In Their Own Words: John Larsen/Carah Burrell @JohnLarsen1 @nuancehoe | Ep. 1706

[@thehammer3193]

The best part about watching your podcasts is that I am able to enjoy a guilt free beer or coffee while I listen to them. :-)

[@ricks9860]

I've been out of Mormonism for years now. Every time I think I'm done with things regarding Mormon history, shows like yours drag me back in. The history is never ending and the shit just keeps getting deeper. Appreciate your show and the historical education.

[@bodytrainer1crane730]

John Larsen and Carah Burrell! I look forward to this all month!

[@CarahBurrell]

❤❤❤

[@CarahBurrell]

John Larsen took me to his library of books and it was like that Seinfeld where Jerry discovers the woman he's dating has all his favorite collectable toys so he drugs her to get his hands on GI Joe. So imagine me all weekend playing with first edition of No Man Knows My History with the glee of a school child.

[@reddish22]

@nuancehoe-now I’ve got the mental image of you diving into a pile of books like Scrooge McDuck while John Larsen is passed out in the corner.

[@mrh3894]

classic

[@bagnasbayabas]

By the way, you look like Meghan Markle.

[@KidFreshie]

Were they bound in leather and smell of rich mahogany?

[@mrh3894]

@@bagnasbayabas I don't see it also I have a crush on @nuancehoe

[@WilboBagg1ns]

What's funny is the Come Follow Me program really pushed me to the breaking of my shelf. We got to the part in D&C where Joseph was going to be killed and I thought, "Why did he get arrested? It can't just be because they hate him for his religion, right? There has to be two sides to the story." I was so angry to find out the real reason he was arrested and the actual history there. I couldn't shake the thought that I was 40 years old and had never heard the actual reason he was arrested and the full story. This led me to deep dive the church history to see what else I had missed. Was I a lazy learner as a member? It turns out that learning the actual history is what has taken me out. Being honest with your fellow man was just a principle that is too important for me and I'm not willing to compromise that with the history and truth claims.

[@LeeLee-nx6dc]

I was in the church 50+ years before I figured out everything we were thought was basically a lie.

[@celineleeuwe1206]

Can you tell me what you found out

[@WilboBagg1ns]

@@celineleeuwe1206 William Law, the First Councilor of the church at the time, saw all of the polygamy that Joseph was participating in and forming the council of 50 - essentially starting to go more extreme. Joseph was then telling the public that he was not doing those things. William Law then bought a printing press, the Nauvoo Expositor, and published everything that Joseph was doing. All accusations were true. Joseph, being the town mayor, gathered the members of the church and destroyed the printing press of the Nauvoo Expositor. This, of course, starts to infringe on freedom of the press, and the head of the state told Joseph this when they sought him for trial. It was while in Carthage that the mob showed up and killed him before his trial. Joseph was in fact practicing polygamy (also against the law) with more than 30 women - some of them as young as 14 (not normal even back in this time). Like I said, I was shocked to learn some of these details and started to understand why some of the local people would be upset with Joseph and the Mormons being there. This is really just the tip of the ice burg in terms of what I started to look into.

[@celineleeuwe1206]

Thanks

[@celineleeuwe1206]

@@WilboBagg1ns thanks. So much just doesn't add up or is hard to understand. They just sweep it under the rug. I'm out already long time. This channel is really very informative

[@BeachKid74-ct2ob]

John Larson ROCKS! Thank you both for hosting him!!!

[@mormonskeptic6836]

As I navigate through my own deconstruction of Mormonism, episodes like this are invaluable. Especially when I have to spend time with my TBM family during the holidays. Thank you!

[@malanawalus5389]

@nuancehoe how I adore thee, let me count the ways! Thank you for validating my younger self and so many of my peers. Thank you for using curse-y words to express your authentic self and breaking through the walls of what a knowledgeable woman sounds like. Keep being you and enhancing Mormon Stories! ❤

[@CarahBurrell]

Well at least someone on this comment section likes silly authenticity. Thanks ❤

[@malanawalus5389]

@@CarahBurrell Anytime! I have had an aversion to fake *Molly* voices since birth. It doesn't equate to a more spiritual or knowledgeable being. Keep. Being. YOU!!!! Ps. I'm geeked you responded and send your videos to both my siblings and friend's. Keep roaring and letting people know the damage that is caused by the toxic culture in which we were raised!!!!

