Inspecting Loft Insulation with the TOPDON Thermal Imaging Camera

[@MrWobling]

I put an extra 6 inches of insulation in our loft last winter. You can see the step change in gas consumption in the data. House was built 2001 and was already fairly well insulated. Well worth it!

[@SpeakToTheGeekTech]

Yeah I added that second layer about 2 years ago to about 70% of the loft where I was able to. Probably about 90%+ covered with two layers now. Made a huge difference to the gas bill!

[@colingoode3702]

Interesting & informative video. I've been meaning to add extra insulation & raise the floor in my loft for a while now. I've got the Loftzone kit to raise the floor, I just need to get the extra 250mm insulation & extra boards. I also been looking at the Topdon & Flir thermal camera's. Whilst a bit pricy I think for a job like this they are almost essential if you are going to try & improve your home insulation.

[@SpeakToTheGeekTech]

The Flir is probably the better known brand but the Topdon has a higher resolution when comparing models. They are expensive but there's already a queue of friends wanting to borrow mine!

[@colingoode3702]

@@SpeakToTheGeekTech I'd charge them a Pint a day🍺.. I hope they have iPhone's! I'm the only one with an iPhone in our family / friends so if I get one it can't be shared unless they take my phone with it!!

[@SpeakToTheGeekTech]

Haha nah, I can’t charge for the borrowing, not for the people I trust anyway! And yeah most of my family have iPhones if only for the ease of asking me for support! They know I don’t use Android regularly so know that if they have questions they can’t ask me… although lately my answers have been “visit the Apple Store”

[@bryanhindle8307]

I would have thought it would take a day before you could see the full benefit of you work as the cold spots will take that long to warm up.

[@SpeakToTheGeekTech]

Yes you're right - there was about 6 hours between doing the work and checking again, but I think it needed longer because it has made more of a difference than shown. Still got plenty of gaps though I need to sort!

[@markloughtonUK]

At least you did it at the right time of year. Its amazing how warm you get up there once you start having to crawl around. Roof pitch is too low on mine to be able to stand up which makes the job really awkward 😅

[@SpeakToTheGeekTech]

Yeah it's ridiculously hot up there in the summer!

[@DavidBond668]

I borrowed my work colleagues thermal camera and ended up insulating under the floor boards and improving the attic insulation. It's improved the comfort of the house and reduced gas consumption. I found that behind the skirting boards is another leaky spot due to gap in plasterboard which has a polystyrene backing. Very interesting. I didn't manage to do anything to improve this as would be too messy pulling off skirtings

[@SpeakToTheGeekTech]

Yeah my skirting boards are showing up as cold too.

[@Leo99929]

For the joists, full between with PIR ideally, then install a set of joists perpendicular and install more PIR between them. Then the thermal bridge is reduced to where the perpendicular joists overlap which will dramatically improve the insulative value.

[@SpeakToTheGeekTech]

Thanks, may be one for a chippy rather than me as a DIYer though :)

[@Leo99929]

​@@SpeakToTheGeekTech It's not structural so I wouldn't worry too much. Put a screw in to the overlap just to stop them moving around. But the PIR wedged between should keep them in place anyway. Might need a long screw and/or to drill a deep hole in the top member. Then you can just lay your OSB/ply on top to walk on, few screws to keep it in place. Extra points if you seal all the gaps and use a metalized vapour barrier with a small air gap on either side and taped joins.

[@caravancapers5091]

Hopefully the verge area was kept clear of insulation to keep your ventilation flow intact. So many forget or don’t know this…

[@davidalmond9334]

I have 300mm , but u still need the air flow

[@tarkadahl1985]

I found a strip of breather membrane stapled to the lowest point if the truss prevents you pushing insulation too far and blocking vents, means you can stuff it right to the edge but there will still be air where it's needed

[@SpeakToTheGeekTech]

Yeah it is, but... there is space to put a single layer of insulation between the joists in a lot of places whilst still having decent air flow. I still need to get up there with some crawl boards and sort that but it's an itchy job that I'm putting off!

[@caravancapers5091]

@@tarkadahl1985 I believe that is an official detail as well!

[@davideyres955]

@@SpeakToTheGeekTechtake a look at the recycled plastic insulation available in places like B&Q. It’s got a good enough r value, but it’s itch free. Just feels like cotton wool. Does the job without the itch.

[@stevejudyrobinson1771]

I have just done my loft which was very badly done with 100mm insulation some carpet and loads of other rubbish. I bought some more 100mm to sort out all the gaps then 6 rolls of 200mm which I laid across the beams so as to close that bridging leak, I then raised the floor where I wanted to walk and store stuff by 300mm which I used 3x2 screwed between the trusses. It took quite a while and as you say a very messy job but I wore a boiler suit and gloves and a professional dust mask. (I was really surprised that you were not wearing protective gear). The final result is fantastic. We have been away for 6 weeks with no heating on and the temperature of the rooms have only dropped a few degrees when viewing my Tado dashboard. Unfortunately I haven’t yet been recording the Tado temperatures with HomeAssistant as that would have shown if I am getting any solar gain. In total a couple of hundred £ and of course the cost of the thermal camera but by the looks of it I will recover that quite quickly. Out of interest I had all my SolarEdge Optimisers mounted in the loft so I need the new floor to access them but at least by mounting them there I won’t have to lift panels if there are failures. Especially as I have integrated panels.

[@colingoode3702]

Good point about optimisers inside the loft. I'm getting 5 extra panels & another battery fitted soon & the quote includes optimisers. I'll see if they can locate them in the loft cos if one goes it's a scaffold & panel off job to replace one.

