drop down mount. This would solve your armrest issue as well. A desk stop mount like you are using is way too high and not realistic. Your stick should be close to your waist and belly button. Where if the upper half of your arm hangs straight down and your forearm is at a 90 degree angle and the stick should be directly in front of unit hand.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Check out my new new video. I've mounted the hotas to my desk chair 👍🏼

[@eq1373]

I imagine it still costs a fortune

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Still cheaper than competitors

[@chaoticnsg7292]

5:25 a what? XD

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Niggle 😂😂 "cause slight but persistent annoyance, discomfort, or anxiety"

[@jparker9320]

your volume is really low

[@MrBlancodan]

damn I wish you would have had this review 2 weeks ago i would have gone to another company

[@silverback-gjr2805]

You've had bad luck with the Orion?

[@MrBlancodan]

@@silverback-gjr2805 haven't recieved it , another 10 days

[@silverback-gjr2805]

You won't regret it buddy I can assure you!

[@MasterMojo85]

But which one? There is not much to choose from. Virpil, maybe Thrustmaster Warthog and that's it, since VKB takes forever to release their throttle.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

I'd get the Orion mate. It also depends on what you fly module wise. Fighter/multirole more then get the orion. A10 more then get the thrustmaster. However I fly the a10 alot with the Orion and it works great for it

[@Phalanx443]

What is it with Brits and WHISPERING into microphones when they're recording?!?

[@Blandy086]

To be honest, it really isn't surprising that a rip-off product, made in China, would be sub par...

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Hardly a rip-off mate, doubt you'll find a replica F/A-18 hotas cheaper...

[@Blandy086]

@@silverback-gjr2805 - Granted, but I will always take quality over price.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Completely up to you, as far as quality is concerned I have no doubt more expensive systems have similar design drawbacks. In my opinion, similar systems from other manufacturers are overpriced compared. Overall though, I think it's a brilliant hotas and it works very well for my use.

[@Blandy086]

@@silverback-gjr2805 Agreed, it will always come down to what suits who and budget constraints. In terms of quality, I can say with experience that the Thrustmaster Replica's are excellent as they are 1:1 designs due to collaboration with the real-life counterpart manufacturers. With my F/A18C stick, all buttons are completely reachable without having to move hand position on the stick at all. The real-life stick has had a lot of money spent on its development because every pilot is going to have a different sized hand and they do not want pilots having to shift hand positions during engagements. As such, the real-life F/A18 stick is specifically designed to cover a wide range of users with excellent usability. With the Thrustmaster F/A18C stick being 1:1 with detailed design information from the manufacturer, the end result is a stick that is incredibly usable, without needing to adjust hand position at all and it covers a wide range of users. Regarding the throttle quadrant, when I lock my TCLs together, there is absolutely no play or wiggle at all, they are LOCKED together completely. This is due to the pins being precision machined and the holes being laser cut. It is also because the TCLs are also 1:1 replicas of their real-life counterparts. Could you imagine the issues associated with sloppy TCLs in a real-life jet? Lastly, the TCLs have a lockout for engine idle, you have to reach down over the front of the TCL handles and lift a locking handle to move the TCLs to idle. So again, I agree that buying a HOTAS will come down to the buyer's budget and needs. But, I maintain my opinion that cheaper is not always best. Yes, you say the WINWING setup is a good alternative. But I counter with the fact that I can employ the aircraft's systems and maintain formation a lot easier and for the amount of time I spend in DCS, the difference in cost was well worth it. Final point, the majority of the Thrustmaster setups are metal with very little plastic, so you know which will be more reliable over time and use. WINWING may be cheaper, but is it really cheaper if you have to buy parts in a year's time?

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Fair points. A) this isn't real life so you can't really use that as a reason to talk about build quality ie saying you can perform better in the game compared to a winwing setup. That's down to skill I'm afraid. Precision is probably better in the thrustmaster no doubt however, I've been beaten many times by people with "cheaper" sticks. Ie the vkb or saitek hotas's. They have also managed to keep formation no problem. B) the winwing is a 1:1 replica (not vetted by usaf granted) but like everything, they've copied it. And it's not a bad copy at all. If you watch my video you can see that I'm sharing my opinion on certain things. One being that I don't have proper mounts hence the position of my hand stretching etc. (this is now rectified on new video) C) many people fall into a marketing trap where they read features and certain information about a product ie the fact the thrustmaster has been made with the usaf. Like that's cool... and? The winwing also is a 1:1. It's also made out of metal Etc etc. It just get boring after a while. I don't get why people get so worked up on here 😂. It's a review, a personal opinion on something I bought. Am I saying it's better than every other system? No. I'm simply saying don't mock it until you actually try it. The Chinese don't have the best rep granted. But honestly try it. You'll be pleasantly suprised like everyone I know who has one. It would be a shit review if I didn't say anything wrong with it. Every product has a fault in someones opinion. 👍🏼

[@TheCort1971]

oh look. a cheap knock off of virpil hardware.

[@silverback-gjr2805]

Oh. When did Virpil make an F/A-18 replica??

[@TheCort1971]

@@silverback-gjr2805 go look up the constellation alpha and the throttle. i used to run constellation delta sticks. switched over to the alpha when they came out. almost the exact same design but not the same quality. to be fair. not an exact replica of the F/A-18 but a very close copy with high end sensors.