Inside 650HP 12v Cummins After 350k Miles

Can a stock 12V Cummins reliably hold 650 Horsepower? In this episode, we take a close look at the internal components of the 12V Cummins after beating on it at 650 Horsepower for over 100,000 miles.
Get the best parts for your 12v Cummins at the lowest prices here: powerdrivendiesel.com/product...
Power Driven Diesel is a specialty performance shop engaged in the engineering and development of high performance turbo diesel technologies.
1 435 962 9555
powerdrivendiesel.com
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[@repairvehicle]

I have always wondered how much wear engine has when modified. Now I know. Thank you for sharing this and being honest without hiding or exaggerating details.

[@pddofficial]

Glad to help

[@repairvehicle]

@Power Driven Diesel , forgot ask you. How did your transmission hold up? Any repairs and what mileage? Good topic for a video

[@Rustedrevivals]

(Machine shop guy here) something to keep in mind, all of those welds can & will cause weak points in your parts, the factory Crankshaft is heat treated & hardened. It is already very brittle, I have had it in other engines where the crank will actually split (yes like a log) after being welded, or heated in an extreme manner. Not bashing you, if it works it works, just something to keep in mind!

[@bcbloc02]

Rod bearings usually always the first to go. I am actually surprised at that much cam wear, but that is a lot of miles. I think 400rwhp single and 600rwhp twin is a good reliable nice driving power level for 12valves.

[@wes11bravo]

Very cool to know that I could go higher in performance (frankly, 99% of the time I'd still run it as conservatively as I would with a bone stock 12V) with no real component degradation. This is a prime example of good old American hot rodding - squeezing the most hp out of an engine without breaking the bank. Subscribed, looking forward to seeing more.

[@aaronkelley8909]

Wow awesome break down of the internals. Thanks for posting!

[@christophergrauer9873]

Great to see you back doing videos Will.

[@kevinredden]

Thank you for showing us your combo. This is exactly what I was looking for. I'll be in touch this spring for sure

[@AustenARW]

Great to see and hear the engine performed great for that mileage at that power level. I have a '98 12v with Industrial Injection towing compounds that have been on there with supporting mods for around 100k as well. I do everything with it from daily driving it to work everyday to hauling a horse trailer. It really is a proven and reliable setup that works flawlessly. You couldn't ask for better driveability and spool up and G56 I have in it also works great with the 12v. A lot of what it takes to "get things to last" is all in how you drive it. If you drive it like a hot rod every single day, then don't expect super longevity if that's what you're after. There is definitely a time and place for it but I don't beat on it every single day when I'm driving it to and from work. Using quality oil and keeping up with oil changes is another high factor of course.

[@Balla1309able]

What oil are you using the one they advertise?

[@lwilde0422]

Great video! Keep them coming!

[@rj8372]

Excellent video man. Much love from Alberta! 🤠

[@208flatbedOO]

Great video guys!

[@Snail2G]

I've been wanting to get into a diesel truck/cummins as my 2nd vehicle just to dick around with and have fun. I'm a gas engine tech for 5 years and it's kinda spooked me the difference from a gas engine to an older style 12v cummins. However, I've been learning a lot from your channel and it's been awesome, and I'm feeling a lot more comfortable. I'm hoping to take the leap come spring time and pickup a "beatup" ram for sub $6k. Love the content and I look forward to watching more of it!

[@adamtheede2575]

Sweet video as always

[@vincentlamoureux8446]

Great show guys 👌

[@justintyme1449]

Glad you made this video, I was already planning on building a project vehicle with a 12 valve Cummins, and this confirms the strength and durability of this engine 😁👍🏻

[@pddofficial]

They are really well-built from the factory!

[@justintyme1449]

I’m still in the preliminary stage of the build, but I’m sure you’ll be impressed with the power potential of this type of set up

[@SunriseCrawlers]

I need learn more about these. I have had a 94 5.9 just sitting around that I need to start building

[@jbmorris2893]

Truly tough engines! Good and interesting video.

[@pddofficial]

Yes they are!

[@jbmorris2893]

@@pddofficial about the s472 turbo... were EGTs different?

[@claytonbourne8967]

Man I would absolutely kill to know everything you guys know

[@kurtwickam4424]

Another great video

[@coalstang]

can’t wait to see where this engine build ends up power wise. 👍

[@pddofficial]

Shoot for the stars.... or limit of the block? LOL

[@zacharyvillanueva955]

Great explanation! Thank you

[@pddofficial]

Glad it was helpful!