[@debbieshrubb1222]

Though faith deconstruction can be painful,I don't see it as negative energy. The material that post mormon podcasters address ultimately is cleansing for me and validating and has enabled me to rebuild. Its not just about deconstruction but reconstruction.

[@oonaellaa]

Carah, you are the best! These monthly videos are such a highlight. Don’t care about what some salty people try to say about you. ❤

[@CarahBurrell]

I know what I’m doing and get that it’s not everyone’s cup of tea! Thanks for connecting with it though! ❤❤❤

[@fredlarge8209]

How could you not kick in a few bucks, love this trio!!!

[@kentthalman4459]

No doubt!

[@brooklynparkse]

Request that after the LDS Discussion series is finished, we have a series on these books.

[@fredlarge8209]

Thanks!

[@bgardunia]

I would love to hear more about the other early leaders excommunicated by Joseph

[@celicalostandfound]

I encourage all to follow John Larsen's advice and get out there and read the source material. I have spent countless hours, days, weeks, months and now years studying it all myself. If for some reason the works of the Tanners and everyone else disappeared it would not matter because you can't help but come to the same conclusions if you read and study them yourselves.

[@samanthahill5428]

Carah and John Larsen! My faves! 🎊🎊

[@kentthalman4459]

This podcast is such an amazing holiday treat. Likely in the 2023 top 5 list. Very informative and quite entertaining. In what I assert is the funniest moment in Mormon Stories history, JD hums Praise to the Man as Larsen reads its text. It was the most that I've laughed in any MS. Thanks so much!

[@Damariobros]

I'm the one that was talking in the live chat going through my faith crisis. I had a talk with my mom today, apparently I'm the nephew of Brian Johnston! I'm really surprised and after the talk I had with my mom about the Church I feel so much weight lifting off of me!

[@CarahBurrell]

Ahhhh I'm so happy! Well done.

[@Funymoney010]

Loved John dehlin and nuancehoe singing praise to the man while John Larsen was reading the words lmao

[@kentthalman4459]

lmao indeed. 🤣

[@deskjockie4948]

It gave me the creeps. I never did like that song.

[@oopsiesh]

@45:09 love Carah's emotion here

[@TheInstigator1026]

nuanceho 45:13 what the world needs to know, is this! ❤🧡💚

[@CarahBurrell]

Haha it’s just the basics!

[@sydneysjoblom2992]

My university library periodically puts out old books for free, and one of them was a bound collection of the Evening and Morning Star. I'm kicking myself for not grabbing that one right then!

[@shanandigans]

Why is it that John Larsen is able to get angry and worked up and Dehlin doesn’t bat an eye, but Carah has a moment and JD reacts like it’s out of line. “Whoa! Carah!” 🙄 Men can get angry about something but women can’t apparently.

[@CarahBurrell]

Yeah.

[@michealfrances]

Please suggest to John that he considered doing an episode with therapists that help clients with recovery from high demand religions. Religious trauma is a real thing and it might be good to have psychotherapists who are in that particular field on to talk about it

[@SR-bw3sc]

Excellent suggestion.

[@KidFreshie]

But John's a therapist. Healing is woven throughout almost every show. And psychotherapy isn't really considered very effective anyway...replaced with CBT and other evidence-based techniques and practices.

[@patricianoel7782]

Fortunately I have a wonderful therapist I’ve been with now for 6 months. And yes, John Larsen my reading is the most fun part of my day… fortunately I have time to read everyday! WAHOO!!!!

[@patricianoel7782]

I go twice a month to a therapist. Thank goodness I found her as she literally is keeping me from call it quits. (Not the church, my life)

[@Lopeys2446]

​@@patricianoel7782stay safe please❤

[@scottduede8134]

@1:38:00 Here is the start of the most essential argument laid in here: Apologist thinking contains tactics for lying. Thank you for laying this out.

[@gloriamosby7527]

I've been looking forward to this. John John and carah. 🥰

[@CarahBurrell]

Yay❤❤❤

[@function0077]

When I was a member (approx. from 1980 thru 2000) I never heard the phrase "ongoing restoration" used by church leaders. The phrase that was always used was "restored gospel". There is no ongoing "restoration" in the SLC based sect of Mormonism, there is an ongoing retreat from what was already "restored".