[@SpeakToTheGeekTech]

The small parts I was covering meant I didn’t have to get too deep in to the mess. When I finally do the edges on crawl boards I’ll have to kit up properly or I’ll be sneezing fibreglass for months

[@stevejudyrobinson1771]

@@colingoode3702 It was a lot of work and used a lot of extra cable as the Sparky said they all had to be the same length to avoid mismatches, but I am really glad I insisted on it. We have Solfit panels which link together to make a complete sealed roof. My panels completely surround a dormer so to get to the back of one panel would mean removing all those below and to the side.

[@stevejudyrobinson1771]

@@SpeakToTheGeekTech Oh yes I understand, I wasn’t criticising only surprised as even dressed for a space walk, I couldn’t wait to get under the shower. But I did a lot of work up there which took me about a week. I can thoroughly recommend the JSP force 8 respirator from Screw Fix. Well worth the £31 rather than the paper ones which never work for me.

[@David-bl1bt]

an eye opening video. although expensive im contemplating getting one of these IR cameras as clearly they are useful if not compulsive! Regarding insulating your gas flue...it is likely to be a precast block flue which is integrated into the inner cavity wall during the build process. If this is the case, the blocks will go up into the roofspace and then there will be a flue pipe connected to it that connects to either a ridge terminal vent, ot the tube may penetrate through the roof tiles to outside, weather sealed with a storm flashing. In the first type (connected to a ridge tile) you can remove the flue pipe between the precast block and the ridge tile vent. once removed you will be able to see down the precast block, it may fo;;ow a completely straight route right down to the fire or it may be stepped, it really doesnt matter, but it will give you an appreciation of the size of the hole in the block. Once the fire is removed, block up the flue hole by whichever means you feel appropriate. Personally, I would cut a piece of stiff card slightly larger than the hole so it can be wedged tightly, Make a number of holes in the cardboard such that the tube of an expanding foam can can pass through, then squirt a couple of seconds of expanding foam through the holes. Use the fireproof foam as previously mentioned in a comment above. Once the foam has cured, remove the cardboard and check thet the hole is completely sealed by the foam, if not apply more foam in any holes. You can of course block up the hole by other means...a piece of olywood perhaps, but whatever you use, ensure it is completely sealed. Once the flue hole is sealed at the bottom it will prevent warm air from your room being sucked out! You could just leave it like this and similarly block off the top of the flue block where it exits into the loft, the trapped air will actually provide some degree of insulation. If you prefer a more thorough approach to insulation (which I think would likely be your preference!), you could actually fill the flueblock hole throughout its length using a loose fill type of insulation (vermiculite, polystyrene beads for example). The outlet to outside via the ridge vent could be blocked up with remaining foam if you have some left, or again, plywood. or even gaffa tape or leave it open to aid roofspace ventilation. Im looking forward future videos of your IR investigation and remedys thereafter!

[@SpeakToTheGeekTech]

Thanks for that info, I think you are correct - there’s a flue in the loft which takes it to a ridge vent. I will have a good look and investigate how it all fits together! Cheers

[@geoffreycoan]

The more insulation layers you can get in the loft the better the results, using kits to raise the loft flooring if necessary. To think we used to have 50mm insulation in our lofts and thought that was plenty!

[@SpeakToTheGeekTech]

I may have to add a raised flooring in a lot of it just so as I can use the space for storage!

[@colingoode3702]

@@SpeakToTheGeekTech I can recommend LoftZone Store Floor. Not the cheapest of it's type but it's lighter than using wood, with no thermal breaks & stronger. It's also BBA approved for new house builds.

[@terryrigden4860]

I have one too and it's very useful

[@SpeakToTheGeekTech]

It really is!

[@philip_james]

Can't you just remove the frame from the old water tank if it's no longer needed to give you better access?

[@SpeakToTheGeekTech]

I could do, but that platform could be useful to store stuff on... I know I could put different platformed flooring in instead but that's effort

[@bryanhindle8307]

There is a fire resistant foam which should be used on garage doors.

[@SpeakToTheGeekTech]

I'll see if I can find some thanks. It's just the door frame that needs sorting, the gap is about 10mm in some places!

[@h.e.verheijden8083]

Warmer Solar panel kabels are only 19 degrees. So the are far under danger teperature

[@SpeakToTheGeekTech]

Yeah, no issues at the moment. I think the idea is that I should check them every couple of months to make sure there are no new hot-spots appearing - for example around by the DC breaker which is a known problem area.

[@tarkadahl1985]

The only way you'd ever reduce the thermal bridging from the joists through the plasterboard would be by dropping the ceiling height a touch by putting insulated plasterboard on the ceiling. All newbuilds do this now round here to reduce it, if I was able to borrow a thermal camera (cough cough) and show you my insulation Vs the original house there would be a huge difference.

[@SpeakToTheGeekTech]

Haha! My camera is already doing the rounds with family!

[@mrgrumpy5116]

where is your personal protective equipment?, ... it's not a good idea to handle insulation products without at least gloves and face protection, also breathing filtration.

[@SpeakToTheGeekTech]

It's still at B&Q. I'll remember for next time...

[@robrs210]

You should wear a diposable suit , mask, gloves and goggles when messing about with insulation. The fibers are not good for you, not only in your lungs but in your eyes.

[@SpeakToTheGeekTech]

Point taken thanks, I’ll be investing in a protective suit thing and a proper mask for next time.

[@edwardpickering9006]

But if you buy natural sheeps wool insulation then you don't need any protective gear and it's really easy to cut/shape. Not cheap mind, but worth it!