[@Knuckledragnation]

That wasn’t a camshaft that was a fricken flagpole!!!!! ✌🏽🇺🇸

[@dbfabworks5320]

Love the mechanical content!! My 96 5 speed truck has 325.000 miles with head studs slipped in one at a time, 60# valve springs, PDD push rods, 6x11 VCOs, 21 degrees timing, and HE351/S369sxe compounds. It has been an amazingly reliable setup and now I know the motor most likely has alot of life left in it. KEEP IT UP!!!

[@pddofficial]

Sounds like a great combination!

[@kalebstout7673]

Ever had it dyno’d and any idea on the power or MPG if you even keep track of it.

[@dbfabworks5320]

@@kalebstout7673 Never had on a dyno, would love too one day. Power is probably north of 400hp off the butt dyno and from driving other trucks. MPGs aren't bad, average about 15, hot rodding around and towing.

[@surfstarcc1]

Well this is an amazing video! I have over 300,000 on my 24v not as much power as your 12v but aftermarket everything and I wonder how my block is doing??

[@SS-iw1gf]

Makes me feel good about my stock Cummins with almost 400k.

[@pddofficial]

If the oil is changed regularly, 400k mile engines still look great inside!

[@gofast8878]

I never repond here. But you guys are great. I like smaller Diesel tuning and i know a lot about the subject. Still its great entertainment. Keep it up

[@pddofficial]

Thanks for watching!

[@joeyclark789]

You guys have an awesome job. I'm jealous.

[@hallasnackbar1865]

I just put compounds 361 over 476 on my 3rd gen along with studs, springs, lift pump and coolant bypass. The truck was completely stock with 150k on the motor but is now tuned to 650 hp. I built it for towing and daily driving. I was told to expect it to go 400k the way it sits and this just supports that. Thanks for the info.

[@davidmowat4056]

I’m planning on going with the ultimate towing compounds on my truck. Thanks for showing this. It just confirms that this is the route I want to go! Now do you think a ZF6 will hold up behind it? (Fummins)

[@ryanthibeaux]

Send it to superstick in Texas

[@Syriondeathvow]

Thanks for this info

[@pddofficial]

Any time

[@VMac822]

We tore down the engine from my old truck, 1996 Cummins at 494,000 miles. It was only about 150 hp overstock for the last 150K. A lot of those smiles were short trip city and local. Hone marks were gone in cylinders 5 & 6. Most bearings looked really good except #5 rod was in bad shape and one main was a bit rough, No idea why. But the crank polished out. I noticed they low the thumping sound for the last 75,000 miles, because of the rod bearing.

[@pddofficial]

Occasionally we've come across random rod bearing failures but not a common issue for sure.

[@MarcoRodriguez-lr2xt]

What mods did you do to get the extra 150hp? I'm looking for a little extra hp on my stock 97 with 237k miles. I tow a toy hauler to the desert.

[@lowellmiller6663]

Well spoken in front of the camera sir.

[@jeffreypinder9398]

Great info.

[@pddofficial]

Glad it was helpful!

[@petek6522]

Good information video

[@docksidemarine4273]

I just rebuilt my 12v after dropping an exhaust valve. It was around 600hp for about 50k miles and my rod bearings looked the same.

[@MarcoRodriguez-lr2xt]

do you run compound turbos? just bought a 97 dually to tow my trailer to the desert. i wouldnt mind another 100 hp.

[@docksidemarine4273]

@@MarcoRodriguez-lr2xt i just went from a single silverbullet 64 to a s362/s475 compound setup. Unreal the difference.

[@aw9680]

I think this says more to the fact that you guys know how to tune the truck to safely make that much horsepower, than anything. Granted the cummins is solid, but if I tweaked my engine that far, something would probably give. Says volumes about your knowledge base.

[@pddofficial]

Some would argue it's really easy to tune a 12v Cummins.... screwdriver and small hand tools.... Honestly with fast spooling compound turbos, it's hard to really overdue-it on the fueling side because the excess airflow produces the power so easily.

[@aw9680]

@@pddofficial I didn't know about you guys and your compounds before buying a Ind. Inj. Boxer turbo. If I would have I would have definitely gone with your setup. I'm in love! I don't really like the boxer anyway. It takes alot to light up. They said it would work great though. Who knew...