[@function0077]

@@randyjordan5521 They also use the phrase, "line upon line, precept upon precept." But when the new line consistently contradicts the previous lines, they lose all credibility.

[@charlesmendeley9823]

The only ongoing restoration I see is at the Community of Christ. They actually add new stuff to the D&C.

[@xaarxncx]

26:57 as an ex catholic with an extreme acedemic interest in Mormonism and the LDS church, the “nonworship” worship of Joseph smith is very reminiscent of how Catholics are criticized for worshipping Mary (who they claim not to worship) even though we erect statues in her honor, pray to her specifically, view her as her own sacred deity, but at the same time claim that she is not worshipped, as she is not Jesus or God. now is it the same? no not at all lol but soooo similar

[@millied4089]

I'm glad you brought this up. I have never been Mormon- became interested in the podcast because someone I cared for was involved. Why are there so many Catholic terms and traditions, and how do they explain that? What comes to mind is sacrament, priesthood, seminary, bishop, etc. They even have a brand of the confessional- confessing to the " bishop".

[@rooheath]

Thanks for this episode - fantastic team as always! We all need some ‘as recommended by’ book bundles to put on our exmo Christmas lists 🎄📚

[@lj9524]

Research and crtical thinking at its best! Thank you and God bless you all for this jnteresting video🎄👏❤️

[@lisamariecorbett2433]

Hello John! My husband and I are HUGE fans!! Please, please, please, please do an episode on "Annalee Skarin" nobody has talked about this yet anywhere. She was excommunicated for writing the book "Ye Are Gods". You won't believe the reasons given for why they excommunicated her. Please do an episode on it!!! Love your work!! ❤❤

[@MrChilli26]

Thank you for bringing history to light with references to documents. Could you please put the list of those 10 written resources mentioned into the comments section for easy reference.

[@kentthalman4459]

As an example of the Church's slow roll of information John mentions, a notable case in point is that fact that we still don't have access to William Clayton's journals. This is after the Church's JSP Project promised years ago that it would be coming out shortly. I'm convinced the Q15 are having big time heart burn about what Clayton will reveal about JS. Just the limited information we have from him about the week of July 3rd when JS deeded Emma a bunch of city lots.

[@kentthalman4459]

@@randyjordan5521 I've found parts of WC's journal, but not in its entirety.

[@DarkFire1536]

This is so fascinating! I can't wait to dig into these resources

[@debra4542]

AMEN Carah!! No pussyfooting required when exposing hoaxers!! Anger is relevant and appropriate. People have been harmed by these lies...

[@CarahBurrell]

Yay :)

[@susanaanderson3150]

Great episode!

[@johngibson9698]

Was the Trinitarian Doctrine still on the front page because the FIRST VISION had not yet been formalized and sprung on members?

[@richardconover8814]

Where are the show notes with the links to the books discussed?

[@t.thompson9977]

Love MS Great episode everyone

[@JP-JustSayin]

So John L. identifies as Buddhist ... good for him ... I'm nothing, but I definitely get more benefit from sitting in silence for 15 min a day than I ever got from 15 min a day reading the BoM.

[@charlesmendeley9823]

Finding anachronisms can be fun though. My latest is Mosiah 4:27. Olympic running in Ancient America?

[@mahayinnovations7162]

Please explain 2 Nephi 31:11-15. There is a pretty clear distinction between the Father and the Son in these verses. That distinction is the same for the current version of the Book of Mormon and the original manuscript. You can verify this in Skousen's book. That being the case, the view of the Father and the Son being separate beings predates 1832 and is evidence contrary to Joseph's evolving view of the trinity. I would like to know your thoughts on this and I am wondering if this has been discussed in other videos of yours?

[@CarahBurrell]

Someone scroll down and tell Karen Morris these are the episodes where we get to say fuck and I wasn't sure John L was going to fill our quota. These swears don't roll over. When you don't use them...They're gone.

[@CarahBurrell]

@Yahooness That…..is not at all the point of what I said. I do however think that your sentiments have all been self centered that we need to cater to what you like though. On Mormon Stories? Maybe. John Larsen episodes? Can I get a fuck no. 🙋‍♀️

[@CarahBurrell]

@@ajensen366 I’m heartwarmed to know people’s mutual hatred of me could lead to their self loathing boning 🥰

[@MrGenejudson]

Karen...🤣🤣🤣

[@timmiestabrnak]

I live Larsen, his brash unfiltered jargon, unfiltered say it like it is& his self-deprecating humour.