[@AlexMendoza69]

Just got my 98 12 valve back from Superstick Transmissions, they did a G56 swap for me. Now I want a little more power, 450whp would be plenty.

[@pddofficial]

Great give a call any time 435-962-9555 or email to [e-mail]

[@pmscompany]

What are you think if i take a 6bt and i tuning to 500 hp with + 13sp transmition and i instal on a semi single axle ? For pull 48k lb trailer. Is crazy?

[@Aciecarter238]

Did it have a problem ? Wondering why you took it apart if there wasn't anything wrong with it. Just found your channel liking the content. Amazing video was it drove hard what was the normal egt temp? Did u pull a trailer full time with it ? Or just a daily driver beat on type build ? Mine has 600 hp in my 3500 dually 6 speed. An on summer days it's usually 2k temp 4 inch straight pipe exhuast compound turbo set up.

[@pddofficial]

The truck had no issues other than Will was bored with 664 HP. Check out the earlier episode for the details on this 98' 12 valve: kzbin.info/www/bejne/q3ykgZuQj6qEbqM

[@jadebrecks]

I love when you guys post videos! You guys coming to UCC again?

[@pddofficial]

We are not attending UCC this year as a competitor. That doesn't mean a few of us won't be there to spectate and/or help should the need arise.

[@jadebrecks]

@@pddofficial bummer to hear you won't be competing but I will definitely say hi to any of you I see!

[@valve-do3jc]

Sweet I have the same 98 12valve 215 pump My dream is your compounds. I have a motor built waiting to be put in, I have a stage 4 colt cam it and would love to see what your compounds would do with that cam. Please and thank you Will

[@pddofficial]

Sounds like a great build plan/setup. We've tested larger cams in the past on a 500ish HP 12v with a medium sized single turbo and it didn't really pick up a measurable horsepower gain on the dyno. We suspect the stock head was holding back dyno gains from the mild cam. The stage 4 colt is bigger than what we tested and the towing compounds flow more air, so it should be a great combination. Now if you topped if off with a ported head..... it might be incredible.

[@FailsAndFightsFNF]

Hey! I love your content and I'm partnered with TheAdrenalineDealer and 8LugsNoPlugs and we'd love to share your content across our platforms with full credit to you!

[@Grant3758]

What kind of mpgs would a truck like this get cruising the highway? This is cool! Makes me want a diesel truck

[@pddofficial]

typically 15-18mpg

[@MrScotty30]

What oil are you using? Tried finding it in comments. Good video I’m upgrading my 18 with banks parts.

[@pddofficial]

For oil, this truck usually was filled up with powerdrivendiesel.com/product/conventional-15w-40-boosted-with-zddp/ Occasionally during wintertime it would get the full synthetic: powerdrivendiesel.com/product/synthetic-15w-40-boosted-with-zddp/ Or for the really cold weather, the newly released 5w-40 helps with cold starts: powerdrivendiesel.com/product/power-driven-diesel-synthetic-diesel-oil-5w-40-gal/

[@wyattl341]

Curious to know if this was running a Fluidampr or not??

[@LabiaLicker]

6bt are really overbuilt. Also what torque did you have for this?

[@williamhunt9115]

This is roughly my goal with my 96 Dually

[@dhillanroy8749]

You talked about the abuse but how was the exhaust temps, was it pretty moderate or did it see 2k EGT weekly

[@pddofficial]

It probably saw 1800 weekly, it probably couldn't get to 2k without a trailer load on a steep hill or at the drag strip at 100 MPH.

[@Rickyssspanish]

When yall doing a double the horsepower truck sponsorship ill drive from California for that to happen!

[@pddofficial]

We already did double, it's probably time to do triple or quadruple?

[@Rickyssspanish]

@Power Driven Diesel Would be awesome to see both tripe and quadruple as part of a series on the channel. If you need a lightly modified 2nd gen to use I'm that guy pal 👍

[@ryanhall3404]

I looking to get a full rebuild on my 98 12v to bad you guys are so far away from Long Island NY! Anyone on here no of someone local to LI to help me out? Thanks for the awesome content fellers keep it up!!!

[@pddofficial]

Thank you Ryan

[@bubbysmithdean]

I’m planning on manual swapping my 12 valve because I went through 2 transmissions. But none of those transmission were from PDD. Idk if I have the skill to build one on my own with one of your kits.

[@truckcampertraveler7369]

Allison swap it i have a 5 speed 12v and it gets old after a while on the bright side 330,000 miles and it still shifts smooth :)

[@pddofficial]

Manuals are great for guys that like rowing gears... full manual VB built autos are better, at least more fun for sure! We've had lots of customers successfully build their own transmission with one of our kits, so if you're up for it, give it a shot!

[@dustindd789]

I am curious if you are running a Fass or just a modified stock mechanical pump on this unit? Also how are you keeping the head down? I have a somewhat similar setup but I cant seam to keep headgaskets in it

[@pddofficial]

This truck was running a stock replacement PDD hotrod lift pump: powerdrivendiesel.com/product/hot-rod-modified-lift-pump-2/ This truck was also running o-rings and Torque Master Head Studs: powerdrivendiesel.com/product/optitorque-torquemaster-head-stud-kit-for-12-valve-cummins/

[@jessiewhitefield8759]

So what what was caseing all the crank case pressure? How was the bore on the block?

[@pddofficial]

Bore had vertical scuffing, most likely from butting rings a time or two at the drag strip on a low 12 second 1/4 mile pass. Bores will clean up with about 009" piston to wall hone job, so for a milder power level rebuild it will probably end up 020" oversized.

[@Balakay9435]

Hell Yeah Brother

[@pddofficial]

I'm gonna go out on a limb based on your comment that you're a Cleetus McFarland fan.... correct?

[@thenomad7120]

Stock engine might handle 700hp …but my 47re would be shaking in it’s boots when it sees those ponies coming 🤣

[@augustinglenn]

You mentioned that this truck started well in the winter and I. The summer but the new engine build will have a hard time starting. I always wondered why these heavily modified diesel engines have a hard time starting. Is it the quantity of fuel injected, the injection timing, or the valve timing? Would be nice if you guys could explain. Great video 👍

[@bcbloc02]

Low compression and high timing make them hard to start.

[@augustinglenn]

@@bcbloc02 By "High timing" you mean advanced fuel injection timing?

[@bcbloc02]

@@augustinglenn Yes 30+deg BTDC Start of injection is high timing. Some pullers can be 50+deg advanced

[@augustinglenn]

@@bcbloc02 Oh ok. Thanks so much for the clarification

[@augustinglenn]

@@bcbloc02 It's amazing that the engine can even run with fuel being injected so early on the compression stroke

[@MrSuperchargedv8]

What are the sought after cummins blocks/engines I can look for if I wanted to buy a used engine to heavily modify for a project vehicle?

[@pddofficial]

The international blocks and the 215 p pump is what you would be after but at 1500+hp unless you are planing on filling it they all tend to break.

[@MrSuperchargedv8]

@@pddofficial nice..I was thinking around half of that kind of power....is there any way to destiguish them or pick them out if I were to go out to a junk yard...

[@ericpettyfishing]

I'm saving up to Cummins swap my 6.0 250. I wonder what the cost for a build like this is. Maybe a parts list?

[@ericpettyfishing]

Truck runs great currently. 267k now. Figured I should save for the big day though.

[@pddofficial]

It's a stock engine with headstuds, pushrods, valve springs, injectors, and towing compound turbo kit. The pump's fuel/power output could be replicated with a stock pump with delivery valves and governor spring upgrade. No need for a $2,000+ pump build for this power level. Wait for the final product, we'll see just how far this 12mm p-pump will take us!

[@wedowhatwewant6850]

What generation is this 12 valve he referring to? First or second generation? What one is better? I’m new to this. Trying to learn and research. Thanks in advance.

[@pddofficial]

he is referring to the 2nd generation as for what is better all depends on what you are after.

[@Friend_of_the_One-Eyed_Ladies]

RWHP: Real-world horsepower. BHP: Banks horsepower.

[@chuck8024]

Nope, sorry. It amazing that with the internet, people still get basic whit wrong like that

[@aw9680]

Do you guys ever balance the rotating assembly?

[@pddofficial]

Yes at 1000hp build we will.

[@ryanstafford6874]

Would 25 degrees of timing be the max for something you daily drive in the winter?

[@pddofficial]

With working grid heaters, you can go as high as 30*, but it's starts hard and is annoying for most. Keep in mind -20F starts in Montana or Minnesota are not going to happen at 30* timing but 10F will be rough, but it'll start. Sometimes if you cycle the grid heaters twice before trying to start with good batteries and 5w-40 synthetic oil so the motor turns over faster will really help and then you could possible run 30+ timing. If you have a working block heater and plug it in, then 30* timing is never a problem.