[@marylamphere2112]

I love that we all started singing as soon as John L said "praise to the man" 😂

[@davashorb6116]

You mentioned that many of the followers here are not Mormon or never were Mormon As a non-Mormon, I love this site because it helps me understand how easy it is to create a religion out of complete BS.

[@yijumiller5659]

Mormons follow and worship their prophets like an idol.

[@fpkwck]

I am sorry I could not understand the words to the song John Lasen read. John Dehlin's singing and humming was louder than the reading. I still enjoyed the program.

[@randallwalker5849]

1:08:47 I had my faith crisis at age 7. I knew in my soul the entire Joseph smith story was total BS

[@Chowmein139]

Love these episodes! Sorry that a few were offended by words used. I’ve been there. Words only have the power that we allow them to have though. It took me some time to learn that. The Mormon church have used language historically that put the value of ex-Mormon, LGBTQIA+, and many other marginalized group’s lives at less than 0. That behavior by the church deserves condemnation. It deserves fiery language. It deserves rebuke. The church has not apologized or atoned for this over the years. Until they have, remember who Carah and others are directing their retribution towards. In my experience it isn’t towards individual members. It is usually aimed towards the systems and processes that allow and even reward this behavior. Heal in your own way however that is. If it is to avoid episodes with JL and Carah I’m sad. Because they represent my frustration and indignation perfectly.

[@EquestrianAltercationsLLC]

It's funny how bishops used to say oral was a sin, when they used to belch out "Praise to the Man" in the most homoerotic performance of fellatio the priesthood session has ever seen.

[@r3b3lutions]

John Larsen mentioned that he'll speak at a Thrive event in March 2023. Can we please get the dates for that? I don't see it on the Thrive Beyond Religion events or anywhere online.

[@mormonstories]

Email [e-mail]

[@jonathanross2304]

I always hated singing "Praise to the man" with investigators or recent converts in the room

[@deborahbarry8458]

25:00 my favourite part was the instrumental background for the lyrics. 🌟 Yes, I am one of people with no exposure to Mormons - fascinated that my beloved Marie Osmond follows this faith. 🌟 now I’m rewinding to the song again. Was that accompaniment the brass section? 🌟📣

[@andrewshaw1706]

Where can I get more info on John L coming to Seattle? I want to be there and yes John D and Carah should totally come out too.

[@amdobler]

Lately we are being told by church leadership that the restoration is ongoing. Does that mean that doctrine and rules can be constantly changed to be "more restored "? Ongoing restoration seems to mean that the Church can be changed as needed by church leadership. I thought the gospel was already restored. At least that's what I learned my whole life. 🤔

[@Indi_Waffle_Girl]

As someone who is right on the line between millennials and gen z's, I am personally offended that John Larsen says we don't know how to read cursive! I learned it in 3rd grade, though it stopped being taught in my area a few years later. My handwriting is basically half-cursive because it's faster to write that way, and I'd like to think that my years of indexing as a youth made me somewhat proficient in reading older cursive. Lol. How rude of you to assume, John Larsen!!! ;) (/sarcasm)

[@grandmaroxie2210]

John, give me more info in Seattle, I would like to be there

[@KevinBullard]

Do y'all still have any t-shirts with built-in peep stones? Might just work...

[@adrichats]

Carahs back!! And looking beautiful

[@CarahBurrell]

omg i l ove you stahp

[@Chowmein139]

Need to know where JD got his hat as well!!

[@HarveyRWiser]

Is John Larsen familiar with Harold Bloom's take on Joseph Smith?

[@lineslines1344]

Aye laddie, what better theme song for your prophet than an old Scottish drinking tune! Hail to the man who communed with Fanny Alger caught in the barn by his wife of 6 years, faithful and true he was not to his beloved built himself a tavern where his friends could drink beers. Praise to his mem'ry he died in a gun fight...

[@thrombus1857]

Have you guys ever read the book “the fate of the persecutors of the prophet joseph smith”? The people were said to have like, rotted to death, and some eaten by bugs I think

[@celineleeuwe1206]

Where's rhe link ?