[@meyaht]

can you ballpark how much i would spend to setup my stock 96 ram for compound ~600hp? just round to the nearest $500 or so?

[@pddofficial]

8-10k

[@rubydelatorre7674]

Question for you. I have a 93 1st gen w350. I would like to build it 600whp. It is a automatic transmission. Would you recommend keeping it auto or would I be better off going to a g56. I want to do p pump swap and your compound setup , k27 with the 369? What would you suggest? Thank you for the good imfo.

[@pddofficial]

Both will be great options but if it is a auto you will need an auto out of a 94 or new tuck so you will have lock up

[@aw9680]

Can you guys comment on when or where the limit is for cylinder ring replacement and bore vs re-ring limit? My 12v blows light blue colored smoke on idle or low rpm.

[@preachers4135]

I’m guessing you’re talking about piston rings and you’re concerned because you see blue smoke. First thing would be to diagnose the cause of the blue smoke, yes it’s most likely engine oil entering the combustion chamber but it could be bad turbo seals or bad valve guide seals. Does the engine have excessive blow-by, hard to start, lack power? Jumping to the most expensive to replace component is fun when you’re spending OPM, other people’s money. As for the limit, ring-end gap specs are listed for each ring in the service manual. With modded / high horsepower engines the ring-end gap is intentionally opened up so it all depends on what your projected cylinder pressure and temps are going to be.

[@pddofficial]

We've torn apart high mileage 12v engines with 040" top ring gap from wear that only used 1 qt of oil per 5k mile oil change. Whereas the stock maximum top ring gap is closer to 026". The same engine with a hone job and new rings would be good to go, just on the looser end of factory spec at 025" or so gap with the new rings and fresh hone.

[@joeinmi8671]

Do you find that the 160hp Ppumps dont respond as well to timing increases as the 215?

[@pddofficial]

We find that you need to add more timing on the 160 p pump to make power

[@alldeisel2208]

How can i get you guys to fix my 99 dodge ram 2500 2wd?

[@TheMahtBro]

any news on when the batwing rockers will be back in?

[@pddofficial]

They should be back in stock by the end of next week.

[@ryanstafford6874]

How often should a person change oil on a setup like this when using a quality oil like pdd synthetic?

[@pddofficial]

At this power level, regular oil changes at 5k miles is pretty standard. When you get up into the 900+ HP range, fuel dilution can become an issue and the limiting factor requiring more frequent oil changes. If you sample and test your oil, you can definitely go to longer intervals 5k+ as long as your air filtration is good to keep the silica down and you keep an eye on the wear metals in the lab reports. This exact truck had quite a bit of oil sampling done over the past 100k miles and Will pushed the oil change interval to just over 10k miles a few times and it had 13k miles on the last oil change right as the engine was removed. On the flip side, some of our BIG power race engines get fresh oil every 20 to 25 dyno pulls and after every 5 quarter mile passes. On these big power setups, the oil starts to smell like fuel and combustion gasses because of dilution and the extreme blowby that occurs with 1800+ HP.

[@ze_german2921]

I plan on building a nice tow rig using a either a 90's Chevy C30HD frame or a Ford F550, What would be the best transmission to use behind a 400-500hp Cummins? I would like to have a manual like a 5sp Eaton or a newer 6sp dodge manual. Don't feel like investing in $10K Built automatics, Not drag racing just wanna tow comfortable any mountain that comes my way.

[@bcbloc02]

If you have the space under the floor I would use a FSO-6406a Eaton Fuller. Its twice the trans of of any Getrag or New Venture.

[@pddofficial]

The G56 6 speeds have larger bearings than the NV5600 and they are usually more affordable. The ZF 6 speeds have a good reputation as well. Outside of those three light duty factory options, I don't have enough first hand experience to share an opinion.

[@bcbloc02]

Curious did you have an external gate to route exhaust around the k27 into the 472? I suspect if you didn't pick up power with the sxe472 it is because it was choked in front of it. Also what turbine and exhaust housing size 472 is it?

[@pddofficial]

Internal gate only. We tried both a 1.0 housing and 1.25AR. The 472 is also tight fit with the factory shock shock tower so it didn't make sense to add a hard to fit, more expensive turbo where the 369sxe worked better for the intended towing application. On the flipside, with the PDD 24V Cummins Common Rail Towing Turbo Kit, the factory He351cw worked extremely well with the 472sxe. The 472 fit well, and when combined with a custom larger turbine wheeled HE351, it was good for over 900 rwhp, yet still capable of excellent towing manners on a stock 300 ish HP truck.

[@Doug6251]

I would love to see this for the vp44

[@preachers4135]

Aside from the bowl location, what difference would you expect?

[@Doug6251]

@@preachers4135 to see what parts wear differently. What lasts with the 24v and what doesn't last.

[@preachers4135]

@@Doug6251 5.9 12V and 24V engines are virtually the same besides the head and fuel system. There’s a few oddities in crank / cam sensor locations but they don’t effect wear. 2003 introduced common rail fuel system and changes in the block.

[@Doug6251]

@@preachers4135 so there would be no difference in wear? Good to know thanks man

[@tylerbrotzman7452]

What valvetrain cominations would you reccomend for a 93 12v with 5x.014s and a 62sxe? And can this injector and turbo combo make 450-500 reliably with a quick spool

[@bcbloc02]

If it is still a VE truck you won't make 450+rwhp with an iinjector that small. I made 488rwhp many times with an old 62-68 .80ar s300 but with 6x.018 injectors and a lot of head work stock everything else.

[@tylerbrotzman7452]

@@bcbloc02 hmm alright ive read a ton about it being able to atleast make 400 with a reasonable turbo and 5x.012s, just needs the pump cranked up and tuned out

[@bcbloc02]

@@tylerbrotzman7452 Probably be right around 400 engine hp with that but not wheel hp. I had a 93 with the pump maxed and 370 marine injectors which are 5x.012 and a hx40-16 and it dynoed just a bit over 325 to the tire and it burned clean so I don't think changing anything that didn't increase fuel would add 75rwhp. I am going to say most of the 400rwhp 5x.012 ve trucks have never actually been on a dyno. They are like the 600rwhp 7.3 powerstrokes.

[@tylerbrotzman7452]

@@bcbloc02 what was it at pump timing wise? and correction factor on the dyno would probably change it some, i know some brands read high and others read lower, could be a classic case of inaccurate dynoes with the 450 to 500 hp ve's i have beeb reading about

[@Taylorhpatrick]

Wowowo, throwing stones at Rotella...

[@pddofficial]

This truck has used/ran some Rotella in its lifetime, but ever since they went to the new CJ oil spec, the wear metals increased dramatically. The current CK oil spec is even worse for the pre 2002 engines that were never designed to run with so little zinc. Have you ever wondered why the new 6.7L Cummins engines abandoned the proven flat tappet camshaft setup and are using roller tappet?

[@goatsgarage2635]

Funny how the first oil comes to mind that’s junk lol ROTELA!

[@ed4709]

How is this junk oil?

[@mikeanglim8093]

I have a 98 12v 5 sp 3500 4x4 quad cab slt leather factor carpet delete. Is ther any sort of registry of how many of each truck and option package was built? I would like to know if its 1 of 1.

[@pddofficial]

We are not aware of any registry or database for truck options/counts... but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist! Maybe someone else could post a reply if they know about a Dodge Cummins Registry?

[@jeremymyers5643]

That's a low volume truck for sure, why you would want leather and no carpet is beyond me, and I would venture to guess that would be the rarest part of it. Rare truck for sure. I would say there is very few quadcab 3500 12v out there.

[@mikeanglim8093]

Thats what i was thinking. But i was hoping there is a list of what they built. If you have a 68 hemi convertible 4sp plum crazy purple they can tell you that there was 3 built. I was hoping that list existed. Ill keep looking. Thanks guys!

[@reitzy69]

Hey now Rotella diesel oil is not junk lol esp is lucas additive is added along with it

[@jefferypugh5681]

what kind of mileage did you get with that rig? I'm a 1st gen guy, but have a 4x4 I'm wanting to build. buddy has a 500 hp truck 98 model. gets 17mpg

[@pddofficial]

Averaged 18mpg

[@diabeetusactual6406]

What oil would you guys use if it wasn’t your own?

[@pddofficial]

Oil with high levels ZDDP and the proper viscosity are the key. We've had good luck with the Joe Gibbs Driven oils on the race trucks back before we had our own high performance diesel oil. We've tried Valvoline VR-1 60 weight and it performed well, but it's a little thick vs 15w-40 oil for sure.