[@patricianoel7782]

I’m reading “Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith” edited by Joseph Fielding Smith. Is that a good history?

[@charlesmendeley9823]

Another smoking gun: Mosiah 4:27: How did King Benjamin get the Olympic running metaphor, including a prize, from St. Paul? (Cf. 1. Cor 9:24)

[@brooklynparkse]

Is that… Norma Bates or Lucy Mack Smith on Larson’s hat?

[@IBNED]

Larsen...your plosives R waaaay 2 prominent buddy. Get a screen or a better mic. Shure SM7B or Electro Voice Re-20

[@lynnj9721]

Carah looks really extra pretty today. I think the light is really good. John would look pretty, too but he is hiding behind glasses and hat. 10 points to Carah.

[@CarahBurrell]

All my love to you.

[@glossypots]

Such a revelation to me the early Mormon church was anti slavery. I think we can give them a point for that unfortunate (to say the least) this was reversed.

[@Indi_Waffle_Girl]

Referencing the book of commandments section, where John Dehlin (around 50 minutes in) was mentioning that the original book said polygamy was NOT allowed... This makes me wonder actually, if it was not allowed, and then allowed later, and then not again, what was up with polygamy? Was it a popular thing at the time/in the area? Or was it pretty much a strictly Mormon thing? It seems strange to mention "polygamy is not allowed" in the original book of commandments, like it feels really random. Makes me wonder why it's mentioned at all. It's like if I made a church and made a rule saying "you are not allowed to keep a monkey as a pet". Wouldn't that only be applicable if someone was keeping monkeys as pets in the first place? Otherwise, why would I even think to write a rule like that? I figured that polygamy was probably a thing bc JS wanted to screw people, along with the power dynamic that comes into play with all of that. But hearing polygamy being outlawed in one of the original books, before it became something that "the Lord allowed/commanded", makes me wonder if it was happening locally. Does anyone know anything?

[@jasonanderson02]

What is this hat John is wearing?

[@TimothyMatkin]

Changes in Mormon scriptures: Joseph Smith never stopped tinkering with his previous work ... just like George Lucas.

[@Sky_Star-hq6bx]

When the Church Is the abuser, hidden abuses cause lasting trauma and internal damage for Years !

[@schulze420]

Anyone think that John Dehlin talks so slow. I can only listen at 1.5x or higher. SERIOUSLY!

[@slconley]

I listen to him at 1.25 lol 😆

[@KevinBullard]

You've had 14 weddings?!?!?... That's a lot of polygamy

[@LUCACAMPBELL-ny4qt]

I had a job in the Harold B. Lee Library at BYU. I don't know what's still available but filing books was a lot of fun back in the day. A lot of other universities would borrow books from off the shelves or special collections. Everything was there, nothing was hidden. You didn't need to go to the Christian book store to get "anti-Mormon" stuff. How many vision stories were HANDWRITTEN by JS? Apparently there are just two. The LDS Church, the Catholic Church and many other churches have changed their position and doctrines over time. Changing dogma is a Christian tradition that the LDS church has embraced fully. I think your way of thinking is a problem, your high expectations of the LDS church and their leaders. You put them on a high pedestal and then knock them down. I am not following you at all with the BoM stuff as it has some great reading: 3 Nephi 11: 3 - 5 "And it came to pass that while they were thus conversing one with another, they heard a voice as if it came out of heaven; and they cast their eyes round about, for they understood not the voice which they heard; and it was not a harsh voice, neither was it a loud voice; nevertheless, and notwithstanding it being a small voice it did pierce them that did hear to the center, insomuch that there was no part of their frame that it did not cause to quake; yea, it did pierce them to the very soul, and did cause their hearts to burn." 4 And it came to pass that again they heard the voice, and they understood it not. 5 And again the third time they did hear the voice, and did open their ears to hear it; and their eyes were towards the sound thereof; and they did look steadfastly towards heaven, from whence the sound came." This is good story telling, like someone who was there and recounting what happened.

[@jimforman3754]

Sorry I'm late. Never Morman; but this story shows the lie of all religion. God talked to some dude; and everything the dude remembers is the word of the lord? Moses, Mohammed, Jesus, JS, LR Hubbard.....

[@abbyhayes22]

*makes fake cheering crowd noise* Carah!!!!! *pumps fists clenched together* 🎉😂

[@fnjsaunders]

Thanks for the info except for the quasi religious stuff...