[@adamknight9248]

Seems like a lot of wear and possible issues for it to be reliable imo

[@billcrane2444]

When you increase hp and torque will that always cause higher engine and transmission temperatures when towing up long grades? Utah has some long 5% and 6% grades on I-70 where my slightly modified, 1998 12 valve gets close to maximum temperatures pulling a 14,000 lb 5th wheel. What modifications have you seen that may increase pulling power without having to pull over to let the truck cool down?

[@pddofficial]

Compound turbos help tremendously with EGT control which in turn helps with overheating. OEM copper cored radiator also cools much better than the newer aluminum aftermarket "cheap" radiators. For the transmission a finned deep pan makes a noticeable difference like 15 to 20 degree drop on most trucks. If that's not enough, adding another transmission cooler and fan under the truck is good for another 20 or so degree drop. When really pulling hard up the big longer hills, kicking the heater on high and rolling down the windows in summertime is another way to pull more heat out of the engine/cooling system. And finally, the guys towing really heavy like 25k gross usually add an electric pusher fan in front of the radiator to push air in addition to the mechanical factory fan pulling air. A final help is to run a lower temp t-stat so you approach the hill with a lower base water temp. All that said, the factory cooling system is not adequate to keep 600 sustained HP cool on the mountains pulling a load, it takes a semi truck cooling system to do that. But 600 HP sustained is enough to run 100+ MPH up any grade here in Utah with 14k 5th wheel.

[@billcrane2444]

@@pddofficial Thanks, I'll have to look into it.

[@petejohnson8397]

pdfofficial is right. cooling systems are designed around duty cycle more than max hp. my 36,000LB FL80 275hp C7 🐱 has a much larger cooling system capacity than any 2500 or 3500 pickup built in the 90s. the only suggestion that i will add to his is add an auxiliary heater somewhere outside the cab to get rid of some heat. don't waste your time with anything less than 40,000 btu.

[@petejohnson8397]

also.. can a later model ram electro viscous fan clutch be retrofitted to your 5.9? if not then on some viscous fan clutches the engage temperature can be adjusted. i did that on my other (International) boom truck when i put a new one on. i didn't like the engage temp on the new unit (oem no longer available). all it took was loosening the hold tab screw on the bi metallic coil and moving it a few notches. that won't STOP your heating up but it would give more time until reaching higher temps.

[@claykoyle-zd7xm]

Indian canyon and sheep creek is 8%+, utah boy here also ;)

[@yonilavi7707]

I inquired about having you guys build me an engine last week I told the guy I was thinking about power range from 650 800 hp he quoted me on that but I’m wonder if I needed the engine to be that built I will be towing a trailer with Jeep on it about once a month and driven daily back and forth to work I planned on compounding it but got me thinking was I planning to over build it I know it’s better to but after seeing this video it got me thinking and also with that power range I was quoted am I able to lower the power range dramatically with the afc I just have questions and serious about buying engine from pdd. as my machine shop local guy just retired so I don’t trust any shops with this type of build

[@pddofficial]

It's tough to know where you'll end up power-wise in the future. The main differences between a 500 HP engine build and an 850 HP engine build would be the head studs, o-ringing or fire ringing, piston to wall clearance, ring gap, and coated piston skirts vs stock. More power means more heat so clearances get opened up for the higher power levels. When you start looking for 1000+ HP is when the build drastically changes because rod failure comes into play, camshaft size, etc.

[@tristengraham2619]

How often did you check your valve lash?

[@pddofficial]

It was kept up and checked every 25k miles or so. The cam wear is from the combination of high miles and really heavy prototype beehive valve springs with double the seat and nose pressure of stock valve springs loaded through the stock 12v tappets that measure just 1.20" whereas most built engines with upgraded "race" valve springs are running a minimum of 1.3" early 24v tappet, aftermarket 1.45" or even 1.5" Common Rail 24v tappets.

[@Benb05]

How much power can I push to the rear tires safety and reliability with a 24v cummins I currently have 305,000 miles on the clock I'd like to bump my power level to about 500hp at the tires

[@pddofficial]

500 HP to the tires is doable with the SO or standard output 215 or 235 HP models. With the factory 245 HP based HO models with the 6 speed manual, the injection pump limits power output to the 450 to 490 HP range.

[@Benb05]

@@pddofficial how do I know if I have the ho model or not I'm kinda new to the diesel engine I've only owned this truck for about a year now

[@fredtrammell3268]

I want to put a 12 valve in my 1990 f700 hotshot truck what are y’all’s build prices

[@pddofficial]

we are not currently building engines, but if you want to build it yourself we are more than happy to work with you on what products you will need. Baron

[@hill160881]

Did you pull with this setup or daily driver?

[@pddofficial]

It was everyday driver and towed regularly for 60-70k

[@AndyFromm]

Do you have a 400-500hp 4bt package?

[@pddofficial]

No sorry 4bts are not a huge market but if you call our sales team they will be able to get you a recipe made up!

[@mangravy2000]

What torque at this hp?

[@kcarson8336]

What oil are you running?

[@pddofficial]

Our Power driven oil.powerdrivendiesel.com/product-category/power-driven-fluids/

[@Rustyrider-og4pf]

Cost wise to make something like this reliable? 5k 10k?

[@pddofficial]

10k-20k depending on trans mission.

[@IanYav5.9]

This definitely makes me feel better about where I'm going with my 99 24v. Guess the weak link is still that stupid VP44, hope to be shed of it one day.

[@pddofficial]

VP's are fine, just need to be changed out every 100k to 200k miles when they fail. Honda's and VW's need a timing belt every 100k.... so what's a VP44? The VP trucks start really nice and they make great power till you try to get past 500 HP, then you need an SO pump or a Hotrod VP44 pump.

[@IanYav5.9]

@@pddofficial lucky for me I have an SO, ever since I swapped in the new VP44 she has been running smooth, but something about a P-Pumped 24 valve just sounds right to me!

[@tannerb55]

Did you have your head oringed man I know that’s a rhetorical question. Love you guys spend more money there than anywhere.

[@pddofficial]

The block was o-ringed in-frame with an Isky Groov o Matic. The proper way to do it now is to o-ring the head since it's easy to remove compared to in-frame grooving the block.

[@nrolled2888]

If someone drops off a w250 and wants this kind of hp, how much is he roughly looking at?

[@pddofficial]

If we were doing it around 60k

[@nashoriano3346]

Rotella junk? What oil do you guys run? Addatives?

[@pddofficial]

We run the PDD brand oil, which includes all the ZDDP additive goodness 👍

[@moaski]

Could the same reliable, 100k mile, 650-hp be had with a 24 valve?

[@preachers4135]

Yes. This was a ‘98 storm block, same as a 24V. Heads and fuel system are main differences but yes a 24V can make this power reliably. Life expectancy depends more on the operator.

[@pddofficial]

Yes, the engine will handle 650 HP, but with the factory VP44 injection pump, it's difficult to get 650 rear wheel HP fuel-only. You'll definitely need a healthy sized injector and a potentially a hotrod VP44 pump if you have a factory 6 speed HO truck. If you have a standard output 5 speed or 4 speed auto, then there's a good chance your factory VP44 injection pump will get to the 600+ HP range fuel-only.

[@bryanpiper2293]

So with that setup could you run waste oil in it?

[@pddofficial]

Yes just need to watch the EGT oil runs hotter

[@bigmurph1447]

I want to take my 96 apart look it over. But I want to waite till I hit 500000miles I got less than 20000 miles to go. I have compound turbos my truck probably sits around 500 to 550hp. It's never had the head off of it. I still have stock valve springs and all.

[@pddofficial]

500k miles is awesome!

[@repairvehicle]

What was the max engine speed?

[@pddofficial]

Normally didn't take it much past 4k RPM. The injection pump is governed to 5k RPM so never past 5k for sure!

[@ToddKing]

2:09 "junk Rotella" /// Yeah, OK. Whatever you say.....

[@pddofficial]

Any CK spec oil is going to have similar detrimental effects on wear items in an older diesel engine that was designed to run with CI spec oil with much higher ZDDP anti-wear.

[@Hitman-ds1ei]

Love how you guys care for skin with same passion as your engines lol, as a 45 year career diesel fitter you can believe you will pay the price for the tough guy persona of not wearing gloves and using barrier cream regularly, as you well know diesel oil is black for a reason and if you think your epidermis layer is as hooked on diesel engines as you lol 😆 love your content though, still amazed how far the US diesel scene has progressed in such a short time to such a high degree

[@pddofficial]

Thank you