[@paro9059]

Kara you might want to consider there are people on this podcast that are here to learn. If this is new to them your outburst is not helpful but hurtful. I understand your frustration but if you want to reach them. It is off putting. Peace and ❤️

[@KidFreshie]

It's John's editorial decision. He knows what kind of energy she brings. He chose to bring it in. She doesn't quite fit with the vibe of this podcast but I think there is a certain element of postMos who like it. It's not my thing but you can't blame her for her for doing her thing. We're all somewhere along this journey and we have to stick together. Our similarities far outweigh our differences.

[@gloriamosby7527]

@@KidFreshie amen

[@davidweaver1120]

I am not Mormon. never was. I listen to this podcast to understand their history. As the Mormon faith is intriguing to me. I am a new listener. I am a Christian. There is so much deception and false doctrine in the Mormon teaching and suppressed truth. My concern is with ex Mormon’s is that they throw out all religion because of their bitterness to the Mormon church. But the Bible is true. God of the Bible is real and what Joseph did to the gospel and his twisting of scripture is exactly what the Bible warns about. “ Beware of false prophets who come to you is sheep’s clothing but inwardly they are ravaging wolves.“ Joseph Smith is a false prophet and a wolf. He preyed on woman and was a monster. I pray that all you ex Mormons find the truth and read the Bible and believe in the God and Jesus and the Holy Spirit of the Bible.

[@underscore3842]

Don’t kill the Buddha

[@KarenSuzMorris]

Must we listen to her bad language?? Please do not have her on your show again!!

[@rooheath]

Would you be able to cope if she said “fetch”? It’s just a word - we imbue the meaning - and I think most people can hold space for individual choices in how people articulate their experiences and thoughts. Keep it real Nuancehoe! 🔥🔥🔥

[@Richard.Atkinson]

I remember when I used to get upset when everyone around me used “swear words.” It was a sad and pathetic time of my life.

[@HeraThea]

Why just her? John Larsen also uses bad language. Sounds like you have internalized issues you need to look into. They have always been transparent about how these episodes are, you need to grow up.

[@Gkit919]

First, they do give a warning at the beginning that there will be language, so you are more than welcome to skip these episodes. Second, all of Carah's fucks seemed very intentional and well placed, it does not seem like an impulse control issue. Third, as far as I heard all the swears were for emphasis, not to degrade anyone, therefore if the content was not offensive then the word used to enhance it shouldn't be offensive either. Lastly, you give meaning to the word. When my husband was in France there were phrases that were totally acceptable for anyone to say, even in church, but if you went to a different province that same phrase was a ghastly affront to ones sensibilities. This video knows their audience and said "hey, we are going to be using language that in our "province" is not offensive, so you may leave or stay and understand that these words are not meant to be offensive in this setting." ...... Amen

[@gloriamosby7527]

She's necessary her view points are her own and she adds flare love her . She represents a portion of non Mormons including myself I love me some @nuancehoe

[@johnmalcolm2028]

Carah is still quite angry and jaded by the damage the church membership inflicted on her. She should get some therapy. The cursing and profanity does not add anything to the presentation. Just a thought. The presentation is powerful on content and needs to linguistic accents.

[@mynot-so-normallife2925]

Carah's great and should cuss as much as wants. If you don't like it just choose another episode. Larsen episodes are fun and full of emotion and adult language (I mean, we are all adults).

[@irohdw6055]

It is ironic that John and his guests argue the importance of studying the history directly without feeling the need to push a conclusion when that is exactly what they do with Mormon history throughout the video. If you watch the video carefully you will find that surprisingly little history is actually discussed. Instead they mention a long series of conclusions about the history and tell the audience to study the history themselves to confirm the claims being made knowing full well that very few people will actually do that. By doing this they can make their conclusions seem more credible than they actually are. There is no doubt that church history as taught by the Mormons is faith promoting bullshit, but the constant poisoning the well that goes on in this video isn't much different. They are the same as the Mormon's propaganda techniques, just from the opposing side. Next time I hope the discussion elaborates on the claims being made by discussing specific documents/events/etc at length and the evidence supporting its claims instead of rapid fire conclusions from a massive list of documents which may or may not be what they say it is.

[@Abogadoarizona]

Thanks!

[@rockytreadway]

Great episode!